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November 23 Livestream Recap

JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 20,698
Today Beamdog CEO Trent Oster and Producer Luke Rideout shared the latest Neverwinter Nights: Enhanced Edition and studio news, talked about the NWN:EE Android Beta, and chatted with Grumpycat, a DM on the popular NWN:EE persistent world Arelith, about her experiences as a longtime Neverwinter Nights player and DM.

Check out the recap.

ThacoBellAedanAerakarStummvonBordwehrTorgrimmertypo_tilly
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Comments

  • RadonGOGRadonGOG Member Posts: 17
    And another week passed without anything concerning an UI-upgrade for BGEE, BG2EE and IWDEE... :(

    AdullefreutKilivitzRavenslight
  • fortysevenfortyseven Member Posts: 70

    RadonGOG said:

    And another week passed without anything concerning an UI-upgrade for BGEE, BG2EE and IWDEE... :(

    The team is looking at UI fixes (not for the 2.6 patch, though), but currently I can't promise anything as it's unknown how many resources will be available.
    Does this mean the focus on infinity-engine games is widing down? I suppose it's understandable after all these years. However, I do really hope they get round to one last UI focused patch as there are some significant issues that would be great for the prosterity of the game if they could get fixed.

  • lefreutlefreut Member Posts: 1,462

    RadonGOG said:

    And another week passed without anything concerning an UI-upgrade for BGEE, BG2EE and IWDEE... :(

    The team is looking at UI fixes (not for the 2.6 patch, though), but currently I can't promise anything as it's unknown how many resources will be available.
    Does this mean the focus on infinity-engine games is widing down? I suppose it's understandable after all these years. However, I do really hope they get round to one last UI focused patch as there are some significant issues that would be great for the prosterity of the game if they could get fixed.
    It's pretty clear from all the past streams that most of the team is working on NWN:EE.

  • AdulAdul Member Posts: 1,998
    edited November 2018
    I'd be very disappointed indeed if the BG:EE and BGII:EE UIs remained in their current states for the years and decades to come. Part of that disappointment is already realized as the 2.0 release was over two years ago and it's been a mess since then, but it would be much more of a shame if it remained this way forever.

    It would be such a big shame that I don't think I'd personally be able to forgive it, even though I've been a supporter of Beamdog since the first announcement of BG:EE.

    Timbo0o0o0KilivitzPeccaRavenslight
  • AdulAdul Member Posts: 1,998
    edited November 2018
    ThacoBell said:

    If they do push out another UI overhaul, I hope its at least as good as the current one. I really like and would hate to end up with something less right before the end.

    You're right, that is a concern of mine as well.

  • RadonGOGRadonGOG Member Posts: 17

    RadonGOG said:

    And another week passed without anything concerning an UI-upgrade for BGEE, BG2EE and IWDEE... :(

    The team is looking at UI fixes (not for the 2.6 patch, though), but currently I can't promise anything as it's unknown how many resources will be available.
    Thanks for the answer!

    lefreut said:

    RadonGOG said:

    And another week passed without anything concerning an UI-upgrade for BGEE, BG2EE and IWDEE... :(

    The team is looking at UI fixes (not for the 2.6 patch, though), but currently I can't promise anything as it's unknown how many resources will be available.
    Does this mean the focus on infinity-engine games is widing down? I suppose it's understandable after all these years. However, I do really hope they get round to one last UI focused patch as there are some significant issues that would be great for the prosterity of the game if they could get fixed.
    It's pretty clear from all the past streams that most of the team is working on NWN:EE.
    I realise that. I guess I wasn't that clear. What I was asking about is are they putting the lid on the infinity-engine franchise for good. It sounds like there will be one more definite patch 2.6 which will fix some random bibs and bobs and then maybe (big maybe) there will be a 2.7 that might look more strongly at the UI. Which to me sounds like we are getting to the end of the road with the ongoing curation of these games (not exactly a big suprise). So I really hope the UI patch can happen before the plug is pulled.

    Also, if they do pull the plug I hope we get one last push on externalisations of the engine to open up the game as much as possible to modding.
    Agree on your post, but would like to add that it would be more suiting to call an UI-focused patch 3.X, as PSTEE (which already features a vastly superior UI, probably due to a total different design approach) is also in the 3.X-branch.

  • MirakMirak Member Posts: 774
    edited November 2018
    I honestly don't get why Beamdog spends so much time with the first NWN. I mean fine, creating new content in IE is tough, but still... Isn't NWN2 a much better candidate for not only enhancement, but has also a much more suitable and desirable engine for creating a new content?

    I'm currently playing NWN: EE Darkness over Daggerford and as much fun as I'm having, it's mostly thanks to the people in Ossian studios. Most of the enhancements in the EE are probably cosmetic, but why even bother, when everything is so fugly (like every early 2000's game in 3D). The towns are somewhat ok looking (even though EVERYTHING looks so boringly bland), but most of the other outside areas look downright laughable.

    And gameplay? Pathfinding is horrible as it always was, PC still trips over invisible barriers or doors, henchmen are stuck somewhere all the time for no apparent reason. I replayed the OC and both expansion packs 2 years ago and sadly I don't see any changes in EE, that actually made the game better gameplay wise.

