0) EET Worldmap is not available as a separate mod. It's only available as part of EET.
1) NToTSC does not need an external worldmap on BG:EE. It supports BP-BGT though, so no issues if BP-BGT is installed after NToTSC on BGEE.
2) What I said is that Dark Horizons's area are placed in different worldmap locations between BP-BGT and EET Worldmap (at least visually, the links to existing locations shouldn't be changed, but I haven't checked this). This is why DH needs to be imported with the BG1 installation to EET, since it doesn't do EET map patching, EET needs to set up the map areas in itself. Although I can't find any code in Dark Horizons now which would update the worldmap, so it probably needs BP-BGT on Tutu/BGEE/BGT.
3) Bone Hill explicitly needs BP-BGT. It's map areas are outside of all the other maps.
4) SotSC doesn't need an external worldmap. I haven't checked his BG2 mods but I suspect they don't need such either, but they do support both EET and the BP-BGT worldmap (I've seen CoI map areas in my BP-BGT install notes somewhere).
I will have to think about the BP/BWS map for Bonehill. Perhaps I will just clua my way around Restenford outskirts.
But I am still puzzled about Dark Horizons. I have played it many times, and haven’t noticed new areas on the map - the new areas are reached by existing maps? DSotSC on the other hand have a couple of new maps of Jet’Lyas quest.
Btw. I am glad for all your work getting the map issues fixed. And off course Jastey for maintaining both the old and making new mods.
Ohdammit. I was thinking the Citadel quest which leads into a copy of the Durlag's Tower's outskirts is DH and not DSotSC. Yeah, you're correct on that one. That is the one which gets repositioned visually.
I haven't gotten very far into this mod yet, but I would offer a suggestion. While I actually really like the idea of dangerous places that a low-level party shouldn't tackle at first, I would give a bit more warning for the cave added to the temple of Lathander near Beregost.
You might also consider having Kelddath warn the player, and perhaps give a suggestion as to just how dangerous that cavern is. Given the proximity of the temple to the cavern, it would make sense that they have cared for other people who ran afoul of that area. Maybe not an exact description of the enemies, but enough to let a low-level party reconsider plans to confront it.
Those enemies are a total party wipe for level 1 or 2 characters, and while that might be "reality", there is also a good chance that locals might be aware of those enemies and warn people. For people playing minimal reloads, that is a rather unpleasant surprise.
As an aside, this really isn't a complaint. I think the sword coast SHOULD be dangerous, and there should be lethal areas that a low-level party can't tackle as a reason to go back later. I just felt this one was a bit unfair, since Beregost is literally the first real town you come to after Candlekeep, which means it will see mostly low-level starting characters. Unlike the vampiric wolves, the cave is so far away from a map edge that it is impossible to escape before losing party members.
Fair enough, but I felt like that was closer to an evil DM's "Yeah, I wouldn't do that..." warning.
Again, I'm not against the content. It's more that it's awfully extreme to be that close to civilization without a bit more made of it. Other people in the town, or at least the temple, should be aware of it.
I agree that it would be nice to have the content better integrated, in this case people nearby mentioning the cave. I'm kind of done with NTotSC with regard to new content, and I know that adding lines to Kelddath is a bit tough because of how the dialogue is structure. I'll note this down as an idea nevertheless.
As an idea, you could put a new NPC in the temple whose only purpose is to be recovering from an attempt to clean it out. It would make sense that this NPC would flee to the temple, and the other guy was their partner.
You could also explain that these two had just discovered the cave and reopened it, which is why no one in town has any idea it is there.
Disagree. There's no point in shoveling more warnings about the tunnel just because you ignored what was there already. It would just annoy the people who go in prepared.
I'm not going to keep arguing it, because I now have player meta knowledge of the situation. It won't affect me in future games. This was mostly aimed at other players who may be encountering it for the first time, as Beregost is on the path to Nashkel.
