While it's great "trans" people come out criticising Mizhena that post could have been made by *anyone* and does not really matter. The implementation was crap and beamdog seem to be aware of it and are already paying the hefty price(but "too bad" right?). But now all we can do is to wait for Mizhena to become a joinable npc with full voice acting and be fully importable to bg2ee(Including tob). With many amazing lines like: "You slaughter drows? Are you racist or something?" and the ever so original: "Curse Irenicus and his womb-envy!". The character also comes with a unique(but equal, maybe even slightly better) paperdoll and many "Mizhena only" items like: the cup of cis white male tears(50 charges, does 20 cold damage), glasses of the professional victim(+3 charisma, for every hit point lost: 5 gold added), red lipstick of doom(8 charges: summon 5 white knights that are *fully* under the caster's control as long as you send them kissing smileys), full plate of the social justice warrior(Armor class -1, +5 charisma, -3 constitution, increases reputation by 3, immunity to logic, CURSED), mace of attention(+3 fire damage, chance on hit: target is forced to attack the wielder and will lose 2 facebook friends each round for 2 rounds), shield of safe space(25% magic resistance, -15 wisdom, +3 to saving throws, once a day: Otiluke's Resilient Sphere, "no one can hurt you in your safe spaaaaace"), boots of triggering(3x a day: detect traps, periodically enrages user upon entering reality) and cloak of intellectual void(-10 intelligence, +3 charisma, on hit: mind flayers must save vs spell with a -5 penalty or become confused for 3 rounds). Concept art:
He has repeatedly used the word "evil" to describe the people who put Mizhena there. Not misguided. Evil. However, those who use Mizhena as an excuse to lash out at trans people? "Oh, I get that. It's not cool, but I get it. They're just taking it out on the easiest target, man. Whatever."
So like I've been saying, this sort of thing drags us through the mud too. I cannot blame those who think Mizhena is just a symbol. We become guilty in the eyes of the public by association.
And this is where I take exception. Whether Mizhena is forced or not, it does not excuse blaming those who had nothing to do with it.
I call anyone including religious people forcing religion evil. That is my opinion, we have endless world problems because people are trying to force others. Religion, ethics, politics anywhere where someone is being forced into things. The "you don't like it tough" attitude Is Evil.
I call anyone including religious people forcing religion evil. That is my opinion, we have endless world problems because people are trying to force others. Religion, ethics, politics anywhere where someone is being forced into things. The "you don't like it tough" attitude Is Evil.
Ouch. I guess I'm evil then. I force my kid to do things all the time.
(Also, if he doesn't want to try a bite of celery, tough.)
I call anyone including religious people forcing religion evil. That is my opinion, we have endless world problems because people are trying to force others. Religion, ethics, politics anywhere where someone is being forced into things. The "you don't like it tough" attitude Is Evil.
Ouch. I guess I'm evil then. I force my kid to do things all the time.
(Also, if he doesn't want to try a bite of celery, tough.)
THat is completely different, your not forcing you are teaching. You are responsible for them completely until they become of age. Your house your rules (within reason). And I bet they try and rebel and "stick it to the man" anyway.
@Mephiston87: I don't understand. What is anyone being "forced into" in this case?
If you want to buy the game u are forced to put up with sjw. It wasn't originally a part of the game, so as u can see by all the reviews people are "sticking it to the man". They want to play it without the agenda.
I'm all for people making their own game with an agenda, I really am. It just won't sell. But I'm against people using names like "baldure's gate" an already established game to trick people into being forced in the agenda which they never expected to get.
@Mephiston87 Do you object to Star Trek's multicultural ethos? Isn't the federation a stand in for the UN? Do you object to the political themes in the X men comics and movies? Professor X and Magneto represent two different positions on Israel-Palestine (and you can't get more controversial than that!).
Do you object to the gender politics of the first game? A medieval fantasy where women are equal to men?
I could go on -- the sci-fi / fantasy genre is full of political commentary both left and right. If you wait for politics free fantasy you will wait a very long time.
@Mephiston87 Do you object to Star Trek's multicultural ethos? Isn't the federation a stand in for the UN? Do you object to the political themes in the X men comics and movies? Professor X and Magneto represent two different positions on Israel-Palestine (and you can't get more controversial than that!).
Do you object to the gender politics of the first game? A medieval fantasy where women are equal to men?
I could go on -- the sci-fi / fantasy genre is full of political commentary both left and right. If you wait for politics free fantasy you will wait a very long time.
The interesting thing about X-Men and mutants in general is that it has been used as a stand-in for many political and social issues. Bryan Singer, who is gay, used mutants as a stand-in for homosexuality. For example, many of the anti-mutant phrases used in the movies ("Have you tried not being a mutant?" "Do you want them teaching your students?") are phrases that have culturally been linked to homophobic groups. Joss Whedon also created link-ins to societal issues relating to homosexuality with his 'mutant cure' storyline in the comic books, while Zach Stenz, who helped write X-Men: FIrst Class, mentioned that he included many allegories to post-Holocaust Jewish identity, the civil rights movement, and, as mentioned before, the movement for gay rights.
