Which Charname should I use in my iOS run of BG/BG2?

Vallmyr

So I just got BG:EE and BG2:EE for my iPhone and now am coming to the greatest decision, what charname to play. I usually play the "characters" Val'myr Zaur, a Drow Necromancer and Piro Faeren, of whom is usually a gnome bard (but no gnome Bards in an unmodded BG). Anyway, here are the characters I'd be interested in playing. If Val I'll romance Neera and if Female then I'll romance Anomen (and if not Anomen then Rasaad).

I mainly want to focus on party support with a dark magick theme.

Edit: I made an error, I thought Priests of Talos could be Chaotic Neutral (I've been playing too much IWD:EE, obviously XD) Change that to a Cleric of Helm since they can be CN.

JuliusBorisov

If you've read https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/40810/complete-pure-necromancer-solo-challenge-restricted-to-using-only-necromancy-spells#latest, then you know that a pure necromancer is very fun. A sorcerer usuing only necromancy spells can give a difference if compared to @Genryu 's attempts. Go for it!

FrdNwsm

Female character, then romance Hexxat and post the details here.

Yay, fanservice!

Skatan

Personally I just don't think it's fun to play a jester or skald as CHARNAME since singing is kinda boring and I tend to always make CHARNAME as mighty as possible.

Blade's are good but they are well represented in the game if you want one. Haerry is a decent char to have along. Jan is an amazing I/T as well, but playing a C/M would let you skip Aerie. Not that she is essential for a party, but still, Jan and Haerry are funnier NPC's IMHO.

Never played a SC cleric through the saga, so that would have been my second choice.

A sorc with only necro spells sounds intriguing but IMHO, but too much self-restriction tend to make me suffer from restartitis.

You're not me though, obviously, but still my vote goes to C/M based on the above.

FrdNwsm

Aerie is annoying, and her crummy con gives poor HP so she falls over dead a lot early on. Roll up your own; the party will be a lot better off.

deltago

Combine two of them together:

Go blade, but only learn Nercomancy spells.

Kamigoroshi

How about Ruaz Rym'lav: Half-Orc Swashbuckler?

Or a Nereaf Orip: Dwarven Cleric of Helm?

Vallmyr

deltago said:

Combine two of them together:

Go blade, but only learn Nercomancy spells.

I like this one.

Also, I love Aerie and so far she's my favorite romance in BG2, though I still need to do Anomen and the EE NPCs.

Vallmyr

I'm actually reeeaallly like the idea for the necro-only blade. I might get some essential spells like find familiar, mage armor, and shield, but then just go necromancy all the way.

My party will be planned as

BG:EE
Val'myr: CN Blade Bard
Imoen
Viconia
Rasaad
Alora
Neera

(Do Rasaad and Viconia fight?)

BG2:EE
Val
Yoshimo>Imoen
Viconia
Rasaad
Neera
Mazzy

If Rasaad and Viconia fight I'll change Rasaad out for Valygar.

Neera will cover my arcane necromancy needs and Viconia my divine necromancy needs.

I considered taking Baeloth so we can have a trio of Drow (I RP my PC as one) but I didn't know who to trade out.

Edit: I may take Dorn for his quest as I've heard you can get Dark Elven Chain that Bards can cast in. Can anyone confirm this? Actually brb I'll just google search. XD

Vallmyr

Welp, just rolled up the Bard and got a 90
Stats:
Strength - 18
Dexterity - 18
Constitution - 9
Intelligence - 18
Wisdom - 9
Charisma - 18

I actually dislike having such high stats but I'm not going to pass up a good roll. Like, on my third roll I got a 90. I usually go for an 87. I know I could drop Charisma to 15 and get the ring in BG2 but Val is SUPER dashing. Like the charming, heroic type. Hell, he's a Bard this time around so he'll be EXTRA overly-dramatic! XD

FrdNwsm

I passed up Dorn's quest in SoA since it totally cheeses off the Radiant Heart folks, and I wanted Keldorn and Anomen in my party later on, so I can't help you there. I believe you can get elven chain from the Planar Prison quest, however,

High charisma helps keep intra-party conflicts to a minimum; you should be OK there.

