Struggling to pick (and keep) a class.
Ghostwheel
Member Posts: 10
I've played BG:EE through multiple times but I've never managed to reach all the way to the end of SoA and I've never touched ToB. i keep getting an itch to roll a new PC so i end up just playing BG:EE over and over again part way. I badly want to be able to play all through the trilogy for once in my life!!!
Does anyone else have this restartitus the same as i do? how do you stop? what classes would you suggest to carry my attention through the games? what was your favorite?
sorry if this is poorly worded, the kids are ensuring there isn't a lot of sleep going around right now. trying to play Baldurs Gate is my only real down time.
Thanks!
Does anyone else have this restartitus the same as i do? how do you stop? what classes would you suggest to carry my attention through the games? what was your favorite?
sorry if this is poorly worded, the kids are ensuring there isn't a lot of sleep going around right now. trying to play Baldurs Gate is my only real down time.
Thanks!
Post edited by Arvia on
5
Comments
Two points that are usually brought up when this type of question is asked:
1. These games have a really intricate and fun magic system. Since you probably want your character to feel important and spend some time micromanaging him/her, it's not a bad idea to make your character a caster (druid/cleric/mage/sorcerer or to a lesser extent bard/paladin/ranger).
2. Opt for picking a class that is not represented among the available companions (if you want to use them). For example, BG2 has no sorcerer companion. There are also lots of interesting class kits that are not represented.
I'd say anybody and everybody who's played these games have suffered/is suffering from restartitis to some extent. Usually it's best to go with your gut feeling, since almost every character becomes a powerhouse in late SoA/ToB, though some more than others obviously.
In spite of the above (since you asked
i do indeed like turnips! so much so that i plan on having a certain mobile turnip peddler in my party for BGII. ive realized that focusing on roplaying and having a good portrait are actually really important to keeping me playing. talking to some other people im almost leaning towards a multi or duel class cleric fighter. i love casting but i love being a brick wall of a character at the same time.
One of my many problems is that most characters kinda stop evolving past a certain point, a thac0 or two, a HLA, but no real significant changes. I guess I could agree that mage types probably keep a freshness to them that more figthter-oriented character don't.
If I would start today and brute force myself through the games despite restartitis etc, I'd probably pick a MC caster since they level slower, thus will continue to evolve into ToB and keep at least some of that happiness every new level yields in the first phases. Maybe a C/M.
I really do wish you luck and hope you find a character that will keep you entertained.
What are your feelings on playing a blade rather than F/M/T?
We will see, I want to take Viconia so I'm not sure I want two clerics
Conversely, a pure cleric like Viconia is best off standing back to cast spells; even with the buffs, their one attack per round just isn't going to do much.
For me, the biggest impetus for finishing runs is logging them. Especially if I'm planning to post about the run, I'm not going to just abandon it. Also, themed parties help keep the interest up. Whether working around self-imposed limits or focusing on making one crazy thing as good as possible, there's a lot there.
That's a good point about Viconia, she should still be useful. I just want to see the story through lol.
Fighter->cleric for tanking and buffs
Inquisitor for glorious mage execution.
F/M/T for magey slashy Geralty goodness
Fighter/thief for sneaky sneaky stabby stabby.
Or just be a sorcerer and joyfully nuke everything.
I keep changing my mind....
Fighter/thief (any race but human). Keep every scroll and wand you find and, after Use Any Item, voila, Fighter/Thief (Mage)!
Edit: Best as a solo run...
I definitely want to do a story heavy party run for my first real run through of the game. Fighter/thief (mage) could be fun though.
What weapons would you take with a character like that?
If you're going the maximum backstabbines route, quarterstaves. Staff of Rynn +4 is available early, so is the Staff of Striking (but you have to keep it recharged by selling it and buying it back). Later on you'll have Staff of the Ram.
But you won't be backstabbing all the time so pick up one of the "general service" weapons: Celestial Fury/Flail of the Ages... Use Belm or Kundane in the off hand for the extra attack (no need to be proficient with it).
Then after use any item you can rock Carsomyr if you want, but not backstab with it. (If you like two handed swords you can pick up Lilarcor early).
In BG1 use whatever
For a fighter/thief, you're probably best off focusing on backstab-capable weapons. The halfling fighter/thief I had leading my no-spellcasting party went with daggers, scimitars, and dual-wielding in BG1, then katanas in BG2. After fighter level 12 ... well, she already had what she needed. I added quarterstaff specialization, one dot in two-handed style, and the third dot in dual-wielding by the end.
