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Black Blade of Disaster THAC0 bonus?

AndreaColomboAndreaColombo Member Posts: 5,525
in Baldur's Gate II: Enhanced Edition
Apologies for what is potentially a silly question, but is the THAC0 bonus from Black Blade of Disaster supposed to be "only" +3?

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I haven't really used the spell before but I thought it'd give +5 (what with its hitting like it's +5 and giving +5 damage.)

Screenshot's from a brand new and unmodded ToB game; I just consolled in a scroll.

Comments

  • kjeronkjeron Member Posts: 2,367
    Normally it grants a +5 to-hit, but see: https://support.baldursgate.com/issues/38274
    Notably, this section:
    • Casting the spell does not immediately update the characters THAC0 stats (this is not just visual).
    • Updating the character (taking damage, altering their inventory in any way) will update their THAC0.
    • This is a side affect of Magical Weapons that grant their own proficiency, as it initially uses the proficiency value that existed prior to its casting.
    If I had to guess you already have specialization in Longswords.
    -3(Proficiency) + -3(Black Blade) = -1(Proficiency) + -5(Black Blade) = -6 total
    I don't know why it displays it this way, but it does.
    A non-proficient mage will display:
    -3(Proficiency) + +3(Black Blade) = +5(non-Proficient) + -5(Black Blade) = +/-0 total
  • AndreaColomboAndreaColombo Member Posts: 5,525
    Thank you very much, @kjeron and @sarevok57 .

    Out of curiosity, what is the benefit of striking as a +6 weapon? Are there enemies immune to +5 in the game?
  • Humanoid_TaifunHumanoid_Taifun Member Posts: 1,055
    The level 9 spell "Absolute Immunity" makes you immune against weapons up to enchantment level 5.
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 7,314
    AndreaColombo wrote: »
    Thank you very much, @kjeron and @sarevok57 .

    Out of curiosity, what is the benefit of striking as a +6 weapon? Are there enemies immune to +5 in the game?

    I don't think there are any benefits in the unmodded game. Absolute immunity requires +5 to hit and there's a demon that also requires +5 to hit, but I'm not aware of anything that needs +6.
  • AndreaColomboAndreaColombo Member Posts: 5,525
    Humanoid_Taifun wrote: »
    The level 9 spell "Absolute Immunity" makes you immune against weapons up to enchantment level 5.

    Possibly an SCS feature (as @Grond0 suggests that is not the case in the unmodded game)?

    It would indeed add value to BBoD and Carsomyr in its +6 form, but I would still want to dispel Absolute Immunity before attacking in all cases—so still not too much of a point to “striking as +6” except perhaps pride of ownership/wielding/striking (which is a legitimate goal in itself, mind you.)

  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 7,314
    AndreaColombo wrote: »
    Humanoid_Taifun wrote: »
    The level 9 spell "Absolute Immunity" makes you immune against weapons up to enchantment level 5.

    Possibly an SCS feature (as @Grond0 suggests that is not the case in the unmodded game)?

    It would indeed add value to BBoD and Carsomyr in its +6 form, but I would still want to dispel Absolute Immunity before attacking in all cases—so still not too much of a point to “striking as +6” except perhaps pride of ownership/wielding/striking (which is a legitimate goal in itself, mind you.)

    I was wrong though ;). It's not a spell I use, but in the vanilla manual it says absolute immunity protects against "all weapons except for those of +5 or better enchantment". That description has been changed in EE to "all weapons except for those of greater than +5 enchantment". Testing the spell itself it does indeed protect against +5, so either the spell has changed or (more likely) the original description is wrong.

    There is a component in SCS that increases the protective effect of mantle, improved mantle and absolute immunity by 1 - so if you had that installed that would mean the latter spell would protect even against +6 weapons.
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,975
    Grond0 wrote: »
    AndreaColombo wrote: »
    Humanoid_Taifun wrote: »
    The level 9 spell "Absolute Immunity" makes you immune against weapons up to enchantment level 5.

    Possibly an SCS feature (as @Grond0 suggests that is not the case in the unmodded game)?

    It would indeed add value to BBoD and Carsomyr in its +6 form, but I would still want to dispel Absolute Immunity before attacking in all cases—so still not too much of a point to “striking as +6” except perhaps pride of ownership/wielding/striking (which is a legitimate goal in itself, mind you.)

    I was wrong though ;). It's not a spell I use, but in the vanilla manual it says absolute immunity protects against "all weapons except for those of +5 or better enchantment". That description has been changed in EE to "all weapons except for those of greater than +5 enchantment". Testing the spell itself it does indeed protect against +5, so either the spell has changed or (more likely) the original description is wrong.

    There is a component in SCS that increases the protective effect of mantle, improved mantle and absolute immunity by 1 - so if you had that installed that would mean the latter spell would protect even against +6 weapons.

    im pretty sure in the original vanilla game, absolute immunity protected you against +5 weapons and less, regardless of what the actual spell description said
  • AndreaColomboAndreaColombo Member Posts: 5,525
    kjeron wrote: »
    If I had to guess you already have specialization in Longswords.
    -3(Proficiency) + -3(Black Blade) = -1(Proficiency) + -5(Black Blade) = -6 total
    I don't know why it displays it this way, but it does.
    A non-proficient mage will display:
    -3(Proficiency) + +3(Black Blade) = +5(non-Proficient) + -5(Black Blade) = +/-0 total

    That's exactly it. I changed something in my character's inventory and I had the correct THAC0 bonus.

    Thank you!
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