    ThacoBellRaduziel
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,094
    @Mirak Enhancing NWN wouldn't improve the gameplay in any real way. Its boring to play largely because of how it was designed to play. There is no party control, so you just have your own character and an ai companion. This, combined with how ugly the game is, and the focus on player generated content (which is kinda pointless when the game isn't fun to play in the first place), and that NWN2 is basically better in every way, there isn't anything here for people who aren't already die hard fans.

    As to WHY, well NWN is Trent Osrer's baby. He worked on it back in the day, and he wants to make it the best he can.

  • Prince_RaymondPrince_Raymond Member Posts: 319
    That's beside the most obvious fact: NWN2 and its expansions were developed by Obsidian Entertainment, not BioWare. I'm guessing that if Beamdog wanted to create new content for that game, they would have to run a legal obstacle course to do so. Thank you for reading and happy gaming to all.

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,094
    @Prince_Raymond I actually don't think that's a factor here. Yes, that would prevent Beamdog from doing a remaster, but NWN2 was never a consideration for Trent. NWN1 is HIS baby. He wanted to come back to it because he wanted to make it the best it can be. Why would he remaster a similar game that fulfills the same purpose and function (better too) when it would take attention (and sales) away from the project that he really wants to do?

    Prince_Raymond
  • themazingnessthemazingness Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 670
    I see the NWN beta is out, but I'm not seeing True Type Fonts in the developer build in Steam yet. Will that feature be available in the near future?

    Sssiksseilor
  • AaezilAaezil Member Posts: 171
    Make an option to toggle between how the old ui/char screen looked in the old ie games please.. sorry but the new style just doesnt cut it and it would be nice to have a choice between new/old... Come to think about it all ee added content should be toggleable.

  • AdulAdul Member Posts: 1,998
    edited November 2018
    Aaezil said:

    Make an option to toggle between how the old ui/char screen looked in the old ie games please.. sorry but the new style just doesnt cut it and it would be nice to have a choice between new/old... Come to think about it all ee added content should be toggleable.

    The radical changes in style are just part of the failings of the 2.0 UI, and it's probably the least offensive bit for me. The more insidious problems in my estimation are the lazy design choices that have led to the diminished utility of much of the UI, as well as the general bugginess and lack of polish that's observable throughout the new UI. Essentially, I think the UI redesign needed more time, resources, and attention to detail.

    These issues would require serious effort to fix, and it's become increasingly clearer over time that such effort will likely not be spent.

    Post edited by Adul on
    KilivitzPeccaRavenslight
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,094
    @Adul Yeah, I've noticed some of these, others don't seem to be consistent. They are certainly issues, you are right. But these are bugs, and not intrinsic issues with how the UI is designed. A bug fix patch alone would fix these issues. When people talk about an overhaul, I picture scrapping everything (including the design) to start over.

    AdulAerakarTimbo0o0o0
  • AdulAdul Member Posts: 1,998
    Well, I don't need an overhaul then, I just need a patch. But I've been waiting for that patch for over two years.

    Some of the 2.0 UI issues actually have gotten fixed, but those are very very few compared to the issues I've listed above, especially considering the amount of time that has passed.

    lefreutThacoBellTimbo0o0o0Mirak
  • lefreutlefreut Member Posts: 1,462
    Adul said:

    Well, I don't need an overhaul then, I just need a patch. But I've been waiting for that patch for over two years.

    Some of the 2.0 UI issues actually have gotten fixed, but those are very very few compared to the issues I've listed above, especially considering the amount of time that has passed.

    And worse, they broke things in 2.5 (a patch that was not supposed to touch the UI) :'( Some of these regressions should be fixed in 2.6 but so far it seems not all of them.

    AdulThacoBellRavenslight
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,094
    There was the semi Beamdog sanctioned UI thread from a couple years ago that we were told the devs were watching. My guess would be that the UI will be the focus whatever patch comes after 2.6. If a full overhaul ends up being the final decision, there are a lot of good ideas in that thread.

    Adul
  • AdulAdul Member Posts: 1,998
    Hopefully so, but I've been awaiting such a patch with bated breath for a while now, and recent indications of things said in these livestreams/recaps have not exactly given me reasons to hold out hope.

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,094
    Beamdog has yet to flat out reneg on their promises. I doubt we would be told they were reading our feedback on the UI, only to not do anything about it.

  • AdulAdul Member Posts: 1,998
    As far as I know, all that ever happened is that they said they were looking at the suggestions, and the tickets on Redmine entered submitted status. They never promised they'd implement or fix anything.

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,094
    The thread was made before 2.5 was announced, and when it was, they said any UI fixes would be in the next major patch. 2.6 is a small scale patch, so there is hope.

  • AdulAdul Member Posts: 1,998
    Yeah, but more recently they also said this:

    The team is looking at UI fixes (not for the 2.6 patch, though), but currently I can't promise anything as it's unknown how many resources will be available.

  • lefreutlefreut Member Posts: 1,462
    In my opinion, the safer thing to do is to focus on fixing the UI bugs and unhardcode everything. For the rest, we have UI mods.

    ThacoBellAdulRavenslight
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