I don't think the different style is that big of a deal. People seem to forget that BG2 already had the problem of clashing styles. In BG2, all the NPC portraits were done by a different artist than the BG1 portraits, but it was still possible to use the BG1 portraits for your main character.
Personally I think the new portraits are pretty cool.
You guys bring up good points. For example, I had no idea that this was actually Jason Manley. Let me clarify that I don't have a problem with the portraits quality-wise. I love the IWD portraits. It's not really a matter of liking or not for me though. I'd be overjoyed if this was for IWDEE, but it's not, it's not on the schedule yet. It just feels like everyone's doing their own thing without paying any homage to the old material, and that in the end you will no longer be able to distinguish what's Baldur's Gate-art and what's been found elsewhere. "Too many cooks spoil the broth", if you will.
As for your point, @Majoca, I am no artist and thus have no idea how hard it is to copy a style such as Mike's. But the difference between using already existing fan-made portraits, for example, and hiring a real artist to make content specifically for you and your project is so that you can know with a higher certainty that the standard is going to be closer to what you want, don't you think? I don't see how Jason's passion, or anyone else's, would matter in this case. It could be a factor if he works for free, which I doubt he does. You've got to be able to ask for a commission from a professional artist without loosing out on the result just because the artist doesn't happen to like what he's doing, if he gets paid to do his best.
And knowing what Jason is capable of, he should certainly be skilled enough to at least make a good attempt at copying the old style, if Beamdog wanted that from him. But seemingly, they didn't, letting him do things the way he normally does. If they wanted portraits resembling the original ones, they could probably have hired someone whose style would be closer to that of Mike Sass' to simply things, or to be more certain of what the result would be.
You've made me change my mind. I'm not upset at the artist, and I was wrong in being so. I'm upset at the ones who made the decision not to be consistent, as if making an overhaul of a classic game is not already playing with fire. This raises a small, yet serious warning flag for me - I wonder if you'll be able to notice the same lack of consistency elsewhere, the new dialogue, the UI, the graphics.. it's unlikely, of course, but I'm no longer totally convinced.
I maintain that they hired Jason Manley because of the higher quality of the IWD portraits. Could they have gotten Mike Sass to do the same photoshop of photographs that we saw in BG1? Maybe. Maybe they tried and he wasn't available, or was asking for too much money.
Or maybe the other portrait pack is the work of Mike Sass. We really have no way of knowing what went into the decision.
We still have no idea what the other portrait pack will look like. If it looks like more of Manley's work, that will be a problem; but if it's in the same vein as Baldur's Gate or even Baldur's Gate 2, then the Manley artwork is just a bonus.
In any case, I would try not to be upset with Overhaul for commissioning some really great portraits, just because they're not in the style you would have chosen. There's a pretty big difference between the style in BG1 and in BG2 as well; it would be quite a feat to pull off something that uses the style from both, and for myself I'd rather see something good than something accurate.
I completely understand what you are saying and I agree with what you are getting at. I do see the inconsistency with the artwork but for me it isnt much of a problem. But it all depends on how you see this project. I dont see it being about the original, as its not trying to be the original, its trying to be enhanced.
Beamdog is refreshing, fixing and playing with baldurs gate to revitalise this game to new people and the old you have to admit the new UI suites the Ipad haha. Personally I feel great about stepping into this game because it will be slightly new, play differently but ultimatley still hold the values of the original. Yes you probably will see the difference with the new areas but what I am getting at is this is more than just the original game.
I do think some people will dislike this enhanced edition and some people will love it, and some people will be slapping there cheeks trying to understand why they didnt pick this up in 1998 but most things in life are like that.
If you remember the original was full of bugs, inconsistencies with spells and text and some classes were bad others were better and lets face it wasnt perfect how many people actually use some of the spells like shocking grasp, some things were just like filler. Then came the modders and such and we had to spend a decent time setting up our games to how we like it and all your friends would have to do the same to get it running together on gameranger or over TCP and most of the phone line connection stuff is out dated now.
Now the game was great then but it can be difficult to play now, I have played it multiple times up to this day because I love it, but on my HD TV screen the game looked diabolical haha, the portraits didnt but the landscape not so much.
Anyway this enhanced edition is nostalgia, old style Isometric, refreshing, clean and... and Baldurs gate! I can assure you will like this game regardless of the choices of art, I am putting a little faith into this game but personally I just like the thought of new people getting into this game.
I think having several differing new portraits in a multitude of styles to choose from, is awesome. I personally have endeavored to match Mike Sass's stuff, but like Majoca has said, It can be quite frustrating to simulate another's artistic style and color choice. I think Manley adds a neat variety to the existing portraits set.
I think having several differing new portraits in a multitude of styles to choose from, is awesome. I personally have endeavored to match Mike Sass's stuff, but like Majoca has said, It can be quite frustrating to simulate another's artistic style and color choice. I think Manley adds a neat variety to the existing portraits set.
