Corporations, above-all, exist to make money. If they are taking a stand on certain issues, it isn't performative "wokeness". It's because the number crunchers, who they pay good money to employ, have told them that it's more beneficial to their bottom-line to do so than not.
Yes, I agree with this. Large corporations will never go out of their way to do the right thing unless it means making more money. I can't think of a single example that points to the contrary.
Small business owners are a different story, many of them for example might start an environment-friendly company because they truly believe in environmental causes.
Corporations, above-all, exist to make money. If they are taking a stand on certain issues, it isn't performative "wokeness". It's because the number crunchers, who they pay good money to employ, have told them that it's more beneficial to their bottom-line to do so than not.
Yes, I agree with this. Large corporations will never go out of their way to do the right thing unless it means making more money. I can't think of a single example that points to the contrary.
Small business owners are a different story, many of them for example might start an environment-friendly company because they truly believe in environmental causes.
It is, in fact, exactly why they moved so swiftly on gay rights about 10 years ago. 10% of the population is a hell of a lot of people and disposable income to ignore.
Another police killing of a unarmed man in Minneapolis. That this would continue to happen is inevitable. What most concerns me is the amount of people who say the exact same thing every time this happens. There is, quite simply, a large portion of the population who believes that having a misdemeanor arrest warrant or fleeing a traffic stop absolutely justifies summary execution without trial. This is, at this point, imo, as big a problem as a cop thinking her gun is a taser. What fills me with existential dread, from the excusal of the attempt to overturn an election to the way stuff like this gets excused, is the amount of people who clearly want to live in an authoritarian state as long as they are among the protected class.
What fills me with existential dread, from the excusal of the attempt to overturn an election to the way stuff like this gets excused, is the amount of people who clearly want to live in an authoritarian state as long as they are among the protected class.
And this surprises you? I doubt there's a nation on earth that doesn't have a 'protected class'. Some countries pretend to be more enlightened than others, but if and when things go south their colors will show in the end.
Big news of the day is that the Johnson and Johnson vaccine was paused after 6 people developed serious blood clots. I get that this is significant, but the statistics dont lie that pausing the Johnson and Johnson vaccine rollout will cause more deaths than the blood clots it might cause otherwise would.
Trump actually released a statement suggesting this was a terrible mistake (the pausing), and for once - I think I agree with him. He blamed Biden (of course) and I dont technically know how much Biden gets to do here... but I have to imagine he at least tacitly agreed to the idea of pausing the J&J vax.
What fills me with existential dread, from the excusal of the attempt to overturn an election to the way stuff like this gets excused, is the amount of people who clearly want to live in an authoritarian state as long as they are among the protected class.
And this surprises you? I doubt there's a nation on earth that doesn't have a 'protected class'. Some countries pretend to be more enlightened than others, but if and when things go south their colors will show in the end.
As far as I can tell, the outstanding warrant was for failure to appear (literally had one of these myself once). The stop itself was of the "broken taillight" variety, and he was shot while trying to get away from the police. Man, some of the quotes of people I have responded to on Twitter are something else, including "if you try to run from cops you're getting your ass shot with something". Really?? Is this "Tango and Cash" or some other Stallone movie, or real-life?? A gun should be pulled and fired only when there is imminent danger to the life of someone else. "Fleeing the scene" is something literally everyone I knew in high school had done at one time or another when cops busted an underage drinking party. I mean, suspected criminals still ostensibly have rights as well, and the way people just toss them on the trash heap to fit a narrative is really something to behold.
On the flip side, the cop who fired the gun reportedly has a history of concealing evidence, which is about 100x worse than anything this kid has been accused of. How the fuck do you keep your job as a cop after concealing evidence in a case UNLESS that is simply seen as standard procedure?? It would be like me purposefully moving money from someone's account to another one without permission and getting a slap on the wrist.
What fills me with existential dread, from the excusal of the attempt to overturn an election to the way stuff like this gets excused, is the amount of people who clearly want to live in an authoritarian state as long as they are among the protected class.
And this surprises you? I doubt there's a nation on earth that doesn't have a 'protected class'. Some countries pretend to be more enlightened than others, but if and when things go south their colors will show in the end.
As far as I can tell, the outstanding warrant was for failure to appear (literally had one of these myself once). The stop itself was of the "broken taillight" variety, and he was shot while trying to get away from the police. Man, some of the quotes of people I have responded to on Twitter are something else, including "if you try to run from cops you're getting your ass shot with something". Really?? Is this "Tango and Cash" or some other Stallone movie, or real-life?? A gun should be pulled and fired only when there is imminent danger to the life of someone else. "Fleeing the scene" is something literally everyone I knew in high school had done at one time or another when cops busted an underage drinking party. I mean, suspected criminals still ostensibly have rights as well, and the way people just toss them on the trash heap to fit a narrative is really something to behold.
On the flip side, the cop who fired the gun reportedly has a history of concealing evidence, which is about 100x worse than anything this kid has been accused of. How the fuck do you keep your job as a cop after concealing evidence in a case UNLESS that is simply seen as standard procedure?? It would be like me purposefully moving money from someone's account to another one without permission and getting a slap on the wrist.
