The most cheesy spell of BG2
Moonheart
Member Posts: 520
Cheese is a long, very long topic in BG2.
There are tons of overpowered things, and everyone will have his own opinion on it...
So, let's make a little poll to see which is the spell that the players think the most cheesy of all
NB: it doesn't include Imprisonment, because Imprisonement is only seen as cheesy in the hands of NPC
There are tons of overpowered things, and everyone will have his own opinion on it...
So, let's make a little poll to see which is the spell that the players think the most cheesy of all
NB: it doesn't include Imprisonment, because Imprisonement is only seen as cheesy in the hands of NPC
- The most cheesy spell of BG263 votes
- Cloudkill (lvl 5)4.76%
- Improved Haste (lvl 6)3.17%
- Mislead (lvl 6)12.70%
- Mordenkanein's Sword (lvl 7)1.59%
- Project Image (lvl 7)26.98%
- Abi-Dalzim's Horrid Wilting (lvl 8)3.17%
- Time Stop (lvl 9)14.29%
- Wish (lvl 9)9.52%
- Improved Alacrity (HLA)14.29%
- Secret Power Word: Reload9.52%
4
Comments
To tell the truth, it's hard to choose. Each spell can be used to defeat enemies. It's a matter of taste, I think, and a matter of the character I'm playing. Mislead on a FMT, Project Image on a Sorcerer.
The damage immunities make this far too god of a tank in situations where magic isn't involved.
Then again, I agree wit Julius, it's just too hard to choose, so I went with one I thought was best at that precise thing what it does. And, IMHO: Planetar > Mordenkainen's > The rest a mage can summon. But then again, I don't see the different varieties of self-cloning as strickt summons, so that might have mislead me. Pun unintended.
Simulacrum very very good for mages, feels a tad strong but still ok for level 8. Gets a tad silly for fighter/mages though.
Mislead is also incredibly strong, easy to abuse, OP for sure vs enemies that don't see invis or when coupled with poor AI or SI.
Spell immunity is imho what separates the true heroes from the mere mortals at least without SR (which I do not use).
Improved Alacrity is a true armageddon spell, I kind of like it if you don't abuse PI or wish resting to avoid the drawbacks of it.
Reloading is not cheating, this is a hard game, especially with mods (SCS).
Too liberal use of resting though, that changes gameplay quite a bit. I feel that always fully prebuffing and using every powerful ability and spell for every fight sort of takes the fun out of the game.
Normaly, each spell cast should remove the spell from it's original spell stock
Project Image isn't so much cheesy, though, as it is conventionally overpowered. Even aside from all the exploits you can do with it (most famously, using Protection from Magic scrolls via the clone without losing the scrolls), it just gives you so many extra high-level spells. The critical disadvantage of the spell is that the caster loses the clone if he or she takes any damage, and the caster is disabled for the duration. I've actually lost a no-reload run because of Project Image, because my character was unable to cast PFMW or run away when a Mind Flayer was attacking them.
I would also vote the Wand of Lightning as the most exploitable item, allowing the player to duplicate any quick slot item or any stackable on-self effect by 6. Sunfire, Mass Cure, Wish, Limited Wish, Mislead, Wondrous Recall, Wail of the Banshee, Holy Word, Mordenkainen's Sword, Called Shot (for Generic Archers from the Tactics mod dual-classed to mages or thieves), Boon of Lathander, Divine Favor, Sunray, the Cloak of Stars, the Efreeti Bottle, the Golem Manual, the Book of Daily Spell, Protection from Magic or Undead scrolls, the Rod of Resurrection, Power Attack, and all manner of potions, scrolls, and wands can all be empowered with the Wand of Lightning. In vanilla, without EE, the WoL can also duplicate Armor of Faith, Blur, Hardiness, Defensive Harmony, Righteous Magic and Spell Immunity.
Mislead is cheesy for a 6th level spell. Stuff it in a contingency and its really easy to abuse as a starting spell in a battle.
Simulacrum - way cheesy but mostly because of the items it retains - there is a mod that sort of fixes it some you can't use items anymore. Really abused for those fighter>mage duals or mutliclass f/m.
Not on the list is the sequencers, contingencies and triggers - tossing out multiple spells (some with long casting times) all at once has to rank up there in terms of cheesiness.
The thing about the spells in that list (and including several unmentioned ones) is that they tend to become usable/useful at around the same time as other OP spells. In the end, if your favorite OP spell isn't working for some reason you can always use your next favorite OP spell and so on.
Summon Woodland Beings is pretty much the only spell in its class. The nymphs can cast mage spells a wizard at the same XP level as the druid can't even cast yet, and they can also cast Mass Cure, making the druid the game's beast healer for most of the game. You can have five out at once, and they are absolutely beastly against humanoid opponents, allowing you to tackle adventurer groups early on and loot their gear. And just like that, your warriors are suddenly wearing +1 Full Plate/shields, your casters have more wands to play around with, everyone has better stats overall, you have more gold to buy stuff with, etc.
The spell that I've seen warp games the most, though, is Improved Haste. It changes so much on so many levels by simply fundamentally changing the balance of combat.
IH no longer doubling APR in Spell Revisions is one big reason (of many) why I love that mod. Double APR is simply way, way, WAY too good.
And for baldurs gate 1 I would even go as far to say that at the end of baldurs gate 1 i rather have a druid then a cleric because of this summon.
Even if we would ignore the awesome crowd control spells that it has like hold person/monster you get mass cure which like you already mentioned makes your druid a beast of a healer, i can only say great things about this spell and i am glad somebudy finally mentions this spell.
I agree with @Lord_Tansheron about IH, but as I play with SR installed it isn't as crazy overpowered on my game.
But in vanilla, mislead on a mage/thief isn't fair.
This thing is literally cheatmode from a legit spell.
Lack of accuracy is the root of all evils!
If I were to tell you that I had a spell that kills instantly with no save and ignores magic resistance, would you consider it to be overpowered? I would, but Imprisonment is even better than that, since it's not stopped by Death Ward and it can affect creatures immune to death magic.
The main thing that aggravates me about it is that it kicks the affected party member out of the group and you have to ask them to rejoin? Hello? You were just in the group 30 seconds ago? Mind rejoining? Breaks the romance so I usually restore. It seems to happen almost every time with that stupid Alchra Diagott in the underdark. I usually move the romance partner far out of his range if I can't defend them.