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User Ratings on Metacritic (*SPOILERS*)

13468935

Comments

  • XzarXzar Member Posts: 215
    joluv said:

    Xzar said:

    right-wing BG fans or liberal intelligentsia who doesnt play games.

    These are the only two groups.
    No, but as of now devs prefer to dismiss the very existence of first group.

    GodKaiserHell
  • ArchaosArchaos Member Posts: 1,421
    edited April 2016
    Joey said:


    No, but people have the right to be pissed at a very old series that is close to their hearts suddenly being injected with extremist politics

    Care to elaborate on where EXACTLY are the "extremist politics"?
    And by exactly I mean, the specific lines of characters that push a political agenda.

    If it boils down to: "Including trans/lesbian/bi/gay" characters, I can make a similar case for the original games.

    "Sarevok and Valygar are black. Can Bioware stop pushing their agenda on their RPGs?"

    Or

    "Yoshimo is asian, can we stop including token asian and black characters?"

    Because this is how idiotic this argument seems to me.
    "They're including characters I don't like, therefore they're pushing extremist politics".

    MoradinKrotos[Deleted User]FinnTheHuman
  • MirandelMirandel Member Posts: 519

    Guys I just received a secret communiqué from Beamdog manangement (now referred to as womanagement) and they are indeed making Baldur's Gate 3. It's about Shar-Teel and her quest to murder every man in the realms.

    You missed the part where she is changing her gender.

  • Diogenes42Diogenes42 Member Posts: 597
    Shar-Teel would never do such a thing, I believe you are mistaken my friend.

  • JoeyJoey Member Posts: 201
    Archaos said:

    Joey said:


    No, but people have the right to be pissed at a very old series that is close to their hearts suddenly being injected with extremist politics

    Care to elaborate on where EXACTLY are the "extremist politics"?
    And by exactly I mean, the specific lines of characters that push a political agenda.

    If it boils down to: "Including trans/lesbian/bi/gay" characters, I can make a similar case for the original games.

    "Sarevok and Valygar are black. Can Bioware stop pushing their agenda on their RPGs?"

    Or

    "Yoshimo is asian, can we stop including token asian and black characters?"

    Because this is how idiotic this argument seems to me.
    "They're including characters I don't like, therefore they're pushing extremist politics".
    The injection of a modern, and rather controversial, view of transexuality is what is bizarre. The original BG had a girdle that let you change your gender at a whim - BG2 even had a quest where one of your NPCs changed gender. What this game has done is ignore all that entirely and inject an SJW's gender fantasy instead.

    EnvygamesOsigold
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,695
    Dark Souls 2 has a casket on a beach that can change your gender, should you choose to track it down. I expect everyone here complaining about Siege of Dragonspear to immediately bring all their From Software games to the pawn shop and refuse to purchase Dark Souls 3....

    justfeelinathome
  • PurudayaPurudaya Member Posts: 816
    Joey said:

    Archaos said:

    Joey said:


    No, but people have the right to be pissed at a very old series that is close to their hearts suddenly being injected with extremist politics

    Care to elaborate on where EXACTLY are the "extremist politics"?
    And by exactly I mean, the specific lines of characters that push a political agenda.

    If it boils down to: "Including trans/lesbian/bi/gay" characters, I can make a similar case for the original games.

    "Sarevok and Valygar are black. Can Bioware stop pushing their agenda on their RPGs?"

    Or

    "Yoshimo is asian, can we stop including token asian and black characters?"

    Because this is how idiotic this argument seems to me.
    "They're including characters I don't like, therefore they're pushing extremist politics".
    The injection of a modern, and rather controversial, view of transexuality is what is bizarre. The original BG had a girdle that let you change your gender at a whim - BG2 even had a quest where one of your NPCs changed gender. What this game has done is ignore all that entirely and inject an SJW's gender fantasy instead.
    Does the narrative ever say that she's *not* wearing the girdle?

