They also updated reputation so that Neutral NPCs are happy at 20 reputation, and only break at 1 reputation, and also have a much lower tolerance level at neutral / unhappy than good characters.
So as long as your reputation doesn't get too low, Neutral NPCs will rarely complain now which I like (why would a neutral character have been unhappy with being a 20 reputation hero in the first place?).
One thing that's wrong with that though is that Lawful Neutrals should never break or complain if they have sworn an oath of service. Druid / TN beliefs in balance had nothing to do with reputation, and self centred CNs would be happy to have a glorious reputation and to be known as heroes to everyone else, they just wouldn't care about other peoples reputation so long as it had no effect on theirs. Technically a CN character should complain any time a parties action damages their reputation, and sing praise any time their reputation is increased.
neera: casts finger of death wild surge: no save Neera's pretty awesome
... you forgot the other best part ; wild surge ; 'on the caster' ! ;D (or any fireball, skull, etc.. fun too 'on your party'.. in the middle of a fight ) But that's fun too, yeah... can be.. ))
Neera and Edwin conflict is more or less a way to avoid power abuse, the late game is made for mages, imagine 2 level 30 excepcional mages, edwin with his extra spell slots and neera using time stop, dragon's breath and more with level 1 spell slots, that would make the game cheese.
If you don't want an evil party member, then sure. Also, if you've used Edwin so many times that you're overly familiar with him. NRD abuse is also fun.
No I mean in the way that Edwin is so strong that it makes me want to beat him up of jelousy that he is a better mage then my pc(he really is) and I know that he can wipe the floor the city and the nation of Amn with both at the same level.
Neera's always good for a laugh. Sometimes when combat is scrolling by too fast, I miss a surge and several rounds later I'm like 'Hey, where my Planetar at?' and she's like 'Hey, I destroyed all 300k of ur gold! For the lulz!'
I don't like Edwin (despite his hilarious banters and voice) just because he feels overpowered. He gets way, way too many spells for my taste. That's just a preference for me, and some people like that aspect.
Hmm is that wild mage mod that adds all those cool spells like wild horde available for EE yet? So far the lack of that mod is the only reason I haven't take Neera yet, though I really want to...
They also updated reputation so that Neutral NPCs are happy at 20 reputation, and only break at 1 reputation, and also have a much lower tolerance level at neutral / unhappy than good characters.
So as long as your reputation doesn't get too low, Neutral NPCs will rarely complain now which I like (why would a neutral character have been unhappy with being a 20 reputation hero in the first place?).
One thing that's wrong with that though is that Lawful Neutrals should never break or complain if they have sworn an oath of service. Druid / TN beliefs in balance had nothing to do with reputation, and self centred CNs would be happy to have a glorious reputation and to be known as heroes to everyone else, they just wouldn't care about other peoples reputation so long as it had no effect on theirs. Technically a CN character should complain any time a parties action damages their reputation, and sing praise any time their reputation is increased.
Well, it depends on what type of Neutral alignment the NPC is. For example, Chaotic Neutral and Lawful Neutral characters typically don't have a problem with high-reputation party leaders, since Chaotic Neutral people are self-centered and often disinterested in the greater effect of their actions, and Lawful Neutral people are more interested in the organization and orderliness of the group and its actions (though some qualms may be had if the party leader is overly individualistic or unique).
The only real issue comes with True Neutral characters, who typically seek balance over all else, including the greater good or benefit of others. This alignment is rarely found in people, however, and those who are True Neutral tend to exhibit biases anyway, whether they are motivated by personal interests or the greater effect on society. Jaheira, for example, displays motives and behaviors which are self-serving and tend to benefit the greater good, at least insomuch as it helps her friends and companions. In the second game, she even
renounces her allegiance with the Harpers due to moral conflicts between her interests and those of the organization
. Plus, I wouldn't be surprised if Khalid's Neutral Good temperament rubbed off on Jaheira during their marriage.