Nonnahswriter

That... That CON...

Otherwise, nice!

Vallmyr

Nonnahswriter said:

That... That CON...

Otherwise, nice!

RP wise his stats should be like

Strength: 9
Dexterity: 14
Constitution: 9
Intelligence: 19
Wisdom: 8
Charisma: 16

Unfortunately I rolled super high

Grum

Con is fine, you get a belt that sets it to 18 for 12 hours. Between that and stoneskin he will be just fine.

Yah...I can't help but power game sometimes...

Skatan

Vallmyr said:

Edit: I may take Dorn for his quest as I've heard you can get Dark Elven Chain that Bards can cast in. Can anyone confirm this? Actually brb I'll just google search. XD

BG1: Yes, but you only get it after getting access to Baldur's gate, so you will have to use AC spells for a good portion of the game or just "borrow" a certain mithril mail from a certain character (no access to spells using that one though). A certain scimitar from the same character adds AC as well, as you probably already know.

BG2: Trademeet has a elven chain mail if you're a douche and play out a certain quest in the non-good way. There's a better melodic chain mail (+3) in the Haer'dalis quest along with some other great gear for a bard, like the Kundane shortsword etc. With a bit of pulling and cheesing (AoE outside visibility range etc), the planar prison can be done fairly early, but I would advice against a straight up brawl directly after the starting dungeon. The githyanki and the efreeti in the pot-holes can be a pain for a low-level party though.

Edit: Going with Kundane and Belm nets you 5 APR with offensive spin. Pretty effective, but your THAC0 will be poor ofc.

Edit 2: Going purely necro means you don't get Tenser's. One thing to consider when creating your blade. Perhaps going army schythe (it's in both BG1 and 2, or Tuigan for BG2) is a better option for portions of the game.

abacus

Nerco-Only Blade sounds really cool... and relatively effective. You'll get the best armour spell, your Bard THAC0 will be better than a Mage's so all the Necro touch spells will be slightly more useable and you've got fast levelling to make the most of Skull Trap and Skelly Minions! Losing Tenser's will be a bit of a bind, but not the end of the world.

Also, low Con is the "other" way to make the Claw of Kazgaroth useable... people often mention that you should get your Rogues/Priests/Mages to Con18 in order to not get a HP penalty... but starting <15 has the same effect (as long as it can't drop to 7). You might miss those extra 2HP/level early on, but that just adds a bit of extra challenge!

Vallmyr

abacus said:

Nerco-Only Blade sounds really cool... and relatively effective. You'll get the best armour spell, your Bard THAC0 will be better than a Mage's so all the Necro touch spells will be slightly more useable and you've got fast levelling to make the most of Skull Trap and Skelly Minions! Losing Tenser's will be a bit of a bind, but not the end of the world.

Also, low Con is the "other" way to make the Claw of Kazgaroth useable... people often mention that you should get your Rogues/Priests/Mages to Con18 in order to not get a HP penalty... but starting <15 has the same effect (as long as it can't drop to 7). You might miss those extra 2HP/level early on, but that just adds a bit of extra challenge!</p>

Yeah, was thinking once I got the Con tome in BG1 I would go by and pick it up since 8 con has no negatives.

FrdNwsm

This thread makes me curious; does Offensive Spin work with missile weapons?

Vallmyr

Well, I google searched and another member of our forums has confirmed it. Also this is what I imagine it to look like.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U02E2sjwlLM

Vallmyr

I just realized this will be the first chaotic evil character I will play. Val has a terrible moral compass and in the Hell Trials in BG2 he's going to totally shift from CN to CE if I RP his character correctly >_>

Also, how long will it take my Bard to hit 13 and get animate dead? I don't play BG2:EE often so I'm unsure about the level pacing in the game.

abacus

660,000 XP... nothing really. and you'll reach level 15 for the best version at 1,100,000

Edit: Compare to mages (1,875,000) and clerics (1,575,000).

