@RedKnight Okay, you won't get into debate about Rey. Have your last word, why not. It's convenient for you.
I don't know your previous experiences with SJWs, I'm not a psychic. I reckon they weren't pleasant. That's one. Two, "shitting" and "criticizing" are two different things, even if critique is wrong at parts. For example, BG1 NPC had little characterization so calling a character "sex object", when pretty much every character was underdeveloped, was too going too far. And finally, no matter how you look at it, details are - well - details. The narrow, focused worldview is what makes you think of them as really important, and thus you start contributing to the drama.
For someone who cares about the series legacy, you joined this community only yesterday. Where were you, in early stages EE's development, when your suggestions really mattered? Where were you during many discussions? Were you there, criticizing the game's element and direction? I won't even mention beta testing or volunteering. No. The fact that you joined yesterday doesn't speak well for your claim. Based on the facts, it is more likely that you joined here just to complain.
Finally, the writer's opinion is - well - an opinion. I personally disagree with Amber Scott on some things, as I'm not focusing on non existent problems. Actively seeking things to be offended at won't do anyone any good.
You have to almost by definition be looking for things to be offended by if this bothers you enough to want to purposefully tank the reviews for the game in a coordinated effort. Where were all these people when Hexxat was revealed?? If the mob had known about it back then, would Baldur's Gate 2 EE have suffered the same fate?? Where were these people when it was revealed Dorn could have a bisexual romance option?? Fact is, most of the people posting these reviews not only haven't played Siege of Dragonspear, they also likely have never even played an Infinity Engine game AT ALL.
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
Is there a more insincere way of debating something like this than turning "I didn't like what she said" into "I didn't like what she said because she's a women" with no reason to imply someone is sexist simply for disagreeing with you?
Or dismiss something because it comes from Breitbart without actually addressing any of the content whatsover?
@RedKnight If Rey was indeed a Mary Sue then so was Anakin in Episode 1. Nobody accused them of pushing an agenda there.
@RedKnight Okay, you won't get into debate about Rey. Have your last word, why not. It's convenient for you.
I don't know your previous experiences with SJWs, I'm not a psychic. I reckon they weren't pleasant. That's one. Two, "shitting" and "criticizing" are two different things, even if critique is wrong at parts. For example, BG1 NPC had little characterization so calling a character "sex object", when pretty much every character was underdeveloped, was too going too far. And finally, no matter how you look at it, details are - well - details. The narrow, focused worldview is what makes you think of them as really important, and thus you start contributing to the drama.
For someone who cares about the series legacy, you joined this community only yesterday. Where were you, in early stages EE's development, when your suggestions really mattered? Where were you during many discussions? Were you there, criticizing the game's element and direction? I won't even mention beta testing or volunteering. No. The fact that you joined yesterday doesn't speak well for your claim. Based on the facts, it is more likely that you joined here just to complain.
Finally, the writer's opinion is - well - an opinion. I personally disagree with Amber Scott on some things, as I'm not focusing on non existent problems. Actively seeking things to be offended at won't do anyone any good.
I told you what my experiences with SJW content was so far.
I had no idea this game was even being made, mate. I just found out about the trailer not so long ago and have been fapping to it daily. Bought the game yesterday and then this shit hit the fan. Doesn't mean I am any less of a fan than you are. I've even done some mods by myself, but never published them because I am not a very good modder and there were still some bugs only I knew how to avoid.
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
She can say whatever she wants mate. But there are consequences to what you say too, you know. Her being a woman is irrelevant.
Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
But she didn't say either of those things, really.
“If there was something for the original Baldur’s Gate that just doesn’t mesh for modern day gamers like the sexism, [we tried to address that],” said writer Amber Scott. “In the original there’s a lot of jokes at women’s expense. Or if not a lot, there’s a couple, like Safana was just a sex object in BG 1, and Jaheira was the nagging wife and that was played for comedy. We were able to say, ‘No, that’s not really the kind of story we want to make.’ In Siege of Dragonspear, Safana gets her own little storyline, she got a way better personality upgrade. If people don’t like that, then too bad.”
“I got to write a little tender, romance-y side quest for Khalid and Jaheira where you could learn a little bit about how their marriage works and how they really feel about each other.”