As for the scrolls ... I had plenty of scrolls, but I just didn't use them. They were allowed in the rules I played by, but just killing enemies in melee was easier. The wands saw a bit more use, although most of that was by the party bard at lower levels.
My next planned run? A Dragon Disciple leading a party of adventurers who will all eventually be immune to fire. And for the BG1 portion, the melee front line will be fire-immune. Throwing fireballs into melee, anyone? Or, in the late game, saturating the battlefield with Incendiary Clouds and Fire Storms?
I've just finished the warm-up, clearing Black Pits and Black Pits 2 with a version of the party. Ah, fun.
Blades suffer from rogue Thac0, which limits their ability to take advantage of Offensive Spin (which is, admittedly, still great). They also can't use helmets until they pick up UAI, which also goes against their dual-wielding tendencies. Pick Pocket is an underrated thief ability and a blade's magic allows some neat tricks, but a F/M/T ends up with better rogue skills and wizard spells. One thing a blade does have is Enchanced Bard Song, which is a solid buff for the whole party... but I'd still pick a F/M/T if I had to choose. They're both great, though, so you wouldn't be disappointed with either.
If you're not doing a solo run, Haer Dalis is a Blade you can experiment with. He's even got an illegal extra pip in shortsword! This allows him some extra umphh in those weapons that usually get left out...
Is boredom/losing interest during a run your problem, or perfectionism?
I mean, you don't need to optimize your build, and you don't need to pick an ideal combination. You have a lot of NPCs to choose from that can fulfill any roll, and the game can be finished with any class.
If you want to experience the story, you don't need the perfect run. Instead of restarting, you can keep other kits for the next time.
So maybe just create a character with a background story and flavor that you gravitate towards, like, pick a race, portrait and alignment that you like and then combine it with one of the classes suggested above that have the skills you enjoy.
A balanced party can go through the whole game even with a "flawed" Charname.
My totally personal opinion is that enjoying the story comes with creating and roleplaying a character that I like, not necessarily the one that's best suited to easily waltz through every fight.
But maybe in this case I'm the one who has never smoked a single cigarette in my life and now try to give advice how to stop smoking
lol, I have a feeling your probably right. I get thinking about other classes or how cool it would be to thief when I'm a tank or how badly I need a good tank when I'm spell casting. need to just stick with one.
what's a good source for portraits? I'm playing on android so I think I'm stuck manually installing them but that's not hard.
Your playstyle also may be a factor. I am analytical by nature and become more invested via game interaction and combat challenge, so this means either a thief or mage/bard variant is a must, as these classes have the most interaction with the game world in my experience and require more planning/thinking to succeed. I like to sneak around, scout, and backstab, so for me a variant of thief is the usual charname. In fact, the only charnames I have finished TOB with have been thieves, with the notable exception of one monk character years ago. I have played variations of all the classes except Wild Mage , but always go with a thief variant these days.
For portraits, try google searching your class and race. Pininterest is also good. Another option is this site on deviantart:
http://rpg-portraits.deviantart.com/
I have played the games since 2001 or so. First umodded, and modded trilogy runs. I have done several BWS runs with the game loaded to the brink with mods. In the EE era I have downsized a bit and now cherry pick the mods.
I don’t have an estimate of how many hours I have played the game, it most be thousands? I actually don’t know. But imho it’s the best game ever.
The funny thing is that I have only finished the game 3 times. First one I couldn’t win the final fight, the second time I did it solo and the last time I did the fight with ascension installed. The rest of my many many runs have been cut short by restartis. It usually hits when I make it to the sixth chapter in BG2. No matter what mod, kit or RP stance I take, I end up not finishing the game.
But it doesn’t matter to me. I am enjoying the game non the less. To me character planning and thinking about the next play is more important than playing the current. I usually run the numbers in my heads for weeks, and take out a spread sheet if it gets to advanced. But that’s just me. If you enjoy the game and can live with the constant restarting, then don’t worry about what others do. It’s your time and your rules.
I wish I could remember it all. It was really fun.
I remember the two big ones were this character had eyes that were very sensitive to the sunlight. So she could not use a ranged weapon in daylight, only melee.
And she was merciful. Any time an enemy asked to be spared, she did so, no matter how foolish it seemed.
Maybe I've still got a document lying around somewhere with the full list.
On my breaks at work I've spent some time coming up with some class ideas that i like, i figured i might as well post them in my thread.
hopefully they make some kind of sense haha.
