Part 3: In the Words of Olivia Newton-John, "Let's Get Invisible, Invisible..."
Executive Summary: Angelo succeeds where Permidion Stark failed using a (perhaps) novel technique.
Having exhausted the peaceful methods of advancing, Angelo needed to engage in trial by combat to earn his XP. After getting his first kill by blinding a swordsman, his next opponents would require very different tactics...
The Flesh Is Not So Weak After All...
The time had come for Angelo to visit High Hedge. Those twin flesh golems were 2,000 XP sitting ducks and, with level 3/3/4 in sight, Angelo would not let the opportunity pass him by. Equipping his new gauntlets, he loaded up with as many +1 arrows from Taerom Fuiruim as he could afford (i.e. all of them!).
Although Thalantyr will turn hostile if you attack his golems after talking to him, you can slaughter them freely before talking to him. They're immune to magic and normal weapons, though, and since Beregost only sells finite echanted ammunition (and you can't buy any from Thalantyr, else the battle stops), you'll want use the Gauntlets of Weapon Specialisation to give yourself the best chance of bringing them down. If you're desparate, Erdane (outside Durlag's Tower) sells more, if you can afford it... but the basic point stands!
Although the following trick may well be known by the cogni scenti, I haven't seen it described explicitly elsewhere... and if my only real contribution to this thread is a trick for an early 4,000 XP (when the petrify-revive-repetrify basilisk loop has basically rendered it obsolete), then I'd still be happy!
After meeting one of the flesh golems, Angelo retreated, luring it into the central ring. The golem was pretty thick and sometimes several attempts were required (Angelo was alert to the flesh golem unwittingly stopping just around the lip of the doorway, as it could have painfully smacked him as soon as he poked his head around the corner). Eventually, however, the beast was suckered in, lumbering towards Angelo as he took potshots at it. Seemingly cornered, death seemed inevitable...
Full disclosure: these screenshots were taken on a similar run on another computer - I forgot to take some this time around - so the portraits and so on may not quite match up.
...But the Flesh Is Pretty Stupid!
Being Lawful Evil, Angelo ducked behind Thalantyr. "Take the women, children and this powerful conjurer first!" he cried.
Miraculously, the flesh golem spun around and began proceeding anticlockwise towards him. After nearly 2 rounds of free shots, when the flesh golem had almost reached him, Angelo again ducked behind Thalantyr and again the golem reversed its circumambulation, marching clockwise this time.
"Thank goodness SCS didn't fix this script," Angelo murmured as he looped this procedure as many times as required for the flesh golem to die, before repeating it on the other flesh golem for a total of 4,000 XP... enough to level up to 3/3/4. And after the flesh golems met their maker, Angelo promptly met their maker and bought a scroll of Invisibility. Since Thalantyr had 3 copies, Angelo went daredevil and attempted to scribe it without augmenting his Intelligence... and was successful first time.
This tactic isn't quite as failsafe as described. It's suitable for an NR run, but occasionally, the second golem joins the action and navigates the perimeter in the opposite direction to the first. This traps you in an ever-decreasing arc until you're caught behind Thalantyr with nowhere to run. Barring other means of invisibility, you can suddenly discover an urgent need to talk to Thalantyr, which will save you at the cost of denying the flesh golem XP.
Now that Angelo had Invisibility and was high enough level to cast it, he had many new options that he didn't have before. He could now complete the remainder of his 'stealth-but-no-combat' quests; several guarded treasure troves could now be safely raided; and the possibility of resting while invisible opens up completing a few dungeons. In particular, Angelo had heard about some mines in Nashkel that needed clearing... and now he had all the tools for the job!
Part 4: Angelo Angers the Warders and Kisses a Nereid
Executive Summary: Angelo goes up a level by combining Invisibility with his imp familiar in Durlag's Labyrinth and using hit-and-run techniques to kill a disproportionately troubling Droth.
Having acquired 00-status with the two flesh golem kills, Angelo decided to explore the Sword Coast and see what easy pickings he can gather. Although the last post did not lie - he does have all the tools for completing the Nashkel Mines - it does not tell the whole truth in that he needs to be level 4/4/5 to execute his plan properly. This means earning another ~15,000 XP... and Invisibility will allow him to do just that!
As this post is longer than my previous ramblings, I've split it up into spoilered sections.
Durlag's Tower:
First, Angelo went back to have another crack at Durlag's Labyrinth. Angelo recovered the mallet handle from the library and immediately dashed out the room before the greater dopplegangers could surround him, only casting Invisibility once he'd turned the corner. This also allowed him to safely disarm the traps in the corridor guarded by mustard jellies without having to rely on Stealth lagging from the bedroom. Doing this granted him entry to the reading room for Pride's quest and the gong for Fear's quest, netting another 4,000 XP.
Completing Love and Avarice's quests were more complicated. The Treasure Room was small enough that sneaking straight in and looting would allow the assorted skeletons and Helmed Horrors to surround Angelo. However, Angelo could only cast a single level 2 spell per day, and this meant that he could not draw the monsters away before casting Invisibility: he could then not loot the container without becoming visible again and this would mean he could not rest invisibly inside the labyrinth.
Why didn't Angelo just lure the monsters away, turn invisible, rest and then loot the container? Because reasons.
Felicity piped up, "Can I help?"
It all came to Angelo in a flash. "I can offer you as bait!"
The imp's expression showed she was not thrilled by this prospect, but Angelo explained. "You can polymorph into a mustard jelly, which are immune to the normal weapons the monsters are using. If I hang out invisibly in a corridor, you can lure the monsters into the engine room, leaving space for me to loot the treasure room while they're busy not damaging you. I'll come back for you when I'm done, you turn back into an imp, I'll put you in the pack and then turn invisible. Et voila!"
If you're wondering where the wands of fire and paralyzation are from, then you've been paying attention! They're from the ankheg nest and Black Alaric's Cave, but I've not mentioned them here for narrative convenience... think how long this post would have been otherwise! I promise I won't be using them before I officially obtain them in a post's time.
Snatching the switch for the engine and the glittering beljuril gem, Angelo pressed the bottle of wine and went back to the main hall. Completing Love's final quest granted 4,000 XP, rather than the usual 2,000 XP (so 10,000 XP in total from the warders), but Angelo was still not sufficiently emboldened to fight the warders. Turning invisible (he'd rested since the heist) to prevent any tailing, he scuttled out the tower and off to Shipwreck's Coast.
Shipwreck's Coast:
When Shoal offered Angelo a kiss, Angelo couldn't help but accept. Even if he failed the Breath Weapon save, he'd only be knocked unconscious with 1 HP... Shoal did non-lethal damage, so there was no way that she would kill him. After shooting her a few times (she was easy for him to hit, whereas he was easy for her to hit on), she summoned Droth for Angelo to sort out. Or did she want Droth to sort Angelo out? In any case, Angelo wasn't much interested in rescuing Shoal, but he quite fancied Droth's Helm of Defence and agreed to dispatch the troublesome ogre mage.
Angelo knew that Droth's script always started by casting Glitterdust... and while he's casting that, Angelo would hit him with Blindness. If the initial Blindness worked, then its 4 hour duration far exceeded Glitterdust's 4 rounds, so Angelo could recover with plenty of time; if it failed, then Angelo would simply turn invisible, rest and try again (Droth had no way of dispelling the invisibility and would also regain his spells after the rest).
Despite the guaranteed blind, Droth's AC was so good that Angelo was only hitting on a critical. Worse, although a polymorphed Felicity fared better than Angelo, having to cut through Droth's defences was time consuming. So much so that Felicity's polymorph spell wore off when Droth was only down to Injured. Angelo was not convinced he could whittle away Droth's remaining health shooting arrows before the ogre mage's vision returned... and with Glitterdust expended, there was no guarantee that Droth wouldn't snap off a nasty spell before Angelo could escape with Invisibility.
From inside his pack, Felicity offered sage advice: "Shooting arrows is not the only way to whittle away Droth's health."
After a second's contemplation, Angelo understood. Drawing his sword, he ducked into the shadowiest region he could find and waited until he passed his Stealth check before swiftly dashing behind Droth, making one quick attack and then retreating out of the brute's reduced vision before any reaction was possible. Rinsing and repeating, the additional +4 from backstab would take the sting out of Droth's AC and the extra damage, especially from a critical, would enable the kill before Blindness wore off.
Finally, Droth lay dead and Angelo he saw Shoal warbling towards him, probably wanting to donate 975 XP before teleporting away. But Angelo was not satisfied. This nasty nereid would have happy sacrificed him to her ogre overlord: now Angelo knew how Riggilo must have felt! Fortunately for Angelo, revenge was easy to come by since all of Shoal's attacks still did non-lethal damage; unfortunately for Shoal, Angelo's weapons did lethal damage and her death was worth 5,000 XP.
Many walkthroughs advocate ignoring Droth and going for Shoal straight out the gates for an easy 5,000 XP. Previously, I have coveted the Helm of Defence as it allows any helm-wielding character to gain 100% fire resistance (together with 2 rings of fire resistance or a ring and Icingdeath). However, upon reflection, you could just use a potion. I share @Grond0's dislike of consumables, but using them saves a difficult and lengthy battle. Swings and roundabouts.
Together, the 10,000 XP from Durlag's Labyrinth and the 5,650 XP from Shipwreck's Coast is enough for Angelo to reach level 4/4/5. Now he can cast two level 2 spells a day, which will be all that's required to clear the Nashkel Mines. Angelo afforded himself a grim chuckle, "Those kobolds don't know what's coming for 'em."
Executive Summary: Angelo steal Mulahey's stuff, then kills him with it.
After going up to level 4/4/5, Angelo decided it was time to advance the plot. "I wonder how often players wait this long on regular difficulties," he asked himself as he turned invisible and sneaked his way into the Nashkel Mines.
Scribing an All-Important Spell
Kylee's dagger was duly returned and Joseph's greenstone ring was promptly pocketed. Disarming the traps, Angelo went straight through to the final mound - was it a mound? - and found Mulahey standing inert, waiting for a PC to activate him. Ignoring him, Angelo opened the big chest (baddies need to stop putting their important items in ostentatious containers) and stuffed its contents into his pockets as his Invisibility wore off.
While still at the chest, Angelo cast Invisibility again and sprinted into a side cavern before Mulahey's monstrous horde (and it truly was a horde... SCS significantly upped their numbers) could get tabs on his whereabouts. Glugging a potion of mind focusing and of genius - neither of which dispelled his Invisibility - Angelo's intelligence was sufficient that he was confident of successfully scribing all the spells in his scroll case... including, among the assorted dweomers from Durlag's Tower and hidden caches, his newest acquisition, the Web spell.
Since it is not sold in High Hedge, early copies of Web are hard to come by. Borda (in the Xvart village) and Narcillus (in the Valley of the Tombs) have one each, but both are tough combats (since Narcillus basically turns hostile immediately and Borda has levels in thief, neither are attractive pickpocket targets). Dushai (in Ulgoth's Beard) has one, but this either requires a successful Pickpocket or costs reputation to extract. There's also one in the Bandit Camp, but that's in Chapter 3. At this stage, it's probably better to save gold than to spend it buying scrolls to maximise potion usage.
Disabling Mulahey
Angelo filled his pair of level 2 spell slots with one Invisibility and one Web. After resting, he made sure that he was positioned in the left side cavern (the one without Xan), since he did not want to be blocked off from the exit if/when the monsters moved into the central crossroads. He peeked around the corner into Mulahey's chamber. The miniature army were all milling around the chest area, where they had last seen Angelo before he'd disappeared, and hadn't bothered to spread out since. "Good," Angelo muttered as, still out of sight, he released Felicity before releasing his Web spell.
The magical webbing ensnared the entirity of Mulahey's horde, giving Angelo and a polymorphed Felicity free rein to pelt their leader with arrows and mustard jelly globules (and a few Blind spells for good measure). Angelo wasn't too concerned with whether the Blind spells connected, since this was only really to make Mulahey easier to hit. At the first sign that Mulahey had made his saving throw against the Web spell, Angelo ducked behind the corner, out of sight and out of range. Even if the cleric had cast Unholy Blight, Angelo knew his evil alignment would protect him.
Even once the Web spell had worn off, Angelo knew he was safe without Invisibility as long as he stayed out of sight. The SCS scripting was a curious thing. Sometimes, if monsters figured out that one mode of attack had no effect, they'd switch to another... and if they didn't have any others, they'd give up and not do anything. As a mustard jelly, Felicity was immune to Mulahey's magic and the normal weapons the monsters used. Mulahey's only option would have been to cast Spiritual Hammer or Shillelagh, then attack Felicity himself... except that he was hemmed in by his own forces and unable to move! As long as the monsters are stopped from rushing you from the start, Mulahey (whether blinded or not) was basically a dead man standing still.
Throughout my time playing BG:EE, I have never once seen any of Mulahey's horde (not including Mulahey himself) make their saving throw on Web. I suppose these tactics are not 100% guaranteed, but I'll give it a 99.99...% success rate.
Killing Mulahey and Making an Escape
The same factors stopping Mulahey from moving out would also stop Angelo from moving in, but this is not much of a bother. Once Mulahey fell, Angelo quickly showed his face before darting back behind the rock, with Felicity following behind. Seeing a character that they could conceivably damage, the kobolds and skeletons began bounding out of the chamber. Giving the monsters enough time to spread out a little, but not enough to block off the chamber's entrance, Angelo swiped Felicity up into his pack again, cast Invisibility and immediately rested while they were still out of sight.
The resting reset the monsters' movement and prevented them from trapping Angelo in the side cavern. When Angleo awoke, he was still invisible and the monsters hadn't moved. Dodging around them, Angelo snatched Mulahey's belongings, cast another Invisibility and weaved his way back out of the mound - yes, it was a mound - and of the Nashkel Mines altogether.
It's essential to have as many Invisibility spells memorised as possible while looting Mulahey's corpse. Sometimes, it's necessary to reposition monsters by attacking, luring them towards you and then disappearing. Getting trapped in Mulahey's chamber with no more Invisibility sucks, even if you're currently invisible, because there's nowhere to potentially rest with no view of any monster.
Having retrieved Mulahey's scrolls, Angelo watched Chapter 3's cinematics roll. He was about to head back to the Friendly Arm Inn.
Since it is not sold in High Hedge, early copies of Web are hard to come by. Borda (in the Xvart village) and Narcillus (in the Valley of the Tombs) have one each, but both are tough combats (since Narcillus basically turns hostile immediately and Borda has levels in thief, neither are attractive pickpocket targets). There's also one in the Bandit Camp, but that's in Chapter 3. At this stage, it's probably better to save gold than to spend it buying scrolls to maximise potion usage.
Dushai also has one, along with a valuable ring of free action - available for just a minor reputation cost ...
Since it is not sold in High Hedge, early copies of Web are hard to come by. Borda (in the Xvart village) and Narcillus (in the Valley of the Tombs) have one each, but both are tough combats (since Narcillus basically turns hostile immediately and Borda has levels in thief, neither are attractive pickpocket targets). There's also one in the Bandit Camp, but that's in Chapter 3. At this stage, it's probably better to save gold than to spend it buying scrolls to maximise potion usage.
Dushai also has one, along with a valuable ring of free action - available for just a minor reputation cost ...
*Sigh*
Every time I try to be comprehensive, I always forget one. Yes, as you say, Dushai has one.
Being the kind-hearted soul that I am, I'm not too fond of killing innocents (probably why I didn't remember Dushai), even if they have items like Algernon's cloak or rings of free action. Still (altogether now)... no trick is too low for Angelo!
It's a while since I tried this challenge, so decided to have another go. I'm not generally a great fan of triple-class characters, but created a F/M/T in order to give Angelo some company . I was originally rolling with the aim of getting 90+, but 88 actually allows maximisation of all the most useful abilities and, when I got an 88 total with 18(00) strength after 20 minutes or so I was more than satisfied with that.
My installation includes the fix for the LoB saving throw bug - giving enemies the intended +5 benefit. Hence spell disablers generally are rather less effective than they would otherwise be. SCS also makes many blinded enemies run all over the map, which is a pain - but blind is still a very useful spell in the right circumstances and Flexi starts with that and find familiar. To make backstabbing tactics less of a hassle he will also be building up stealth capabilities substantially.
Flexi's first act after creation (at least after removing the unwanted script) was to summon a pseudo-dragon familiar. That's very capable of tanking against early enemies as well as offering invisible blocking and distraction abilities.
Flexi's first main stop after leaving Candlekeep was to look in at a gnoll in the Lake area and dare it to attack an out-of-sight Drizzt. Checking back in 30 minutes or so showed it had broken its weapon, so there was then just a need to wait patiently for another hour or so until it had beaten Drizzt unconscious. Killing Drizzt was worth 12k XP to kick start Flexi's levelling.
While in the mood to be a bad boy, Flexi went to find Dushai. He also killed some fishermen and returned Tenya's bowl for another 2,500 to get to mage level 3. It would make sense at that point to buy invisibility - but he didn't do that yet. At Ulgoth's Beard his pseudo-dragon made mincemeat of Dushai in melee and Flexi recovered a ring of free action and a web spell.
Blindness helped deal with some hobgoblins and recover Joia's ring to boost reputation back to 6 and donating 1,050 gold at the local temple pushed that to 11. Firebead and Mr Colquetle added to that before Flexi headed to the basilisk area. Korax was put to work paralyzing basilisks there, allowing Flexi to then join in with dual-wielded scimitars. Thanks to those and the extra damage from the familiar, Korax lasted comfortably long enough to kill all the basilisks and Mutamin as well.
A first use of web helped Flexi get some stealthy boots from a hobgoblin without the need to run round too much. Zhurlong put a claim in for those, but was disappointed by the bonus pummeling he received from Flexi's staff.
Switching back to searching for reputation, Flexi went to Nashkel for the first time and spoke to Oublek. Samuel was safely delivered to the FAI, Brage to a local sanatorium and Caldo & Krumm were blinded and webbed. At the Lighthouse a group of worgs were inclined to scatter when blinded, but web and the familiar helped deal with them reasonably quickly. I was thinking reputation 19 and charisma 13 would give him a final reputation point gain from Drienne, but she was only willing to hand over the last of her allowance.
After sneaking through the Gnoll Stronghold to get the charisma tome, Flexi did a bit more sneaking in the ankheg nest - successfully hiding again after looting the treasure. Helping out Farmer Brun pushed reputation to 20. That means Flexi can get rock-bottom prices with the help of friends and he'll have a look at what's for sale next time.
Executive Summary: After discovering the limitations of door-hopping, Angelo 'disposes' of Nimbul and Neira.
What was initially planned to be a short update has sprawled considerably. I'll split it up again using 'Spoiler' tags.
Nimbul: Part 1
After the Nashkel Mines, Angelo decided to head back to town. Spells needed to be memorised; quivers needed to be refilled; and 1,800 XP from talking to Berrun Ghastkill and Joseph's wife needed to be earned. Angelo achieved the last two objectives simply enough and made for the tavern to polish off the first.
Out of nowhere, Nimbul appeared. "I am death come for thee," he intoned gravely.
Angelo sighed. Just up the road, he'd seen a ranger talking to a hamster and a man in a red robe shouting, "Elminster this, Elminster that, give me 3,000 years and a pointy hat and I'll kick his arse!" What was it with Nashkel and nutjobs?
When Angelo saw Nimbul automatically cast Mirror Image and Stoneskin, his mind was made up. He ducked into the Nashkel shop, hoping to wear down Nimbul's spells by hopping in and out. Unfortunately, Nimbul refused to fall for such cheap tactics. "You cannot escape from me!" he snarled as he followed Angelo inside.
It must be said, dear readers, that Angelo was so shocked that he slammed the Pause button and took a second to work out what to do. Nimbul's Horror and Magic Missile combo could be quite deadly to a PC without Shield or a Greenstone amulet, neither of which Angelo had bothered to acquire yet. Worse, Nimbul's saving throws against Blind were decent and his Boots of Avoidance made shooting through his defences even more painful.
Then, after a moment's thought, Angelo hit upon a solution. Nipping quickly out of the shop, he slammed the door behind him. "Let's see if the AI's scripts can open doors as well as go through them," he said to himself.
It turned out that Nimbul's, at least, couldn't.
As far as I know, neither can any others', at least in BG:EE.
Neira
Vowing to deal with the assassin later, Angelo's thoughts returned to the Nashkel Tavern. "At least the way to the bar is free now," he muttered as he approached.
Out of nowhere, Neira appeared. "I'm going to slit your throat, I am," she intoned gravely.
"Oh for goodness' sake," Angelo replied, which wasn't one of the dialogue options. Rather than let Neira cast Hold Person at him, he ducked outside and waited a second before re-entering. However, upon his return, the cleric was nowhere to be seen. "Eh?" Angelo gasped as he exited the tavern once more.
Angelo could only surmise that Neira had left the Inn at the same time as he had, but had delayed her re-entry by a second or so. This meant when Angelo went outside, to prevent him occupying the same space as Neira, he materialised several feet away. She was now blocking the door and had already begun casting her next Hold Person. Too slow to run, Angelo prayed to RNG-sus and snapped off a quick Blind of his own.
He felt his limbs tighten as the paralysis took hold. "Guess this is a reload..." he managed to mutter before his jaw locked. But when his eyes adjusted their focus, he saw that the Blind spell had also connected at the exact same time. Neira stood unable to see or attack the helpless Angelo and so was instead content to act as target practice for Rasaad and the town guard. A long overdue activity, it would appear, as they never seemed to hit her, even with a -4 AC penalty.
"What are the chances?" Angelo asked himself as Hold Person wore off after a mere 10 rounds, giving him plenty of time to shoot blind Neira to death (no Boots of Avoidance for her!). "Actually not too bad," he decided, as clerics' Saves vs Spells were crap.
These events did actually play out roughly as described (I forgot to take a screenshot, which was a rookie error!). That said, I'd still probably trust entrance-hopping as a reliable method of draining Neira of spells.
