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Can Nalia use potion of Master Thievery?

fncruzfncruz Member Posts: 26
I am replaying after a few years. When Nalia, who is thief 4 and now a mage, drinks a portion of master thievery the symbol that would normally appear indicating the effect of taking that potion is not there and her pickpocketing is not higher.

I have SCS installed.

Is this normal?

Post edited by fncruz on
iosfrustration

Comments

  • OrlonKronsteenOrlonKronsteen Member Posts: 789
    It's not normal - the potion should work. I couldn't tell you what's wrong, however. Do you have any other mods installed? If so, you might look into those first. I can't imagine SCS having any effect on thieving skills. The only SCS component I can think of that 'might' affect thieves would be the one that allows you to allocate points in multiples of five. There is also the NPC customization and management component, but I don't know if it affects thief abilities in any way. For the record, I have never installed either of these components and I have never heard of this bug before. But if you have them installed you might try uninstalling them and run a test with Nalia, just to see.

    iosfrustrationJuliusBorisov
  • MaurvirMaurvir Member Posts: 684
    Nalia may be a terrible thief, but she still has that as a class so it should work. BTW, does the potion show as red for her? It shouldn't, but that would be a sign that she can't use it.

    I haven't had her in a party since using SCS, though, so I would have to try it out.

    iosfrustration
  • iosfrustrationiosfrustration Member Posts: 132
    I love the way Nalia plays from an RP perspective. In her backstory as a noble on the side of peasants she is well-meaning but often does more harm than good. As a character she technically is a thief, but again often does more harm than good.
    This mirroring would be even more perfect if it were possible to dual to a wild mage. She would wander the world like a well-meaning natural disaster - spreading goodwill, kind words and inadvertent destruction in her wake.

    In the case on Nalia a potion of Master Thievery could be safely be renamed as a potion of Adequate Thievery. But she is a thief and they should work just fine.
    SCS is infinitely configurable. I can’t think of a particular setting that would cause this, but it’s probably tucked away in there somewhere.

    RedRodent
  • ilduderinoilduderino Member Posts: 591
    edited July 5
    I think it’s a shame in a game that had fewer joinable npcs than BG, which had a very good range of races and classes, they basically went with an inferior clone of Imoen. The game was begging for more thief types (of which there were a nice bunch in BG and this is thankfully addressed somewhat with Hexxat).

    Blackbɨrd
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,077
    @ilduderino That's because Nalia was Imoen's replacement. Imoen was originally going to die in spellhold, so would be unusable outside the starting dungeon.

  • ilduderinoilduderino Member Posts: 591
    edited July 5
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    @ilduderino That's because Nalia was Imoen's replacement. Imoen was originally going to die in spellhold, so would be unusable outside the starting dungeon.

    True, they could have easily had her as a single class thief ready for dualling or have dualled her at a higher level than Imo though - two easy ways to make her better. She’s barely enough thief regardless of whether she is a permanent replacement. Or have her as an interesting multi

  • ilduderinoilduderino Member Posts: 591
    edited July 5
    I agree though I think most of the BG2 NPCs do as well. She is quite annoying and they could have given her a slightly different backstory to match whatever class didn’t make her an inferior copy of Imo. I can never justify taking her instead of Imo from an RP perspective and even if I could she is the same but worse. You can take them both but I would rather a bit more variety than two female good human thieves dualled to a mage. Maybe a non avarial or drow elf? Even BG managed to avoid such close matching of npcs and that had more possible joiners

  • VanDerBergVanDerBerg Member Posts: 125
    BG had far too many thieves, most of which I personally never used. But BG2 goes to the other extreme, especially if you want a good party - you have basically one option in Jan unless you are happy to use the thief just for picking locks and detecting traps (which is how I usually use them). SoD was even worse. Jan is at least likeable. The two most annoying characters in the whole series for me are Safana and Glint, which happen to be the only thieves available in SoD.

    All that said, Nalia was lovely in the playthrough I am currently doing. She wasn't annoying at all to me and I think her character was very well written, better than most of the others. Still, I ditched her before Spellhold, because Imoen is Imoen. Imoen and Jaheira just have to be there. No compromises.

    DJKajuruiosfrustration
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,077
    ilduderino wrote: »
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    @ilduderino That's because Nalia was Imoen's replacement. Imoen was originally going to die in spellhold, so would be unusable outside the starting dungeon.

    True, they could have easily had her as a single class thief ready for dualling or have dualled her at a higher level than Imo though - two easy ways to make her better. She’s barely enough thief regardless of whether she is a permanent replacement. Or have her as an interesting multi

    Nalia is perfectly sufficient for the essential thief needs. Get the ring of lockpicks and danger sense, and you're good to go.

    @VanDerBerg You don't like Glint?! I'm pretty sure that's illegal.

  • MaurvirMaurvir Member Posts: 684
    I never understood why so many NPCs were either killed outright, or unavoidably killed, in BG2. What were the devs smoking to think those were good ideas? It would have made for so much better continuity to be able to have some of your old team back? Also, I can't fathom the idiot who tried to green light killing Imoen after what happened in BG1. She was apparently a last minute afterthought, put in to make sure the player had at least one party member who would never leave them, but she became so beloved that most people take her regardless of whether they are running a good or evil party.

    There was some serious idiocy at work when it came to decisions about NPCs in BG2. Serious idiocy. I still get steamed about Safana and Coran, moreso than Khalid and Dynaheir, because there is no way to salvage them.

    This is one reason I love the NPC mods - I can have consistent party members through the games.

  • VanDerBergVanDerBerg Member Posts: 125
    edited July 6
    You don't like Glint?! I'm pretty sure that's illegal.

    I know, I am such a rebel.