Undead Hunter Paladin
Logain
Human
** B.Sword
** Axe
** Flail
Tanking using Sword and Shield.
+ Minor Cleric spells.
+ Solid bonus against Undead
+ Resistance to Level Drain
+ Lots of Romance options
RP as less of a shiny doogooder as much as a solid slayer of evil.
Kind and giving to many but utterly ruthless against what he sees as Evil or unjust, though not as zealous as a "normal" Paladin. Not sure, More Light Gray than Pure White. Especially as he gains experience with the world.
Maybe RP that his undead slaying abilities come from time spent in the crypts.
Fighter/Cleric
Darmin
Dwarf
** Warhammer
** Mace?
** Flail?
** Sling? (ranged option)
*** Two weapon fighting
Tank that starts using Hammer and Shield
then transfer to Two Weapon.
Primarily self buffing. Minor Party buffs.
+ Heavy Buffing
+ Probably best Tank
+ Dwarf
- Terrible Romance options
RP as strong and Loyal. Completely devoted to Gorions teachings at first
but grows into his own with experience. Basically a hammer wielding face smashing beast of a Tank. RP that the origin of his Cleric abilities are a mystery, maybe RP tie them into his Bhaal spawn powers.
Might have to be a later playthrough though due to Romance restrictions.
Fighter/Thief
Elf
** Long Sword
** Short Bow
** Dagger
Primarily sneak attacks and ranged support.
May transfer to Two Weapon Fighting later on.
+ UAI HLA
+
Blade
HalfElf
** Halberd
** Two Handed Sword
** Two Handed Style
Arcane debuffs mixed with Summons and "Trickery" spells.
Aiming for Carsomyr.
+ UAI trickery.
+ Side Spell Support
Having a hard time thinking of how to RP this one, Honestly i just like the look of the Rogue Sprite holding big Two Handed weapons. Plus the idea of the Blade using a Halberd with offensive spin.
Stalker
Human
** Long Sword
** Axe
*** Two Weapon
Scout, Mage Stabber and (hopefully) Two Weapon wielding Blender.
Spent much of his years sneaking around Candlekeep as well as sneaking over the walls or out the gate to spend time sneaking about the woods. Never went far but spent many a night in the dark forest. Very comfortable in both "city" castle type places as well as the deep forest. Warms up to cities quickly, learning to move silently and quickly. Over all has a good guy outlook but isn't overly concerned with how he goes about it... maybe. lol.
Honestly every time I think about the Stalker I see River Tam holding that axe and sword combo.
Paladin - Not going 2-Handed Sword will make you regret at some point in time in the game.
Fighter/Cleric - From a powergaming POV, Flails is certain. Whether you go Mace or Warhammer is a matter of RP as a Dwarf, or going with an OP weapon.
Fighter/Thief - You should be building for IH/Time Stop/Assassination. So nope, your build ain't it, unless it's purely for RP.
Blade - Why half-elf in the first place? You are taking a class that can get Mastery in 2W style and you are ignoring 2W and have no ranged proficiency? And what are you going to do in the early stages of the game? Be a tank with only Mirror Images and crap armor?
Stalker - A Stalker is almost a F/T with more hp, better THACO for much of the game, and no traps. If you are already doing a F/T, why do a Stalker? If a Blade is a budget F/M, a Stalker is a budget F/T, except you don't even have a Spike Trap/UAI argument......
In general, you should consider exactly what you want to experience in each playthrough - romances? certain weapons? certain playstyles, like mislead backstab? Then you build your character accordingly.
Even as a Sorcerer, you don't have to PI/IA/TS all the time. If you like bashing, your sorcerer can just be a debuffer and summoner, and your melee boys bash their way through the entire game.
Can you RP and powergame at the same time? Sure why not? Think of a Dwarven Defender - Thorin Oakenshield style, Axes and Flails, then Warhammers. Smash through trash mobs using Axes and Warhammers on HM, and stick to DOE for big boss fights and tanking. Chop your way through everything with AOU and rip through undead with Azuredge.
Of course, you can choose to go 2-handed swords for a DD, but you won't have the same kind of playthrough experience.
Needless to say, you don't need proficiency to do that sort of thing. Or to pick off undead with a thrown Azuredge.
The big advantage of flails on any protagonist? None of the standard NPCs starts with any proficiency. You get the Flail of Ages early, it remains strong throughout the game, and you're not competing with anyone for it.
Why half-elf for a Blade? Because the only other option is to be human, and the racial modifiers are a strict upgrade when dual-classing isn't an option.