Nimbul: Part 2
Having cheated death twice in as many encounters, Angelo decided that enough was enough. Magic Missile was no longer going to be the lethal go-to for 'low level' LoB mages. Angelo raided the nearby manor house for a Shield scroll, as he could also pocket a Potion on Invisibility on the way (he had a vague feeling - didn't know why - that it might be useful against a demon in the future). Since High Hedge also sold multiple copies, Angelo trusted his luck on the scribing roll. Another success. All gravy.
The additional 12 levels that enemy NPCs get in LoB makes fighting mages a real nuisance. Not only does every paltry excuse for a conjurer now fire 5 Magic Missiles, but now Chromatic Orb is essentially 'save v spells or die' (although the +6 bonus does help). Melf's Acid Arrow also lasts so long as to be almost a death sentence for beginning characters, especially since there are not many ways to resist acid damage. Mirror Image is a decent way to nullify this spell, although its success is not guaranteed.
Angelo woke up refreshed. "Time to sort out Nimbul," he said as he cast Shield before going into the store. He'd waited long enough for Nimbul's defences to have worn off, so the whole battle should be a lot easier now...
As soon as Nimbul saw Angelo enter the store, his Stoneskin and Mirror Image were re-erected. This led Angelo to only one conclusion: when he got his spells back after resting, so did his opponents. "Only fair, I suppose," Angelo conceded through gritted teeth.
Nimbul was in no mood for chit chat. "Surrender, and your passage..."
Neither was Angelo. "I'm not surrendering my passage!" he exclaimed, dashing back outside and slamming the door shut. Dealing with Nimbul would have to wait a little longer.
Angelo had a fair idea what to do in the meantime. He had not yet exhausted the looting possibilities of his Invisibility magic... and his new Shield spell could be useful against another hired killer not far North...
Hope everyone's enjoying my posts so far. I recognise that they may sometimes seem quite long, but I've tried to balance being thorough (although, as we've seen, I don't always quite succeed!) with trying to make it entertaining to read (most/all of you will be familair with at least the majority of its content anyway, so hopefully the narrative makes it a bit less 'old hat').
Perhaps an odd question, but are there any restrictions on modding for the Poverty challenge? There's no way Angelo is retiring, but I sometimes feel that I'm flogging a dead horse by trying to find ways to not exploit Algernon's Cloak (e.g. who cares if I find a new way of killing Thalantyr's flesh golems if any player would just basilisk XP-loop?!). One vastly overkill way of tackling this would be to do the Poverty challenge, but it seems rather mental to do it strictly (no enchanted weapons for killing creatures immune to normal weapons, no spell scrolls for mages to learn spells, etc.). One class I thought of which might perform better than most would be the Geomantic Sorcerer, but it's only accessible via a mod. It seems rather overpowered (although in solo LoB, is anything really overpowered?) and if using one would gain the same reaction as, say, removing the XP cap, then I'd rethink my strategy somewhat.
It's a while since I tried this challenge, so decided to have another go. I'm not generally a great fan of triple-class characters, but created a F/M/T in order to give Angelo some company . I was originally rolling with the aim of getting 90+, but 88 actually allows maximisation of all the most useful abilities
You say 'company', I say 'competition'!
I jest, I jest. It's good to see another challenger join the fray, especially if it's 'out of retirement'. I agree that 88 is enough for a triple: ironically, not casting 9th level spells is kinda a blessing as you don't need to worry too much about Wisdom for the Wish spell (always potions for those times when you or a simulacrum are casting from a scroll). Truth be told, a triple class would not be my first pick either - an I/C always rock my boat, although I'd also take a F/I - but both of those have already been done. Completing the challenge at all is a major achievement, but I'd like to at least try something new before reverting back to my standbys.
I only ever play no-reload and my record would suggest that Flexi is unlikely to be competition for Angelo for long. However, hope springs eternal in the half-elf breast ...
Incidentally, I do a lot of door-hopping myself and it's by no means a panacea against all enemies. It's certainly possible for them to follow you both in and out of locations and, as you've discovered, some of them have a nasty habit of blocking entrances when they do that. Another problem, which particularly annoys me, is when enemies start casting a spell at you from outside and carry on casting during the transition so that the spell actually casts inside. Very fine control and timing for the transition are needed to beat that sort of tactic .
At High Hedge Flexi spent a while stealth attacking the 2 golems. His 95% stealth ability gave him a decent chance of hiding and, even used non-proficiently, he was able to hit the golems with only a 10 using Twinkle. It still took multiple attacks though and Flexi was hit once by each golem - so he was glad when the ticklish business was over.
He successfully learned a friends scroll and subsequently bought a fair number of other spells - learning all the more important ones of those. He also kept just enough cash back to buy the +3 staff and cloak of displacement.
He used his new staff and an invisible familiar to beat up Karlat for a bit of practice. More lucrative opportunities for that tactic awaited at Durlag's Tower, but first Flexi wanted a final boost to his combat power. At Firewine Bridge I thought there was a good chance that Meilum would shrug off all 5 blind spells - after all 2 separate gnolls had done that at High Hedge. However, this time the fates were with Flexi and Meilum succumbed immediately. That interrupted his script and he stayed neutral while Flexi practised his backstabs - which included a nice pair of consecutive criticals.
At Durlag's a few enemies were lured into attacking where their short weapon reach proved fatally incapable of reaching over the familiar. However, most of them were killed by Flexi alone using repeated backstabs. One of the spells purchased had been protection from petrification, so Flexi was theoretically free to join in the fight against the basilisks on the roof - getting his first 3 figure backstab there.
However, as usual I couldn't resist one risk too many. I was aware that the PfP was close to ending, but rather than leave the final basilisk to the familiar, or rest to get a replacement, I couldn't resist trying one more backstab to finish the basilisk off - and the protection must have expired as Flexi was retreating from that ...
There's no way Angelo is retiring, but I sometimes feel that I'm flogging a dead horse by trying to find ways to not exploit Algernon's Cloak (e.g. who cares if I find a new way of killing Thalantyr's flesh golems if any player would just basilisk XP-loop?!).
I wouldn't worry about that too much.
I myself only used the basilisk loop twice and I think most people here are in the same boat.
The bg 1 xp cap is very low and very easy to reach solo.
Lately I actually never even worried about actively trying to reach cap, but instead just rushed BG city asap, which is much more beneficial to most chars then max xp and you automatically reach cap really quickly once you have access to the city.
I have started a jester run the other day, but should I die it's not gonna be a no reload run, also I have xp cap turned off, because otherwise there would be no point in playing a jester.
(In fact I highly suspect there is no point in it period and stacking webs is far more powerful than Jester's song. :P)
Executive Summary: Angelo completes some miscellaneous tasks.
As he made his way North, Angelo decided he should do the BG:EE equivalent of chores, whipped out his 'to do' list and promptly ticked them off one by one:
These tasks could have been completed as soon as Angelo had acquired Invisibility, but for the purposes of having something to write about in Chapter 3, I delayed describing them. The hand of the producer is strong in this one.
Drizzt
Edmund Burke popularised the expression, 'All it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing' and Angelo decided to test this principle (being Lawful Evil, Angelo quite fanced triumph and was prepared to be good and do nothing to get it). Sneaking around Fisherman's Lake, he activated one or two gnolls without alerting Drizzt to his presence. Since the gnolls couldn't see him, they went for the next best thing, a drow ranger vastly more powerful than them. Still, since he hadn't been activated, then he should just stand defenceless and it'll only be a matter of time before he succumbed.
Angelo minimised the game, had a cup of tea and waited.
To his alarm, when Angelo returned and looked at the UI, he saw that Drizzt had somehow killed his attackers. Perhaps this tactic was not as failsafe as he'd thought. If Drizzt had proceeded to kill all the gnolls, then this was disastrous: no way would Angelo beat Drizzt in a fair fight, he could barely beat an Xvart! Still invisible, Angelo swept a circle around where he thought Drizzt would be, being careful to discover any surrounding gnolls while not activating the dark elf himself. As Angelo had hoped, Drizzt had only erroneously killed the gnolls that had been roused into attacking him, so it was simply a case of activating the remainder and waiting some more.
Luring the gnolls away before coming back for the loot, Angelo sheathed Icingdeath. Together with his Helm of Defence and Ring of Fire Resistance, he was totally immune to fire (once he remembered to take Gorion's belt off). Angelo had a feeling that this would be absolutely crucial in the adventures to come.
Gnoll Stronghold
Having only 14 Charisma, Angelo wasn't as beach body ready as he'd like to be. Figuring that reading a book, rather than doing some pressups, would solve this problem, Angelo went to the library in the Gnoll Stronghold. The tome he desired was in the forbidden section, so he sneaked in invisibly to borrow it. Quickly exiting the cave to avoid being surrounded, Angelo also had a brief chat to Dynaheir. She was excited to see a friendly face, but her relief turned to disappointment when she was abandoned after Angelo received 800 XP for her rescue.
Neera
As Shoal had already proven, Angelo could not resist a damsel in distress. And as Drizzt has already proven, he's also a coward. When the invaders followed through on their threats to try and take the girl, Angelo had a change of heart. He ducked behind Neera as the wizard prepared his acid arrow and the guards approached with their sharp looking swords. Neera only had 4 HP, but that'd be one less hostile spell sent Angelo's way.
"Fantastic!" Angelo cried as he saw Neera's HP never fall below 1, despite getting dissolved and hacked to pieces. As long as he stayed behind her shooting arrows, none of the opposition targeted him and were mown down by the indestructible wild mage. In fact, were it not far an awkward script that occasionally fired where Neera would strike up conversation mid-battle asking to join the party (why she would want to do this when it removed her invincibility was anyone's guess), Angelo would have had minimised and had another cup of tea.
As it happened, Neera asked to join the party after the battle had ended, which Angelo allowed... and kicked her out as soon as he'd taken her gem bag. He let her keep her robe and staff, though, because he was a gentleman.
Some people have described how they killed Neera and looted the gem bag from her body to avoid recruiting her. At least in my install, Neera is unkillable before her initial script fires (so I can't shoot her down before she summons Elkandor... even the Ctrl+Y cheat doesn't work!) and the gem bag doesn't appear in the lootable belongings. In any case, I've already broken the 'strictly' solo rule by hiring/dumping Dynaheir for the 800XP. I'll count some extra sheep tonight in recompense.
Black Alaric's Cave
Now that Angelo had his beach body, he also wanted to ensure that he could down as many shots as possible in Faerun's many nightclubs. As with his Charisma, Angelo knew of a book that he could read all about improving his Constitution. Sneaking past the pesky sirines and the flesh golem bouncers, Angelo decided that he preferred the Glyph of Warding and Magic Missile traps he'd encounter by going right in Black Alaric's Cave, rather than the Hold Person and Dire Charm traps he'd encounter if he went left. Not that it really mattered since he disarmed them all anyway, but if he hadn't, he'd definitely have used the right corridor exclusively.
In addition to the Tome of Getting Buff Real Quick, Angelo pocketed the Wand of Paralyzation, which he knew would come in handy.
After a hard afternoon's questing, Angelo finished his day with the Friendly Arm Inn coming into sight. Tomorrow, he was looking forward to finishing off a few more assorted quests and meeting some bandits.
Oh no, sorry to hear about Flexi. I've definitely been exploiting the reload button to figure out my strategies so far. I get why some people do NR playthroughs, but it seems too risky to begin what would undoubtedly be a large time investment. It's not like Diablo 3 hardcore, when you can at least keep your Paragon levels and stashed loot on another character (not that I play that more either - internet connection's not stable enough). The challenge of figuring out what should be foolproof strategies, rather than their actual execution, is the most fun part for me.
Some people have described how they killed Neera and looted the gem bag from her body to avoid recruiting her. At least in my install, Neera is unkillable before her initial script fires (so I can't shoot her down before she summons Elkandor... even the Ctrl+Y cheat doesn't work!) and the gem bag doesn't appear in the lootable belongings.
I have a vague memory that Beamdog made her unkillable in that encounter as a result of complaints about the difficulty of keeping her alive. However, she should be killable if you don't activate the encounter in the first place, i.e. never get within speaking range. With SCS installed you can't do that with a single shot as a result of the mechanism that allows you to level her up once you've recruited her, but if you keep shooting she should go down (unless you've got some other mod installed that affects that).
Executive Summary: Angelo takes out Tarnesh, does a few more chores and sneaks through the Bandit Camp.
You know the drill about the Spoilers section by now.
Friendly Arm Inn
Taking out Tarnesh was always a chore, even more so on LoB. Felicity polymorphed into a mustard jelly behind the lip of the stairs while Angelo conversed with Tarnesh. Angelo's Invisibility spell finished just as Tarnesh's Horror spell turning him into a frightened child. Still, he was an invisible frightened child, and that was what mattered. Since Tarnesh couldn't target Angelo with his magic, he would inevitably waste all his spells on a magic-immune Felicity before Angelo ended the proceedings with a devastating backstab.
With SCS, Tarnesh’s Mirror Image casts instantly and his first spell is not necessarily Horror. His roster includes Charm Person and Magic Missile, which could potentially hit faster than Invisibility. In a NR playthrough, I’d either shoot Tarnesh once as he approached, then turn invisible - this introduces a short delay on Tarnesh casting his first spell which should allow you to vanish – or just attack directly with a polymorphed familiar and stay invisible throughout.
Much to Angelo's disappointment, Tarnesh squinted at Felicity before swinging at her with his quarterstaff. At first, this wasn't especially concerning to Angelo: this allowed the Horror spell to run its course and since Felicity was immune to normal weapons, Tarnesh's assault was of no consequence. It was a slightly different reaction to the monsters in the Nashkel Mines, but no less ineffective. Given that the commotion had attracted the local guards to fight his cause, Angelo expected the fight to be over soon enough.
However, he'd forgotten that the Friendly Arm Inn's guards were in equal need of target practice as those in Nashkel, as well as the fact that (as mustard jelly polymorphs are exclusively a ranged attacker) Felicity had a -8 penalty to hit in melee. At this rate, Felicity's polymorph would run out before the battle ended, enabling Tarnesh to magically smack her down before Angelo could intervene.
So Angelo decided to intervene early. Tarnesh's Mirror Images had expired and that back looked mighty tempting. Manoeuvering behind his prey, Angelo took aim and cut the wizard between the shoulder blades. "Argh!" Tarnesh grunted before whirling and releasing a bunch of Magic Missiles into his newly visible opponent. His growling expression turned more pained still when Angelo's frame absorbed them harmlessly.
"Cast the Shield spell before I attacked you," Angelo offered in explanation before his final blow. "It's a self-targeted buff, so it doesn't dispel Invisibility, you see."
Although this encounter played out as I've described, there has been some narrative embellishment. The polymorphed imp familiar and the guards could have killed Tarnesh on their own if required: although mustard jellies aren't fast movers, their attacks can slow and this enables some torturous kiting. I just wanted an excuse to wax lyrical about a technical detail of Invisibility in the name of completeness.
Having disposed of Tarnesh, Angelo bought Bentley's Buckler. Between this and the Tome of Getting Buff Real Quick, he now had 20 Constitution, and this meant (modest) regeneration. Apart from recovering HP effectively while resting and travelling between areas, this also afforded Angelo use of an exploit that he was sure he'd exhibit later. For good measure, he also recruited Khalid and Jaheira, stole their stuff, then kicked them out. He needed every potion of invisibility he could get.
Ankheg Nest and Farmer Brun
First, Angelo raided the Ankheg Nest, then he went to Farmer Brun. Is everyone keeping up at the back?
Apart from another 1,500 XP, Angelo also gained a Wand of Fire. One of the nice things about Wands of Fire is that using charges on one mode (e.g. Fireball) does not deplete charges on the other (e.g. Azgannar’s Scorcher), although using up all the charges in either mode causes the wand to vanish regardless of how many remaining charges there are in the other. In any case, Angelo was mostly interested in boosting his area damage credentials.
The BG:EE wiki says that there are some bugged wands that do not do this. I’ll leave comment on those matters to people who know what they’re talking about.
Shopping
Next on the list was Ulgoth’s Beard, where Angelo purchased a lovely Greenstone Amulet. He didn’t kill Dushai, nor did he talk to Shandalar. He had plans for them later. Instead, he used his Greenstone Amulet to raid the Tome of Wisdom from Durlag’s Tower, lest he forgot. While he was at it, Angelo also went to the Carnival and bought a necklace of missiles. Now he had learned Shield, he didn’t need the Shield Amulet, but thought he should mention its existence to keep the completists happy.
Bandit Camp
Since he’d started playing LoB, Angelo’s favourite method of infiltrating the Bandit Camp was to meet Teven in Larswood. This allowed him to go through to the main tent without dealing with Ardenor Crush or Targousz Khosann, with the option to rest uninterrupted beforehand the cherry on top.
Throughout BG, whether vanilla or BG:EE, I’ve found bandits to be surprisingly tough. They always seem to manage to hit good ACs with bad rolls and have more HP than I would expect for unnamed opponents at this stage of the game. And, of course, the infamous waylay where you start surrounded by bandits peppering arrows is a major reason to travel invisible.
An invisible Angelo poked his head into the main tent. “Ugh,” he said to himself, as he saw several Black Talon Elites in addition to the customary foursome of Raemon, Britik, Venkt and Hakt. “More SCS ‘improvements’.” He weighed up his options. On the one hand, Hakt had a nice Longbow of Marksmanship and Venkt had the only non-random scroll of Spell Thrust in BG:EE… on the other, Angelo had specialised in shortbows (“Suffer now,” he told himself, “to reap the rewards in BG2!”) and perhaps he’d be able to find another copy of Spell Thrust in SoD…
Black Talon Elites carry the same warning as bandits, only more so.
“Discretion is the better part of valour,” Angelo told himself as he opened the chest at the back (again with the bosses and ostentatious containers!). The Boots of Grounding absorbed most of the shock of the Lightning Bolt trap and Angelo had already started casting Invisibility before Raemon’s dialogue initiated. This ate into the group’s collective reaction time and just as they’d found the wherewithal to attack, Angelo disappeared again.
Wasting no time, Angelo scuttled out of the Bandit Camp. Maybe he would return when he was stronger, maybe he wouldn’t. What he did know is that his next destination was Cloakwood.
Postscript: News Just In
Turns out that in my install, if you try to come back to the Bandit Camp after you've removed the Chapter 4 scrolls from the main tent, the entrance to the main tent is magically sealed off: you cannot get in and its inhabitants will not come out (although I've also tested it with a Chapter 3 save and they don't exit the main tent as advertised then either). This is pretty annoying: since a F/M/T can only reach level 6/6/7 in BG:EE, your memorised offensive spells (excluding summons) are shut down by Minor Globe of Invulnerability. Had I known, I would have handled that section differently. But you live and learn. Angelo will continue without Spell Thrust for now - it's not essential in BG:EE by any means.
Executive Summary: Angelo tests out the Cloak of Non-Detection to kill Drasus et al.
This post is self-indulgent, even by my standards. But the tactics are quite finnicky to describe and, heck, I had fun writing it.
Arrival at the Mines
As Angelo approached Cloakwood, he reflected that, apart from part 2 (with the spiders), it always seemed like a bit of a non-event. For whatever reason, Angelo had never felt much enthusiasm for weeding out shadow druids and whatnot. With LoB making the avoidance most non-essential encounters highly desirable, Angelo felt a lot less guilty about skipping the majority of it. Coran may be the best NPC in BG:EE, but since Angelo didn't need his services, going wyvern hunting seemed a bit surplus to requirements.
What was not optional, however, was tracking down Gurke's Cloak of Non-Detection in the first area. This was mainly a case of casting Blind and archery, but the reactions of the tasloi to being blinded were frustratingly mixed. Most stood around helplessly, but some started running wildly all over the map. "Very annoying," Angelo complained as he ended the final critter's flailing.
From there, it was plain-sailing throughout Cloakwood. Angelo rescued Chelak's body from Centeol, hearing her plight about Jon Icarus Irenicus and wondered whether this was foreshadowing anything. He did this by first luring the two sword spiders out, turning invisible the instant he exited and going back in before dashing back out with the goods. He had worried whether the external sword spiders would have blocked his retreat in the meantime, but fortunately, they stand stationary when deactivated... and since Angelo hadn't moved from the exit the first time, there was still an Angelo-shaped hole when he left.
He also retrieved a potion of invulnerability from Laskal on his way. He wasn't in the mood for completing much of the map, but if friendly druids are just giving things away...
Preparing the Battlefield
Finally, the Cloakwood Mines lay ahead. Angelo lured the guards away from the connecting bridge before blinding them. Luckily, these ones stood nice and still without flapping around. From there, he scanned his surroundings while invisible, formulating a plan of attack. These bounty hunters looked stronger than the previous ones and he wanted a foolproof plan.
Although I'm trying to play 'elegantly' here - not killing more than I need and so on - it might be simpler to just kill the guards. In some tests, blinded Genthore went on walkabout and the last thing you want mid-chase is to encounter guards whose Blind has worn off. Blind Drasus is far worse, since he can sprint off and you lose him, having to trek all over the map in the hope of bumping into him or waiting embarrassingly for him to randomly loop back... and unlike Genthore, whose stuff is nice-but-inessential, Drasus' Boots of Speed are the best boots in the game (and can't be pickpocketed, sadly). So he need to die, preferably without too much hassle.
To begin with, Angelo made the arena his own. Nipping into the large house in the bailey, Angelo lured the two downstairs guards upstairs and out of the way, using Invisibility to leave them stranded. The same principle applied to the guard offering the Black Lotus in the hut beyond the bounty hunters, except Angelo just killed him this time. Elegance be damned, he needed these two areas empty.
