I imagine he will rationalize it by bringing in Satan and his temptations, if I understand the playbook well enough.
The mind is so good at hiding reality from ourselves. It takes quite a concerted effort to see through the self obfuscation. The Satan's temptation defense is a way to outsource his own failings and protect him from confronting his own darkness. I suspect he will reavow his faith in and service to God and miss any chance he had to truly understand why he has behaved so abhorrently.
This is indeed disgusting. I've done a little looking into this and it seems that priests and other clergy are not more likely, on average, to be sexual predators but they have access to far more potential victims and have more power over those victims than your everyday average pedophile/rapist. In other words, it's not the religion, it's the easy access to victims that's at play here. It also explains why so many of these assholes are doctors/coaches/psychologists/therapists/teachers/nurses/clergy/politicians, etc... Access to the vulnerable draws this type of person to those fields.
The big problem is that the church tends/tended to move these priests around. I read an article ages back where a lot of molesting priests got moved to Alaska, where they did the same to indigenous children. That, of course, also made me sick. And I mean... physically sick. For a organization supposedly founded by Peter, this is gross.
My major problem with the religion I was raised in is the self-loathing that is almost required to be a real adherent of it. That and the whole, intelligent people need not apply bullshit. Any religion that praises ignorance over enlightenment is suspect in my book. I was a sceptic at a very early age (like 7 years old!) and I've pretty much felt like an outsider ever since. I honestly don't feel at home with religious people or atheists. It's not fun to feel akin to nobody. I feel like both sides are missing part of the puzzle but I'm no closer to the truth than either side...
The big problem is that the church tends/tended to move these priests around. I read an article ages back where a lot of molesting priests got moved to Alaska, where they did the same to indigenous children. That, of course, also made me sick. And I mean... physically sick. For a organization supposedly founded by Peter, this is gross.
Move the problem to a remote place and hope it goes away. Sounds like a beauracratic solution to a spiritual problem. Secrecy is dying in the age of social media. The double-edged sword cuts the evil, maybe that makes up for it cutting the neutral and the good once in a while, eh?
My major problem with the religion I was raised in is the self-loathing that is almost required to be a real adherent of it. That and the whole, intelligent people need not apply bullshit. Any religion that praises ignorance over enlightenment is suspect in my book. I was a sceptic at a very early age (like 7 years old!) and I've pretty much felt like an outsider ever since. I honestly don't feel at home with religious people or atheists. It's not fun to feel akin to nobody. I feel like both sides are missing part of the puzzle but I'm no closer to the truth than either side...
From my perspective I'd say you are much closer to the truth. At least you are at the starting line!
Enlightenment is our nature. The difficulty is that we turn it into a goal or search, but since it's already what we are, how can we search for it? Any movement you make will just take you away from it.
I think of this quote a lot:
"I had never gone anywhere. I have, always and always, been at my home. I have always been here and now. Only I was dreaming, so the dreams created the illusion that I had gone somewhere. Now the dream has disappeared, and I am where I have always been." -Osho
Yeah, there's reasons why I don't like the Catholic Church. I get that people are individuals and all that. But this seems to happen A LOT and the church seems to just keep protecting it.
Or simply raised in a theistic tradition where his statement applies without conflict, as with much of the west. The distinction you make is accurate, but not intuitive for most people with a background in the Abrahamic religions.
Or simply raised in a theistic tradition where his statement applies without conflict, as with much of the west. The distinction you make is accurate, but not intuitive for most people with a background in the Abrahamic religions.
I was making a joke but actually I do think there went something wrong if you are an adult and you never learned these things. I.e. if your parents failed to educate you more thoroughly I would say my joke was factual.
A child is more likely to be molested at church than in a transgender-friendly bathroom. Earlier this week a gay Alabama lawmaker discusses the fact that church is a greater threat to children than transgender-friendly bathrooms. In a touching op-ed post, state representative Patricia Todd discussed the difficulties of being transgender, and the myths surrounding the transgender community. As for “the bathroom issue” Todd notes:
No evidence has been uncovered showing that fears of transgender persons and “the bathroom issue” are warranted. Several states, school districts and corporations have adopted their own policies affirming transgender people’s right to use the bathroom that aligns with their gender identity and have not reported problems.
As for the plight of transgender people, Todd reports:
In a study from UCLA’s Williams Institute, nearly 70% of transgender people said they had experienced verbal harassment in a situation involving gender-segregated bathrooms, while nearly 10% reported physical assault.
As for the safety of children, Todd observes:
Most child predators are male (The National Center for Victims of Crime) and The Child Molestation Research & Prevention Institute notes that 90% of child molesters target children in their network of family and friends, and the majority are men married to women.
In other words, the real danger to children is not strangers in a public bathroom, but people they know, and are taught to trust.
More at the article. But, this: A presentation titled “Offenders Within The Church: Who Are They And How Do They Operate?” gives an ominous indication of the grave threat facing children in American churches, including the fact that reported child abuse accusations against US protestant churches average 70 per week (GRACE also acknowledges that the actual number is probably much higher due to under-reporting.)
