4) How many guards & Flaming Fist does Baldur's Gate have? I've read they have 300 Flaming Fist but also read somewhere that it's more towards thousands.
I dont know for sure, but one thread a few months ago had a screencap of about 100 Flaming Fist mercenaries in Beregost alone, because the player refused to sleep in the inn.
I guess their recruitment levels can vary depending on how severe criminal activity is, with vagrants being the #1 priority.
Screw this, the damn BOOK isn't canon. My playthroughs are cannon. Your playthroughs are canon. Canon in the eye of the beholder... minus the whole turn into a statue thing
Well, no...technically canon is decided by the gents at Wizards of the Coast. Individual campaigns can deviate from canon as they see fit.
Heck, by all accounts, Ed Greenwood, the creator of the Realms, has a campaign that is remarkably different from the published setting. Doesn't make his version canon, though.
Technically, the novels are canon. But they're canon in the same way that the Clone Saga is canon for Spider-Man comics - nobody mentions them and we all generally pretend they didn't happen. Even Murder in Baldur's Gate avoids referencing them directly save for the existence of Abdel Adrian.
4) How many guards & Flaming Fist does Baldur's Gate have? I've read they have 300 Flaming Fist but also read somewhere that it's more towards thousands.
I dont know for sure, but one thread a few months ago had a screencap of about 100 Flaming Fist mercenaries in Beregost alone, because the player refused to sleep in the inn.
I guess their recruitment levels can vary depending on how severe criminal activity is, with vagrants being the #1 priority.
Don't they also have a larger base in the south somewhere? If they can teleport then they may recruit from the south
Screw this, the damn BOOK isn't canon. My playthroughs are cannon. Your playthroughs are canon. Canon in the eye of the beholder... minus the whole turn into a statue thing
Well, no...technically canon is decided by the gents at Wizards of the Coast. Individual campaigns can deviate from canon as they see fit.
Heck, by all accounts, Ed Greenwood, the creator of the Realms, has a campaign that is remarkably different from the published setting. Doesn't make his version canon, though.
Technically, the novels are canon. But they're canon in the same way that the Clone Saga is canon for Spider-Man comics - nobody mentions them and we all generally pretend they didn't happen. Even Murder in Baldur's Gate avoids referencing them directly save for the existence of Abdel Adrian.
I'll try and pinpoint this discussion down to a few questions, which may make it easier rather than discussing the books.
1) Do Elminster's appearances line up with his timeline? 2) Why are Minsc and Dynaheir going on their dejemma at quite a late age (from appearance)? 3) Is Shandalar's ship between Baldur's Gate and Ulgoth's Beard or actually within the city? 4) How many guards & Flaming Fist does Baldur's Gate have? I've read they have 300 Flaming Fist but also read somewhere that it's more towards thousands. 5) Is Boo really a miniature giant space hamster? (OH GOD, IT HAS BEGUN :P)
1) to tell the truth I don't really recall if Elminster was in the books or not. It is possible that he was and it is also possible that this timeline would sync up. When you're the Sage of Shadowdale it's nothing to travel between one end of the realms to the other in a matter of moments. 2) Dynaheir isn't even mentioned in the books and I don't believe it mentions anything about Minsc being on a dajemma. He is basically a naked lunatic that Abdel is imprisoned with in Irenicus' dungeon. In the books there's dozens of prisoners there for some reason, Minsc just happens to be one of those that aided Abdel, Imoen, and Jaheira. Once they are free he goes with them to the Copper Coronet where he decides to become a serving wench (not joking). 3) Shandalar is not in the novels so he is not a canon character. 4) Not entirely sure on the numbers. The population of Baldur's Gate around that time was 42,000 so I would assume there would have been more than 300 flaming fist mercenaries. 5) Probably not. He is with Minsc in the second novel but much like the redheaded (long red hair and a patchy beard as he is described) madman he isn't fleshed out at all.
5) Probably not. He is with Minsc in the second novel but much like the redheaded (long red hair and a patchy beard as he is described) madman he isn't fleshed out at all.
It's like Athans was told that Minsc was a beloved character but provided 0 background. "There's this really buff imbecile character that you must include." "We can't have him in the book! He's too similar to Abdel!" "Well, then write him out really early."
I'll try and pinpoint this discussion down to a few questions, which may make it easier rather than discussing the books.