Here's an example of a bad union (the police union). Protecting people that shouldn't be protected. Bad employees should not be exempt from consequences. Granted, concealing evidence is far worse than sleeping on the job or showing up under the influence, but all three of those examples are people I wouldn't want working for me if I were the boss.
What fills me with existential dread, from the excusal of the attempt to overturn an election to the way stuff like this gets excused, is the amount of people who clearly want to live in an authoritarian state as long as they are among the protected class.
And this surprises you? I doubt there's a nation on earth that doesn't have a 'protected class'. Some countries pretend to be more enlightened than others, but if and when things go south their colors will show in the end.
As far as I can tell, the outstanding warrant was for failure to appear (literally had one of these myself once). The stop itself was of the "broken taillight" variety, and he was shot while trying to get away from the police. Man, some of the quotes of people I have responded to on Twitter are something else, including "if you try to run from cops you're getting your ass shot with something". Really?? Is this "Tango and Cash" or some other Stallone movie, or real-life?? A gun should be pulled and fired only when there is imminent danger to the life of someone else. "Fleeing the scene" is something literally everyone I knew in high school had done at one time or another when cops busted an underage drinking party. I mean, suspected criminals still ostensibly have rights as well, and the way people just toss them on the trash heap to fit a narrative is really something to behold.
On the flip side, the cop who fired the gun reportedly has a history of concealing evidence, which is about 100x worse than anything this kid has been accused of. How the fuck do you keep your job as a cop after concealing evidence in a case UNLESS that is simply seen as standard procedure?? It would be like me purposefully moving money from someone's account to another one without permission and getting a slap on the wrist.
Here's an example of a bad union.
Indeed. It was pretty garden variety stuff for cops actually. She advised officers involved in the shooting of an autistic man to shut off their body cameras in the aftermath. She was "admonished" by investigators for doing so. At least according to the Daily Beast article. The report itself clears the cops involved, so there wasn't even any need to do it. Just a base instinct of "cover-up just in case". I just saw the part where she was apparently the union President at the time. Perfect.
I know I won't win any popularity contests in this thread but I have to say that unions were useful and needed years ago, but they morphed into protecting everybody, whether or not they deserved protecting. They also became prime forums for nepotism and cronyism. Before I would get behind empowering unions, I would need to see better self-policing. I'm not as anti-union as my parents, but honestly I can see their point...
I honestly believe this was an accident and that the officer is genuinely sorry. Her actions reflect that. I'm not sure what can be done to stop this from happening again, but I'm not averse to some kind of real action to stop this bullshit. There has to be some way of enforcing laws without allowing lawbreakers to escape consequences but also prevent things from escalating to lethal levels. I'm all ears...
I honestly believe this was an accident and that the officer is genuinely sorry. Her actions reflect that. I'm not sure what can be done to stop this from happening again, but I'm not averse to some kind of real action to stop this bullshit. There has to be some way of enforcing laws without allowing lawbreakers to escape consequences but also prevent things from escalating to lethal levels. I'm all ears...
Well, let's start with how bullshit traffic stops are used to substitute for actual police work, and who they disproportionately effect. Pull over enough people on technicalities that are improving the safety of absolutely no one, and odds are some of them are going to have a bench warrant out for something.
I just read the Twitter comment of an African-American woman about her two brothers. She said one of them literally STOPPED driving altogether a few years ago because the anxiety of constantly getting pulled over was too much for him. Her other brother had bought a Lexus (usually the type of car that is a treat to yourself for doing well in life), but he returned it to the dealer for something more modest. Why?? Because he was also constantly getting pulled over and the cops were consistently not believing it was his car.
So you can't drive a nice car because that's suspicious. You can't drive a cheap car because those are the ones that get you pulled over for faulty or broken parts. Total Catch-22. And this is just the story of one set of siblings. Think of how many times you would have to get pulled over to take these kind of drastic actions. And they aren't making it up, though many have been insisting for years the black community is exaggerating about traffic stops. They aren't. All you have to do is ask them about it. And you'll quickly find out that, to a person, they get pulled over more in six months than most of us have in 30 years.
Speaking even more to the culture of police unions, this is about as bad as it gets. They flat-out KNEW this guy was a serial child molester, and not only didn't pursue criminal charges against him, he stayed on the police force for another TWO DECADES:
No offense, but what the hell is in the water in Boston?? This is where the center of Catholic Church scandal took place (and was eventually uncovered by the same newspaper who has the dirt on this guy, the Boston Globe) and now this. Are you just flat-out allowed to molest children if you are in a position of power the community respects?? Because the evidence suggests that until recently, that was pretty much the case. I'm linking the abbreviated version here because the Globe investigation is behind a paywall.
If that’s the case, and the officer is found to no wrong in the event of a person being critically injured or killed, it’s time to look at these ‘procedures’ instead of just the officer.
If an officer is trained to pull out a stun gun during a minor traffic infraction or to tap on their window with a loaded gun when the driver isn’t responding (such as with the first time Floyd was pulled over) then it’s time to change these procedures.
Even with the Floyd trial, the defence has paid an ex cop to testify that what Chauvin did was justified. It’s just baffling that’s the society some Americans live in.
The Biden Administration has announced they are essentially pulling out of Afghanistan by the 20th anniversary of 9/11. Normally I would be HEAVILY skeptical this was actually going to take place, but they are going to almost extreme lengths to make people aware of the decision, which is amplified even more by tying the withdrawal date to the anniversary of the attack. If this is a bluff or PR, I'm not sure what the goal is. The way they are emphatically broadcasting it everywhere the can makes me think it might be the real deal.