She said there is sexism in BG. Which is fair. There is. How much you value it/it annoys you is up to you, of course. But it's there. I mean, hell, we're talking about the series where the only native female romance option is Anomen.
That's pretty much a straight up assault on women.
To the other point, she basically said two archetypal characters will get personality upgrades. While that is possible to construe as completely bastardizing the characters, it's also pretty easy to read as choosing to simply expand on them as characters.
Like she talks about in the second quote. Jaheria's love of Khalid (which is quite real, since, you know, reactions in BG2 and all) gets a chance to be played up a bit over the nagging. Which strikes me as good, assuming it was decently executed.
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
Is there a more insincere way of debating something like this than turning "I didn't like what she said" into "I didn't like what she said because she's a women" with no reason to imply someone is sexist simply for disagreeing with you?
Then why is she the focal point of every single discussion about what happend?? The people who are tanking reviews and joining this site out of the blue the last few days are here for a very specific reason, and it's because they're pissed about "SJW" issues in the game, and Amber Scott's interview. It doesn't take an FBI profiler to figure out the type of crowd we're dealing with here....
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
She can say whatever she wants mate. But there are consequences to what you say too, you know. Her being a woman is irrelevant.
Yep, consequences to what you say. Something the militant anti-PC crowd says without a hint of irony, when their entire nonsense, Gamergate platform is based on the fact that they can't get away with demeaning comments about others without someone calling them out on it. And when they are called out on it, they act as if they've been taken to a Siberian prison camp....
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
Is there a more insincere way of debating something like this than turning "I didn't like what she said" into "I didn't like what she said because she's a women" with no reason to imply someone is sexist simply for disagreeing with you?
Then why is she the focal point of every single discussion about what happend?? The people who are tanking reviews and joining this site out of the blue the last few days are here for a very specific reason, and it's because they're pissed about "SJW" issues in the game, and Amber Scott's interview. It doesn't take an FBI profiler to figure out the type of crowd we're dealing with here....
You answered the question yourself. To use your own words, kt doesn't take an FBI profiler to figure out that the reason she is at the center of it was because of her quote.
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
Or - and this is just an alternate possibility you may wish to consider - you're misinterpreting the interview in order to have it support your position.
@Ratcliff If I got the article right, he attributes Amber's "Too bad" line as a response to the backlash, not as a part of her interview from the past. At least that's how I understood it based on the way it was presented to me within it.
Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
But she didn't say either of those things, really.
“If there was something for the original Baldur’s Gate that just doesn’t mesh for modern day gamers like the sexism, [we tried to address that],” said writer Amber Scott. “In the original there’s a lot of jokes at women’s expense. Or if not a lot, there’s a couple, like Safana was just a sex object in BG 1, and Jaheira was the nagging wife and that was played for comedy. We were able to say, ‘No, that’s not really the kind of story we want to make.’ In Siege of Dragonspear, Safana gets her own little storyline, she got a way better personality upgrade. If people don’t like that, then too bad.”
“I got to write a little tender, romance-y side quest for Khalid and Jaheira where you could learn a little bit about how their marriage works and how they really feel about each other.”
She said there is sexism in BG. Which is fair. There is. How much you value it/it annoys you is up to you, of course. But it's there. I mean, hell, we're talking about the series where the only native female romance option is Anomen.
That's pretty much a straight up assault on women.
To the other point, she basically said two archetypal characters will get personality upgrades. While that is possible to construe as completely bastardizing the characters, it's also pretty easy to read as choosing to simply expand on them as characters.
Like she talks about in the second quote. Jaheria's love of Khalid (which is quite real, since, you know, reactions in BG2 and all) gets a chance to be played up a bit over the nagging. Which strikes me as good, assuming it was decently executed.
Lol! What do you mean? She said the original game had sexism in it. She gave examples and said that was not the kind of story she wanted to make, only to conclude the whole thing how she doesnt give a shit if we dont like her "personality upgrades".
Assault on women? Oh come on... What are you smoking? That just triviliazes the word assault. You know what assault is, right? You are aware that the reason behind there being only 1 female romance was the target group. Developers know who plays their games, so they focused on their targeted audience. There is nothing sexist about it.
Jaheira is the nagging wife? Err... nope. She isnt. But even if she was, Khalid is the bumbling idiot. I say Khalid definately got the worse treatment. But nobody cares, because he is a man.
