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Hilarious video on Siege of Dragonspear, had to share!

StorytellerStoryteller Member Posts: 38
Loved this video. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Siege, but this guy nails Beamdog to the wall on some of the things they got wrong. Thought you might enjoy checking it out.
Wandering_Minstrel

Comments

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited January 2017
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
    ronaldoQuartzMoomintroll
  • Sylvus_MoonbowSylvus_Moonbow Member Posts: 1,085
    edited January 2017
    WRONG
  • StorytellerStoryteller Member Posts: 38
    edited January 2017
    chimaera said:

    "Us old people"?
    ...

    You know, as one of those gamers who played the game back when it came out, I really don't appreciate it when a reviewer decides that he is going to speak for all the old timers. We are not a mass of sheeple, everyone has their own opinions and criticism, so why not present yours as just that: yours? Do you need that ego stroking to pretend everyone agrees with you by speaking in plural?

    The message I got was that the vast majority of people who are likely to buy the remake of a game that is almost 20 years old is likely to be an older set with their own established likes and dislikes about certain aspects of a game. Because given that Baldur's Gate is an RPG, characters are an aspect of the game that are most well-loved by fans, and changing characters is most likely to anger fans of the original. That's not 'speaking for everyone', that's making a logical assumption to describe something that DID happen.
    Gallowglass
  • StorytellerStoryteller Member Posts: 38

    He flat out says he didn't play the game. So he doesn't know what he's talking about. He's going on pure hearsay. And do we really need to go around and around about this for the thousandth time? OP, I can only conclude that your intention is to troll the forum.

    Nonsense, this is a forum discussing Siege of Dragonspear, isn't it? And is this video I enjoyed, and decided to share, not about Siege of Dragonspear? Your claim that he doesn't know what he's talking about isn't accurate, the things the reviewer pointed out are in the game, as I can attest to. I actually bought and played Siege, I have 900 hours clocked on Steam on BGEE. So saying he 'doesn't know what he's talking about' is kind of disingenuous, as is claiming I'm a 'troll'.
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 2,666
    it's videos like this thats the reason we have no real reviews of sod on youtube. type in sige of dragon speear reviews and all you get is drama videos telling people not to buy the game.
    CrevsDaakNimranQuartz
  • GallowglassGallowglass Member Posts: 3,356
    chimaera said:

    I recall there have been plenty of polarizing discussions about those "well-loved" characters back in ye olde days, because they certainly weren't that loved by everyone.

    No, hang on, the guy does have a logical point.

    Yes, there were always some people who disliked some of the characters (or other aspects) in the original games ... but those are generally unlikely to be the people who are still interested in the games 20 years later. No-one keeps on playing a game which they don't like, that'd be daft! Instead, they'll have moved on long ago to something they liked better.

    Therefore you're missing a key point when you say ...
    chimaera said:

    People that played the game 20 years ago are a very diverse group, who are connected only by age really

    ... because the group we're discussing are those who were playing 20 years ago and liked it so much that they're still playing. "Still playing" is a significant common factor in addition to age, and gives us more insight into their preferences.

    Thus, when considering the old-time players who are still playing BG and thereby among potential customers for SoD, it's a pretty solid assumption that a large majority of them are going to be people who liked the original games very much, specifically including liking the established personalities of the various NPCs. (There'll be individual variations, of course, and many of this cohort might have some NPC or another whom they don't like, but I'll bet that there's a big majority of the cohort in favour of retaining the personality of each NPC, even if the composition of that majority changes from case to case, because people who dislike lots of the NPCs won't be the people who stuck with BG.)

    On the other hand, even though I consider it logically acceptable for the reviewer and his defenders to assert that most old-time players are likely to be upset by personality changes to established characters, where I think the claim to speak for others is distinctly weaker is when he makes assumptions about what new content and new characters we old-timers may or may not like. The fact that we have in common a set of things which we like doesn't logically prove very much about what other things we may or may not like (save where that might be very directly contradictory to the things we are known to like).
    StorytellerQuartz
  • StorytellerStoryteller Member Posts: 38
    chimaera said:

    He is not making a logical assumption, because that should be based on something besides "because I think so".

    But isn't he? Like I said, in terms of the actual objectionable content of the game, everything he stated was factual. There was also a response against said content, that's also factual. The reviewer used a logical assumption to determine why. The particulars might be up for debate, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's just blowing this all out of his rear.
  • StorytellerStoryteller Member Posts: 38

    it's videos like this thats the reason we have no real reviews of sod on youtube. type in sige of dragon speear reviews and all you get is drama videos telling people not to buy the game.

