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Which Bard (NPC) do you prefer?

ArcanjoArcanjo Member Posts: 126
Bards,
apparently they can use spells from any school!
learn until level 4 of spells!
has Magic slots: 3 (Level one and two), 2 (Level three) and 1 (Level four).
Song on BG: EE only protects against fear! :'( :(
I do not know if there are any items that make it hard to have or cast more spells.

Honestly, I do not know if Bardo has any differential that makes it worth being on the team, I leave you with comments, your opinions about it and of course the vote! If so, please explain the reason for the vote.

Which Bard (NPC) do you prefer? 28 votes

Eldoth [Char: 16 | Int: 13 | Con: 15 | Dex: 12 | Str: 16 | Wis: 10]
21%
deltagoKamigoroshiRaduzielContemplative_HamsterYann1989Arctodus 6 votes
Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
53%
CamDawgbyrne20jkhristianAstroBryGuyThacoBellArcanjosmady3thespacejsavingmirandirDhariusevildevil97SssiksseilorEnuhalChronicler 15 votes
None
25%
Aedansarevok57LuthfordNoonOrlonKronsteenMidoriStummvonBordwehr 7 votes

Comments

  • jsavingjsaving Member Posts: 227
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    Bards are an underrated class to some degree in BG1. They level up faster than most other classes so their caster level for spells like fireball is actually pretty good. They can also be decent situational contributors to melee DPS if they have the blade kit, though their low hit points and inability to wear armor means you have to watch them carefully (and make liberal use of defensive buffs like mirror image). Unfortunately neither of the in-game bard NPCs are blades, but if you want to use one of them anyway, I think Garrick's better AC gives him a slight advantage over Eldoth.

    ThacoBellArcanjobutteredsoul
  • ArcanjoArcanjo Member Posts: 126
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    jsaving said:

    Bards are an underrated class to some degree in BG1. They level up faster than most other classes so their caster level for spells like fireball is actually pretty good. They can also be decent situational contributors to melee DPS if they have the blade kit, though their low hit points and inability to wear armor means you have to watch them carefully (and make liberal use of defensive buffs like mirror image). Unfortunately neither of the in-game bard NPCs are blades, but if you want to use one of them anyway, I think Garrick's better AC gives him a slight advantage over Eldoth.

    But does the Bardo's quick enjoyable gain compensate? In the end, he uses his spells and stays there with the bard's fatigue, would you trade Edwin for a bard? I love bards, but I'm kind of sad about the Bardos NPCs, they do not seem to have anything good or bard items worth having in the game. But it's just my impression, does it hit reality? The main problem is this dance of them that seems very weak even by the standards of BG1:EE.

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 6,204
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    Bards are the best class in the series. Their level scaling spells will be stronger than the mages' and their wide bag of tricks means they can pull off almost anything.

    Arcanjo
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 3,202
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    In the original BG1, bards were terrible. The bard song was basically useless, so the only advantage they had over a thief-mage was level scaling spells (especially since thief-mages could specialize in the original BG1). A thief-mage had a broader array of thief skills and could use mage-specific items like Evermemory and the Robes of the Archmagi.

    The BG1 developers made the odd choice of having Garrick, Eldoth, and Skie in a kind of love triangle. So, the intention was to have both Garrick and Eldoth, but two bards in one party was pointless.

    Now, in BGEE the Luck and morale effects of the vanilla Bard song make it useful. There's also a suit of elven chain available in BGEE for a bard's armored spellcasting needs, and a few bard-specific items have been added (like the Bard Hat in SoD). So, bards are much more useful now. Certainly, the EE vanilla bard can start to hold its own against the bard kits from BG2.

    In IWD and IWD2, bards have always rocked (the Jedi War Song in IWD1 was OP TBH; IWD2 nerfed it to combat-only). I would never tackle IWD or IWD2 without a bard.

    Arcanjo
  • Yann1989Yann1989 Member Posts: 92
    edited July 31
    Eldoth [Char: 16 | Int: 13 | Con: 15 | Dex: 12 | Str: 16 | Wis: 10]
    Bards can use wands, and there are a lot of wands out there :). I prefer Eldoth's personnality, he also gives me access to Skie. I have them both in my current party (Eldoth & Skie).

    A shame that the standard bard song doesn't give better bonuses

    Edit: I just checked and it seems that it should give +1 luck now, according to the wiki, but this is not written in the in-game text description of the class. Anybody can confirm the +1 luck bonus applies? If so, the song is really interesting

    Arcanjo
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 3,202
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    Yann1989 said:

    Bards can use wands, and there are a lot of wands out there :). I prefer Eldoth's personnality, he also gives me access to Skie. I have them both in my current party (Eldoth & Skie).

    A shame that the standard bard song doesn't give better bonuses

    Edit: I just checked and it seems that it should give +1 luck now, according to the wiki, but this is not written in the in-game text description of the class. Anybody can confirm the +1 luck bonus applies? If so, the song is really interesting

    Yes, the +1 Luck bonus applies. It increases to +2 at level 15, and +3 at level 20.

