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Yuan-Ti Mage in Lower Reaches below Temple District

YelocessejYelocessej Member Posts: 182
in Baldur's Gate II: Enhanced Edition
This Yuan-Ti mentally dominated Yoshimo despite him rolling a 20 (!) on his saving throw. What gives!? Why do so many enemies not play by the rules?

Comments

  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 8,264
    Well, this isnt 3E rules where you always succeed at a save if you roll a 20. That said, the game usually only shows your save rolls if you succeed at a save. I have seen odd things like this happen before and I am not entirely sure what the cause is...
  • YelocessejYelocessej Member Posts: 182
    Oh, I didn't mean to imply the natural 20 on saves worked like on attack rolls, just that a 20 roll, even with some neg modifiers, is going to be way above the saving throw for a thief of Yoshimo's level...
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    Two possibilities:
    1. One or more parts of the Mental Domination spell is/are erroneously tagged as not offering a save, in which case you'd get the save vs. spell message despite still being affected by another part of the spell.
    2. More likely, that save vs. spell is from a different spell that did not affect Yoshimo.
  • YelocessejYelocessej Member Posts: 182
    I wish it showed failed rolls.
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,975
    kind of unnecessary to show failed rolls, you know what you need to fail, for example; if you have a save vs death/paralyze/poison 5, that means you need a 5 or higher on your save to succeed, so if you see a save vs death of 5 or above that means you passed, if you got 4 or lower, no doubt you have the affect on you, but mostly I think the reason why you don't see failed saves is again, you already know what you need to fail
  • joluvjoluv Member Posts: 2,137
    @sarevok57: I disagree. I don't always know which save is used for a given spell/ability or what the penalty/bonus is. Does Flesh to Stone check your save vs. polymorph/petrification or vs. spell? Does Umber Hulk confusion have a save penalty? I could look it up, but it would be nice to have that information in the combat feedback.
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 8,264
    Yeah, seeing failed save rolls would also make it a heck of a lot easier to figure out bugs like this one too.
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,975
    usually for my parties my melee guys are the ones getting bashed with all the saves and with 3 melee guys I can usually get their save vs death/spell close to 0 or lower, which basically makes it so they save every time, maybe that's the reason why im not so concerned if I see a fail or not
  • YelocessejYelocessej Member Posts: 182
    "If it CAN happen, it WILL happen (and more than once)." ~Murphy's Law (Murphy musta played 2nd Edition)
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    edited December 2015
    I said it before and I will say it again but I already rolled a critical miss on a saving throw !
    Despite the evidences and what the developers said about it.

    I was once playing a solo F/M/T without xp cap in BG1, I got him to -5 or better saves vs everything and after a rest, I casted Spirit Armor and failed the save vs spell (at -0) .

    So I'm sure there are some circumstances in which you can fail a save which was supposed to be an automatic success. (bug/Bg1/precise patch / precise spell/ because it was a selfbuff / anything / I don't know)
    Post edited by Gotural on
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    @Gotural: What exactly did you see? Did you see a failed save or a successful save? Or did you just get hit by the damage? Because failed saves never show up in the dialog box.
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    It shows :

    Charname-Casts Spirit Armor : Charname
    Charname-Auto-Paused : Spell Cast
    Charname-Armor

    I remember it very well and I even took a screenshot for two reasons. Firstly because we had a talk already on the forum concerning saving throws failures and secondly because there is a bug with Spirit Armor which prevents you to save your game if you fail your save which is pretty annoying.

    Unfortunately I didn't take a screenshot of my saving throws so the screenshot of my failed save is a bit useless.
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    I have confirmed that there are no critical failures for saving throws in BG2:EE. I created a custom spell that repeated itself constantly, forcing the target to make a save at no penalty every second or take 1 fire damage. I then set Jaheira's save vs. spell to 1 and Minsc's save vs. spell to 2. Jaheira never once failed her save in over 50 iterations, rolling several 1's in the process, while Minsc failed a save eventually.
    image
    image

    If a character has a save vs. spell of 1 and there are no penalties involved, there is a 100% chance of making any save vs. spell. There is no chance of failure.
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    In the end, I'm sure you are all right. There is no critical failure for saving throws in general.

    It still happened to me once, (and I found another screenshot of my character which indicates I have a base save of -2 vs spells without any buffs) so maybe in some very rare instances with very specific conditions you can rolled a critical failure, but it's definitely a bug.
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    @bengoshi @semiticgod

    Here it is, I have another proof, with screenshots.

