Skip to content

Sword Coast Legends. Is this the spiritual successor to NWN?

191012141520

Comments

  • mlnevesemlnevese Member, Moderator Posts: 10,214
    I'll keep it in my wishlist and see how the development goes. If it does not change I won't bother to buy it.
  • AedanAedan Member, Translator (NDA) Posts: 8,550
    Sjerrie said:

    My eyes fell on this in the Google doc from a few pages back, and my heart sank.

    image

    What? I did not know that! It has no sense! WHY??? Why can't I play modules on singleplayer? They should change this behavior!
  • SapphireIce101SapphireIce101 Member Posts: 866
    Well, the easiest way to play modules alone in SCL is to download the module you want to play, create a game, and set it to private. I can't really solve the fill up the party with AI controlled NPCs problem though.

    Also, playing story mode works the same way as the above. You literally have to set it to private if you want it to be "singleplayer".
  • VallmyrVallmyr Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 2,459
    Wellllll
    I bought it
    Because I can refund it with steam refund if I don't enjoy it in the first two hours.

    I'm messing with character creation in the "Head Start Access" and I've realized I have no idea what to make.
    I can deal with playing as a standard Elf as opposed to a Drow.

    But for classes.
    No Necromancer
    No Bard

    What do.
    I know an NPC gets animate dead but It doesn't look like it's available for players. Maybe I'll play a Cleric of Bhaal or something and just RP the Necromancy.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    edited October 2015
    Sjerrie said:

    My eyes fell on this in the Google doc from a few pages back, and my heart sank.

    image

    Dealbreaker for me. Sure, I have friends, but only a few are interested in playing RPGs. And let's not speak of problems like matching schedules or "other interests".

    I've actually checked the game and the document is incorrect (and in fairness I did say to take everything in it with a grain of salt). You can play modules with just you and 3 controlled AI NPCs (though modules marked "Needs DM" probably won't let you play them this way).

    To get them all you need to do is to create a "solo" game then then click on the empty portraits on the left hand of your screen and select the NPC's you want.
    Post edited by elminster on
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    edited October 2015
    Does that mean SCL also allows "classic" solo runs without AI controlled NPC's in community created modules? I ask because I honestly have no interest in creating my own party, or playing with others via multiplayer. If the game let's me experience fully immersive singleplayer playthroughs, I may give SCL a chance after all in the future.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    edited October 2015
    Provided that the modules don't have the "Needs DM" flag then it should work. However, since enemies scale with level you are probably going to die quite a bit if you don't have other party members.
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    Hrm, dying at every encounter or so now is really not what I would call immersive. Much less something enjoyable in my case. Sounds like module creators need much more modding tools in order to create singleplayer friendly modules then. For now, I will hold off buying the game and wait for its modding community to take on a sufficient developed shape. Perhaps in a year or two SCL will suit my needs more.
  • VallmyrVallmyr Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 2,459
    edited October 2015
    I'm going to be trying out the game just now. Decided I'd make a cute halfling cleric girl because no gnomes.

    Edit: Also saw the Arcane Trickster line in the rogue talent-things. May also try that.

    Edit the second: OH CRAP
    I CAN PICK KELEMVOR AS A DEITY!
    I could RP as a Doomguide of Kelemvor.
    But I could also play a cute halfling arcane trickster.
    While there might not be as many actual class options or paths as other D&D CRPGs but the RP value is still there and that is my primary concern with an RPG.
    Post edited by Vallmyr on
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    edited October 2015

    Hrm, dying at every encounter or so now is really not what I would call immersive. Much less something enjoyable in my case. Sounds like module creators need much more modding tools in order to create singleplayer friendly modules then. For now, I will hold off buying the game and wait for its modding community to take on a sufficient developed shape. Perhaps in a year or two SCL will suit my needs more.

