Sorry, I should have clarified. When I said average, I meant for the test I took. It gave everyone pretty high stats. (with a few lies, it gave me a 20 CHA >_>)
I took one of the harder tests (loads of math questions and non verbal reasoning) and I got somewhat lower scores:
STR 10 DEX 11 CON 9 INT 15 WIS 12 CHA 17
Again with the high Charisma, which is pretty nice I guess. If I were to grade myself, it'd probably be about the same as that but with Charisma at 14 or 15.
Strength: 10 I think if I worked out I'd have really awesome muscles, but I don't. I do nothing at all but rarely can't lift or carry something. I think that puts me a touch above average.
Dexterity: 12 I reckon I'm pretty good with the whole hand-eye coordination thing. I can throw a ball in the air and catch it without looking at my hand for example (most of the time...). I'm also quite good with my fingers thanks to lots of video games. So I think I sit in the above average category.
Constitution: 10 I don't like being knocked about, but I can handle it to a degree. I don't get ill very often as long as I'm careful not to fall into a junk-food spell, so I think I can really only get away with being about average.
Intelligence: 13 I know I'm intelligent. Not super smart but well above the average crop. I have years of school reports to back me up! I'm lazy though and never reach the potential that everyone always says I can achieve.
Wisdom: 9 I try to think things through all the time and make the right decisions... but experience has told me I don't get it right nearly as much as I'd like. I'm completely average here I think.
Charisma: 8 I'm not sweet talking life of the party guy. I think I'm quite a nice guy once I get to know someone. But initially I'm a bit of a cold fish. So I think it's only fair to mark myself a touch below average on charisma.
Str: 14 - I have worked in many physically demanding jobs and was scouted to play football at the collegiate level but I couldn't break any records
Dex: 8 - I'm more clumsy than the average person
Con: 8 - I get sick fairly often and have a slew of strange medical problems
Int: 15-16 if I gain 3 more levels - I like to think of myself as being intelligent, high IQ scores, college was very easy, post-graduate degree in the works
Wis: 8 - I'm prone to making very poor decisions
Cha: 12 I think I'm more liked than the average person, but not that much more.
STR 7 /I really am not strong at all... DEX 15 /Pretty good at sneaking around and picking simple locks (I do that IRL lol) CON 8 /Health problems drag this down INT 13 /Memorization sucks big time but once I do memorize it, it stays with me WIS 17 /Advice giver to my friends and family CHA 8 /I get into a lot of "interesting" and stupid verbal disagreements and am also outspoken or passive depending on the situation
wow the average attribute here is something like 14,we have no average people in here it seems!
just for the record: normal is all 10s
15 int as so many people here have chosen is like actively working on scientific research(18 is leading one) 15 wis for young is well...funny 15 cha is a great orator capable of keeping the attention of hundreds of people(18 is deeply affecting them) 15 str is an average proffesional wrestler(18 is like a heavy weight olympic weight lifter) 15 dex means you have acrobatic moves at your disposal(18 means you're a kung-fu master or something) 15 con means you have joined your countries special forces and found it comfortable(18 well that would remind me of some martial artists who strike wood and stone to toughen their bones)
in fact 13 is quite high compared to the normal 10,and 8 is not odd at all for instance everyone who is not excercising at least 4 times a week has physical attributes like: 8/9/10
so maybe some posts need to be edited for the sake of honesty?
ps: i'll give you mine just to be fair
str 12-resistance training at least 3 times per week (but i'm on the welter weight category) dex 14-competitive taekwondo courses at least 3 times per week,i can kick someone's head without trouble con 11-i've taken hits in sparring did ok int 11-well finished college and i'm studying international relationships at the university now,how dumb can i be? wis 8-i'm just 23... cha 9-sometimes i'm distant in social interactions
wow the average attribute here is something like 14,we have no average people in here it seems!
just for the record: normal is all 10s
so maybe some posts need to be edited for the sake of honesty?
ps: i'll give you mine just to be fair
str 12-resistance training at least 3 times per week (but i'm on the welter weight category) dex 14-competitive taekwondo courses at least 3 times per week,i can kick someone's head without trouble con 11-i've taken hits in sparring did ok int 11-well finished college and i'm studying international relationships at the university now,how dumb can i be? wis 8-i'm just 23... cha 9-sometimes i'm distant in social interactions
I said this before. Many took the test you can do online and also said so! thats one of the reasons the avg is high. But I've also seen alot of people with very realistic stats (if we can call it that even) I agree that 13-14 is very high and if you are higher than that you really exceed (I do believe I exceed the vast majority on one point) but also know my weakness
I am going to ask you something btw..