My incredible powers of deduction lead me to believe that @Boozilla is the other artist and is indeed trying to do portraits in the BG1 style
Whichever way you look at it you still have the choice of whether to use a new portrait or not. In some ways, provided that the portraits are not out of character, the more the merrier. I just wish that the enhanced game was available and I could just get on with it.
@Syntia13 Don't need proof, he's got a badge. That's like saying to a policeman "Prove you can arrest me, show me your cuffs!".
He'd make himself look really bad lying about it. :P
@Ward He indeed have the BG:EE Team badge but that doesn't mean he is the second Artist which is working with Nat, he may as well be Overhaul janitor, Hence we need a proof.
Of the 3 NPCs, I guess... But as a good human beings, we always want more
Any minute now boozilla will pull off the scooby doo mask to reveal himself as Mike Sass, and then admit its really really hard to mimic your own style from 15 years ago
I think Rasaad's portrait is quite a lot in keeping with the art style. The potrait given to us in the first page reminds me of Icewind Dale a lot more but whatever, it's all good.
"She" actually, My name is Madolin, but please, continue to think I am a giant rampaging space hamster that has a taste for skyscrapers. I have given it (the portraits) a shot, but I am not sure anything will come of it, since I am usually too busy working on other art assets. However, I am partial to Nat's portraits ( and that is not just because he is also my boss) I dig the Dorn one.
Also you don't get the BG:EE team badge unless you work for Beamdog, ....janitor really?
I think the portraits are particularly hard to do because even if you try to mimic Sass's style, it still won't exactly match up. That's why I will just reiterate myself and say the more portraits, the better.
You guys bring up good points. For example, I had no idea that this was actually Jason Manley. Let me clarify that I don't have a problem with the portraits quality-wise. I love the IWD portraits. It's not really a matter of liking or not for me though. I'd be overjoyed if this was for IWDEE, but it's not, it's not on the schedule yet. It just feels like everyone's doing their own thing without paying any homage to the old material, and that in the end you will no longer be able to distinguish what's Baldur's Gate-art and what's been found elsewhere. "Too many cooks spoil the broth", if you will.
As for your point, @Majoca, I am no artist and thus have no idea how hard it is to copy a style such as Mike's. But the difference between using already existing fan-made portraits, for example, and hiring a real artist to make content specifically for you and your project is so that you can know with a higher certainty that the standard is going to be closer to what you want, don't you think? I don't see how Jason's passion, or anyone else's, would matter in this case. It could be a factor if he works for free, which I doubt he does. You've got to be able to ask for a commission from a professional artist without loosing out on the result just because the artist doesn't happen to like what he's doing, if he gets paid to do his best.
And knowing what Jason is capable of, he should certainly be skilled enough to at least make a good attempt at copying the old style, if Beamdog wanted that from him. But seemingly, they didn't, letting him do things the way he normally does. If they wanted portraits resembling the original ones, they could probably have hired someone whose style would be closer to that of Mike Sass' to simply things, or to be more certain of what the result would be.
You've made me change my mind. I'm not upset at the artist, and I was wrong in being so. I'm upset at the ones who made the decision not to be consistent, as if making an overhaul of a classic game is not already playing with fire. This raises a small, yet serious warning flag for me - I wonder if you'll be able to notice the same lack of consistency elsewhere, the new dialogue, the UI, the graphics.. it's unlikely, of course, but I'm no longer totally convinced.
@Majoca - Having though on it even more, I realize that you can't really be upset about Beamdog either, for doing it this way.
If something doesn't work, it doesn't work. Obviously, if Mike's style can't be copied, why not go ahead and get Jason. He'll do a great job for sure, even if he has a style that, in my mind, is almost inseparable from IWD. Though, if IWDEE comes out eventually, and they don't get Jason to do the new portraits, Beamdog will have to put me in Spellhold before I go ape shit.
And when it comes to the other pack of portraits, I'm glad to know that @Boozilla tried, at least, to copy Sass' style. Looking at the NPC portraits, it's a mix of both BG1 and BG2. And that's as good as it gets. And now that we know the game's going to be delayed, perhaps the artists will be able to actually get some sleep between drawing pictures.
And yeah, considering your other points, BGEE will be totally awesome.
Comments
Personally I think the new portraits are pretty cool.
As for your point, @Majoca, I am no artist and thus have no idea how hard it is to copy a style such as Mike's. But the difference between using already existing fan-made portraits, for example, and hiring a real artist to make content specifically for you and your project is so that you can know with a higher certainty that the standard is going to be closer to what you want, don't you think? I don't see how Jason's passion, or anyone else's, would matter in this case. It could be a factor if he works for free, which I doubt he does. You've got to be able to ask for a commission from a professional artist without loosing out on the result just because the artist doesn't happen to like what he's doing, if he gets paid to do his best.