Btw, great site for level progression,etc:

http://playithardcore.com/pihwiki/index.php/Baldur's_Gate:_Progression_Charts

Vallmyr

This information is relevant to my interests.
I need to go update my Analysis on Necromancy thread and update my information about Bards.

Vallmyr

So, update.
Currently level 5 and heading down to Nashkel after doing a bunch of side quests+clearing out the basalisks. Current party is Val, Imoen, Jaheira, Khalid, and Neera. I'm going to go grab Viconia soon and then drop Jaheira/Khalid at Nashkel to get Rasaad.

As for my Charname I LOOOOVEEEEE HIM. Ok.
So fighting enemy spell casters (like the bandit trio with the mage, hobgoblin, and bandit guy) that have fear spells, BAM BARD SONG! It's not a cool of a modal as Turn Undead but I'll have Viconia for that.

I love the versatility with my gear. I can either use two longswords with the offensive spin and wreck people hard, equip a buckler+chainmail and Defensive spin to become a Dwarvern Defender for a little bit, or go spellcasting mode wrecking people with Horror, Chill Touches, and healing with Larloch's minor drain. Once I decide to get Crossbow proficiency ( I like crossbows) I can use ranged attacks when I feel like it. I'm probably going to cry on missing out things like Finger of Death and such later on but hey, I have party members for that.

Also, Imoen and Alora won't have to worry about Pick Pocketing because Val will auto-get that as he levels.

Really I think this just might be the class that cures my re-rollitis. Why re-roll when my character can do anything I want them to do? XD

I mean sure, he can't stealth; but that's what invisibility will be for n_n

FrdNwsm

Haven't used a bard in BG, but I've got one in early SoA (blade kit). Looks pretty effective with the girdle of Hill Giant strength pumping up the attack.

I haven't gotten the spell yet, but dual wielding with Giant strength + Tenser's Transformation + Offensive Spin sounds pretty nasty.

abacus

A pip in katanas will be useful in BG2 for Dak'kon's Zerth Blade... it grants extra spell slots for levels 1-4 (a noted weakness of Bards)... these slots are perfect for your pre combat buffs, as you can swap weapons once they're cast.

Skatan

FrdNwsm said:

I haven't gotten the spell yet, but dual wielding with Giant strength + Tenser's Transformation + Offensive Spin sounds pretty nasty.

It is. Add stone skin, mirror image, blur etc etc and you're golden. IH > Off.spin though, but since six level slots are rare and you want tenser's, you'll have to save the IH for the hardest fight or have a buddy buffing your blade (unless you rest-spam ofc). Tenser's and bards quick level is really what makes the blade so good. You'll get such a massive boost to THAC0 you can even be better than a fighter, but at the cost of less APR and damage.

This is exaclty why I have such a hard time deciding which I like better, blades or T/M's. The blade don't get as many spell slots or thieving skills other than pickpocketing, but tenser's on a high level blade is very impressive. Gaah, the agony of choice!

abacus said:

A pip in katanas will be useful in BG2 for Dak'kon's Zerth Blade... it grants extra spell slots for levels 1-4 (a noted weakness of Bards)... these slots are perfect for your pre combat buffs, as you can swap weapons once they're cast.

You don't need a pip to just equip, memorize spells, cast spell and switch to a better weapon. Unless you plan to use CF I think you're better of using scimis and shorties with a pip in your choice of ranged and DW ofc.

Vallmyr

ohhhh thanks for all the tips and stuff. I've only played BG2 once and never beat ToB, just SoA. I don't really know anything about itemization other than that I want Val to eventually use the Blackrazor because it's SUPER cool and my Blackguard never got it because he was Lawful Evil and gave the Genie the sword.

abacus

Skatan said:

abacus said:

A pip in katanas will be useful in BG2 for Dak'kon's Zerth Blade... it grants extra spell slots for levels 1-4 (a noted weakness of Bards)... these slots are perfect for your pre combat buffs, as you can swap weapons once they're cast.

