I think it's a similar stutation as with the proposed movie. Rather than selling the licence for 5th edition, they are giving it away and begging people to use it, in an attempt to repair the damage done to the D&D brand by the 4th edition debacle.
They should never have made Garrick managing director.
Also not translating the 5th edition books is pretty bad imo.
So I played the game for an hour and my initial reaction is I enjoyed it. Playing as Piro Faeren of whom is normally a gnome bard but now is a halfling arcane trickster. I chose the entertainer background that gives her a health regen aura.
I desperately hope with expansions or dpc that can add every 5e class, archetype, and race. This game has potential I think.
@Vallmyr - please keep us updated on your review of the game. At present, I am heavily leaning towards not buying it. Reviewers saying things like "I hope that expansions will add content" don't give me a warm-fuzzy. But who knows?
I have no problem with 'Diabloesque' games and even have spend many hours with the 'Dark Alliance' games. I was just personally hoping for something a little more Neverwinter Nights 3 and a little less 'Skirmish style' MMO type game.
I made a mistake at character creation so going to re-do my character today XD Still going with the psuedo-bard build, though.
I forgot in 5e that dex affects attack and damage with finesse weapons as opposed to 3e that uses finesse for attack but strength for damage. Going to drop my strength to 8 because RP-wise Piro is super weak + it doesn't do anything for her offensively.
Edit: So far my impression is this character generation is "ok" unlike the glorious options we had in NWN and NWN2 or even Baldur's Gate. The actual game does feel very D&D-y especially if you make it auto-pause every round.
I think it's a similar stutation as with the proposed movie. Rather than selling the licence for 5th edition, they are giving it away and begging people to use it, in an attempt to repair the damage done to the D&D brand by the 4th edition debacle.
They should never have made Garrick managing director.
Also not translating the 5th edition books is pretty bad imo.
Not worth it with the poor shape the brand is in. (Cost of translation + printing of localised versions + cost of marketing) > revenue additional sales.
I'm in the UK (where we speak English) and 5th edition is very difficult to find and has no marketing.
No sorcerers, no warlocks, no monks. In that case, they can sod off.
Also no Dragonborns or Tieflings.
I can tolerate that if the story and narration is quite good with athmosphere of epic fantasy. Also, additional classes could be written in future DLC if devs would like it.
I've enjoyed the story from what little I've played of it (maybe the first two hours).
The other thing that I would most certainly like to see (on top of anything else I've written) is an easier method of testing out your modules. As it stands now there isn't any kind of "preview" option that you can use when you are creating a given map. So you end up having to save your module and then go into the player section of the game and launch it from there (which also has the problem of it meaning that you have to test your module from its start). I'm not certain if saved games will incorporate changes made to the module they are using. But even then it seems like this aspect of module creation needs work.
I've been playing SCL quite a bit and I really like it. If one goes into the game with expectations of it being exactly like tabletop, then yes they're going to be disappointed. But if you're looking for a simple, fun D&D experience (and for a mere $40), then SCL works just fine.
Re. class and race limitations, I think it is entirely reasonable that they didn't include everything right away because they're a small company trying to do something very big. They have said, and I accept their word, that in time they will expand to cover all the typical D&D classes and races. Same thing for available monsters and other tiles in the DM mode. Once they get the base game working right, it would be relatively easy to add in more of all things.
As I've been expanding my module more its become increasingly clear how limiting the lack of custom scripting is on the game. Even doing something as simple as having a neutral character (whom you can talk to) turn hostile isn't possible. Without this the options you have available for encounters is extremely limited.
Well if anyone does every decides to buy the game the module I created is called "Ahazu Trilogy: Murder at the Gate" (and its available for download).
Unfortunately, trying it out now just showed me that its still got a bunch of kinks to work out (maps were not showing when they should be showing, quests weren't updating properly, that kind of thing). So I have actually "unshared" it for the time being. But at least people will now know about it
I've uploaded it again to their servers. I can't guarantee its bug free, which in large part has to do with the lack of being able to preview maps, but if anyone is interested it is there. I do plan on adding more side quests and other things. But the main path is done at this point I think (apart from bug fixes). At the moment it stands at 14 different areas on the world map (including at least one underdark location) and 14 different quests. Apologies in advance if (in the unlikely event anyone plays it) you get to the final quest and have an annoying amount of clicking to do to read text. The word limit in this game is pretty annoying if you are trying to write a series of journal entries.
