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Politics. The feel in your country.

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  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,963
    edited December 2016
    This is perfect-------------
    ----------------------
    --------------------
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOgyKFZ8GnA
  • TakisMegasTakisMegas Member Posts: 835
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    edited May 2017
    most perfectest


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJOwdrTA8Gw


    Just because I've been obsessed with this video for ages.
    Post edited by semiticgoddess on
  • TakisMegasTakisMegas Member Posts: 835
    edited December 2016
    Semiticgod you funnyerist.


    This is the last one for today. Don't condone the channel but the info is interesting.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9F-cHc5Qog
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    Hillary's final popular vote margin is likely going to sit at around 2.9 million, and well over 2%. I believe I was laughed at earlier in the thread weeks ago suggesting that would be the case. It's quite easy to tell liberals to just sit back and take it, since this Electoral College discrepency NEVER happens in the opposite direction. Democrats have won the popular vote in 6 of the last 7 Presidential elections. Yet it's basically 50/50 in terms of who has actually been in power. I've posted it many times, but will say one more time. A country being ruled by a party who got 3 million less votes, but acting as if they have a massive mandate, is not a recipe for social stability. But it's nice that the thousands of square miles of grassland in the middle of the country count more than actual people. Indeed, we have a solid history of only giving certain people a fraction of their humanity. Something like 3/5 maybe.
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    It's worth pointing out that the 3/5 compromise was never about gauging the worth of a black person's life relative to a white person. It was done as a compromise with the slave states, who believed that they should get extra power from their slave populations even though their slaves could not vote. It was about political power, not the value of a human being.

    When you think about it, the notion that whites of the time would have believed a black person was only worth 3/5 of a white person is unrealistic. They'd probably have put the figure closer to 1/10 of a person.
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,037
    If Democrats want to win the White House back in 2020 then 1) they should quit concentrating themselves into the large cities by having some move to areas where their votes might help swing a State away from Republican control and 2) front better candidates.

    *************

    The Russian Ambassador to Turkey was gunned down in public while giving a speech at an art museum. The shooter claimed that he was committing his act of violence in response to what has been going on in Aleppo for quite some time. Recently, Syrian rebels have mostly lost any control of that city that they might have had--they will probably be completely defeated within a year.
  • ButtercheeseButtercheese Member Posts: 3,766
    I just read about a recent publishing from the AfD (Alternative für Deutschland), a neo-nazi party from Germany who have gained a lot of popularity in recent years.
    http://www.afdfraktion-lsa.de/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/Fruehsexualisierung.pdf

    In this paper they bash gay people in the name of "the children", claiming that "every child has the right to a father and mother" and that "children should be protected from any sexually themed influences to assure a healthy upbringing".

    These guys make me so f***ing sick, I am going to puke at this point.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2016

    If Democrats want to win the White House back in 2020 then 1) they should quit concentrating themselves into the large cities by having some move to areas where their votes might help swing a State away from Republican control and 2) front better candidates.

    *************

    The Russian Ambassador to Turkey was gunned down in public while giving a speech at an art museum. The shooter claimed that he was committing his act of violence in response to what has been going on in Aleppo for quite some time. Recently, Syrian rebels have mostly lost any control of that city that they might have had--they will probably be completely defeated within a year.

    I can't tell if that's a sarcastic suggestion, but the idea that one side would have to employ some sort of mass migration movement to attain Electoral relevancy is, frankly, absurd. Logistically foremost, and simply as a matter of principle.

    You can certainly say that either way we go (Electoral/Popular), one side is going to be at a disproportionate advantage. However, one is based on the actual reality of where people live, and the other is simply assigning signifigance to rural areas simply to counter the reality of the first. One reflects the way things are (population-wise), and the other reflects a imagined America that many WISH existed.

    Funny enough, it is most often conservatives who talk about how horrible it is for society when teachers "grade on a curve", or hand out participation trophies. That is exactly what is being done with the lower-population states.

    Also something to watch?? The absolute BEDROCK of conservative principles for decades has been local control and giving power to the states. Watch what happens when liberal governors and mayors attempt to do so now to counter the Trump Administration. This "principle" will reveal itself like the Wizard behind the curtain as nothing but an illusion. It's already taking place in NC.

