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Would you be interested in adding some prestige classes (mod)?

Hey guys,

Here's a mod idea I've had for a while but never thought further of it.
I was considering prestige classes from 3+E, and thought it was a shame we couldn't have that in BG. Here's how I would consider implementing them:

-Prestige classes would be unavailable until a certain level is reached, depending on which prestige class you want. Vanilla classes will typically gain access to more prestige classes than kits, but kits will still get some. Some Prestige Classes will have extra conditions to become reachable (Alignment, attributes, race ...).

-A character could have multiple Prestige Classes. However, once reaching HLAs, the available HLAs will only be that of the active class. One may still start training a new Prestige Class upon reaching these epic levels.

- Prestige Class characters cannot dual class. But one can dual into a class, then gain a prestige class from their new class. Any kit effect from the original class will be lost if the character gains a prestige class before recovering their original abilities. (This is an engine limitation, only one kit at a time).

-Double and triple class characters will be able to choose between Prestige Classes of any of their classes. Once the choice is made, however, they won't be able to choose Prestige Classes from the other class. For example, a Fighter/Mage may become a Fighter/Arcane Scholar of Candlekeep, but once it is a Fighter/Arcane Scholar of Candlekeep, it cannot become a Frenzied Berserker.

- For every character, a limit of 4 (maybe less? "As balance dictates", I guess) total classes would be implemented, as in 3E. A single class counts as 1, a dual class as 2, a double class as 2, and a triple class as 3. Any Prestige Class taken afterwards counts as an extra 1. A kitted character has its class counter incremented by one compared to a vanilla-class character. A few examples for clarification: A vanilla mage may gain levels in 3 mage Prestige classes. A FMT will only be able to gain levels in one prestige class. A gnome Cleric/illusionist already has a class counter of 3 (2 from dual class, 1 from kit: illusionist), so it will only be able to gain levels in one Prestige Class.

- Once a character starts training a new prestige class, they can no longer get levels in a class, whether prestige, vanilla or kit, they used to have.

These classes would feature extra abilities and downsides compared to their vanilla class of origin, as well as a some custom HLAs
Most will still be stronger than the class they originate from, as well as than most kits, but this will be counterbalanced (by a malus to gained experience for example)

Some examples I thought of. Keep in mind that these are draft ideas, they still require a lot of maturation and balancing and are only a very small part of what could be done:


Mage

Arcane Scholar of Candlekeep: Available to Vanilla Mages from level 9. Their spell progression follows that of a vanilla mage, with no extra spell. Special abilities would include a form of Quicken Spell, a form of Empower Spells. Quicken Spell would reduce the casting time of spells for a certain duration, Empower Spells increase Elemental damage by a percentage for a certain duration.
Red Wizard of Thay: Available to Human, Non-Good specialist mages from level 11. They get further specialization into their school of predilection, which forbids them from learning spells from one more school (so now they have 2 forbidden schools). In exchange for that, they get extra spellcasts, extra bonus saving throws against their school, and access to one new unique spell of their specialization school per spell level. Note that this might not be available as soon as the mod is released, should it ever be:
it highly depends on whether someone find a way of making specialist mage subkits that benefit from the hardcoded bonus specialist mages get (malus to enemy saving throws when using spells of the specialized school etc...) on which a discussion is currently had in this thread

Archmage: Available to Vanilla Mages from level 18. An archmage can use Arcana Fire, a blast of raw magic energy, or the ability to cast certain spells changing the elemental type of damage that spell deals. E.G. An acid Fireball or a cold Abi-Dalzim's Horrid Wilting. An archmage may use touch spells from a distance (30 feets)



Fighter

Weapon Master: Available to Vanilla fighters from level 9. A Weapon Master immediately forgets about any weapon specialization it has had except for its weapon of choice, as well as the corresponding fighting style, either single weapon or two-handed weapon, which is granted 2 pips. It gains Grandmastery in its weapon of choice. A weapon master can only become proficient with other weapons. A Weapon Master gets extended crit range and crit damage when using its weapon of choice, along with other bonuses.

Frenzied Berserker: Available to Berserker and Barbarian from level 9. A Frenzied berserker gets various Power Attack mod, giving a +x malus to thac0 along with a +x (or +1.5x for two handed weapons) bonus to damage, as well as a special fury that massively increases strength and constitution while decreasing AC. That frenzy progresses with the fighter's level.