On the other hand ... Blades can't specialize in weapons, or any style other than dual-wielding. Since they don't get extra attacks from levels or specialization, two-weapon style is one of the few ways to get decent APR with them. So - yeah, you need to rethink that build a bit.
Or you could just stand back and sing most of the time. That's what I had Haer'Dalis do in my no-spellcasting party. When you do feel like attacking, a ranged weapon would fit this style best.
"You should be building for _" - No. You should build a character that you like. I just finished posting a run with a fighter/thief protagonist, and I think she used Assassination once all game. Improved Haste and Time Traps were only slightly more common. Most of the time, she just played like a traditional tanky fighter with a few extra tricks. Detect Illusion, deal with traps and locks (take off the full plate for that), occasionally open the battle with a backstab.
As I would build it, a fighter/thief can slide into whatever role is needed in the moment with nothing more than a change of equipment. You're a jack of all trades, rather than a focused specialist. With that in mind - that's a fine selection of weapons. And as the game goes on, you'll pick up even more options.
On a Stalker, one thing to keep in mind - you can only backstab with melee weapons that a thief could use. And when dual-wielding, the main hand gets the stab almost every time. So make sure to have a backstab-capable weapon (not an axe) in the main hand when you go for a stab.
What you're saying is the same as what I'm saying. You should build a character that you like? Then why are you talking about being able to get FOA early? Then you're building for FOA no?
In short, you are still building for something that you want to do - either experience certain gear or experience certain playstyles, like mislead backstab, which is exactly what I said earlier.
I stand corrected over Blades and race, cos as a Tweaks Anthology user, I get confused about race and classes these days. But you pointed out the same lack of ranged weapon thing as me. TS needs to think about what his Blade is going to be doing for the early game when a Blade isn't that much a tank.
Has TS experienced IH/TS/Assassination? Nope, he has never touched TOB. Should a F/T experience it? Most probably yes. But do that for every F/T playthrough? Of cos not. Will TS have fun completing TOB as a F/T then realising that wow, IH/TS/Assassination exists! Damn, I didn't do it the last time!
This is exactly why I used the Sorcerer example - there are many ways to play a Sorcerer besides PI/TS/IA/Unload/Wish Rest, etc. However, if you have never tried how stupidly OP fun PI/TS/IA is, it's always good to experience it as least once.
My DD example also explained this clearly. Who says that a DD cannot use 2H swords? Dwarves do use 2H swords....
Look at TS's intentions for his F/T and Stalker - both are basically going to sneak and backstab - aka playstyle duplication. Sure, you can use different weapons, but it's the same playstyle - so why do both instead of doing some other ranger build, like Archer?
If his F/T is going to sneak and backstab and then fight on the frontline, then why spend the 2 pips on short bow? The 2 pips can be better spent on other melee weapons.
So TS needs to know exactly what he wants and what will provide him with the fun that he wants. Only then will he truly enjoy his SOA and TOB journey.
P.S, for me, romance is a big thing......we can use any class and any build to complete the game anyway....
Personally, I think it's high time I finally made a character that uses spears and halberds for once. I've always found them cool but always avoided them because they were never the truly optimal choice for powergaming purposes.
Totally! One of my most fun playthroughs was as a Fighter 13/Druid with GM in spears. With BG1NPC, you get a great spear at High Hedge with Kivan as early as Chapter 1. And there are lots of great spears in SOA.
So yeah, one just needs to decide exactly what one wants to experience in a playthrough - certain gear, or certain playstyles, and there will always be great fun.
The halberd idea I've had loosely rattling around is a party with as much vorpal as possible. A halberd-using protagonist (the Ravager), someone with two-handed swords (the Silver Sword), someone with axes (the Axe of the Unyielding), and mages summoning planetars. Off with their heads!
And really, that sort of thing is how I come up with my playthroughs. Take something cool, or apply a restriction, and optimize the whole party around that. There's a strong strain of powergaming in that, but it's not the conventional kind.
Yeah, you're right in the sense that only elves can use that spear by default, but if you look at the item itself, it doesn't exclude fighters, fighter/druids and druids. And yeah, the Kivan and halberds and spears thing has been the subject of discussion for ages. I think there was talk about making some changes for BG1NPC to change Kivan's starting proficiencies as an option, but I'm not updated nor in touch with the current situation.
I did a vorpal playthrough once, with an Inquisitor CHARNAME getting Dark Justice in WK, Sarevok using the Silver Sword, Korgain using AOU, and Minsc using Ravager. Quite fun.