Some have even argued that a large portion of the societal concept of mutants (born different, hated and feared by non-mutant society, denied civil rights) has been an allegory by comic writers to bring gay rights into the spotlight.
Chris Claremont, who defined the X-Men franchise more than any other writer, put Professor Xavier in the position of Martin Luther King and Magneto in the position of Malcolm X. There is a story called God Loves, Man Kills which begins with two black mutant children being lynched and revolves around Xavier and Magneto's response to the tragedy. It ends with Magneto turning down an offer to join the X-Men. It was really a great example of how nerdy fiction can be political and provocative.
I have to admit I share pretty much the same sentiments with the poster on Steam. I'm not passing in the least, and while it's difficult sometimes, it's infinitely more painful to see" progressive" groups and individuals dragging the perception of transgendered people through the mud, making us seem like a bunch of whiny b*****s.
It's cringe worthy, it lowers the public opinion of us in general, and it makes it so that the only place we're supposedly welcome to be ourselves are places of toxic vitriol. I've been treated like a bigot that hates transpeople for not agreeing with the methods of feminists (I've had to deal with self hate but it's not that kind of self hate, it's a body complex), and as such I can wholly sympathize with people getting browbeat in this discussion.
I mean, when it hurts and enrages me because I can't have an opinion on something that affects me, imagine the feelings you're instilling in others who wouldn't have a dog in that fight in the first place? This has got to stop. It's poisoning our society. It's breeding hatred to go along with the confusion that exists.
Please stop trying to help. You may wear a fireman's coat but your hoses are spraying gasoline.
I have to admit I don't agree at all with the poster on steam, as a trans person.
I don't think Beamdog was "virtue signalling" at all (I think that term is a ridiculous reactionary dogwhistle term but for the sake of argument even using the 4chan/GG/alt-right/neo-reactionary definitions of the term Beamdog wasn't doing that).
I think Beamdog did "just put a trans woman in a game and has her there as a character", unlike what the poster on steam implies. She's involved in multiple quests and none of them once mention that she is trans, the dialogue branches to get there are buried in dialogue with her and admittedly should be triggered after more than just your first meeting with her, but honestly my only complaint with it is that it seems unrealistic that as a reply to charname being like "woah weird name" she just volunteers that she made it up because her old name didn't suit her. I'd never do that post-transition, and I don't know any trans people who would, but I do know plenty of trans people, myself included, who would definitely reveal that to someone I trusted if the situation warranted it. The dialogue after that weak linkage is bang-on and great, I have zero complaints with it and don't think it pushes any kind of political agenda at all (and certainly "pushing" an agenda on someone isn't "click several options down into a dialogue tree" in my books anyway, even if it were an agenda). I think it's just the link to the explanation that's a bit weak and out of nowhere, but the explanation itself is awesome and all they'd have to do is change one thing!
However they fix it, with a scripted event or a quest or just dialogue tweaks, it already is and will be after the fix exactly what this steam poster is complaining isn't in the game/should be in the game, which is a character that doesn't make a big deal out of being trans. She mentions it once, and it isn't a focus of her character (and for the record, I'd love to see a transition-related quest, as a trans person, and don't care who complains about that, but as I said I don't mind whether the fix is something you witness, a dialogue fix or a quest any of those are fine to me). Transness isn't a focus, and if it was for ONE additional quest it would be for 1/4 of the quests she's involved in (and if they don't add a quest, it'll be for 0/3). Her being a worshiper of Tempus is a focus. Her being a cleric is a focus. These are things repeatedly brought up in quests and dialogue with her throughout SoD. Transness comes up one time, and it's dealt with great aside from the lead-in so I strongly disagree with that point.
The comparison to the Samus thing is ridiculous too, because Sakamoto and Matsuoka have both said (before the 21st century, so long before GG's inception or the beginning of the ridiculous dismissive use by right-wing 4chan types of the term "Social Justice Warrior") that Samus was trans. They used a term that's a slur against trans women in Japanese, newhalf, so it wasn't exactly progressive but they said so in two separate interviews. So this trans poster clearly isn't aware that it wasn't a headcanon fan theory, and in fact lots of trans women don't consider it great representation because the creators used a slur to describe her as trans. All that said, she's trying to compare a situation (which didn't happen but whatever) where trans people redefined Samus' gender from cis female to trans female based on a fan theory to the situation with Mizhena, which was (like the actual Samus situation but far less offensively) intended as trans by the devs from the start. I don't agree at all with the conflating of these two conceptual things that the steam poster makes here, even if I were to agree with the premise about how the Samus Aran thing went down (which I don't).
And finally, I also don't agree with the idea that refusing to include us in media improves people's perception of us over time any more than I agree with the idea that inclusion worsens people's perception of us over time.