If we for a moment assume this actually happens, it will be yet another indication of a guy who may be personally moderate, and presents himself that way outwardly to most casual observers, but is governing farther to the left than anyone in recent memory:
It's also in line with Biden's political history. He has been consistently antiwar throughout his career, so it's no surprise he'd go for something like this. The political spectrum has more than one dimension, after all.
The Obama administration, you say? Back then, he was just one voice. Now, he's the one that makes the final decisions.
Another random article I came across while delving into the rabbit hole that is my brain. I was just wondering why people are so humorless these days and lo and behold, the supercomputer at my fingertips to the rescue...
It's also in line with Biden's political history. He has been consistently antiwar throughout his career, so it's no surprise he'd go for something like this. The political spectrum has more than one dimension, after all.
The Obama administration, you say? Back then, he was just one voice. Now, he's the one that makes the final decisions.
Is that true, how has he shown that to be the case? (Asking honestly, I dont really know much about Biden's philosophy with respect to war. I know he voted for the Iraq war, but almost everyone did... so that doesnt seem like the most important/useful measuring stick, even if some people want it to be).
This was an interesting tweet I saw. It shows sort of how the GOP is negotiating in bad faith with Biden.
Another one 72 hours later. The 13-year old kid in Chicago did have a gun. He was ordered to put it down. He did. He was told to put his hands up. He did. Then he was shot anyway. The police appear to have been (shock!!!) lying about what happened right up til the moment the tape was released. Kind of gives food for thought as to why the guy in Brooklyn Center would flee. Because compliance will not save you. The exact same excuses are being trotted out. Either suspected criminals have rights, or they don't. If people want cops to just kill everyone they suspect is in commission of a crime, they should have the balls to just admit it instead of dancing around what they actually believe. Because as far as I tell, there isn't a single criminal act, no matter how major or minor, that doesn't justify homicide by cop if that happens to take place in the minds of alot of people "Don't start none, won't be none" is not the basis of our justice system.
Another one 72 hours later. The 13-year old kid in Chicago did have a gun. He was ordered to put it down. He did. He was told to put his hands up. He did. Then he was shot anyway. The police appear to have been (shock!!!) lying about what happened right up til the moment the tape was released. Kind of gives food for thought as to why the guy in Brooklyn Center would flee. Because compliance will not save you. The exact same excuses are being trotted out. Either suspected criminals have rights, or they don't. If people want cops to just kill everyone they suspect is in commission of a crime, they should have the balls to just admit it instead of dancing around what they actually believe. Because as far as I tell, there isn't a single criminal act, no matter how major or minor, that doesn't justify homicide by cop if that happens to take place in the minds of alot of people
The ironic thing about this, the 21 year old who was with the kid was charged with felony endangerment of a child.
Another one 72 hours later. The 13-year old kid in Chicago did have a gun. He was ordered to put it down. He did. He was told to put his hands up. He did. Then he was shot anyway. The police appear to have been (shock!!!) lying about what happened right up til the moment the tape was released. Kind of gives food for thought as to why the guy in Brooklyn Center would flee. Because compliance will not save you. The exact same excuses are being trotted out. Either suspected criminals have rights, or they don't. If people want cops to just kill everyone they suspect is in commission of a crime, they should have the balls to just admit it instead of dancing around what they actually believe. Because as far as I tell, there isn't a single criminal act, no matter how major or minor, that doesn't justify homicide by cop if that happens to take place in the minds of alot of people "Don't start none, won't be none" is not the basis of our justice system.
The article here from CNN doesn't seem to corroborate your viewpoint. The kid's family's lawyer doesn't even know if it's worth a lawsuit yet. Not as cut and dry as some of the other cases...
Another one 72 hours later. The 13-year old kid in Chicago did have a gun. He was ordered to put it down. He did. He was told to put his hands up. He did. Then he was shot anyway. The police appear to have been (shock!!!) lying about what happened right up til the moment the tape was released. Kind of gives food for thought as to why the guy in Brooklyn Center would flee. Because compliance will not save you. The exact same excuses are being trotted out. Either suspected criminals have rights, or they don't. If people want cops to just kill everyone they suspect is in commission of a crime, they should have the balls to just admit it instead of dancing around what they actually believe. Because as far as I tell, there isn't a single criminal act, no matter how major or minor, that doesn't justify homicide by cop if that happens to take place in the minds of alot of people "Don't start none, won't be none" is not the basis of our justice system.
The article here from CNN doesn't seem to corroborate your viewpoint. The kid's family's lawyer doesn't even know if it's worth a lawsuit yet. Not as cut and dry as some of the other cases...
Edit: Just because shit happens doesn't mean that everything that happens is shit...
Was the officer fired upon by the kid? Was the officer's life in danger as the kid ran away, who was being chased by a police officer with his gun already drawn?
The officer didn't even see if the kid had a gun, the officer presumed the kid had a gun because he had already quickly frisked down the 21 year old that the kid was with. The police scan that came through, just said "shots were fired" in the vicinity of the two as Chicago uses computers to detect if a gun was fired. No one saw these two fire a gun. It was just the officer's presumption that they were armed, and that presumption I guess warrants a death sentence.