    ArcanjoYann1989ThacoBellGrond0
  • XanatosXanatos Member Posts: 22
    Very interested in the results of this poll. I've only used Garrick once, and have never used Eldoth but my Garrick playthrough was recent and I actually really liked having him around. Light crossbow of speed, elven chainmail, whistling sword +2, there ended up being some nice equipment for him and he could still fire off whatever spells i needed without class restriction and with an extra level of power over my mage.

    ArcanjoThacoBellbyrne20
  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 296
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    Eldoth needs the Gauntlets of Dexterity, but if you're doing an evil party you pretty much need those gauntlets for Kagain.

    He's proficient in Longbows but he'll never be able to use Composite Longbows.

    He's tied to a thief you get very late in the game.

    If you based your entire party around him he could be better than Garrick but it's hard to say he'd be worth the trouble.

    Arcanjo
  • ArcanjoArcanjo Member Posts: 126
    edited August 1
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]

    Yes, the +1 Luck bonus applies. It increases to +2 at level 15, and +3 at level 20.

    BG1:EE 2.0? or only 2.5?
    At BG1 as far as I know, it only protects against fear! The bonus to Luck? If so, how do I see in the game if the bonus actually exists? here does not change any status.

    Speaking of equipment, what equipments in BG1: EE, are made for Bards or fit well in it?

  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 2,931
    Eldoth [Char: 16 | Int: 13 | Con: 15 | Dex: 12 | Str: 16 | Wis: 10]
    Eldoth with the Charlatan kit.

    ZaghoulArcanjo
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 3,583
    None
    even though i usually never use bards in my runs, i have used garrick a few times and even eldoth the odd time

    i found garrick to be pretty mediocre, but where he really shines is solo runs,

    he is the best "bag of holding" and a great identifier, and what i will do it wait until i hit the 32000 XP mark and he warps up to level 6, then bring him to the area where you fight droth and the sirines for an easy level up to 7, and then drop him back off in beregost when i need him, and then when it it time to go to baldur's gate, he is chilling outside the sorcerus sundries ( or whatever it is called )

    ArcanjoContemplative_Hamster
  • butteredsoulbutteredsoul Member Posts: 54
    No option for either (or both), but I'll take... either (hmm... maybe both next time. I like a good NPC fight)! One is evil, one isn't, so that's usually my choice point. I really enjoyed Eldoth's poison arrows when I took him, even if his dex is only 12. I also used a mod (SCS) to get him early and allow for separating pairs (sorry, not sorry, Skie).

    Full disclosure: once I met Baeloth I put the zombie ring on Eldoth and left him at the Friendly Arm Inn. He provided me with the Skie quest-line and magic IDs. My CHARNAME was such a user.

    Like others have mentioned, pick pocketing, identifying stuff, casting level, and wand use are all major selling points for either (or both) bard(s). In BG 2 they can kind of lose their luster at higher levels if you're barding a CHARNAME.

    Arcanjo
  • Contemplative_HamsterContemplative_Hamster Member Posts: 797
    Eldoth [Char: 16 | Int: 13 | Con: 15 | Dex: 12 | Str: 16 | Wis: 10]
    I like Eldoth for his personality, not his stats or class; i use a mod to place him much earlier in the game, and sometimes I change his kit or class through EEKeeper.

    I dislike Garrick simply because his voice annoys me.

    Arcanjo
  • Yann1989Yann1989 Member Posts: 92
    edited August 1
    Eldoth [Char: 16 | Int: 13 | Con: 15 | Dex: 12 | Str: 16 | Wis: 10]
    Arcanjo said:



    Speaking of equipment, what equipments in BG1: EE, are made for Bards or fit well in it?

    Good equipment for your bard in BGEE includes:

    - Elven chainmail (don't forget to remove it when you want to pickpocket)
    - Amulet of metaspell influence : gives an extra level 2 spell slot

    Weapons:
    - [Longbow] The dead shot
    - [Short bow] Protector of the dryads
    - [Crossbow] Light crossbow of speed
    - [Halberd] The Chesley Crusher : Thac0 +2, damage +6, set to 1 APR, as long as you have enough strength to carry it (30 lbs)
    - [Darts] I guess darts can be good too

    The list is not exhaustive but that's what I think about

    EDIT:
    Of course the best equipment for your bard is **wands** : wand of fire, wand of paralyzation, wand of polymorphing, etc.

    Arcanjo
  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 296
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    The Chestley Crusher is pretty much made for bards. Any warrior would be too set back by the apr limitation, but any non-warrior other than the bard would be unable to use it at all.

    I hear Garrick can be a shockingly effective melee combatant if you give him The Chestley Crusher and the Gauntlets of Ogre Power, but I imagine the same could be said of anybody. Any bard certainly.

    On the note of wands though, one thing that I think a lot of people don't take advantage of is the ability to cast from scrolls. There are several spell scrolls that merchants sell in bulk. You can buy up to twenty scrolls of Otiluke's Resilient Sphere for example, so basically one or two for your casters to memorize and then the rest is just a wand with twenty some odd charges.