At least, this is how I understand the alignment spectrum's Neutral category in relation to Good-aligned characters, especially in the games. Remember that in later additions and installments of Dungeons & Dragons, more complex alignment systems were introduced, some of which permitted individuals to be Neutral Good with Chaotic Good individualism and a Lawful Good demeanor, such as myself, or even Evil-aligned characters with benevolent streaks. Alignment, especially if you try to apply it to the real world, can be much more complex.
I don't know, maybe it's just me, but I have a hard time with all the EE characters. Dorn is boooring. Hexxat is also boooring and irritating, and the voice acting for her is especially bad, the dialogue woefully uninteresting. To me, Neera is flat-out immersion-breaking. Her style of dialogue, the way she speaks, doesn't fit the game's tone. She seems out of place and out of time. She can be entertaining, though, not knowing what spell will come from her. That adds some unexpected twists. If I play her, it's usually because of the romance.
As for a comparison between her and Ediwn as mages, the power Edwin obtains is impressive. Sure, you don't need him, but even so, no other mage can touch him. And he's funny in a snide way. Of course, it helps too that I usually choose Neutral Evil or Chaotic Evil for my PC. Where's the fun in being a goody-too shoes?
I've had a man crush on Edwin since BG1. Even in vanilla BG1 he was by far the best magic user in the game. When you take him on complete run BG1 -> ToB he becomes an absolute terror. Really the kind of mage that fits perfectly with an unbeatable company of heroes like in late ToB.
Neera is funny and wild magic has its upsides, but since you can't combine her with Edwin (maybe there is a mod for that?) I don't really use her that much.
I quite enjoy helping out people (even if they're only fictional), fixing their problems, and seeing them safe, happy and prosperous. Gives me good feelings.
But I do agree that in general the EE companions do fall short of the standard set by the original games.
Dorn seems far too one-dimensional ("My patron says kill. I kill.")
Rasaad has an interesting background and character arc, but it feels like his story from BG1 to ToB is all about his brother and chasing down Alorgoth. It's like we never really get to know him "outside of work", if that makes sense, quite similar to a certain paladin from NWN2 that won't stop harping about Old Owl Well. :P
Hexxat I felt had a lot of potential for exploring the difficulties of maintaining your own identity when you are afflicted with Vampirism, but the vampire part gets relegated to a mechanics role and barely gets mentioned. (For instance, through conversations with companions we learn that Hexxat goes out at nights to find victims to drink from, but we never see this happen, nor can we really confront her about it if she's in the party.)
Neera does definitely feel "out of place", as you put it, using mannerisms and terms that seem far too modern. ("Meat shield"??) Still, her story and character development is interesting enough that I'm willing to give her a pass.
That said, I was VERY impressed by M'Khiin's character from SoD. Whoever wrote her, her interactions and her stories deserves a commendation!
Wild Mages are a mixed bag. They are potentially the strongest and weakest characters in the game. I mean I've never had Edwin throw multiple Symbol, Stuns at enemies at mid-level, and I'll never expect him to be able to do that. Neera can, however. With wildly (heh) mixed results. The highs are amazingly high (it's so nice to fight high level enemies who just stand there while you beat them to death) and the lows are... well.
I'd argue that she can potentially be Baeloth-in-BG1-level OP in BG2 in the right hands/with some luck, though that never really happens in BG1 because it's harder to find high level spell scrolls.
And that's not counting if you get real lucky in your adventures and end up looting a very rare high level spell scroll from randoms and then just Ooooooooooooooh.
as long as my neera is able to cast lev 7 spells she is able (using a clone) to spam ADHW (thank to the CW to provide the scroll to learn it in chap 2) and wish (2 scrolls in WK).
this mean that neera from the very moment she can cast PI has much more spells/day available, and also the other casters and the items with charges/day will benefit, and can spam as much high level spells as lev 1 slots she has. from that point of the game she memorizes no other lev 1 spells.