So as someone taking a journey on a Hormone Brick Road all the way to the Genital Reconstructive Surgery of Oz, I gotta say I strongly disagree with basically everything the steam poster had to say. I don't pass at all yet, and in fact since my electric shaver broke my poverty-stricken face has got a wicked Trans Depression Beard going on so believe me I know what it's like not to pass, and from where I'm sitting the only people dragging us through the mud and making us look like whiny b*****s are people affiliated with GamerGate and people claiming they're not affiliated with GamerGate while parroting the exact same right-wing b.s. opinions of the GGers dragging us through the mud and accusing us and any supporters of this move by Beamdog of being whiners. Yeah I'm mad when we're made to look bad, but the people making us look bad are people using words like "SJW" and "virtue signalling", and just like I vehemently disagree with Caitlyn Jenner's support of the Republican Party and Ted Cruz because she's supporting a party and a candidate who is not good for us, I vehemently disagree with this steam poster supporting and utilizing right-wing GG rhetoric about us. Trans people are a diverse group of people, and some of them side with people who love to tokenize the few of us who are willing to side with them in the service of furthering derision of us. That's what this steam poster is doing, and I'm not here for it.
I don't see any progressive groups or individuals talking about Siege of Dragonspear or Mizhena that are saying anything cringe-worthy, and I don't see anyone's estimation of us lowering as a result of progressive groups or individuals...except the GG side of things. And before anyone jumps on this with #NotAllGamerGaterz I'm not saying every single GG and GG-supportive person is in on this, I'm just saying that's the only place trans-derisive sentiments came from in the initial days of this particular instance of snide dismissive commentary (at best, on average it was outright transmisogynist and bigoted stuff and at worst it was murderous eugenics-esque comments about our very existence), and now that it's exploded onto the wider net of course other a-holes with no affiliation to GG have started nodding their bigoted heads in vigorous agreement that we're whiny and less worthy of respect and on and on, this is not new. This happens any time a particular group that doesn't like us finds a reason to express that they don't like us, and GG-affiliated people will comment on non-gaming related news items so it's not like the same "non-GG" people that are adding their transphobic voices to the chorus are any different than GG people commenting on the Republican state governments getting anti-trans bathroom laws implemented before any of this SoD debacle started. Again, it wasn't all of them, but there's overlap between people who hold right-wing views as gamers and people who hold right-wing views elsewhere on the net, and you see them reinforce each other in waves every time things like this happen. I could care less about them, but it's disingenuous to blame us for their pre-established opinions mixing with an event that centers us in the same way those two things always mix. It's not the fault of progressives that people who hate us hate us, they hated us first and progressives wanting to raise an issue about us is just a release valve for their pre-existing sewage buildup to start pouring out of their fingers onto their keyboards.
But that's just my 2 copper as a trans person who loves Beamdog and thinks they're doing a great job. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@Mephiston87 Do you object to Star Trek's multicultural ethos? Isn't the federation a stand in for the UN? Do you object to the political themes in the X men comics and movies? Professor X and Magneto represent two different positions on Israel-Palestine (and you can't get more controversial than that!).
Do you object to the gender politics of the first game? A medieval fantasy where women are equal to men?
I could go on -- the sci-fi / fantasy genre is full of political commentary both left and right. If you wait for politics free fantasy you will wait a very long time.
Ever read the forgotten realm books? Drizzt ones are my favourite. Yes according to the Lore the majority of races including humans are skewed towards one sex, males similar to how it was for our medieval period(not as bad tho) . Elves seem pretty balanced and equal(close to our current day), The drow are the extreme opposite super feminists. Other then bandits/rebel factions I can't really remember an extreme male dominant society to match up to the drow.
So yes the game is sexist in all respects, and that matches the Lore. Do I kick up a fuss that there is a supremely feminist race in FR? Nope it's the Lore. Why change the females when they are supposed to be how they are? Why add a transexxual when in this world it is a non issue due to magic, why get minsc talking about ethics when his intelligence is too low to even understand what picking the side of sjw's means. There is More about the writers comments etc, but that alone is a heavy a gender.
I Don't really follow star trek or xmen or the other stuff, so I have no idea.
@Mephiston87: I don't understand. What is anyone being "forced into" in this case?
If you want to buy the game u are forced to put up with sjw.
1. Being forced into something 2. Not getting exactly what you want
Those are different.
Also, that was interesting information about X-Men.
Either way a decent portion of this gaming community didn't get what we want according to the lore, both works. Like I have said atleast 10 times its not all about the transsexual, that is a small part. How transexxual was implemented was garbage, I have no problem with him/her being there.
@Mephiston87: I don't understand. What is anyone being "forced into" in this case?
If you want to buy the game u are forced to put up with sjw.
1. Being forced into something 2. Not getting exactly what you want
Those are different.
Also, that was interesting information about X-Men.
Either way a decent portion of this gaming community didn't get what we want according to the lore, both works. Like I have said atleast 10 times its not all about the transsexual, that is a small part. How transexxual was implemented was garbage, I have no problem with him/her being there.