In fact, GRACE even has a name for this phenomenon that contributes to sexual abuse in churches: The Five Exploitations:
Exploitation of “religious cover”: Child molesters’ apparent embrace of religious practices and doctrine gives them access to children while providing cover for their behavior. Exploitation of faith: “The victim’s own analysis of religious doctrine may result in confusion and silence.” Exploitation of power: Children are taught to submit to authority “from the earliest age.” Exploitation of needs: Churches are always in need of volunteers and don’t always have the resources to thoroughly vet everyone. On top of that, churchgoers often come in need of support and spiritual solace. Exploitation of trust: Churches foster a trusting environment, especially for families with children, and children are taught to trust in God and those whom they see as His representatives.
A Tennessee children’s minister faces felony charges for seeking sex with underage girls.
Earlier this week two Tennessee pastors, one a children’s minister, were arrested in an undercover sting operation targeting human trafficking and prostitution.
Jason Evan Kennedy, 46, head of the children’s ministry at Grace Baptist Church of Knoxville, was one of two men charged with felony human trafficking and patronizing prostitution after they answered online advertisements specifically offering sex with an underage girl.
Also charged with felony trafficking is Pastor Zubin Percy Parakh, 32, of Oak Ridge, who serves as Creative Pastor with Lifehouse Church in Oak Ridge, according to the church’s website.
This is indeed disgusting. I've done a little looking into this and it seems that priests and other clergy are not more likely, on average, to be sexual predators but they have access to far more potential victims and have more power over those victims than your everyday average pedophile/rapist. In other words, it's not the religion, it's the easy access to victims that's at play here. It also explains why so many of these assholes are doctors/coaches/psychologists/therapists/teachers/nurses/clergy/politicians, etc... Access to the vulnerable draws this type of person to those fields.
Edit: should have mentioned cops as well...
You're 100% accurate in this. Religion, spirituality, politics, education and similar factors have no correlation whatsoever to a person's predilection to abusing children. They purposefully seek out professions through which they will have greater access to children, and in fact often rationalize this to themselves and others. The most significant issues relate to a lack of understanding of how paedophiles develop (thus allowing us to provide them with proper treatment early on before the behavior is too strongly embedded) and a failure to recognize the signs of an abuser. Of all children who have been abused in any way (which is estimated to be as high as 20-25% of all boys and 25-35% of all girls), only 5% ever report it, and usually only well after the abuse has ended.
If there is a god then it's not cool he allows this.
Ultimately, from a theistic perspective, that's why I think free will is so crucial. Unfortunately, most theistic stances have done a poor job of explaining how evil can exist given an omnibenevolent, omniscient and omnipotent deity (which most argue for). There was a great discussion that we had a few years ago in another thread around the varying positions for this.
I always felt that evil = because of free will to be quite a cop out... First off, it does nothing to explain suffering caused by disease or natural catastrophes.
Second, thankfully most people have zero desire to sexually abuse children. It is not that they are heroically withstanding temptation, they do not even feel that temptation. Does that limit their free will? I would not say so.
Free will and empathy are perfectly compatible, and if every person was fully capable of empathy we would have a much better world.
I think it's interesting the tendency humanity has to assign anything bad that happens in their lives as punishment from a deity in some cases a benevolent omnipotent, omniscient being.
Some people seem to be unable to understand bad things and good things just happen. Your child does not have a rare genetic disease because god is punishing you, run a genetic mapping on both sides of the family and you'll see offspring with that condition would happen sooner or later. Don't even ask me what I think about natural disasters killing hundreds of people because some were involved in evil ways...
Goodness, yes. In the US, we have more than our share of blithering idiots who blame hurricanes on "The Gays" or whatever. Supposedly, God is punishing the US for letting "The Gays" exist or have rights or whatever. But if God is so incensed about it, surely he would punish... I don't know, "The gays" or the people responsible instead of just sending a hurricane or earthquake to strike some state that had nothing to do with it, yes?
Comments
The mind is so good at hiding reality from ourselves. It takes quite a concerted effort to see through the self obfuscation. The Satan's temptation defense is a way to outsource his own failings and protect him from confronting his own darkness. I suspect he will reavow his faith in and service to God and miss any chance he had to truly understand why he has behaved so abhorrently.
Vermont pastor hid his history of molesting a child--and his church doesn't care
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/1/18/1827324/-Vermont-pastor-hid-his-history-of-molesting-a-child-and-his-church-doesn-t-care?detail=emaildkreGet away from me kid, you disturb the hell outta me..
EXvangelicals #ExposeChristianSchools. Want to understand T***p base? Read these horror stories
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/1/19/1827570/-EXvangelicals-ExposeChristianSchools-Want-to-understand-T-p-base-Read-these-horror-stories?detail=emaildkreWarning. Disturbing Stuff ahead.
