Imoen (I suppose) is just a random Bhaalspawn, whereas Charname was saved by Gorion when we were a child at a Bhaal's temple. Sarevok was here too, I think that"s why he knows where to search, and who. Imoen is like all the other random child of bhaal who come to Saradush in ToB
Actually what matters is who Gorion thought knew of mainchar and Imoen as Bhaalspawns.
Why should he try to protect Imoen if he was certain that no one knew about her anyway? So I guess he had reason to believe that mainchar's origin had been discovered while Imoen's had not yet.
Also by leaving Candlekeep with the bhaalspawn whose identity he feared had been revealed - he took away the enemy's attention from Candlekeep and thus Imoen.
So yes, actually Imoen should have been quite safe in Candlekeep with Gorion and mainchar on the run... or so Gorion might have thought...
Actually, staying in Candlekeep would have been the best course of action. Lure the rat into your trap, and kill it. I mean, you left a well guarded fortress filled with some of the realms most powerful wizards, all willing to fight to defend their keep and one of their most trusted and befriended members (Gorion).
The smart thing would have been to summon some Harpers into the keep to secretly keep an eye on the protagonist(s) from the Shanks of the world, and await Sarevok, and then kill him and his little cleric too. Maybe 8 rounds of combat...roll credits. Tehoril would have turned Sarevok into a rabbit and kept him as a pet.
Elminster and co. were Gorion's friends, not your PC's. Your PC was the son of the god of the murder, and considering how you can choose to go on a murder spree on a scale greater than Sarevok's you can understand why Elminster and co. weren't exactly too interested in rallying around your PC.
Only Gorion truly believed in and cared for you, and if you turned evil (which is what? 30% of all PCs?) then he was simply being naive and everyone else's fears would have been justified.
Elminster and co. were Gorion's friends, not your PC's. Your PC was the son of the god of the murder, and considering how you can choose to go on a murder spree on a scale greater than Sarevok's you can understand why Elminster and co. weren't exactly too interested in rallying around your PC.
Only Gorion truly believed in and cared for you, and if you turned evil (which is what? 30% of all PCs?) then he was simply being naive and everyone else's fears would have been justified.
Pretty thin. If it's like you say, then why did they allow two Bhaalers into their crib, under their protection to begin with? And since they did, why would they throw them to the wolves all of a sudden? Elminster and the Harpers were already helping Gorion, and by extension the protagonist, because Gorion was aiding and protecting the protagonist.
It seems like as soon as Gorion caught wind of Sarevok, he panicked and decided to make a run for it. Which is a 7 INT move at best.
You are assuming that the Harpers are some kind of Justice League. They're not. They're more like the CIA. The Harpers were "watching" you, the same way they were "watching" Montaron and Xzar in BG2. They were waiting to see what would happen to you, gathering information so they could act appropriately if you turned out evil or whatever. Saving the innocent (baby Bhaalspawn) is one thing, going out of your way to protect someone who is both unproven and who has the potential to cause murder on a grand scale is something else entirely.
Gorion was the only one who was actually trying to protect the PC, because he saw himself as your PC's father. When he realized that he couldn't count on anyone else in the Keep to do that, of course he panicked.
Remember, she read a letter that had been conspicuously left out by Gorion where she could get to it. Imoen may be a good thief, but I doubt she could have really read that letter without Gorion knowing about it. I think Gorion planned for her to be following.
This is my favourite explanation. It's a good example of taking something written pre-retcon that by happy coincidence can be repurposed to explain post-retcon stuff. It's like how Darth Vader wasn't meant to be Luke's father in A New Hope. Obi Wan's story that Vader killed Luke's father was meant to be true. However, he does show guilt as he explains it and looks uncomfortable talking about it; at the time it was mean to be guilt because he trained Vader and so he feels responsible for his actions. Once it was retconned that Obi Wan was lying, it can now be taken as Obi Wan being guilty about concealing the truth from Luke.