Kysus Finds Angelo a Charming Man
Sizing him up, Angelo could tell that Kysus was a nasty opponent, complete with multiple Monster Summoning casts, two Magic Missiles and Blindnesses, a single Chromatic Orb and Vitriolic Sphere... as well as a pair of Melf's Acid Arrows in a sequencer, all of which could make Angelo's life miserable. He also had several defensive spells, so Angelo doubted his ability to take the conjurer out quickly. On the other hand, as an enchanter, Rezdan only has CC and defensive spells in his repertoire, all of which (apart from one cast of Slow and Monster Summoning II, along with twin Rays of Enfeeblement in his sequencer) could be blocked by the Greenstone Amulet.
Angelo's mind was made up: although he was too low level to reliably tank Kysus' spells, if he could get Kysus out of the way, then the Greenstone Amulet could take care of the rest.
Nipping out of the Black Lotus hut invisibly, Angelo considered his options. Both mages began neutral (as long as Drasus didn't see Angelo), but each would turn hostile on attempted blinding (rather than stay neutral allowing multiple attempts), so there was no guarantee that would work. However, although Angelo manually casting Charm Person would elicit the same reaction, casting it using his Ring of Human Influence did not... and combined with invisible resting, this gave Angelo a free charm on Kysus.
I said before that I wouldn't abuse Algernon's Cloak, and the Ring of Human Influence is basically the diet version. Although I'm sure I could have come up with another method, this was the first that sprang to mind. So far in my (unwrittenup) playthrough, I haven't used charm since and, if possible, I don't intend on using it again. But as I've also said before... no trick is too low for Angelo!
Even with this, Angelo knew that there was a hint of nuance in getting Kysus to die properly. For instance, he knew that summoning loads of monsters before attacking the rest of the group (to 'get his charm's worth') was not a good strategy, as one cast of Chaos from Rezdan would nullify the whole thing. Furthermore, Angelo didn't want Kysus to die before he'd had a chance to unleash all his good stuff, so Kysus was made to cast some defensive spells (not too many... Angelo didn't want him surviving past the charm' duration!) before unleashing the hurt. Finally, Angelo was sure to activated his non-Invisibility-breaking Greenstone Amulet: he needed to keep Kysus in sight to control him, but didn't want to get caught in an area of effect from Rezdan, since if he broke his invisibility by attacking while confused, he was a dead man.
His protections in place, Angelo ordered Kysus to fire his sequencer at Rezdan and watched the fireworks show. Despite some vague waffle in the Charm Person description about charmed enemies not doing things against their instincts, Kysus promptly fired his spells off, effecting the assault of Drasus and Genthore. Rezdan could smell something was up and tried to cast Detect Invisibility, but Angelo's cloak did its job and shielded him from the scrying attempt. Kysus looked almost pleadingly in Angelo's direction as he was sliced and diced by his former friends, but Angelo stood motionless and emotionless, waiting for the conjurer to die.
Catch Me If You Can
Once Kysus' blood was dripping from Drasus' morning star, Angelo began the next phase. Making sure his Greenstone Amulet protection was still functioning, he came out from hiding, Icingdeath swishing across Drasus' shoulderblades and adding further crimson to the red-tinged grass. And yet before Drasus could turn to retaliate, Angelo was away, barrelling towards the Black Lotus hut. As he did so felt, his limbs suddenly felt weary: Rezdan's Ray of Enfeeblement sequencer had caught him. Luckily, Angelo had accounted for this and drank the Potion of Hill Giant Strength from Durlag's Labyrinth (although any strength potion would have done, Angelo chose the least valuable he had).
Drasus and his flunkies gathered around the hut's exit. "You're trapped," he sneered.
Angelo was unconcerned. "It's just a pity none of you can get in here, then, isn't it?"
Drasus' voice acquired a new hint of doubt. "You have nowhere to run and nowhere to hide."
"Au contraire," purred Angelo, "I can Hide in Shadows right here, and I have as long as I want to make the Stealth check too."
The doubt in Drasus' refrain turned to full desparation. "You can't stay in there forever."
"You're right," Angelo said as he skulked into the shadows, "But I'll be out in a minute. And do you know the funny thing? When I leave the Black Lotus hut, I'll actually appear behind you, so you've not got me trapped in here after all."
Drasus’ voice was now barely a whisper. “Please don’t backstab me,” he whimpered.
Angelo's response was quieter still. "I'm afraid I can't promise that..."
Playing Switcheroo
Drasus roared in agony as Angelo's scimitar cut deep into his ribs. He swished wildly at Angelo, but nobody was there: Angelo was already on the move, this time towards the main house (the stooges having blocked off his return to the Black Lotus Hut). Again, Rezdan hurled his enchantments at Angelo and again they bounced off the Greenstone Amulet's warding. So poor was Genthore's reaction time, he was unable to launch an axe before Angelo was back inside the house. Although Drasus was doubly quick with his Boots of Speed, he fell foul of Zeno's paradox: as soon as he'd caught up with Angelo's previous position, Angelo had moved a little further away, and Drasus could never get long enough to land a hit before Angelo got to safety.
"I bet they're so stupid that they'll all pile around the entrance here, unable to come in," Angelo said to himself as he clicked Stealth mode as many times as he needed before it finally worked.
Happily, they were... and when Angelo's exit left him behind them, it turned out to be third time unlucky for Drasus.
Genthore was beginning to understand what was going on when Angelo ducked back towards the Black Lotus hut. "Are you going to keep doing this until we all die?"
Angelo laughed as he turned the corner. "And who said the Baldur's Gate AI was bad?"
Rezdan tried one last gambit. "I bet that Greenstone Amulet doesn't have that many charges left."
"Right," Angelo replied as he closed the door behind him, "but it's got enough to deal with all your spells."
He was right. In fact, once Genthore was down for the count and Angelo knew Rezdan was out of spells, he stopped bothering with all this backstab malarkey and took Rezdan out in a straight fight. Sure, Rezdan had Stoneskin and a Mirror Image or two, but nothing that some old fashioned hacking and a dash of Detect Illusion (the next thief skill that Angelo was focussing on) couldn't handle.
Angelo smirked as he tried on his new Boots of Speed. He hadn't even had to use Blind to get the better of them. His tactical smarts were growing... and not a moment too soon. He knew Davaeorn was looming, and taking him out would require all of Angelo's newly acquired nous.
Appendum: A Less Charming Method
After doing some tests, these tactics can be adapted to include Kysus in steps 3 and 4 by tinkering with step 2 to avoid charming. Tanking his spells yourself is possible, but complicated and prone to mistakes. An easier solution is to use the Wand of Monster Summoning (Angelo could use the one he found in Durlag's Labyrinth, but you can also raid The Valley of the Tombs) to create fodder to take the heat for you. Be sure to stand well away from the action (to avoid getting seen or caught in any areas of effect), send them in one by one (to soak up more spells) and wait for any residual Monster Summoning spells the bounty hunters cast to wear off before using another wand charge (their summons last longer than yours, so don't hesitate to send in the remainder of a previous wand charge).
I tend to initiate proceedings with a backstab, then retreat, sneak around them and begin my summoning assault, but squishy classes can lead with their monsters. Rezdan's sequencer can hurt a lot, so either have a protection scroll of Acid Resistance, several potions of healing or Mirror Image cast (in this case, he won't fire his sequencer). If he sees you, Rezdan will ignore your summoned forces and fire CC your way, so do not slack off too much with the Greenstone Amulet. Also do not let summoned ranged creatures attack Drasus et al prematurely - you, not your monsters, choose where the bounty hunters' attention is focussed. Finally, you can begin step 3 as soon as Kysus stops being a threat (i.e. when he runs out of spells... although dying also accomplishes this quite nicely).
Effectively, I've replaced the most pungent cheese in BG:EE (charm abuse) with one of its next strongest incarnations (summons abuse). In a way, this is kind of unsatisfying, but these are classic tactics for a reason... and it's not as if my previous techniques were any more honourable. Is it really cheese if the game doesn't let you succeed any other way? At the end of the day, the enemies' charms 'kill' a solo character on hit, and what's good for the goose...
Executive Summary: Angelo utilises his skills as a fighter, a mage and a thief to beat Davaeorn (without abusing charm).
Ditto the previous note about self-indulgence, finnicky tactics and so on.
Reaching Davaeorn
Angelo crept invisibly through the Cloakwood Mines, stopping to chat to the miner next to the river plug and Rill to release the miners (Angelo didn't care about their lives, but he did care about getting cheaper prices). Aside from this (and nicking some potions on the third level), Angelo skipped these encounters worthy of mention on his way to Davaeorn:
Hareishan: As an enchanter, she had only CC spells memorised, making her an attractive target, but her guards looked mean and Angelo would buy a scroll of Haste later.
Natasha: As an invoker, she had an array of nasty spells (not to mention her Chromatic Orb would only allow a +4 save bonus) and a single Potion of Invisibility wasn't rewarding enough to brave that.
Ogre Mage: Actually not too bad - the ogre mage was quite susceptible to Blind and had limited spells - but Angelo was trying to be economical with his play.
Upon reaching the final level, Angelo disarmed the traps, lured the battle horrors into the bedroom and dumped them there using Invisibility. Their immunities to missile weapons and most CC (although thankfully not Blind) made them an instant skip. They could swap stories with the senior guard, who was also abandoned there not to be heard from again.
Killing the Spares
Despite being invisible, Angelo was surprised that Davaeorn's script still fired, but he relaxed when the invoker took no further action. As he readied a plan of action, however, several guards trooped into the chamber from the level 3 stairway. Rather than initiate hostilities, Angelo waited to see if any more flunkies came in. After a while, the flow of incoming troops staunched, but there were loads of them. Fighting all of them would be a complete non-starter.
From his position near the lift back to level 1, Angelo produced the necklace of missiles he'd bought from the Nashkel Carnival from his backpack and began hurling fireballs into the central chamber from beyond the fog of war. If they wanted to play rough...
Davaeorn had 70% resistance to fire and excellent saving throws, so he shrugged off the incindeary assault. The assorted guards and Black Talon Elites were much vulnerable, but their collective HP from LoB was still considerable. Angelo almost exhausted his necklace of missiles, but he stopped on 1 charge (selling and buying it back would recharge it completely) and switched to the Wand of Fire. Most of the remaining survivors were unable to cope with this charring change and died a painful, burning death.
Davaeorn still stood tall, barely injured and angry. It would take more than eighteen fireballs to bring him down.
Soaking Up Davaeorn's Spells
"A coward's tactic," Davaeorn declared as he launched a lightning bolt straight at Angelo. Angelo didn't disagree: he hadn't picked up Kiel's Helmet from Durlag's Tower yet, so he wasn't immune to fear, far from it. He was fully aware that Davaeorn was a deadly opponent and had taken precautions... such as drinking a potion of insulation which, together with the Boots of Grounding, dissipated Davaeorn's lightning harmlessly.
The invoker's eyes both widened and narrowed as he saw his spell have no effect. "Have some of your own medicine," he sneered as he released a fireball.
"Most of your damaging magic is fire," Angelo replied. "Why do you think I went to such lengths to make myself immune to it?"
Davaeorn quickly found this became a running theme. Whatever he tried, Angelo had a counter:
He tried Chromatic Orb once, but Angelo had drunk his Potion of Invulnerability from Laskal to add +5 to his saving throws, negating the instant death effect.
He tried Snilloc's Snowball Swarm once, but before it hit, Angelo had strapped on Gorion's belt (removing it after, lest another fire spell burn him).
He tried Horror once, but found Angelo's mind warded by the Greenstone Amulet.
He tried Magic Missile twice, but they were all absorbed harmlessly by Angelo's Shield spell.
The only spell Davaeorn had any success with was a single Melf's Acid Arrow, but Protection from Acid scrolls were rare and so Angelo had resolved to just tank that. By timing his Cure Light Wounds properly, Angelo could reliably end the acid damage with around half health, which was good enough.
Making Some Bad Choices
Unfortunately, just as Davaeorn was discovering that Angelo was immune to his attacks, Angelo was discovering that Davaeorn was immune to his. The invoker's LoB AC was remarkably good, and combined with Stoneskin and Mirror Image, Angelo was making little headway. Worse, although Davaeorn's Protection from Normal Missiles had worn off and Angelo could try to take advantage of his bow's higher attack rate (switching back to Icingdeath whenever a fire spell came his way), Davaeorn's rapid attacks with Melf's Minute Meteors between spells were accurate and painful, even with fire immunity.
Angelo realised he had no choice and closed Davaeorn down for melee. This protection lasted a short time, was Davaeorn was unable to overcome the -8 penalty for attacking in melee with a ranged weapon. But once his spells, Melf Minute Meteors and darts were expended, Davaeorn switched to his staff where Angelo discovered another uncomfortable fact: he was a good melee fighter as well! While his Detect Illusion skill had dispelled any refreshed mirror images, the stone skins were still in place... a spell Angelo wished he had when Davaeorn smacked him with surprising ease.
"Does it pain you," Davaeorn gloated, "that as a wizard, I am still a better warrior than you, a fighter multiclass?"
Staggering back, Angelo rifled through his backpack looking for something else to use. He knew the invoker had 70% resistance to lightning, as well as fire, so both of those were out. Davaeorn's saving throws were also so good that a Wand of Paralyzation was not the safe bet it usually was. In such circumstances, the Wand of Frost was often a good fallback, so Angelo took aim and fired...
Davaeorn's cackle was pure malice as the beam of ice bounced off him and chilled Angelo to the bone. He'd forgotten about Davaeorn's Minor Spell Turning. To be honest, he thought that the Wand of Frost replicated Cone of Cold, a 5th level spell which should have overpower the 4 spell levels reflected by Minor Spell Turning, but obviously he was mistaken. He didn't know how many spell levels the Minor Spell Turning had left and hadn't the health to find out.
Upon reflection (see what I did there?), a nice way to deal with this would be to have memorised some Magic Missiles, as these could be safely bounced back onto Angelo since his Shield would absorb them.
Stealth is Always the Answer
The fight was not going according to plan, but Angelo was unwilling to throw in the towel. "You're right," he muttered through gritten teeth, "you are a better warrior and a wizard than me. But what you'll never, ever be is a better thief than me."
Davaeorn tittered, "And what do you mean by that, weak one?"
"My normal hits may be weak," Angelo retorted, "but you cannot fight what you cannot see or catch..." With that, he sprinted from the main chamber to the side chamber. Boosted by his Boots of Speed, Angelo knew that Davaeorn would be unable to keep up, affording him an opportunity to Hide in Shadows in the empty room before the invoker arrived.
"Your Stealth check failed," Davaeorn laughed as he turned the corner, "what now?"
"More of the same." Angelo continued around the circuit into the next open room, continuing his hiding attempts whenever the invoker was out of sight. He was quietly pleased to find that sometimes Davaeorn just gave up the chase and stood around waiting, but even if he did not, as long as Angelo did not alert the bedroom's occupants to his presence (he imagined, although he didn't want to, the senior guard and the battle horrors were having a nice ménage a trois), this tactic was a failsafe method of entering Stealth mode. And entering Stealth mode meant only one thing...
Davaeorn's AC became rather more manageable with the +4 attacking from Stealth bonus. The invoker frequently tried to renew his Mirror Image spells, but these were torn down by Detect Illusion. Slowly, one by one, the Stoneskin layers were stripped off and Davaeorn finally became vulnerable. It took a while, but Angelo was nothing if not patient.
"You didn't let me finish," Angelo remarked as his final blow took Davaeorn's head from his shoulders. "My normal hits may be weak, but you cannot fight what you cannot see or catch... and my backstabs are strong indeed."
Clearing Up
After looting Davaeorn's body, Angelo retrieved the Knock spell from the unlocked chest in the side passage, immediately went invisible and, after drinking some potions, learned it and all the other spells in Davaeorn's libraries and his repertoire. Repeatedly resting invisibly to memorise at least one Knock and one Invisibility, he plundered the valuables from the locked chests before heading to the surface and flooding the mines. That would make the ménage a trois awkward...!
Angelo looked northwards towards his next destination: the titular city of Baldur's Gate.
Executive Summary: Angelo completes the 'stealth-but-no-combat' in Baldur's Gate quests, including some thief-exclusives.
In contrast to my last few posts, this one is narration-light and content-heavy. I'll let you decide for yourselves whether this is a relief or a disappointment...
The sun was shining brightly as Angelo strode across Wyrm's Crossing and into Baldur's Gate. Saying he was an exotic nymph didn't evade the 6 GP tax, nor did it avoid summoning Scar, but Angelo signed up to investigating the Seven Suns anyway, because what else was he going to do?
Quests - 44,900 XP
Plenty, actually. Angelo knew that there was 44,900 XP (i.e. over a quarter of the XP cap!) available for 'stealth-but-no-combat' quests in Baldur's Gate:
'Universal' Quests - 36,400 XP
Quests Not Involving Charm - 21,400 XP
Arkion (East BG) - 1,800 XP
Brevlik (Elfsong Tavern, East BG) - 5,500 XP
Gax'xir the Seer (Blade & Stars) - 1,000 XP
Ghorak (BG Docks) - 1,000 XP
Noralee (BG Docks) - 1,000 XP
Scar (South West BG) - 1,000 XP {get the Seven Sun dopplegangers to reveal their identities, then flee and refuse to go back and kill them; Scar's ogre mage quest is totally optional and completing reconnaissance on the Iron Throne for Duke Eltan gives 2,000 GP, but no XP}
Fergus (South West BG) - 800 XP
Varci Roaringhorn (West BG) - 5,000 XP {getting the body from Jalantha costs 2,000 GP - it cannot be pickpocketed - but you get 2,000 GP as a reward; if you do this, do not initiate the Marek and Lothander quest until after you have bought the body}
Ragefast & Abelea (West BG) - 2,000 XP
Petrine and Noralee (North BG) - 500 XP {you can also kill the cat (it has 90% physical resistance, but does not retaliate) after giving Petrine the Angel Skin Ring for another 400 XP... Angelo decided he wasn't that desperate for XP/heartless!}
Larze (North East BG) - 900 XP
Rinnie (Central BG) - 900 XP
Quests Involving Charm - 15,000 XP
Lothander and Marek - 15,000 XP {ask Jalantha to give you the Geas removal scroll, then flee (the priestesses won't leave the temple; charm Marek (using Algernon's Cloak or Ring of Human Influence, else he turns hostile if you fail) and he'll give you the second half of the antidote without a fight. Both the scroll and Marek's antidote can be pickpocketed (Lothander's antidote cannot), but Jalantha and Marek are C/T and M/T respectively, so you'll need >100% PP to guarantee success}
Quests Requiring a Thief or Familiar - 8,500 XP
Pick Pocket Required (could substitute a thief for a familiar) - 4,500 XP
Ordulinian (East BG) - 3,500 XP {you need to pickpocket Arkion's amulet and Nemphre's ring; giving Nemphre Arkion's ring will grant 1,000 XP, but you then cannot pickpocket Arkion's amulet from her and so cannot complete Ordulinian's quest without combat}
Brielbara (North East BG) - 1,000 XP {you need to pickpocket Yago's Book of Curses}
Thief Required (cannot substitute a thief for a familiar) - 4,000 XP
Alatos (East BG) - 4,000 XP {non-thieves can complete this quest, but since only thieves are offered Narlen's quests, only non-thieves can complete this without combat; non-thieves may as well not complete this, since in Chapter 7, most of the thieves' guild's occupants (including Resar) will be dead and their corpses can be safely looted}}
This was one reason why Angelo didn't sweat too much about early combats. No need to grind hard for XP when you could sneak past most opponents and then the game just hurls XP at you for doing almost nothing. The other reason, of course, was that he was lazy. Because Angelo was trying not to abuse charm, he refused to complete the relevant Universal Quest using this method. However, this would still leave him with 29,900 XP (nearly 20% of the XP cap!) without having to fight anything.
Picking Pockets
Of course, two of the three thief quests would involve picking pockets, a skill which Angelo had neglected until now. However, Angelo gulped down two of his Potions of Master Thievery and suddenly his Pick Pockets skill jumped past 100%, which was more than enough for what he had in mind (he didn't know what PP% he'd need to guarantee pickpocketing Jalantha or Marek, but he didn't intend on risking it). Still, it would be a pity to blow two potions of Master Thievery on 4,500 XP... surely there must be some other items that Angelo could filch during the 3 hours where he was a sleight-of-hand supremo?
Since his imp familiar was 13th century technology, Angelo used his virtual assistant Felicity to access https://pihwiki.bgforge.net/Baldur's_Gate:_Ultimate_Pickpocket_Reference to check out pickpocketing opportunities. Discounting miscellaneous fluff, Angelo picked out some (subjective) highlights:
'Essential' Pick Pockets (Otherwise Difficult to Obtain)
Amulet of Missiles - Delorna (Oberon's Estate, Central BG)
Wand of Paralyzation & Spider Spawn scroll - Niemann (Sorcerous Sundries, East BG)
Potion of Invulnerability - William Garst (Sorcerous Sundries, East BG)
Wand of Polymorphing - Voltine (North West BG)
Ring of Wizardry - Sunin (South West BG)
'Nice Pick Pockets' (Saves You Some Hassle)
Cloak of Balduran - Quenash (Undercellar, North East BG) {by positioning yourself next to her in Chapter 7, you can 'trick' her into being killed without reputation loss by a Cloudkill from Krystin, so don't sweat this}
Nymph Cloak - Halbazzer Drin (Sorcerous Sundries, East BG) {this only costs 100 GP with the nymph hair from Abelea, so isn't a big deal either}
Redundant Pick Pockets (You'll Get These Anyway!)
Cloak of Non-Detection - Ordulinian (Sorcerous Sundries, East BG) {if you can pickpocket him, you may as well complete the relevant Thief Quest and he'll give you it}
Wand of Lightning - Brevlik (Elfsong Tavern, East BG) {complete the relevant Universal Quest and he'll give you it}
Minor Sequencer scroll, Ring of Free Action & Wand of Lightning - Alai (Iron Throne, BG Docks) {if you're going to sneak past this, this becomes an 'Essential' Pick Pocket!}
Vocalise scroll - Naaman (Iron Throne, BG Docks) {ditto, although with considerably less priority}
Wand of Lightning & Fireshield: Red scroll - Resar (Thieves' Guild, East BG) {just loot his corpse after the relevant Thief Quest}
While each of these targets began neutral (if they were initially hostile, they couldn't be pickpocketed), but Angelo had to approach several of them while in Stealth mode (else they would initiate dialogue on sight/contact and turn immediately hostile) and then run away afterwards.