    1. Mizhena is born. She is raised a boy because of her biological sex.
    2. She grows up and comes to an understanding with her parents: she is actually a woman.
    3. She purchases a girdle of sex change and joins the Flaming Fist.

    You're making this so much harder than it needs to be.

    [Deleted User]
  • MirandelMirandel Member Posts: 519

    Shar-Teel would never do such a thing, I believe you are mistaken my friend.

    You are probably right - otherwise her quest would be a touch hypocritical. But it was so fitting to discussion!

  • EnvygamesEnvygames Member Posts: 57
    I see...the discussion that the Metascore might be justified is already over hm?

  • ArchaosArchaos Member Posts: 1,421
    edited April 2016
    Joey said:


    The injection of a modern, and rather controversial, view of transexuality is what is bizarre. The original BG had a girdle that let you change your gender at a whim - BG2 even had a quest where one of your NPCs changed gender. What this game has done is ignore all that entirely and inject an SJW's gender fantasy instead.

    Uh, so? In the originals, there was gender changing magically, here the gender-change was mundanely.

    And yeah, it has ignored all that because it's a new game.
    What's so different than changing your gender magically to changing your gender mundanely?

    I'm honestly not getting what the big deal is all about.
    If people can change genders magically in the Realms, it means that it's not that uncommon, so changing it mundanely is practically the same, correct?

    Would you be fine if the character said: "I changed my gender with magic, because I wasn't comfortable with it" ?

    And really, where's the problem with including a trans character, since that seems to be your issue?

    Lastly, the original BGs included modernisms all the time. It's not medieval Europe. It's a fantasy setting with influences from all sorts of eras.
    Even Ed Greenwood said that there are gay men and lesbians or bisexuals around.

    And I believe Corellon has been described as a hermaphrodite in a ADnD 2E rulebook.
    Same with 5E.

    MoradinSayaki
  • JoeyJoey Member Posts: 201
    Purudaya said:

    Joey said:

    Archaos said:

    Joey said:


    No, but people have the right to be pissed at a very old series that is close to their hearts suddenly being injected with extremist politics

    Care to elaborate on where EXACTLY are the "extremist politics"?
    And by exactly I mean, the specific lines of characters that push a political agenda.

    If it boils down to: "Including trans/lesbian/bi/gay" characters, I can make a similar case for the original games.

    "Sarevok and Valygar are black. Can Bioware stop pushing their agenda on their RPGs?"

    Or

    "Yoshimo is asian, can we stop including token asian and black characters?"

    Because this is how idiotic this argument seems to me.
    "They're including characters I don't like, therefore they're pushing extremist politics".
    The injection of a modern, and rather controversial, view of transexuality is what is bizarre. The original BG had a girdle that let you change your gender at a whim - BG2 even had a quest where one of your NPCs changed gender. What this game has done is ignore all that entirely and inject an SJW's gender fantasy instead.
    Does the narrative ever say that she's *not* wearing the girdle?

    1. Mizhena is born. She is raised a boy because of her biological sex.
    2. She grows up and comes to an understanding with her parents: she is actually a woman.
    3. She purchases a girdle of sex change and joins the Flaming Fist.

    You're making this so much harder than it needs to be.
    In that case, she's not a woman she's a man under an illusion.

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,695
    There is NOTHING that justifies the amount of reviews this game has on Metacritic outside of a coordinated Gamergate smear job. 219 reviews. By contrast the new FALLOUT 4 DLC, which came out at roughly the same time, has 69. Fallout 4. Bethesda. Possibly the most popular gaming franchise in the world at the moment. And it has a 1/4th of the reviews of Siege.

    InconnurjmacreadyKrotosFinnTheHuman
  • ArchaosArchaos Member Posts: 1,421
    edited April 2016
    Joey said:


    In that case, she's not a woman she's a man under an illusion.

    Technically, it's not an Illusion, it's Transmutation.
    Changing something to something else is Transmutation, the change is real.
    Concealing something to something else is Illusion, the change is only visual.