    I watched the video of the Russian Ambassator being gunned down. Crazy stuff. It's also what happens when your government is at least 50% complicit in the wholesale slaughter of an entire population.
  • TakisMegasTakisMegas Member Posts: 835

    If Democrats want to win the White House back in 2020 then 1) they should quit concentrating themselves into the large cities by having some move to areas where their votes might help swing a State away from Republican control and 2) front better candidates.

    *************

    The Russian Ambassador to Turkey was gunned down in public while giving a speech at an art museum. The shooter claimed that he was committing his act of violence in response to what has been going on in Aleppo for quite some time. Recently, Syrian rebels have mostly lost any control of that city that they might have had--they will probably be completely defeated within a year.

    Just saw the vid. That is what happens when a country gets overtaken by a religious fanatical group combined with a tyrannical leader. No one wants an Islamic state on their doorstep. This is why Europe, the US, Russia and Iran are trying to work out their differences in Syria and then turn it's eyes solely on eliminating this creation called ISIL and any country that enables these fanatics.

    It does not look good for Turkey and Saudi Arabia right now, especially how the voting in countries is going in the rest of the world.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2016
    ISIL's very existence is a result of the vacuum created by removing Saddam Hussein from power with even the slightest clue about what to do next. Paul Bremer disbanded the entire Iraqi security force, putting thousands upon thousands of men now without jobs into a war ravaged country without the slightest prospect of what they should do next. Those men ended up forming the foundations of what ISIL is today. Or basically, everything Iraq War critics were predicting 13 years ago.
  • TakisMegasTakisMegas Member Posts: 835

    ISIL's very existence is a result of the vacuum created by removing Saddam Hussein from power with even the slightest clue about what to do next. Paul Bremer disbanded the entire Iraqi security force, putting thousands upon thousands of men now without jobs into a war ravaged country without the slightest prospect of what they should do next. Those men ended up forming the foundations of what ISIL is today. Or basically, everything Iraq War critics were predicting 13 years ago.

    The first 9/11

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Vienna


    This was the documentation and push to stop ISIL the first time.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Barbary_War


    Here I do not condone this person but it was the easiest way for me to share and educate those who have forgotten world history.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uj8J62BqRMo

    Education of past events in human history is the KEY to making sure future generations do not repeat or accept past transgressions.
  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 975
    ...the two aren't even similar.


    This was the documentation and push to stop ISIL the first time.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Barbary_War

    Neither are these.

    Specious historical comparisons are specious. "This time a Muslim army fought a Christian one" does not a 9/11 make, especially since no armies were involved in the latter (and also, if one is pretending 9/11 was a battle, the jihadists won). ISIL is also trying to establish an imagined pure Caliphate like the early Islamic ones (without all the necessary compromises of ruling over a mostly non-Islamic population), instead of a multicultural, polyglot sophisticated empire like the Ottomans.

    More to the point, this "clash of civilisations" crap is crap. Islam and Christianity are not nations. They're religions, and there are Christians in Syria and Iraq and millions of Muslims in America and Britain. They are no more destined to fight than Buddhists and Hindus (despite the bloody past between the two, or that Hindus largely drove Buddhism out of India).

    ISIL exists because the United States invaded Iraq in response to 9/11 despite Iraq having nothing to do with 9/11, deposed its Sunni dictator and allowed a government run by the Shiite majority to be in charge. The dispossessed Sunni minority, having lost power and being persecuted and ethnically cleansed by the majority (and doing their own in turn, because there's rarely any good guys in civil wars), turned in some numbers to a charismatic cleric claiming to be the new Caliph, and whose forces provided protection and aid to abandoned and distressed Sunnis, while attacking and demonising everyone else. Simple story, happened a thousand times all over the world. If it was in Africa or Southeast Asia, the leader would have some other hook besides claiming to be Caliph.

    Hell, violent militias pop up all over the Western world (look at Hungary, for example) despite the fact that white Christians are in control of those countries and in no realistic danger of losing it. If they actually did lose control to a majority of Muslims, does anyone doubt that some of those would end up being pretty much the same as ISIL?