1) Do Elminster's appearances line up with his timeline? 2) Why are Minsc and Dynaheir going on their dejemma at quite a late age (from appearance)? 3) Is Shandalar's ship between Baldur's Gate and Ulgoth's Beard or actually within the city? 4) How many guards & Flaming Fist does Baldur's Gate have? I've read they have 300 Flaming Fist but also read somewhere that it's more towards thousands. 5) Is Boo really a miniature giant space hamster? (OH GOD, IT HAS BEGUN :P)
1) to tell the truth I don't really recall if Elminster was in the books or not. It is possible that he was and it is also possible that this timeline would sync up. When you're the Sage of Shadowdale it's nothing to travel between one end of the realms to the other in a matter of moments. 2) Dynaheir isn't even mentioned in the books and I don't believe it mentions anything about Minsc being on a dajemma. He is basically a naked lunatic that Abdel is imprisoned with in Irenicus' dungeon. In the books there's dozens of prisoners there for some reason, Minsc just happens to be one of those that aided Abdel, Imoen, and Jaheira. Once they are free he goes with them to the Copper Coronet where he decides to become a serving wench (not joking). 3) Shandalar is not in the novels so he is not a canon character. 4) Not entirely sure on the numbers. The population of Baldur's Gate around that time was 42,000 so I would assume there would have been more than 300 flaming fist mercenaries. 5) Probably not. He is with Minsc in the second novel but much like the redheaded (long red hair and a patchy beard as he is described) madman he isn't fleshed out at all.
Seriously, what sort of drugs was the author on? Why write a book about a game, and go so far off point? Did this guy just get an outline of what happens in the game, some character names, and have absolutely no inkling as to the personality of the game? It's rather infuriating just hearing these silly and stupid changes to the story. Has the author ever been interviewed about his "thought process". Would love to hear a bit of that.
I'll try and pinpoint this discussion down to a few questions, which may make it easier rather than discussing the books.
1) Do Elminster's appearances line up with his timeline? 2) Why are Minsc and Dynaheir going on their dejemma at quite a late age (from appearance)? 3) Is Shandalar's ship between Baldur's Gate and Ulgoth's Beard or actually within the city? 4) How many guards & Flaming Fist does Baldur's Gate have? I've read they have 300 Flaming Fist but also read somewhere that it's more towards thousands. 5) Is Boo really a miniature giant space hamster? (OH GOD, IT HAS BEGUN :P)
1) to tell the truth I don't really recall if Elminster was in the books or not. It is possible that he was and it is also possible that this timeline would sync up. When you're the Sage of Shadowdale it's nothing to travel between one end of the realms to the other in a matter of moments. 2) Dynaheir isn't even mentioned in the books and I don't believe it mentions anything about Minsc being on a dajemma. He is basically a naked lunatic that Abdel is imprisoned with in Irenicus' dungeon. In the books there's dozens of prisoners there for some reason, Minsc just happens to be one of those that aided Abdel, Imoen, and Jaheira. Once they are free he goes with them to the Copper Coronet where he decides to become a serving wench (not joking). 3) Shandalar is not in the novels so he is not a canon character. 4) Not entirely sure on the numbers. The population of Baldur's Gate around that time was 42,000 so I would assume there would have been more than 300 flaming fist mercenaries. 5) Probably not. He is with Minsc in the second novel but much like the redheaded (long red hair and a patchy beard as he is described) madman he isn't fleshed out at all.
Seriously, what sort of drugs was the author on? Why write a book about a game, and go so far off point? Did this guy just get an outline of what happens in the game, some character names, and have absolutely no inkling as to the personality of the game? It's rather infuriating just hearing these silly and stupid changes to the story. Has the author ever been interviewed about his "thought process". Would love to hear a bit of that.
He was probably supplied with just that. I think that's how most game tie-in novels work and i doubt it would have been much different in this case. Its likely he wasn't even given the final game plot, and certainly not the game script (who would have time for that?). Its likely Athans was supplied with the core plot direction, probably about mid-way through development or even earlier, and the names and rough descriptions of some major characters (personality-wise, maybe not even physically).
Seriously, what sort of drugs was the author on? Why write a book about a game, and go so far off point? Did this guy just get an outline of what happens in the game, some character names, and have absolutely no inkling as to the personality of the game? It's rather infuriating just hearing these silly and stupid changes to the story. Has the author ever been interviewed about his "thought process". Would love to hear a bit of that.
That's a good question and I personally think it came down to lazy writing and just getting a paycheck. I honestly think he might have played the first bit, all the way up until you meet Xzar and Montaron (so like 10 minutes tops) but didn't like that his main character wasn't a badass right out of the gate and changed his origin a bit. After that it went right off the rails.