Anointed Knights: Available to both vanilla Paladin and vanilla Fighters from level 9. An Anointed Knight gets the ability to use special oils and potions on their weapons to give them temporary effects.




These were just draft ideas, like I said, but and I have more for thieves, clerics, bards, and most other base classes. Most of them would be adapted from existing 3+E prestige classes.





I guess you got the idea, please tell me what you think.

The primary aim is to allow much more customisation to your characters, as well as to give some love to vanilla classes, because hardly anyone uses them right now, as a viable alternative to kits, more lategame-oriented. The possibilities are close to limitless (well I guess 256 kits is the limit we get, and I must ). Here are many more Prestige Classes that could be ultimately implemented:
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Prestige_classes



@Experimented Modders: Here's how I plan on processing, if you care to give any better idea on how to manage the mod:

I'll add some new lines to all CLAB tables, granting one-use special abilities to change class at level 1. These abilities will trigger a dialogue that will describe the prestige class and either say you don't match the criteria, and depending on what criteria it is, remove the ability or let you keep it, or ask for confirmation you want to change class, and then will change your kit, give you your first level abilities and increment the class counter variable. The criteria will be divided into two categories:
-Those that can change (Attributes, Reputation, level, alignment (to a certain extent only since you can become NE during Hell Trials)...). These will allow you to keep the ability
-Those that cannot change (Race,...). These will remove the ability
Then, upon gaining a level in your prestige class, a local variable will be incremented, and a dialogue will give you the abilities that correspond to that level by testing the variable's value.
I'll also add a spell that triggers on character creation to set the value of the class counter based on whether it's a kit or not, and a multiclass or not.


@Moderators: since it's not really a mod announcement - I'm waiting for people's reaction to decide whether I do anything - and I'm looking for as many reactions as I can get, I posted this in general discussion rather than general modding. Move it if you think another board would be more appropriate.

Kamigoroshi

Comments

  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,833
    I never was particularly fond of the concept of prestige classes. The very name itself reflects the problem: they're totally superior to the base classes, so the only reason not to be one is because you don't fit the requirements--they don't come with any disadvantages once you qualify.

    That being said, I have always been fond of kit mods, and I'd love to try out some new kits if they're markedly different than the base classes. I will summon @subtledoctor, @Grammarsalad, and @Aquadrizzt to solicit their wisdom.

    ArunsunOrlonKronsteen
  • ArunsunArunsun Member Posts: 1,590
    edited July 2017

    I never was particularly fond of the concept of prestige classes. The very name itself reflects the problem: they're totally superior to the base classes, so the only reason not to be one is because you don't fit the requirements--they don't come with any disadvantages once you qualify.

    That being said, I have always been fond of kit mods, and I'd love to try out some new kits if they're markedly different than the base classes. I will summon @subtledoctor, @Grammarsalad, and @Aquadrizzt to solicit their wisdom.

    I'm still looking at how I could make them balanced. My first idea is to apply a nerf to experience. Maybe a -30% exp malus? That would certainly do the trick in full parties, but it wouldn't be that meaningful when soloing.

    semiticgoddess
  • AquadrizztAquadrizzt Member Posts: 1,018
    If I may, what purpose does a prestige class serve that is not already handled by kits, multi-/dual-classing and HLAs? Prestige classes in 3E seem to exist to fill one of a few purposes:

    - cool new abilities piled onto a character with a high level in a base class (Archmage/Hierophant/Thamaturge/Frenzied Berserker)
    - enabling multiclassing without massive downsides (Eldritch Knight, Arcane Trickster, Mystic Theurge)
    - focusing on a single element of their wider abilities (Loremaster for divination magic, Assassin for sneak attacks, Weapon Master for a specific weaponetc.)

    First category = HLAs or kit abilities unlocked at higher levels
    Second category = multiclassing, dual-classing and multiclass kits
    Third category = how all kits are intended to function

    I don't want to discourage you, but I think that a lot of the work spent developing this extensive multiclass system (which would be incredibly fragile and likely break SCS) could be better spent just developing new kits for the existing classes that function within the existing class system.