    And none of it would bear much resemblance to a battle between a sprawling Islamic empire and a coalition of smaller European states, nor to a minor war fought over trade routes.
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,037
    @jjstraka34 Yes, the idea that a huge mass of people should move was sarcastic. Strangely, though, that tactic would be faster and easier than trying to amend the Constitution to get rid of the Electoral College--there will never be enough Republican support in Congress or in State Legislatures for that to happen in my lifetime (or yours, for that matter). Fronting better candidates, though, was not sarcastic--unless he really screws up I still think Julian Castro would be a good option for Democrats in 2020. No one else comes to mind right now but I haven't really looked into the issue too deeply since I am not a Democrat.

    The roots of the IS go all the way back to the 1950s. The research topics you want search to fill in the details: Mosaddeq, the Shah of Iran, Ayatollah Khomenei, Saddam Hussein, Gulf War, Al Qeuda. Perhaps one day we will quit messing around with the internal politics of other countries but we haven't learned that lesson yet, despite the events of 2001.
  • TakisMegasTakisMegas Member Posts: 835
    Ayiekie said:

    ...the two aren't even similar.


    This was the documentation and push to stop ISIL the first time.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Barbary_War

    Neither are these.

    Specious historical comparisons are specious. "This time a Muslim army fought a Christian one" does not a 9/11 make, especially since no armies were involved in the latter (and also, if one is pretending 9/11 was a battle, the jihadists won). ISIL is also trying to establish an imagined pure Caliphate like the early Islamic ones (without all the necessary compromises of ruling over a mostly non-Islamic population), instead of a multicultural, polyglot sophisticated empire like the Ottomans.

    More to the point, this "clash of civilisations" crap is crap. Islam and Christianity are not nations. They're religions, and there are Christians in Syria and Iraq and millions of Muslims in America and Britain. They are no more destined to fight than Buddhists and Hindus (despite the bloody past between the two, or that Hindus largely drove Buddhism out of India).

    ISIL exists because the United States invaded Iraq in response to 9/11 despite Iraq having nothing to do with 9/11, deposed its Sunni dictator and allowed a government run by the Shiite majority to be in charge. The dispossessed Sunni minority, having lost power and being persecuted and ethnically cleansed by the majority (and doing their own in turn, because there's rarely any good guys in civil wars), turned in some numbers to a charismatic cleric claiming to be the new Caliph, and whose forces provided protection and aid to abandoned and distressed Sunnis, while attacking and demonising everyone else. Simple story, happened a thousand times all over the world. If it was in Africa or Southeast Asia, the leader would have some other hook besides claiming to be Caliph.

    Hell, violent militias pop up all over the Western world (look at Hungary, for example) despite the fact that white Christians are in control of those countries and in no realistic danger of losing it. If they actually did lose control to a majority of Muslims, does anyone doubt that some of those would end up being pretty much the same as ISIL?

    And none of it would bear much resemblance to a battle between a sprawling Islamic empire and a coalition of smaller European states, nor to a minor war fought over trade routes.
    I am not talking about Christianity or Islam. If that's where your mind goes by seeing my post then I apologize that I could not make it clearer for you. If you think I was talking about religion in general then I think you should revisit my post and analyze it some more.

    Tyranny is Tyranny period.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    Trump is planning on continuing to employ his own private security force, consisting of ex-cops and FBI agents, separate from the Secret Service. When this all falls apart, we won't be able to say all the signs weren't flashing in neon letters with 1000 watt bulbs.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited December 2016

    @jjstraka34 Yes, the idea that a huge mass of people should move was sarcastic. Strangely, though, that tactic would be faster and easier than trying to amend the Constitution to get rid of the Electoral College--there will never be enough Republican support in Congress or in State Legislatures for that to happen in my lifetime (or yours, for that matter). Fronting better candidates, though, was not sarcastic--unless he really screws up I still think Julian Castro would be a good option for Democrats in 2020. No one else comes to mind right now but I haven't really looked into the issue too deeply since I am not a Democrat.

    The roots of the IS go all the way back to the 1950s. The research topics you want search to fill in the details: Mosaddeq, the Shah of Iran, Ayatollah Khomenei, Saddam Hussein, Gulf War, Al Qeuda. Perhaps one day we will quit messing around with the internal politics of other countries but we haven't learned that lesson yet, despite the events of 2001.

    I agree it would be faster, because the other option isn't ever going to happen, ESPECIALLY now. Better candidates, of course. Castro should have been put on the ticket this time, in retrospect. I have no idea who we get to run in 2020, though I know if needs to be someone with an edge and balls of steel, or Trump will eat them for lunch. Someone who doesn't let the bully take their lunch money.

