Thoughts on NPC's for the most FLEXIBLE party?
Nerva
Member Posts: 133
I'm planning on playing a single game of BG2EE and instead of going for the "what's the most POWERFUL party?" approach (I think my character will be plenty powerful anyway, and besides, above a certain amount of power the game just gets more boring), I am taking the approach of trying to build the most FLEXIBLE non-evil party. By that I mean:
1) A party that can use every non-evil item in the game, ignoring the thief's "use any item" HLA blanket exception. Obviously I probably won't actually use all of them, and I certainly won't use them all at the same time, but if I pick something up, I want someone in the party with the right class and proficiencies for using it. I might even broaden my goal to include evil items if it is possible to recruit and keep evil NPC's in the party next to my Chaotic Good protagonist.
2) A party with every kind of proficiency -- yes, even the less-powerful weapons and Single-Weapon Style.
3) A party that gets every HLA in the game.
4) A party that gets every spell in the game.
5) A party that has every thieving ability in the game.
6) I'm also kicking around the idea of having three divine casters and three arcane casters, so they can all cast party buffs.
My protagonist is a Cleric/Ranger, so he takes care of a lot of things on his own. He'll get the Ranger's Tracking HLA and other Warrior HLA's, the Cleric's spells, and the Cleric's HLA's. He'll max Two-Weapon Style, War Hammers, Flails, Slings, and probably a few other things.
I expect another key party member will be Jaheira, who adds the Druid stuff.
There's also Keldorn, who gets his holy sword, and he'll be a third divine caster to supplement the stronger two.
Haer’Dalis is a must, to have a Bard in the party and his HLA's and arcane spell ability.
Beyond that, it gets murkier. I need a high-level thief and a high-level wizard, but I'd also like a total of three arcane casters. So I am thinking one solution is Jan plus Sarevok dualed to (specialist?) Mage.
1) A party that can use every non-evil item in the game, ignoring the thief's "use any item" HLA blanket exception. Obviously I probably won't actually use all of them, and I certainly won't use them all at the same time, but if I pick something up, I want someone in the party with the right class and proficiencies for using it. I might even broaden my goal to include evil items if it is possible to recruit and keep evil NPC's in the party next to my Chaotic Good protagonist.
2) A party with every kind of proficiency -- yes, even the less-powerful weapons and Single-Weapon Style.
3) A party that gets every HLA in the game.
4) A party that gets every spell in the game.
5) A party that has every thieving ability in the game.
6) I'm also kicking around the idea of having three divine casters and three arcane casters, so they can all cast party buffs.
My protagonist is a Cleric/Ranger, so he takes care of a lot of things on his own. He'll get the Ranger's Tracking HLA and other Warrior HLA's, the Cleric's spells, and the Cleric's HLA's. He'll max Two-Weapon Style, War Hammers, Flails, Slings, and probably a few other things.
I expect another key party member will be Jaheira, who adds the Druid stuff.
There's also Keldorn, who gets his holy sword, and he'll be a third divine caster to supplement the stronger two.
Haer’Dalis is a must, to have a Bard in the party and his HLA's and arcane spell ability.
Beyond that, it gets murkier. I need a high-level thief and a high-level wizard, but I'd also like a total of three arcane casters. So I am thinking one solution is Jan plus Sarevok dualed to (specialist?) Mage.
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Edit: More seriously, you need a Dwarf to wield the Dwarven Thrower.
So, given that, I like Jaheira here, for weapon/armor use and druid stuff. I like Haer'Dalis, for generally being awesome and extremely flexible. I'd probably go with Jan, to double up on thief skills and a second mage. You lose out on high-level necromancy with him, but that's about it.
On the other hand, I don't think Keldorn's necessary. The ability to wield Carsomyr is awesome, but his Dispel and True Sight are made more-or-less redundant by Jaheira's Insect Plague and Jan's Detect Illusions. Instead, I'd probably make a Cavalier main character to tank, use Carsomyr, and provide some secondary priest spellcasting.
I'd also pick up Valygar for ranger abilities and someone who actually wants to use light armor. You could easily swap him for Minsc, but since your main character is gonna use two-handed swords anyway, and you've already got plenty of tanking, I think Valygar is the better choice overall. Aerie is then a good final choice to pump your final spellcasting and add a full cleric.
The end result is this:
MC (Cavalier)
Jaheira
Haer'Dalis
Valygar
Jan
Aerie
Arcane: all available, 3x casters
Divine: all available, 2x primary and 2x secondary
Weapon use: Should be able to cover just about everything
HLAs: You miss out on the Shadowdancer unique abilities, but other than that all bases are covered. Although mage HLAs will come very late.
Item Use: Very nearly everything that's not evil-restricted. You do miss the Scarlet Ninja-to, but that's pretty much it.
Thieving skills: With Jan, you'll eventually get everything.
I probably shouldn't have been so broad in saying "every" HLA and "every" item. I should have said I want access to all "categories" of HLA's -- Warrior, Bard, Thief, Wizard, Cleric, Druid -- and to all "types" of weapons -- two-handed swords, long swords, maces, slings, darts, heavy crossbows, etc. -- but it isn't critical that every single weapon (like Carsomyr) be usable.