You say you are studying International Relationships, but should you not take pickpocket classes instead ? (tease intended)
and at the same time, some people are just amazing, i knew people who back in high school would have had at least 15s in all ability scores, except for maybe str ( depending on which edition we are talking about here) and usually those were the foreign exchange students, and then there could be people like me out there who always attempts to kick ass in everything they do, so i would say its completely plausible that people can have over 14 for all of their scores
And of course, let's not forget, that D&D stats can't represent reality in general.
Strength measuring for example must be the most off-measure i've seen.
If 18 strength represents what an olympic weightlifter lifts, then i'll have you informed that 80-85kg weight lifters lift up to 200-220 kilograms overhead, that is about 440-465 lbs. overhead lift. An insane amount for sure.
Of course, some D&D tests say that if you can bench 330lbs you have 18 strength, or 18/90 in 2nd edition. Well, then i guess i am Minsc or Sarevok, according to these tests.
So let's just have our fun with D&D stats, and not expect them to be 100% accurate :]
P.S. I have a friend in my martial arts school, that can lift 200kg overhead, he was a weight lifter and still lifts. That's 440 pounds.
I can't lift 440 pounds overhead, but i can tell you that when we lock hands to apply force, he loses.
Why?
Because lifting something, and smashing or hitting something need different muscle groups. And weight lifters have overly developped antagonist muscles, which are good for keeping the body safe from pressure of weight, but bad to apply straight force. For example, the overly developped bicep muscles are in hypertention, and block the fast movement of the tricep that is trying to throw a punch. Pulling and pushing your arm outward at the same time is impossible.
So i strongly disagree with D&D folks who believe that the strength for carrying capacity, is the same strength for hitting with your sword or hammer. It helps, but there are guys out there that smash walls with punches, and can't lift jack.
@Mornmagor - just FYI the "Press" strength listed in AD&D 2nd edition is not the bench press, which was adapted in later editions because more people were familiar with that, but instead it is the clean and press (overhead) so a 330 bench would not give you 18/ anything strength unless you can also overhead press 255+. The range up to 18/00 is based on the world record clean and press which was 507 at the time of print (and I believe still is because they dropped that lift from the Olympics) after 1972.
That actually makes better sense then. They still have clean and jerk in Olympics, so a ~18 str would be lifting that, aka 220 kilograms. About 470 lbs overhead.
But still, you need to be trained to lift, you don't just lift through strength, you need proper technique and specific muscle groups to support your body against the weight pressure.
And of course, you need specific bodyweight. Weight-lifters are separated in weight categories for a reason.
A fighter or a warrior, would never use the same muscle groups to hit, warriors and monks need to do slashing or thrusting movements, and antagonist muscles slow one another on striking, if they are both developped, the way they are for body-building or weight-lifting. The higher you lift, the slower your explosive movement potential, that is needed to strike efficiently.
A clean and jerk is much easier than a clean and press which is why that record is close to 600 lbs. I certainly agree the olympic lifts are highly technical and need to be trained specifically.
I don't agree with your statement that the higher you lift the slower you are. It is true that there is little correlation between bench press strength and punching power, but little correlation doesn't mean an inverse correlation otherwise it would be beneficial to be weak which obviously isn't the case.
Certainly the use of strength is not perfect and I agree there are many types and expressions of strength. The same could likely be said for any attribute, accuracy with a bow doesn't automatically mean one is good at dodging incoming attacks and is quick on their feet, etc. But it seems like a pretty good system to me for what it is intended to do. Do you have a suggestion for how to set it up so it is equally simple but it would work better and be more like real life?
Yeah my statement that "the slower you are" is not 100% correct. What i should say is : After a certain point where antagonist muscles overly develop, then you start to become slower.