What's the line I read earlier. A cop's blue fear is not worth a person's (black) life. The sad part is, the person who is terrified in this situation was the kid, not the cop, and the outcome shows he was terrified for good reason.
Another one 72 hours later. The 13-year old kid in Chicago did have a gun. He was ordered to put it down. He did. He was told to put his hands up. He did. Then he was shot anyway. The police appear to have been (shock!!!) lying about what happened right up til the moment the tape was released. Kind of gives food for thought as to why the guy in Brooklyn Center would flee. Because compliance will not save you. The exact same excuses are being trotted out. Either suspected criminals have rights, or they don't. If people want cops to just kill everyone they suspect is in commission of a crime, they should have the balls to just admit it instead of dancing around what they actually believe. Because as far as I tell, there isn't a single criminal act, no matter how major or minor, that doesn't justify homicide by cop if that happens to take place in the minds of alot of people "Don't start none, won't be none" is not the basis of our justice system.
The article here from CNN doesn't seem to corroborate your viewpoint. The kid's family's lawyer doesn't even know if it's worth a lawsuit yet. Not as cut and dry as some of the other cases...
Edit: Just because shit happens doesn't mean that everything that happens is shit...
Was the officer fired upon by the kid? Was the officer's life in danger as the kid ran away, who was being chased by a police officer with his gun already drawn?
The officer didn't even see if the kid had a gun, the officer presumed the kid had a gun because he had already quickly frisked down the 21 year old that the kid was with. The police scan that came through, just said "shots were fired" in the vicinity of the two as Chicago uses computers to detect if a gun was fired. No one saw these two fire a gun. It was just the officer's presumption that they were armed, and that presumption I guess warrants a death sentence.
What's the line I read earlier. A cop's blue fear is not worth a person's (black) life. The sad part is, the person who is terrified in this situation was the kid, not the cop, and the outcome shows he was terrified for good reason.
Yes, he was terrified for good reason. He had a gun and was running from the cops. That's completely different from the examples of police shooting unarmed civilians. It just is. Let's see if any lawsuit is filed on this kid's behalf. If not, then this incident isn't going to help your argument.
I would question the notion that the presence or absence of a lawsuit tells us much about the underlying case. I can think of a lot of reasons a solid case would not involve a lawsuit, and Lord knows there are successful lawsuits on spurious grounds.
If my girlfriend was shot by a cop I'd want to file a lawsuit, but I wouldn't be confident it would make a difference.
Another one 72 hours later. The 13-year old kid in Chicago did have a gun. He was ordered to put it down. He did. He was told to put his hands up. He did. Then he was shot anyway. The police appear to have been (shock!!!) lying about what happened right up til the moment the tape was released. Kind of gives food for thought as to why the guy in Brooklyn Center would flee. Because compliance will not save you. The exact same excuses are being trotted out. Either suspected criminals have rights, or they don't. If people want cops to just kill everyone they suspect is in commission of a crime, they should have the balls to just admit it instead of dancing around what they actually believe. Because as far as I tell, there isn't a single criminal act, no matter how major or minor, that doesn't justify homicide by cop if that happens to take place in the minds of alot of people "Don't start none, won't be none" is not the basis of our justice system.
The article here from CNN doesn't seem to corroborate your viewpoint. The kid's family's lawyer doesn't even know if it's worth a lawsuit yet. Not as cut and dry as some of the other cases...
Edit: Just because shit happens doesn't mean that everything that happens is shit...
Was the officer fired upon by the kid? Was the officer's life in danger as the kid ran away, who was being chased by a police officer with his gun already drawn?
The officer didn't even see if the kid had a gun, the officer presumed the kid had a gun because he had already quickly frisked down the 21 year old that the kid was with. The police scan that came through, just said "shots were fired" in the vicinity of the two as Chicago uses computers to detect if a gun was fired. No one saw these two fire a gun. It was just the officer's presumption that they were armed, and that presumption I guess warrants a death sentence.
What's the line I read earlier. A cop's blue fear is not worth a person's (black) life. The sad part is, the person who is terrified in this situation was the kid, not the cop, and the outcome shows he was terrified for good reason.
Yes, he was terrified for good reason. He had a gun and was running from the cops. That's completely different from the examples of police shooting unarmed civilians. It just is. Let's see if any lawsuit is filed on this kid's behalf. If not, then this incident isn't going to help your argument.
Ok scenario two.
The kid doesn't run, reveals he has a gun and gets shot while attempting to 'drop it' again. The police rolled up on these two with their guns drawn prior to knowing if they were armed or not. Remember no one saw these shots fired. They were only heard. They were guilty in the eyes of the police officers prior to any proof being established.
And I'd love the family to sue on second amendment rights. I'd like to see the hoops politicians on the right would need to jump through to both placate Blue Lives Matter & Second Amendment Rights while not appearing bigoted in any way.
Having a gun in your possession doesn't warrant a death sentence. Running from the cops does not warrant a death sentence. A cop being afraid for his life because he didn't assess the situation, determine his surroundings (no cover) or wait for back up doesn't warrant a death sentence.
A child lost his life to a police officer and we want to pretend that the officer didn't do anything wrong because a handgun (and my guess, an unloaded one due to the amount of shots that were recorded being fired) was recovered at the scene.