    To address the kit suggestions in your top post:
    - Arcane Scholar: you could have it be a mage kit that gained metamagic type abilities at various levels (I actually have had one of these sketched out for Tome and Blood for a while, although I never got around to it)
    - Red Wizard: give them a bonus spell slot (on top of the specialist one) and add one or two restricted schools.
    - Archmage: could be implemented as new Mage HLAs available to all Mages/Sorcerers
    - Weapon Master: literally the same as the Revised Kensai from Might and Guile but only kicking in at level 9+
    - Frenzied Berserker: could be implemented as a stance that gives -X to attack and +X to damage for melee weapons.
    - Anointed Knight: make it a kit with access to alchemy/special oils/what have you via innate abilities.

    Also several of the suggestions you included feature the character losing access to abilities once they choose certain prestige classes (e.g. losing your proficiency points in weapons with Weapon Master or losing spells you know with Red Wizard). This will make building towards these classes a tedious process, as now you would have to be very careful to not gimp your character by investing in abilities that you will eventually lose.

    semiticgoddessArunsunOrlonKronsteen
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,833
    If you're going to implement an XP penalty as a means of balancing the kits, bear in mind that their impact varies dramatically in the context of HLAs. A sorcerer with a 30% XP penalty will only be a single level behind a normal sorcerer for most of the game, but it also means it needs another 900,000 XP to reach HLAs, so it'll be a huge handicap in the late game.

    Arunsun
  • ArunsunArunsun Member Posts: 1,590

    If you're going to implement an XP penalty as a means of balancing the kits, bear in mind that their impact varies dramatically in the context of HLAs. A sorcerer with a 30% XP penalty will only be a single level behind a normal sorcerer for most of the game, but it also means it needs another 900,000 XP to reach HLAs, so it'll be a huge handicap in the late game.

    Which is exactly the idea, not being too penalizing for early game, harder to play in the midgame, and outshining vanilla kits lategame. The 30% was just a figure I threw there, it might need more, or less

    If I may, what purpose does a prestige class serve that is not already handled by kits, multi-/dual-classing and HLAs?

    Well this mod would aim at allowing multiple prestige classes, on top of kits, with still that 4 class limit 3E imposes, to give much more customization capabilities to your character builds. It's a sort of implementation of the 3E class system to BG, with a counterpart being slower leveling up.



    I don't want to discourage you, but I think that a lot of the work spent developing this extensive multiclass system (which would be incredibly fragile and likely break SCS) could be better spent just developing new kits for the existing classes that function within the existing class system.

    I am not sure why it would be so fragile or why it would break SCS. It pretty much uses the same system you or @Artemius_I use with respectively TnB and the Shadow Magic mod to give the abilities, and picking a prestige class is not a must so it won't have any influence on enemies (except that they will have special abilities they won't use anyway because they are not scripted to use them). Well, of course if it breaks SCS I will give up on this mod and make it happen some other way, SCS is a must-have, but if you could be a bit more precise (I am still an amateur in terms of modding) I would greatly appreciate it. I could consider modifying some enemies to give them prestige class and modify their scripting but this is entirely new project that would take years.



    Also several of the suggestions you included feature the character losing access to abilities once they choose certain prestige classes (e.g. losing your proficiency points in weapons with Weapon Master or losing spells you know with Red Wizard). This will make building towards these classes a tedious process, as now you would have to be very careful to not gimp your character by investing in abilities that you will eventually lose.

    Mmh it might be different in PnP but in NWN2 Red Wizards don't forget the spells from the school that becomes forbidden, they keep them, but just can't learn new ones. I was planning on doing that.
    Concerning Weapon Master, well, if it's a class you take at level 9 as a pureclass fighter you should have exactly 7 proficiency points, which is grandmastery in one weapon +2 points in the corresponding fighting style. This design is quite similar to that of the 3E weapon master: one weapon with which it's good, with the others it's just a subpar warrior.