neera: casts finger of death
wild surge: no save
Neera's pretty awesome
... you forgot the other best part ;
wild surge ; 'on the caster' ! ;D
(or any fireball, skull, etc.. fun too 'on your party'.. in the middle of a fight )
But that's fun too, yeah... can be.. ))
on a whole run with neera i had few bad surges but needed 0 reloads even abusing of the dwehomers.
a clone is the key to avoid the on the caster surge, and a wild mage should never use his spells to buff the party, it is not a 100% sure way to go, but the chance that a bad surge really creates a problem is greatly reduced. in end tob every PI of my neera can cast like 9-11 lev 9 spells, 6 of them has not to be memorized before and naturally ignore the 1 spell/round limit. her simulacrum is almost as good, and can work in tandem with the PI, no edwin or no other mage can bring to a single battle like 20 lev 9 spells + 2 full spellbooks at the other levels.
when i really use the potential fo a high level neera usually, won the battle, i have still plenty of lev 9 spells capability from her clones that i can get the wish for rest option from the same clones i used for the battle, this gives an idea of the real power of a wild mage...
also edwin is really powerful, before that phase surely more then neera, but he has some mechanical problems, there is no control on the spells his simulacrum retains (EE only) and a barred school of magic.
probably my way of playing affects the thing, as i usually have multiple casters and i try to use the spells, not to abuse of them, but usually my parties have to sleep because they get fatigued, not because they need more spells, if not is special situations like a hard battle with a boss that needs specific spells.
so i find the more spells edwin can memorize useful but far from game changing, with him as a main mage i could spam a little more spells in situations where are not really needed, but even without him or neera i never really found a situation where i really needed more spells if not in early soa.
i have little experience with edwin because i can not stand his personality and the way he relates with the rest of the party, but even so i fail to see how he should be so superior to the other mages for the simple reason that he has more spells/day.
i am talking of bg2 as we are in the bg2 section, in bg a couple (3 as he is specialized) more spells/level can make the difference.
Comments
So as long as your reputation doesn't get too low, Neutral NPCs will rarely complain now which I like (why would a neutral character have been unhappy with being a 20 reputation hero in the first place?).
One thing that's wrong with that though is that Lawful Neutrals should never break or complain if they have sworn an oath of service. Druid / TN beliefs in balance had nothing to do with reputation, and self centred CNs would be happy to have a glorious reputation and to be known as heroes to everyone else, they just wouldn't care about other peoples reputation so long as it had no effect on theirs. Technically a CN character should complain any time a parties action damages their reputation, and sing praise any time their reputation is increased.
wild surge ; 'on the caster' ! ;D
(or any fireball, skull, etc.. fun too 'on your party'.. in the middle of a fight
But that's fun too, yeah... can be.. ))
Well I'd say "(.)(.)" but there is this one scroll....
Also, if you've used Edwin so many times that you're overly familiar with him.
NRD abuse is also fun. I think you have it the other way around.
I don't like Edwin (despite his hilarious banters and voice) just because he feels overpowered. He gets way, way too many spells for my taste. That's just a preference for me, and some people like that aspect.
Neera - Casts Disintegrate
Wild Surge: Area of Affect
Minsc - Death
Valygar - Death
Aerie - Death
.... -_-
Edwin is funnier, better and more awesome.
For a mage he gets an A
Neerda gets a D because im in a good mood.
The only real issue comes with True Neutral characters, who typically seek balance over all else, including the greater good or benefit of others. This alignment is rarely found in people, however, and those who are True Neutral tend to exhibit biases anyway, whether they are motivated by personal interests or the greater effect on society. Jaheira, for example, displays motives and behaviors which are self-serving and tend to benefit the greater good, at least insomuch as it helps her friends and companions. In the second game, she even
At least, this is how I understand the alignment spectrum's Neutral category in relation to Good-aligned characters, especially in the games. Remember that in later additions and installments of Dungeons & Dragons, more complex alignment systems were introduced, some of which permitted individuals to be Neutral Good with Chaotic Good individualism and a Lawful Good demeanor, such as myself, or even Evil-aligned characters with benevolent streaks. Alignment, especially if you try to apply it to the real world, can be much more complex.