It's well established in BG that Imoen is sneaky and is always up to no good, yet everyone knows that of her and expects her to be like that. It makes sense you could basically leave "bait" for her in that way. It still doesn't make 100% sense, I have to say, because surely Gorion could just tell her "I want you to come with us but keep your distance so we don't attract too much attention as a larger group". Yet given how that part of the plot is all full of mysterious machinations and lots of secrecy, it does fit in all the same.
Remember, she read a letter that had been conspicuously left out by Gorion where she could get to it. Imoen may be a good thief, but I doubt she could have really read that letter without Gorion knowing about it. I think Gorion planned for her to be following.
This is my favourite explanation. It's a good example of taking something written pre-retcon that by happy coincidence can be repurposed to explain post-retcon stuff. It's like how Darth Vader wasn't meant to be Luke's father in A New Hope. Obi Wan's story that Vader killed Luke's father was meant to be true. However, he does show guilt as he explains it and looks uncomfortable talking about it; at the time it was mean to be guilt because he trained Vader and so he feels responsible for his actions. Once it was retconned that Obi Wan was lying, it can now be taken as Obi Wan being guilty about concealing the truth from Luke.
It's well established in BG that Imoen is sneaky and is always up to no good, yet everyone knows that of her and expects her to be like that. It makes sense you could basically leave "bait" for her in that way. It still doesn't make 100% sense, I have to say, because surely Gorion could just tell her "I want you to come with us but keep your distance so we don't attract too much attention as a larger group". Yet given how that part of the plot is all full of mysterious machinations and lots of secrecy, it does fit in all the same.
Baldur's Gate 3 will be a prequel and everything will be answered.
It'll all be forgiven when the actual sequel comes out a decade later and outsells the original game while a few fans who are actualky dead inside complain that the plot uses up all its story beats.
Let's just address the elephant in the room. Imoen's hygiene. Her silent and deadly tendencies were mentored by that belching Winthorp. She wasn't left behind, they were fleeing her. It was an elaborate plot to get her out of the keep for good. Gorion faked his death and changed his identity.
My theory is that Charname isn't actually a Bhaalspawn at all; you're just a decoy, and you happen to have some mixture of fiendish and celestial blood in you (which explains your acquisition of special abilities, and the fact that everyone's super surprised when you turn into the Slayer).
Imoen was the real Bhaalspawn all along; Gorion was hoping she would stay in Candlekeep where it was safe (especially since everyone's chasing after Charname), but of course she had the spirit of adventure in her, and she couldn't be kept hidden away.
What's the difference between a bhaalspawn and a normal person? In apperance, it is none. Of course that the correct answer to the question of this thread is "because in BG1 she was not intended to be a bhaalspawn". But we can find plausible explanations in the story.
Gorion knew Imoen was a bhaalspawn, but I think that her bhaal's essence was still dorment, and she wasn't detected yet. Sarevok started to pay a bount on the head of charname because of two possible reasons:
1. Because charname was about to start to manifest his bhaal's essence. So, the force was awakenning in Charname, and through his powers he could be found by divination spells. 2. Because Sarevok was one of the children that were on the ritual from where Gorion rescued Charname (Charname was a baby, while Sarevok should be 5~8 years old). So, he knew Gorion had 1 ward that was a bhaalspawn and start searching for him.
So, Gorion found out by some way that Sarevok was comming for Charname. But he knew Imoen was still passing unnoticed, so she was hidden and safe in Candlekeep. Taking her with Charname would just reveal and endanger herself as well.
Dee, your theory is flawed. While in many ways it would be easy to mislead a true Bhaalers ID, there would be no way to predict which high level cleric Sarevok was going to bully (and murder) into divining the Bhaalspwnz whereabouts. So, there is no way that cleric could have lied. And I'm sure he mentioned Imoen too because Sarevok knew about her, he pretty much is the one who tells the protagonist this.
BTW how did some zero level newbs (Skank and Carbos) get 5,000 gp books to enter a keep to collect what at the time was 150gp reward?