This complication aside, he systematically completed the 'Thief Quests' and 'Universal Quests Not Involving Charm'. He decided that he would not pickpocket Alai or Naaman since he wanted to kill the Iron Throne inhabitants personally - a decision that he would later come to regret - but we're getting ahead of ourselves... before we describe Angelo's escapades with the Iron Throne, we have the small matter of getting poisoned and how Angelo resolved the outstanding 'Universal Quest Not Involved Charm'...
If it was not obvious already, I've set this up as an aide-memoire to myself (and others) for all of the available 'stealth-but-no-combat' quests in this part of the game. If I think of any others (or, more likely, someone else reminds me!), I'll edit them into the post. This won't affect the rest of the narrative (e.g. if someone reminds me of a 5,000 XP quest, I'd change the totals in this post from their original value of 44,900 XP to 49,900 XP, but the story will continue as if Angelo had only earned 44,900 XP).
btw does anyone know if u can do the chess part of durlags tower Legit kill all of em for the xp ? i dont see a way to beat them as a group ( i always charm the king and go invis ,,, and let the enemy deal with the king)
I completed it last night in a roundabout (quite literally) manner. If that doesn't give it away, I'll describe my method when I get to it in Angelo's adventures... although I don't obey your criteria to the letter, I do in spirit in that I don't use charm at any point.
Part 12: Angelo Completes Lothander and Marek's Quest 'with Geas' (Edited for Accuracy)
Executive Summary: Angelo kills the Bitch Queen by fighting dirty and kills Marek by fighting dirtier still.
Can everyone join in a moment's collective silence for quite how groanworthy the pun in the title was?
Setting the Scene
Three hours, many items and 44,900 XP later, the sun was still shining on Baldur's Gate. As it slipped into early afternoon, Angelo meandered past the Counting House into NE Baldur's Gate, whereupon he stumbled upon an unlikely pairing... or was it them who stumbled onto him?
"Stop meddling in the Iron Throne's affairs," Marek growled.
"Honestly, gentlemen," Angelo insisted, "I desire only the minimum interaction with the Iron Throne that the game's plot will allow." This was a lie, as Angelo was already planning how he'd take down Zhalimar Cloudwulfe et al, but he knew what he should say (and what, in future playthroughs, he would do).
"Enough," Marek gasped with a wave of his hand as he skulked off. "Just quit it, okay." Lothander followed, rather more quickly than in vanilla BG... obviously his Boots of Speed were an Enhanced Edition addition. Had Angelo been in a party, this would have earmarked Lothander for certain death, but he was playing solo and had killed Drasus, so he let it pass.
Barely 10 seconds later, when Angelo just happened to be wandering central Baldur's Gate, he ran into Lothander again. Entering the diviner's tent as directed, the wise old sage looked him in the eye. "What question would you like answered for your 50 GP fee?"
"In vanilla BG, was there a legitimate way to kill Scar? He was immune to everything but magic missiles... and I once had a party of six 9th level invokers waste all their spells and wands to no avail."
"You're not as funny as you think you are," the diviner sighed.
"Fine, how do you cure Lothander of his Geas?"
"Meh, I dunno," the diviner shrugged. "Go ask Jalantha Mistmyr."
"You're not as funny as you think you are either," Angelo snapped as he left the tent.
Angelo's Glory Blinds the Ladies of Tymora
Despite Angelo paying 50GP for an audience, Jalantha also refused to co-operate without receiving a Tome of Wisdom. Angelo was getting fed up with paying fees to not get the service he'd wanted. "That's life," he muttered as he talked Chanthalas Ulbright into giving up the book. "Perhaps I could just ask Jalantha for the scroll, then refuse to give her the book in return," Angelo mused to himself. "If she needs a Tome of Wisdom in the first place, she'd probably fall for that."
Angelo decided that he'd just kill Jalantha and take the Geas scroll (and Tremain's son's body, if he hadn't already completed Varci Roarington's quest) from her body. To do this, he'd need to stop the other priestesses from ganging up on him: apart from multiple Hold Person casts, one of them had a nasty Animate Dead spell. As priestesses, their saves v spell were terrible, but for some reason, they didn't turn hostile if they didn't make their save. Better yet, whenever one priestess turned hostile, she did not alert the other priestesses. This allowed Angelo to blind each one individually, which was very helpful.
Curiously, the priestess with Animate Dead started casting it immediately upon being blinded. Even more curiously, it was not the tough-as-nails skeleton warrior that a priestess of her LoB-enhanced level should have summoned, but a weak skeleton that even Angelo could beat without too much hassle. Picking a bone with this skeleton, Angelo proceeded to blind all 5 ladies of Tymora. Now all that remained was their leader...
The Battle Lasts Too Long...
Unsurprisingly, Jalantha did not appreciate Angelo's blade in her back and retaliated by hurling multiple spells, all of which were cancelled by Angelo walking out the temple's door. Since she didn't follow, Angelo tried to use his regular hit-and-fade techniques. Popping in to fire an arrow before ducking back out drained Jalantha of several spells, but Angelo missed an important shot and she managed to cast Cure Disease on one of the priestesses. Apparently, this spell also cured Blind as well, because suddenly Angelo had another opponent to deal with.
Switching tactics, Angelo hoped to try and repeatedly backstab Jalantha using hit-and-fade, but he realised he'd made a mistake by choosing to fight in the early afternoon. In BG:EE, attempting to Stealth outdoors in broad daylight cuts your Stealth success rate by 1/2 (whereas trying to Stealth indoors in lit condition incurs a penalty of 1/3). Angelo's Stealth percentage was so low that even when he stood in a shadowy corner, it took so long to Stealth that he could not get Jalantha's health down quickly enough (her AC wasn't amazing, but not too shabby either).
Worse, as a C/T herself, Jalantha could also Stealth... and her skills were much better. Angelo would often leave the temple, Stealth and come back in to find that she'd completely disappeared. He could not maintain Stealth mode and Detect Illusions simultaneously, not that this mattered since Jalantha's thief skills were classed as non-magical (i.e. not an illusion), so he couldn't have detected her with 100% DI (much less the 75% he currently had). The only saving grace was that, as a C/T, she didn't have many options to backstab him with - since she used a flail, rather than a quarterstaff or club, she'd picked one of the ineffective ones - but it was still irritating to be fed his own medicine.
Rather embarrassingly, as a result of this, his Blind spells were beginning to wear off (they 'only' lasted 4 hours). Angelo knew that he couldn't reliably maintain door hopping if all the priestesses awakened: even if they had no spells, they would crowd the door, surrounding him. Angelo's health was already running low, but he knew that he couldn't rest to heal, else everyone would also have full spells and still be hostile upon his return. This battle had been pretty straightforward without SCS - Angelo was screwing it up badly!
...So Make It Last Even Longer
Outside, Angelo had a brainwave. Although he had no healing spells left himself and was loathe to use healing potions or shell out for an actual temple to cure him, he did have Bentley's Buckler, which would rocket his Constitution to 20... and regeneration. It would take a while, but Angelo didn't mind waiting. After all, patience had beaten Davaeorn and although Jalantha was also worth 6,000 XP, she was a far lesser opponent.
Having regenerated sufficiently, Angelo strode back into the temple with new tactics. As predicted, the priestesses had surrounded the door, but he ran around the walkways, luring them away and opening the avenue of escape. Taking potshots at Jalantha, Angelo made for the door as soon as she disappeared into the shadows. He stopped short of the exit, allowing Jalantha the possibility of hitting him should she desire, but Angelo's overriding concern was not to allow himself to get surrounded... and standing right next to the exit ensured that he could always escape if required. If things got too hairy, he could always regenerate outside before coming back in for another round.
Jalantha's Stealth prolonged the combat, but she couldn't do enough with it to end the battle decisively. Eventually, she was cut down by Angelo's vicious scimitar and he snatched the Geas scroll before leaving the shocked princesses to clean up his mess.
Dealing With Marek the Easy Way
Angelo was in a pensive mood when he took Lothander's vial and made for the Blushing Mermaid. If his last two battles had taught him anything, it was that fighting wizards was dangerous and fighting thieves was also dangerous, so there was no way he was going to fight a M/T (even if he was a F/M/T himself!). The word 'fight' implied a trading of blows, which was not a word Angelo would use to describe the encounter he had in mind...
Positioning himself by the entrance of the alcove, Angelo released a blast from his Wand of Paralysation at the initially neutral Marek. Immediately hiding in the storeroom so that Marek couldn't register where he was, Angelo checked the UI to see if it had worked. If it hadn't, Angelo planned to cast Invisibility, run away, rest and turned the following day to do basically the same thing. If he'd continued the fight, he knew Marek would Stealth while Angelo was out of his sight, erect his defences and go to town with Chromatic Orb and backstabbing. This way, Marek would initially be hostile, but his script would have reset and if Angelo sneaked back into the alcove while invisible, there was no way that Marek could stop Angelo from either initially stunning him or running out of charges (although given Marek's brace of Charm Persons in his sequencer, support from the Greenstone Amulet may be required).
As it happened, the -4 to Marek's save versus wands was enough and and the blast stopped him clean in his tracks first try. Angelo knew he only had 10 rounds to finish Marek off: he couldn't guarantee a second successful stun and if Marek managed to get his defences up, Angelo would have to start again. Angelo also knew that casting Blind before leisurely finishing Marek off wouldn't work either. Even if he saved his saving throw, as soon as the stun wore off, the globe would automatically kick in and its immunity to level 1-3 spells would somehow disable the Blind that had already been applied, along with further paralysation attempts.
Using the Invisibility that he'd reserved to escape if necessary, Angelo guaranteed himself a successful backstab. Inbetween sword slashes, he released Magic Missiles, wanting to cause as much damage as quickly as possible...
Angelo had 1.5 attacks/round with his scimitars doing a minimum of 11 damage each time, so the minimum damage over a turn would be 10 x 11 x 1.5 = 165.
Replacing one attack with a backstab of minimum 3 x 11 = 33 would guarantee at least 165 - 11 + 33 = 187 damage.
Every Magic Missile cast summons 3 missiles with a minimum of 2 damage per missile. Hence, with 8 Magic Missile spells available, the minimum Magic Missile damage would be 8 x 2 x 3 = 48.
Altogether, this 187 + 48 = 235 damage is 2 short of Marek's LoB health of 237 HP... but with your familiar also attacking (which you will have as an arcane caster, else you can't use the wand), you can guarantee his demise.
"The term 'trading blows' implies a two-way interaction," Angelo remarked to Felicity as he finished Marek off, "and that's the last thing I want."
Combining Marek's and Lothander's antidotes, Angelo felt the 15,000 XP ripple through his body (Angelo actually had to physically drink them this time... back in vanilla BG, simply having both in your inventory was enough!). Together with the Eagle Bow he'd taken from Marek, he felt stronger than before. Strong enough to take on the Iron Throne!
Executive Summary: Using a full array of cheap tricks, Angelo kills all of Sarevok's associates.
Fair warning: the narrative approach is back and bigger than before. There are lots of tricky details in this fight and although it's not really possible to give an 100% reliable method for a battle with this many opponents (without using charm, of course), there are enough strategies here to adapt to any situation.
As he ascended the Iron Throne headquarters, Angelo was beginning to rethink his vow to take down their flunkies. He'd read in the Tome of Wisdom/SCS readme that Kaalos the thief, Gardush the berserker and Shennara the F/T had been added to this battle... as if Alai the F/M, Zhalimar Cloudwulfe the berserker, Diyab the C/T, Aasim the F/C, Naaman the enchanter and Emissary Tar the doppelganger weren't enough!
However, in the words of Olenna Tyrell, who knew a thing about the Iron Throne, "Once the cow's been milked, there's no squirting the cream back up her udder, so here we are to see things through."
Arranging the Battlefield
As usual, Angelo used Stealth to survey the battleground without Zhalimar. Going up the right set of stairs, he picked the corner by the initially neutral Aasim and Diyab. From here, he could cast Blind on Aasim first, then Diyab, since neither turned hostile if they made their save (being careful to stay in the corner, else Shennara may have backstabbed him prematurely).
Aasim doesn't turn hostile if he fails his save... ... and neither does Diyab!
Unfortunately, Alai, Naaman and Gardush - the other associates worth blinding that you can potentially see without Zhalimar spotting you - do turn hostile if you attempt to Blind them. Angelo's priority was to disable Aasim: it would be nice to blind Diyab, but Angelo knew, for reasons that would become apparent, he would rather keep one Blind spell in reserve than to spend them all on Diyab (although if Aasim made all of his saving throws, Angelo would abandon the attempt and come back after resting).
Angelo's next move was to go back to the original corner by the right stairs. Despite the fact that Aasim and Diyab were blinded, Stealth check modifiers are made based on what you characters see, rather than the other way around. Hence, since Angelo could see the now hostile-but-motionless pair, he would automatically fail his Stealth check... so to avoid tipping off Zhalimar, he'd have to cast Invisibility before moving. Fancy footwork.
Angelo then cast Mirror Image on himself (which didn't dispel Invisibility) and then Blind on Emissary Tar. Angelo knew that blinding Emissary Tar would have no ultimate consequence: even if she died before Zhalimar was activated, she would be reborn as a doppelganger as soon as combat started.
This is only to illustrate the doppelganger rebirth and doesn't form part of the narrative.
However, while the doppelganger was disguised, it also inherited the saving throws of the commoner it was impersonating, so the Blind was guaranteed to be successful. What the spell did do was to make Angelo visible without causing Zhalimar et al to swarm in. A 'swarm' would imply multiple enemies, whereas there was only one person whose attention Angelo wanted to attract...
Getting the First Two Kills
Sure enough, Shennara (who was initially invisible) couldn't resist the bait and tried to backstab Angelo, but her blade cut harmlessly through one of his mirror images. And now that she was visible, Angelo had no intention of letting her go back into Stealth mode. The best way to do that was to paralyse them and the best way to do that was to use the Wand of Paralysation...
It's easy not to bother casting Mirror Image before you blind Emissary Tar and hope to tank Shennara's first backstab. But if she saves against your first charge and you have to wait until the next round to try again, you'll be glad of those mirror images!
Once Shennara fell back, stunned, Angelo knew he had 10 rounds to hack her to pieces. Unfortunately, Angelo could neither maneouvre behind her to backstab nor (else he risked alerting the others) nor had he the space to summon Felicity for assistance. Since all his 1st level spells were filled with Blind, he also couldn't rely on Magic Missiles for further damage. However, he could still guarantee the kill without using any potions or other charges...
Angelo initially has 1.5 attacks/round with Icingdeath, doing a minimum of 11 damage per attack.
Angelo equipped the Scimitar +2 that he found in Cloakwood Nest. This adds 1 attack/round, doing a minimum of 10 damage per attack. Any penalties arising from Angelo's lack of dual-wielding proficiency are engligible since attacks on stunned targets always hit.
The minimum damage that dual-wielding Angelo would do in the first 2 rounds would be (1.5 x 11 x 2) + (10 x 2) = 53.
Haste (from Sorcerous Sundries) lasts for 3 rounds + 1round/level. Angelo was a 5th level mage, so it would last for 8 rounds. Casting it at the start of the third combat round (and attacking as soon as it's complete) gives Angelo 2 attacks/round with Icingdeath for the remainder of the stun.
The minimum damage that dual-wielding, hasted Angelo would do in the last 8 rounds would be (2 x 11 x 8) + (10 x 8) = 256.
Hence, the minimum total damage over the 10 round stun would be 256 + 53 = 309 HP, which is more than Shennara's 263 HP.
As predicted, Shennara could not withstand the sustained assault.
Depending on his exact positioning by the stairs, Angelo knew this death might occur with Aasim (and perhaps Niyab) in his sight... luckily, with his earlier blinding, the death didn't occur in theirs.
Subsequent testing has shown that, contrary to my expectation, none of the associates except Zhalimar care if you slaughter Shennara or Kaalos in their sight. This allows you the option of casting Detect Invisibility right away to dispel their Stealth (they start off hostile).
Shennara and Kaalos start on either sides of the potplants.
Since they start off hostile, but can't Stealth in your line of sight (and won't deliberately move out of it), they'll walk over to you to be stunned and beaten as above. Of course, during this playthrough, Angelo wasn't aware of this possibility...
Wasting not and wanting not, Angelo then proceeded to shoot Aasim to death. Strangely, whereas Angelo knew the associates would immediately would run to Diyab's defence, it was only upon Aasim's death that they roused themselves. Angelo was prepared for this, though, and cast his second Invisibility (he'd stolen the Amulet of Metaspell Influence from Razamith, so he had three level 2 spells).
Figuring two Iron Throne flunkies was enough for one day, Angelo retreated to the balcony and set himself to memorise 3 Invisibility spells. He also released Felicity from his backpack before resting: although her description claimed she could cast Polymorph Self 1/day, she only regained her spell if she was not in Angelo's inventory when he rested, and Angelo knew she would play a crucial part in the events to come...
Fiery Armageddon
Angelo had to break his invisibility to talk to Felicity and put her back into his pack. Making as many Stealth checks as required, he re-entered the 5th floor and made for the bedroom at the back at the end of the corridor. Once inside the room, Felicity was duly released and she cast Polymorph Self. Angelo then cast Invisibility on her and she flitted just out the doorway before morphing into a mustard jelly (it was a special ability, so that did not break invisibility). As a jelly, she was now so wide that she blocked the entire entrance, a fact that Angelo would shortly exploit.
Occasionally, Alai and Diyab cast spells to detect invisibility, even though they don't have them memorised and there's nothing in-game that should tip you off to your presence (i.e. SCS makes them cheat). Fortunately, you can block this using the Cloak of Non-Detection and the door's entrance will be so far away from them that it won't dispel your imp's invisibility.
Whipping out another Wand of Fire, Angelo shot Fireball after Fireball down the corridor, retreating behind the corner as soon as he released each blast. Most of the time, the remaining associates would suck up the blasts without complaint - they could not see their assailant and weren't bothered enough to investigate - but the berserkers would occasionally wander around looking in the rooms. Unfortunately, with Felicity blocking the door, they would never find Angelo and would eventually meander back into the central chamber to receive another blast.
Again, Angelo stopped when the wand had 1 charge remaining, vowing to sell-rebuy again later. After waiting for a successful Stealth check, Angelo moved past Felicity and checked out who was still alive. Emissary Tar, Naaman and Alai had perished in the assault, but Zhalimar, Gardush and Diyab were still alive, albeit barely. That was enough for Angelo, who sneaked back, re-entered Stealth mode and proceeded to the next stage.
There is no guarantee that Naaman and Alai will be killed in other playthroughs, but the next steps would be the same regardless. Shennara begins outside the radius of the fireballs, which is why we took her out first, and if you don't block the door off, she can find and backstab you, altering everyone to your presence. Aasim wouldn't be too difficult to kill in this stage, but you know what they say about gift horses...
Divide and Conquer
Although it was previously stated that Emissary Tar would rebirth as a doppelganger even if she was killed, this occurs when Zhalimar's initial dialogue is triggered. If he was to die without beginning his speech, then Emissary Tar does not come back. This and the fact that Zhalimar could fire arrows made him the highest priority living target that Angelo could find, and his wavering health made him extraordinarily vulnerable to backstabs...
The UI notified Angelo that in addition to Diyab and Gardush, Kaalos had also been alerted to Angelo's presence. He'd started on the left of floor 5, so had been undisturbed by the events so far, but activating him was not good news. More backstab-happy than Shennara, Angelo did not want to fight him at all, really... much less with an angry Diyab and Gardush in tow. So when he drew back from Gardush and Diyab's retaliation and stuffed Felicity into his tunic, he fled downstairs to the 4th floor, hoping to split the remaining associates up.
Kaalos duly obliged, descending to engage Angelo while Diyab and Gardush remained behind. He was left disappointed, though, as by the time he'd gone down the stairs, Angelo was back up the other set, and his AI was so flustered that he stayed there feeling lonely. Had Angelo been followed by more pursuers, he could have shaken them off by repeating the floor-hopping and combining with hit-and-fade tactics as required.
The nice thing about fighting a C/T is that they can rarely benefit from their Stealth abilities to backstab properly, but they also don't utilise their ability to wear heavy armour and cast spells, as they must wear leather armour to use their thief skills. Combined with the fact that Diyab was also on death's door from the Fireball armageddon, Angelo quickly killed him, leaving only Gardush. Even with the Oil of Speed he'd drunk when he first saw Angelo, he was only a melee fighter and so was relatively straightforward to kite using the Boots of Speed. When a Blind spell failed to connect, Angelo resorted to basic arrows to get the job done... and they did.
Withdrawing to the balcony, Angelo released Felicity again before resting. Kaalos hadn't taken any damage anyway and Angelo had a final trick in mind for him.
Tricking the Trickster
The next morning, Angelo repacked Felicity, turned invisible and went down to the 4th floor. Yesterday, he hadn't moved past the bar, so even although Kaalos was invisible, Angelo knew Kaalos would be around that area. Moving to the kitchens at the back, where he knew Kaalos couldn't detect him, Angelo set Felicity loose without breaking his Invisibility. Felicity cast her Polymorph Self and floated back through into the main bar area.
Kaalos couldn't believe his luck when he saw the undefended imp. He couldn't find any sign of Angelo, but he would definitely settle for his familiar. Emerging from the shadows, he took aim at the Felicity's filmsy AC.
Angelo had already spotted Kaalos' imminent assault on Felicity flash up on his UI. Before Kaalos could complete his action, Felicity's shape had shifted into a mustard jelly and Kaalos cursed. Jellies were immune to backstab, so his attack wouldn't do full damage. Unfortunately, the situation was even worse than he'd anticipated.
