Having enjoyed it, I'd rather see a continuation of Mass Effect Andromeda. Presenting me with an (at that time trendy) Kobayasi Meru ending to the original trilogy means I have zero interest in remastered versions thereof.
Having enjoyed it, I'd rather see a continuation of Mass Effect Andromeda. Presenting me with an (at that time trendy) Kobayasi Meru ending to the original trilogy means I have zero interest in remastered versions thereof.
TR
Now there is an unpopular opinion if I ever heard one.
Not gonna lie, every character in Andromeda was like nails on the chalkboard of my sanity.
Having seen complaints about the facial animations (the uncanny real aspect never bothered me) a continuation would give a chance to correct that for those who were bothered by it.
Give them a consistent set of combat mechanics through all three games, as well as consistent leveling.
Rethink the ending.
Vulkan's a better renderer
HDR is good. Ray tracing is good.
Having enjoyed it, I'd rather see a continuation of Mass Effect Andromeda. Presenting me with an (at that time trendy) Kobayasi Meru ending to the original trilogy means I have zero interest in remastered versions thereof.
TR
Now there is an unpopular opinion if I ever heard one.
Not gonna lie, every character in Andromeda was like nails on the chalkboard of my sanity.
Plus the quest outcomes. There was that one side quest I remember in particular where at the end you have to choose between two outcomes. But it was like why would I want either of these things?
(apparently the sidequest was First Murderer)
There was no like "keep him in prison and retry him on the correct charge" option. You either banish him or let him walk free. Like... what?
Maybe there wasn't enough for other charges. But I just remember the quest ending really falling flat for me.
Give them a consistent set of combat mechanics through all three games, as well as consistent leveling.
Rethink the ending.
Vulkan's a better renderer
HDR is good. Ray tracing is good.
Some of that seems dicey. Which combat mechanics should be used? I really liked 3's, but there's no way everybody does.
Give them a consistent set of combat mechanics through all three games, as well as consistent leveling.
Rethink the ending.
Vulkan's a better renderer
HDR is good. Ray tracing is good.
Some of that seems dicey. Which combat mechanics should be used? I really liked 3's, but there's no way everybody does.
*whispers* I really like the ending.
*whispers* mee too...
Such an unpopular opinion ?
With Baldur's Gate, ME is one of my favourite games ever. I would love an unified gameplay and consistent leveling, but it would be quite some work to adjust all the content... It's not likely.
I feel like I've seen clickbait articles about this remaster for the last two years running in my cell-phone Google feed. I'll believe it when I see it.
Give them a consistent set of combat mechanics through all three games, as well as consistent leveling.
Rethink the ending.
Vulkan's a better renderer
HDR is good. Ray tracing is good.
the only thing i see happening is all the graphics and technical issues of me 1 getting fixed. the games are gonna be the same.
J/k. But no, I'm firmly in the "Dislike" camp of the ME3 ending. It just felt like the player had very little agency in the last hour or so of the game. To be fair though, I think that behind the scenes ME was struggling a bit with exactly what it was trying to go for with its core theme. If it really was trying for a "organics vs synthetics" theme, then it should not have allowed us to find a peaceful solution between the Quarians and the Geth, because that very outcome is proof that the Reapers' insistence that organics and synthetics can't co-exist is wrong, and it feels jarring to the player.
@Zaxares There's been a very strong theme of, "You can't save them all", hard choices, and personal sacrifice all throughout the game. I think the final choice is a near perfect expression of those themes in a single choice. The ultimate choice. A peaceful solution would have been jarring imo, after what the trilogy had been constantly drilling into my head.
J/k. But no, I'm firmly in the "Dislike" camp of the ME3 ending. It just felt like the player had very little agency in the last hour or so of the game. To be fair though, I think that behind the scenes ME was struggling a bit with exactly what it was trying to go for with its core theme. If it really was trying for a "organics vs synthetics" theme, then it should not have allowed us to find a peaceful solution between the Quarians and the Geth, because that very outcome is proof that the Reapers' insistence that organics and synthetics can't co-exist is wrong, and it feels jarring to the player.
But that was the point of that mission. The reapers are wrong about co-existence.
The ending was trash. The ending that was replaced by this ending after a leak was also trash. This is always why a story should actually be written backwards (at least roughly) instead of forwards. Start with a cool ending
I am a fan, and will always be a fan of the indoctrination theory with the real right choice being of destroying the relay. That would have opened up a gritty sequel of everyone stranded in the Sol system (earth) and the limited resources, with an attempt to try to fix the relay as racial tensions between the different alien species mount. Instead we get Andromeda. but I digress.
and figure out how to actually get to that point. It doesn't have to be the indoctrination theory, but at least give us something that says - all the choices you've made up to this point - matter. Mass Effect 2nailed that beautifully with the suicide mission. Mass Effect 3 squandered it with a choose your coloured light show.