I'm glad I stopped expecting a next-gen BG a long time ago. Otherwise I would be very disappointed with this game. I may try it out in the future, but I'm not there yet.
I very much understand their choice of making SCL easily approachable because honestly, there just aren't that many hardcore BG/NWN-fans out there. Even 10 k people is very small number in the current gaming industry. So just making a mantlebearer for the old classics is not enough. They are a company, and they need to make a living out of their product. So they NEED to be able to attract new players as well.
Unfortunately, I think they still went in the wrong direction. Over-emphasizing the multiplayer is not a smart choice since they are directly going against massive MMO's like WoW and GW2, which are frankly better and more immersive. They would have fared much better if they had developed the toolset further and made the engine less limiting. That would have distinguished them from MMO's, and the party mechanics would have made it different from action RPG's such as Witcher or Assassin's Creed.
The only big cards they are holding are the DM-mode and the D&D franchise. I hope those are enough, and this game keeps developing. Until then, I'm not holding my breath in excitement.
I unfortunately haven't been able to play the game at all since last time @_@ Life has been super hard/busy as of late. I've read TONS of negative reviews and comments over on the SCL forums about how limited the module creating is. I've heard also lesser comments about how limited character creation is and how there is too much magic gear in the game as opposed to how 5e makes it sparse. Also apparently bounded accuracy is gone for stats.
/shrugs.
I'm still looking forward to playing the game, though! n_n Still sad no Necromancer for the Player Character QQ Oh well.
Unsure, I imagine something will be done though with such a large portion of the community saying stuff. Threads I see in particular are the following:
I wish they would allow module uploading to a website. There presently isn't much functionality when it comes to searching for a module within the game itself (you can't search based on category, difficulty ratings, or any other metric that could prove useful).
From the standpoint of a content creator its also frustrating because the only feedback you get (if you get any at all) is a review out of 5. Which is basically useless.
So ... the two of us that have had big expectations with regard to Sword Coast Legends, have finished the single-player game meanwhile ... we both had started at normal difficulty, then the other one restarted at hard (after discovering that wizards in the game suck big time) ... and we have been disappointed.
The game is much too limited in what you can do ... and especially in what you need to do. And it's too much like a cartoon ... almost as if it's made specifically for children.
From the positive side of things ... the music is good. I've had tears in my eyes the first time my heroes set up a special Adventurer's Camp ... sort of a safe haven where unused companions wait ... and I talked to every companion to learn about them a bit. I truly wish there had been more events like that ... It made a big difference compared with the silliness throughout the rest of the game.
I can understand the excitement when starting a new game and discovering things you like during the first 3-4 hours. Unfortunately, afterwards, you've seen everything the graphics engine can do. Back into the sewers. Next another cave. Then another mausoleum-style "maze". Ascent again into the city of Luskan. Back into the sewers, now the "abandoned" ones. If only the sewers were much more difficult and dangerous to explore ... with focus on environmental sounds. Oh no, they didn't take that chance! Not a single huge forest either. Only areas where you always can find your way. Or where running around becomes a pain, because you can't speed up movement.
The game failed to scare me. When I faced the first trolls, I didn't check my inventory for fire/acid weapons. Why would I? The wizard NPC can throw unlimited fire missiles. I didn't even check whether I needed to do that. I didn't bother opening the combat log ... which opens a chat input prompt and blocks other combat specific keys ... that confused me more than once and even made my reload a few times because I thought keyboard didn't work anymore.
The game failed completely at making me think about how to develop my heroes further. The enemies that confronted me never required me to learn something new. I didn't spend a minute thinking about what spells and skills to learn in advance, because reviewing the skills I could learn already and the locked skills I could learn at higher levels only, didn't open many paths. My thief never failed to open a lock ... and when he failed to disarm a trap, oh my gosh, you simply stabilize fallen heroes with a simple mouse click. Stabilizing is a feature that makes it possible to undo unconsciousness even in the heat of combat. No priest with special skills needed. Anyone can do it. What a joke! I never encountered an enemy caster that required me to dispell protections. I never was attacked by archers I could not overrun quickly. No threat at all.