Another one 72 hours later. The 13-year old kid in Chicago did have a gun. He was ordered to put it down. He did. He was told to put his hands up. He did. Then he was shot anyway. The police appear to have been (shock!!!) lying about what happened right up til the moment the tape was released. Kind of gives food for thought as to why the guy in Brooklyn Center would flee. Because compliance will not save you. The exact same excuses are being trotted out. Either suspected criminals have rights, or they don't. If people want cops to just kill everyone they suspect is in commission of a crime, they should have the balls to just admit it instead of dancing around what they actually believe. Because as far as I tell, there isn't a single criminal act, no matter how major or minor, that doesn't justify homicide by cop if that happens to take place in the minds of alot of people "Don't start none, won't be none" is not the basis of our justice system.
The article here from CNN doesn't seem to corroborate your viewpoint. The kid's family's lawyer doesn't even know if it's worth a lawsuit yet. Not as cut and dry as some of the other cases...
Edit: Just because shit happens doesn't mean that everything that happens is shit...
Was the officer fired upon by the kid? Was the officer's life in danger as the kid ran away, who was being chased by a police officer with his gun already drawn?
The officer didn't even see if the kid had a gun, the officer presumed the kid had a gun because he had already quickly frisked down the 21 year old that the kid was with. The police scan that came through, just said "shots were fired" in the vicinity of the two as Chicago uses computers to detect if a gun was fired. No one saw these two fire a gun. It was just the officer's presumption that they were armed, and that presumption I guess warrants a death sentence.
What's the line I read earlier. A cop's blue fear is not worth a person's (black) life. The sad part is, the person who is terrified in this situation was the kid, not the cop, and the outcome shows he was terrified for good reason.
Yes, he was terrified for good reason. He had a gun and was running from the cops. That's completely different from the examples of police shooting unarmed civilians. It just is. Let's see if any lawsuit is filed on this kid's behalf. If not, then this incident isn't going to help your argument.
Ok scenario two.
The kid doesn't run, reveals he has a gun and gets shot while attempting to 'drop it' again. The police rolled up on these two with their guns drawn prior to knowing if they were armed or not. Remember no one saw these shots fired. They were only heard. They were guilty in the eyes of the police officers prior to any proof being established.
And I'd love the family to sue on second amendment rights. I'd like to see the hoops politicians on the right would need to jump through to both placate Blue Lives Matter & Second Amendment Rights while not appearing bigoted in any way.
Having a gun in your possession doesn't warrant a death sentence. Running from the cops does not warrant a death sentence. A cop being afraid for his life because he didn't assess the situation, determine his surroundings (no cover) or wait for back up doesn't warrant a death sentence.
A child lost his life to a police officer and we want to pretend that the officer didn't do anything wrong because a handgun (and my guess, an unloaded one due to the amount of shots that were recorded being fired) was recovered at the scene.
Considering many people will classify any police killing as a "good shooting" (I've seen this repulsive term thrown out with absolute glee consistently over the last 24 hours) even if the person who was shot smoked weed at any time in their life or once had detention in 6th grade, being in a possession of a gun absolutely means it will be seen as such.
You don't have to have a spotless existence to expect not to be killed during an arrest. But I go back to the absolutely heinous case of Elijah McClain in Colorado. A kid who literally did nothing but go to the store to buy his siblings some snacks. Was wearing headphones, and a facemask in weather warmer than most people would because he suffered from anemia, which causes you to be cold. Someone calls him in for making hand motions listening to his music, cops roll up on him, he doesn't hear them (and why would he expect to be approached since he committed no crime other than offending the sensibilities of window watcher), they tackled and pinned him to the ground, and had paramedics inject him with ketamine, which ended up killing him.
He was literally the "angel" everyone always demands police murder victims to be. He was on the autism spectrum. He played violin for kittens at an animal shelter. And the police department itself was forced to admit last month they had NO justifiable reason for even stopping him, much less what actually happened. And I STILL heard people defending the cops. Cops who, by the way, went to the site of where it all went down and took smiling selfies like the ghouls they are. So frankly, I don't really give a fuck what excuse or technicality people use to justify this stuff anymore. Because even when there isn't one, they find one or make one up.
I think it's telling our resident Canadian poster is the one who sees this the most clearly. Because in almost all other civilized countries, the way this goes down is absolute madness. But many Americans do absolutely believe that non-compliance in a traffic stop or during an attempted arrest IS justification for a death sentence. They just do.
Another one 72 hours later. The 13-year old kid in Chicago did have a gun. He was ordered to put it down. He did. He was told to put his hands up. He did. Then he was shot anyway. The police appear to have been (shock!!!) lying about what happened right up til the moment the tape was released. Kind of gives food for thought as to why the guy in Brooklyn Center would flee. Because compliance will not save you. The exact same excuses are being trotted out. Either suspected criminals have rights, or they don't. If people want cops to just kill everyone they suspect is in commission of a crime, they should have the balls to just admit it instead of dancing around what they actually believe. Because as far as I tell, there isn't a single criminal act, no matter how major or minor, that doesn't justify homicide by cop if that happens to take place in the minds of alot of people "Don't start none, won't be none" is not the basis of our justice system.