    SkatanKrotos[Deleted User]Sayaki
  • shawneshawne Member Posts: 3,239
    Joey said:

    In that case, she's not a woman she's a man under an illusion.

    That's not what happens with Edwina - half her dialogues are about noticing certain "changes" after the spell backfires. Why would Mizhena be any different in the same scenario?

  • UltraB00nUltraB00n Member Posts: 37
    edited April 2016
    shawne said:

    You find the transgender character offensive? You find Beamdog's politics offensive? Don't buy the goddamn game. That's fine, no one's going to chastise you for that beyond pointing out that you might be missing out on a solid RPG. But that's your choice, and no one can take it away from you. Just don't expect to push your agenda on other people and be welcomed with open arms.

    No, sorry, it's bigger than the invidiual choice to buy or not to buy. It's about drawing a line in the sand. It's about actively fighting the SJW entryism into my hobby. It's about pushing back against the drive to sanitize the medium of video games and make it comply with the ever-changing and ever-expanding demands of a radical but loud political minority group, which Amber Scott apparentely identifies with.

    SJWs are to the left what teabaggers are to the right. The SJWs and indentity politics have destroyed my political home (the left), I'll not let them destroy my hobby without a fight. This is a front in the culture wars and it's dead serious.

    And let's not mince words here. Beamdog brought this upon themselves. THEY have decided to jump headfirst into the minefield of the video games culture wars. No one forced them to. No one forced Amber Scott to tell Nathan Grayson of Kotaku that the supposedly horrendous sexism of Baldur's Gate needs to be rectified and if the fans don't like it, well, that's just too bad. No one forced them to take a jab at GamerGate. They CHOSE to do this and now that they're reaping what they have sowed, they whinge about it.

    I guess Amber Scott was just too damn occupied with virtue signalling to her SJW peers to just stop for a moment and consider the broader implications of her actions. Aside from the personal emotional gratification she got from absuing this beloved franchise as her personal pulpit for poisonous, venomous, noxious and virulent grievence politics, what good did it do? It's not like it is a big secret that the culture wars in the video gaming word have turned utterly toxic. Why jump into the fray?

    Or maybe beamdog really have swallowed the Kool-Aid that "gamers are over" and that "gamers don't have to be your audience". They certainly show a certain degree of disdain for those who do not wish a beloved franchise turned into a SJW propganda megaphone. Well, I guess Beamdog can now chase that elusive "diverse" customer base that would never buy their games anyway, even if it actually existed. Good job, Amber and good job Beamdog for doubling down on the SJW crap.

    CoffeethrallOsigoldproghead3
  • PurudayaPurudaya Member Posts: 816
    edited April 2016
    UltraB00n said:

    shawne said:

    You find the transgender character offensive? You find Beamdog's politics offensive? Don't buy the goddamn game. That's fine, no one's going to chastise you for that beyond pointing out that you might be missing out on a solid RPG. But that's your choice, and no one can take it away from you. Just don't expect to push your agenda on other people and be welcomed with open arms.

    No, sorry, it's bigger than the invidiual choice to buy or not to buy. It's about drawing a line in the sand. It's about actively fighting the SJW entryism into my hobby. It's about pushing back against the drive to sanitize the medium of video games and make it comply with the ever-changing and ever-expanding demands of a radical but loud political minority group, which Amber Scott apparentely identifies with.

    SJWs are to the left what teabaggers are to the right. The SJWs and indentity politics have destroyed my political home (the left), I'll not let them destroy my hobby without a fight. This is a front in the culture wars and it's dead serious.

    And let's not mince words here. Beamdog brought this upon themselves. THEY have decided to jump headfirst into the minefield of the video games culture wars. No one forced them to. No one forced Amber Scott to tell Nathan Grayson of Kotaku that the supposedly horrendous sexism of Baldur's Gate needs to be rectified and if the fans don't like it, well, that's just too bad. No one forced them to take a jab at GamerGate. They CHOSE to do this and now that they're reaping what they have sowed, they whinge about it.