Yeahhhhh Wizards are not D&D wizards. Imagine the standard mage from any MMO. They have Frost, Lightning, and Fire as three separate trees. . . Transmutation has Invisibility in it but not polymorph.
Like
Being a caster is not a great time in SCL which is why I'm playing a rogue focusing on the arcane trickster tree.
I went the cleric route for my character. Pretty sure that I went with a pretty safe god like Tyr (as I am lawful neutral) but I don't think your alignment even shows up when playing the campaign.
Since I haven't restarted yet, I was actually curious about the Cleric. Thinking of making a Cleric of Kelemvor at some point. How are the Cleric spells? Any cool "smiting undead" ones? I know the death domain isn't there (QQ) but I might go for the opposite approach and be an undead hunter.
Nothing special. Its basically a healing class with some damage and buff spells. But the damage spells in particular (to me anyways) didn't seem nearly as effective as the healing.
Ah I see. Also on your comment on the alignment thing, I've read multiple places on the SCL forums that alignment doesn't affect the game at all and doesn't appear on your char sheet. I think they need to overhaul the char sheet to actually show your total to hit bonus and all the math involved and such.
Face it ... much of the hype about the game is based on wishful thinking. And its marketing. Calling it Dungeons & Dragon is not enough. There must be references to Baldur's Gate, Icewind Dale, Neverwinter ... to attract that audience ... but without giving them what they love in those games.
Smiting undead? There is Turn Undead I and Turn Undead II which are not worthwhile since the undead in the game don't pose a threat ... and with at least one fighter type hero in your party you kill everthing around you as quickly as possible anyway.
There is the graveyard in Luskan. Yet it's only a very small, rather calm area with three small dungeons. Groups of ordinary skeletons, zombies and ghouls ... a few soft versions of vampires ... vampire thralls. Unable to drain you or cause you any problems. They only look different.
And creatures like a zombie ogre are quite typical for the game. Hit points bumped up into the hundreds to extend the duration of the fight in a very stupid way ... the game does that even for goblins and bug bears later on. No, it doesn't make it Heart of Fury style. It only takes longer to bring them down without any other reason. At higher levels it makes it sound like a battle in Star Wars.
There is no gradually increasing difficulty against all those undead either. No surprises like facing a "master" or needing special weapons, items or spells to be successful.
Action role-playing without the role-playing component ... you enter a residence ... as always, since you may need to explore every location on a map in order to discover something. You know it's "breaking in", but not doing that, you may miss something. The house is empty except for some chests. You may think twice before unlocking the chests, but so far throughout the game, you have been expected to take everything you could find. Even from chests just next to a merchant. Ouch. But this time, the house's owner returns. And you're forced to kill him or her, because the owner attacks the party, which is armed to the teeth and doesn't get any other option. And afterwards? You leave the house as if nothing has happened. The city guards haven't noticed. You don't even need to hide a dead body. No change of alignment. No consequences. Not immediately, not later.
About the clerics ... yes, they are capable healers until you notice the impressive number of potions you find. Healing, regeneration, attribute boosts .... everyone can access your pool of items even during combat and fetch potions to drink.
The level of enemies is boosted, making them more powerful and tougher to defeat. Pausing the game to queue up buffs, heals, and attacks should now be more common. Friendly Fire is also enabled at 50%, requiring the player to be cautious about where they cast spells that have an area of effect.
Based on that I thought it would be more of a challenge than the default "easy" ... however, this difficulty setting can't add what you cannot do in the game anyway.
It's not as if the last few character levels added all the shiny abilities or spells.