Nope, they are just Gorions dear friend, he may even be a member.
He WAS a member. Does that change anything? As I said, the Harpers are more like a secret organization with its own agendas than the Justice League you seem to make them out to be. https://dnd.wizards.com/dungeons-and-dragons/story/faction/harpers Khalid and Jaheira were both his friends and colleagues, which is probably why they even agreed to meet him despite the shady nature of his adopted charge. The rest were just colleagues.
Gorion had initially wanted her to come, but he was miffed when she ate his last , so he left her for dead in Candlekeep. She had also eaten CHARNAME's , that's why both Gorion and she didn't tell CHARNAME. It would have broken his/her heart to the point where he/she would try to kill him/herself. It would surely have been a horrifying experience for the player as well, so it was not mentioned at all to avoid horrendous backlash from the fans.
BTW how did some zero level newbs (Skank and Carbos) get 5,000 gp books to enter a keep to collect what at the time was 150gp reward?
How does Candlekeep handle their non-skilled work? Surely they don't charge the entrance fee to every person who wants to be a stable hand. Or if they do, I imagine they have some sort of reimbursement program for people who bring in a party of workers considering 1 book will get at least 6 people in. Or at worst, Sarevok had a fairly large budget that consisted of buying 2 guys' passage in to Candlekeep and just a weeeee bit left over to pay them for the job, at which point the whole thing fell through and his "kill CHARNAME" budget only replenished at about 200 gold a week or so. Or it was all a ploy by Sarevok to get you to leave the keep so he could ambush you himself and Shank and Carbos were expendable to begin with.
BTW how did some zero level newbs (Skank and Carbos) get 5,000 gp books to enter a keep to collect what at the time was 150gp reward?
How does Candlekeep handle their non-skilled work? Surely they don't charge the entrance fee to every person who wants to be a stable hand. Or if they do, I imagine they have some sort of reimbursement program for people who bring in a party of workers considering 1 book will get at least 6 people in. Or at worst, Sarevok had a fairly large budget that consisted of buying 2 guys' passage in to Candlekeep and just a weeeee bit left over to pay them for the job, at which point the whole thing fell through and his "kill CHARNAME" budget only replenished at about 200 gold a week or so. Or it was all a ploy by Sarevok to get you to leave the keep so he could ambush you himself and Shank and Carbos were expendable to begin with.
If I recall correctly, one of the guards you can chat up in the grounds of Candlekeep refers to the fact that there has been no caravan bringing supplies for Winthrop in some weeks. This suggests a regular stream of Non-paying academics who were not permitted into the Library proper.
Re the question of Imoen very much occupied my mind the first time I set out to write a novelization of the Chapter1 playthrough. When did she leave Candlekeep exactly. My surmise was that the titanic battle between Gorion and Zarevok's party was not all that far away. Near enough for the tell-tale glow of Arcane Magic Missiles to be reflected from clouds perhaps and their distinctive Crack-Snap sound to be registered.
Then when she saw no preparations being made for a search party, she set off alone, fearing the worst. Perhaps under a certain compulsion. After all, how could she have guessed which way to search beyond the Druid circles unless she was a highly skilled tracker.
But a darker possibility lurked in my mind. That she had been closely following the whole time and might even have been responsible for alerting Zarevok to the whereabouts of Gorion and Charname. After all Gorion was cutting across country with the specific objective of being harder to find.
My head-canon re Candlekeep is also much liberalized from textbook canon. I imagine that Imoen and Charname more or less knew the immediate surroundings as far as 2-3miles in every direction from light-hunting excursions. The idea that they had been cooped up inside the fortress itself for more than a decade just did not ring true.
Also, perhaps Elminster and Gorion had a pre-arranged code which would mean that Imoen's nature had become known to Zarevok or other interested parties. Since this was not in the letter Gorion felt it best to leave her for the moment till he found a safer lodging for Charname. Perhaps in Cormyr.