Oh... and that final thing you mentioned is just pure gold. Yes you can interpret words however you wish, but in the context of sexism, and her making changes... I think its perfectly understandable why people flipped their shit.
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
Is there a more insincere way of debating something like this than turning "I didn't like what she said" into "I didn't like what she said because she's a women" with no reason to imply someone is sexist simply for disagreeing with you?
Then why is she the focal point of every single discussion about what happend?? The people who are tanking reviews and joining this site out of the blue the last few days are here for a very specific reason, and it's because they're pissed about "SJW" issues in the game, and Amber Scott's interview. It doesn't take an FBI profiler to figure out the type of crowd we're dealing with here....
You answered the question yourself. To use your own words, kt doesn't take an FBI profiler to figure out that the reason she is at the center of it was because of her quote.
I own hundreds upon hundreds of games, many of which I'm sure have NPCs I don't like. Many of which probably have developers I wouldn't be able to stand in real life. What I DON'T usually do when games come out is search out interviews by the game developers, see something I disagree with, and immediately go join message boards talking about the imminent collapse of society as we know it. If Miyazaki of From Software does an interview tomorrow where he says he likes to beat children over the head with pineapples, I'm not going to start a movement to boycott Dark Souls 3....
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
Or - and this is just an alternate possibility you may wish to consider - you're misinterpreting the interview in order to have it support your position.
And what position would that be? I have yet to find one of you SJW types present my position correctly.
So basically you've said absolutely nothing which would make you think it is associated with her gender, just overreaction to perceived political correctness.
@jjstraka34 I get an impression that you really don't get my intentions. That or I misunderstood yours. I was making a point towards RedKnight. As for "feeling offended". I don't. I feel the game isn't treated fairly, and because of very shallow, primitive even, reasons. I am fan of Baldur's Gate for a long time and I would like people to get into it. I want the franchise and the fandom to be alive. But people here might just contributed very negatively for it. For, as I said, shallow reasons.
As for Hexxat, I don't really know and I can't judge the character, since I haven't tried BG2:EE. I had my circumstances, although now I am ashamed of them. About Dorn, here's what I know: before BG:EE release, community knew that a bi-character is going to be included, but we were not informed who it will be. It turned out it's Dorn after the game has been released. Truth to be told, I was not moved by this. There was a topic regarding our opinion on bi and homosexual romance options in the game. My opinion was that they are ok, as long as the proportions are realistic. 1 NPC didn't seem like much of a deal for me. The fact that he was bi-sexual made even less of an impression.
Doesn't mean that I cannot be critical of the devs. Oh no. I honestly cannot recall when I was as enraged as on release day of BG:EE.
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
Is there a more insincere way of debating something like this than turning "I didn't like what she said" into "I didn't like what she said because she's a women" with no reason to imply someone is sexist simply for disagreeing with you?
Or dismiss something because it comes from Breitbart without actually addressing any of the content whatsover?
@RedKnight If Rey was indeed a Mary Sue then so was Anakin in Episode 1. Nobody accused them of pushing an agenda there.
I have long claimed Anakin in Episode 1 was a Gary Stu and I disliked the prequels too, so I dont see how Anakin being a Gary Stu makes Rey somehow not be a Mary Sue
so beamdog loves political corectness, easy to understand in these times
And so? I don't have much time for political correctness myself, but the uproar has been excessively excessive. It is not as though the entire game is some massive SJW Crusade, its limited to one childish snipeshot at what is apparently the most thin-skinned internet movement of all time and clunky writing on one character. The idea that this should merit the kind of backlash is almost unbelievable.
To be honest, its kind of interesting seeing people so passionate about it, but the arguments devolved immediately. I'm just wondering how long it will go one for.
so beamdog loves political corectness, easy to understand in these times
And so? I don't have much time for political correctness myself, but the uproar has been excessively excessive. It is not as though the entire game is some massive SJW Crusade, its limited to one childish snipeshot at what is apparently the most thin-skinned internet movement of all time and clunky writing on one character. The idea that this should merit the kind of backlash is almost unbelievable.
To be honest, its kind of interesting seeing people so passionate about it, but the arguments devolved immediately. I'm just wondering how long it will go one for.
Well, the whole internet is currently in a SJW crusade. This is just one small battleground. This is happening all across every single media and people are starting to resist the SJWs. Thats why this is happening. You push people too much and soon they will start pushing back even for the slightest transgression. I am just sad my favorite game was caught in the middle of it.