Sorry, I'm having a lot of trouble parsing this comment. Could you rephrase the first sentence? Also, were we even talking about Mizhena in particular? I was just pointing out that Beamdog isn't forcing you into anything. It was in reference to your earlier post:
I call anyone including religious people forcing religion evil. That is my opinion, we have endless world problems because people are trying to force others. Religion, ethics, politics anywhere where someone is being forced into things. The "you don't like it tough" attitude Is Evil.
@Mephiston87 Do you object to Star Trek's multicultural ethos? Isn't the federation a stand in for the UN? Do you object to the political themes in the X men comics and movies? Professor X and Magneto represent two different positions on Israel-Palestine (and you can't get more controversial than that!).
Do you object to the gender politics of the first game? A medieval fantasy where women are equal to men?
I could go on -- the sci-fi / fantasy genre is full of political commentary both left and right. If you wait for politics free fantasy you will wait a very long time.
Ever read the forgotten realm books? Drizzt ones are my favourite. Yes according to the Lore the majority of races including humans are skewed towards one sex, males similar to how it was for our medieval period. Elves seem pretty balanced and equal(close to our current day), The drow are the extreme opposite super feminists. Other then bandits/rebel factions I can't really remember an extreme male dominant society to match up to the drow.
So yes the game is sexist in all respects, and that matches the Lore. Do I kick up a fuss that there is a supremely feminist race in FR? Nope it's the Lore.
I Don't really follow star trek or xmen or the other stuff, so I have no idea.
I'm one of the olds so I read the early Drizzt books when they first came out. I think Catti-Brie is a kick ass character who doesn't at all fit gender stereotypes. And, yes, back when we put onions on our belts I played the vault of the drow and loved it. I think drow society was indeed political statement. It's not so much a feminist society as a matriarchy. The drow are the photo-negatives of the surface elves and their society is the photo-negative of a patriarchy; Gygax gave men a glimpse of what it would be like to be on the receiving end of patriarchal privilege. One of the dialogues I really liked in SOD was the one
with drow teens. When when the girl says something to the effect of "and he was so pretty so I had to have him". I thought "oh yeah, someone got it". Someone saw what Gygax was trying to do. That is what would be like to be a male in drow society -- to be valued for your looks, to expect to stand by as an ornament while the woman took the lead in the discussion
It was perfect.
So, in the realms you can be a princess or you can be a kick-ass archer. And it's been that way since the beginning.
@Mephiston87: I don't understand. What is anyone being "forced into" in this case?
If you want to buy the game u are forced to put up with sjw.
1. Being forced into something 2. Not getting exactly what you want
Those are different.
Also, that was interesting information about X-Men.
Either way a decent portion of this gaming community didn't get what we want according to the lore, both works. Like I have said atleast 10 times its not all about the transsexual, that is a small part. How transexxual was implemented was garbage, I have no problem with him/her being there.
Sorry, I'm having a lot of trouble parsing this comment. Could you rephrase the first sentence? Also, were we even talking about Mizhena in particular? I was just pointing out that Beamdog isn't forcing you into anything. It was in reference to your earlier post:
I call anyone including religious people forcing religion evil. That is my opinion, we have endless world problems because people are trying to force others. Religion, ethics, politics anywhere where someone is being forced into things. The "you don't like it tough" attitude Is Evil.
It's In perfect English and it makes perfect sense even the quotation is correct what do you want me to change? Most sjw's that have come into this forum believe all this fuss is about a transexxual being in there only and it's not at all the case.
While I agree with 99% percent of what you've written I would emphasize that you, and others on this forum, wouldn't volunteer that sort of information post-transition, some others would. Take Dean Spade. If you don't know that Dean is trans he'd like you to know -- the sooner the better.
It's In perfect English and it makes perfect sense even the quotation is correct what do you want me to change? Most sjw's that have come into this forum believe all this fuss is about a transexxual being in there only and it's not at all the case.
I'm trying to have a constructive conversation by understanding you and finding common ground. Your messages are often confusing to me, though, and it seems like you keep jumping between different subjects.
Also, I would generally avoid scrutinizing grammar on an international forum, but since you brought it up and have said that you're Australian: No, your message was not in perfect English.
It's In perfect English and it makes perfect sense even the quotation is correct what do you want me to change? Most sjw's that have come into this forum believe all this fuss is about a transexxual being in there only and it's not at all the case.
I'm trying to have a constructive conversation by understanding you and finding common ground. Your messages are often confusing to me, though, and it seems like you keep jumping between different subjects.
Also, I would generally avoid scrutinizing grammar on an international forum, but since you brought it up and have said that you're Australian: No, your message was not in perfect English.
Talking about my grammar does not seem constructive. No matter where I'm from. I'm on my phone with auto correct on. And we won't find common ground, polar opposites. Someone already put the best answer out there. I swap names to help you out.
Mephiston(I represent no party) is deeply committed to respectability politics, believing that the best way to change people's prejudices is to patiently show them that you are worthy of their respect. He would prefer that people avoid direct confrontation regarding trans rights because of the negative reactions it could provoke.