The article here from CNN doesn't seem to corroborate your viewpoint. The kid's family's lawyer doesn't even know if it's worth a lawsuit yet. Not as cut and dry as some of the other cases...
Edit: Just because shit happens doesn't mean that everything that happens is shit...
Was the officer fired upon by the kid? Was the officer's life in danger as the kid ran away, who was being chased by a police officer with his gun already drawn?
The officer didn't even see if the kid had a gun, the officer presumed the kid had a gun because he had already quickly frisked down the 21 year old that the kid was with. The police scan that came through, just said "shots were fired" in the vicinity of the two as Chicago uses computers to detect if a gun was fired. No one saw these two fire a gun. It was just the officer's presumption that they were armed, and that presumption I guess warrants a death sentence.
What's the line I read earlier. A cop's blue fear is not worth a person's (black) life. The sad part is, the person who is terrified in this situation was the kid, not the cop, and the outcome shows he was terrified for good reason.
Yes, he was terrified for good reason. He had a gun and was running from the cops. That's completely different from the examples of police shooting unarmed civilians. It just is. Let's see if any lawsuit is filed on this kid's behalf. If not, then this incident isn't going to help your argument.
Ok scenario two.
The kid doesn't run, reveals he has a gun and gets shot while attempting to 'drop it' again. The police rolled up on these two with their guns drawn prior to knowing if they were armed or not. Remember no one saw these shots fired. They were only heard. They were guilty in the eyes of the police officers prior to any proof being established.
And I'd love the family to sue on second amendment rights. I'd like to see the hoops politicians on the right would need to jump through to both placate Blue Lives Matter & Second Amendment Rights while not appearing bigoted in any way.
Having a gun in your possession doesn't warrant a death sentence. Running from the cops does not warrant a death sentence. A cop being afraid for his life because he didn't assess the situation, determine his surroundings (no cover) or wait for back up doesn't warrant a death sentence.
A child lost his life to a police officer and we want to pretend that the officer didn't do anything wrong because a handgun (and my guess, an unloaded one due to the amount of shots that were recorded being fired) was recovered at the scene.
Considering many people will classify any police killing as a "good shooting" (I've seen this repulsive term thrown out with absolute glee consistently over the last 24 hours) even if the person who was shot smoked weed at any time in their life or once had detention in 6th grade, being in a possession of a gun absolutely means it will be seen as such.
You don't have to have a spotless existence to expect not to be killed during an arrest. But I go back to the absolutely heinous case of Elijah McClain in Colorado. A kid who literally did nothing but go to the store to buy his siblings some snacks. Was wearing headphones, and a facemask in weather warmer than most people would because he suffered from anemia, which causes you to be cold. Someone calls him in for making hand motions listening to his music, cops roll up on him, he doesn't hear them (and why would he expect to be approached since he committed no crime other than offending the sensibilities of window watcher), they tackled and pinned him to the ground, and had paramedics inject him with ketamine, which ended up killing him.
He was literally the "angel" everyone always demands police murder victims to be. He was on the autism spectrum. He played violin for kittens at an animal shelter. And the police department itself was forced to admit last month they had NO justifiable reason for even stopping him, much less what actually happened. And I STILL heard people defending the cops. Cops who, by the way, went to the site of where it all went down and took smiling selfies like the ghouls they are. So frankly, I don't really give a fuck what excuse or technicality people use to justify this stuff anymore. Because even when there isn't one, they find one or make one up.
I think it's telling our resident Canadian poster is the one who sees this the most clearly. Because in almost all other civilized countries, the way this goes down is absolute madness. But many Americans do absolutely believe that non-compliance in a traffic stop or during an attempted arrest IS justification for a death sentence. They just do.
I don't believe that at all. I do believe, however that when powder burns are found on somebody's gloves, it generally means that they discharged a firearm. Who was the kid shooting at? It might have been a drug dealer or some other transaction went south and warranted a violent response. Who the Hell knows? All I know is that this poor kid wasn't in a situation that he should have been in. He should have been sweating his next math quiz, not wondering if he should take a shot at somebody or not. The system failed him. Let's talk about what should be done to change the system, not blame a cop who probably is now a raging alcoholic because of that selfsame system.
Pretty standard pattern we see in society. A black child, with a toy or real gun, is a dangerous menace who must be put down without a thought. White men, despite being nearly eligible for social security, are perpetually viewed as "boys getting into some trouble", and hey, he was probably having a really rough day.
Beat a cop with a hammer. Alive and well. Wouldn't be surprised if they took him out for one last meal at McDonald's on the way back to the station.
It is OBVIOUSLY possible to take a suspect alive despite legitimate danger to an officer about 1000x more extreme than we saw in either of the recent shootings. It's a matter of whose life they view as meaningless and whose they believe should be preserved. Shit, they may not even be conscious of the bias. That's how ingrained it is.
Here's the statics by race. I would argue that it has more to do with economic status than race. If you control for economic status than the race issue wouldn't be as stark. How can we combat that? I'm a subscriber to the Next-door app and it amazes me how many of the negative posts are from the 'white-trash' trailer parks. The problem is deeper than race. How do we combat the real problem, poverty?
Comments
Yes, I agree with this. Large corporations will never go out of their way to do the right thing unless it means making more money. I can't think of a single example that points to the contrary.
