Well... that's something, I suppose. Though if you're genuinely concerned about transparency, you might want to figure that out before you release the game to additional platforms, as it'll only serve to bring more people in who have no idea where the winds are blowing, so to speak.
@Dee - Just for clarification - will there be any 'expansion pack' sized additional content in the future? I know there are a few missions included already, as is the Black Pits - but will there be anything such as Durlag's Tower? or will that be it for BG:EE?
Are you guys allowed to include anything of that size?
@EntropyXII I can't say anything specific, but you may have heard some talk about an "Adventure Y". That will be fairly substantial, and it's still "in the cards", so to speak.
Really not what I was referring to - knowing who the trustworthy sources are doesn't help when those sources won't (or can't) communicate any specific information. You brought up Adventure Y: what exactly does "in the cards" mean? Is this something that's actively being developed? A concept that may or may not be realized? Paid DLC? Free DLC? Expansion pack? Patched-in content? Integrated into the campaign? External content like the Black Pits?
BG:EE has been out for six months, and there is no clear and reliable data on any future content or plans for future content. For comparison's sake, BioWare released "Throne of Bhaal" nine months after "Shadows of Amn", and announced it three months prior.
"How to spot a team member" isn't "better visibility on what we are working on".
I must agree, information is not at its best for now from Beamdog.
No announcement of BG2EE, no release date, very small info on patchs content, we don't really know what is going now. I really hope that all this darkness will be gone as soon as the next patch will be out (my guess is, they don't / can't release info until they finish their big patch, which seems to be related to both BGEE and BG2EE).
@Palanthis - How do you mean they haven't told us anything about the new patch? Did you read Trent's post? He explained in quite thorough detail what will be included on the next patch (Renderer etc). It has also been said numerous times there will be no new content - many times in this thread alone.
I don't understand where the confusion is coming from.
Well i mean we had only one or two posts on three months about this patch, and we don't know any real detaisl on the bugs that should be fixed for example. I mean, at least a patch note in progress could be done, am i wrong ? Moreover, they have been SO elusive about BG2EE, about the additionnal content or any addon... and like @shawne said, it's not like BGEE was released yesterday.
@Palanthis - "We've also logged 117 bugs fixed, including that damned Firebead Elvenhair butthole. I hate that guy. A lot. " - Trent Oster, Page 1 of this thread.
I am guessing that with 117 bugs fixed, we are looking at the majority of the bugs being fixed - if not all. What more detail do you need? each individual bug-fix listed?
In regards to your comment about BG2: How many game developers discuss in-depth all the details about an unreleased game again?
Forgive me if I sound blunt or agitated. I have only been a member of these forums for around 2 months and whereas I understand everyone's frustration, a little empathy wouldn't hurt.
Games have bugs. Bugs take time to fix. Fixing takes even longer with a smaller team. Fixing takes even longer when the developers have to continuously spend time on forums reassuring everybody.
If we aren't announcing something, it's because it's either in flux or because it hasn't been approved yet. Approvals need to come from several sources before something can be announced, and this can take quite a while.
We don't want to announce something and then have to do a 180 on what we've said previously because something changed after we posted. We want to be absolutely sure what we tell you is true, to the best of our abilities.
Approvals need to come from several sources before something can be announced, and this can take quite a while.
Some folks seem to forget that Overhaul/Beamdog is not the only company involved here, which complicates things, specially in this particular case, where you have 3 other companies overlooking the project.
I think in Overhaul's case, it's damned if you do, damned if you don't. Today you've got people complaining that there's not enough information. If they give out more details about what their plans are, people will be scrutinizing every little syllable and protesting if they get anything less (or too different).
I mean, seriously, remember when they announced the delay and people argued for 10 pages over what the "little something extra" that was promised should or could be? Patch 2015, by the way, was never promised for May. Some folks said it *might* come out before June and people were already protesting when the 30th of May came with no update.