And knowing what Jason is capable of, he should certainly be skilled enough to at least make a good attempt at copying the old style, if Beamdog wanted that from him. But seemingly, they didn't, letting him do things the way he normally does. If they wanted portraits resembling the original ones, they could probably have hired someone whose style would be closer to that of Mike Sass' to simply things, or to be more certain of what the result would be.
You've made me change my mind. I'm not upset at the artist, and I was wrong in being so. I'm upset at the ones who made the decision not to be consistent, as if making an overhaul of a classic game is not already playing with fire. This raises a small, yet serious warning flag for me - I wonder if you'll be able to notice the same lack of consistency elsewhere, the new dialogue, the UI, the graphics.. it's unlikely, of course, but I'm no longer totally convinced.
We'll simply see once the game gets released.
Or maybe the other portrait pack is the work of Mike Sass. We really have no way of knowing what went into the decision.
We still have no idea what the other portrait pack will look like. If it looks like more of Manley's work, that will be a problem; but if it's in the same vein as Baldur's Gate or even Baldur's Gate 2, then the Manley artwork is just a bonus.
In any case, I would try not to be upset with Overhaul for commissioning some really great portraits, just because they're not in the style you would have chosen. There's a pretty big difference between the style in BG1 and in BG2 as well; it would be quite a feat to pull off something that uses the style from both, and for myself I'd rather see something good than something accurate.
I completely understand what you are saying and I agree with what you are getting at. I do see the inconsistency with the artwork but for me it isnt much of a problem. But it all depends on how you see this project. I dont see it being about the original, as its not trying to be the original, its trying to be enhanced.
Beamdog is refreshing, fixing and playing with baldurs gate to revitalise this game to new people and the old you have to admit the new UI suites the Ipad haha. Personally I feel great about stepping into this game because it will be slightly new, play differently but ultimatley still hold the values of the original. Yes you probably will see the difference with the new areas but what I am getting at is this is more than just the original game.
I do think some people will dislike this enhanced edition and some people will love it, and some people will be slapping there cheeks trying to understand why they didnt pick this up in 1998 but most things in life are like that.
If you remember the original was full of bugs, inconsistencies with spells and text and some classes were bad others were better and lets face it wasnt perfect how many people actually use some of the spells like shocking grasp, some things were just like filler. Then came the modders and such and we had to spend a decent time setting up our games to how we like it and all your friends would have to do the same to get it running together on gameranger or over TCP and most of the phone line connection stuff is out dated now.
Now the game was great then but it can be difficult to play now, I have played it multiple times up to this day because I love it, but on my HD TV screen the game looked diabolical haha, the portraits didnt but the landscape not so much.
Anyway this enhanced edition is nostalgia, old style Isometric, refreshing, clean and... and Baldurs gate! I can assure you will like this game regardless of the choices of art, I am putting a little faith into this game but personally I just like the thought of new people getting into this game.
I think Manley adds a neat variety to the existing portraits set.
He'd make himself look really bad lying about it. :P
He indeed have the BG:EE Team badge but that doesn't mean he is the second Artist which is working with Nat, he may as well be Overhaul janitor, Hence we need a proof.
P.S
Why the blue??
P.S.S
J/k
As I said if he was lying he'd make himself look really poor, he's got no reason to lie. For all we know Beamdog is just a front for EA.
You never know.
Boozilla, gimme your lunch monies, or your portraits right now.
Of the 3 NPCs, I guess... But as a good human beings, we always want more
I have given it (the portraits) a shot, but I am not sure anything will come of it, since I am usually too busy working on other art assets. However, I am partial to Nat's portraits ( and that is not just because he is also my boss) I dig the Dorn one.
Also you don't get the BG:EE team badge unless you work for Beamdog, ....janitor really?
I think the portraits are particularly hard to do because even if you try to mimic Sass's style, it still won't exactly match up. That's why I will just reiterate myself and say the more portraits, the better.
If something doesn't work, it doesn't work. Obviously, if Mike's style can't be copied, why not go ahead and get Jason. He'll do a great job for sure, even if he has a style that, in my mind, is almost inseparable from IWD. Though, if IWDEE comes out eventually, and they don't get Jason to do the new portraits, Beamdog will have to put me in Spellhold before I go ape shit.
And when it comes to the other pack of portraits, I'm glad to know that @Boozilla tried, at least, to copy Sass' style. Looking at the NPC portraits, it's a mix of both BG1 and BG2. And that's as good as it gets. And now that we know the game's going to be delayed, perhaps the artists will be able to actually get some sleep between drawing pictures.
And yeah, considering your other points, BGEE will be totally awesome.
I still want your portraits though. Gimmegimmegimme.
*I don't actually take people's lunch monies.