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LOCALIZED TIME (time zones)

GM_ODAGM_ODA Member Posts: 177
in General Discussions NWN:EE
Hello Beamdog!

I have a server that is a 'world' - and this is impossible to simulate using the current time in game system which has it that there is only ONE time that is valid. I would like to have a system where I can tag an area (by variable maybe) to be offset from the world's equivalent of GMT if that is at all possible. THANK YOU!

Be well. Game ON!
GM_ODA

Comments

  • JFKJFK Member Posts: 214
    Isn't this possible now? You can set a variable on an area, and check that variable when you get the time, and adjust the result?

    -JFK
  • GM_ODAGM_ODA Member Posts: 177
    No, it does not work that way. That would adjust the time for the whole server not just the area the PC entered (the latter is what is desired - since for example a PC might be in 'Paris' while another PC is in 'NYC').
  • JFKJFK Member Posts: 214
    edited July 2018
    I see now what you're asking for. That's not what I meant. I'm asking if, when your script calls for the current time, cannot that script also check a variable on the area? Based on that area, the value returned can be adjusted. It doesn't actually change game time, but only adjusts the result. That way, you could have an area be 'an hour' away from the starting area, and when you check the time, instead of 10 am you'd get 11 am, because the script checked the variable nTimeZone, found it contained a value of 1, and adjusted the output.

    Can sunrise/sunset be set per area? and changed at run-time?

    I get it now. ;)

    We'd like to be able to set the time on a per area basis. Good idea!

    -JFK
  • GM_ODAGM_ODA Member Posts: 177
    JFK said:


    We'd like to be able to set the time on a per area basis. Good idea!
    -JFK

    Thank you. IDK how doable the sunrise/sunset change might be but when simulating a world, time zone support should be included.

    We had toyed with the idea of spinning up an extra server for each time zone, but that seemed a cludgy work around at best.
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,724
    https://trello.com/c/rsEVbCVm/205-ability-to-set-the-time-on-a-per-area-basis
  • FreshLemonBunFreshLemonBun Member Posts: 909
    Considering you would need 125235 areas of 32 tiles in length to get the circumference of the Earth I think the need to simulate a world is quite niche. The exception to this would be with planar travel and teleportation, however if you were to do a fairly good job of simulating a world with NWN I believe you would have already partitioned your areas up into sub-servers, which would also automatically provide the solution for time zone management.

    I think having a server for each time zone would probably be the best idea if you want to preserve some sense of verisimilitude simply due to the scale of what you're hoping to simulate. Even over multiple servers you would probably still be at a 1m = 1km scale, which would be 10km or 6.2 miles per tile.
  • jglvz256jglvz256 Member Posts: 52
    JuliusBorisov said:

    https://trello.com/c/rsEVbCVm/205-ability-to-set-the-time-on-a-per-area-basis

    Yep, usual routine.

    Builder makes a thread asking for a feature, it instantly gets added to the Trello.

    Player makes a request or in the correct "Request" threads it gets ignored, or "Thank you for your feedback".
  • GM_ODAGM_ODA Member Posts: 177
    FreshLemonBun said:

    Considering you would need 125235 areas of 32 tiles in length to get the circumference of the Earth I think the need to simulate a world is quite niche. The exception to this would be with planar travel and teleportation, however if you were to do a fairly good job of simulating a world with NWN I believe you would have already partitioned your areas up into sub-servers, which would also automatically provide the solution for time zone management.

    I think having a server for each time zone would probably be the best idea if you want to preserve some sense of verisimilitude simply due to the scale of what you're hoping to simulate. Even over multiple servers you would probably still be at a 1m = 1km scale, which would be 10km or 6.2 miles per tile.

    Except you don't need to make the whole world to have a real need for time zones. Many game worlds offer 'far flung locations' - suspension of disbelief is made more difficult when the sun rises at the same instant in London and Caracas. If a builder makes ONE area in London and ONE area in Caracas, that is enough justification for the change; one need not build every area from that London street corner to the street corner in Caracas to make the case.

    Yes, it is true you need a huge number of areas to completely map the world, any world of Earth size. We've done the math too. Our systems allow for mapping almost none of the Ocean of course, since a few 'blank ocean tiles' are enough to simulate that with good scripting.

    I disagree that it is a better notion to have 24 separate servers as the default solution for any builder who wants sunrise and sunset to be more locally controlled - it is hard enough for most folks to manage one server, and most modules don't have enough areas to justify that kind of break up by region. Again, a module that features a couple locations in London and a couple locations in Caracas is enough to justify the minor change to how time is handled. Likewise any server that features multiple planes/worlds... why would it always be the same time everywhere - that makes no sense at all and harms my ability to suspend disbelief.

  • JFKJFK Member Posts: 214
    Faerun is, according to canon, absolutely riddled with portals. Portals can lead to distant places a player or group in MP could access, and the ability to reflect that distance through varying time zones would be great.


    -JFK
  • FreshLemonBunFreshLemonBun Member Posts: 909
    While you can have a "world" of areas connected by portals you still end up with a problem with the suspension of disbelief. Why is it you can transport halfway across the globe but you can't travel a few miles over. Even with a dwarf planet the size of Pluto you really don't have the resources to represent scale appropriately, you'll still end up having tiles that represent tens or hundreds of miles.

    The only way to make such a world with a single server instance is if the situation is similar to a water world or similar post apocalyptic setting, where there are only a few pockets of habitable land left. Tho it would still beg the question of why you are representing tiny pockets at immense distance rather than focusing on the immediate surroundings of a single area.

    ALFA and CoPaP approached the problem with multiple servers for each region and plane.

    You are welcome to disagree of course and to test any ideas you have.
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,724
    edited August 2018
    jglvz256 said:

    JuliusBorisov said:

    https://trello.com/c/rsEVbCVm/205-ability-to-set-the-time-on-a-per-area-basis

    Yep, usual routine.

    Builder makes a thread asking for a feature, it instantly gets added to the Trello.

    Player makes a request or in the correct "Request" threads it gets ignored, or "Thank you for your feedback".
    It doesn't work that way. All requests made in the "Request" threads are being looked at, and put onto the Roadmap board based on the feedback they get (if they're not there already). Just as any request made in a separate thread.
  • GM_ODAGM_ODA Member Posts: 177
    FreshLemonBun said:

    While you can have a "world" of areas connected by portals you still end up with a problem with the suspension of disbelief. Why is it you can transport halfway across the globe but you can't travel a few miles over.

    Every NWN server I've seen is built in either a 'vignette style' or a 'contiguous style'. Vignette being "they build the areas where interesting stuff happens and journeys from one point to another is typically glossed over", these are the typical server. For those who want to be able to walk from say "gameworld Bejing" to "gameworld Paris", the latter style or "contiguous style" server is available. Argentum Regio is built in the contiguous form; your PC can walk a long long way. We are not done building the world yet, having only 1337+ areas to offer so far, but our plans include a whole world and ultimately these will be divided among multiple server instances. That said, initially we are built as a single module, and we can peel off areas into other modules and host those in server with ease (by design). Even given that I'm managing multiple servers built to handle time zones by spinning up more servers, it is not something every world designer wants to do - managing 24 servers is really not the best solution if you don't have a zillion areas. A simple solution would be to have the engine look for a standardized variable on an area "tOff" as in "time offset", any value from 1-23 is considered valid all else is ignored and time is handled normally in those areas. In all areas where tOff is valid and non-zero, time is offset by that number of hours.
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