    I guess Amber Scott was just too damn occupied with virtue signalling to her SJW peers to just stop for a moment and consider the broader implications of her actions. Aside from the personal emotional gratification she got from absuing this beloved franchise as her personal pulpit for poisonous, venomous, noxious and virulent grievence politics, what good did it do? It's not like it is a big secret that the culture wars in the video gaming word have turned utterly toxic. Why jump into the fray?

    Or maybe beamdog really have swallowed the Kool-Aid that "gamers are over" and that "gamers don't have to be your audience". They certainly show a certain degree of disdain for those who do not wish a beloved franchise turned into a SJW propganda megaphone. Well, I guess Beamdog can now chase that elusive "diverse" customer base that would never buy their games anyway, even if it actually existed. Good job, Amber and good job Beamdog for doubling down on the SJW crap.
    $9.99 on GoG: https://www.gog.com/game/baldurs_gate_the_original_saga

  • PurudayaPurudaya Member Posts: 816
    Purudaya said:

    UltraB00n said:

    shawne said:

    You find the transgender character offensive? You find Beamdog's politics offensive? Don't buy the goddamn game. That's fine, no one's going to chastise you for that beyond pointing out that you might be missing out on a solid RPG. But that's your choice, and no one can take it away from you. Just don't expect to push your agenda on other people and be welcomed with open arms.

    No, sorry, it's bigger than the invidiual choice to buy or not to buy. It's about drawing a line in the sand. It's about actively fighting the SJW entryism into my hobby. It's about pushing back against the drive to sanitize the medium of video games and make it comply with the ever-changing and ever-expanding demands of a radical but loud political minority group, which Amber Scott apparentely identifies with.

    SJWs are to the left what teabaggers are to the right. The SJWs and indentity politics have destroyed my political home (the left), I'll not let them destroy my hobby without a fight. This is a front in the culture wars and it's dead serious.

    And let's not mince words here. Beamdog brought this upon themselves. THEY have decided to jump headfirst into the minefield of the video games culture wars. No one forced them to. No one forced Amber Scott to tell Nathan Grayson of Kotaku that the supposedly horrendous sexism of Baldur's Gate needs to be rectified and if the fans don't like it, well, that's just too bad. No one forced them to take a jab at GamerGate. They CHOSE to do this and now that they're reaping what they have sowed, they whinge about it.

    I guess Amber Scott was just too damn occupied with virtue signalling to her SJW peers to just stop for a moment and consider the broader implications of her actions. Aside from the personal emotional gratification she got from absuing this beloved franchise as her personal pulpit for poisonous, venomous, noxious and virulent grievence politics, what good did it do? It's not like it is a big secret that the culture wars in the video gaming word have turned utterly toxic. Why jump into the fray?

    Or maybe beamdog really have swallowed the Kool-Aid that "gamers are over" and that "gamers don't have to be your audience". They certainly show a certain degree of disdain for those who do not wish a beloved franchise turned into a SJW propganda megaphone. Well, I guess Beamdog can now chase that elusive "diverse" customer base that would never buy their games anyway, even if it actually existed. Good job, Amber and good job Beamdog for doubling down on the SJW crap.
    $9.99 on GoG: https://www.gog.com/game/baldurs_gate_the_original_saga
    You don't get to demand to live in a world where you're never confronted with things you don't like.

    InconnuSayaki
  • JoeyJoey Member Posts: 201
    shawne said:

    Joey said:

    In that case, she's not a woman she's a man under an illusion.

    That's not what happens with Edwina - half her dialogues are about noticing certain "changes" after the spell backfires. Why would Mizhena be any different in the same scenario?
    Edwin's change is played for laughs. The transexual's is not, as far as I know.