Before he could blink, Angelo was on top of him wielding a Wand of Paralysation. Miraculously, Kaalos managed to resist the first charge, but he foolishly continued to attack Felicity the mustard jelly, who continued to be immune to his normal weapon. When Angelo fired another ray from his wand, Kaalos couldn't save a second time and once the turn's stun began, Angelo executed the same sequence as he had on Shennara. With Felicity's assistance, Kaalos' 261 HP became a mere formality.
"SCS thieves are so slimy," Angelo quipped as he wiped off Kaalos' Studded Leather Armour +2 while Felicity returned to her natural form. "Especially this one," he finished, putting both of them into his pack.
After talking to Thaldorn and stealing the letters in the back bedroom (either on their own would have done), Angelo left the Iron Throne building. He was glad that was over. After such a difficult fight, he yearned for some home comforts and to return to surroundings more familiar. After reading the letters he'd stolen, he realised that he wouldn't have to wait long...
The best treasure in this fight is probably Alai's Minor Sequencer scroll, the only one in BG:EE and SoD (unless you're wielding halberds and fancy Zhalimar's halberd +2). As mentioned before, a much easier way for Angelo to have obtained the scroll would have been to Pick Pocket Alai while invisible and then flee when you become visible. But F/M/T were never known for their wisdom...
Angelo missed an important shot and she managed to cast Cure Disease on one of the priestesses. Apparently, SCS made this cure Blind as well, because suddenly Angelo had another opponent to deal with.
Cure disease always cured blindness. The change SCS makes is to improve the AI so that it can actually take advantage of that. Heal also always cured blindness and I seem to remember I've got the optional SCS component that allows true seeing to cure blindness. I remember experimenting in the early days of playing this challenge and trying to blind Mad Arcand with a sorcerer. At that stage I hadn't installed the fix for LoB saving throws, so had a decent chance of success with each spell. I can't remember how many spells I had, but suspect it would have been 12 with the help of the ring of wizardry. I do remember I successfully blinded him 4 times during the combat - and on each occasion he cured himself with one of the above 3 options - relying on blindness to deal with a high level cleric is a dubious tactic with SCS .
Switching tactics, Angelo hoped to try and repeatedly backstab Jalantha using hit-and-fade, but he realised he'd made a mistake by choosing to fight in the early afternoon. In BG:EE, attempting to Stealth outdoors in broad daylight cuts your Stealth success rate (and trying to Stealth indoors incurs a further penalty regardless of when you try). Angelo's Stealth percentage was so low that even when he stood in a shadowy corner, it took so long to Stealth that he could not get Jalantha's health down quickly enough (her AC wasn't amazing, but not too shabby either).
Worse, as a T/C herself, Jalantha could also Stealth... and her skills were much better. Angelo would often leave the temple, Stealth and come back in to find that she'd completely disappeared. He could not maintain Stealth mode and Detect Illusions simultaneously, not that this mattered since Jalantha's thief skills were classed as non-magical (i.e. not an illusion), so he couldn't have detected her with 100% DI (much less the 75% he currently had).
I don't believe stealth is affected by whether you're indoors or outdoors per se - though of course the lighting level can change as a result of moving. Thief detect illusion also works differently from the mage spell - it should detect both magical invisibility and non-magical stealth. I don't know if Jalantha has some unique ability to prevent that happening, but the general rule is certainly that DI is a good way to find hidden thieves.
Cure disease always cured blindness. The change SCS makes is to improve the AI so that it can actually take advantage of that.
I was aware that the AI casting Cure Disease to cure blindness was an SCS upgrade, but I didn't know that it cured blindness in BG:EE. Probably because I cannot recall ever being blinded in BG:EE...
At that stage I hadn't installed the fix for LoB saving throws, so had a decent chance of success with each spell.
As far as I know, the enemies I've been facing have been receiving a saving throw bonus as usual. Is it included in the latest patch (which I have) or must I download an external mod or fixpack?
I don't believe stealth is affected by whether you're indoors or outdoors per se - though of course the lighting level can change as a result of moving.
I think I read something about the indoors/outdoors on a forum about this and being surprised by it myself, but I haven't tested it. Does anyone know the exact penalties regarding trying to Stealth in different lighting conditions? While we're here, I've also read in some places that Hide in Shadows affects the initial attempt to hide and that Move Silently influences attempts to maintain Stealth, whereas other places say that an average is taken. There's a lot of misinformation out there... can anyone set the record straight?
Thief detect illusion also works differently from the mage spell - it should detect both magical invisibility and non-magical stealth. I don't know if Jalantha has some unique ability to prevent that happening, but the general rule is certainly that DI is a good way to find hidden thieves.
I have just tested this. After 'Ctrl+Y'-ing the other Iron Throne members, I goaded Shennara and Kaalos into attacking me. I let them leave my sight a second and sure enough, they used Stealth to disappear (no 'drinks potion of invisibility' sign came up). I also vanished using a potion of invisibility and I can figure out where they are because my character keeps veering around an invisible object rather than going in a straight line. Still, despite cheating to gain XP to put 100% in DI, switching it on and watching Angelo stand next to them for 2 minutes, they did not appear. And yet when I used a scroll of Detect Invisibility, they both suddenly appeared.
In another test, I wandered invisible around Iron Throne 5th floor with 100% DI and this didn't reveal Shennara or Kaalos, but as soon as I blinded Emissary Tar, Shennara appeared to beam in and backstab me. This is not because they start off neutral and so are not classed as 'nonfriendly' (just like you can sneak past initially neutral Drasus et al without incident, but as soon as they turn hostile, they cast divinations to dispel your illusions), since casting Detect Invisibility immediately shows them to begin as hostile.
Thieves often use any potions of invisibility they have before using Stealth, and this effect is dispelled by DI. But, at least on my install, I am 100% convinced that DI does not reveal Stealth. What I am not so sure of is my claim that enemy thieves can disappear like shadowdancers. It's very possible that I lost sight of them for a moment, and that's all it takes. Either way, if DI doesn't do the job, thieves can be a major headache.
At that stage I hadn't installed the fix for LoB saving throws, so had a decent chance of success with each spell.
As far as I know, the enemies I've been facing have been receiving a saving throw bonus as usual. It's probably included in the latest patch, but I'm not redoing the run I've done so far if I have to install an external mod or fixpack. Just sayin'.
The fault is with BGEE, not SCS. It might be fixed in the next update, but unless you've included a specific modded change your chance of success with spells in LoB is virtually the same as at any other difficulty level. In fact your chance of success is better with low level enemies. That's because LoB does reduce the saving throw die roll by 5, but it also increases the base saving throw required by 5. For most enemies those cancel each other out. However, for weaker enemies, if the base saving throw becomes 20 or more that is treated by the game as an automatic failure - irrespective of how great the adjustment to the throw is. Hence I suspect you will find that blinding things like kobolds is always successful in your installation.
I don't believe stealth is affected by whether you're indoors or outdoors per se - though of course the lighting level can change as a result of moving.
I think I read something about the indoors/outdoors on a forum about this and being surprised by it myself, but I haven't tested it. Does anyone know the exact penalties regarding trying to Stealth in different lighting conditions? While we're here, I've also read in some places that Hide in Shadows affects the initial attempt to hide and that Move Silently influences attempts to maintain Stealth, whereas other places say that an average is taken. There's a lot of misinformation out there... can anyone set the record straight?
The thing about separate effects was commonly said in the past, but is not true. Stealth is just the average of the two scores.
The variables from lighting are included here. This is one of a number of threads @Alonso compiled about aspects of Baldur's Gate where adequate explanations to apparently simple questions had never been published. He's done an exceptional job in asking deceptively simple questions and then distilling what were sometimes quite complex answers given to him into readily understandable form.
Thief detect illusion also works differently from the mage spell - it should detect both magical invisibility and non-magical stealth. I don't know if Jalantha has some unique ability to prevent that happening, but the general rule is certainly that DI is a good way to find hidden thieves.
Thieves often use any potions of invisibility they have before using Stealth, and this effect is dispelled by DI. But, at least on my install, I am 100% convinced that DI does not reveal Stealth. What I am not so sure of is my claim that enemy thieves can disappear like shadowdancers. It's very possible that I lost sight of them for a moment, and that's all it takes. Either way, if DI doesn't do the job, thieves can be a major headache.
Thinking about it, I was wrong above - I was remembering detecting thieves using potions rather than stealth. The reason why that pair disappear like that though is not because they're shadowdancers, but because they are in an ambush situation - SCS uses a script in that situation to make them disappear rather than them having to make a stealth check. If they appear after attacking you, they won't be able to hide again while in sight (though they could use potions to disappear of course).
Executive Summary: Angelo sneaks through Candlekeep's Catacombs, killing a Prat who gets in his way.
Mercifully, this is a shorter update than the last one.
Some 'Unwelcome Home' Gifts
After stopping off at High Hedge, Angelo visited Duke Eltan with his findings. "You'll be paid extremely well: 2,000 GP" he'd said. Considering Berrun Ghastkill was quoted as saying that his 900 GP reward was "a small fortune by anyone's standards", he thought that the duke could have done slightly better than this - especially as Beregost could seemingly afford 5,000 GP for the disposal of Bassilus - but gold seemed an inconsistent resource in BG:EE.
After receiving the History of the Nether Scrolls, Angelo appeared outside Candlekeep and encountered another SCS alteration. The ogre mages who had previously confined themselves to warehouse in BG Docks had decided to venture out. Unfortunately, although they thought they had the drop on Angelo, he had picked up the Horn of Kazgaroth from High Hedge and a quick trumpet gave him immunity to the Chromatic Orbs they hurled at him. It didn't last long, inflicted 10 crushing damage and, frankly, wasn't as good a counter as invisibility, but for a bit of variety, Angelo used its protection to chat to the warden and move into Candlekeep. One of the ogre mage's paralysis spells followed him inside the walls, but Angelo was safely out of harm's way.
When the Keeper of the Portal said, 'Hold, travellers!', Angelo took it literally.
Sometimes, the ogre mages follow the protagonist inside Candlekeep's walls. This didn't happen when I played it (i.e. I didn't save-scum to ensure it wouldn't occur), but it has happened in some tests I've done since. Personally, I feel this is rather unfair, but I supposed I've survived this far by abusing various loopholes in the game's engine. If they follow you, lost them outside the library with Invisibility (Horn of Kazgaroth's immunity only applies to external <2nd level spells).
First, Angelo looted the Potion of Clarity from Candlekeep Inn (strangely restocked since Angelo last pilfered it back in the Prologue) and picked up the Vocalise scroll from the 1st floor library (the only copy in BG:EE besides the one on Naaman's body - so Naaman was strictly a lesser priority Iron Throne Pick Pocket target than Alai). Angelo then grabbed a Ring of Protection +1 from a mysterious man named Koveras and decided not to bother with Brunos and Rieltar. The only thing of value to Angelo that they carried was another Potion of Clarity (although mages doing an 'Adventurer's Challenge' might be interested in their Potion of Genius)... but Angelo figured that his Greenstone Amulet was protection enough.
Only a Prat Would Oppose Angelo
By now, Angelo's nostalgia had run dry: being falsely accused of killing Brunos and Rieltar dampened his enthusiasm somewhat (although he was sure to make Ulraunt explain very clearly which set of Iron Throne associates he was being accused of murdering). So, after Tethtoril teleported him into the vault beneath Candlekeep, Angelo memorised several Invisibility spells and resolved to loot the catacombs and disarm the plentiful traps (free XP!) as quickly as possible.
And that's exactly what he did. Apart from one small complication...
Prat and his cohorts were a curiosity to Angelo. On the one hand, they had the potential to unleash lots of needless pain; on the other, Sakul carried the only scroll of Wraithform in BG:EE (had Angelo been that way inclined, he would also have cherished Prat's Throwing Axe +2). Wraithform wasn't nearly as useful to a F/M/T as it was to a F/M, but Angelo had made the mistake of spurning the sole chance of getting Spell Thrust and he wasn't going to make the same mistake again.
Standing in the corner by the entrance, Angelo put the wand of fire he'd found in the 1st floor of catacombs to good use.
The resulting barrage of fireballs softened the group up considerably: by the time it had a single charge remaining, only Prat and Tam were left alive. Since Prat seemed to be on his last legs, Angelo figured he was a good target for his newly improved 19 Strength backstab, but he missed with his strike. Somehow, Prat seemed to have a permanent Blur effect (from an undroppable ring, perhaps?), and this gave him a disgustingly low AC.
Prat and Tam both gave chase, but while Tam the archer was easily disabled via Blind, Prat was not so loosely shaken off. He had good saving throws and was able to cast Haste on himself, making him difficult to evade. Worse, his AC was so good that neither kiting nor backstabbing seemed feasible. Luckily, though, he was already severely weakened from the earlier blasting and a few shots of Agannazar's Scorcher (also from the wand) was enough to kill him. After that, shooting blind Tam in the chest felt easier than shooting fish in a barrel.
If Ogre Mages Can Abuse the Infinity Engine, Why Can't I?
Ignoring the assorted spiders and basilisks, Angelo sneaked through to the end of the Candlekeep Catacombs to see a surprising face. "Wasn't expecting to see anyone here," Angelo remarked to Diarmid, who seemed not to hear him because Angelo was invisible. Which wasn't really how invisibility works, but this abuse of the game enigne was pale in comparison to the one that Angelo was about to commit...
Felicity's earlier scan of the Pick Pocket opportunities available in BG:EE had convinced Angelo that it was not the best use of his precious skill points. Worse, as Angelo was not using charm, any skill check failure caused its targets to become irrevocably hostile, and since Diarmid was unkillable at this stage in the game (even trusty Ctrl+Y fails), Angelo wasn't keen on letting this happen. But Diarmid was also one of the handful of special cases who disappeared after presenting a line of dialogue... and this abrupt script change would override any prospective hostility they would feel after a failed Pick Pockets check.
Hence, even though he failed in his second attempt to pickpocket Diarmid (the first had yielded a rare Protection from Magic scroll), Angelo was unconcerned. He simply talked to Diarmid in the short interim before Diarmid turned hostile, Diarmid spouted some rubbish that Angelo already knew, Diarmid's script flipped and he wandered off out of the cavern. "Hopefully, you'll be missing that protection scroll if I meet you again," Angelo mused wistfully, "but probably not."
Once a mainstay of vanilla BG abuse, this 'force-talking' has, to my knowledge, largely been fixed in BG:EE. Talking to Algernon if your Pick Pocket attempt fails, for instance, does not stop him from going hostile. However, if the target's variables change after dialogue, then they can be safely pickpocketed using this technique. Other examples include pilfering Shandalar's scroll selection before informing him of your success in Ice Ise and stealing Kirinhale's staff-spear +2 before telling her that you've given Riggilo her hair (although I think you need > 50% PP for that, since it's in her quick items (rather than her inventory), which is why Angelo never attempted it).
As he emerged from underneath the walls of Candlekeep, Angelo was pleased to see the outside world again. Stealthily evading the ogre mages congregated around the gated entrance (why hadn't the Keeper of the Portal shooed them away?!), Angelo left his hometown for good. Before he went back to Baldur's Gate, he had a few errands to run, tasks that would take him to the windswept village of Ulgoth's Beard...
The variables from lighting are included here. This is one of a number of threads @Alonso compiled about aspects of Baldur's Gate where adequate explanations to apparently simple questions had never been published. He's done an exceptional job in asking deceptively simple questions and then distilling what were sometimes quite complex answers given to him into readily understandable form.
Interesting reading for the thief skills post. It was roughly in line with my expectations (glad to see that hiding in lit indoor settings was different to hiding in daylight), but I was unaware of several subtleties. I agree with your shadowdancer/ambush point - when I tested it more carefully, there was always an instant where they escaped my line of sight - and I will adjust my posts accordingly. I'd like to do my bit to prevent the spread of duff information and if I'm spouting fallacies left, right and centre, then I'll own up and fix it.
Speaking of retroactively changing posts, I edited my post to delete the bit about not redoing my run, as I thought it was a little cheeky, but you obviously quoted it first! I've been trying as much as possible to ensure that any strategies I use are repeatable without relying too much on 'lucky' dice rolls and so on. Hopefully this will minimise the damage that creatures suffer if they're missing a saving throw bonus.
The only example I can think of where (given enough time and/or charges) a failed save is not guaranteed was, somewhat ironically, in the last post (although I suppose Neira could have repeatedly made her save against the Blind). The two thieves need not necessarily fail their saves v paralysation and it's difficult to engage them in melee without alerting Zhalimar. Originally, I'd planned to eliminate the other associates (using some combination of steps 3 and 4) and omit the thieves entirely... perhaps I'll revert back to that!
I have a vague memory that Beamdog made her unkillable in that encounter as a result of complaints about the difficulty of keeping her alive. However, she should be killable if you don't activate the encounter in the first place, i.e. never get within speaking range. With SCS installed you can't do that with a single shot as a result of the mechanism that allows you to level her up once you've recruited her, but if you keep shooting she should go down (unless you've got some other mod installed that affects that).
I suspected this was the reason why she seemed strangely invulnerable. However, I've just tested it and I'm pretty sure I can't kill her without activating the encounter.
If Ctrl+Y can't do it, Angelo definitely can't do it. Guess I'll have to abuse her indestructibility after all!
There's a simple hotfix to make LoB saving throw bonuses work. Attached is a WeiDU mod by @subtledoctor that patches all non-joinable critters to have +5 to saving throws. It will have the same effect outside of LoB mode, so if you're doing any non-LoB runs on the same install, it will affect those two.
Thief stealth is indeed unbreakable by a thief's Detect Illusions ability; it only works on other forms of invisibility (I think the Staff of the Magi's invisibility is also unbreakable). You can bait SCS thieves into breaking stealth with a summoned critter and then reveal them when they drink a Potion of Invisibility to once again disappear.
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Executive Summary: Angelo succeeds where Permidion Stark failed using a (perhaps) novel technique.
Having exhausted the peaceful methods of advancing, Angelo needed to engage in trial by combat to earn his XP. After getting his first kill by blinding a swordsman, his next opponents would require very different tactics...
Although Thalantyr will turn hostile if you attack his golems after talking to him, you can slaughter them freely before talking to him. They're immune to magic and normal weapons, though, and since Beregost only sells finite echanted ammunition (and you can't buy any from Thalantyr, else the battle stops), you'll want use the Gauntlets of Weapon Specialisation to give yourself the best chance of bringing them down. If you're desparate, Erdane (outside Durlag's Tower) sells more, if you can afford it... but the basic point stands!
Although the following trick may well be known by the cogni scenti, I haven't seen it described explicitly elsewhere... and if my only real contribution to this thread is a trick for an early 4,000 XP (when the petrify-revive-repetrify basilisk loop has basically rendered it obsolete), then I'd still be happy!
After meeting one of the flesh golems, Angelo retreated, luring it into the central ring. The golem was pretty thick and sometimes several attempts were required (Angelo was alert to the flesh golem unwittingly stopping just around the lip of the doorway, as it could have painfully smacked him as soon as he poked his head around the corner). Eventually, however, the beast was suckered in, lumbering towards Angelo as he took potshots at it. Seemingly cornered, death seemed inevitable...
Full disclosure: these screenshots were taken on a similar run on another computer - I forgot to take some this time around - so the portraits and so on may not quite match up.
Miraculously, the flesh golem spun around and began proceeding anticlockwise towards him. After nearly 2 rounds of free shots, when the flesh golem had almost reached him, Angelo again ducked behind Thalantyr and again the golem reversed its circumambulation, marching clockwise this time.
"Thank goodness SCS didn't fix this script," Angelo murmured as he looped this procedure as many times as required for the flesh golem to die, before repeating it on the other flesh golem for a total of 4,000 XP... enough to level up to 3/3/4. And after the flesh golems met their maker, Angelo promptly met their maker and bought a scroll of Invisibility. Since Thalantyr had 3 copies, Angelo went daredevil and attempted to scribe it without augmenting his Intelligence... and was successful first time.
This tactic isn't quite as failsafe as described. It's suitable for an NR run, but occasionally, the second golem joins the action and navigates the perimeter in the opposite direction to the first. This traps you in an ever-decreasing arc until you're caught behind Thalantyr with nowhere to run. Barring other means of invisibility, you can suddenly discover an urgent need to talk to Thalantyr, which will save you at the cost of denying the flesh golem XP.
Now that Angelo had Invisibility and was high enough level to cast it, he had many new options that he didn't have before. He could now complete the remainder of his 'stealth-but-no-combat' quests; several guarded treasure troves could now be safely raided; and the possibility of resting while invisible opens up completing a few dungeons. In particular, Angelo had heard about some mines in Nashkel that needed clearing... and now he had all the tools for the job!
Executive Summary: Angelo goes up a level by combining Invisibility with his imp familiar in Durlag's Labyrinth and using hit-and-run techniques to kill a disproportionately troubling Droth.
Having acquired 00-status with the two flesh golem kills, Angelo decided to explore the Sword Coast and see what easy pickings he can gather. Although the last post did not lie - he does have all the tools for completing the Nashkel Mines - it does not tell the whole truth in that he needs to be level 4/4/5 to execute his plan properly. This means earning another ~15,000 XP... and Invisibility will allow him to do just that!
As this post is longer than my previous ramblings, I've split it up into spoilered sections.
Completing Love and Avarice's quests were more complicated. The Treasure Room was small enough that sneaking straight in and looting would allow the assorted skeletons and Helmed Horrors to surround Angelo. However, Angelo could only cast a single level 2 spell per day, and this meant that he could not draw the monsters away before casting Invisibility: he could then not loot the container without becoming visible again and this would mean he could not rest invisibly inside the labyrinth.
Why didn't Angelo just lure the monsters away, turn invisible, rest and then loot the container? Because reasons.
Felicity piped up, "Can I help?"