Small business owners are a different story, many of them for example might start an environment-friendly company because they truly believe in environmental causes.
It is, in fact, exactly why they moved so swiftly on gay rights about 10 years ago. 10% of the population is a hell of a lot of people and disposable income to ignore.
And this surprises you? I doubt there's a nation on earth that doesn't have a 'protected class'. Some countries pretend to be more enlightened than others, but if and when things go south their colors will show in the end.
Trump actually released a statement suggesting this was a terrible mistake (the pausing), and for once - I think I agree with him. He blamed Biden (of course) and I dont technically know how much Biden gets to do here... but I have to imagine he at least tacitly agreed to the idea of pausing the J&J vax.
As far as I can tell, the outstanding warrant was for failure to appear (literally had one of these myself once). The stop itself was of the "broken taillight" variety, and he was shot while trying to get away from the police. Man, some of the quotes of people I have responded to on Twitter are something else, including "if you try to run from cops you're getting your ass shot with something". Really?? Is this "Tango and Cash" or some other Stallone movie, or real-life?? A gun should be pulled and fired only when there is imminent danger to the life of someone else. "Fleeing the scene" is something literally everyone I knew in high school had done at one time or another when cops busted an underage drinking party. I mean, suspected criminals still ostensibly have rights as well, and the way people just toss them on the trash heap to fit a narrative is really something to behold.
On the flip side, the cop who fired the gun reportedly has a history of concealing evidence, which is about 100x worse than anything this kid has been accused of. How the fuck do you keep your job as a cop after concealing evidence in a case UNLESS that is simply seen as standard procedure?? It would be like me purposefully moving money from someone's account to another one without permission and getting a slap on the wrist.
Here's an example of a bad union (the police union). Protecting people that shouldn't be protected. Bad employees should not be exempt from consequences. Granted, concealing evidence is far worse than sleeping on the job or showing up under the influence, but all three of those examples are people I wouldn't want working for me if I were the boss.
Indeed. It was pretty garden variety stuff for cops actually. She advised officers involved in the shooting of an autistic man to shut off their body cameras in the aftermath. She was "admonished" by investigators for doing so. At least according to the Daily Beast article. The report itself clears the cops involved, so there wasn't even any need to do it. Just a base instinct of "cover-up just in case". I just saw the part where she was apparently the union President at the time. Perfect.
https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/13/us/kim-potter-daunte-wright-police-shooting/index.html
Well, let's start with how bullshit traffic stops are used to substitute for actual police work, and who they disproportionately effect. Pull over enough people on technicalities that are improving the safety of absolutely no one, and odds are some of them are going to have a bench warrant out for something.
I just read the Twitter comment of an African-American woman about her two brothers. She said one of them literally STOPPED driving altogether a few years ago because the anxiety of constantly getting pulled over was too much for him. Her other brother had bought a Lexus (usually the type of car that is a treat to yourself for doing well in life), but he returned it to the dealer for something more modest. Why?? Because he was also constantly getting pulled over and the cops were consistently not believing it was his car.
So you can't drive a nice car because that's suspicious. You can't drive a cheap car because those are the ones that get you pulled over for faulty or broken parts. Total Catch-22. And this is just the story of one set of siblings. Think of how many times you would have to get pulled over to take these kind of drastic actions. And they aren't making it up, though many have been insisting for years the black community is exaggerating about traffic stops. They aren't. All you have to do is ask them about it. And you'll quickly find out that, to a person, they get pulled over more in six months than most of us have in 30 years.
https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2021/04/11/ex-boston-police-officer-and-union-chief-stayed-on-force-despite-abuse-allegation
No offense, but what the hell is in the water in Boston?? This is where the center of Catholic Church scandal took place (and was eventually uncovered by the same newspaper who has the dirt on this guy, the Boston Globe) and now this. Are you just flat-out allowed to molest children if you are in a position of power the community respects?? Because the evidence suggests that until recently, that was pretty much the case. I'm linking the abbreviated version here because the Globe investigation is behind a paywall.
If that’s the case, and the officer is found to no wrong in the event of a person being critically injured or killed, it’s time to look at these ‘procedures’ instead of just the officer.
If an officer is trained to pull out a stun gun during a minor traffic infraction or to tap on their window with a loaded gun when the driver isn’t responding (such as with the first time Floyd was pulled over) then it’s time to change these procedures.
Even with the Floyd trial, the defence has paid an ex cop to testify that what Chauvin did was justified. It’s just baffling that’s the society some Americans live in.
https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/liberal-mp-causes-consternation-in-house-of-commons-after-appearing-naked-on-camera-in-front-of-colleagues
*snickering*
If we for a moment assume this actually happens, it will be yet another indication of a guy who may be personally moderate, and presents himself that way outwardly to most casual observers, but is governing farther to the left than anyone in recent memory:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/biden-breaks-with-obama-as-well-as-trump-on-everything-from-afghanistan-to-spending-211954060.html
The Obama administration, you say? Back then, he was just one voice. Now, he's the one that makes the final decisions.
https://quillette.com/2020/09/25/why-is-funny-how-america-lost-its-sense-of-humor/
Is that true, how has he shown that to be the case? (Asking honestly, I dont really know much about Biden's philosophy with respect to war. I know he voted for the Iraq war, but almost everyone did... so that doesnt seem like the most important/useful measuring stick, even if some people want it to be).