Up to a point, weight lifting and strength training(without steroids), is beneficial.
And of course, no, i don't think i will come up with a better suggestion soon without overcomplicating things.
And it's not bad to carry around 10 suits of armor :] ( so you can always be fashionable depending on circumstance - VERY important and overlooked often )
I find this interesting how people see themselves and how they rank their attributes. You see people like to try or believe that they are more than what they are. It's a natural human thing to do. so whatever you think a stat would be lower it by one, and that would be more accurate because you are removing your bias of yourself.
Str - 10 - Average, I don't do much manual work, but I do walk a lot and keep my self healthy Dex - 10 - I don't practice at anything that requires reflexes Con - 13 - I never really get ill, I also have quite good endurance, if I trained I could have good potential Int - 12 - Considering 18, 17, 16 would be the smartest people on the planet, 15, 14 are gifted or have lived a long time to accumulate a lot of knowledge and intelligence, 13, clever and 12. doing well at uni, 11 doing well at college, 10 average
Wis - 11 - I ponder about things and made lots of great decisions, but wisdom comes with age. Cha - 14 - Something I can boast, being a photographer and salesman requires people skills. I love communicating with others.
I find this interesting how people see themselves and how they rank their attributes. You see people like to try or believe that they are more than what they are. It's a natural human thing to do. so whatever you think a stat would be lower it by one, and that would be more accurate because you are removing your bias of yourself.
Str - 10 - Average, I don't do much manual work, but I do walk a lot and keep my self healthy Dex - 10 - I don't practice at anything that requires reflexes Con - 13 - I never really get ill, I also have quite good endurance, if I trained I could have good potential Int - 12 - Considering 18, 17, 16 would be the smartest people on the planet, 15, 14 are gifted or have lived a long time to accumulate a lot of knowledge and intelligence, 13, clever and 12. doing well at uni, 11 doing well at college, 10 average
Wis - 11 - I ponder about things and made lots of great decisions, but wisdom comes with age. Cha - 14 - Something I can boast, being a photographer and salesman requires people skills. I love communicating with others.
Well even if I agree that people overestimate themselves. making 1 point lower still gets you criticized by some (Ie. I lowered my int - str - char - con when I made mine..
That being said. its pretty hard to define yourself with stats, people disagree on even the basic terms of stats ^^
10 is average person. I don't believe that we all are better than average. Where's humility and critical estimation? Gone for a holiday? Subjective reality, I'll take a stab at it.
Str: 14 (6'3 215lb, 450lb dead-lift, 12%bf, 3yrs. exp. Krav Maga) Dex: 16 (D1 Goalkeeper in my younger years = Reflexes, Agility, Speed) Con: 14 (Paleo diet/Exercise/Sex -> Tri-force of health) Int: 12 (M.E. here, Einstein being an 18. The more I Know, the less intelligent I know I am) Wis: 11 (27yrs old and still playing BG = (-2)) Cha: 7 (Shy, dark sense of humor, lost faith in humanity)
Str: 17 (The tests were poor) Dex: 17 (Hard to say) Con: 17 (Tests were poor) Int: 16/12 (I'm smarter then I think I am according to a process that fails to account for relativity/environment) Wis: 14 (I'm lacking in experience to be this wise) Cha: 11 (Yes, I repeat what people say in conversation, is that not appropriate?)
I'd think one's "Wisdom score" would determine the accuracy of one's estimations. This would imply a direct correlation between our levels of self-awareness and our capacity to accurately assess our abilities.
@antisthenes Is playing BG (or other PC games) an indication of a lower level of Wisdom? If you play it to your own detriment (e.g., avoiding one's responsibilities; using it as an escape from life, etc.), then I could see how it would be "unwise." But, if you can manage playing a few hours a week of BG (or metagaming BG on this forum) without it being a detriment to your life, I don't see how it's any more unwise than watching TV/films, reading a novel, watching YouTube videos, going to parties, and so on.
Wisdom is possibly the hardest stat to evaluate, I think there should definitely be caps in accordance with age. I know some people are wise beyond their years, but take into consideration how more developed your mental stats become with age.