As for a comparison between her and Ediwn as mages, the power Edwin obtains is impressive. Sure, you don't need him, but even so, no other mage can touch him. And he's funny in a snide way. Of course, it helps too that I usually choose Neutral Evil or Chaotic Evil for my PC. Where's the fun in being a goody-too shoes?
Neera is funny and wild magic has its upsides, but since you can't combine her with Edwin (maybe there is a mod for that?) I don't really use her that much.
I quite enjoy helping out people (even if they're only fictional), fixing their problems, and seeing them safe, happy and prosperous. Gives me good feelings.
But I do agree that in general the EE companions do fall short of the standard set by the original games.
Dorn seems far too one-dimensional ("My patron says kill. I kill.")
Rasaad has an interesting background and character arc, but it feels like his story from BG1 to ToB is all about his brother and chasing down Alorgoth. It's like we never really get to know him "outside of work", if that makes sense, quite similar to a certain paladin from NWN2 that won't stop harping about Old Owl Well. :P
Hexxat I felt had a lot of potential for exploring the difficulties of maintaining your own identity when you are afflicted with Vampirism, but the vampire part gets relegated to a mechanics role and barely gets mentioned. (For instance, through conversations with companions we learn that Hexxat goes out at nights to find victims to drink from, but we never see this happen, nor can we really confront her about it if she's in the party.)
Neera does definitely feel "out of place", as you put it, using mannerisms and terms that seem far too modern. ("Meat shield"??) Still, her story and character development is interesting enough that I'm willing to give her a pass.
That said, I was VERY impressed by M'Khiin's character from SoD. Whoever wrote her, her interactions and her stories deserves a commendation!
I'd argue that she can potentially be Baeloth-in-BG1-level OP in BG2 in the right hands/with some luck, though that never really happens in BG1 because it's harder to find high level spell scrolls.
And that's not counting if you get real lucky in your adventures and end up looting a very rare high level spell scroll from randoms and then just Ooooooooooooooh.
this mean that neera from the very moment she can cast PI has much more spells/day available, and also the other casters and the items with charges/day will benefit, and can spam as much high level spells as lev 1 slots she has. from that point of the game she memorizes no other lev 1 spells. on a whole run with neera i had few bad surges but needed 0 reloads even abusing of the dwehomers.
a clone is the key to avoid the on the caster surge, and a wild mage should never use his spells to buff the party, it is not a 100% sure way to go, but the chance that a bad surge really creates a problem is greatly reduced. in end tob every PI of my neera can cast like 9-11 lev 9 spells, 6 of them has not to be memorized before and naturally ignore the 1 spell/round limit. her simulacrum is almost as good, and can work in tandem with the PI, no edwin or no other mage can bring to a single battle like 20 lev 9 spells + 2 full spellbooks at the other levels.
when i really use the potential fo a high level neera usually, won the battle, i have still plenty of lev 9 spells capability from her clones that i can get the wish for rest option from the same clones i used for the battle, this gives an idea of the real power of a wild mage...
also edwin is really powerful, before that phase surely more then neera, but he has some mechanical problems, there is no control on the spells his simulacrum retains (EE only) and a barred school of magic.
probably my way of playing affects the thing, as i usually have multiple casters and i try to use the spells, not to abuse of them, but usually my parties have to sleep because they get fatigued, not because they need more spells, if not is special situations like a hard battle with a boss that needs specific spells.
so i find the more spells edwin can memorize useful but far from game changing, with him as a main mage i could spam a little more spells in situations where are not really needed, but even without him or neera i never really found a situation where i really needed more spells if not in early soa.
i have little experience with edwin because i can not stand his personality and the way he relates with the rest of the party, but even so i fail to see how he should be so superior to the other mages for the simple reason that he has more spells/day.
i am talking of bg2 as we are in the bg2 section, in bg a couple (3 as he is specialized) more spells/level can make the difference.