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,695
    UltraB00n said:

    shawne said:

    You find the transgender character offensive? You find Beamdog's politics offensive? Don't buy the goddamn game. That's fine, no one's going to chastise you for that beyond pointing out that you might be missing out on a solid RPG. But that's your choice, and no one can take it away from you. Just don't expect to push your agenda on other people and be welcomed with open arms.

    No, sorry, it's bigger than the invidiual choice to buy or not to buy. It's about drawing a line in the sand. It's about actively fighting the SJW entryism into my hobby. It's about pushing back against the drive to sanitize the medium of video games and make it comply with the ever-changing and ever-expanding demands of a radical but loud political minority group, which Amber Scott apparentely identifies with.

    SJWs are to the left what teabaggers are to the right. The SJWs and indentity politics have destroyed my political home (the left), I'll not let them destroy my hobby without a fight. This is a front in the culture wars and it's dead serious.

    And let's not mince words here. Beamdog brought this upon themselves. THEY have decided to jump headfirst into the minefield of the video games culture wars. No one forced them to. No one forced Amber Scott to tell Nathan Grayson of Kotaku that the supposedly horrendous sexism of Baldur's Gate needs to be rectified and if the fans don't like it, well, that's just too bad. No one forced them to take a jab at GamerGate. They CHOSE to do this and now that they're reaping what they have sowed, they whinge about it.

    I guess Amber Scott was just too damn occupied with virtue signalling to her SJW peers to just stop for a moment and consider the broader implications of her actions. Aside from the personal emotional gratification she got from absuing this beloved franchise as her personal pulpit for poisonous, venomous, noxious and virulent grievence politics, what good did it do? It's not like it is a big secret that the culture wars in the video gaming word have turned utterly toxic. Why jump into the fray?

    Or maybe beamdog really have swallowed the Kool-Aid that "gamers are over" and that "gamers don't have to be your audience". They certainly show a certain degree of disdain for those who do not wish a beloved franchise turned into a SJW propganda megaphone. Well, I guess Beamdog can now chase that elusive "diverse" customer base that would never buy their games anyway, even if it actually existed. Good job, Amber and good job Beamdog for doubling down on the SJW crap.
    Broader implications of her actions?? Video game culture wars?? Lines in the sand?? I can't tell you're serious, unhinged, or on a bad acid trip....

    joluvMoradinSayaki
  • EnvygamesEnvygames Member Posts: 57

    There is NOTHING that justifies the amount of reviews this game has on Metacritic outside of a coordinated Gamergate smear job. 219 reviews. By contrast the new FALLOUT 4 DLC, which came out at roughly the same time, has 69. Fallout 4. Bethesda. Possibly the most popular gaming franchise in the world at the moment. And it has a 1/4th of the reviews of Siege.

    The amount is one thing...the score another. I have played it twice already, i didnt even know about that transgender char, or the Minsc-Line up till earlier today. I wouldnt score the Addon much higher honestly. A bit higher...probably even arround 5/10 but more would realy stretch it.

  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,695
    Envygames said:

    There is NOTHING that justifies the amount of reviews this game has on Metacritic outside of a coordinated Gamergate smear job. 219 reviews. By contrast the new FALLOUT 4 DLC, which came out at roughly the same time, has 69. Fallout 4. Bethesda. Possibly the most popular gaming franchise in the world at the moment. And it has a 1/4th of the reviews of Siege.

    The amount is one thing...the score another. I have played it twice already, i didnt even know about that transgender char, or the Minsc-Line up till earlier today. I wouldnt score the Addon much higher honestly. A bit higher...probably even arround 5/10 but more would realy stretch it.
    The point is, there is no way the first DLC to the biggest selling console game of the last year should have a fraction of the reviews of a obscure expansion to a game that is nearly 20 years old. Not in any rational universe.

  • JoeyJoey Member Posts: 201

    Envygames said:

    There is NOTHING that justifies the amount of reviews this game has on Metacritic outside of a coordinated Gamergate smear job. 219 reviews. By contrast the new FALLOUT 4 DLC, which came out at roughly the same time, has 69. Fallout 4. Bethesda. Possibly the most popular gaming franchise in the world at the moment. And it has a 1/4th of the reviews of Siege.