It all came to Angelo in a flash. "I can offer you as bait!"
The imp's expression showed she was not thrilled by this prospect, but Angelo explained. "You can polymorph into a mustard jelly, which are immune to the normal weapons the monsters are using. If I hang out invisibly in a corridor, you can lure the monsters into the engine room, leaving space for me to loot the treasure room while they're busy not damaging you. I'll come back for you when I'm done, you turn back into an imp, I'll put you in the pack and then turn invisible. Et voila!"
If you're wondering where the wands of fire and paralyzation are from, then you've been paying attention! They're from the ankheg nest and Black Alaric's Cave, but I've not mentioned them here for narrative convenience... think how long this post would have been otherwise! I promise I won't be using them before I officially obtain them in a post's time.
Snatching the switch for the engine and the glittering beljuril gem, Angelo pressed the bottle of wine and went back to the main hall. Completing Love's final quest granted 4,000 XP, rather than the usual 2,000 XP (so 10,000 XP in total from the warders), but Angelo was still not sufficiently emboldened to fight the warders. Turning invisible (he'd rested since the heist) to prevent any tailing, he scuttled out the tower and off to Shipwreck's Coast.
Angelo knew that Droth's script always started by casting Glitterdust... and while he's casting that, Angelo would hit him with Blindness. If the initial Blindness worked, then its 4 hour duration far exceeded Glitterdust's 4 rounds, so Angelo could recover with plenty of time; if it failed, then Angelo would simply turn invisible, rest and try again (Droth had no way of dispelling the invisibility and would also regain his spells after the rest).
Despite the guaranteed blind, Droth's AC was so good that Angelo was only hitting on a critical. Worse, although a polymorphed Felicity fared better than Angelo, having to cut through Droth's defences was time consuming. So much so that Felicity's polymorph spell wore off when Droth was only down to Injured. Angelo was not convinced he could whittle away Droth's remaining health shooting arrows before the ogre mage's vision returned... and with Glitterdust expended, there was no guarantee that Droth wouldn't snap off a nasty spell before Angelo could escape with Invisibility.
From inside his pack, Felicity offered sage advice: "Shooting arrows is not the only way to whittle away Droth's health."
After a second's contemplation, Angelo understood. Drawing his sword, he ducked into the shadowiest region he could find and waited until he passed his Stealth check before swiftly dashing behind Droth, making one quick attack and then retreating out of the brute's reduced vision before any reaction was possible. Rinsing and repeating, the additional +4 from backstab would take the sting out of Droth's AC and the extra damage, especially from a critical, would enable the kill before Blindness wore off.
Finally, Droth lay dead and Angelo he saw Shoal warbling towards him, probably wanting to donate 975 XP before teleporting away. But Angelo was not satisfied. This nasty nereid would have happy sacrificed him to her ogre overlord: now Angelo knew how Riggilo must have felt! Fortunately for Angelo, revenge was easy to come by since all of Shoal's attacks still did non-lethal damage; unfortunately for Shoal, Angelo's weapons did lethal damage and her death was worth 5,000 XP.
Many walkthroughs advocate ignoring Droth and going for Shoal straight out the gates for an easy 5,000 XP. Previously, I have coveted the Helm of Defence as it allows any helm-wielding character to gain 100% fire resistance (together with 2 rings of fire resistance or a ring and Icingdeath). However, upon reflection, you could just use a potion. I share @Grond0's dislike of consumables, but using them saves a difficult and lengthy battle. Swings and roundabouts.
Together, the 10,000 XP from Durlag's Labyrinth and the 5,650 XP from Shipwreck's Coast is enough for Angelo to reach level 4/4/5. Now he can cast two level 2 spells a day, which will be all that's required to clear the Nashkel Mines. Angelo afforded himself a grim chuckle, "Those kobolds don't know what's coming for 'em."
Executive Summary: Angelo steal Mulahey's stuff, then kills him with it.
After going up to level 4/4/5, Angelo decided it was time to advance the plot. "I wonder how often players wait this long on regular difficulties," he asked himself as he turned invisible and sneaked his way into the Nashkel Mines.
While still at the chest, Angelo cast Invisibility again and sprinted into a side cavern before Mulahey's monstrous horde (and it truly was a horde... SCS significantly upped their numbers) could get tabs on his whereabouts. Glugging a potion of mind focusing and of genius - neither of which dispelled his Invisibility - Angelo's intelligence was sufficient that he was confident of successfully scribing all the spells in his scroll case... including, among the assorted dweomers from Durlag's Tower and hidden caches, his newest acquisition, the Web spell.
Since it is not sold in High Hedge, early copies of Web are hard to come by. Borda (in the Xvart village) and Narcillus (in the Valley of the Tombs) have one each, but both are tough combats (since Narcillus basically turns hostile immediately and Borda has levels in thief, neither are attractive pickpocket targets). Dushai (in Ulgoth's Beard) has one, but this either requires a successful Pickpocket or costs reputation to extract. There's also one in the Bandit Camp, but that's in Chapter 3. At this stage, it's probably better to save gold than to spend it buying scrolls to maximise potion usage.
The magical webbing ensnared the entirity of Mulahey's horde, giving Angelo and a polymorphed Felicity free rein to pelt their leader with arrows and mustard jelly globules (and a few Blind spells for good measure). Angelo wasn't too concerned with whether the Blind spells connected, since this was only really to make Mulahey easier to hit. At the first sign that Mulahey had made his saving throw against the Web spell, Angelo ducked behind the corner, out of sight and out of range. Even if the cleric had cast Unholy Blight, Angelo knew his evil alignment would protect him.
Even once the Web spell had worn off, Angelo knew he was safe without Invisibility as long as he stayed out of sight. The SCS scripting was a curious thing. Sometimes, if monsters figured out that one mode of attack had no effect, they'd switch to another... and if they didn't have any others, they'd give up and not do anything. As a mustard jelly, Felicity was immune to Mulahey's magic and the normal weapons the monsters used. Mulahey's only option would have been to cast Spiritual Hammer or Shillelagh, then attack Felicity himself... except that he was hemmed in by his own forces and unable to move! As long as the monsters are stopped from rushing you from the start, Mulahey (whether blinded or not) was basically a dead man standing still.
Throughout my time playing BG:EE, I have never once seen any of Mulahey's horde (not including Mulahey himself) make their saving throw on Web. I suppose these tactics are not 100% guaranteed, but I'll give it a 99.99...% success rate.
The resting reset the monsters' movement and prevented them from trapping Angelo in the side cavern. When Angleo awoke, he was still invisible and the monsters hadn't moved. Dodging around them, Angelo snatched Mulahey's belongings, cast another Invisibility and weaved his way back out of the mound - yes, it was a mound - and of the Nashkel Mines altogether.
It's essential to have as many Invisibility spells memorised as possible while looting Mulahey's corpse. Sometimes, it's necessary to reposition monsters by attacking, luring them towards you and then disappearing. Getting trapped in Mulahey's chamber with no more Invisibility sucks, even if you're currently invisible, because there's nowhere to potentially rest with no view of any monster.
Having retrieved Mulahey's scrolls, Angelo watched Chapter 3's cinematics roll. He was about to head back to the Friendly Arm Inn.
Dushai also has one, along with a valuable ring of free action - available for just a minor reputation cost ...
*Sigh*
Every time I try to be comprehensive, I always forget one. Yes, as you say, Dushai has one.
Being the kind-hearted soul that I am, I'm not too fond of killing innocents (probably why I didn't remember Dushai), even if they have items like Algernon's cloak or rings of free action. Still (altogether now)... no trick is too low for Angelo!
It's a while since I tried this challenge, so decided to have another go. I'm not generally a great fan of triple-class characters, but created a F/M/T in order to give Angelo some company
My installation includes the fix for the LoB saving throw bug - giving enemies the intended +5 benefit. Hence spell disablers generally are rather less effective than they would otherwise be. SCS also makes many blinded enemies run all over the map, which is a pain - but blind is still a very useful spell in the right circumstances and Flexi starts with that and find familiar. To make backstabbing tactics less of a hassle he will also be building up stealth capabilities substantially.
Flexi's first act after creation (at least after removing the unwanted script) was to summon a pseudo-dragon familiar. That's very capable of tanking against early enemies as well as offering invisible blocking and distraction abilities.
F1/M1/T1, 32 HPs, 0 kills
Flexi's first main stop after leaving Candlekeep was to look in at a gnoll in the Lake area and dare it to attack an out-of-sight Drizzt. Checking back in 30 minutes or so showed it had broken its weapon, so there was then just a need to wait patiently for another hour or so until it had beaten Drizzt unconscious. Killing Drizzt was worth 12k XP to kick start Flexi's levelling.
While in the mood to be a bad boy, Flexi went to find Dushai. He also killed some fishermen and returned Tenya's bowl for another 2,500 to get to mage level 3. It would make sense at that point to buy invisibility - but he didn't do that yet. At Ulgoth's Beard his pseudo-dragon made mincemeat of Dushai in melee and Flexi recovered a ring of free action and a web spell.
Blindness helped deal with some hobgoblins and recover Joia's ring to boost reputation back to 6 and donating 1,050 gold at the local temple pushed that to 11. Firebead and Mr Colquetle added to that before Flexi headed to the basilisk area. Korax was put to work paralyzing basilisks there, allowing Flexi to then join in with dual-wielded scimitars. Thanks to those and the extra damage from the familiar, Korax lasted comfortably long enough to kill all the basilisks and Mutamin as well.
A first use of web helped Flexi get some stealthy boots from a hobgoblin without the need to run round too much. Zhurlong put a claim in for those, but was disappointed by the bonus pummeling he received from Flexi's staff.
Switching back to searching for reputation, Flexi went to Nashkel for the first time and spoke to Oublek. Samuel was safely delivered to the FAI, Brage to a local sanatorium and Caldo & Krumm were blinded and webbed. At the Lighthouse a group of worgs were inclined to scatter when blinded, but web and the familiar helped deal with them reasonably quickly. I was thinking reputation 19 and charisma 13 would give him a final reputation point gain from Drienne, but she was only willing to hand over the last of her allowance.
After sneaking through the Gnoll Stronghold to get the charisma tome, Flexi did a bit more sneaking in the ankheg nest - successfully hiding again after looting the treasure. Helping out Farmer Brun pushed reputation to 20. That means Flexi can get rock-bottom prices with the help of friends and he'll have a look at what's for sale next time.
F5/M4/T5, 64 HPs, 28 kills
Executive Summary: After discovering the limitations of door-hopping, Angelo 'disposes' of Nimbul and Neira.
What was initially planned to be a short update has sprawled considerably. I'll split it up again using 'Spoiler' tags.
Out of nowhere, Nimbul appeared. "I am death come for thee," he intoned gravely.
Angelo sighed. Just up the road, he'd seen a ranger talking to a hamster and a man in a red robe shouting, "Elminster this, Elminster that, give me 3,000 years and a pointy hat and I'll kick his arse!" What was it with Nashkel and nutjobs?
When Angelo saw Nimbul automatically cast Mirror Image and Stoneskin, his mind was made up. He ducked into the Nashkel shop, hoping to wear down Nimbul's spells by hopping in and out. Unfortunately, Nimbul refused to fall for such cheap tactics. "You cannot escape from me!" he snarled as he followed Angelo inside.
It must be said, dear readers, that Angelo was so shocked that he slammed the Pause button and took a second to work out what to do. Nimbul's Horror and Magic Missile combo could be quite deadly to a PC without Shield or a Greenstone amulet, neither of which Angelo had bothered to acquire yet. Worse, Nimbul's saving throws against Blind were decent and his Boots of Avoidance made shooting through his defences even more painful.
Then, after a moment's thought, Angelo hit upon a solution. Nipping quickly out of the shop, he slammed the door behind him. "Let's see if the AI's scripts can open doors as well as go through them," he said to himself.
It turned out that Nimbul's, at least, couldn't.
As far as I know, neither can any others', at least in BG:EE.
Out of nowhere, Neira appeared. "I'm going to slit your throat, I am," she intoned gravely.
"Oh for goodness' sake," Angelo replied, which wasn't one of the dialogue options. Rather than let Neira cast Hold Person at him, he ducked outside and waited a second before re-entering. However, upon his return, the cleric was nowhere to be seen. "Eh?" Angelo gasped as he exited the tavern once more.
Angelo could only surmise that Neira had left the Inn at the same time as he had, but had delayed her re-entry by a second or so. This meant when Angelo went outside, to prevent him occupying the same space as Neira, he materialised several feet away. She was now blocking the door and had already begun casting her next Hold Person. Too slow to run, Angelo prayed to RNG-sus and snapped off a quick Blind of his own.
He felt his limbs tighten as the paralysis took hold. "Guess this is a reload..." he managed to mutter before his jaw locked. But when his eyes adjusted their focus, he saw that the Blind spell had also connected at the exact same time. Neira stood unable to see or attack the helpless Angelo and so was instead content to act as target practice for Rasaad and the town guard. A long overdue activity, it would appear, as they never seemed to hit her, even with a -4 AC penalty.
"What are the chances?" Angelo asked himself as Hold Person wore off after a mere 10 rounds, giving him plenty of time to shoot blind Neira to death (no Boots of Avoidance for her!). "Actually not too bad," he decided, as clerics' Saves vs Spells were crap.
These events did actually play out roughly as described (I forgot to take a screenshot, which was a rookie error!). That said, I'd still probably trust entrance-hopping as a reliable method of draining Neira of spells.
The additional 12 levels that enemy NPCs get in LoB makes fighting mages a real nuisance. Not only does every paltry excuse for a conjurer now fire 5 Magic Missiles, but now Chromatic Orb is essentially 'save v spells or die' (although the +6 bonus does help). Melf's Acid Arrow also lasts so long as to be almost a death sentence for beginning characters, especially since there are not many ways to resist acid damage. Mirror Image is a decent way to nullify this spell, although its success is not guaranteed.
Angelo woke up refreshed. "Time to sort out Nimbul," he said as he cast Shield before going into the store. He'd waited long enough for Nimbul's defences to have worn off, so the whole battle should be a lot easier now...
As soon as Nimbul saw Angelo enter the store, his Stoneskin and Mirror Image were re-erected. This led Angelo to only one conclusion: when he got his spells back after resting, so did his opponents. "Only fair, I suppose," Angelo conceded through gritted teeth.
Nimbul was in no mood for chit chat. "Surrender, and your passage..."
Neither was Angelo. "I'm not surrendering my passage!" he exclaimed, dashing back outside and slamming the door shut. Dealing with Nimbul would have to wait a little longer.
Angelo had a fair idea what to do in the meantime. He had not yet exhausted the looting possibilities of his Invisibility magic... and his new Shield spell could be useful against another hired killer not far North...
Perhaps an odd question, but are there any restrictions on modding for the Poverty challenge? There's no way Angelo is retiring, but I sometimes feel that I'm flogging a dead horse by trying to find ways to not exploit Algernon's Cloak (e.g. who cares if I find a new way of killing Thalantyr's flesh golems if any player would just basilisk XP-loop?!). One vastly overkill way of tackling this would be to do the Poverty challenge, but it seems rather mental to do it strictly (no enchanted weapons for killing creatures immune to normal weapons, no spell scrolls for mages to learn spells, etc.). One class I thought of which might perform better than most would be the Geomantic Sorcerer, but it's only accessible via a mod. It seems rather overpowered (although in solo LoB, is anything really overpowered?) and if using one would gain the same reaction as, say, removing the XP cap, then I'd rethink my strategy somewhat.
You say 'company', I say 'competition'!
I jest, I jest. It's good to see another challenger join the fray, especially if it's 'out of retirement'. I agree that 88 is enough for a triple: ironically, not casting 9th level spells is kinda a blessing as you don't need to worry too much about Wisdom for the Wish spell (always potions for those times when you or a simulacrum are casting from a scroll). Truth be told, a triple class would not be my first pick either - an I/C always rock my boat, although I'd also take a F/I - but both of those have already been done. Completing the challenge at all is a major achievement, but I'd like to at least try something new before reverting back to my standbys.
Incidentally, I do a lot of door-hopping myself and it's by no means a panacea against all enemies. It's certainly possible for them to follow you both in and out of locations and, as you've discovered, some of them have a nasty habit of blocking entrances when they do that. Another problem, which particularly annoys me, is when enemies start casting a spell at you from outside and carry on casting during the transition so that the spell actually casts inside. Very fine control and timing for the transition are needed to beat that sort of tactic
Like I said about the duration of competition ...
At High Hedge Flexi spent a while stealth attacking the 2 golems. His 95% stealth ability gave him a decent chance of hiding and, even used non-proficiently, he was able to hit the golems with only a 10 using Twinkle. It still took multiple attacks though and Flexi was hit once by each golem - so he was glad when the ticklish business was over.
He successfully learned a friends scroll and subsequently bought a fair number of other spells - learning all the more important ones of those. He also kept just enough cash back to buy the +3 staff and cloak of displacement.
He used his new staff and an invisible familiar to beat up Karlat for a bit of practice. More lucrative opportunities for that tactic awaited at Durlag's Tower, but first Flexi wanted a final boost to his combat power. At Firewine Bridge I thought there was a good chance that Meilum would shrug off all 5 blind spells - after all 2 separate gnolls had done that at High Hedge. However, this time the fates were with Flexi and Meilum succumbed immediately. That interrupted his script and he stayed neutral while Flexi practised his backstabs - which included a nice pair of consecutive criticals.
At Durlag's a few enemies were lured into attacking where their short weapon reach proved fatally incapable of reaching over the familiar. However, most of them were killed by Flexi alone using repeated backstabs. One of the spells purchased had been protection from petrification, so Flexi was theoretically free to join in the fight against the basilisks on the roof - getting his first 3 figure backstab there.
I wouldn't worry about that too much.
I myself only used the basilisk loop twice and I think most people here are in the same boat.
The bg 1 xp cap is very low and very easy to reach solo.
Lately I actually never even worried about actively trying to reach cap, but instead just rushed BG city asap, which is much more beneficial to most chars then max xp and you automatically reach cap really quickly once you have access to the city.
I have started a jester run the other day, but should I die it's not gonna be a no reload run, also I have xp cap turned off, because otherwise there would be no point in playing a jester.
(In fact I highly suspect there is no point in it period and stacking webs is far more powerful than Jester's song. :P)
Executive Summary: Angelo completes some miscellaneous tasks.
As he made his way North, Angelo decided he should do the BG:EE equivalent of chores, whipped out his 'to do' list and promptly ticked them off one by one:
These tasks could have been completed as soon as Angelo had acquired Invisibility, but for the purposes of having something to write about in Chapter 3, I delayed describing them. The hand of the producer is strong in this one.
Angelo minimised the game, had a cup of tea and waited.
To his alarm, when Angelo returned and looked at the UI, he saw that Drizzt had somehow killed his attackers. Perhaps this tactic was not as failsafe as he'd thought. If Drizzt had proceeded to kill all the gnolls, then this was disastrous: no way would Angelo beat Drizzt in a fair fight, he could barely beat an Xvart! Still invisible, Angelo swept a circle around where he thought Drizzt would be, being careful to discover any surrounding gnolls while not activating the dark elf himself. As Angelo had hoped, Drizzt had only erroneously killed the gnolls that had been roused into attacking him, so it was simply a case of activating the remainder and waiting some more.
Luring the gnolls away before coming back for the loot, Angelo sheathed Icingdeath. Together with his Helm of Defence and Ring of Fire Resistance, he was totally immune to fire (once he remembered to take Gorion's belt off). Angelo had a feeling that this would be absolutely crucial in the adventures to come.
"Fantastic!" Angelo cried as he saw Neera's HP never fall below 1, despite getting dissolved and hacked to pieces. As long as he stayed behind her shooting arrows, none of the opposition targeted him and were mown down by the indestructible wild mage. In fact, were it not far an awkward script that occasionally fired where Neera would strike up conversation mid-battle asking to join the party (why she would want to do this when it removed her invincibility was anyone's guess), Angelo would have had minimised and had another cup of tea.
As it happened, Neera asked to join the party after the battle had ended, which Angelo allowed... and kicked her out as soon as he'd taken her gem bag. He let her keep her robe and staff, though, because he was a gentleman.
Some people have described how they killed Neera and looted the gem bag from her body to avoid recruiting her. At least in my install, Neera is unkillable before her initial script fires (so I can't shoot her down before she summons Elkandor... even the Ctrl+Y cheat doesn't work!) and the gem bag doesn't appear in the lootable belongings. In any case, I've already broken the 'strictly' solo rule by hiring/dumping Dynaheir for the 800XP. I'll count some extra sheep tonight in recompense.
In addition to the Tome of Getting Buff Real Quick, Angelo pocketed the Wand of Paralyzation, which he knew would come in handy.
After a hard afternoon's questing, Angelo finished his day with the Friendly Arm Inn coming into sight. Tomorrow, he was looking forward to finishing off a few more assorted quests and meeting some bandits.
Oh no, sorry to hear about Flexi. I've definitely been exploiting the reload button to figure out my strategies so far. I get why some people do NR playthroughs, but it seems too risky to begin what would undoubtedly be a large time investment. It's not like Diablo 3 hardcore, when you can at least keep your Paragon levels and stashed loot on another character (not that I play that more either - internet connection's not stable enough). The challenge of figuring out what should be foolproof strategies, rather than their actual execution, is the most fun part for me.
Good luck for all those new attempts even though i dont have the time to read everything in detail.
@semiticgod: Feel free to update the "Hall of Fame" whenever needed.
Executive Summary: Angelo takes out Tarnesh, does a few more chores and sneaks through the Bandit Camp.
You know the drill about the Spoilers section by now.
With SCS, Tarnesh’s Mirror Image casts instantly and his first spell is not necessarily Horror. His roster includes Charm Person and Magic Missile, which could potentially hit faster than Invisibility. In a NR playthrough, I’d either shoot Tarnesh once as he approached, then turn invisible - this introduces a short delay on Tarnesh casting his first spell which should allow you to vanish – or just attack directly with a polymorphed familiar and stay invisible throughout.