Sjw's believes that such behavior will get you nowhere and lets bigots off the hook, unfairly putting the burden of responsibility on the victims of prejudice. She thinks that confrontation is necessary for change.
A good summary of both sides as another insightful observer posted. I didn't know I was anti sjw till this all happened and I heard very little about the gamer gate stuff
While I agree with 99% percent of what you've written I would emphasize that you, and others on this forum, wouldn't volunteer that sort of information post-transition, some others would. Take Dean Spade. If you don't know that Dean is trans he'd like you to know -- the sooner the better.
That's a good point, some people do make a point of it. I concede that, for sure! Transness as such can be something that is dangerous to reveal though, and while that might not be as true on Abeir-Toril as on Earth, I do get why some people feel that a reveal like that should resonate with the kinds of situations that tend to have trans people revealing that information (i.e. a very deep level of trust or contextual necessity, such as someone misgendering or deadnaming you in front of someone who wasn't aware you were trans and just thought you were who you present as).
But you're right, it's not universal by any means that trans folks obscure their transness, it's just that in this world you can end up on the wrong end of violence to reveal that facet. Public figures, whether speakers or intellectuals or journalists or celebrities or what have you, often have a very different world than the majority of us and even they sometimes come under physical attack.
@Mephiston87: Hmm. The post you've modified there was one by me about how people with those views aren't polar opposites but just have a disagreement about methods. I also said those were both reasonable stances. Despite that, you've apparently assigned me to one of the sides and are using "sjw's" (a term you have consistently associated with "evil") as a stand-in for my name. I was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt because I wanted to believe that the forum was almost back to normal, but I guess I had better face reality and stop feeding the troll, as they say. Later.
@Mephiston87: Hmm. The post you've modified there was one by me about how people with those views aren't polar opposites but just have a disagreement about methods. I also said those were both reasonable stances. Despite that, you've apparently assigned me to one of the sides and are using "sjw's" (a term you have consistently associated with "evil") as a stand-in for my name. I was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt because I wanted to believe that the forum was almost back to normal, but I guess I had better face reality and stop feeding the troll, as they say. Later.
Oh sorry I copied it for referance but didn't remember your name lol, very few people have jumped in with a minimal "unbiased opinion" most come on hard and fast and word pick endlessly(which u were doing) so I wrongly assumed you were an sjw sorry. I'm fine to discuss whatever, but my spelling and words will be off due to auto correct.
You did well with your assessment of Sides of the "political" debate sort of thing. Looking as reviews Still, I'm unsure weather the developer fixes will be enough. Feels like alot of people are. Jumping ship I dunno.
What makes Plamsen strange compared to other names? The fact that I've never heard it before. So I roleplayed that CHARNAME had never met a Mizhena before.
What makes Plamsen strange compared to other names? The fact that I've never heard it before. So I roleplayed that CHARNAME had never met a Mizhena before.
In this case it's not really roleplay, since it is somewhat forced that Mizhena is an unusual name to Charname. Most of the names are strange to us, so perhaps Mizhena could be a strange name for the region, but no such reason is ever given.
Joluv is a weird name too, be we aren't prompted to ask about his name when purchasing the Defender of Easthaven +3.
I guess I probably shouldn't have said "critical thinking" when I actually meant "common sense."
Unfortunately there's nothing common about common sense.
Aphorisms aside, saying "Someone made a mediocre game with (minority) in it! This is all (minority)'s fault!" is a childish, knee-jerk, spiteful response, and I don't know why Mephiston wants to give people a pass on that while holding the "evil" SJWs fully accountable.
And this is where I take exception. Whether Mizhena is forced or not, it does not excuse blaming those who had nothing to do with it.
Unfortunately, this is how the human mind works. If you're aware of it (and most aren't), you can avoid these pitfalls, but human beings are not entirely rational, nor do they regularly think too deeply into things. To a sense, this happened with Mizhena, but it's a little more complex than just working in one direction or "everyone blame the tranny".
See, if it had just been Mizhena, I'm about 89.47% certain that there wouldn't have been the huge backlash. Yeah, the writing would have been a little cheesy, but I don't think it would have bothered half as many people. Because there are a lot of non-cisgendered characters in video games, and while they occasionally make a few people bat a few lashes with surprise, it's by the large not even surprising anymore. Even when the Black Belt/Karate King turned Beauty from Pokemon remarks about her transformation, most go "Huh, okay" and then go back to to playing. Sure, there's a few people that wonder more, and there's a few people that get antsy about it, but by the large nobody gives a ****.
A brief and very incomplete example (though they're wrong about Poison, she was always a transsexual even in the original Japanese version, but mistakes are human).
Because gamers, in general, aren't transphobic, homophobic, etc. Hell, the frequency that I meet other transsexuals through gaming is pretty astounding (given our relatively small % of the overall population). Gaming, both electronic and tabletop, is one of the most welcoming places for us as far as communities are concerned, even moreso than most LGBT communities I tried to interact with (which are often exceedingly toxic, self entitled, preachy, and petty; though your mileage may vary).