  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,876
    edited July 2017
    The concept in itself really reminds me of Pathfinder:
    • Base Classes => Kitless
    • Archetypes => Kits
    • Prestige Classes => This mod concept
    I'm generally all for more character building options. So I'm really interested where this mod idea leads you. :)


    Alternatively, you could create something akin to a "trait system". Which compliments races, kits and alignments alike as you level up. For instance:
    • a Ranger could pick an 'Urban Ranger' trait that let him summon street dogs. Or grants a bonus to hide in shadows while in settlements.
    • a racial trait for Half-Elves with thicker Elf blood than Human blood. Granting a bonus to sleep resistance (or other elvish stuff, such as longswords)
    • a Cleric who received a divine mark on their body. Strengthening their faith and lessens the chance for moral failure.
    • a Thief could pick up a Lucky Coin along the way. This trait would place a 'coin' object in the inventory which makes dealing with merchants a little easier.
    • an 'Alpha Familar' trait for arcane spellcasters. It could grant the familiar the ability to summon more of its kind. Just imagine: A stampede of fluffy rabbits! >:D
    Needless to say such traits would be overall weak. And more outlets for roleplaying possibilities than filling a strategic role in battle. So it's quite different from your concept of prestige classes. But I'm still throwing this out for brainstorming's sake. :)

    OrlonKronsteen
  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 2,307
    edited July 2017
    @Arunsun

    Look, Ranger (for example) is already an "enriched" Fighter. The XP table reflects the prestige aspect of the Ranger class compared to the essentially base Fighter in 2e.

    Then you have a Ranger kit. Ranger kits are undoubtedly an "enriched" Ranger...but there's no penalty this time: it's because balance has been eschewed here, to make players happier but essentially, a kit is just "free prestige". In the case of Ranger it's the second tier of prestige-ness.

    Now to add a THIRD tier of prestige on top of that would be ...i'm looking for the right word... overwrought. like too baroque. heavy on form and light on substance, things start getting diluted. if there's the third tier of prestige-ness, why stop there? why not make a modular system as in every innate ability, passive kit advantage or HLA you choose makes your levelling more expensive by 5% or something like that?

    edit:

    for example, picking a kit disadvantage (via dialogue, with an npc for example), such as not being able to use ranged weapons makes you get 10% bonus experience, giving up the ability to have grandmastery, another 10%, while picking a kit advantage such as kensai melee passive bonuses makes you get -30% experience. and picking berzerk, at some later point also -30% experience, so you get -40% experience, and level very slowly, but become a kenzerker-without-grandmastery

    Post edited by bob_veng on
    OrlonKronsteen
  • ArunsunArunsun Member Posts: 1,590
    bob_veng said:

    if you're doing this for the reasons i think you are, which is giving the player some actual choices in how their character develops, well then kits themselves could be "prestige classes", i.e. you always start as a pureclass guy and when conditions are met (find trainer, swear oath to a deity, read book, become a lycanthrope etc. + reach level + pay experience), you can pick a kit, and that's about the only way you can get a kit.

    if it's an overpowered kit (like berserker), then you have to "pay" a bigger amount of experience (for example 100k). that's how you could even kits out a bit and add that "prestige" element that you have to sacrifice something to get something better

    this would do a lot for roleplaying i think. it would also be a good way to get cleric kits (you go to a temple and become a priest of that god), and especially obscure kits that are thematically hard to reconcile with your upbringing

    An idea I simply love, which I would push further for roleplay's sake (a trainer gives you a quest, and once you complete that you get you have completed your training and can claim your kit) but alas I don't think it's really doable, if only because it would be inconsistent with many existing kit mods. What I could do however would be making such NPCs and Quest to actually get the prestige class.

    The concept in itself really reminds me of Pathfinder:

    • Base Classes => Kitless
    • Archetypes => Kits
    • Prestige Classes => This mod concept
    I'm generally all for more character building options. So I'm really interested where this mod idea leads you. :)


    Alternatively, you could create something akin to a "trait system". Which compliments races, kits and alignments alikes as you level up. For instance:
    • a Ranger could pick an 'Urban Ranger' trait that let him summon street dogs. Or grants a bonus to hide inshadows while in settlements.
    • a racial trait for Half-Elves with thicker Elf blood than Human blood. Granting a bonus to sleep resistance (or other elvish stuff, such as longswords)
    • a Cleric who received a divine mark on their body. Strengthening their faith and lessens the chance for moral failure.
    • a Thief could pick up a Lucky Coin along the way. This trait would place a 'coin' object in the inventory which makes dealing with merchants a little easier.
    • an 'Alpha Familar' trait for arcane spellcasters. It could grant the familiar the ability to summon more of its kind. Just imagine: A stampede of fluffy rabbits! >:D
    Needless to say such traits would be overall weak. And more outlets for roleplaying possibilities than filling a strategic role in battle. So it's quite different from your concept of prestige classes. But I'm still throwing this out for brainstorming's sake. :)
    Actually I thought of making all basic classes kitless, and adding the kits afterwards upon meeting certain conditions, a certain level, ... much like Tree of Savior, if you know of that MMO, but this would break any chance of compatibility with a lot of other mods. So then I switched to considering kits as some sort of prestige class you get from the start.
    bob_veng said:

    @Arunsun

    Look, Ranger (for example) is already an "enriched" Fighter. The XP table reflects the prestige aspect of the Ranger class compared to the essentially base Fighter in 2e.

    Then you have a Ranger kit. Ranger kits are undoubtedly an "enriched" Ranger...but there's no penalty this time: it's because balance has been eschewed here, to make players happier but essentially, a kit is just "free prestige". In the case of Ranger it's the second tier of prestige-ness.

    Now to add a THIRD tier of prestige on top of that would be ...i'm looking for the right word... overwrought. like too baroque. heavy on form and light on substance, things start getting diluted. if there's the third tier of prestige-ness, why stop there? why not make a modular system as in every innate ability, passive kit advantage or HLA you choose makes your levelling more expensive by 5% or something like that?

    The ranger class is indeed somewhat of an "enriched" fighter, with downsides (limited to specialization, slower exp progression). But besides these downsides and advantages, roleplay fluff gives these class a rather distinct identity. Yes, they are the fighting-with-weapons type, but the similarities stop there. We are in an RPG, and while powergaming is important to some, the RP aspect is actually an important part too.

    Concerning what you said about ranger kits, well there are penalties this time again. No vanilla ranger kit can wear a plate mail, the kitless ranger can. That, and specific penalties each kit gets.

    You mentioned piling up prestige classes being overwrought (I had to google that word, I am not quite bilingual, but tonight I learnt something :smiley: ). Well that's how things are done in the third edition, and while some powerbuilds are quite absurd roleplay-wise, you can really build an identity up for your character which I find to be much deeper than what the class system allows. Especially if I implement that quest system I was mentioning earlier in this post.

  • The user and all related content has been deleted.

  • ArunsunArunsun Member Posts: 1,590

    Not sure why it's necessary to "outshine" vanilla kits, which are already so powerful as to be borderline cheesy/muchkiny.

    BUT there are a million ways to skin the character development cat. I tried one way with feats; they let you start with a base class or a kit, and then focus your skills along certain paths within those archetypes. So an Assassin could focus on stealth and backstabbing, or on poisons and alchemy, etc.

    Formalizing this in a different way, choosing certain archetypes once you get to mid/high level, is another way. I never liked the particular way they work in 3E, because it just seemed like a way to become superpowered - more about power and "optimization" than character.

    I think such things work best when they come with costs. Both actual costs in the form of disadvantages, and opportunity costs in having to choose one feat/trait/bonus/kit/etc. over others. IMO a good way to tell if this is well done is to compare against someone who doesn't take the feat/kit/whatever. An example in practice is fighter kits: in the vanilla game the kits are regarded as strictly superior than the trueclass. I give some feats to the trueclass fighter to give players pause, and think hard about giving up something cool in exchange for that dumb berserk ability.

    So tl;dr sure, this could be cool. Or it could be not to my taste. It's all in the implementation. I suspect this will be utterly incompatible with my mods, so I'm not likely to use it anyway :lol:

    Well, I might not have expressed myself properly. A bit more development on this "outshining" point might be required:
    No, I don't want to make these classes super cheesy or autopilot ones (like vanilla berserkers for example). What I want to do is giving the players more possibilities, more leeway to think of a strategy to deal with a situation, of an interesting build (both roleplay-wise and for powergamers). What I meant by outshining would be a development of the player's reflexion and involvement into his or her character. And once the player has truly went deep into how to play his or her character, then the power level should be good enough to be satisfying. Not necessarily overpowered, but satisfying.

    To a limited extent, the Shadowdancer Beamdog implemented is exactly the type of kit I really love. Its gameplay is very different from that of the other thief kits, it's not that straightforward to play, and once you play it well it's a good kit. Not overpowered, though quite cheesy at times. And that's what I'd call a kit that outshines some (many?) other kits.