In other words, no matter how much transparency we get, there's never gonna be an ending to the bitching and the complaining. Me, I'd rather put things in perspective and enjoy the fact that BG:EE not only exists at all, but it's still being worked on.
@EntropyXII: That's not exactly a fair comparison, though - most people on this forum are here because they're existing fans of BG, and know a bit more about it than the average gamer. This isn't a completely unknown property, and when you're dealing with an audience that already has a certain level of understanding about your product, vague and ambiguous comments about what may or may not find its way into the game at some unspecified point in the future are simply insufficient.
@Kilivitz: No one forced Beamdog to announce that "little something extra". They invited the speculation, instead of presenting a clear statement (to this day I have no idea what that "extra" actually was - the inclusion of Baeloth as a party member? Something that still hasn't been implemented?).
Any forum will have detractors, that's just how the Internet works. But that, in itself, is not an excuse to provide only the bare minimum of information.
@shawne - But I consider that the point in itself. Most people here have always been fans of Baldur's Gate, you're right. Myself included. Most people have played this game multiple times and likely been playing it the last 10-15 years.
I, personally am very grateful that Overhaul decided to resurrect this great game. They are adding new content which will be official, and not simply fan-made mods. They are updating it for use over multi-platforms, and made this game playable with modern software. I haven't been able to play Baldur's Gate since Windows XP, so you can imagine my enthusiasm. For a long while I had given up on any prospect of a Baldur's Gate sequel or any further update to the games due to complex ownership on the BG name. Overhaul managed to get the rights to make an Enhanced Edition, albeit with a few restrictions and contractual obligations but that was always the best we could hope for. I am sure I wasn't the only one googling 'BG3' once every few months for the past 5-6 years.
We are here because we are fans and we care about this game because we are fans. Many of us would have waited nearly a decade for this game so i'm sure as fans we can wait a little longer.
...And in regards to your post towards @Kilivitz - I still can't see/understand/fathom why people still think they have released a bare minimum of information. They have told us specifics on a number of occasions. I think the argument at this point is that people are not happy with the specifics being mentioned - especially in regards to this next patch containing no new content.
@EntropyXII: Not to belittle your technical difficulties, because I know how that feels when it comes to older games, but my first BG experience was through GOG and on Windows XP. Yes, I had to install patches and mods and tweaks and fixpacks... but the end result worked well enough for me to play through the entire saga without a single glitch or crash. So from my perspective, it's not enough to claim that functionality is, in and of itself, a selling point for BG:EE.
As for lack of specifics: does the upcoming patch solve the issue with ranged NPCs making melee attacks? What about the stat problems with Dwarven Defenders? Has the Shadowdancer kit been fixed? And while it's clear no new content is being added in this patch, the question remains: is there new content in the pipeline?
@Dee has repeatedly pointed out that it's simply not possible to announce things that haven't been approved, and I accept that - but speaking as someone who has supported this game, that doesn't mean I have to be happy or grateful about what amounts to contractually obligated ambiguity.
Someday , your iMac/iPhone/iPad , Galaxy S4/Note burning , explosion in your home,
You will charge for apple / samsung to get the money back , You forget where you have thousands companies overlooking the product.. You pay money for who ,then you ask who take responsibility, it's reasonable
Customer doesn't need to know how many companies involve , it's not their duty ,
Second,
If Beamdog can't deal with ATARI , Wizards for information disclose , release date , etc.. by themselves
They should manage their team members don't release non-confident information to customers,
Trent tweet information as below on Apr.17th The current plan , barring disaster is to roll the new renderer before the end of May. We may roll out a partial version earlier
I also saw lots of feedback from beamdog related members (beta tester , etc.. ) reply to fans : the new patch coming "soon" , "soon" , "soon" ... in many threads and the timeframe is mid of May
Please define what's the "soon " in beamdog , one week ? Two or Three ? Or more ?