    It is happening during the fight with Haz, the Mage guarding the key in the Shadow Thieves Guildhall. He is using a Spell Sequencer with Web + Stinking Cloud, I have a save vs spell of -2 and Web offers a save versus spell at -2. Which means my save is at 0, and still I got webbed.

    image
    image

    I'm not under the effect of Greater Malison / Doom or others effects, it would display on my buffs or saving throws anyway.

    It could mean the end of my no-reload run ... :disappointed:
  • Lord_TansheronLord_Tansheron Member Posts: 4,211
    I assume no mods are involved? I know that BGTweaks offers an option to introduce save penalties based on caster level. That could explain this behavior, if it was installed.
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    My Weidu log.

    // Log of Currently Installed WeiDU Mods
    // The top of the file is the 'oldest' mod
    // ~TP2_File~ #language_number #component_number // [Subcomponent Name -> ] Component Name [ : Version]
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #130 // Force All Dialogue to Pause Game: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1010 // More Interjections: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1020 // Alter HP Triggers for NPC Wounded Dialogues: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1040 // Improved Athkatlan City Guard: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1080 // Add Bags of Holding: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1101 // Do Not Reveal City Maps When Entering Area: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1120 // Stores Sell Higher Stacks of Items: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1170 // Bonus Merchants (Baldurdash): v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1220 // Allow Cromwell to Upgrade Watcher's Keep Items: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #1230 // Allow Cespenar to Use Cromwell Recipes: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2060 // Weapon Styles for All: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2090 // Change Experience Point Cap -> Remove Experience Cap: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2140 // Expanded Dual-Class Options: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2151 // Wear Multiple Protection Items -> No Restrictions: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2200 // Multi-Class Grandmastery (Weimer): v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2210 // True Grandmastery (Baldurdash): v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2300 // Triple-Class HLA Tables: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2352 // Alter Multiclass Restrictions -> Install both of the above options: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2360 // Remove Racial Restrictions for Single Classes: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2371 // Alter Dual-class Restrictions -> Allow non-humans to dual-class: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #2380 // Remove Racial Restrictions for Kits: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #3000 // Higher HP on Level Up -> Maximum: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #3010 // Maximum HP for NPCs (the bigg) -> For All Creatures in Game: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #3030 // Easy Spell Learning -> 100% Learn Spells: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #3040 // Make Bags of Holding Bottomless: v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #3070 // Change Effect of Reputation on Store Prices -> Low Reputation Store Discount (Sabre): v16
    ~BG2_TWEAKS/SETUP-BG2_TWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #4020 // ToB-Style NPCs: v16
    ~IWDIFICATION/SETUP-IWDIFICATION.TP2~ #0 #30 // IWD Arcane Spell Pack: Beta 2
    ~IWDIFICATION/SETUP-IWDIFICATION.TP2~ #0 #40 // IWD Divine Spell Pack: Beta 2
    ~IWDIFICATION/SETUP-IWDIFICATION.TP2~ #0 #50 // IWD Bard Song: Beta 2
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #0 // Proper dual-wielding implementation for Thieves and Bards: v4.80
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #3 // Proper racial adjustments for thieving skills: v4.80
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #4 // Bard kit revisions: v4.80
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #5 // Bard High Level Ability revisions: v4.80
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #7 // Additional equipment for Thieves and Bards: v4.80
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #8 // Upgradeable Equipment: v4.80
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #9 // Revised Thievery -> Use PnP thievery potions and prevent their effects from stacking: v4.80
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #11 // Chosen of Cyric encounter: v4.80
    ~RR/SETUP-RR.TP2~ #0 #12 // Shadow Thief Improvements: v4.80
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #1000 // Initialise mod (all other components require this): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #1910 // Protection from Normal Missiles also blocks Arrows of Fire/Cold/Acid and similar projectiles without pluses: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2000 // Allow Spellstrike to take down a Protection from Magic scroll: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2010 // More consistent Breach spell (always affects liches and rakshasas; doesn't penetrate Spell Turning): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2020 // Antimagic attacks penetrate improved invisibility: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2050 // Allow individual versions of Spell Immunity to be placed into Contingencies and Spell Triggers: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2070 // Blade Barrier and Globe of Blades only affect hostile creatures: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2080 // Cap damage done by Skull Trap at 12d6: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2090 // Make Power-Word: Blind single-target: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2120 // Slightly weaken insect plague spells, and let fire shields block them: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2140 // Slightly increase the power of Mantle, Improved Mantle, and Absolute Immunity: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2150 // Make spell sequencers, spell triggers, and contingencies learnable by all mages: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2160 // Add an extra copy of some hard-to-find spell scrolls: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2170 // True Sight/True Seeing spells protect from magical blindness: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2180 // Prevent Simulacra and Projected Images from using magical items: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #3100 // Make the healing and resurrection powers of the Rod of Resurrection into separate abilities: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4010 // Grant large, flying, non-solid or similar creatures protection from Web and Entangle: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4040 // Make party members less likely to die irreversibly: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4180 // Make Freedom scrolls available earlier: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4240 // Treat mages' and priests' High-Level Abilities as innate abilities rather than memorisable spells (each may be taken only once): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #5000 // Ease-of-use party AI: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #5900 // Initialise AI components (required for all tactical and AI components): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6000 // Smarter general AI: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6010 // Better calls for help: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6024 // Add high-level abilities (HLAs) to spellcasters -> All eligible spellcasters in Throne of Bhaal and Shadows of Amn get HLAs (very challenging and not really recommended!): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6030 // Smarter Mages -> Mages cast some short-duration spells instantly at start of combat, to simulate pre-battle casting: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6040 // Smarter Priests -> Priests cast some short-duration spells instantly at start of combat, to simulate pre-battle casting: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6100 // Potions for NPCs -> All of the potions dropped by slain enemies are recoverable: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6200 // Improved Spiders: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6500 // Improved golems: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6510 // Improved fiends -> Fiends have about 50 percent more hit points than normal: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6520 // Smarter genies -> Genies have about 50 percent more hit points than normal: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6530 // Smarter celestials -> Celestials have about 50 percent more hit points than normal: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6540 // Smarter dragons -> Dragons have a substantial hit point increase: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6551 // Smarter beholders -> Don't give beholder rays any chance of burning through spell protections; beholder antimagic blocks all spells, including harmful ones, for a round (simulates D&D rules): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6563 // Smarter mind flayers -> Illithids have enhanced damage resistance; Illithids cannot see invisible enemies: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6570 // Smarter githyanki: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6580 // Improved Vampires: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6590 // Smarter Throne of Bhaal final villain: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8000 // Make the starting dungeon slightly harder: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8010 // Improved Shade Lord: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8020 // Spellcasting Demiliches: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8030 // More resilient trolls: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8050 // Improved Random Encounters: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8060 // Improved de'Arnise Keep ("Tactics Remix") -> Spirit trolls have the same powers as in the original game: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8070 // Improved Unseeing Eye: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8080 // Improved Bodhi (Tactics Remix) -> "Toned-down" version of the original Tactics Improved Bodhi, with SCSII scripting: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8100 // Improved battle with Irenicus in Spellhold: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8110 // Improved Sahuagin: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8120 // Improved Beholder hive (adapted from Quest Pack): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8141 // Slightly Improved Drow -> Leave Ust Natha's defences alone: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8150 // Slightly Improved Watcher's Keep: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8160 // Improved Fire Giant temple: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8170 // Enhanced Sendai's Enclave: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8180 // Improved Abazigal's Lair: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8190 // Improved Minor Encounters: v30
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #100 // Restore innate infravision to Half-Orc characters: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #101 // Prevent skeletal and incorporeal undead from being affected by Illithids' Devour Brain attack: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #130 // Additional racial traits for Dwarves: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #140 // Additional racial traits for Gnomes: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #201 // Instant casting for warrior innates: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #202 // Revised Bhaalpowers -> Enhance the Bhaalpowers and standardize their casting time: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #218 // Regain Bhaalpowers in ToB: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #203 // Make druidic shapeshifting uninterruptable: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #211 // Make Death Ward protect against Vorpal Hits: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #210 // Restore the Dispel Magic vulnerability to Nishruu and Hakeashars: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #212 // Make alignment detection spells more accurate: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #213 // Expanded saving throw bonus tables for Dwarves, Gnomes and Halflings: v4.32
    ~ATWEAKS/SETUP-ATWEAKS.TP2~ #0 #510 // Expanded temple services: v4.32
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #100 // FThief1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #110 // FThief2: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #120 // F_Barb: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #130 // F_Bard: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #140 // F_Drow: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #150 // F_Fgt01: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #160 // F_Fgt02: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #170 // F_Fgt03: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #180 // F_Fgt04: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #190 // F_Fgt05: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #200 // F_HOrc1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #210 // F_HoW1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #220 // F_HoW2: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #230 // F_HoW3: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #240 // F_Mage1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #250 // F_Mage2: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #260 // F_Mage3: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #270 // F_Mage4: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #280 // F_Mage5: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #290 // F_Monk1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #300 // F_Sorc1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #310 // MThief1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #320 // MThief2: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #330 // M_Barb: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #340 // M_Bard: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #350 // M_Drow: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #360 // M_Fgt01: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #370 // M_Fgt02: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #380 // M_Fgt03: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #390 // M_Fgt04: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #400 // M_Fgt05: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #410 // M_HOrc1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #420 // M_HoW1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #430 // M_HoW2: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #440 // M_HoW3: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #450 // M_Mage1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #460 // M_Mage2: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #470 // M_Mage3: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #480 // M_Mage4: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #490 // M_Mage5: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #500 // M_Monk1: 1.01
    ~S9SOUNDSETSVOL2/SETUP-S9SOUNDSETSVOL2.TP2~ #0 #510 // M_Sorc1: 1.01