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
Is there a more insincere way of debating something like this than turning "I didn't like what she said" into "I didn't like what she said because she's a women" with no reason to imply someone is sexist simply for disagreeing with you?
Or dismiss something because it comes from Breitbart without actually addressing any of the content whatsover?
@RedKnight If Rey was indeed a Mary Sue then so was Anakin in Episode 1. Nobody accused them of pushing an agenda there.
I have long claimed Anakin in Episode 1 was a Gary Stu and I disliked the prequels too, so I dont see how Anakin being a Gary Stu makes Rey somehow not be a Mary Sue
@RedKnight Well then the question is why is one attributed merely to poor writing, while the other is attributed to political correctness, rather than "we've had 2 male heroes already, why no have a female one?"?
@jjstraka34 I get an impression that you really don't get my intentions. That or I misunderstood yours. I was making a point towards RedKnight. As for "feeling offended". I don't. I feel the game isn't treated fairly, and because of very shallow, primitive even, reasons. I am fan of Baldur's Gate for a long time and I would like people to get into it. I want the franchise and the fandom to be alive. But people here might just contributed very negatively for it. For, as I said, shallow reasons.
As for Hexxat, I don't really know and I can't judge the character, since I haven't tried BG2:EE. I had my circumstances, although now I am ashamed of them. About Dorn, here's what I know: before BG:EE release, community knew that a bi-character is going to be included, but we were not informed who it will be. It turned out it's Dorn after the game has been released. Truth to be told, I was not moved by this. There was a topic regarding our opinion on bi and homosexual romance options in the game. My opinion was that they are ok, as long as the proportions are realistic. 1 NPC didn't seem like much of a deal for me. The fact that he was bi-sexual made even less of an impression.
Doesn't mean that I cannot be critical of the devs. Oh no. I honestly cannot recall when I was as enraged as on release day of BG:EE.
Was not directed at you, they were rhetorical questions.
so beamdog loves political corectness, easy to understand in these times
And so? I don't have much time for political correctness myself, but the uproar has been excessively excessive. It is not as though the entire game is some massive SJW Crusade, its limited to one childish snipeshot at what is apparently the most thin-skinned internet movement of all time and clunky writing on one character. The idea that this should merit the kind of backlash is almost unbelievable.
To be honest, its kind of interesting seeing people so passionate about it, but the arguments devolved immediately. I'm just wondering how long it will go one for.
Thin-skinned doesn't even begin to describe it. Especially when you consider how loudly they make their feelings heard. They bull-rush into forums and message boards and review sites, destroy all the china in the shop, then tell everyone who takes issue with them that if we hadn't have had such ugly china, they wouldn't have had to come in and destroy it. It's OUR fault....
Sometimes I think we were better off in the mid 90s, when the internet was gaining prevalence, but wasn't used to solve most of life's concerns. The Internet mob can tank game reviews, movie reviews... it is actually quite a spectacle to behold.
It has it's uses, but based on what I'm reading, it really seems to be going for the throat this time. Ouch.
The biggest tragedy would be if the game is actually good and it sells horrible due to political debate surrounding it. But seriously, what the hell was Beamdog thinking?! They know how much controversy SJWs have with the gaming community, they know their playerbase is very well informed since they are all in their late 20s and 30s. To stir the hornets nest with SJW provocations on launch date,... *shakes his head in disbelief*
Again, the fact that you think they "stirred a hornet's nest" by including a trans NPC that encompasses roughly .00001% of the story, and that one of the female developers DARES to have a Twitter account and follow the people she wants to follow....well, for the 100th time, it says nothing much about Beamdog, but everything about the people who have this much of a problem with it. Even the acronym "SJW" is just beyond obnoxious. It sounds like a professional wrestling stable, not a term anyone should take seriously.
What are you talking about? I never claimed that they stirred the hornet's nest by including a trans NPC. That is your own strawman. Again, you do this! Read what i wrote. I know reading is hard for some people, but seriously this is becoming ridiculous.
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
What is Amber Scott allowed to say in interviews?? Draw us up a list that meets the non-PC crowd's personal parameters so we know what things women are allowed and aren't allowed to say if they work on video games.