However, because of the stuff surrounding Mizhena, it became a perfect storm to hate Mizhena not for being transgendered but for being a symptom, a symbol, a tool, of a form of ideological mongering. I'm pretty sure that Mephistan87 isn't a transphobe, and I strongly think trying to paint him as one is in bad taste. Same with the rest of the community. And SJWs fired first, which is why there is a lot of backlash against them (such as with the Anita Sarkeesian thing), and in the case of Baldur's Gate, you have a writer who is confirmed to be changing the original material (which fans loved) to suite her own idealogical interests, which is as blasphemous to the fanbase as going back and rewriting Lord of the Rings because somebody didn't think Frodo was manly enough.
When framed in this context, Mizhena isn't just transgendered character #37 on some list somewhere, she's something else entirely. Something people don't want. She now is associating transgenderism with a political agenda and raining on someone's anniversary parade. Hence why even some of us transgendered folk are disappointed, or even upset, at her inclusion in this fashion.
Again, gamers are among the most accepting people in the entire world. As noted earlier, there is a reason that same-sex/cross-race romance mods are so prevalent in games (including this one). The problem is the association with things that are hostile to the community and entangled with Mizhena, combined with the in-universe oddity of it (nobody has addressed the fact I brought up earlier, that homosexuality has been declared abnormal in Baldur's Gate, which makes transsexuality a bit suspect on the normal-o'-meter), combined with everyone calling anyone with concerns or criticism bigots and trolls.
What makes Plamsen strange compared to other names? The fact that I've never heard it before. So I roleplayed that CHARNAME had never met a Mizhena before.
In this case it's not really roleplay, since it is somewhat forced that Mizhena is an unusual name to Charname. Most of the names are strange to us, so perhaps Mizhena could be a strange name for the region, but no such reason is ever given.
Joluv is a weird name too, be we aren't prompted to ask about his name when purchasing the Defender of Easthaven +3.
CHARNAME isn't from Amn, and Joluv is from even farther away. An unfamiliar name wouldn't be surprising in that context. This is an extra-ridiculous new excuse to complain about Mizhena, and it's obvious that no one is actually interested in having the question answered, so I'm going to stop talking about it.
Comments
But now all we can do is to wait for Mizhena to become a joinable npc with full voice acting and be fully importable to bg2ee(Including tob). With many amazing lines like: "You slaughter drows? Are you racist or something?" and the ever so original: "Curse Irenicus and his womb-envy!". The character also comes with a unique(but equal, maybe even slightly better) paperdoll and many "Mizhena only" items like: the cup of cis white male tears(50 charges, does 20 cold damage), glasses of the professional victim(+3 charisma, for every hit point lost: 5 gold added), red lipstick of doom(8 charges: summon 5 white knights that are *fully* under the caster's control as long as you send them kissing smileys), full plate of the social justice warrior(Armor class -1, +5 charisma, -3 constitution, increases reputation by 3, immunity to logic, CURSED), mace of attention(+3 fire damage, chance on hit: target is forced to attack the wielder and will lose 2 facebook friends each round for 2 rounds), shield of safe space(25% magic resistance, -15 wisdom, +3 to saving throws, once a day: Otiluke's Resilient Sphere, "no one can hurt you in your safe spaaaaace"), boots of triggering(3x a day: detect traps, periodically enrages user upon entering reality) and cloak of intellectual void(-10 intelligence, +3 charisma, on hit: mind flayers must save vs spell with a -5 penalty or become confused for 3 rounds).
Concept art:
Hype?
(Also, if he doesn't want to try a bite of celery, tough.)
I'm all for people making their own game with an agenda, I really am. It just won't sell. But I'm against people using names like "baldure's gate" an already established game to trick people into being forced in the agenda which they never expected to get.
So because of it we get A Controversy
Do you object to the gender politics of the first game? A medieval fantasy where women are equal to men?
I could go on -- the sci-fi / fantasy genre is full of political commentary both left and right. If you wait for politics free fantasy you will wait a very long time.
Some have even argued that a large portion of the societal concept of mutants (born different, hated and feared by non-mutant society, denied civil rights) has been an allegory by comic writers to bring gay rights into the spotlight.
2. Not getting exactly what you want
Those are different.
Also, that was interesting information about X-Men.
I don't think Beamdog was "virtue signalling" at all (I think that term is a ridiculous reactionary dogwhistle term but for the sake of argument even using the 4chan/GG/alt-right/neo-reactionary definitions of the term Beamdog wasn't doing that).