This was an interesting tweet I saw. It shows sort of how the GOP is negotiating in bad faith with Biden.
The ironic thing about this, the 21 year old who was with the kid was charged with felony endangerment of a child.
The article here from CNN doesn't seem to corroborate your viewpoint. The kid's family's lawyer doesn't even know if it's worth a lawsuit yet. Not as cut and dry as some of the other cases...
https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/15/us/adam-toledo-police-shooting-body-camera/index.html
Edit: Just because shit happens doesn't mean that everything that happens is shit...
Was the officer fired upon by the kid? Was the officer's life in danger as the kid ran away, who was being chased by a police officer with his gun already drawn?
The officer didn't even see if the kid had a gun, the officer presumed the kid had a gun because he had already quickly frisked down the 21 year old that the kid was with. The police scan that came through, just said "shots were fired" in the vicinity of the two as Chicago uses computers to detect if a gun was fired. No one saw these two fire a gun. It was just the officer's presumption that they were armed, and that presumption I guess warrants a death sentence.
What's the line I read earlier. A cop's blue fear is not worth a person's (black) life. The sad part is, the person who is terrified in this situation was the kid, not the cop, and the outcome shows he was terrified for good reason.
Yes, he was terrified for good reason. He had a gun and was running from the cops. That's completely different from the examples of police shooting unarmed civilians. It just is. Let's see if any lawsuit is filed on this kid's behalf. If not, then this incident isn't going to help your argument.
If my girlfriend was shot by a cop I'd want to file a lawsuit, but I wouldn't be confident it would make a difference.
Ok scenario two.
The kid doesn't run, reveals he has a gun and gets shot while attempting to 'drop it' again. The police rolled up on these two with their guns drawn prior to knowing if they were armed or not. Remember no one saw these shots fired. They were only heard. They were guilty in the eyes of the police officers prior to any proof being established.
And I'd love the family to sue on second amendment rights. I'd like to see the hoops politicians on the right would need to jump through to both placate Blue Lives Matter & Second Amendment Rights while not appearing bigoted in any way.
Having a gun in your possession doesn't warrant a death sentence. Running from the cops does not warrant a death sentence. A cop being afraid for his life because he didn't assess the situation, determine his surroundings (no cover) or wait for back up doesn't warrant a death sentence.
A child lost his life to a police officer and we want to pretend that the officer didn't do anything wrong because a handgun (and my guess, an unloaded one due to the amount of shots that were recorded being fired) was recovered at the scene.
Considering many people will classify any police killing as a "good shooting" (I've seen this repulsive term thrown out with absolute glee consistently over the last 24 hours) even if the person who was shot smoked weed at any time in their life or once had detention in 6th grade, being in a possession of a gun absolutely means it will be seen as such.
You don't have to have a spotless existence to expect not to be killed during an arrest. But I go back to the absolutely heinous case of Elijah McClain in Colorado. A kid who literally did nothing but go to the store to buy his siblings some snacks. Was wearing headphones, and a facemask in weather warmer than most people would because he suffered from anemia, which causes you to be cold. Someone calls him in for making hand motions listening to his music, cops roll up on him, he doesn't hear them (and why would he expect to be approached since he committed no crime other than offending the sensibilities of window watcher), they tackled and pinned him to the ground, and had paramedics inject him with ketamine, which ended up killing him.
He was literally the "angel" everyone always demands police murder victims to be. He was on the autism spectrum. He played violin for kittens at an animal shelter. And the police department itself was forced to admit last month they had NO justifiable reason for even stopping him, much less what actually happened. And I STILL heard people defending the cops. Cops who, by the way, went to the site of where it all went down and took smiling selfies like the ghouls they are. So frankly, I don't really give a fuck what excuse or technicality people use to justify this stuff anymore. Because even when there isn't one, they find one or make one up.
I think it's telling our resident Canadian poster is the one who sees this the most clearly. Because in almost all other civilized countries, the way this goes down is absolute madness. But many Americans do absolutely believe that non-compliance in a traffic stop or during an attempted arrest IS justification for a death sentence. They just do.
I don't believe that at all. I do believe, however that when powder burns are found on somebody's gloves, it generally means that they discharged a firearm. Who was the kid shooting at? It might have been a drug dealer or some other transaction went south and warranted a violent response. Who the Hell knows? All I know is that this poor kid wasn't in a situation that he should have been in. He should have been sweating his next math quiz, not wondering if he should take a shot at somebody or not. The system failed him. Let's talk about what should be done to change the system, not blame a cop who probably is now a raging alcoholic because of that selfsame system.
Pretty standard pattern we see in society. A black child, with a toy or real gun, is a dangerous menace who must be put down without a thought. White men, despite being nearly eligible for social security, are perpetually viewed as "boys getting into some trouble", and hey, he was probably having a really rough day.
Beat a cop with a hammer. Alive and well. Wouldn't be surprised if they took him out for one last meal at McDonald's on the way back to the station.
It is OBVIOUSLY possible to take a suspect alive despite legitimate danger to an officer about 1000x more extreme than we saw in either of the recent shootings. It's a matter of whose life they view as meaningless and whose they believe should be preserved. Shit, they may not even be conscious of the bias. That's how ingrained it is.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/