Origianl release date delay must get releated companies approved then just can be announced , We see , not ready , no experience , more polish ,
Eight months later (Orginal release date is Sep/M)
new patch , they should already know , they can't catch up end of May target, why do they still let their team members keep reply to fans "soon" , "soon" , "soon" in mid of May timeframe,
Are still fans problems ? Or they have bad communication with customers ?
Do they study previous experience already ?
Third,
If promise , communication are not important. What is the advantage point in this small company ?
Because you are small , you should more quick , flexible than other companies
We all have choice for other games , i can pay my money for wasteland , eternity project , torment first ..
Like don't starve which is $14.99 , i can use my money to have fun first ,
multi-match not ready , cloudy save not ready , all language translation not ready... after six months
Why should we have to pre-order the game ? I can buy it 1~1.5 years later after the game be released
We pay the money not only for save 2 bucks , it also show we support beamdog , trust developers
This is why they can't always say 's fans have unrealistic wish ,
If they find new patch can't meet end of May target , they can release some information from beta tester or related members more early
That's all , nobody can complain .. because we had knew it in advance.
But after May.25th , it still has lots of "soon" , "soon" , "soon" from team members ... how come ?
Fourth,
There are many feature request threads in the forum , Developers say they consider weather effects , even Linux version , graphic enhance , etc ..
The problem is that is it really possible or not ?
Beamdog is samll company which only has 13 crew ,
Do they really have enough resources , manpowers, capabilities to meet their dreams ?
What's their interal target?
All platform sales?
Focus on multi-play support? Focus on new contents? Foucs on game experience improve?
Or even additonal graphic enhance ? I know source art had been lost , but they ever mention water / weather effects can be considered enhance
If not , why do they set up so high level target then dis-commit again and again, You can't always say under working , consideration ...
Final,
Don't give the fans big dreams... it's bad to say everything is possible , every features can be considered.. but eventually it's almost impossible can be done by current team resource...
I may just waste the time by myself
I really hope the game be fantastic , the company become nice , so i complain,
new patch , they should already know , they can't catch up end of May target, why do they still let their team members keep reply to fans "soon" , "soon" , "soon" in mid of May timeframe,
Because from our perspective we seem to be within 1-2 weeks of shipping, but the big new features Trent mentioned are having more issues than expected.
The thinly veiled requests for specific information are tedious. The fact is that we get way more information about BG:EE than most projects and the devs are frequently active here. Bug fixing is something that you can't always schedule - you work on a problem, but that problem sometimes opens new cans of worms. As for BG2:EE, the same is true, but (I believe) it's also affected by work on BG:EE.
Anyway, I appreciate the information we've been given thus far, even when some of the answers aren't quite what I want to hear. I'm looking forward to the newest patch, as I'm not playing until it comes (the renderer is sorely needed).
I'm a bit tired of the game crashes, so I'm waiting for this patch to come out. It is probably going to be the most significant patch since that first one came out right after the initial game release.
As a side note, I am not sure I agree with continually barraging the team's communication efforts when the OP and director of the project said that things would be changing. Can we not-I don't know-give it a few weeks?
Comments
Woman: Did you remember to wash your face?
Girl: I did now! (laughter)
Man: Have a fine day, dear.
The camera pans over and zooms in on the lead kobold, who turns to face the audience.
Kobold: I love the smell of washed face in the morning...
End
Do you know if there will be some additional content in this patch? I mean something like new quests, kits, npc's, banters ?
Are you guys allowed to include anything of that size?
I can't say anything specific, but you may have heard some talk about an "Adventure Y". That will be fairly substantial, and it's still "in the cards", so to speak.
BG:EE has been out for six months, and there is no clear and reliable data on any future content or plans for future content. For comparison's sake, BioWare released "Throne of Bhaal" nine months after "Shadows of Amn", and announced it three months prior.
"How to spot a team member" isn't "better visibility on what we are working on".
No announcement of BG2EE, no release date, very small info on patchs content, we don't really know what is going now.