    I don't know about that, I posted a more than fair review on this forum and on Steam. It's just that people are going to naturally have issues when they feel ambushed and held hostage to a didactic and politically charged message in an entirely inappropriate time and place, such as a game.

    By the way, here's my review if you're interested in reading, I thought it was a good one. There are spoilers! https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/54361/final-impressions-of-siege-of-dragonspear-spoilers#latest
    [Deleted User]GallowglassQuartz
  • GallowglassGallowglass Member Posts: 3,356
    Thanks, @Storyteller, I'd missed that review when you first posted it - IIRC, I was too busy playing the game at that time! Yes, it's an intelligent review and pretty fair.
  •  TheArtisan TheArtisan Member Posts: 3,277
    I want five minutes of my life back.
    wubbleCrevsDaak
  • batoorbatoor Member Posts: 676
    edited January 2017
    Well with Safana the only thing that bothers me is that they didn't try to connect the whole Werewolf plot with Coran and Safana in BG2. That was always a random moment of ''wtf is this'' much like so many other BG1 npc moments in bg2. Instead Safana and Coran just split up at the start of SoD and there's no build up or foreshadowing as to why they would end up getting involved with werewolves. But that's just my opinion, I felt SoD could have done a better job bridging certain things to bg2.

    Granted I did find her obnoxious in SoD as well, but i didn't feel they ruined her character.

    chimaera said:

    I recall there have been plenty of polarizing discussions about those "well-loved" characters back in ye olde days, because they certainly weren't that loved by everyone.

    No, hang on, the guy does have a logical point.

    Yes, there were always some people who disliked some of the characters (or other aspects) in the original games ... but those are generally unlikely to be the people who are still interested in the games 20 years later. No-one keeps on playing a game which they don't like, that'd be daft! Instead, they'll have moved on long ago to something they liked better.

    Therefore you're missing a key point when you say ...
    chimaera said:

    People that played the game 20 years ago are a very diverse group, who are connected only by age really

    ... because the group we're discussing are those who were playing 20 years ago and liked it so much that they're still playing. "Still playing" is a significant common factor in addition to age, and gives us more insight into their preferences.

    Thus, when considering the old-time players who are still playing BG and thereby among potential customers for SoD, it's a pretty solid assumption that a large majority of them are going to be people who liked the original games very much, specifically including liking the established personalities of the various NPCs. (There'll be individual variations, of course, and many of this cohort might have some NPC or another whom they don't like, but I'll bet that there's a big majority of the cohort in favour of retaining the personality of each NPC, even if the composition of that majority changes from case to case, because people who dislike lots of the NPCs won't be the people who stuck with BG.)

    On the other hand, even though I consider it logically acceptable for the reviewer and his defenders to assert that most old-time players are likely to be upset by personality changes to established characters, where I think the claim to speak for others is distinctly weaker is when he makes assumptions about what new content and new characters we old-timers may or may not like. The fact that we have in common a set of things which we like doesn't logically prove very much about what other things we may or may not like (save where that might be very directly contradictory to the things we are known to like).
    Well with Safana, Khalid and Dynaheir and most of the npcs from bg1, aren't all that in-depth in the first place, so criticizing personality changes there..Hmm well I don't think they radically messed up any of those characters imo.

    Post edited by batoor on
    [Deleted User]
  • ArchaosArchaos Member Posts: 1,421
    deltago said:

    I stopped at 2:27 when I realized it was just a regurgitation of all points that have been previously brought up, and he wasn't actually playing the game to show examples, just talking over a screen cap. It seems to be a desperate attempt at click-baiting. Both when the author originally posted the video and OP now sharing of it.

    While I agree with the points roughly, the video is just that: a regurgitation.
    It was boring more than anything.
    "Here, let me jump on the bandwagon and tell you about the same things I heard, without any originality or effort put to it."

    His way of speaking was also kind of annoying, to be honest. Though it might have been his accent. *Shrug*
    [Deleted User]
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited January 2017
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
    [Deleted User]CrevsDaak
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 7,305
    I didn't watch the video, but I know it was just trying to force on me a particular political viewpoint and the video just got so many things wrong it reflects badly on the maker.

    Hmm, I can't help thinking the style of my above comment reminds me of something ...
  • batoorbatoor Member Posts: 676
    Oh Bruce..that was wonderful.
    BelgarathMTHCrevsDaak
  • NimranNimran Member Posts: 4,875
    Stopped when he said "retards". If I wanted to read or hear language like that, I'd go to another site.

    And no, they are not 'retards'. They are designers, programmers, professional writers, and BG fans. Doesn't sound like they are 'retards' to me.
    kcwisePekingduckman[Deleted User]CrevsDaak
This discussion has been closed.