I still feel that at 23 a wisdom score of 11 is possibly too generous regardless of what's happened in my past.
Str 15 college wrestling, martial artist, gymnastics bench 180% body weight etc Dex 14-15 see above. juggle, walk on hands, quick and agile con 14 see above hardly ever get sick and have done lots of conditioning int 14-15 this one is easy : tested iQ 145, 148,, 151.. score was always iQ/10 wis 14 applied mathematics major, see above cha 13-14 voted wrestling team captain ...twice, a+ public speaking class, high school debate team
Strength: 11 -I am plenty strong to get by, and can carry chairs and couches easily enough, but I'm no weight-lifter. So, respectable average.
Dexterity: 14 -I am distinctly quicker and more coordinated than most people I know. This includes stupid things like video games, as well as sword fighting. So, quite respectable.
Constitution: 12 -Very rarely sick, and I tend to heal from injuries quite well and rapidly. I'm no soldier or special ops member, though, so hardly as good as many.
Intelligence: 18 -I could give some reasons, but no one wants to read that crap. All I can say is, "thanks be to God," for this one.
Wisdom: 9 -I do know that I don't know much, and I'm only 20. I'm not a wise person, by any measure. That would be my grandpa- not me!
Charisma:4 -I'm about as introverted as you can get without having some sort of disability. However, the friends I have will be my friends for life, so at least I've that going for me!
(Edit: Typos don't really support that INT claim, do they? Oops!)
@masterdesbaxter i would say at the very least you would have 6 charisma, if you have friends with an "s" as in more than one friend, you had to have some sort of ability to gather them up, 4 charisma and you can barely define the idea that you even exist, there is no way to have more than 1 friend with 4 charisma, i wouldnt even be surprised if you had 8 or 9 even, because that 18 intelligence could be a synergy for your charisma, basically with 4 charisma you couldnt lead a thirsty human to water even if you put salt into their food and they had a glass of water beside them, so i say ye be a bit highter
I'm an actor/magician (yes - real-life professional magician) with wits, charm and intellect. Not the strong built type but I do work out at the gym 2 times a week so heer is my stats.
Comments
I took one of the harder tests (loads of math questions and non verbal reasoning) and I got somewhat lower scores:
STR 10
DEX 11
CON 9
INT 15
WIS 12
CHA 17
Again with the high Charisma, which is pretty nice I guess. If I were to grade myself, it'd probably be about the same as that but with Charisma at 14 or 15.
(I'm messing, + I would be worse than Garrick too lol)
I think if I worked out I'd have really awesome muscles, but I don't. I do nothing at all but rarely can't lift or carry something. I think that puts me a touch above average.
Dexterity: 12
I reckon I'm pretty good with the whole hand-eye coordination thing. I can throw a ball in the air and catch it without looking at my hand for example (most of the time...). I'm also quite good with my fingers thanks to lots of video games. So I think I sit in the above average category.
Constitution: 10
I don't like being knocked about, but I can handle it to a degree. I don't get ill very often as long as I'm careful not to fall into a junk-food spell, so I think I can really only get away with being about average.
Intelligence: 13
I know I'm intelligent. Not super smart but well above the average crop. I have years of school reports to back me up! I'm lazy though and never reach the potential that everyone always says I can achieve.
Wisdom: 9
I try to think things through all the time and make the right decisions... but experience has told me I don't get it right nearly as much as I'd like. I'm completely average here I think.
Charisma: 8
I'm not sweet talking life of the party guy. I think I'm quite a nice guy once I get to know someone. But initially I'm a bit of a cold fish. So I think it's only fair to mark myself a touch below average on charisma.
Str: 14 - I have worked in many physically demanding jobs and was scouted to play football at the collegiate level but I couldn't break any records
Dex: 8 - I'm more clumsy than the average person
Con: 8 - I get sick fairly often and have a slew of strange medical problems
Int: 15-16 if I gain 3 more levels - I like to think of myself as being intelligent, high IQ scores, college was very easy, post-graduate degree in the works
Wis: 8 - I'm prone to making very poor decisions
Cha: 12 I think I'm more liked than the average person, but not that much more.