I really hope that all this darkness will be gone as soon as the next patch will be out (my guess is, they don't / can't release info until they finish their big patch, which seems to be related to both BGEE and BG2EE).
The sooner the better !
I don't understand where the confusion is coming from.
I mean, at least a patch note in progress could be done, am i wrong ? Moreover, they have been SO elusive about BG2EE, about the additionnal content or any addon... and like @shawne said, it's not like BGEE was released yesterday.
I am guessing that with 117 bugs fixed, we are looking at the majority of the bugs being fixed - if not all. What more detail do you need? each individual bug-fix listed?
In regards to your comment about BG2: How many game developers discuss in-depth all the details about an unreleased game again?
Forgive me if I sound blunt or agitated. I have only been a member of these forums for around 2 months and whereas I understand everyone's frustration, a little empathy wouldn't hurt.
Games have bugs. Bugs take time to fix. Fixing takes even longer with a smaller team. Fixing takes even longer when the developers have to continuously spend time on forums reassuring everybody.
If we aren't announcing something, it's because it's either in flux or because it hasn't been approved yet. Approvals need to come from several sources before something can be announced, and this can take quite a while.
We don't want to announce something and then have to do a 180 on what we've said previously because something changed after we posted. We want to be absolutely sure what we tell you is true, to the best of our abilities.
I think in Overhaul's case, it's damned if you do, damned if you don't. Today you've got people complaining that there's not enough information. If they give out more details about what their plans are, people will be scrutinizing every little syllable and protesting if they get anything less (or too different).
I mean, seriously, remember when they announced the delay and people argued for 10 pages over what the "little something extra" that was promised should or could be? Patch 2015, by the way, was never promised for May. Some folks said it *might* come out before June and people were already protesting when the 30th of May came with no update.
In other words, no matter how much transparency we get, there's never gonna be an ending to the bitching and the complaining. Me, I'd rather put things in perspective and enjoy the fact that BG:EE not only exists at all, but it's still being worked on.
So having made that clear, is there a "stop Karoug from wiping me out even at the lowest difficulty" patch in the works?
@Kilivitz: No one forced Beamdog to announce that "little something extra". They invited the speculation, instead of presenting a clear statement (to this day I have no idea what that "extra" actually was - the inclusion of Baeloth as a party member? Something that still hasn't been implemented?).
Any forum will have detractors, that's just how the Internet works. But that, in itself, is not an excuse to provide only the bare minimum of information.
I, personally am very grateful that Overhaul decided to resurrect this great game. They are adding new content which will be official, and not simply fan-made mods. They are updating it for use over multi-platforms, and made this game playable with modern software. I haven't been able to play Baldur's Gate since Windows XP, so you can imagine my enthusiasm. For a long while I had given up on any prospect of a Baldur's Gate sequel or any further update to the games due to complex ownership on the BG name. Overhaul managed to get the rights to make an Enhanced Edition, albeit with a few restrictions and contractual obligations but that was always the best we could hope for. I am sure I wasn't the only one googling 'BG3' once every few months for the past 5-6 years.
We are here because we are fans and we care about this game because we are fans. Many of us would have waited nearly a decade for this game so i'm sure as fans we can wait a little longer.
...And in regards to your post towards @Kilivitz - I still can't see/understand/fathom why people still think they have released a bare minimum of information. They have told us specifics on a number of occasions. I think the argument at this point is that people are not happy with the specifics being mentioned - especially in regards to this next patch containing no new content.
As for lack of specifics: does the upcoming patch solve the issue with ranged NPCs making melee attacks? What about the stat problems with Dwarven Defenders? Has the Shadowdancer kit been fixed? And while it's clear no new content is being added in this patch, the question remains: is there new content in the pipeline?
@Dee has repeatedly pointed out that it's simply not possible to announce things that haven't been approved, and I accept that - but speaking as someone who has supported this game, that doesn't mean I have to be happy or grateful about what amounts to contractually obligated ambiguity.