Action role-playing without the role-playing component ... you enter a residence ... as always, since you may need to explore every location on a map in order to discover something. You know it's "breaking in", but not doing that, you may miss something. The house is empty except for some chests. You may think twice before unlocking the chests, but so far throughout the game, you have been expected to take everything you could find. Even from chests just next to a merchant. Ouch. But this time, the house's owner returns. And you're forced to kill him or her, because the owner attacks the party, which is armed to the teeth and doesn't get any other option. And afterwards? You leave the house as if nothing has happened. The city guards haven't noticed. You don't even need to hide a dead body. No change of alignment. No consequences. Not immediately, not later.
Not to be a detractor or anything, but isn't this how BG plays things as well?
Comments
I desperately hope with expansions or dpc that can add every 5e class, archetype, and race. This game has potential I think.
I have no problem with 'Diabloesque' games and even have spend many hours with the 'Dark Alliance' games. I was just personally hoping for something a little more Neverwinter Nights 3 and a little less 'Skirmish style' MMO type game.
Still going with the psuedo-bard build, though.
I forgot in 5e that dex affects attack and damage with finesse weapons as opposed to 3e that uses finesse for attack but strength for damage. Going to drop my strength to 8 because RP-wise Piro is super weak + it doesn't do anything for her offensively.
Edit: So far my impression is this character generation is "ok" unlike the glorious options we had in NWN and NWN2 or even Baldur's Gate. The actual game does feel very D&D-y especially if you make it auto-pause every round.
I'm in the UK (where we speak English) and 5th edition is very difficult to find and has no marketing.
Also, additional classes could be written in future DLC if devs would like it.
The other thing that I would most certainly like to see (on top of anything else I've written) is an easier method of testing out your modules. As it stands now there isn't any kind of "preview" option that you can use when you are creating a given map. So you end up having to save your module and then go into the player section of the game and launch it from there (which also has the problem of it meaning that you have to test your module from its start). I'm not certain if saved games will incorporate changes made to the module they are using. But even then it seems like this aspect of module creation needs work.
Re. class and race limitations, I think it is entirely reasonable that they didn't include everything right away because they're a small company trying to do something very big. They have said, and I accept their word, that in time they will expand to cover all the typical D&D classes and races. Same thing for available monsters and other tiles in the DM mode. Once they get the base game working right, it would be relatively easy to add in more of all things.
I very much understand their choice of making SCL easily approachable because honestly, there just aren't that many hardcore BG/NWN-fans out there. Even 10 k people is very small number in the current gaming industry. So just making a mantlebearer for the old classics is not enough. They are a company, and they need to make a living out of their product. So they NEED to be able to attract new players as well.
Unfortunately, I think they still went in the wrong direction. Over-emphasizing the multiplayer is not a smart choice since they are directly going against massive MMO's like WoW and GW2, which are frankly better and more immersive. They would have fared much better if they had developed the toolset further and made the engine less limiting. That would have distinguished them from MMO's, and the party mechanics would have made it different from action RPG's such as Witcher or Assassin's Creed.
The only big cards they are holding are the DM-mode and the D&D franchise. I hope those are enough, and this game keeps developing. Until then, I'm not holding my breath in excitement.
Life has been super hard/busy as of late. I've read TONS of negative reviews and comments over on the SCL forums about how limited the module creating is. I've heard also lesser comments about how limited character creation is and how there is too much magic gear in the game as opposed to how 5e makes it sparse. Also apparently bounded accuracy is gone for stats.
/shrugs.
I'm still looking forward to playing the game, though! n_n
Still sad no Necromancer for the Player Character QQ
Oh well.
https://forums.swordcoast.com/index.php?/topic/7049-wishlist-player-characters/
https://forums.swordcoast.com/index.php?/topic/7048-wishlist-creatures/
https://forums.swordcoast.com/index.php?/topic/7039-wishlist-gameplay/
From the standpoint of a content creator its also frustrating because the only feedback you get (if you get any at all) is a review out of 5. Which is basically useless.
The game is much too limited in what you can do ... and especially in what you need to do. And it's too much like a cartoon ... almost as if it's made specifically for children.
From the positive side of things ... the music is good. I've had tears in my eyes the first time my heroes set up a special Adventurer's Camp ... sort of a safe haven where unused companions wait ... and I talked to every companion to learn about them a bit. I truly wish there had been more events like that ... It made a big difference compared with the silliness throughout the rest of the game.