DEX 15 /Pretty good at sneaking around and picking simple locks (I do that IRL lol)
CON 8 /Health problems drag this down
INT 13 /Memorization sucks big time but once I do memorize it, it stays with me
WIS 17 /Advice giver to my friends and family
CHA 8 /I get into a lot of "interesting" and stupid verbal disagreements and am also outspoken or passive depending on the situation
just for the record: normal is all 10s
15 int as so many people here have chosen is like actively working on scientific research(18 is leading one)
15 wis for young is well...funny
15 cha is a great orator capable of keeping the attention of hundreds of people(18 is deeply affecting them)
15 str is an average proffesional wrestler(18 is like a heavy weight olympic weight lifter)
15 dex means you have acrobatic moves at your disposal(18 means you're a kung-fu master or something)
15 con means you have joined your countries special forces and found it comfortable(18 well that would remind me of some martial artists who strike wood and stone to toughen their bones)
in fact 13 is quite high compared to the normal 10,and 8 is not odd at all
for instance everyone who is not excercising at least 4 times a week has physical attributes like: 8/9/10
so maybe some posts need to be edited for the sake of honesty?
ps: i'll give you mine just to be fair
str 12-resistance training at least 3 times per week (but i'm on the welter weight category)
dex 14-competitive taekwondo courses at least 3 times per week,i can kick someone's head without trouble
con 11-i've taken hits in sparring did ok
int 11-well finished college and i'm studying international relationships at the university now,how dumb can i be?
wis 8-i'm just 23...
cha 9-sometimes i'm distant in social interactions
I am going to ask you something btw..
You say you are studying International Relationships, but should you not take pickpocket classes instead ? (tease intended)
Strength measuring for example must be the most off-measure i've seen.
If 18 strength represents what an olympic weightlifter lifts, then i'll have you informed that 80-85kg weight lifters lift up to 200-220 kilograms overhead, that is about 440-465 lbs. overhead lift. An insane amount for sure.
Of course, some D&D tests say that if you can bench 330lbs you have 18 strength, or 18/90 in 2nd edition. Well, then i guess i am Minsc or Sarevok, according to these tests.
So let's just have our fun with D&D stats, and not expect them to be 100% accurate :]
P.S. I have a friend in my martial arts school, that can lift 200kg overhead, he was a weight lifter and still lifts. That's 440 pounds.
I can't lift 440 pounds overhead, but i can tell you that when we lock hands to apply force, he loses.
Why?
Because lifting something, and smashing or hitting something need different muscle groups. And weight lifters have overly developped antagonist muscles, which are good for keeping the body safe from pressure of weight, but bad to apply straight force. For example, the overly developped bicep muscles are in hypertention, and block the fast movement of the tricep that is trying to throw a punch. Pulling and pushing your arm outward at the same time is impossible.
So i strongly disagree with D&D folks who believe that the strength for carrying capacity, is the same strength for hitting with your sword or hammer. It helps, but there are guys out there that smash walls with punches, and can't lift jack.
Str - 13 (overestimation likely)
Dex - 15
Con - 15
Int - 18
Wis - 18
Cha - 15
Lawful good human 6th level wizard.
Thats a character I'd like to have in my party
But still, you need to be trained to lift, you don't just lift through strength, you need proper technique and specific muscle groups to support your body against the weight pressure.
And of course, you need specific bodyweight. Weight-lifters are separated in weight categories for a reason.
A fighter or a warrior, would never use the same muscle groups to hit, warriors and monks need to do slashing or thrusting movements, and antagonist muscles slow one another on striking, if they are both developped, the way they are for body-building or weight-lifting. The higher you lift, the slower your explosive movement potential, that is needed to strike efficiently.
I don't agree with your statement that the higher you lift the slower you are. It is true that there is little correlation between bench press strength and punching power, but little correlation doesn't mean an inverse correlation otherwise it would be beneficial to be weak which obviously isn't the case.
Certainly the use of strength is not perfect and I agree there are many types and expressions of strength. The same could likely be said for any attribute, accuracy with a bow doesn't automatically mean one is good at dodging incoming attacks and is quick on their feet, etc. But it seems like a pretty good system to me for what it is intended to do. Do you have a suggestion for how to set it up so it is equally simple but it would work better and be more like real life?