    Besides a general difficulty slider there are tools to make enemies weaker (you can "demote" them so I guess they have less health/worse attributes and other stats). But to be honest its unlikely people are going to go that route. There is an option for creators to allow people to edit their modules so I suppose its possible that you (or someone else interested in playing solo) might be able to edit someone's module that you can reduce the strength of enemies on.
    Post edited by elminster on
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    Sounds like it's not all bad :)
  • iKrivetkoiKrivetko Member Posts: 934
    So, what races, classes and archetypes are available?
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    Races: Humans, Half-Elf, Elves, Dwarves, and Halflings. No Gnomes or Half-Orcs (yet).

    Classes: Fighter, Paladin, Ranger, Cleric, Rogue, Mage
  • iKrivetkoiKrivetko Member Posts: 934
    No sorcerers, no warlocks, no monks. In that case, they can sod off.
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,724
    I suggest to check this opinion https://www.reddit.com/r/baldursgate/comments/3pajkd/in_case_anybody_was_thinking_of_getting_sword/

    Although it's hard for everybody to agree with this player's thoughts (in the PoE part, for example), this opinion is still useful for us who are trying to decide whether to try SCL or not, because the post has not only views but some actual facts:

    "< ... >you decided to make half of the Wizards spells simply "evocation" divided into 3 skill trees? No polymorph, no animate undead (apparently there's an npc that has necromancy?? Even if we unlock it for our character, why don't we have it from the start??), no conjure elementals, < ... > no fire shield, no grease, no mirror image, no hold person < ... >"
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    I
    mlnevese said:

    bengoshi said:

    I suggest to check this opinion https://www.reddit.com/r/baldursgate/comments/3pajkd/in_case_anybody_was_thinking_of_getting_sword/

    Although it's hard for everybody to agree with this player's thoughts (in the PoE part, for example), this opinion is still useful for us who are trying to decide whether to try SCL or not, because the post has not only views but some actual facts:

    "< ... >you decided to make half of the Wizards spells simply "evocation" divided into 3 skill trees? No polymorph, no animate undead (apparently there's an npc that has necromancy?? Even if we unlock it for our character, why don't we have it from the start??), no conjure elementals, < ... > no fire shield, no grease, no mirror image, no hold person < ... >"

    Is it just me or all the limitations make it feel as a generic system game instead of D&D?
    I can think of generic systems (e.g D:OS, PoE) that have more DnD DNA.
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,724
    edited October 2015
    I remember when I watched the trailer for the very first time, I thought: "This looks like a Dragon Age: Origins game, with D&D spells' and monsters' names".

    It seems this very first impression is the right one.

    I think the fact that Dan Tudge has been the director of both Dragon Age: Origins and Sword Coast Legends has influenced such an impression a lot.
  • the_spyderthe_spyder Member Posts: 5,018
    bengoshi said:
    Although I haven't played this (and therefore take the salty review with a... grain of salt??), I can actually see a lot of this. If I had to guess, I'd think that a lot of what this reviewer sees as "missing" is because of an attempt to make it 'Console friendly'. I kind of suspected that this was going to be Diablo but in Forgotten Realms and this review actually strengthens that feel.

    Shame really, but this looks to be something that I won't be spending money on. Least wise this will fall way below the line until the discount rack (which may come sooner than we originally hoped).
  • brusbrus Member Posts: 944
    edited October 2015
    I would not trust some reddit post if the source is not verified. I would read official reviews.
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,724
    edited October 2015
    The official reviews are often far from telling the truth. It's up to the reader to decide whether the reviewer was fair or not in his opinions.

    So far, the game has been released today, and there's one review with a 80/100 score: http://www.hardcoregamer.com/2015/10/20/review-sword-coast-legends/172818/ but it doesn't cover the problems that have been discussed on the last pages of this thread.