    As for the never-ending problems in the Middle East.....they can't do anything to us we haven't done to them 1000 times over. Since the end of WWII, Russia and the US have been inserting themselves into places we have no business, because of oil. It's a "terrorist" when a lone person blows up a marketplace, but the US or Russia dropping bombs on an entire village in wholesale slaughter is "collateral damage". The term terrorism is meaningless to me, because it only applies to radical Muslim extremists. Hell, it isn't even used to describe white extremists in the US who commit mass murder. They are always referred to as a "lone wolf". We've been overthrowing their leaders and pillaging their land for a century, and are surprised when there is reprisal?? That is the height of arrogance.
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,037
    edited December 2016
    Here is the list of past and current domestic terror organizations operating inside the United States, according to the FBI. A handful of these groups fall under the general umbrella category of "white supremacist organizations". Notable lone wolves include Timothy McVeigh, Terry Nichols, Eric Rudolph, Wade Page, and, of course, Theodore Kaczynski.

    This is why capitalism, for all its other flaws, winds up being the best way to deal with other people and countries. "Oh, you have crude or refined oil for sale, you say? What is the price of the goods you are selling?" "$30 per standard barrel." "$27.50 and I'll cut you a good deal on food we are exporting." "Deal." No guns or political machinations required, just truthful and open communication between equal trading partners. How exactly is that difficult, I wonder? *shrug*

    Well, the Electoral College has voted and so now the count is official. Some electors on both sides did become faithless--Clinton lost a few (some of whom were replaced) and Trump lost a few.

    Since I give advice to Democrats I should, in the interest of equity, give advice to Republicans. Sure, you won this time but if you want to continue winning in the future you need to figure out how to woo California. Clinton's total: 65,844,610, Clinton's California total: 8,753,788; Trump's total: 62,979,636, Trump's California total: 4,483,810. Analysis: without California, Trump wins the popular vote, as well--58,495,826 to 57,090,822. There once was a time when California voted Republican; of course, back in those days Texas voted Democrat.

    Trump is planning on continuing to employ his own private security force, consisting of ex-cops and FBI agents, separate from the Secret Service. When this all falls apart, we won't be able to say all the signs weren't flashing in neon letters with 1000 watt bulbs.

    There is no way this ends well. Ideally, people should avoid even the appearance of doing anything that looks like this.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850

    Here is the list of past and current domestic terror organizations operating inside the United States, according to the FBI. A handful of these groups fall under the general umbrella category of "white supremacist organizations". Notable lone wolves include Timothy McVeigh, Terry Nichols, Eric Rudolph, Wade Page, and, of course, Theodore Kaczynski.

    This is why capitalism, for all its other flaws, winds up being the best way to deal with other people and countries. "Oh, you have crude or refined oil for sale, you say? What is the price of the goods you are selling?" "$30 per standard barrel." "$27.50 and I'll cut you a good deal on food we are exporting." "Deal." No guns or political machinations required, just truthful and open communication between equal trading partners. How exactly is that difficult, I wonder? *shrug*

    Well, the Electoral College has voted and so now the count is official. Some electors on both sides did become faithless--Clinton lost a few (some of whom were replaced) and Trump lost a few.

    Since I give advice to Democrats I should, in the interest of equity, give advice to Republicans. Sure, you won this time but if you want to continue winning in the future you need to figure out how to woo California. Clinton's total: 65,844,610, Clinton's California total: 8,753,788; Trump's total: 62,979,636, Trump's California total: 4,483,810. Analysis: without California, Trump wins the popular vote, as well--58,495,826 to 57,090,822. There once was a time when California voted Republican; of course, back in those days Texas voted Democrat.

    Trump is planning on continuing to employ his own private security force, consisting of ex-cops and FBI agents, separate from the Secret Service. When this all falls apart, we won't be able to say all the signs weren't flashing in neon letters with 1000 watt bulbs.

    There is no way this ends well. Ideally, people should avoid even the appearance of doing anything that looks like this.
    It was Pete Wilson's support of Prop 187 that drove the Republican Party in California into the ground. The only reason Governor Terminator got in was because of a recall election organized by, among other corporate sleaze, Enron (they were purposefully initiating rolling blackouts to tank Grey Davis' popularity). I believe many of these guys are sitting in a prison cell right now.