Alums of Karen Pence's Anti-LGBTQ School Speak Out on the Harm It Does
https://www.advocate.com/youth/2019/1/20/alums-karen-pences-anti-lgbtq-school-speak-out-harm-it-does?fbclid=IwAR1Gt5IgdYy04GDwE68Bx0GpaG7oHnjxlBsU4mdhuVPFEwLetTOHx24ILNECatholic Priests Ran Child Porn Ring Out Of Pittsburgh Diocese
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/progressivesecularhumanist/2018/08/catholic-priests-ran-child-porn-ring-out-of-pittsburgh-diocese/?fbclid=IwAR3Bl_lmrK48xq8AvqTbbAH0y_LuZKmX17yybBhxnYfxTMsuSitUlW6VVn8Okay, now this... this is sick.
The report demonstrates that hundreds of “predator priests” sexually abused more than 1,000 children in Pennsylvania for decades — all the while being protected and enabled by Roman Catholic Church leaders.
Edit: should have mentioned cops as well...
Enlightenment is our nature. The difficulty is that we turn it into a goal or search, but since it's already what we are, how can we search for it? Any movement you make will just take you away from it.
I think of this quote a lot:
Church More Dangerous For Kids Than Transgender Bathrooms
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/progressivesecularhumanist/2016/05/church-more-dangerous-for-kids-than-transgender-bathrooms/?fbclid=IwAR18_H8GkHWrVHv41MohPF_fi4-R11KrCb5jCAzRa7UriPn6Q3KTDUCnKiYA child is more likely to be molested at church than in a transgender-friendly bathroom.
Earlier this week a gay Alabama lawmaker discusses the fact that church is a greater threat to children than transgender-friendly bathrooms. In a touching op-ed post, state representative Patricia Todd discussed the difficulties of being transgender, and the myths surrounding the transgender community.
As for “the bathroom issue” Todd notes:
No evidence has been uncovered showing that fears of transgender persons and “the bathroom issue” are warranted. Several states, school districts and corporations have adopted their own policies affirming transgender people’s right to use the bathroom that aligns with their gender identity and have not reported problems.
As for the plight of transgender people, Todd reports:
In a study from UCLA’s Williams Institute, nearly 70% of transgender people said they had experienced verbal harassment in a situation involving gender-segregated bathrooms, while nearly 10% reported physical assault.
As for the safety of children, Todd observes:
Most child predators are male (The National Center for Victims of Crime) and The Child Molestation Research & Prevention Institute notes that 90% of child molesters target children in their network of family and friends, and the majority are men married to women.
In other words, the real danger to children is not strangers in a public bathroom, but people they know, and are taught to trust.
More at the article.
But, this:
A presentation titled “Offenders Within The Church: Who Are They And How Do They Operate?” gives an ominous indication of the grave threat facing children in American churches, including the fact that reported child abuse accusations against US protestant churches average 70 per week (GRACE also acknowledges that the actual number is probably much higher due to under-reporting.)
In fact, GRACE even has a name for this phenomenon that contributes to sexual abuse in churches: The Five Exploitations:
Exploitation of “religious cover”: Child molesters’ apparent embrace of religious practices and doctrine gives them access to children while providing cover for their behavior.
Exploitation of faith: “The victim’s own analysis of religious doctrine may result in confusion and silence.”
Exploitation of power: Children are taught to submit to authority “from the earliest age.”
Exploitation of needs: Churches are always in need of volunteers and don’t always have the resources to thoroughly vet everyone. On top of that, churchgoers often come in need of support and spiritual solace.
Exploitation of trust: Churches foster a trusting environment, especially for families with children, and children are taught to trust in God and those whom they see as His representatives.
Children’s Minister Arrested In Child Prostitution Sting
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/progressivesecularhumanist/2016/05/childrens-minister-arrested-in-child-prostitution-sting/A Tennessee children’s minister faces felony charges for seeking sex with underage girls.
Earlier this week two Tennessee pastors, one a children’s minister, were arrested in an undercover sting operation targeting human trafficking and prostitution.
Jason Evan Kennedy, 46, head of the children’s ministry at Grace Baptist Church of Knoxville, was one of two men charged with felony human trafficking and patronizing prostitution after they answered online advertisements specifically offering sex with an underage girl.
Also charged with felony trafficking is Pastor Zubin Percy Parakh, 32, of Oak Ridge, who serves as Creative Pastor with Lifehouse Church in Oak Ridge, according to the church’s website.
Urgh.
It's stupid and ridiculous.
Did you see this?
Where Have All the Protestants Gone? Poll Shows Dramatic Drop in U.S. Christians: Reason Roundup
https://reason.com/blog/2018/05/11/where-have-all-the-protestants-gone-poll?fbclid=IwAR0HNzLiM2iLSnju5qJa5Q7nNaUscNZCI76u82Tos49nhzyQUxBZliJRDFgWhy The Patriarchy Lies About Reproductive Health: And No, New York Is Not Killing Babies
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/irreverin/2019/01/why-the-patriarchy-lies-about-reproductive-health-and-no-new-york-is-not-killing-babies/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=FBCP-PRX&fbclid=IwAR10vy5wK5WUPK4apyUIkhXBfku9L9E5t6w9_vZRUy6LrPZ0WQwW0-1RxmYThis is a religious issue...