The reason I wanted 3 arcane + 3 divine casters is so that everyone in the party could have some sort of party buff they could cast on the first round of combat while the enemy is at a distance. Strictly speaking they don't all have to be "casters"... just as long as they all have something to do that benefits the entire party that first round prior to the real combat starting. So Keldorn's special abilities would certainly count in the sense he can quickly use them to help the party (debuff enemies) at the start of combat -- and free up the other casters from having to memorize and cast True Sight and Dispel Magic. A non-caster thief MIGHT meet that criteria if setting traps is actually useful (I haven't played one to high enough level to get a feel for that), or if they had the PnP ability to read arcane and divine scrolls at 10th level.
This is also why I don't much care for cleric/mages after the experience of having Quayle in my BG1 party and discovering too late I should have kept Jaheira and Dynaheir -- I was able to go back for Jaheira but not Dynaheir. Sure, cleric/mages get a ton of spells, but they still can only cast them one at a time in combat -- I would rather spread the casting ability out more.
I'm still not sure Keldorn fulfills your desire for buffs, since his abilities are only really useful in a small (but important) number of fights. As such, I would consider swapping him out for one of a number of other characters. Valygar is useful as noted above, and has access to some nice buffs by virtue of being a Stalker, while Rasaad has some nice Sun Soul Monk abilities and is generally quite strong. However, you're actually lacking in your ability to use a lot of heavier melee weapons, so I might well go with Minsc.
Given that your main character is half cleric, and given your dislike of cleric/mages, I'd try and fill the last party slot with a pure mage. Neera is your best bet here, although Imoen or Nalia would do in a pinch.
MC (ranger/cleric)
Jaheira
Haer'Dalis
Keldorn/Valygar/Rasaad/Minsc
Jan
Neera/Imoen/Nalia
Jan HAS the same weapong skills but he alrdy has proficiency in crossbows which you will probably go with.
Longbows can be overlooked but Valygar or Minsc would have access to those from the start. Then you have 2 slingers and finally, Haer'Dalis, who you may want to keep as strictly melee/caster. Darts or a throwing dagger are a choice ofc.
Rasaad is a monk, so his weapon proficiencies are irrelevant but his class does bring fun stuff to the table.
I'd like to avoid all the EE characters -- I have far higher regard for Bioware's original game than Beamdog's "enhancements".
I am hoping I can find a way to use Sarevok in my party -- for roleplaying reasons, I'd like to have my half-brother in the party. But obviously I really don't need a single-class Fighter in the scheme I want to run, and the question becomes, does it makes sense to dual-class him? Apparently mage and thief are the candidates, and from what I've read the latter is more popular. If I can make him a Chaotic Good Fighter>Thief, I think there might be mods that let him use scrolls like the PnP rules? So then he could carry a bunch of buff scrolls, and get Use Any Item, greatly increasing the party's flexibility? I also like the idea of having both a mage-thief and a fighter-thief, each optimized for different thieving skills.
The other thing I'm wrestling with, besides just having a "flexible" party, is coming up with one that lends itself to a good formation and marching order. I'm thinking a two-column, three-row formation is best for keeping formation through narrow corridors, with my Cleric/Ranger in the #1 slot and Jaheira next to me in the front row. The ideal setup would be priests with the best AC in the front row, then archers in the second row (who are secondary spellcasters that can fight melee if necessary), and arcane casters in the third row. I'm disappointed Coran wasn't carried over into BG2, since he was a great archer, and there don't seem to be good archers in BG2. In theory Sarevok could fill that role, but his weapon proficiencies are in crossbows rather than longbows, and my recollection is the former are far inferior to the latter.
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As for your party....
Cleric/Ranger + Jaheira (first row)
Mazzy + Minsc (Mazzy has ***** shortbows and is a beast at range. Minsc can fight from the second row with a great sword, and has ** in longbows)
Sarevok + Jan (third row. Two mages. Jan also has crossbow *, which works with firetooth.)
Sarevok will eventually go into the second row with Minsc though. When he gets his fighter levels back, he'll have ***** in greatswords, along with stoneskin, mirror image, protection from magical weapons, etc...he'll be your best damage dealer hands down.
Here's my updated party:
FIRST ROW
Cleric/Ranger -- first buffing party and then charging strongest enemy, using 2-weapon style
Jaheira -- first buffing party, then firing sling once (prioritizing interrupting caster), then charging nearest enemy with sword-and-shield style
SECOND ROW
Keldorn, later replaced by Sarevok dual-classed to thief -- first buffing party (if possible), firing Heavy Crossbow once (prioritizing interrupting caster), then switching to Carsomyr and charging nearest enemy
Minsc, later replaced by Valygar -- first buffing party, then firing longbow at enemy casters, then enemy archers, and if enemy gets close, switching to spear (two-handed style)
THIRD ROW
Haer'Dalis -- first buffing party, then casting or throwing darts/daggers, and if enemy attacks him in melee, switching to shortsword or dagger (single-weapon style)
Nalia, later replaced by Imoen -- first buffing party, then casting, and if enemy gets close, run away, run away!
The nice thing about this arrangement is both of the second row NPC's have long-reach melee weapons, so if the party ends up fighting in close quarters, the first two rows can use melee attacks.
It does annoy me, though, that the game won't let me easily switch from two-weapon style to using a one-handed missile weapon. I'd like for my Cleric/Ranger to be able to switch between melee and a sling and for Haer'Dalis to switch between melee and a dart or throwing dagger.
Playing with a F/T not long ago I realized quite quickly that charname was no match vs Valy when it came to disable spellcasters since there is not weapon available to charname that is as good as Corthala's family blade.
Edit: Btw, it's almost too good and take some fun out of the game when you start to use it. So use it with caution.