Much to Angelo's disappointment, Tarnesh squinted at Felicity before swinging at her with his quarterstaff. At first, this wasn't especially concerning to Angelo: this allowed the Horror spell to run its course and since Felicity was immune to normal weapons, Tarnesh's assault was of no consequence. It was a slightly different reaction to the monsters in the Nashkel Mines, but no less ineffective. Given that the commotion had attracted the local guards to fight his cause, Angelo expected the fight to be over soon enough.
However, he'd forgotten that the Friendly Arm Inn's guards were in equal need of target practice as those in Nashkel, as well as the fact that (as mustard jelly polymorphs are exclusively a ranged attacker) Felicity had a -8 penalty to hit in melee. At this rate, Felicity's polymorph would run out before the battle ended, enabling Tarnesh to magically smack her down before Angelo could intervene.
So Angelo decided to intervene early. Tarnesh's Mirror Images had expired and that back looked mighty tempting. Manoeuvering behind his prey, Angelo took aim and cut the wizard between the shoulder blades. "Argh!" Tarnesh grunted before whirling and releasing a bunch of Magic Missiles into his newly visible opponent. His growling expression turned more pained still when Angelo's frame absorbed them harmlessly.
"Cast the Shield spell before I attacked you," Angelo offered in explanation before his final blow. "It's a self-targeted buff, so it doesn't dispel Invisibility, you see."
Although this encounter played out as I've described, there has been some narrative embellishment. The polymorphed imp familiar and the guards could have killed Tarnesh on their own if required: although mustard jellies aren't fast movers, their attacks can slow and this enables some torturous kiting. I just wanted an excuse to wax lyrical about a technical detail of Invisibility in the name of completeness.
Having disposed of Tarnesh, Angelo bought Bentley's Buckler. Between this and the Tome of Getting Buff Real Quick, he now had 20 Constitution, and this meant (modest) regeneration. Apart from recovering HP effectively while resting and travelling between areas, this also afforded Angelo use of an exploit that he was sure he'd exhibit later. For good measure, he also recruited Khalid and Jaheira, stole their stuff, then kicked them out. He needed every potion of invisibility he could get.
Apart from another 1,500 XP, Angelo also gained a Wand of Fire. One of the nice things about Wands of Fire is that using charges on one mode (e.g. Fireball) does not deplete charges on the other (e.g. Azgannar’s Scorcher), although using up all the charges in either mode causes the wand to vanish regardless of how many remaining charges there are in the other. In any case, Angelo was mostly interested in boosting his area damage credentials.
The BG:EE wiki says that there are some bugged wands that do not do this. I’ll leave comment on those matters to people who know what they’re talking about.
Throughout BG, whether vanilla or BG:EE, I’ve found bandits to be surprisingly tough. They always seem to manage to hit good ACs with bad rolls and have more HP than I would expect for unnamed opponents at this stage of the game. And, of course, the infamous waylay where you start surrounded by bandits peppering arrows is a major reason to travel invisible.
An invisible Angelo poked his head into the main tent. “Ugh,” he said to himself, as he saw several Black Talon Elites in addition to the customary foursome of Raemon, Britik, Venkt and Hakt. “More SCS ‘improvements’.” He weighed up his options. On the one hand, Hakt had a nice Longbow of Marksmanship and Venkt had the only non-random scroll of Spell Thrust in BG:EE… on the other, Angelo had specialised in shortbows (“Suffer now,” he told himself, “to reap the rewards in BG2!”) and perhaps he’d be able to find another copy of Spell Thrust in SoD…
Black Talon Elites carry the same warning as bandits, only more so.
“Discretion is the better part of valour,” Angelo told himself as he opened the chest at the back (again with the bosses and ostentatious containers!). The Boots of Grounding absorbed most of the shock of the Lightning Bolt trap and Angelo had already started casting Invisibility before Raemon’s dialogue initiated. This ate into the group’s collective reaction time and just as they’d found the wherewithal to attack, Angelo disappeared again.
Wasting no time, Angelo scuttled out of the Bandit Camp. Maybe he would return when he was stronger, maybe he wouldn’t. What he did know is that his next destination was Cloakwood.
Postscript: News Just In
Executive Summary: Angelo tests out the Cloak of Non-Detection to kill Drasus et al.
This post is self-indulgent, even by my standards. But the tactics are quite finnicky to describe and, heck, I had fun writing it.
What was not optional, however, was tracking down Gurke's Cloak of Non-Detection in the first area. This was mainly a case of casting Blind and archery, but the reactions of the tasloi to being blinded were frustratingly mixed. Most stood around helplessly, but some started running wildly all over the map. "Very annoying," Angelo complained as he ended the final critter's flailing.
From there, it was plain-sailing throughout Cloakwood. Angelo rescued Chelak's body from Centeol, hearing her plight about Jon Icarus Irenicus and wondered whether this was foreshadowing anything. He did this by first luring the two sword spiders out, turning invisible the instant he exited and going back in before dashing back out with the goods. He had worried whether the external sword spiders would have blocked his retreat in the meantime, but fortunately, they stand stationary when deactivated... and since Angelo hadn't moved from the exit the first time, there was still an Angelo-shaped hole when he left.
He also retrieved a potion of invulnerability from Laskal on his way. He wasn't in the mood for completing much of the map, but if friendly druids are just giving things away...
Although I'm trying to play 'elegantly' here - not killing more than I need and so on - it might be simpler to just kill the guards. In some tests, blinded Genthore went on walkabout and the last thing you want mid-chase is to encounter guards whose Blind has worn off. Blind Drasus is far worse, since he can sprint off and you lose him, having to trek all over the map in the hope of bumping into him or waiting embarrassingly for him to randomly loop back... and unlike Genthore, whose stuff is nice-but-inessential, Drasus' Boots of Speed are the best boots in the game (and can't be pickpocketed, sadly). So he need to die, preferably without too much hassle.
To begin with, Angelo made the arena his own. Nipping into the large house in the bailey, Angelo lured the two downstairs guards upstairs and out of the way, using Invisibility to leave them stranded. The same principle applied to the guard offering the Black Lotus in the hut beyond the bounty hunters, except Angelo just killed him this time. Elegance be damned, he needed these two areas empty.
Angelo's mind was made up: although he was too low level to reliably tank Kysus' spells, if he could get Kysus out of the way, then the Greenstone Amulet could take care of the rest.
Nipping out of the Black Lotus hut invisibly, Angelo considered his options. Both mages began neutral (as long as Drasus didn't see Angelo), but each would turn hostile on attempted blinding (rather than stay neutral allowing multiple attempts), so there was no guarantee that would work. However, although Angelo manually casting Charm Person would elicit the same reaction, casting it using his Ring of Human Influence did not... and combined with invisible resting, this gave Angelo a free charm on Kysus.
I said before that I wouldn't abuse Algernon's Cloak, and the Ring of Human Influence is basically the diet version. Although I'm sure I could have come up with another method, this was the first that sprang to mind. So far in my (unwrittenup) playthrough, I haven't used charm since and, if possible, I don't intend on using it again. But as I've also said before... no trick is too low for Angelo!
Even with this, Angelo knew that there was a hint of nuance in getting Kysus to die properly. For instance, he knew that summoning loads of monsters before attacking the rest of the group (to 'get his charm's worth') was not a good strategy, as one cast of Chaos from Rezdan would nullify the whole thing. Furthermore, Angelo didn't want Kysus to die before he'd had a chance to unleash all his good stuff, so Kysus was made to cast some defensive spells (not too many... Angelo didn't want him surviving past the charm' duration!) before unleashing the hurt. Finally, Angelo was sure to activated his non-Invisibility-breaking Greenstone Amulet: he needed to keep Kysus in sight to control him, but didn't want to get caught in an area of effect from Rezdan, since if he broke his invisibility by attacking while confused, he was a dead man.
His protections in place, Angelo ordered Kysus to fire his sequencer at Rezdan and watched the fireworks show. Despite some vague waffle in the Charm Person description about charmed enemies not doing things against their instincts, Kysus promptly fired his spells off, effecting the assault of Drasus and Genthore. Rezdan could smell something was up and tried to cast Detect Invisibility, but Angelo's cloak did its job and shielded him from the scrying attempt. Kysus looked almost pleadingly in Angelo's direction as he was sliced and diced by his former friends, but Angelo stood motionless and emotionless, waiting for the conjurer to die.
Drasus and his flunkies gathered around the hut's exit. "You're trapped," he sneered.
Angelo was unconcerned. "It's just a pity none of you can get in here, then, isn't it?"
Drasus' voice acquired a new hint of doubt. "You have nowhere to run and nowhere to hide."
"Au contraire," purred Angelo, "I can Hide in Shadows right here, and I have as long as I want to make the Stealth check too."
The doubt in Drasus' refrain turned to full desparation. "You can't stay in there forever."
"You're right," Angelo said as he skulked into the shadows, "But I'll be out in a minute. And do you know the funny thing? When I leave the Black Lotus hut, I'll actually appear behind you, so you've not got me trapped in here after all."
Drasus’ voice was now barely a whisper. “Please don’t backstab me,” he whimpered.
Angelo's response was quieter still. "I'm afraid I can't promise that..."
"I bet they're so stupid that they'll all pile around the entrance here, unable to come in," Angelo said to himself as he clicked Stealth mode as many times as he needed before it finally worked.
Happily, they were... and when Angelo's exit left him behind them, it turned out to be third time unlucky for Drasus.
Genthore was beginning to understand what was going on when Angelo ducked back towards the Black Lotus hut. "Are you going to keep doing this until we all die?"
Angelo laughed as he turned the corner. "And who said the Baldur's Gate AI was bad?"
Rezdan tried one last gambit. "I bet that Greenstone Amulet doesn't have that many charges left."
"Right," Angelo replied as he closed the door behind him, "but it's got enough to deal with all your spells."
He was right. In fact, once Genthore was down for the count and Angelo knew Rezdan was out of spells, he stopped bothering with all this backstab malarkey and took Rezdan out in a straight fight. Sure, Rezdan had Stoneskin and a Mirror Image or two, but nothing that some old fashioned hacking and a dash of Detect Illusion (the next thief skill that Angelo was focussing on) couldn't handle.
Angelo smirked as he tried on his new Boots of Speed. He hadn't even had to use Blind to get the better of them. His tactical smarts were growing... and not a moment too soon. He knew Davaeorn was looming, and taking him out would require all of Angelo's newly acquired nous.
Appendum: A Less Charming Method
Effectively, I've replaced the most pungent cheese in BG:EE (charm abuse) with one of its next strongest incarnations (summons abuse). In a way, this is kind of unsatisfying, but these are classic tactics for a reason... and it's not as if my previous techniques were any more honourable. Is it really cheese if the game doesn't let you succeed any other way? At the end of the day, the enemies' charms 'kill' a solo character on hit, and what's good for the goose...
Executive Summary: Angelo utilises his skills as a fighter, a mage and a thief to beat Davaeorn (without abusing charm).
Ditto the previous note about self-indulgence, finnicky tactics and so on.
From his position near the lift back to level 1, Angelo produced the necklace of missiles he'd bought from the Nashkel Carnival from his backpack and began hurling fireballs into the central chamber from beyond the fog of war. If they wanted to play rough...
Davaeorn had 70% resistance to fire and excellent saving throws, so he shrugged off the incindeary assault. The assorted guards and Black Talon Elites were much vulnerable, but their collective HP from LoB was still considerable. Angelo almost exhausted his necklace of missiles, but he stopped on 1 charge (selling and buying it back would recharge it completely) and switched to the Wand of Fire. Most of the remaining survivors were unable to cope with this charring change and died a painful, burning death.
Davaeorn still stood tall, barely injured and angry. It would take more than eighteen fireballs to bring him down.
The invoker's eyes both widened and narrowed as he saw his spell have no effect. "Have some of your own medicine," he sneered as he released a fireball.
"Most of your damaging magic is fire," Angelo replied. "Why do you think I went to such lengths to make myself immune to it?"
Davaeorn quickly found this became a running theme. Whatever he tried, Angelo had a counter:
Angelo realised he had no choice and closed Davaeorn down for melee. This protection lasted a short time, was Davaeorn was unable to overcome the -8 penalty for attacking in melee with a ranged weapon. But once his spells, Melf Minute Meteors and darts were expended, Davaeorn switched to his staff where Angelo discovered another uncomfortable fact: he was a good melee fighter as well! While his Detect Illusion skill had dispelled any refreshed mirror images, the stone skins were still in place... a spell Angelo wished he had when Davaeorn smacked him with surprising ease.
"Does it pain you," Davaeorn gloated, "that as a wizard, I am still a better warrior than you, a fighter multiclass?"
Staggering back, Angelo rifled through his backpack looking for something else to use. He knew the invoker had 70% resistance to lightning, as well as fire, so both of those were out. Davaeorn's saving throws were also so good that a Wand of Paralyzation was not the safe bet it usually was. In such circumstances, the Wand of Frost was often a good fallback, so Angelo took aim and fired...
Davaeorn's cackle was pure malice as the beam of ice bounced off him and chilled Angelo to the bone. He'd forgotten about Davaeorn's Minor Spell Turning. To be honest, he thought that the Wand of Frost replicated Cone of Cold, a 5th level spell which should have overpower the 4 spell levels reflected by Minor Spell Turning, but obviously he was mistaken. He didn't know how many spell levels the Minor Spell Turning had left and hadn't the health to find out.
Upon reflection (see what I did there?), a nice way to deal with this would be to have memorised some Magic Missiles, as these could be safely bounced back onto Angelo since his Shield would absorb them.
The fight was not going according to plan, but Angelo was unwilling to throw in the towel. "You're right," he muttered through gritten teeth, "you are a better warrior and a wizard than me. But what you'll never, ever be is a better thief than me."
Davaeorn tittered, "And what do you mean by that, weak one?"
"My normal hits may be weak," Angelo retorted, "but you cannot fight what you cannot see or catch..." With that, he sprinted from the main chamber to the side chamber. Boosted by his Boots of Speed, Angelo knew that Davaeorn would be unable to keep up, affording him an opportunity to Hide in Shadows in the empty room before the invoker arrived.
"Your Stealth check failed," Davaeorn laughed as he turned the corner, "what now?"
"More of the same." Angelo continued around the circuit into the next open room, continuing his hiding attempts whenever the invoker was out of sight. He was quietly pleased to find that sometimes Davaeorn just gave up the chase and stood around waiting, but even if he did not, as long as Angelo did not alert the bedroom's occupants to his presence (he imagined, although he didn't want to, the senior guard and the battle horrors were having a nice ménage a trois), this tactic was a failsafe method of entering Stealth mode. And entering Stealth mode meant only one thing...
Davaeorn's AC became rather more manageable with the +4 attacking from Stealth bonus. The invoker frequently tried to renew his Mirror Image spells, but these were torn down by Detect Illusion. Slowly, one by one, the Stoneskin layers were stripped off and Davaeorn finally became vulnerable. It took a while, but Angelo was nothing if not patient.
"You didn't let me finish," Angelo remarked as his final blow took Davaeorn's head from his shoulders. "My normal hits may be weak, but you cannot fight what you cannot see or catch... and my backstabs are strong indeed."
Angelo looked northwards towards his next destination: the titular city of Baldur's Gate.
Executive Summary: Angelo completes the 'stealth-but-no-combat' in Baldur's Gate quests, including some thief-exclusives.
In contrast to my last few posts, this one is narration-light and content-heavy. I'll let you decide for yourselves whether this is a relief or a disappointment...
The sun was shining brightly as Angelo strode across Wyrm's Crossing and into Baldur's Gate. Saying he was an exotic nymph didn't evade the 6 GP tax, nor did it avoid summoning Scar, but Angelo signed up to investigating the Seven Suns anyway, because what else was he going to do?
- Pick Pocket Required (could substitute a thief for a familiar) - 4,500 XP
- Ordulinian (East BG) - 3,500 XP {you need to pickpocket Arkion's amulet and Nemphre's ring; giving Nemphre Arkion's ring will grant 1,000 XP, but you then cannot pickpocket Arkion's amulet from her and so cannot complete Ordulinian's quest without combat}
- Brielbara (North East BG) - 1,000 XP {you need to pickpocket Yago's Book of Curses}
- Thief Required (cannot substitute a thief for a familiar) - 4,000 XP
- Alatos (East BG) - 4,000 XP {non-thieves can complete this quest, but since only thieves are offered Narlen's quests, only non-thieves can complete this without combat; non-thieves may as well not complete this, since in Chapter 7, most of the thieves' guild's occupants (including Resar) will be dead and their corpses can be safely looted}}
This was one reason why Angelo didn't sweat too much about early combats. No need to grind hard for XP when you could sneak past most opponents and then the game just hurls XP at you for doing almost nothing. The other reason, of course, was that he was lazy. Because Angelo was trying not to abuse charm, he refused to complete the relevant Universal Quest using this method. However, this would still leave him with 29,900 XP (nearly 20% of the XP cap!) without having to fight anything.Since his imp familiar was 13th century technology, Angelo used his virtual assistant Felicity to access https://pihwiki.bgforge.net/Baldur's_Gate:_Ultimate_Pickpocket_Reference to check out pickpocketing opportunities. Discounting miscellaneous fluff, Angelo picked out some (subjective) highlights:
This complication aside, he systematically completed the 'Thief Quests' and 'Universal Quests Not Involving Charm'. He decided that he would not pickpocket Alai or Naaman since he wanted to kill the Iron Throne inhabitants personally - a decision that he would later come to regret - but we're getting ahead of ourselves... before we describe Angelo's escapades with the Iron Throne, we have the small matter of getting poisoned and how Angelo resolved the outstanding 'Universal Quest Not Involved Charm'...
If it was not obvious already, I've set this up as an aide-memoire to myself (and others) for all of the available 'stealth-but-no-combat' quests in this part of the game. If I think of any others (or, more likely, someone else reminds me!), I'll edit them into the post. This won't affect the rest of the narrative (e.g. if someone reminds me of a 5,000 XP quest, I'd change the totals in this post from their original value of 44,900 XP to 49,900 XP, but the story will continue as if Angelo had only earned 44,900 XP).
I completed it last night in a roundabout (quite literally) manner. If that doesn't give it away, I'll describe my method when I get to it in Angelo's adventures... although I don't obey your criteria to the letter, I do in spirit in that I don't use charm at any point.
Executive Summary: Angelo kills the Bitch Queen by fighting dirty and kills Marek by fighting dirtier still.
Can everyone join in a moment's collective silence for quite how groanworthy the pun in the title was?
"Stop meddling in the Iron Throne's affairs," Marek growled.
"Honestly, gentlemen," Angelo insisted, "I desire only the minimum interaction with the Iron Throne that the game's plot will allow." This was a lie, as Angelo was already planning how he'd take down Zhalimar Cloudwulfe et al, but he knew what he should say (and what, in future playthroughs, he would do).
"Enough," Marek gasped with a wave of his hand as he skulked off. "Just quit it, okay." Lothander followed, rather more quickly than in vanilla BG... obviously his Boots of Speed were an Enhanced Edition addition. Had Angelo been in a party, this would have earmarked Lothander for certain death, but he was playing solo and had killed Drasus, so he let it pass.
Barely 10 seconds later, when Angelo just happened to be wandering central Baldur's Gate, he ran into Lothander again. Entering the diviner's tent as directed, the wise old sage looked him in the eye. "What question would you like answered for your 50 GP fee?"
"In vanilla BG, was there a legitimate way to kill Scar? He was immune to everything but magic missiles... and I once had a party of six 9th level invokers waste all their spells and wands to no avail."
"You're not as funny as you think you are," the diviner sighed.
"Fine, how do you cure Lothander of his Geas?"
"Meh, I dunno," the diviner shrugged. "Go ask Jalantha Mistmyr."
"You're not as funny as you think you are either," Angelo snapped as he left the tent.
Angelo decided that he'd just kill Jalantha and take the Geas scroll (and Tremain's son's body, if he hadn't already completed Varci Roarington's quest) from her body. To do this, he'd need to stop the other priestesses from ganging up on him: apart from multiple Hold Person casts, one of them had a nasty Animate Dead spell. As priestesses, their saves v spell were terrible, but for some reason, they didn't turn hostile if they didn't make their save. Better yet, whenever one priestess turned hostile, she did not alert the other priestesses. This allowed Angelo to blind each one individually, which was very helpful.
Curiously, the priestess with Animate Dead started casting it immediately upon being blinded. Even more curiously, it was not the tough-as-nails skeleton warrior that a priestess of her LoB-enhanced level should have summoned, but a weak skeleton that even Angelo could beat without too much hassle. Picking a bone with this skeleton, Angelo proceeded to blind all 5 ladies of Tymora. Now all that remained was their leader...
Switching tactics, Angelo hoped to try and repeatedly backstab Jalantha using hit-and-fade, but he realised he'd made a mistake by choosing to fight in the early afternoon. In BG:EE, attempting to Stealth outdoors in broad daylight cuts your Stealth success rate by 1/2 (whereas trying to Stealth indoors in lit condition incurs a penalty of 1/3). Angelo's Stealth percentage was so low that even when he stood in a shadowy corner, it took so long to Stealth that he could not get Jalantha's health down quickly enough (her AC wasn't amazing, but not too shabby either).
Worse, as a C/T herself, Jalantha could also Stealth... and her skills were much better. Angelo would often leave the temple, Stealth and come back in to find that she'd completely disappeared. He could not maintain Stealth mode and Detect Illusions simultaneously, not that this mattered since Jalantha's thief skills were classed as non-magical (i.e. not an illusion), so he couldn't have detected her with 100% DI (much less the 75% he currently had). The only saving grace was that, as a C/T, she didn't have many options to backstab him with - since she used a flail, rather than a quarterstaff or club, she'd picked one of the ineffective ones - but it was still irritating to be fed his own medicine.