    The amount is one thing...the score another. I have played it twice already, i didnt even know about that transgender char, or the Minsc-Line up till earlier today. I wouldnt score the Addon much higher honestly. A bit higher...probably even arround 5/10 but more would realy stretch it.
    The point is, there is no way the first DLC to the biggest selling console game of the last year should have a fraction of the reviews of a obscure expansion to a game that is nearly 20 years old. Not in any rational universe.
    Unless the devs make a point of enthusiastically stepping into the biggest cultural debate of their times. That'll do it.

  • EnvygamesEnvygames Member Posts: 57


    The point is, there is no way the first DLC to the biggest selling console game of the last year should have a fraction of the reviews of a obscure expansion to a game that is nearly 20 years old. Not in any rational universe.

    Depends on the Fanbase doesnt it?

  • ArchaosArchaos Member Posts: 1,421
    edited April 2016
    Joey said:



    Edwin's change is played for laughs. The transexual's is not, as far as I know.

    So? I'm still expecting an answer about my question in the comment about magical vs mundane gender change, above.

    I'm honestly curious about the actual issue here.
    Unless the issue is really "I don't like transexuals".

    Sayaki
  • PurudayaPurudaya Member Posts: 816
    Envygames said:

    There is NOTHING that justifies the amount of reviews this game has on Metacritic outside of a coordinated Gamergate smear job. 219 reviews. By contrast the new FALLOUT 4 DLC, which came out at roughly the same time, has 69. Fallout 4. Bethesda. Possibly the most popular gaming franchise in the world at the moment. And it has a 1/4th of the reviews of Siege.

    The amount is one thing...the score another. I have played it twice already, i didnt even know about that transgender char, or the Minsc-Line up till earlier today. I wouldnt score the Addon much higher honestly. A bit higher...probably even arround 5/10 but more would realy stretch it.
    That's funny, I've been playing BG for 18 years and I'd rate SoD a 9 or a 10. 71% of Steam reviews, which require that you purchase the game, seem to agree.

    I think we need to stop pretending that the 20+ pages of 0-1 star reviews on other sites are anything other than what they are.

  • JoeyJoey Member Posts: 201
    Archaos said:

    Joey said:



    Edwin's change is played for laughs. The transexual's is not, as far as I know.

    So? I'm still expecting a comment about my question in the comment about magical vs mundane gender change, above.

    I'm honestly curious about the actual issue here.
    Is the issue really "I don't like transexuals" ?
    ...you should be able to tell the difference between whimsically altering someone's gender for a tongue-in-cheek side quest, and SJW-era transexuals being commended for their bravery.

  • PurudayaPurudaya Member Posts: 816
    Joey said:

    Envygames said:

    There is NOTHING that justifies the amount of reviews this game has on Metacritic outside of a coordinated Gamergate smear job. 219 reviews. By contrast the new FALLOUT 4 DLC, which came out at roughly the same time, has 69. Fallout 4. Bethesda. Possibly the most popular gaming franchise in the world at the moment. And it has a 1/4th of the reviews of Siege.

    The amount is one thing...the score another. I have played it twice already, i didnt even know about that transgender char, or the Minsc-Line up till earlier today. I wouldnt score the Addon much higher honestly. A bit higher...probably even arround 5/10 but more would realy stretch it.
    The point is, there is no way the first DLC to the biggest selling console game of the last year should have a fraction of the reviews of a obscure expansion to a game that is nearly 20 years old. Not in any rational universe.
    Unless the devs make a point of enthusiastically stepping into the biggest cultural debate of their times. That'll do it.
    So you think its justified to skew reviews downward over this? To try and sink the game, ruin it for fans that enjoy it, and harm the developer because it contains something you don't like? I'm really curious, because every time a point is made you take it in another direction.

    Sayaki
This discussion has been closed.