Actually what matters is who Gorion thought knew of mainchar and Imoen as Bhaalspawns.
Why should he try to protect Imoen if he was certain that no one knew about her anyway? So I guess he had reason to believe that mainchar's origin had been discovered while Imoen's had not yet.
Also by leaving Candlekeep with the bhaalspawn whose identity he feared had been revealed - he took away the enemy's attention from Candlekeep and thus Imoen.
So yes, actually Imoen should have been quite safe in Candlekeep with Gorion and mainchar on the run... or so Gorion might have thought...
Actually, staying in Candlekeep would have been the best course of action. Lure the rat into your trap, and kill it. I mean, you left a well guarded fortress filled with some of the realms most powerful wizards, all willing to fight to defend their keep and one of their most trusted and befriended members (Gorion).
The smart thing would have been to summon some Harpers into the keep to secretly keep an eye on the protagonist(s) from the Shanks of the world, and await Sarevok, and then kill him and his little cleric too. Maybe 8 rounds of combat...roll credits. Tehoril would have turned Sarevok into a rabbit and kept him as a pet.
Actually the higher ups in Candlekeep didn't want Gorion to keep you there in the first place. In one of the dream sequence you have in bg1 is your younger self playing with Gorion and I think his name starts with a U arguing very loudly with the end of the arguement being the U guy giving in to Gorion's wishes and saying that that Mc will be the death of him. So no I don't believe that Gorion had a chance to stay in Candlekeep.
Actually what matters is who Gorion thought knew of mainchar and Imoen as Bhaalspawns.
Why should he try to protect Imoen if he was certain that no one knew about her anyway? So I guess he had reason to believe that mainchar's origin had been discovered while Imoen's had not yet.
Also by leaving Candlekeep with the bhaalspawn whose identity he feared had been revealed - he took away the enemy's attention from Candlekeep and thus Imoen.
So yes, actually Imoen should have been quite safe in Candlekeep with Gorion and mainchar on the run... or so Gorion might have thought...
Actually, staying in Candlekeep would have been the best course of action. Lure the rat into your trap, and kill it. I mean, you left a well guarded fortress filled with some of the realms most powerful wizards, all willing to fight to defend their keep and one of their most trusted and befriended members (Gorion).
The smart thing would have been to summon some Harpers into the keep to secretly keep an eye on the protagonist(s) from the Shanks of the world, and await Sarevok, and then kill him and his little cleric too. Maybe 8 rounds of combat...roll credits. Tehoril would have turned Sarevok into a rabbit and kept him as a pet.
Actually the higher ups in Candlekeep didn't want Gorion to keep you there in the first place. In one of the dream sequence you have in bg1 is your younger self playing with Gorion and I think his name starts with a U arguing very loudly with the end of the arguement being the U guy giving in to Gorion's wishes and saying that that Mc will be the death of him. So no I don't believe that Gorion had a chance to stay in Candlekeep.
So they were less than thrilled about a Bhaalspawn in their midst and yet for 20 years they were cool with it and they seen what a great kid Gorion raised but then suddenly on a whim they want the kid dead/banished?
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The smart thing would have been to summon some Harpers into the keep to secretly keep an eye on the protagonist(s) from the Shanks of the world, and await Sarevok, and then kill him and his little cleric too. Maybe 8 rounds of combat...roll credits. Tehoril would have turned Sarevok into a rabbit and kept him as a pet.
Only Gorion truly believed in and cared for you, and if you turned evil (which is what? 30% of all PCs?) then he was simply being naive and everyone else's fears would have been justified.
It seems like as soon as Gorion caught wind of Sarevok, he panicked and decided to make a run for it. Which is a 7 INT move at best.
The Harpers were "watching" you, the same way they were "watching" Montaron and Xzar in BG2. They were waiting to see what would happen to you, gathering information so they could act appropriately if you turned out evil or whatever.
Saving the innocent (baby Bhaalspawn) is one thing, going out of your way to protect someone who is both unproven and who has the potential to cause murder on a grand scale is something else entirely.