You don't need a pip to just equip, memorize spells, cast spell and switch to a better weapon. Unless you plan to use CF I think you're better of using scimis and shorties with a pip in your choice of ranged and DW ofc.

True.

My only concern then would be if I encounter a minor battle/skirmish/trash mob where I wanted to use my better weapon, but didn't necessarily want to splurge my spells. (Bards receive -3(?) THAC0 and Damage if not proficient.)

Depends on your play-style and how frequently you want to rest I suppose.

Vallmyr

I should probably plan out my proficiency points better

So far I have:
1. Longswords, Two Weapon Fighting
4. Two Weapon Fighting

Planned:
8. Two Weapon Fighting
12. Katana
16. Warhammers (maybe I'll use Crom Faeyr in my off hand? I've never used the weapon before).

20+ I have no idea what to do for proficiency XD

Skatan

Vallmyr said:

I should probably plan out my proficiency points better

So far I have:
1. Longswords, Two Weapon Fighting
4. Two Weapon Fighting

Planned:
8. Two Weapon Fighting
12. Katana
16. Warhammers (maybe I'll use Crom Faeyr in my off hand? I've never used the weapon before).

20+ I have no idea what to do for proficiency XD

Neither long swords nor katanas offer +APR weapons, only scimitars and short swords do. This means you will be stuck with 2 APR for dual weild and +1 from offensive spin/regular haste or +2 with improved haste, for a total of 3 or 4 APR. Adding a speed weapon in the off-hand (or using both main hand and off hand speed weapons) is what you need to be truly efficient in melee combat. This of course is dependent on if you really want to be able to dish out melee damage or if your weapons are mainly there for the occasional defensive attacks if engaged in melee.

Belm and Scarlet (after use any items, normally restricted to monks), are both within scimitar/waki/ninjato proficeny and Kundane is a short sword. Both Belm and Kundade (both pretty "low" +2 weapons though) are very easy to get after Irenicus dungeon. Scarlet is a late-game addition after reaching HLA's. Therefore these two proficines are arguable the best for a non-fighter type class such as blades, swashbucklers etc, who won't get +APR on level ups.

There are many good long swords and a few good katanas you can use with your current setup, but you'll be lacking APR. Since you won't be using Tenser's due to you playing a "necro blade", perhaps focusing on melee combat isn't really your first priority anyways.

This will sound like such a cliché, but as long as you are enjoying your character, don't bother too much on creating "the one CHARNAME to rule them all", meaning power-gaming in absurdum. 4 APR is still enough to make it through most fights and still be a good addition to the party, but you won't outclass your more fighter-oriented NPC's. If I can give one last advice it would be to skip katanas and go for scimis instead for Belm/scarlet in the long run.

Regarding blackrazor I don't know if the haste from the special ability replaces your offensive spin or is wasted if you are already using offensive spin(OS). Since OS adds damage this means that OS is better than regular haste and if you are using OS you wouldn't want a haste spell affecting your charname. Depending on your number of attacks per round, OS can even be better than IH, but someone has to crunch the numbers to confirm that. Also, someone who has actually used blackrazor on a blade would have to confirm if haste replaces OS or if OS stays active and the haste is wasted, since I don't know (and since I'm at work now, I can't look it up either. Google for 3 minutes didn't give me the answer).

Cheers//Skat.

Skatan

abacus said:

True.

My only concern then would be if I encounter a minor battle/skirmish/trash mob where I wanted to use my better weapon, but didn't necessarily want to splurge my spells. (Bards receive -3(?) THAC0 and Damage if not proficient.)

Depends on your play-style and how frequently you want to rest I suppose.

True as well, it depends on playstyle. I very seldom use Dak'kon's since I hate that spell slots disappear on item change, so it doesn't fit my playstyle at all. However, if the main purpose is for spell slots only, then I would advice against wasting a pip on katanas since the blade get so few and need to pump DW. I'd rather spend a pip on a ranged weapon for army schythe/tuigans or throwing daggers for convinience.