I will say that I have enjoyed the new mod content a great deal, so I want to reiterate that this wasn't a complaint. Just knowing stuff like that is there, right off the path, makes exploring the forests more intense.
As an aside, though, I noticed in my last run that the Northern Chionthar river area (zombie farm) was locked out after starting the SoD portion by EET. I'm not sure if that was a one-off, or a bug in EET, but that would lock out some content if you waited to start that. I have posted on the G3 site, but I haven't seen a response yet.
The water in the Wood of the Dead appears to be missing. I can hear the ambient sound effect, and see the stream bed, but there is no water layer. It looks a bit odd, but if the sound effects were removed, it would just be a dry stream bed - though I imagine that isn't what was intended.
Interestingly, I *think* the same thing is happening in the Northern Coast area. It is shaded blue, likely to give it the appearance of seawater when the water layer is present, but it is flat - which makes me think the water layer in that area isn't working either.
For reference, this is an EET build on the latest patch of BG2EE.
@Maurvir the question is whether there is water layers for these areas. When I recall the trouble and extra work the team had to make the Balduran's Seatower water work - in the right color! - for all games, I believe these NTotSC areas just don't use water layers. I didn't check, though.
Ah, that's a shame. However, the stream beds look like they are merely dry. Removing the sound effects would probably fix at least one of them, though at that point it wouldn't make sense that you couldn't walk there.
I am a bit curious, though - the Wood of the Dead looks like a modified version of the Cloakwood forest Druid Grove area. I would have to compare them, but wouldn't the water layers be virtually the same?
@Maurvir that's very well possible. Maybe it's just a missing copied animation or something. Or it's missing an entry inside the .are-file which could be done by cloning what is in the game area, if the graphics are really the same.
I don't know enough about NI to figure out what is different, but yes, the water portion is identical to the Cloakwood druid grove. It shows without the water in NI, which matches what I saw in-game. However, it seems like it should be possible to restore the water using data from the Cloakwood area.
As near as I can tell in Photoshop, there are four major changes and the rest is identical. The mound where the wyvern cavern was has been covered with trees, the giant tree has been replaced with another giant tree - but without windows or doors, and the temple area has been altered to become a tomb. Oh, and the water is missing.
I'm setting up a new install, and adding a couple of quest mods, but I'm having a hard time figuring out in which order to include them.
Mini Quests and Encounters specifically states that it goes before NPC Project, while Romantic Encounters specifically states that it goes after NPC Project and before Unfinished Business. So far, so good. Unfinished Business also states that it checks for the NPC Project and Northen Tales of the Sword Coast, so does that mean NTofSC should be installed before UB?
And where do other similar mods like Ascalon's Quest Pack, Lure of the Sirine's Call, and Stone of Askaver go in comparison to NTotSC (and other mods)?
My currently planned install order:
- DLC Merger
- Mini Quests and Encounters - Before NPC Project
- NPC Project - After Mini Quests and Encounters
- NPC Project Music Pack
- Romantic Encounters - After NPC Project, Before Unfinished Business
- Ascalon's Quest Pack - Before NPC mods
- Sirine's Call
- Stone of Askavar
- Northern Tales of the Sword Coast
- Unfinished Business - Checks for NPC Project and Northern Tales of the Sword Coast
- Delainy/Durlyle Same-Sex Romance Options
- Neera Expansion
- Neera Banters
- Chatty Imoen
- Jaheira Recast
- Jastey's Tweaks for SoD
- SoD Dialog Banters
- The Calling
- Convinient Ammunition
- Wand Case
- IWDification
- Distinguishable Clubs
- Portraits Portraits Everywhere
- Continuous NPC Portraits
- Four Quicksaves
- Enchant the Missile Launchers
- Tweaks Anthology
- NPC EE v4.5 (not newest)
- LeUI BG1EE
- EEUITweaks
Are you referring to BG1 Romantic Encounters and BG1 Unfinished Business (I guess because it's an BG:SoD game if I got that right)?