Up to a point, weight lifting and strength training(without steroids), is beneficial.
And of course, no, i don't think i will come up with a better suggestion soon without overcomplicating things.
And it's not bad to carry around 10 suits of armor :] ( so you can always be fashionable depending on circumstance - VERY important and overlooked often
Str - 10 - Average, I don't do much manual work, but I do walk a lot and keep my self healthy
Dex - 10 - I don't practice at anything that requires reflexes
Con - 13 - I never really get ill, I also have quite good endurance, if I trained I could have good potential
Int - 12 - Considering 18, 17, 16 would be the smartest people on the planet, 15, 14 are gifted or have lived a long time to accumulate a lot of knowledge and intelligence, 13, clever and 12. doing well at uni, 11 doing well at college, 10 average
Wis - 11 - I ponder about things and made lots of great decisions, but wisdom comes with age.
Cha - 14 - Something I can boast, being a photographer and salesman requires people skills. I love communicating with others.
That being said. its pretty hard to define yourself with stats, people disagree on even the basic terms of stats ^^
Subjective reality, I'll take a stab at it.
Str: 14 (6'3 215lb, 450lb dead-lift, 12%bf, 3yrs. exp. Krav Maga)
Dex: 16 (D1 Goalkeeper in my younger years = Reflexes, Agility, Speed)
Con: 14 (Paleo diet/Exercise/Sex -> Tri-force of health)
Int: 12 (M.E. here, Einstein being an 18. The more I Know, the less intelligent I know I am)
Wis: 11 (27yrs old and still playing BG = (-2))
Cha: 7 (Shy, dark sense of humor, lost faith in humanity)
Results from http://www.angelfire.com/dragon/terragf/back/xstattest.html
Str: 17 (The tests were poor)
Dex: 17 (Hard to say)
Con: 17 (Tests were poor)
Int: 16/12 (I'm smarter then I think I am according to a process that fails to account for relativity/environment)
Wis: 14 (I'm lacking in experience to be this wise)
Cha: 11 (Yes, I repeat what people say in conversation, is that not appropriate?)
@antisthenes Is playing BG (or other PC games) an indication of a lower level of Wisdom? If you play it to your own detriment (e.g., avoiding one's responsibilities; using it as an escape from life, etc.), then I could see how it would be "unwise." But, if you can manage playing a few hours a week of BG (or metagaming BG on this forum) without it being a detriment to your life, I don't see how it's any more unwise than watching TV/films, reading a novel, watching YouTube videos, going to parties, and so on.
This is actually pretty cool for seeing what your RL stats are!
I still feel that at 23 a wisdom score of 11 is possibly too generous regardless of what's happened in my past.
Dex 14-15 see above. juggle, walk on hands, quick and agile
con 14 see above hardly ever get sick and have done lots of conditioning
int 14-15 this one is easy : tested iQ 145, 148,, 151.. score was always iQ/10
wis 14 applied mathematics major, see above
cha 13-14 voted wrestling team captain ...twice, a+ public speaking class, high school debate team
Strength: 11
-I am plenty strong to get by, and can carry chairs and couches easily enough, but I'm no weight-lifter. So, respectable average.
Dexterity: 14
-I am distinctly quicker and more coordinated than most people I know. This includes stupid things like video games, as well as sword fighting. So, quite respectable.
Constitution: 12
-Very rarely sick, and I tend to heal from injuries quite well and rapidly. I'm no soldier or special ops member, though, so hardly as good as many.
Intelligence: 18
-I could give some reasons, but no one wants to read that crap. All I can say is, "thanks be to God," for this one.
Wisdom: 9
-I do know that I don't know much, and I'm only 20. I'm not a wise person, by any measure. That would be my grandpa- not me!
Charisma:4
-I'm about as introverted as you can get without having some sort of disability. However, the friends I have will be my friends for life, so at least I've that going for me!
(Edit: Typos don't really support that INT claim, do they? Oops!)
Not the strong built type but I do work out at the gym 2 times a week so heer is my stats.
Str 9
Dex 12
Con 11
Int 13
Wis 13
Cha 14