First,
Someday , your iMac/iPhone/iPad , Galaxy S4/Note burning , explosion in your home,
You will charge for apple / samsung to get the money back ,
You forget where you have thousands companies overlooking the product..
You pay money for who ,then you ask who take responsibility, it's reasonable
Customer doesn't need to know how many companies involve , it's not their duty ,
Second,
If Beamdog can't deal with ATARI , Wizards for information disclose , release date , etc.. by themselves
They should manage their team members don't release non-confident information to customers,
Trent tweet information as below on Apr.17th
The current plan , barring disaster is to roll the new renderer before the end of May. We may roll out a partial version earlier
I also saw lots of feedback from beamdog related members (beta tester , etc.. ) reply to fans : the new patch coming "soon" , "soon" , "soon" ... in many threads and the timeframe is mid of May
Please define what's the "soon " in beamdog , one week ? Two or Three ? Or more ?
Origianl release date delay must get releated companies approved then just can be announced ,
We see , not ready , no experience , more polish ,
Eight months later (Orginal release date is Sep/M)
new patch , they should already know , they can't catch up end of May target, why do they still let their team members keep reply to fans "soon" , "soon" , "soon" in mid of May timeframe,
Are still fans problems ? Or they have bad communication with customers ?
Do they study previous experience already ?
Third,
If promise , communication are not important.
What is the advantage point in this small company ?
Because you are small , you should more quick , flexible than other companies
We all have choice for other games , i can pay my money for wasteland , eternity project , torment first ..
Like don't starve which is $14.99 , i can use my money to have fun first ,
multi-match not ready , cloudy save not ready , all language translation not ready... after six months
Why should we have to pre-order the game ? I can buy it 1~1.5 years later after the game be released
We pay the money not only for save 2 bucks , it also show we support beamdog , trust developers
This is why they can't always say 's fans have unrealistic wish ,
If they find new patch can't meet end of May target , they can release some information from beta tester or related members more early
That's all , nobody can complain .. because we had knew it in advance.
But after May.25th , it still has lots of "soon" , "soon" , "soon" from team members ... how come ?
Fourth,
There are many feature request threads in the forum ,
Developers say they consider weather effects , even Linux version , graphic enhance , etc ..
The problem is that is it really possible or not ?
Beamdog is samll company which only has 13 crew ,
Do they really have enough resources , manpowers, capabilities to meet their dreams ?
What's their interal target?
All platform sales?
Focus on multi-play support?
Focus on new contents?
Foucs on game experience improve?
Or even additonal graphic enhance ? I know source art had been lost , but they ever mention water / weather effects can be considered enhance
If not , why do they set up so high level target then dis-commit again and again,
You can't always say under working , consideration ...
Final,
Don't give the fans big dreams... it's bad to say everything is possible , every features can be considered.. but eventually it's almost impossible can be done by current team resource...
I may just waste the time by myself
I really hope the game be fantastic , the company become nice , so i complain,
At the end of the day, we all care deeply about making this the best game it can be, and we don't want to disappoint you guys. We're fans, too.
Anyway, I appreciate the information we've been given thus far, even when some of the answers aren't quite what I want to hear. I'm looking forward to the newest patch, as I'm not playing until it comes (the renderer is sorely needed).
I'm a bit tired of the game crashes, so I'm waiting for this patch to come out. It is probably going to be the most significant patch since that first one came out right after the initial game release.
As a side note, I am not sure I agree with continually barraging the team's communication efforts when the OP and director of the project said that things would be changing. Can we not-I don't know-give it a few weeks?
It's quite clear that patient and impatient alike, are very interested in getting more out of BG:EE, and its' sequel.
That is all good in my book, dedication and love towards a game comes in many forms.
Remember, every time someone in here writes in harsh words, its usually spurred by a desire for the product to (impossibly) flawless.
And it comforts me for the months to come, had the forum been dead at this point, beamdog would know that it was time throw in the towel.
Crack on, summer is comming, I need a tan and lots of beer - sep/oct release sounds just fine.