NTotSC and bg1ub both restored some original game content so what the mods do is check whether the other mod already installed said content and skip installation if detected. It also means, that install order (with regard to these components) is not important, just make sure you install the quests via the mod you prefer.
Apart from that I think you already had order help in Discord(?)
Ah, yes, I should have clarified, it's for a BG:EE+SOD run (no EET), so the BG1 versions of RE and UB.
NTotSC seems more detailed than UB (with its own regions and all), so I'll opt into those. Does that mean that if I install NTotSC first, and enable all the components, UB will automatically skip the components that overlap?
I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask, but I can't find anywhere else. Can anyone tell me how to actually find the entrance to the extra dungeon at Firewine Bridge. I know it is on the south side of the bridge, near the entrance to the standard dungeon, and I have the scroll given to me by Charlston Nibb. However I just can't find the *expletive deleted* door. My eyesight isn't brilliant and I often miss things that are low contrast or in shadow, so a bit of detail would be very welcome.
In Torqion's cave, is it intended that you can just walk past the three and get to the treasure? They seemed to be positioned to block entrance to the backroom, so that you'd have to deal with them before getting to the shinies, but to my surprise, I could simply walk past them.
I don't know, I honestly forgot what they say and whether they are guarding the treasure. I know they are not supposed to be hostile from the start.
They weren't hostile, but the power of the items behind them seems to indicate they're not to be accessed by lowlevel characters. Yes, there are some monsters on the way there, but the toughest one can be avoided, and the rest is pretty easy to deal with.
Comments
1) If I where to play NTotSC in a BG:EE I would need the EET world map or some other?
2) Graion or some other mentioned that Dark Horizons needed the world map as well. That was a surprise, and perhaps it’s the DSotSC that was meant?
3) And if where to play Secret of Bonehill (it extremely buggy - I know), would I need the EET world map or the old BP/BWS.
4) and Lavas mods don’t require any of the maps, or will it be advised to use the EET world map?
0) EET Worldmap is not available as a separate mod. It's only available as part of EET.
1) NToTSC does not need an external worldmap on BG:EE. It supports BP-BGT though, so no issues if BP-BGT is installed after NToTSC on BGEE.
2) What I said is that Dark Horizons's area are placed in different worldmap locations between BP-BGT and EET Worldmap (at least visually, the links to existing locations shouldn't be changed, but I haven't checked this). This is why DH needs to be imported with the BG1 installation to EET, since it doesn't do EET map patching, EET needs to set up the map areas in itself. Although I can't find any code in Dark Horizons now which would update the worldmap, so it probably needs BP-BGT on Tutu/BGEE/BGT.
3) Bone Hill explicitly needs BP-BGT. It's map areas are outside of all the other maps.
4) SotSC doesn't need an external worldmap. I haven't checked his BG2 mods but I suspect they don't need such either, but they do support both EET and the BP-BGT worldmap (I've seen CoI map areas in my BP-BGT install notes somewhere).
Thanks for the in depth answers.
I will have to think about the BP/BWS map for Bonehill. Perhaps I will just clua my way around Restenford outskirts.
But I am still puzzled about Dark Horizons. I have played it many times, and haven’t noticed new areas on the map - the new areas are reached by existing maps? DSotSC on the other hand have a couple of new maps of Jet’Lyas quest.
Btw. I am glad for all your work getting the map issues fixed. And off course Jastey for maintaining both the old and making new mods.
You might also consider having Kelddath warn the player, and perhaps give a suggestion as to just how dangerous that cavern is. Given the proximity of the temple to the cavern, it would make sense that they have cared for other people who ran afoul of that area. Maybe not an exact description of the enemies, but enough to let a low-level party reconsider plans to confront it.
Those enemies are a total party wipe for level 1 or 2 characters, and while that might be "reality", there is also a good chance that locals might be aware of those enemies and warn people. For people playing minimal reloads, that is a rather unpleasant surprise.