Xzar and Montaron are evil and working for a secret organization? Hmm... I wont progress the story to discover that means they work for the Zhentarim and just assume it means their in league with Sarevok... the evil guy in this story... why would it have anything to do with established lore outside of this game? Man, I don't like this Khalid guy and Jaheira is soo fricking hot! I know, I'll have Khalid be a wife beating asshole who is killed in a random encounter with some slimes while walking down the road. That way I can totally have Abdel bone Jaheira guilt free! Hmm, this game needs more loveable NPC's included besides Jaheira... I know I'll add Xan! Oh, he's a mage? Yeah but I don't know anything about the game, especially about the games magic (quite evident since Jaheira casts 0 spells in the first novel despite being a druid), so I'll just say he's a fighter too. I also wont portray him as a depressing downer, because I never got that far to see what his personality is like, I'll just make him a generic elf. Sarevok casts spells right? Eh, wahtever... I'll have him cast spells.
Wham, bam, thank you ma'am! BG1 The Book. Make the cheque out to cash please!
None of what happens in the BG games is canonical in the novelised works of Faerun. Video-games have to exist in their own canon.
The only things you could say were canonical for sure are the solid, unchanging events. That Sarevok tried to start a war against Amn, that the Bhaalspawn were persecuted ... nothing about the characters can ever be considered to have actually happened.
Also, on a semi-related note, it should be noted that anything Ed Greenwood says about Forgotten Realms is considered canon unless stated otherwise by WotC.
I think the only person with the authority to retcon it (with all respect to Ed Greenwood) is Volo. Maybe I'll have Dorn threaten him into it during Throne of Bhaal.
Dang. That's kind of amazing, how much work you've put into it. My novelization attempt's been collecting dust inside my computer for the past several months... Doesn't help that it's pretty slow, and I've got my own worlds to create!
Comments
Heck, by all accounts, Ed Greenwood, the creator of the Realms, has a campaign that is remarkably different from the published setting. Doesn't make his version canon, though.
Technically, the novels are canon. But they're canon in the same way that the Clone Saga is canon for Spider-Man comics - nobody mentions them and we all generally pretend they didn't happen. Even Murder in Baldur's Gate avoids referencing them directly save for the existence of Abdel Adrian.
2) Dynaheir isn't even mentioned in the books and I don't believe it mentions anything about Minsc being on a dajemma. He is basically a naked lunatic that Abdel is imprisoned with in Irenicus' dungeon. In the books there's dozens of prisoners there for some reason, Minsc just happens to be one of those that aided Abdel, Imoen, and Jaheira. Once they are free he goes with them to the Copper Coronet where he decides to become a serving wench (not joking).
3) Shandalar is not in the novels so he is not a canon character.
4) Not entirely sure on the numbers. The population of Baldur's Gate around that time was 42,000 so I would assume there would have been more than 300 flaming fist mercenaries.
5) Probably not. He is with Minsc in the second novel but much like the redheaded (long red hair and a patchy beard as he is described) madman he isn't fleshed out at all.
Xzar and Montaron are evil and working for a secret organization? Hmm... I wont progress the story to discover that means they work for the Zhentarim and just assume it means their in league with Sarevok... the evil guy in this story... why would it have anything to do with established lore outside of this game? Man, I don't like this Khalid guy and Jaheira is soo fricking hot! I know, I'll have Khalid be a wife beating asshole who is killed in a random encounter with some slimes while walking down the road. That way I can totally have Abdel bone Jaheira guilt free! Hmm, this game needs more loveable NPC's included besides Jaheira... I know I'll add Xan! Oh, he's a mage? Yeah but I don't know anything about the game, especially about the games magic (quite evident since Jaheira casts 0 spells in the first novel despite being a druid), so I'll just say he's a fighter too. I also wont portray him as a depressing downer, because I never got that far to see what his personality is like, I'll just make him a generic elf. Sarevok casts spells right? Eh, wahtever... I'll have him cast spells.
Wham, bam, thank you ma'am! BG1 The Book. Make the cheque out to cash please!
The only things you could say were canonical for sure are the solid, unchanging events. That Sarevok tried to start a war against Amn, that the Bhaalspawn were persecuted ... nothing about the characters can ever be considered to have actually happened.
Maybe I'll have Dorn threaten him into it during Throne of Bhaal.
Want to see how much I've done so far?
https://www.fanfiction.net/u/4738936/SilentGuy2011
... God I hope it's reliable.
Just keep going, and take whatever time you need!