I can understand the excitement when starting a new game and discovering things you like during the first 3-4 hours. Unfortunately, afterwards, you've seen everything the graphics engine can do. Back into the sewers. Next another cave. Then another mausoleum-style "maze". Ascent again into the city of Luskan. Back into the sewers, now the "abandoned" ones. If only the sewers were much more difficult and dangerous to explore ... with focus on environmental sounds. Oh no, they didn't take that chance! Not a single huge forest either. Only areas where you always can find your way. Or where running around
becomes a pain, because you can't speed up movement.
The game failed to scare me. When I faced the first trolls, I didn't check my inventory for fire/acid weapons. Why would I? The wizard NPC can throw unlimited fire missiles. I didn't even check whether I needed to do that. I didn't bother opening the combat log ... which opens a chat input prompt and blocks other combat specific keys ... that confused me more than once and even made my reload a few times because I thought keyboard didn't work anymore.
The game failed completely at making me think about how to develop my heroes further. The enemies that confronted me never required me to learn something new. I didn't spend a minute thinking about what spells and skills to learn in advance, because reviewing the skills I could learn already and the locked skills I could learn at higher levels only, didn't open many paths. My thief never failed to open a lock ... and when he failed to disarm a trap, oh my gosh, you simply stabilize fallen heroes with a simple mouse click. Stabilizing is a feature that makes it possible to undo unconsciousness even in the heat of combat. No priest with special skills needed. Anyone can do it. What a joke! I never encountered an enemy caster that required me to dispell protections. I never was attacked by archers I could not overrun quickly. No threat at all.
Wizards are not D&D wizards. Imagine the standard mage from any MMO. They have Frost, Lightning, and Fire as three separate trees. . . Transmutation has Invisibility in it but not polymorph.
Like
Being a caster is not a great time in SCL which is why I'm playing a rogue focusing on the arcane trickster tree.
Smiting undead? There is Turn Undead I and Turn Undead II which are not worthwhile since the undead in the game don't pose a threat ... and with at least one fighter type hero in your party you kill everthing around you as quickly as possible anyway.
There is the graveyard in Luskan. Yet it's only a very small, rather calm area with three small dungeons. Groups of ordinary skeletons, zombies and ghouls ... a few soft versions of vampires ... vampire thralls. Unable to drain you or cause you any problems. They only look different.
And creatures like a zombie ogre are quite typical for the game. Hit points bumped up into the hundreds to extend the duration of the fight in a very stupid way ... the game does that even for goblins and bug bears later on. No, it doesn't make it Heart of Fury style. It only takes longer to bring them down without any
other reason. At higher levels it makes it sound like a battle in Star Wars.
There is no gradually increasing difficulty against all those undead either. No surprises like facing a "master" or needing special weapons, items or spells to be successful.
Action role-playing without the role-playing component ... you enter a residence ... as always, since you may need to explore every location on a map in order to discover something. You know it's "breaking in", but not doing that, you may miss something. The house is empty except for some chests. You may think twice before unlocking the chests, but so far throughout the game, you have been expected to take everything you could find. Even from chests just next to a merchant. Ouch. But this time, the house's owner returns. And you're forced to kill him or her, because the owner attacks the party, which is armed to the teeth and doesn't get any other option. And afterwards? You leave the house as if nothing has happened. The city guards haven't noticed. You don't even need to hide a dead body. No change of alignment. No consequences. Not immediately, not later.
About the clerics ... yes, they are capable healers until you notice the impressive number of potions you find. Healing, regeneration, attribute boosts .... everyone can access your pool of items even during combat and fetch potions to drink.
But so far this games sounds pretty lackluster, too bad...
The only tiny manual that is available (19 pages with no maths, skill tables or details ... https://d5u5y8k2.ssl.hwcdn.net/sites/all/themes/swordcoastbase/images/playerGuide/SCL_Guide_condensed.pdf ) calls it "medium": Based on that I thought it would be more of a challenge than the default "easy" ... however, this difficulty setting can't add what you cannot do in the game anyway.
It's not as if the last few character levels added all the shiny abilities or spells.