As an aside, this really isn't a complaint. I think the sword coast SHOULD be dangerous, and there should be lethal areas that a low-level party can't tackle as a reason to go back later. I just felt this one was a bit unfair, since Beregost is literally the first real town you come to after Candlekeep, which means it will see mostly low-level starting characters. Unlike the vampiric wolves, the cave is so far away from a map edge that it is impossible to escape before losing party members.
Again, I'm not against the content. It's more that it's awfully extreme to be that close to civilization without a bit more made of it. Other people in the town, or at least the temple, should be aware of it.
You could also explain that these two had just discovered the cave and reopened it, which is why no one in town has any idea it is there.
I will say that I have enjoyed the new mod content a great deal, so I want to reiterate that this wasn't a complaint. Just knowing stuff like that is there, right off the path, makes exploring the forests more intense.
As an aside, though, I noticed in my last run that the Northern Chionthar river area (zombie farm) was locked out after starting the SoD portion by EET. I'm not sure if that was a one-off, or a bug in EET, but that would lock out some content if you waited to start that. I have posted on the G3 site, but I haven't seen a response yet.
Interestingly, I *think* the same thing is happening in the Northern Coast area. It is shaded blue, likely to give it the appearance of seawater when the water layer is present, but it is flat - which makes me think the water layer in that area isn't working either.
For reference, this is an EET build on the latest patch of BG2EE.
I am a bit curious, though - the Wood of the Dead looks like a modified version of the Cloakwood forest Druid Grove area. I would have to compare them, but wouldn't the water layers be virtually the same?
As near as I can tell in Photoshop, there are four major changes and the rest is identical. The mound where the wyvern cavern was has been covered with trees, the giant tree has been replaced with another giant tree - but without windows or doors, and the temple area has been altered to become a tomb. Oh, and the water is missing.
Mini Quests and Encounters specifically states that it goes before NPC Project, while Romantic Encounters specifically states that it goes after NPC Project and before Unfinished Business. So far, so good. Unfinished Business also states that it checks for the NPC Project and Northen Tales of the Sword Coast, so does that mean NTofSC should be installed before UB?
And where do other similar mods like Ascalon's Quest Pack, Lure of the Sirine's Call, and Stone of Askaver go in comparison to NTotSC (and other mods)?
My currently planned install order:
- Mini Quests and Encounters - Before NPC Project
- NPC Project - After Mini Quests and Encounters
- NPC Project Music Pack
- Romantic Encounters - After NPC Project, Before Unfinished Business
- Ascalon's Quest Pack - Before NPC mods
- Sirine's Call
- Stone of Askavar
- Northern Tales of the Sword Coast
- Unfinished Business - Checks for NPC Project and Northern Tales of the Sword Coast
- Delainy/Durlyle Same-Sex Romance Options
- Neera Expansion
- Neera Banters
- Chatty Imoen
- Jaheira Recast
- Jastey's Tweaks for SoD
- SoD Dialog Banters
- The Calling
- Convinient Ammunition
- Wand Case
- IWDification
- Distinguishable Clubs
- Portraits Portraits Everywhere
- Continuous NPC Portraits
- Four Quicksaves
- Enchant the Missile Launchers
- Tweaks Anthology
- NPC EE v4.5 (not newest)
- LeUI BG1EE
- EEUITweaks
NTotSC and bg1ub both restored some original game content so what the mods do is check whether the other mod already installed said content and skip installation if detected. It also means, that install order (with regard to these components) is not important, just make sure you install the quests via the mod you prefer.
Apart from that I think you already had order help in Discord(?)
NTotSC seems more detailed than UB (with its own regions and all), so I'll opt into those. Does that mean that if I install NTotSC first, and enable all the components, UB will automatically skip the components that overlap?
Thanks for your help, and your efforts on the mod!
The entrance should be at x =3129 y=1073 if i remenber correctly...
They weren't hostile, but the power of the items behind them seems to indicate they're not to be accessed by lowlevel characters. Yes, there are some monsters on the way there, but the toughest one can be avoided, and the rest is pretty easy to deal with.