  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,833


    a Ranger could pick an 'Urban Ranger' trait that let him summon street dogs.

    Or better yet, the power for an Urban Ranger kit to summon Plank:

    bob_vengArunsunFlashburn
  • ArunsunArunsun Member Posts: 1,590
    edited July 2017
    In the end I decided that I would make most kits a prestige class, with a few exceptions. Swashbuckler and Warlock would be considered "base classes" for this mod, though accessible from the character creation menu as kits, and if I have faith enough I will make a favored soul shaman subkit, since this is a spellcaster that casts divine spells innately too.Priests would still be able to choose a deity and gain the appropriate kit (Working on how to make this compatible with FnP, but it will be).
    Compatibility with most of the popular kit mods will be ensured. I will contact the authors to see how they want their kits to be implemented as a prestige class, and will make a default solution for the rest. Once the mod is released (don't expect it too soon, the first version will rework every vanilla kit and offer new kits, probably around 30, so it's a lot of work ), if you want your kit mod to be compatible with this, make sure to send me a message.
    Prestige Classes will come with requirements, similar to those of their 3E counterparts, and the earliest point at which you can get a prestige class is at level 6. Every Prestige Class will incur an experience penalty, based on the power level of the class and how late it is available. Typically a low-level prestige class (e.g. Assassin) will incur a 10% penalty, a middle level prestige class (e.g Shadowdancer) will incur a 20% penalty, and an Epic prestige class (e.g. Archmage) will incur a 30% penalty.
    Some hybrid Prestige Classes (Arcane Archer, Arcane Trickster, for example) will require levels in the two classes they originate from. So for example, an Arcane trickster will have requirements from both a thief and a mage, and M/T, T=>M and M=>T will be able to become Arcane Tricksters, providing that they match the other requirements.
    You will be able to change the class in which you are leveling up once per level. This is to make sure the exp penalty is properly applied.



    Then, I have reworked the vanilla thief kits as a first step, and I would like you to give me your opinion on the power level of these kits. Character level means the total level of the character, and level or class level the level in their current class.




    Assassin:
    • Requirements: Non-good, level 6 Thief, having at least 60 points in both Hide in Shadows and Move Silently
    • Experience Penalty: 10%
    • Features:
    • Thief Skills: An assassin’s skill in his camouflage abilities. On level-up gains no skill points, but both Hide in Shadows and Move Silently are increased by 12%
    • Death Attack: On a successful backstab, deals an extra 1d6 piercing damage. This increases every odd Assassin level, up to 5d6 at 9 Assassin level.
    • From level 1, an Assassin may use Poison Weapon once a day. Extra uses are gained at levels 6 and 10.
    POISON WEAPON: Each successful hit within the next 5 rounds will inject poison into the target. Each target can only be affected once per round. The amount of poison damage depends on the character's Assassin level:

    1st - Target suffers 1 poison damage per second for 6 seconds (Save vs. Death at +1 negates)
    3th - Target suffers 1 poison damage per second for 12 seconds (Save vs. Death negates), and also • immediately suffers 2 poison damage (no save)
    5th - Target suffers 1 poison damage per second for 18 seconds (Save vs. Death at -1 negates), and also immediately suffers 4 poison damage (no save)
    7th - Target suffers 1 poison damage per second for 24 seconds (Save vs. Death at -2 negates), and also immediately suffers 6 poison damage (no save)

    From level 2, an assassin becomes increasingly resistant to poison. This resistance starts at 20% and increases by 20% at even levels, reaching 100% at level 10.

    Once per day, an assassin can cast a few arcane spells in tune with its job. These spells are:
    Level 2: Cloaking
    Level 4: Darkness
    Level 6: Invisibility
    Level 8: Greater Invisibility

    Cloaking increases the Hide in Shadows and Move Silently skills by 2% per character level up to 40% at level 20 for an hour.