Rather embarrassingly, as a result of this, his Blind spells were beginning to wear off (they 'only' lasted 4 hours). Angelo knew that he couldn't reliably maintain door hopping if all the priestesses awakened: even if they had no spells, they would crowd the door, surrounding him. Angelo's health was already running low, but he knew that he couldn't rest to heal, else everyone would also have full spells and still be hostile upon his return. This battle had been pretty straightforward without SCS - Angelo was screwing it up badly!
Having regenerated sufficiently, Angelo strode back into the temple with new tactics. As predicted, the priestesses had surrounded the door, but he ran around the walkways, luring them away and opening the avenue of escape. Taking potshots at Jalantha, Angelo made for the door as soon as she disappeared into the shadows. He stopped short of the exit, allowing Jalantha the possibility of hitting him should she desire, but Angelo's overriding concern was not to allow himself to get surrounded... and standing right next to the exit ensured that he could always escape if required. If things got too hairy, he could always regenerate outside before coming back in for another round.
Jalantha's Stealth prolonged the combat, but she couldn't do enough with it to end the battle decisively. Eventually, she was cut down by Angelo's vicious scimitar and he snatched the Geas scroll before leaving the shocked princesses to clean up his mess.
Positioning himself by the entrance of the alcove, Angelo released a blast from his Wand of Paralysation at the initially neutral Marek. Immediately hiding in the storeroom so that Marek couldn't register where he was, Angelo checked the UI to see if it had worked. If it hadn't, Angelo planned to cast Invisibility, run away, rest and turned the following day to do basically the same thing. If he'd continued the fight, he knew Marek would Stealth while Angelo was out of his sight, erect his defences and go to town with Chromatic Orb and backstabbing. This way, Marek would initially be hostile, but his script would have reset and if Angelo sneaked back into the alcove while invisible, there was no way that Marek could stop Angelo from either initially stunning him or running out of charges (although given Marek's brace of Charm Persons in his sequencer, support from the Greenstone Amulet may be required).
As it happened, the -4 to Marek's save versus wands was enough and and the blast stopped him clean in his tracks first try. Angelo knew he only had 10 rounds to finish Marek off: he couldn't guarantee a second successful stun and if Marek managed to get his defences up, Angelo would have to start again. Angelo also knew that casting Blind before leisurely finishing Marek off wouldn't work either. Even if he saved his saving throw, as soon as the stun wore off, the globe would automatically kick in and its immunity to level 1-3 spells would somehow disable the Blind that had already been applied, along with further paralysation attempts.
Using the Invisibility that he'd reserved to escape if necessary, Angelo guaranteed himself a successful backstab. Inbetween sword slashes, he released Magic Missiles, wanting to cause as much damage as quickly as possible...
"The term 'trading blows' implies a two-way interaction," Angelo remarked to Felicity as he finished Marek off, "and that's the last thing I want."
Combining Marek's and Lothander's antidotes, Angelo felt the 15,000 XP ripple through his body (Angelo actually had to physically drink them this time... back in vanilla BG, simply having both in your inventory was enough!). Together with the Eagle Bow he'd taken from Marek, he felt stronger than before. Strong enough to take on the Iron Throne!
Executive Summary: Using a full array of cheap tricks, Angelo kills all of Sarevok's associates.
Fair warning: the narrative approach is back and bigger than before. There are lots of tricky details in this fight and although it's not really possible to give an 100% reliable method for a battle with this many opponents (without using charm, of course), there are enough strategies here to adapt to any situation.
As he ascended the Iron Throne headquarters, Angelo was beginning to rethink his vow to take down their flunkies. He'd read in the Tome of Wisdom/SCS readme that Kaalos the thief, Gardush the berserker and Shennara the F/T had been added to this battle... as if Alai the F/M, Zhalimar Cloudwulfe the berserker, Diyab the C/T, Aasim the F/C, Naaman the enchanter and Emissary Tar the doppelganger weren't enough!
However, in the words of Olenna Tyrell, who knew a thing about the Iron Throne, "Once the cow's been milked, there's no squirting the cream back up her udder, so here we are to see things through."
Aasim doesn't turn hostile if he fails his save...
... and neither does Diyab!
Angelo's next move was to go back to the original corner by the right stairs. Despite the fact that Aasim and Diyab were blinded, Stealth check modifiers are made based on what you characters see, rather than the other way around. Hence, since Angelo could see the now hostile-but-motionless pair, he would automatically fail his Stealth check... so to avoid tipping off Zhalimar, he'd have to cast Invisibility before moving. Fancy footwork.
Angelo then cast Mirror Image on himself (which didn't dispel Invisibility) and then Blind on Emissary Tar. Angelo knew that blinding Emissary Tar would have no ultimate consequence: even if she died before Zhalimar was activated, she would be reborn as a doppelganger as soon as combat started.
This is only to illustrate the doppelganger rebirth and doesn't form part of the narrative.
It's easy not to bother casting Mirror Image before you blind Emissary Tar and hope to tank Shennara's first backstab. But if she saves against your first charge and you have to wait until the next round to try again, you'll be glad of those mirror images!
Once Shennara fell back, stunned, Angelo knew he had 10 rounds to hack her to pieces. Unfortunately, Angelo could neither maneouvre behind her to backstab nor (else he risked alerting the others) nor had he the space to summon Felicity for assistance. Since all his 1st level spells were filled with Blind, he also couldn't rely on Magic Missiles for further damage. However, he could still guarantee the kill without using any potions or other charges...
As predicted, Shennara could not withstand the sustained assault.
Subsequent testing has shown that, contrary to my expectation, none of the associates except Zhalimar care if you slaughter Shennara or Kaalos in their sight. This allows you the option of casting Detect Invisibility right away to dispel their Stealth (they start off hostile).
Shennara and Kaalos start on either sides of the potplants.
Wasting not and wanting not, Angelo then proceeded to shoot Aasim to death. Strangely, whereas Angelo knew the associates would immediately would run to Diyab's defence, it was only upon Aasim's death that they roused themselves. Angelo was prepared for this, though, and cast his second Invisibility (he'd stolen the Amulet of Metaspell Influence from Razamith, so he had three level 2 spells).
Occasionally, Alai and Diyab cast spells to detect invisibility, even though they don't have them memorised and there's nothing in-game that should tip you off to your presence (i.e. SCS makes them cheat). Fortunately, you can block this using the Cloak of Non-Detection and the door's entrance will be so far away from them that it won't dispel your imp's invisibility.
Whipping out another Wand of Fire, Angelo shot Fireball after Fireball down the corridor, retreating behind the corner as soon as he released each blast. Most of the time, the remaining associates would suck up the blasts without complaint - they could not see their assailant and weren't bothered enough to investigate - but the berserkers would occasionally wander around looking in the rooms. Unfortunately, with Felicity blocking the door, they would never find Angelo and would eventually meander back into the central chamber to receive another blast.
Again, Angelo stopped when the wand had 1 charge remaining, vowing to sell-rebuy again later. After waiting for a successful Stealth check, Angelo moved past Felicity and checked out who was still alive. Emissary Tar, Naaman and Alai had perished in the assault, but Zhalimar, Gardush and Diyab were still alive, albeit barely. That was enough for Angelo, who sneaked back, re-entered Stealth mode and proceeded to the next stage.
There is no guarantee that Naaman and Alai will be killed in other playthroughs, but the next steps would be the same regardless. Shennara begins outside the radius of the fireballs, which is why we took her out first, and if you don't block the door off, she can find and backstab you, altering everyone to your presence. Aasim wouldn't be too difficult to kill in this stage, but you know what they say about gift horses...
The UI notified Angelo that in addition to Diyab and Gardush, Kaalos had also been alerted to Angelo's presence. He'd started on the left of floor 5, so had been undisturbed by the events so far, but activating him was not good news. More backstab-happy than Shennara, Angelo did not want to fight him at all, really... much less with an angry Diyab and Gardush in tow. So when he drew back from Gardush and Diyab's retaliation and stuffed Felicity into his tunic, he fled downstairs to the 4th floor, hoping to split the remaining associates up.
Kaalos duly obliged, descending to engage Angelo while Diyab and Gardush remained behind. He was left disappointed, though, as by the time he'd gone down the stairs, Angelo was back up the other set, and his AI was so flustered that he stayed there feeling lonely. Had Angelo been followed by more pursuers, he could have shaken them off by repeating the floor-hopping and combining with hit-and-fade tactics as required.
The nice thing about fighting a C/T is that they can rarely benefit from their Stealth abilities to backstab properly, but they also don't utilise their ability to wear heavy armour and cast spells, as they must wear leather armour to use their thief skills. Combined with the fact that Diyab was also on death's door from the Fireball armageddon, Angelo quickly killed him, leaving only Gardush. Even with the Oil of Speed he'd drunk when he first saw Angelo, he was only a melee fighter and so was relatively straightforward to kite using the Boots of Speed. When a Blind spell failed to connect, Angelo resorted to basic arrows to get the job done... and they did.
Withdrawing to the balcony, Angelo released Felicity again before resting. Kaalos hadn't taken any damage anyway and Angelo had a final trick in mind for him.
Kaalos couldn't believe his luck when he saw the undefended imp. He couldn't find any sign of Angelo, but he would definitely settle for his familiar. Emerging from the shadows, he took aim at the Felicity's filmsy AC.
Angelo had already spotted Kaalos' imminent assault on Felicity flash up on his UI. Before Kaalos could complete his action, Felicity's shape had shifted into a mustard jelly and Kaalos cursed. Jellies were immune to backstab, so his attack wouldn't do full damage. Unfortunately, the situation was even worse than he'd anticipated.
Before he could blink, Angelo was on top of him wielding a Wand of Paralysation. Miraculously, Kaalos managed to resist the first charge, but he foolishly continued to attack Felicity the mustard jelly, who continued to be immune to his normal weapon. When Angelo fired another ray from his wand, Kaalos couldn't save a second time and once the turn's stun began, Angelo executed the same sequence as he had on Shennara. With Felicity's assistance, Kaalos' 261 HP became a mere formality.
"SCS thieves are so slimy," Angelo quipped as he wiped off Kaalos' Studded Leather Armour +2 while Felicity returned to her natural form. "Especially this one," he finished, putting both of them into his pack.
After talking to Thaldorn and stealing the letters in the back bedroom (either on their own would have done), Angelo left the Iron Throne building. He was glad that was over. After such a difficult fight, he yearned for some home comforts and to return to surroundings more familiar. After reading the letters he'd stolen, he realised that he wouldn't have to wait long...
The best treasure in this fight is probably Alai's Minor Sequencer scroll, the only one in BG:EE and SoD (unless you're wielding halberds and fancy Zhalimar's halberd +2). As mentioned before, a much easier way for Angelo to have obtained the scroll would have been to Pick Pocket Alai while invisible and then flee when you become visible. But F/M/T were never known for their wisdom...
Cure disease always cured blindness. The change SCS makes is to improve the AI so that it can actually take advantage of that. Heal also always cured blindness and I seem to remember I've got the optional SCS component that allows true seeing to cure blindness. I remember experimenting in the early days of playing this challenge and trying to blind Mad Arcand with a sorcerer. At that stage I hadn't installed the fix for LoB saving throws, so had a decent chance of success with each spell. I can't remember how many spells I had, but suspect it would have been 12 with the help of the ring of wizardry. I do remember I successfully blinded him 4 times during the combat - and on each occasion he cured himself with one of the above 3 options - relying on blindness to deal with a high level cleric is a dubious tactic with SCS
I don't believe stealth is affected by whether you're indoors or outdoors per se - though of course the lighting level can change as a result of moving. Thief detect illusion also works differently from the mage spell - it should detect both magical invisibility and non-magical stealth. I don't know if Jalantha has some unique ability to prevent that happening, but the general rule is certainly that DI is a good way to find hidden thieves.
I was aware that the AI casting Cure Disease to cure blindness was an SCS upgrade, but I didn't know that it cured blindness in BG:EE. Probably because I cannot recall ever being blinded in BG:EE...
As far as I know, the enemies I've been facing have been receiving a saving throw bonus as usual. Is it included in the latest patch (which I have) or must I download an external mod or fixpack?
I think I read something about the indoors/outdoors on a forum about this and being surprised by it myself, but I haven't tested it. Does anyone know the exact penalties regarding trying to Stealth in different lighting conditions? While we're here, I've also read in some places that Hide in Shadows affects the initial attempt to hide and that Move Silently influences attempts to maintain Stealth, whereas other places say that an average is taken. There's a lot of misinformation out there... can anyone set the record straight?
I have just tested this. After 'Ctrl+Y'-ing the other Iron Throne members, I goaded Shennara and Kaalos into attacking me. I let them leave my sight a second and sure enough, they used Stealth to disappear (no 'drinks potion of invisibility' sign came up). I also vanished using a potion of invisibility and I can figure out where they are because my character keeps veering around an invisible object rather than going in a straight line. Still, despite cheating to gain XP to put 100% in DI, switching it on and watching Angelo stand next to them for 2 minutes, they did not appear. And yet when I used a scroll of Detect Invisibility, they both suddenly appeared.
In another test, I wandered invisible around Iron Throne 5th floor with 100% DI and this didn't reveal Shennara or Kaalos, but as soon as I blinded Emissary Tar, Shennara appeared to beam in and backstab me. This is not because they start off neutral and so are not classed as 'nonfriendly' (just like you can sneak past initially neutral Drasus et al without incident, but as soon as they turn hostile, they cast divinations to dispel your illusions), since casting Detect Invisibility immediately shows them to begin as hostile.
Thieves often use any potions of invisibility they have before using Stealth, and this effect is dispelled by DI. But, at least on my install, I am 100% convinced that DI does not reveal Stealth. What I am not so sure of is my claim that enemy thieves can disappear like shadowdancers. It's very possible that I lost sight of them for a moment, and that's all it takes. Either way, if DI doesn't do the job, thieves can be a major headache.
The fault is with BGEE, not SCS. It might be fixed in the next update, but unless you've included a specific modded change your chance of success with spells in LoB is virtually the same as at any other difficulty level. In fact your chance of success is better with low level enemies. That's because LoB does reduce the saving throw die roll by 5, but it also increases the base saving throw required by 5. For most enemies those cancel each other out. However, for weaker enemies, if the base saving throw becomes 20 or more that is treated by the game as an automatic failure - irrespective of how great the adjustment to the throw is. Hence I suspect you will find that blinding things like kobolds is always successful in your installation.
The thing about separate effects was commonly said in the past, but is not true. Stealth is just the average of the two scores.
The variables from lighting are included here. This is one of a number of threads @Alonso compiled about aspects of Baldur's Gate where adequate explanations to apparently simple questions had never been published. He's done an exceptional job in asking deceptively simple questions and then distilling what were sometimes quite complex answers given to him into readily understandable form.
Thinking about it, I was wrong above - I was remembering detecting thieves using potions rather than stealth. The reason why that pair disappear like that though is not because they're shadowdancers, but because they are in an ambush situation - SCS uses a script in that situation to make them disappear rather than them having to make a stealth check. If they appear after attacking you, they won't be able to hide again while in sight (though they could use potions to disappear of course).
Executive Summary: Angelo sneaks through Candlekeep's Catacombs, killing a Prat who gets in his way.
Mercifully, this is a shorter update than the last one.
After receiving the History of the Nether Scrolls, Angelo appeared outside Candlekeep and encountered another SCS alteration. The ogre mages who had previously confined themselves to warehouse in BG Docks had decided to venture out. Unfortunately, although they thought they had the drop on Angelo, he had picked up the Horn of Kazgaroth from High Hedge and a quick trumpet gave him immunity to the Chromatic Orbs they hurled at him. It didn't last long, inflicted 10 crushing damage and, frankly, wasn't as good a counter as invisibility, but for a bit of variety, Angelo used its protection to chat to the warden and move into Candlekeep. One of the ogre mage's paralysis spells followed him inside the walls, but Angelo was safely out of harm's way.
When the Keeper of the Portal said, 'Hold, travellers!', Angelo took it literally.
Sometimes, the ogre mages follow the protagonist inside Candlekeep's walls. This didn't happen when I played it (i.e. I didn't save-scum to ensure it wouldn't occur), but it has happened in some tests I've done since. Personally, I feel this is rather unfair, but I supposed I've survived this far by abusing various loopholes in the game's engine. If they follow you, lost them outside the library with Invisibility (Horn of Kazgaroth's immunity only applies to external <2nd level spells).
First, Angelo looted the Potion of Clarity from Candlekeep Inn (strangely restocked since Angelo last pilfered it back in the Prologue) and picked up the Vocalise scroll from the 1st floor library (the only copy in BG:EE besides the one on Naaman's body - so Naaman was strictly a lesser priority Iron Throne Pick Pocket target than Alai). Angelo then grabbed a Ring of Protection +1 from a mysterious man named Koveras and decided not to bother with Brunos and Rieltar. The only thing of value to Angelo that they carried was another Potion of Clarity (although mages doing an 'Adventurer's Challenge' might be interested in their Potion of Genius)... but Angelo figured that his Greenstone Amulet was protection enough.
And that's exactly what he did. Apart from one small complication...
Prat and his cohorts were a curiosity to Angelo. On the one hand, they had the potential to unleash lots of needless pain; on the other, Sakul carried the only scroll of Wraithform in BG:EE (had Angelo been that way inclined, he would also have cherished Prat's Throwing Axe +2). Wraithform wasn't nearly as useful to a F/M/T as it was to a F/M, but Angelo had made the mistake of spurning the sole chance of getting Spell Thrust and he wasn't going to make the same mistake again.
Standing in the corner by the entrance, Angelo put the wand of fire he'd found in the 1st floor of catacombs to good use.
Prat and Tam both gave chase, but while Tam the archer was easily disabled via Blind, Prat was not so loosely shaken off. He had good saving throws and was able to cast Haste on himself, making him difficult to evade. Worse, his AC was so good that neither kiting nor backstabbing seemed feasible. Luckily, though, he was already severely weakened from the earlier blasting and a few shots of Agannazar's Scorcher (also from the wand) was enough to kill him. After that, shooting blind Tam in the chest felt easier than shooting fish in a barrel.
Ignoring the assorted spiders and basilisks, Angelo sneaked through to the end of the Candlekeep Catacombs to see a surprising face. "Wasn't expecting to see anyone here," Angelo remarked to Diarmid, who seemed not to hear him because Angelo was invisible. Which wasn't really how invisibility works, but this abuse of the game enigne was pale in comparison to the one that Angelo was about to commit...
Felicity's earlier scan of the Pick Pocket opportunities available in BG:EE had convinced Angelo that it was not the best use of his precious skill points. Worse, as Angelo was not using charm, any skill check failure caused its targets to become irrevocably hostile, and since Diarmid was unkillable at this stage in the game (even trusty Ctrl+Y fails), Angelo wasn't keen on letting this happen. But Diarmid was also one of the handful of special cases who disappeared after presenting a line of dialogue... and this abrupt script change would override any prospective hostility they would feel after a failed Pick Pockets check.
Hence, even though he failed in his second attempt to pickpocket Diarmid (the first had yielded a rare Protection from Magic scroll), Angelo was unconcerned. He simply talked to Diarmid in the short interim before Diarmid turned hostile, Diarmid spouted some rubbish that Angelo already knew, Diarmid's script flipped and he wandered off out of the cavern. "Hopefully, you'll be missing that protection scroll if I meet you again," Angelo mused wistfully, "but probably not."
Once a mainstay of vanilla BG abuse, this 'force-talking' has, to my knowledge, largely been fixed in BG:EE. Talking to Algernon if your Pick Pocket attempt fails, for instance, does not stop him from going hostile. However, if the target's variables change after dialogue, then they can be safely pickpocketed using this technique. Other examples include pilfering Shandalar's scroll selection before informing him of your success in Ice Ise and stealing Kirinhale's staff-spear +2 before telling her that you've given Riggilo her hair (although I think you need > 50% PP for that, since it's in her quick items (rather than her inventory), which is why Angelo never attempted it).
As he emerged from underneath the walls of Candlekeep, Angelo was pleased to see the outside world again. Stealthily evading the ogre mages congregated around the gated entrance (why hadn't the Keeper of the Portal shooed them away?!), Angelo left his hometown for good. Before he went back to Baldur's Gate, he had a few errands to run, tasks that would take him to the windswept village of Ulgoth's Beard...
Interesting reading for the thief skills post. It was roughly in line with my expectations (glad to see that hiding in lit indoor settings was different to hiding in daylight), but I was unaware of several subtleties. I agree with your shadowdancer/ambush point - when I tested it more carefully, there was always an instant where they escaped my line of sight - and I will adjust my posts accordingly. I'd like to do my bit to prevent the spread of duff information and if I'm spouting fallacies left, right and centre, then I'll own up and fix it.
Speaking of retroactively changing posts, I edited my post to delete the bit about not redoing my run, as I thought it was a little cheeky, but you obviously quoted it first! I've been trying as much as possible to ensure that any strategies I use are repeatable without relying too much on 'lucky' dice rolls and so on. Hopefully this will minimise the damage that creatures suffer if they're missing a saving throw bonus.
The only example I can think of where (given enough time and/or charges) a failed save is not guaranteed was, somewhat ironically, in the last post (although I suppose Neira could have repeatedly made her save against the Blind). The two thieves need not necessarily fail their saves v paralysation and it's difficult to engage them in melee without alerting Zhalimar. Originally, I'd planned to eliminate the other associates (using some combination of steps 3 and 4) and omit the thieves entirely... perhaps I'll revert back to that!
I suspected this was the reason why she seemed strangely invulnerable. However, I've just tested it and I'm pretty sure I can't kill her without activating the encounter.
Thief stealth is indeed unbreakable by a thief's Detect Illusions ability; it only works on other forms of invisibility (I think the Staff of the Magi's invisibility is also unbreakable). You can bait SCS thieves into breaking stealth with a summoned critter and then reveal them when they drink a Potion of Invisibility to once again disappear.