Is there a more insincere way of debating something like this than turning "I didn't like what she said" into "I didn't like what she said because she's a women" with no reason to imply someone is sexist simply for disagreeing with you?
Or dismiss something because it comes from Breitbart without actually addressing any of the content whatsover?
@RedKnight If Rey was indeed a Mary Sue then so was Anakin in Episode 1. Nobody accused them of pushing an agenda there.
I have long claimed Anakin in Episode 1 was a Gary Stu and I disliked the prequels too, so I dont see how Anakin being a Gary Stu makes Rey somehow not be a Mary Sue
@RedKnight Well then the question is why is one attributed merely to poor writing, while the other is attributed to political correctness, rather than "we've had 2 male heroes already, why no have a female one?"?
I have no problem with a female lead. Actually, I prefer female leads if they are done well (for example, Sarah Connor in Terminator, Ripley from Alien, etc.). My problem with Rey is that she was written as near perfect, can do anything at any time, learns the jedi skills within one day - the same skills Luke had to master through years of training, etc.. I just find her whole character like a typical feminist hero from Tumblr fan fiction.
As to why one is attributed to PC and the other one is not, well... I think you have to be blind not to see all the feminist propaganda happening in art lately. Its just my opinion based on everything that has been happening in art for the last 15-20 years. Take it as you will.
Lol! What do you mean? She said the original game had sexism in it. She gave examples and said that was not the kind of story she wanted to make, only to conclude the whole thing how she doesnt give a shit if we dont like her "personality upgrades".
Assault on women? Oh come on... What are you smoking? That just triviliazes the word assault. You know what assault is, right? You are aware that the reason behind there being only 1 female romance was the target group. Developers know who plays their games, so they focused on their targeted audience. There is nothing sexist about it.
Jaheira is the nagging wife? Err... nope. She isnt. But even if she was, Khalid is the bumbling idiot. I say Khalid definately got the worse treatment. But nobody cares, because he is a man.
Oh... and that final thing you mentioned is just pure gold. Yes you can interpret words however you wish, but in the context of sexism, and her making changes... I think its perfectly understandable why people flipped their shit.
1. She said that Baldur's Gate contained sexist elements. She did not say the game was sexist. There is actually a world of difference between those two things.
And frankly, given the current reactionary environment to anything perceived as "SJW"-y, I can't really blame her flippant dismissal if people don't like it. That said, people are, of course, free to dislike that as well.
2. Take a deep breath, man. It was a joke. I even used a smiley. Or am I not allowed to make jokes?
3. Might be my distance talking (it's been a few years since I've done a BG replay), but I remember Jaheira being pretty bitchy. And sure, you might well have a point about Khalid! She cares more about Jaheira, so that's who she emphasized (though I don't even know if that's true - honestly, the sidequest sounds like it'd be beneficial to both of them).
Also general argument re: breadth of male role models and the healthy development of gamers can go here. Honestly, you could make pretty reasonable arguments about Khalid being a positive male role model. Yeah, he's a bit of a klutz and a coward, but he still goes out there, does heroic things, finds true love, etc, etc.
4. Or, you know, people could hold their tongues until they see the content. Again, with the context of her scary, scary changes presented in the next paragraph (a bit of the actual romance between Khalid and Jaheira), it is hard to really find the energy to read "Oh no, she's ruining these characters!"
Just a friendly reminder, this thread was created to address the coordinated effort to tank SoD's reviews by the Gamergate outrage machine. I know I've certainly contributed to the off-topic discussions here and there, but I'd really like to hear how people can justify what's being done at metacritic and elsewhere over this objectively minimal content.
And again, I would encourage anyone who has actually PLAYED the game to leave a review on Metacritic or GoG. If you bought a version directly from Beamdog, I believe you can request a Steam key if you would like to leave a review – positive or negative – on that site. Whatever your views on the inclusion of these few lines of dialogue, I'm hopeful that most of us can agree that trying to utterly destroy the release of this game over it is an ignoble effort.
I'm not concerned about how Beamdog "invited this" any more than I think a car with a political bumper sticker "invites" getting purposely rear ended. If these people are successful in harming the financial success of this game, then they will be negatively impacting the lives of real human beings who depend on the success of the franchise. That's what I would like to talk about – taking a moral stance on this issue. Anyone else?