    Bounty Hunter:
    • Requirements: Level 6 Thief, having at least 60 points in Detect Traps and Set Traps
    • Experience Penalty: 10%
    • Features:
    • Thief Skills: A Bounty Hunter gains only 15 skill points per level, but its Detect Traps and Set Traps are increased by 5% each level
    • Magical Traps: A Bounty Hunter has access to a few Trap spells that can be cast once a day:
    • Level 3: Glyph of Warding (Extra use at levels 6 and 9)
    • Level 5: Skull Trap (Extra use at level 10)
    • Level 8: Symbol: Stun
    • Level 10: Symbol : Death
    Special Trap: From level 1, a bounty hunter may use Hunter's trap. Another use is gained at levels 5 and 9. This ability allows the Bounty Hunter to choose between several traps that become available at various levels:
    Level 1: Ankle Snare: On a failed save versus Paralysation, roots the target and deals 1d8 damage per round for 5 rounds
    Level 4: Otiluke’s Trap: Casts Resilient Sphere of Otiluke onto the target, with a -2 modifier to the saving throw.
    Level 7: Spider Trap: Deals 2d10 damage to the target and summons 2 Phase Spiders onto the target.
    Level 10: Maze Trap: Casts Maze onto the target

    Shadowdancer:
    • Requirements: Non-Lawful, Level 11 Thief, 16 Dexterity and 16 Charisma, having at least 60 in both Hide in Shadows and Move Silently
    • Experience Penalty: 20%
    • Features:
    • Thief Skills: On level-up gains no skill points, but both Hide in Shadows and Move Silently are increased by 15%
    • Slippery: a Shadowdancer gets a +1 bonus to its saving throws, increasing to +2 at level 6
    • Shadowsight: A Shadowdancer can close its eyes at will, focusing on its connection with the Shadow Plane. With its eyes closed, the Shadowdancer has a much reduced sight range, as if it was blinded, but it can lay traps and hide in shadows even with nearby enemies. It also gains a +2 Instinct bonus to AC and THAC0. Shadowdancers gain a +1 Dodge bonus to AC at level 3, 6 and 9
    • A Shadowdancer can cast Shadow magic once per day at levels 4, 7 and 10. Shadow Magic allows them to pick from one of these spells and cast it:
    – Blindness
    – Shadow Door
    – Shadowstep
    – Shadow Eye

    A bit of context concerning this one. First of all, credits to @subtledoctor , the last ability is directly inspired from his MnG shadowdancer rework, which is definitely a great one. A Shadowdancer's signature ability is the possibility to Hide in Plain Sight. Alas, for now, this feature is hardcoded and if you aren't actually a Shadowdancer with the kit number of the vanilla Shadowdancer, you lose access to this feature. This mod using kit changing a lot, I'm sure you all get the issue. My idea here was to make use of an engine limit for the kit to behave as I want, while adding a bit of balance (because Hide in Plain Sight is super strong) and homemade RP fluff. Mix that and you get the Shadowsight ability. Shadowsight gives various bonus, one of which is the ability to Hide in Plain Sight (unless enemies are really, really close to you), but has a downside (Blindness). A high-level Shadowdancer will have access to Shadow Eye as well. Shadow Eye will be a copy of Wizard Eye, with maybe a few extra features.

    Swashbuckler:
    • Requirements: None, it’s considered a new base class (as in 3E) which will be available as a fighter kit in the character creation menu
    • Experience Penalty: None
    • Features:
    • Thief Skills: None
    • D10, Fighter THAC0 progression and saving throws
    • Can reach Mastery in any light weapon, as well as two weapon fighting and specialization in Single weapon Fighting. Cannot use other weapons.
    • May only wear light armors
    • Gains a to-hit bonus when using light weapons, based on dexterity. Only innate dexterity matters. If the dexterity changes, the bonus is automatically updated on the next level up.
    • Can use Swashbuckling once per day per 5 levels, gaining -1 to AC up to -10 for 5 rounds
    • From level 3, gains bonus damage to melee attacks based on intelligence. Only innate Intelligence matters. If the intelligence changes, the bonus is automatically updated on the next level up.
    • Gains +1 AC every 5 levels
    • From level 7, a swashbuckler gains a burst of movement speed after hitting an enemy
    • From level 11, a swashbuckler is permanently affected by the Luck spell
    • At level 14, a swashbuckler’s critical hits weakens its opponents, draining two points of strength for a turn (not stackable). At level 19, they drain two points of constitution as well.

    Post edited by Arunsun on
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