I think Beamdog did "just put a trans woman in a game and has her there as a character", unlike what the poster on steam implies. She's involved in multiple quests and none of them once mention that she is trans, the dialogue branches to get there are buried in dialogue with her and admittedly should be triggered after more than just your first meeting with her, but honestly my only complaint with it is that it seems unrealistic that as a reply to charname being like "woah weird name" she just volunteers that she made it up because her old name didn't suit her. I'd never do that post-transition, and I don't know any trans people who would, but I do know plenty of trans people, myself included, who would definitely reveal that to someone I trusted if the situation warranted it. The dialogue after that weak linkage is bang-on and great, I have zero complaints with it and don't think it pushes any kind of political agenda at all (and certainly "pushing" an agenda on someone isn't "click several options down into a dialogue tree" in my books anyway, even if it were an agenda). I think it's just the link to the explanation that's a bit weak and out of nowhere, but the explanation itself is awesome and all they'd have to do is change one thing!
However they fix it, with a scripted event or a quest or just dialogue tweaks, it already is and will be after the fix exactly what this steam poster is complaining isn't in the game/should be in the game, which is a character that doesn't make a big deal out of being trans. She mentions it once, and it isn't a focus of her character (and for the record, I'd love to see a transition-related quest, as a trans person, and don't care who complains about that, but as I said I don't mind whether the fix is something you witness, a dialogue fix or a quest any of those are fine to me). Transness isn't a focus, and if it was for ONE additional quest it would be for 1/4 of the quests she's involved in (and if they don't add a quest, it'll be for 0/3). Her being a worshiper of Tempus is a focus. Her being a cleric is a focus. These are things repeatedly brought up in quests and dialogue with her throughout SoD. Transness comes up one time, and it's dealt with great aside from the lead-in so I strongly disagree with that point.
The comparison to the Samus thing is ridiculous too, because Sakamoto and Matsuoka have both said (before the 21st century, so long before GG's inception or the beginning of the ridiculous dismissive use by right-wing 4chan types of the term "Social Justice Warrior") that Samus was trans. They used a term that's a slur against trans women in Japanese, newhalf, so it wasn't exactly progressive but they said so in two separate interviews. So this trans poster clearly isn't aware that it wasn't a headcanon fan theory, and in fact lots of trans women don't consider it great representation because the creators used a slur to describe her as trans. All that said, she's trying to compare a situation (which didn't happen but whatever) where trans people redefined Samus' gender from cis female to trans female based on a fan theory to the situation with Mizhena, which was (like the actual Samus situation but far less offensively) intended as trans by the devs from the start. I don't agree at all with the conflating of these two conceptual things that the steam poster makes here, even if I were to agree with the premise about how the Samus Aran thing went down (which I don't).
And finally, I also don't agree with the idea that refusing to include us in media improves people's perception of us over time any more than I agree with the idea that inclusion worsens people's perception of us over time.
So as someone taking a journey on a Hormone Brick Road all the way to the Genital Reconstructive Surgery of Oz, I gotta say I strongly disagree with basically everything the steam poster had to say. I don't pass at all yet, and in fact since my electric shaver broke my poverty-stricken face has got a wicked Trans Depression Beard going on so believe me I know what it's like not to pass, and from where I'm sitting the only people dragging us through the mud and making us look like whiny b*****s are people affiliated with GamerGate and people claiming they're not affiliated with GamerGate while parroting the exact same right-wing b.s. opinions of the GGers dragging us through the mud and accusing us and any supporters of this move by Beamdog of being whiners. Yeah I'm mad when we're made to look bad, but the people making us look bad are people using words like "SJW" and "virtue signalling", and just like I vehemently disagree with Caitlyn Jenner's support of the Republican Party and Ted Cruz because she's supporting a party and a candidate who is not good for us, I vehemently disagree with this steam poster supporting and utilizing right-wing GG rhetoric about us. Trans people are a diverse group of people, and some of them side with people who love to tokenize the few of us who are willing to side with them in the service of furthering derision of us. That's what this steam poster is doing, and I'm not here for it.
I don't see any progressive groups or individuals talking about Siege of Dragonspear or Mizhena that are saying anything cringe-worthy, and I don't see anyone's estimation of us lowering as a result of progressive groups or individuals...except the GG side of things. And before anyone jumps on this with #NotAllGamerGaterz I'm not saying every single GG and GG-supportive person is in on this, I'm just saying that's the only place trans-derisive sentiments came from in the initial days of this particular instance of snide dismissive commentary (at best, on average it was outright transmisogynist and bigoted stuff and at worst it was murderous eugenics-esque comments about our very existence), and now that it's exploded onto the wider net of course other a-holes with no affiliation to GG have started nodding their bigoted heads in vigorous agreement that we're whiny and less worthy of respect and on and on, this is not new. This happens any time a particular group that doesn't like us finds a reason to express that they don't like us, and GG-affiliated people will comment on non-gaming related news items so it's not like the same "non-GG" people that are adding their transphobic voices to the chorus are any different than GG people commenting on the Republican state governments getting anti-trans bathroom laws implemented before any of this SoD debacle started. Again, it wasn't all of them, but there's overlap between people who hold right-wing views as gamers and people who hold right-wing views elsewhere on the net, and you see them reinforce each other in waves every time things like this happen. I could care less about them, but it's disingenuous to blame us for their pre-established opinions mixing with an event that centers us in the same way those two things always mix. It's not the fault of progressives that people who hate us hate us, they hated us first and progressives wanting to raise an issue about us is just a release valve for their pre-existing sewage buildup to start pouring out of their fingers onto their keyboards.