    As far as I know, nothing from my mods affect saving throws. I didn't install the component you are describing.
  • GallowglassGallowglass Member Posts: 3,356
    edited December 2015
    Very interesting, @Gotural. I guess one has to ask for the avoidance of doubt ... is there any chance that you have some mod installed which might be changing Save behaviour? Or is this a pure unmodded game?

    [Edit: sorry, I see I was ninja'ed while writing!]
    Post edited by Gallowglass on
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    My WeiDu log:

    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #0 // Big Picture, core component (required for most subcomponents): v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #10 // Patching all the existing innate spells, setting level to one.....: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #50 // Level-50 Ruleset (Code By King Diamond): v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1190 // Hell Trial Additions: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1200 // Horreds Lair: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1315 // Nalia Quests: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1330 // Tavern Brawl (In the Seven Veils): v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1675 // Wand of Orcus Add-In: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1110 // Kensai Ryu's Brown Dragon: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1120 // Kensai Ryu's Improved Crypt King: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1175 // Kensai Ryu's Gnome Fighter/Illusionist in the Docks: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1275 // Gebhard Blucher's Lich in the Docks: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1525 // Improved Small Teeth Pass, by Kensai Ryu: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1250 // Kuroisan the Acid Kensai, by Westley Weimer: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1425 // Red Badge, Poison-Based Encounter, by Westley Weimer: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1450 // The Ritual, by Westley Weimer: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #1800 // ToB Improvements: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #2000 // Ascension for BP: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #2100 // Improved Abazigal: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #2200 // Improved Demogorgon: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #2300 // Improved Gromnir: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #2400 // Improved Illasera: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #2500 // Improved Sendai: v181-b4611
    ~BP/SETUP-BP.TP2~ #0 #2600 // Improved Yaga-Shura: v181-b4611
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #1000 // Initialise mod (all other components require this): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #1910 // Protection from Normal Missiles also blocks Arrows of Fire/Cold/Acid and similar projectiles without pluses: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2000 // Allow Spellstrike to take down a Protection from Magic scroll: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2010 // More consistent Breach spell (always affects liches and rakshasas; doesn't penetrate Spell Turning): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2020 // Antimagic attacks penetrate improved invisibility: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2030 // Iron Skins behaves like Stoneskin (can be brought down by Breach): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2041 // Modify the Harm spell so it does damage rather than reducing target to 1 hp -> Enemy and player Harm spells both do 150 hp of damage: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2050 // Allow individual versions of Spell Immunity to be placed into Contingencies and Spell Triggers: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2070 // Blade Barrier and Globe of Blades only affect hostile creatures: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2080 // Cap damage done by Skull Trap at 12d6: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2090 // Make Power-Word: Blind single-target: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2100 // Make Minute Meteors into +2 weapons: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2110 // Reduce the power of Inquisitors' Dispel Magic -> Inquisitors dispel at 1.5 x their level (not twice their level): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2120 // Slightly weaken insect plague spells, and let fire shields block them: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2140 // Slightly increase the power of Mantle, Improved Mantle, and Absolute Immunity: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2150 // Make spell sequencers, spell triggers, and contingencies learnable by all mages: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2160 // Add an extra copy of some hard-to-find spell scrolls: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2170 // True Sight/True Seeing spells protect from magical blindness: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #2180 // Prevent Simulacra and Projected Images from using magical items: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #3010 // Replace +1 arrows with nonmagical "fine" ones: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #3020 // Replace +1 magical weapons with Fine ones: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #3041 // Reduce the number of Arrows of Dispelling in stores -> Stores sell a maximum of 5 Arrows of Dispelling: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #3110 // Change Carsomyr so that its Dispel on contact power grants a saving throw: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4010 // Grant large, flying, non-solid or similar creatures protection from Web and Entangle: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4030 // Improved shapeshifting: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4040 // Make party members less likely to die irreversibly: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4180 // Make Freedom scrolls available earlier: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4216 // Remove unrealistically convenient ammunition from certain areas -> Only remove nonmagical ammo from random containers: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #4240 // Treat mages' and priests' High-Level Abilities as innate abilities rather than memorisable spells (each may be taken only once): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #5010 // Move Boo into Minsc's pack: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #5020 // Remove the blur graphic effect from the Cloak of Displacement: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #5030 // Remove animation from the Cloak of Mirroring (leave it for other spells and effects that use the same graphic): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #5900 // Initialise AI components (required for all tactical and AI components): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6000 // Smarter general AI: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6010 // Better calls for help: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6024 // Add high-level abilities (HLAs) to spellcasters -> All eligible spellcasters in Throne of Bhaal and Shadows of Amn get HLAs (very challenging and not really recommended!): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6030 // Smarter Mages -> Mages cast some short-duration spells instantly at start of combat, to simulate pre-battle casting: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6040 // Smarter Priests -> Priests cast some short-duration spells instantly at start of combat, to simulate pre-battle casting: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6100 // Potions for NPCs -> All of the potions dropped by slain enemies are recoverable: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6200 // Improved Spiders: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6500 // Improved golems: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6510 // Improved fiends -> Fiends have about 50 percent more hit points than normal: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6520 // Smarter genies -> Genies have about 50 percent more hit points than normal: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6530 // Smarter celestials -> Celestials have about 50 percent more hit points than normal: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6540 // Smarter dragons -> Dragons have a substantial hit point increase: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6551 // Smarter beholders -> Don't give beholder rays any chance of burning through spell protections; beholder antimagic blocks all spells, including harmful ones, for a round (simulates D&D rules): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6560 // Smarter mind flayers -> Illithids have only original-game resistances; Illithids can see through invisibility: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6570 // Smarter githyanki: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6580 // Improved Vampires: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6590 // Smarter Throne of Bhaal final villain: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6800 // Smarter Illasera: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6810 // Smarter Gromnir: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6820 // Smarter Yaga-Shura: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6830 // Smarter Abazigal: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6840 // Give Ascension versions of Irenicus and Sendai SCS scripts and abilities: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #6850 // Give Ascension demons SCS scripts and abilities: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8000 // Make the starting dungeon slightly harder: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8010 // Improved Shade Lord: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8020 // Spellcasting Demiliches: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8030 // More resilient trolls: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8041 // Increase difficulty of level-dependent monster groupings -> Significantly increased difficulty: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8050 // Improved Random Encounters: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8060 // Improved de'Arnise Keep ("Tactics Remix") -> Spirit trolls have the same powers as in the original game: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8070 // Improved Unseeing Eye: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8081 // Improved Bodhi (Tactics Remix) -> Original Tactics Improved Bodhi with SCSII scripting: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8100 // Improved battle with Irenicus in Spellhold: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8110 // Improved Sahuagin: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8120 // Improved Beholder hive (adapted from Quest Pack): v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8130 // Prevent resting in the Illithid city: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8140 // Slightly Improved Drow -> Upgrade Ust Natha's defences: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8150 // Slightly Improved Watcher's Keep: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8160 // Improved Fire Giant temple: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8170 // Enhanced Sendai's Enclave: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8180 // Improved Abazigal's Lair: v30
    ~STRATAGEMS/SETUP-STRATAGEMS.TP2~ #0 #8190 // Improved Minor Encounters: v30

    @Gotural and I both have SCS, but I have some BP components and Gotural has a few other things. I can't tell which one would be causing any discrepancy.
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