Roleplay-wise features of specialist mages

AvGur

Hello!
What distincts Your gameplay for Necromancer from general Mage gameplay (or Conjurer, etc)?
There are no difference, we still use same spells for 90% of time. Additional spell-slot\level for specialist is only a number, but quantity is not a quality. You will remember the gameplay for Thief or Bard cause it's can't be reproduced by Fighter or Monk and vice versa. Sad, but all specialist mages gives same experience, like kits of any other class. As D&D tales Illusionists is really stick to illusions, not Fireballs.
Choosing specialist gives something to roleplay only if You force yourself to constant use of specific school, but You can do it even with Sorcerer.

There is a good way to bring true specialist experience! They should use spell of choosed school as it was
one tier lower than before.
So, level 7 Necromancer should get Animate dead (originally on 5th tier) as 4th tier spell instead of wait to level 9 as general Mage. Most spells aren't used often due to strong concurency on every tier, but against spells of lower tier they shine as brilliants. Do You feel attracted by Your school now? I am! No more "same spells\tactic every walkthrough".

Technically, it's better to do in IWD2 way (D&D3), where engine allows You to learn and use the same spell at different tiers based on character class. If You like the concept, then comment and involve devs to conversation.

If impossible, then WeiDu

haven't coding for years
1st part (create .spl)
Look through all .spl to search for type 1 "wisard-only",
create copy and name it (registered prefix +spell name = 8 characters max).
Read through copy for spell-level and substrat 1 from it.
Lowered spells created.
2nd part (append scroll i.tm)
Look through all .itm for ability page where opcode 148 "add spell (to book)" located, it should be scroll,
set resource from opcode 148 as "spell name"
inner action
read "spell name".spl
look for "School (for effects)" and set it as "school"
end inner action, again .itm patch
If "school" = 1 (MAGESCHOOL_Abjurer), than create opcode 177 "add eff", param 2 = 9 (Kits), param 1 = kit's number from kit.ids, in vanilla was 0x0040 (MAGESCHOOL_Abjurer)
resource field in opcode should contain (registered prefix +spell name, 8 characters max)),
it would cast specific .eff file if kit match
If "school" = 2 (MAGESCHOOL_Conjurer), than create opcode 177 "add eff", param 2 = 9 (Kits), param 1 = kit's number from kit.ids, in vanilla was 0x0080 (MAGESCHOOL_Conjurer)
resource field in opcode should contain (registered prefix +spell name, 8 characters max),
it would cast specific .eff file if kit match
If "scholl" ... and rest schools
3rd part (create .eff)
For every patched .itm create .eff file named (registered prefix +spell name, 8 characters max)
opcode 148 "learn spell" with resource (registered prefix +spell name, 8 characters max))
Done. You will learn "lowered spell" only if it's from matching kit.

List of schools from .spl
0x01 MAGESCHOOL_ABJURER
0x02 MAGESCHOOL_CONJURER
0x03 MAGESCHOOL_DIVINER
0x04 MAGESCHOOL_ENCHANTER
0x05 MAGESCHOOL_ILLUSIONIST
0x06 MAGESCHOOL_INVOKER
0x07 MAGESCHOOL_NECROMANCER
0x08 MAGESCHOOL_TRANSMUTER

Their matching from kit.ids
0x0040 MAGESCHOOL_ABJURER
0x0080 MAGESCHOOL_CONJURER
0x0100 MAGESCHOOL_DIVINER
0x0200 MAGESCHOOL_ENCHANTER
0x0400 MAGESCHOOL_ILLUSIONIST
0x0800 MAGESCHOOL_INVOKER
0x1000 MAGESCHOOL_NECROMANCER
0x2000 MAGESCHOOL_TRANSMUTER

Three possible issues with this approach stops me from work for now.
1st. Game scripts looks for memorised spells to use them. It needs patch.
If only playable characters will use spell-clones, than it could be rendered to not critical by controlling Your specialist manually. Side effect of this is fight vs ex-companion with spell-clones memorised, he would be helpless without updated script.
2nd. Vanilla BG2 and TOB forces You to choose preferred spells on character generation. Only way around is to remove known spells from spellboock in game and learn it again from scrolls, now with clones.
3rd. Scribing spell from scroll grants XP. With two spells learned from one scroll You'll get weird XP amount.

Any help with WeiDu macro is appreciated. My coding skills wasnt active for years.

thanks for reading to that point!

p.s same topic already was removed without notice so this is a clone.
If it's content violetes any forum rule, it's not intentional.

Tresset

It was removed by the forum's automatic spam filter. I have verified you so this should not happen again.

Did you know, however, that specialist mages do actually get something really nice out of their specialty? All spells they cast within their specialty are harder to resist, applying a -2 penalty to the saving throws for these spells.

AvGur

I've reed about something like that (harder to resist spells) added by mods or feats (IWD2), but wasn't aware that this is part of vanilla EE.
It's good, but not immersive enough to completely change my spellbook every walktrough, eg roleplay experience.
Thank You.

DJKajuru

I wouldn't call it "roleplay" of you're actually making them more powerful in combat. A roleplay-wise change, in my opinion, would be stuff like extra dialogue options for specialists . Also, a rule that should have bern enforced long ago was that the extra spell slot given to specialists needs to be used for spells from his school.

Artona

I think that it would be cool if specialists in BG2 could resolve Planar Sphere stronhold quest in different way - e. g. having different items crafted by pupils, and so on.

OlvynChuru

I like the "spells of the specialist mage's school are harder to resist" mechanic. A high-level necromancer could cast Finger of Death, forcing an enemy to die instantly unless it makes a Save vs. Death at -4 (or -8 if you cast Greater Malison first). Even Throne of Bhaal enemies will fail those kinds of saving throws some of the time.

AvGur

@DJKajuru, Thanks for Your opinion. For me and I hope for many other, gameplay for Illusionist with mostly Illusion spells used is part of definition to Roleplay, and it's should be different from Necromancer's gameplay. For now they just don't feel as those who as class\kit name suggest they are, ie indentical. With proposed concept realised, there would be only rare slot used for other schools.
p.s. Do we need a ton of new dialogs for every mage school? Some differences in Stronghold would be a nice flavor, but still, it's only a part of one quest, while choosing best spells are our bread for whole game.

AvGur

topic edited, added more "WeiDu" references

Emardon_Lareous

This may appeal to you, particularly the revised specialists. https://github.com/subtledoctor/TomeAndBlood
I believe this is also part of Talents of Faerun on Gibberlings 3 which may be the latest and most supported version