    Meanwhile, if you look user reviews, the picture will be quite different: http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/sword-coast-legends/user-reviews and http://store.steampowered.com/app/325600/

    This is what Dan O'Leary said about their thoughts on players' expectations:

    "Consumer expectations of involvement have changed drastically, even during the last year of SCL's development. Where some folks have cited examples like Camelot Unchained as good models for community facing development, that is an asymmetric comparison. Consumers cannot reasonably expect the same degree of involvement in SCL (announced less than a year ago and releasing in 3 weeks) as they have in a game like CU, which will have been built almost entirely in the open for nearly 3 years (at its eventual release). Neither method is wrong and, as someone that has personally supported over 50 kickstarters, I would love to embrace even more open methods in the future. But for SCL it was not the right approach. Regardless, I am still proud of the efforts we have made to be open and available to the community given our constraints and approach. In less than one product development cycle n-Space has transformed from a work for hire development company that was contractually prohibited from talking about our games during development to where we are now. Knowing that it was unrealistic to shift the company methods, culture and expertise farther or faster we settled on this middle ground approach (not traditional box product development but also not Kickstarter). I understand that some are disappointed and want more. That doesn't mean that we have misled or misinformed.
    Expectations for this game, like all games, have varied dramatically from the beginning. There is a thread here that I often refer to, in which people share their expectations based on the coverage to date. Answers vary from a Diablo style ARPG to NWN with persistent worlds and servers to Dragon Age Origins in the Forgotten Realms. All of this based on the exact same messaging. I think this has more to do with people projecting their personal preferences than us providing confusing messaging. Even within this thread I read diametrically opposed views on what the game is, what it should be and what people want out of it. This is all fine and expected, but realize it cannot be everything to everyone. I'm happy to see that some of you already understand this and so, to an extent, I'm preaching to the choir."

    https://forums.swordcoast.com/index.php?/topic/5150-development-roadmap-should-be-announced-before-the-release/page-5#entry54099

    Edit: I recommend to read this review: http://www.pcworld.com/article/2994976/software-games/sword-coast-legends-review-impressions-dungeons-dragons-dungeon-masters.html
    Post edited by JuliusBorisov on
  • brusbrus Member Posts: 944
    Was this game marketed as D&D and ended more like action-RPG?
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    There are several reviews on Steam and they pretty much all seem to be telling the same story.
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    brus said:

    Was this game marketed as D&D and ended more like action-RPG?

    To be fair, there where plenty of clues that it would be a Diabolo clone. It's just that everyone hoped otherwise, because making a Diabalo clone would be a stupid waste of the licence.
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    I think it's a similar stutation as with the proposed movie. Rather than selling the licence for 5th edition, they are giving it away and begging people to use it, in an attempt to repair the damage done to the D&D brand by the 4th edition debacle.

    They should never have made Garrick managing director.
  • brusbrus Member Posts: 944
    Fardragon said:

    I think it's a similar stutation as with the proposed movie. Rather than selling the licence for 5th edition, they are giving it away and begging people to use it, in an attempt to repair the damage done to the D&D brand by the 4th edition debacle.

    Who officially writes D&D rules?
    Engine-wise they did quite the hard work. It's not easy to make 3d engine but I personally prefer POE 2d look.
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    edited October 2015
    brus said:

    Fardragon said:

    I think it's a similar stutation as with the proposed movie. Rather than selling the licence for 5th edition, they are giving it away and begging people to use it, in an attempt to repair the damage done to the D&D brand by the 4th edition debacle.

    Who officially writes D&D rules?
    Engine-wise they did quite the hard work. It's not easy to make 3d engine but I personally prefer POE 2d look.
    5th edition was written by committee and public playtest. I don't think it has any specifically credited writers.

    Wizards of the Coast is the publisher since 3rd edition, they are owned by Hasbro.

    1st and 2nd edition where published by TSR, and written by Gary Gygax, Dave Cook, and Frank Mentzer, amongst others.

    I think Monte Cook and Jonathan Tweet where the main writers on 3rd edition.
Sign In or Register to comment.