Just a friendly reminder, this thread was created to address the coordinated effort to tank SoD's reviews by the Gamergate outrage machine. I know I've certainly contributed to the off-topic discussions here and there, but I'd really like to hear how people can justify what's being done at metacritic and elsewhere over this objectively minimal content.
And again, I would encourage anyone who has actually PLAYED the game to leave a review on Metacritic or GoG. If you bought a version directly from Beamdog, I believe you can request a Steam key if you would like to leave a review – positive or negative – on that site. Whatever your views on the inclusion of these few lines of dialogue, I'm hopeful that most of us can agree that trying to utterly destroy the release of this game over it is an ignoble effort.
I'm not concerned about how Beamdog "invited this" any more than I think a car with a political bumper sticker "invites" getting purposely rear ended. If these people are successful in harming the financial success of this game, then they will be negatively impacting the lives of real human beings who depend on the success of the franchise. That's what I would like to talk about – taking a moral stance on this issue. Anyone else?
Well, people are fighting PC culture in any way they know, since it is infiltrating everything they hold holy. PC culture was invading people's lives for a very long time, so people are now fighting back. I wish BG was not caught in the middle of it, but there is the rationale you were asking for.
Honestly, I think people over-reacted, and many people get an alergic reaction as soon as they hear words like political correctness or SJWs. I understand them and support their fight against political correctness which is imo the cancer of western society, but i dont believe BG DoS deserved such a reaction.
Just a friendly reminder, this thread was created to address the coordinated effort to tank SoD's reviews by the Gamergate outrage machine. I know I've certainly contributed to the off-topic discussions here and there, but I'd really like to hear how people can justify what's being done at metacritic and elsewhere over this objectively minimal content.
And again, I would encourage anyone who has actually PLAYED the game to leave a review on Metacritic or GoG. If you bought a version directly from Beamdog, I believe you can request a Steam key if you would like to leave a review – positive or negative – on that site. Whatever your views on the inclusion of these few lines of dialogue, I'm hopeful that most of us can agree that trying to utterly destroy the release of this game over it is an ignoble effort.
I'm not concerned about how Beamdog "invited this" any more than I think a car with a political bumper sticker "invites" getting purposely rear ended. If these people are successful in harming the financial success of this game, then they will be negatively impacting the lives of real human beings who depend on the success of the franchise. That's what I would like to talk about – taking a moral stance on this issue. Anyone else?
Well, people are fighting PC culture in any way they know, since it is infiltrating everything they hold holy. This has been going on for a very long time, so people are now fighting back. I wish BG was not caught in the middle of it, but here is the rationale you were asking for.
Honestly, I think people over-reacted, but many people get an alergic reaction as soon as they hear words like political correctness or SJWs, so I understand them.
See... this is where I have trouble following people. I see offensive things in videogames, books, movies, etc. all the time. Just recently I played a mediocre game called "Remember Me" and thought the first chapter's depiction of the female protagonist was an objectifying one.
And you know what I did? Nothing. I rolled my eyes at the content I found disagreeable and I evaluated the rest of the game on its merits. It would never have occurred to me to leave a 0 review or wage war on the developers, because they're just *people* who made some content that wasn't to my taste. Could you imagine if everyone responded to content they didn't like by trying to run its creator of of business?
If you think the backlash to this has been overblown, I would encourage you to do the right thing and stand up against these people even if you happen to agree with them: write an honest review that evaluates the game on the other 99.99% of its content, even if it's negative. There's right and there's wrong no matter which side of the fence you're on.
Just a friendly reminder, this thread was created to address the coordinated effort to tank SoD's reviews by the Gamergate outrage machine. I know I've certainly contributed to the off-topic discussions here and there, but I'd really like to hear how people can justify what's being done at metacritic and elsewhere over this objectively minimal content.
And again, I would encourage anyone who has actually PLAYED the game to leave a review on Metacritic or GoG. If you bought a version directly from Beamdog, I believe you can request a Steam key if you would like to leave a review – positive or negative – on that site. Whatever your views on the inclusion of these few lines of dialogue, I'm hopeful that most of us can agree that trying to utterly destroy the release of this game over it is an ignoble effort.
I'm not concerned about how Beamdog "invited this" any more than I think a car with a political bumper sticker "invites" getting purposely rear ended. If these people are successful in harming the financial success of this game, then they will be negatively impacting the lives of real human beings who depend on the success of the franchise. That's what I would like to talk about – taking a moral stance on this issue. Anyone else?