    I see a TON of people on the right claiming "well, if it wasn't for California". Which is preposterous. It's even more preposterous considering that California is the EXACT state that has it's votes most devalued by the Electoral College.

    Don't forget "lone wolf" Dylan Roof, who walked into a black church, sat down with them for bible study, and then shot 9 of them to death. For the record, after he was caught, the cops made sure they got him some food at Burger King, which I'm sure they absolutely, 100% would have done if it had been a black suspect, or a suspected Muslim bomber.
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,037
    My concern isn't about California being able to swing elections by itself. My concern is that the Electoral College helps keep us all handcuffed to the idea that our only two choices are Democrat or Republican when, in fact, both parties are part of the problem rather than the solution.

    I couldn't name every lone wolf--I missed other infamous ones like John Allen Muhammad, the D. C. Sniper (as well as his accomplice, Lee Boyd Malvo).
  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 975



    I am not talking about Christianity or Islam. If that's where your mind goes by seeing my post then I apologize that I could not make it clearer for you. If you think I was talking about religion in general then I think you should revisit my post and analyze it some more.

    Tyranny is Tyranny period.

    Hokay, I apologise for the misunderstanding then. Could you try to make it clearer in what way, shape or form the first battle of Vienna is reminiscent of 9/11? (And, for that matter, how "tyranny" is relevant, since both sides were headed by tyrannical imperial monarchies?)

    And how America's war to keep from paying tribute to (some of) the Barbary Pirates is related to fighting ISIL?

    The reason I assumed you were comparing these events in generalised Muslim vs Christian terms is because there were no other significant similarities between them that I can discern (which, indeed, was the thrust of my post). If you've got a different angle on it I'm not seeing, I'd like to hear what you're saying in your words.
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    @Ayiekie: I'm reasonably certain the only reason the Battle of Vienna came up is because it has religious significance in the Middle East. Bin Laden and al Qaeda attacked the World Trade Center on September 11 because it coincided with the anniversary of the Battle of Vienna. The Battle of Vienna wasn't historically very similar to the 9/11 attacks (no airplanes, for one thing); al Qaeda just picked that date for symbolic reasons.

    If an American launched an attack someplace on July 4, you wouldn't think it was much like the signing of the Declaration of Independence--a written letter is nothing like an act of violence--but you'd recognize that they chose the date for a reason.

    The link is strictly symbolic.
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  • Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
    Shandyr said:

    As much as I dislike and disagree with the AfD they are more or less the only party that openly admits that refugees are not a gift from Heaven to Germany. Of course they do exaggerate in the negative. But the German public media pictures a very, VERY positive picture about refugees.

    I'm not so sure that the media paints a particularly great picture about refugees, especially after the attacks last year. The sad thing is, no matter how you feel about the party or immigration, this is the type of thing that gives them a podium to speak from... and it's something that should never occur if people in charge were doing their jobs right.

    Wherever you are in Germany (or anywhere, really) this year during the festive season... be safe.
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  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    I didn't think the Holy Roman Em-- Germany is that religious a country... is it?
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    None of us is ever going to live in a world where it is possible to prevent someone who is bent on doing it from driving into a crowd of people. It's a disturbing trend, though not an unsurprising one. Not familiar with German politics, though I'd guess this is bad news for Merkel.
  • MathsorcererMathsorcerer Member Posts: 3,037
    Speaking of Michigan Governor Snyder, Michigan's Attorney General has filed criminal charges against four officials who were directly responsible for the Flint Water Crisis, including Darnell Earley (the emergency manager who signed off of the water switch). It is unclear yet whether charges will ultimately be filed against Gov. Snyder, but I rather doubt it. Technically, the Flint Water crisis was not his fault because he didn't make any of those decisions; realistically, though, when your underling makes a horrible decision the blame falls upon you for choosing that underling in the first place.

    Turkish police have arrested the entire *family* of the off-duty police officer who assassinated Russian Ambassador Andrey Karlov. They even arrested the owner of an apartment where the shooter *used* to live. What the--? Erdogan's government has been becoming much more aggressive over the past couple of years. Turkish authorities are trying to link the shooter to Fethullah Gulen, an exiled Turkish cleric currently living in the United States despite the shooter's own claims of being motivated by the situation in Syria (at least, that is what he claimed before he was, himself, killed by security forces on site).
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