    If it helps, in my one and only playthrough of SoD, I had him in the party instead of Safana, because I found her even more annoying. So I can say I had him in 100% of my SoD playthroughs.

    But as a character, at least to me, he is ridiculously over the top and totally unbelievable for the game setting. Basically a poor man's attempt on Jan v2. He can't even say he is tired without going into annoying drivel which I presume was supposed to be funny, but which I find extremely dull. And Safana speaks like a cheap 21st century hooker, so I almost wanted to kick Glint out of my party and just play thieveless and walk into all those traps instead of listening to either of them.

    DJKajuru
  • DJKajuruDJKajuru Member Posts: 3,277
    edited July 6
    My two cents:

    I don't really like Glint, either. Too high energy all the time. IMO beamdog's npcs writing is too, um , "in your face"? I mean , I feel that npcs like glint , baeloth or neera are written in a way that they *try* to be funny all the time, while characters like Edwin and Jan work well on the funny side because they do the exact opposite.
    Jan speaks the most ridiculous things as if he were giving some serious advice, and he doesn't sound cartoonish or funny, in fact he's always telling stories and speaking of turnips as if it were small talk, not jokes. Edwin doesn't "play smart", his high intelligence is shown as someone who's always thinking and plotting, so whenever you need him to do something simple he'll respond to it as if he were doing you a big favor, because anything and anyone around him is a nuisance. I'm not saying that Jan and Edwin aren't meant to be funny, they are, but they are not showboats or overacted.

    As for Nalia, I've always loved her as character. RPwise she is consistent and a proof that CG doesn't mean cocky or outlaw, but rather someone who wishes to change the current system by other means. Mechanically if already have a thief then she is a mage who can use a shortbow, has two quests and a very powerful magic item, by AD&D means she is not weak at all.

  • masteralephmasteraleph Member Posts: 94
    Maurvir wrote: »
    I never understood why so many NPCs were either killed outright, or unavoidably killed, in BG2. What were the devs smoking to think those were good ideas? It would have made for so much better continuity to be able to have some of your old team back?

    Note the large number of people around here who kill partnered characters or lock them into a house somewhere in BG1. Particularly in BG2, where one of the best parts of the game is the party dialogue, being forced to take along paired NPCs would cause significantly reduced dialogue and replayability.
    Also, I can't fathom the idiot who tried to green light killing Imoen after what happened in BG1. She was apparently a last minute afterthought, put in to make sure the player had at least one party member who would never leave them, but she became so beloved that most people take her regardless of whether they are running a good or evil party.

    Also, fridging characters was a lot more popular in the 90s.
    There was some serious idiocy at work when it came to decisions about NPCs in BG2. Serious idiocy. I still get steamed about Safana and Coran, moreso than Khalid and Dynaheir, because there is no way to salvage them.

    This is one reason I love the NPC mods - I can have consistent party members through the games.

    I can hear that. I do wonder, though, how popular Coran and Safana really were given that there aren’t really significant mods for them (vs Kivan and Ajantis for example).

  • ilduderinoilduderino Member Posts: 591
    edited July 6
    I can hear that. I do wonder, though, how popular Coran and Safana really were given that there aren’t really significant mods for them (vs Kivan and Ajantis for example).

    There’s a great Coran mod, very well done characterwise and provides a missing multi class option - it’s very nice to have a good thief that levels up!!

    Post edited by ilduderino on
  • DJKajuruDJKajuru Member Posts: 3,277
    edited July 6
    I can hear that. I do wonder, though, how popular Coran and Safana really were given that there aren’t really significant mods for them (vs Kivan and Ajantis for example).

    Mods of BG1 NPCs in BG2 don't really reflect on how popular the npc was, but rather on how liked the npc is by the modder who did it.

    RedRodentThacoBell
  • MaurvirMaurvir Member Posts: 684
    I do agree that not having an option in vanilla to split pairs was a bad idea. It forced you to take characters that might not have fit the party. Realistic, perhaps, but it did make building the idea party difficult in the days before mod added NPCs.

    I was glad to see that go by the wayside in BG2.

  • RedRodentRedRodent Member Posts: 78
    Cast me as a contrarian then, because I really missed the pair ups in BG2. It's true it impedes player freedom, but I think it adds a lot of valuable flavour to the NPCs. Having party members be connected to eachother even before you meet them is a pretty effective way of providing depth and world building. And I'll always be a sucker for character-specific reactions to when their partner falls in battle. :)

    ilduderino
  • MaurvirMaurvir Member Posts: 684
    RedRodent wrote: »
    Cast me as a contrarian then, because I really missed the pair ups in BG2. It's true it impedes player freedom, but I think it adds a lot of valuable flavour to the NPCs. Having party members be connected to eachother even before you meet them is a pretty effective way of providing depth and world building. And I'll always be a sucker for character-specific reactions to when their partner falls in battle. :)

    Oh, I agree with that. I just wish there was an RP friendly way to separate them if need be.

    RedRodent
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 11,077
    Never mind killing so many old npcs, why the heck are so many people from the sword coast migrating to Athkatla?! Nearly EVERYONE just happens to gone south to Amn at the same time as charname. Its ridiculous. I'd have been happier with fewer cameos and more new npcs.

    RedRodentilduderinoBalrog99
  • ilduderinoilduderino Member Posts: 591
    edited July 7
    The cast of BG get off lightly compared to the cast of Game of Thrones.

  • ReticentReticent Member Posts: 109
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Never mind killing so many old npcs, why the heck are so many people from the sword coast migrating to Athkatla?! Nearly EVERYONE just happens to gone south to Amn at the same time as charname. Its ridiculous. I'd have been happier with fewer cameos and more new npcs.

    Economy was shot after the iron crisis, and the neighborhoods went downhill once the only way to keep the slime infestations at bay was the vigorous application of pointy sticks.

    ThacoBell
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