Well, people are fighting PC culture in any way they know, since it is infiltrating everything they hold holy. This has been going on for a very long time, so people are now fighting back. I wish BG was not caught in the middle of it, but here is the rationale you were asking for.
Honestly, I think people over-reacted, but many people get an alergic reaction as soon as they hear words like political correctness or SJWs, so I understand them.
See... this is where I have trouble following people. I see offensive things in videogames, books, movies, etc. all the time. Just recently I played a mediocre game called "Remember Me" and thought the first chapter's depiction of the female protagonist was an objectifying one.
And you know what I did? Nothing. I rolled my eyes at the content I found disagreeable and I evaluated the rest of the game on its merits. It would never have occurred to me to leave a 0 review or wage war on the developers, because they're just *people* who made some content that wasn't to my taste. Could you imagine if everyone responded to content they didn't like by trying to run its creator of of business?
If you think the backlash to this has been overblown, I would encourage you to do the right thing and stand up against these people even if you happen to agree with them: write an honest review that evaluates the game on the other 99.99% of its content, even if it's negative. There's right and there's wrong no matter which side of the fence you're on.
Well, I havent yet played the game yet, so I can't really judge it. Part of me wants to support this 100%, because I am a huge BG fan, but I dont want to give the developer the wrong impression that I am supporting their game just because its BG. I care about where BG goes far too much to give it an easy 10/10 - especially after this PR fiasco.
Comments
I dont care what she follows on Twitter. Again, my problem with her was the interview in which she said BG was sexist and said she would change it by changing 2 characters. Its the same shit I have seen in comic books when they forcefully changed Thor into a female. Its one thing to allow your political views get into art you are creating in subtle ways, but doing something extreme as changing original characters into something else is a whole another story!
And again, I am not saying that this is the case in DoS. I am saying, she made it sound like that was the case in the interview and then shit hit the fan.
Or dismiss something because it comes from Breitbart without actually addressing any of the content whatsover?
@RedKnight If Rey was indeed a Mary Sue then so was Anakin in Episode 1. Nobody accused them of pushing an agenda there.
I had no idea this game was even being made, mate. I just found out about the trailer not so long ago and have been fapping to it daily. Bought the game yesterday and then this shit hit the fan. Doesn't mean I am any less of a fan than you are. I've even done some mods by myself, but never published them because I am not a very good modder and there were still some bugs only I knew how to avoid.
“If there was something for the original Baldur’s Gate that just doesn’t mesh for modern day gamers like the sexism, [we tried to address that],” said writer Amber Scott. “In the original there’s a lot of jokes at women’s expense. Or if not a lot, there’s a couple, like Safana was just a sex object in BG 1, and Jaheira was the nagging wife and that was played for comedy. We were able to say, ‘No, that’s not really the kind of story we want to make.’ In Siege of Dragonspear, Safana gets her own little storyline, she got a way better personality upgrade. If people don’t like that, then too bad.”
“I got to write a little tender, romance-y side quest for Khalid and Jaheira where you could learn a little bit about how their marriage works and how they really feel about each other.”
She said there is sexism in BG. Which is fair. There is. How much you value it/it annoys you is up to you, of course. But it's there. I mean, hell, we're talking about the series where the only native female romance option is Anomen.
That's pretty much a straight up assault on women.
To the other point, she basically said two archetypal characters will get personality upgrades. While that is possible to construe as completely bastardizing the characters, it's also pretty easy to read as choosing to simply expand on them as characters.
Like she talks about in the second quote. Jaheria's love of Khalid (which is quite real, since, you know, reactions in BG2 and all) gets a chance to be played up a bit over the nagging. Which strikes me as good, assuming it was decently executed.
At the very least, you can read the other sides position without the drama.
Assault on women? Oh come on... What are you smoking? That just triviliazes the word assault. You know what assault is, right? You are aware that the reason behind there being only 1 female romance was the target group. Developers know who plays their games, so they focused on their targeted audience. There is nothing sexist about it.
Jaheira is the nagging wife? Err... nope. She isnt. But even if she was, Khalid is the bumbling idiot. I say Khalid definately got the worse treatment. But nobody cares, because he is a man.