But that's just my 2 copper as a trans person who loves Beamdog and thinks they're doing a great job.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
So yes the game is sexist in all respects, and that matches the Lore. Do I kick up a fuss that there is a supremely feminist race in FR? Nope it's the Lore. Why change the females when they are supposed to be how they are? Why add a transexxual when in this world it is a non issue due to magic, why get minsc talking about ethics when his intelligence is too low to even understand what picking the side of sjw's means. There is More about the writers comments etc, but that alone is a heavy a gender.
I Don't really follow star trek or xmen or the other stuff, so I have no idea.
It was perfect.
So, in the realms you can be a princess or you can be a kick-ass archer. And it's been that way since the beginning.
Good luck on that road
While I agree with 99% percent of what you've written I would emphasize that you, and others on this forum, wouldn't volunteer that sort of information post-transition, some others would. Take Dean Spade. If you don't know that Dean is trans he'd like you to know -- the sooner the better.
Also, I would generally avoid scrutinizing grammar on an international forum, but since you brought it up and have said that you're Australian: No, your message was not in perfect English.
Mephiston(I represent no party) is deeply committed to respectability politics, believing that the best way to change people's prejudices is to patiently show them that you are worthy of their respect. He would prefer that people avoid direct confrontation regarding trans rights because of the negative reactions it could provoke.
Sjw's believes that such behavior will get you nowhere and lets bigots off the hook, unfairly putting the burden of responsibility on the victims of prejudice. She thinks that confrontation is necessary for change.
A good summary of both sides as another insightful observer posted. I didn't know I was anti sjw till this all happened and I heard very little about the gamer gate stuff
But you're right, it's not universal by any means that trans folks obscure their transness, it's just that in this world you can end up on the wrong end of violence to reveal that facet. Public figures, whether speakers or intellectuals or journalists or celebrities or what have you, often have a very different world than the majority of us and even they sometimes come under physical attack.
You did well with your assessment of Sides of the "political" debate sort of thing. Looking as reviews Still, I'm unsure weather the developer fixes will be enough. Feels like alot of people are. Jumping ship I dunno.
Joluv is a weird name too, be we aren't prompted to ask about his name when purchasing the Defender of Easthaven +3.
See, if it had just been Mizhena, I'm about 89.47% certain that there wouldn't have been the huge backlash. Yeah, the writing would have been a little cheesy, but I don't think it would have bothered half as many people. Because there are a lot of non-cisgendered characters in video games, and while they occasionally make a few people bat a few lashes with surprise, it's by the large not even surprising anymore. Even when the Black Belt/Karate King turned Beauty from Pokemon remarks about her transformation, most go "Huh, okay" and then go back to to playing. Sure, there's a few people that wonder more, and there's a few people that get antsy about it, but by the large nobody gives a ****.
A brief and very incomplete example (though they're wrong about Poison, she was always a transsexual even in the original Japanese version, but mistakes are human).
Because gamers, in general, aren't transphobic, homophobic, etc. Hell, the frequency that I meet other transsexuals through gaming is pretty astounding (given our relatively small % of the overall population). Gaming, both electronic and tabletop, is one of the most welcoming places for us as far as communities are concerned, even moreso than most LGBT communities I tried to interact with (which are often exceedingly toxic, self entitled, preachy, and petty; though your mileage may vary).
However, because of the stuff surrounding Mizhena, it became a perfect storm to hate Mizhena not for being transgendered but for being a symptom, a symbol, a tool, of a form of ideological mongering. I'm pretty sure that Mephistan87 isn't a transphobe, and I strongly think trying to paint him as one is in bad taste. Same with the rest of the community. And SJWs fired first, which is why there is a lot of backlash against them (such as with the Anita Sarkeesian thing), and in the case of Baldur's Gate, you have a writer who is confirmed to be changing the original material (which fans loved) to suite her own idealogical interests, which is as blasphemous to the fanbase as going back and rewriting Lord of the Rings because somebody didn't think Frodo was manly enough.
When framed in this context, Mizhena isn't just transgendered character #37 on some list somewhere, she's something else entirely. Something people don't want. She now is associating transgenderism with a political agenda and raining on someone's anniversary parade. Hence why even some of us transgendered folk are disappointed, or even upset, at her inclusion in this fashion.
Again, gamers are among the most accepting people in the entire world. As noted earlier, there is a reason that same-sex/cross-race romance mods are so prevalent in games (including this one). The problem is the association with things that are hostile to the community and entangled with Mizhena, combined with the in-universe oddity of it (nobody has addressed the fact I brought up earlier, that homosexuality has been declared abnormal in Baldur's Gate, which makes transsexuality a bit suspect on the normal-o'-meter), combined with everyone calling anyone with concerns or criticism bigots and trolls.