    Yann1989ArcanjothespaceContemplative_Hamster
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 3,484
    Arcanjo said:

    Yes, the +1 Luck bonus applies. It increases to +2 at level 15, and +3 at level 20.

    BG1:EE 2.0? or only 2.5?
    At BG1 as far as I know, it only protects against fear! The bonus to Luck? If so, how do I see in the game if the bonus actually exists? here does not change any status.
    This thread gives a good analysis of the impact of luck (beware that there is an awful lot of material on sites which gives incorrect information about luck).

    You can't see luck directly in the character record, but you can see the impact of that on combat. That's perhaps made easier by adding the following to your LUA file to show more detailed combat information.
    SetPrivateProfileString('Game Options','Extra Combat Info','1')

    This screenshot shows the extra information you get.
    You can see in the to hit roll the specified increase in luck (even without the extra information you'll see that having bard song active will increase the displayed modifier by 1). Note that luck will not cause a die roll to go higher than its natural value, so if a base 20 had been rolled, the luck modifier would have shown as 0 rather than 1. The impact on damage rolls is less clear as the luck modifier is not separately shown, but if you keep rolling you'll notice that the value displayed as base damage is always at least 1 above the theoretical base damage for that weapon.

    ArcanjoYann1989
  • DhariusDharius Member Posts: 178
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    Garrick is quite a nice person. Eldoth is not a very nice person, so Garrick wins :) There

    ArcanjoThacoBell
  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 5,369
    edited August 2
    Eldoth [Char: 16 | Int: 13 | Con: 15 | Dex: 12 | Str: 16 | Wis: 10]
    I usually take one or the other in my party and honestly, it’s a coin flip IMO.

    Garrick
    Stats: Higher Wisdom helps Lore Dex helps AC ranged attack
    Align/Personality: Fits better with Good/Neutral parties
    Pros: Early Access
    Cons: After Silke, no other quests, light banter

    Eldoth
    Stats: higher Str and Con means higher HP, better pack mule and better melee when forced.
    Alignment/Personality: Fits better with Evil/Neutral parties
    Pros: Has some late game quests, can create poison arrows (but only he can use them)
    Cons: Tied to Skie, aquired late in the game.

    If I had to choose, Eldoth with his poison arrows gives him the edge.

    Arcanjo
  • PingwinPingwin Member Posts: 65
    Garrick is awesome.His stats are mediocre but that doesn't matter when his job is standing at the back using all of those scrolls and wands that would otherwise go to waste. He's not too bad at shooting things with a longbow either.

    Friends, Identify and Knock are all great spells that would be wastes of spell slots for a mage but as they will always be used where it is safe to remove armour, they are ideal for a bard.

    Contemplative_HamsterThacoBellDharius
  • DhariusDharius Member Posts: 178
    edited August 14
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    Garrick IS awesome :) All the wands, magical bolts, mage scrolls and potions you can find are his for the using, and he casts mage spells at lvl 10 effectiveness if you max his experience. You can't really argue with that.

    And you say there isn't much equipment for a bard in BG1, what about Bracers ACX? They're made for bards :smiley:

    I love bards, very much indeed

    Post edited by Dharius on
    ThacoBell
  • Ludwig_IILudwig_II Member Posts: 44
    Why no Sod npcs? I want to vote for Voghiln. He's my favourite

  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 296
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    Ludwig_II said:

    Why no Sod npcs? I want to vote for Voghiln. He's my favourite

    Voghiln's not really in competition with Garrick or Eldoth. He can't be recruited in their campaign and they can't be recruited in his.

    RaduzielContemplative_HamsterArcanjo
  • Contemplative_HamsterContemplative_Hamster Member Posts: 797
    edited August 13
    Eldoth [Char: 16 | Int: 13 | Con: 15 | Dex: 12 | Str: 16 | Wis: 10]
    Agree. But you can put your Eldoth and Garrick in SOD thru the console, either the standard versions or your end-game leveled, dudes with items etc. ... and I just realized that means you can put Voghiln in BGee, too !

    Post edited by Contemplative_Hamster on
    Arcanjo
  • ZaghoulZaghoul Member, Moderator Posts: 2,821
    I've used either or even both at times. For myself it just depends on my PC's backstory and to a lesser extent alignment, based on the same (and talks, esp. from BGNPC1) each of these bards. Their stats have no bearing on the matter after I take that into consideration. B)

    StummvonBordwehr
  • byrne20byrne20 Member Posts: 217
    Garrick [Char: 15 | Int: 13 | Con: 9 | Dex: 16 | Str: 14 | Wis: 14]
    I much prefer Garrick to Eldoth. I usually run a good/neutral party and he fits in much better than Eldoth plus Garrick has the dexterity advantage and I like to keep my Bard at range in BG1 so he just works better at range. Plus Garrick is so pathetic that he is funny. Eldoth is just annoying lol

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