Gorion was the only one who was actually trying to protect the PC, because he saw himself as your PC's father. When he realized that he couldn't count on anyone else in the Keep to do that, of course he panicked.
It's well established in BG that Imoen is sneaky and is always up to no good, yet everyone knows that of her and expects her to be like that. It makes sense you could basically leave "bait" for her in that way. It still doesn't make 100% sense, I have to say, because surely Gorion could just tell her "I want you to come with us but keep your distance so we don't attract too much attention as a larger group". Yet given how that part of the plot is all full of mysterious machinations and lots of secrecy, it does fit in all the same.
Perhaps they can have a go at the originals, insert some random uneeded scenes with fantastic CGI while they're at it?
"seriously dude, ANOTHER MINE?"
Imoen was the real Bhaalspawn all along; Gorion was hoping she would stay in Candlekeep where it was safe (especially since everyone's chasing after Charname), but of course she had the spirit of adventure in her, and she couldn't be kept hidden away.
Of course that the correct answer to the question of this thread is "because in BG1 she was not intended to be a bhaalspawn". But we can find plausible explanations in the story.
Gorion knew Imoen was a bhaalspawn, but I think that her bhaal's essence was still dorment, and she wasn't detected yet. Sarevok started to pay a bount on the head of charname because of two possible reasons:
1. Because charname was about to start to manifest his bhaal's essence. So, the force was awakenning in Charname, and through his powers he could be found by divination spells.
2. Because Sarevok was one of the children that were on the ritual from where Gorion rescued Charname (Charname was a baby, while Sarevok should be 5~8 years old). So, he knew Gorion had 1 ward that was a bhaalspawn and start searching for him.
So, Gorion found out by some way that Sarevok was comming for Charname. But he knew Imoen was still passing unnoticed, so she was hidden and safe in Candlekeep. Taking her with Charname would just reveal and endanger herself as well.
BTW how did some zero level newbs (Skank and Carbos) get 5,000 gp books to enter a keep to collect what at the time was 150gp reward?
As I said, the Harpers are more like a secret organization with its own agendas than the Justice League you seem to make them out to be.
https://dnd.wizards.com/dungeons-and-dragons/story/faction/harpers
Khalid and Jaheira were both his friends and colleagues, which is probably why they even agreed to meet him despite the shady nature of his adopted charge. The rest were just colleagues. He reveals this in ToB, after he died. Exactly. And you wonder why Gorion panicked.
Also: don't count your silver dragon eggs before they hatch! (This means you, Adalon!)
Rejiek the Tanner would like to add: there's more than one way to skin a human!
Re the question of Imoen very much occupied my mind the first time I set out to write a novelization of the Chapter1 playthrough. When did she leave Candlekeep exactly. My surmise was that the titanic battle between Gorion and Zarevok's party was not all that far away. Near enough for the tell-tale glow of Arcane Magic Missiles to be reflected from clouds perhaps and their distinctive Crack-Snap sound to be registered.
Then when she saw no preparations being made for a search party, she set off alone, fearing the worst. Perhaps under a certain compulsion. After all, how could she have guessed which way to search beyond the Druid circles unless she was a highly skilled tracker.
But a darker possibility lurked in my mind. That she had been closely following the whole time and might even have been responsible for alerting Zarevok to the whereabouts of Gorion and Charname. After all Gorion was cutting across country with the specific objective of being harder to find.
My head-canon re Candlekeep is also much liberalized from textbook canon. I imagine that Imoen and Charname more or less knew the immediate surroundings as far as 2-3miles in every direction from light-hunting excursions. The idea that they had been cooped up inside the fortress itself for more than a decade just did not ring true.
Also, perhaps Elminster and Gorion had a pre-arranged code which would mean that Imoen's nature had become known to Zarevok or other interested parties. Since this was not in the letter Gorion felt it best to leave her for the moment till he found a safer lodging for Charname. Perhaps in Cormyr.
No.