Oh... and that final thing you mentioned is just pure gold. Yes you can interpret words however you wish, but in the context of sexism, and her making changes... I think its perfectly understandable why people flipped their shit.
I get an impression that you really don't get my intentions. That or I misunderstood yours. I was making a point towards RedKnight. As for "feeling offended". I don't. I feel the game isn't treated fairly, and because of very shallow, primitive even, reasons. I am fan of Baldur's Gate for a long time and I would like people to get into it. I want the franchise and the fandom to be alive. But people here might just contributed very negatively for it. For, as I said, shallow reasons.
As for Hexxat, I don't really know and I can't judge the character, since I haven't tried BG2:EE. I had my circumstances, although now I am ashamed of them. About Dorn, here's what I know: before BG:EE release, community knew that a bi-character is going to be included, but we were not informed who it will be. It turned out it's Dorn after the game has been released. Truth to be told, I was not moved by this. There was a topic regarding our opinion on bi and homosexual romance options in the game. My opinion was that they are ok, as long as the proportions are realistic. 1 NPC didn't seem like much of a deal for me. The fact that he was bi-sexual made even less of an impression.
Doesn't mean that I cannot be critical of the devs. Oh no. I honestly cannot recall when I was as enraged as on release day of BG:EE.
To be honest, its kind of interesting seeing people so passionate about it, but the arguments devolved immediately. I'm just wondering how long it will go one for.
Well then the question is why is one attributed merely to poor writing, while the other is attributed to political correctness, rather than "we've had 2 male heroes already, why no have a female one?"?
As to why one is attributed to PC and the other one is not, well... I think you have to be blind not to see all the feminist propaganda happening in art lately. Its just my opinion based on everything that has been happening in art for the last 15-20 years. Take it as you will.
And frankly, given the current reactionary environment to anything perceived as "SJW"-y, I can't really blame her flippant dismissal if people don't like it. That said, people are, of course, free to dislike that as well.
2. Take a deep breath, man. It was a joke. I even used a smiley. Or am I not allowed to make jokes?
3. Might be my distance talking (it's been a few years since I've done a BG replay), but I remember Jaheira being pretty bitchy. And sure, you might well have a point about Khalid! She cares more about Jaheira, so that's who she emphasized (though I don't even know if that's true - honestly, the sidequest sounds like it'd be beneficial to both of them).
Also general argument re: breadth of male role models and the healthy development of gamers can go here. Honestly, you could make pretty reasonable arguments about Khalid being a positive male role model. Yeah, he's a bit of a klutz and a coward, but he still goes out there, does heroic things, finds true love, etc, etc.
4. Or, you know, people could hold their tongues until they see the content. Again, with the context of her scary, scary changes presented in the next paragraph (a bit of the actual romance between Khalid and Jaheira), it is hard to really find the energy to read "Oh no, she's ruining these characters!"
And again, I would encourage anyone who has actually PLAYED the game to leave a review on Metacritic or GoG. If you bought a version directly from Beamdog, I believe you can request a Steam key if you would like to leave a review – positive or negative – on that site. Whatever your views on the inclusion of these few lines of dialogue, I'm hopeful that most of us can agree that trying to utterly destroy the release of this game over it is an ignoble effort.
I'm not concerned about how Beamdog "invited this" any more than I think a car with a political bumper sticker "invites" getting purposely rear ended. If these people are successful in harming the financial success of this game, then they will be negatively impacting the lives of real human beings who depend on the success of the franchise. That's what I would like to talk about – taking a moral stance on this issue. Anyone else?
Honestly, I think people over-reacted, and many people get an alergic reaction as soon as they hear words like political correctness or SJWs. I understand them and support their fight against political correctness which is imo the cancer of western society, but i dont believe BG DoS deserved such a reaction.
And you know what I did? Nothing. I rolled my eyes at the content I found disagreeable and I evaluated the rest of the game on its merits. It would never have occurred to me to leave a 0 review or wage war on the developers, because they're just *people* who made some content that wasn't to my taste. Could you imagine if everyone responded to content they didn't like by trying to run its creator of of business?
If you think the backlash to this has been overblown, I would encourage you to do the right thing and stand up against these people even if you happen to agree with them: write an honest review that evaluates the game on the other 99.99% of its content, even if it's negative. There's right and there's wrong no matter which side of the fence you're on.