@Zaxares There's been a very strong theme of, "You can't save them all", hard choices, and personal sacrifice all throughout the game. I think the final choice is a near perfect expression of those themes in a single choice. The ultimate choice. A peaceful solution would have been jarring imo, after what the trilogy had been constantly drilling into my head.
Warning: MAJOR ME3 spoilers ahead, so I'm wrapping everything in spoiler tags. XD
That's a fair point, but I still feel that the ending doesn't properly take into account player agency and the impact of the actions the player does beyond a binary "Is your War Score high enough? Y/N". Shepard and the Citadel races DO lose a lot in the war. Remember all those missions on the main planets (especially Earth, Palaven and Thessia?) Untold thousands of civilians are dying every second you're on those planets, so yes, Shepard can't save them all. It's just that it's glossed over and in the background. To most players, I imagine just like with the hundreds of thousands of COVID deaths going on right now, they're just "statistics". It's hard to feel empathy for a bunch of faceless strangers whom you've never met.
I was just terribly disappointed with the last mission and the finale considering the perfection that was the Suicide Mission in 2. Depending on how well you built your squad, and your decisions on how to deploy them, the mission could be a unparalleled success or an absolute travesty. ME3 could have done the same. Did you manage to recruit the Krogan clans? Or saved the biotic kids from the Grissom Academy? Perhaps during the final push, Shepard receives a message about how Reaper forces are breaking through the front line and reinforcements are desperately needed. If you managed to acquire either ally, you can send either the Krogans or the biotics to reinforce them. (Failure to do so means you get a penalty during your final push to the Beacon.) And furthermore, depending on whether or not it's Wrex or Wreave leading the Krogans, or whether you told the biotic kids to focus more on defense or offense, can also drastically change the outcome of your decision.
Put in enough of those decisions, decisions that harken back to the choices the player made throughout the game, and then it all comes down to that final push. If your score is too low, then Harbinger wipes out the entire Hammer squad, Shepard dies and it's over. If your score is just middling, Shepard alone makes it to the beacon. Whoever was in his team for the final push dies. If your score is high, then Shepard AND his team make it, and that drastically changes the outcome of the final encounter again. (His teammates show up and stop the Illusive Man from killing Anderson.)
And finally, exactly how high your war score is will influence the final outcome of your choice. For example, picking the Destroy option with a low war score is catastrophic; the Relays explode destructively, wiping out all life in their systems. The Reapers are defeated, but Earth is gone, and humanity is extinct. With a middle score, you get the "Dark Age" ending. The relays still explode, but the damage is contained enough that most of the system survives. However, with the relays gone, the galaxy is thrown back into a new Dark Age where nobody can travel to nearby clusters in any kind of timely fashion anymore. Trillions of people will probably die from starvation and deprivation, trapped on planets that can't feed them or construct essential industry. But if you have a high war score, then the relays survive mostly intact, and the Citadel races manage to repair them within a few decades.
Also, one idea I had? At some point, you also get given control of an allied Dreadnought (if you saved the Destiny Ascension, you're given control of that instead), and you have to slug it out in a space battle with Harbinger. How well you do in this fight also has an impact on the final push, as Harbinger is either still mostly intact, or badly wounded and can't bring his full arsenal to bear on Hammer squad.) I was just majorly annoyed that despite being a major villain throughout the series, the player never gets a chance to confront Harbinger directly and mete out justice.
@Zaxares I see it more as the sum of your decisions. Your choices got you to this point, they are WHY you have any options at all. The only choice that matters at this point...is the current one. Its not perfect, but I'd give it a 8/10 as an ending overall (I'm counting the revised ending in this. I never saw the original one.).
For sure its not perfect, I'd have your war score have variability in the ending. One new ending and a variant on another isn't enough. I'd have liked if:
You only have destroy with low or really low war score. You get control for low to mid score, hybrid end for mid to high, high score letting shepard survive the destroy ending, and finally, a very high score letting you combine the control and destroy endings that lets you fire a destruction pulse (without destroying the weapon) that only targets the reapers.
It would give more weight to your cumulation of all your choices throughout the series without ruining the restricted nature of the final choice.
@Zaxares I see it more as the sum of your decisions. Your choices got you to this point, they are WHY you have any options at all. The only choice that matters at this point...is the current one. Its not perfect, but I'd give it a 8/10 as an ending overall (I'm counting the revised ending in this. I never saw the original one.).
For sure its not perfect, I'd have your war score have variability in the ending. One new ending and a variant on another isn't enough. I'd have liked if:
You only have destroy with low or really low war score. You get control for low to mid score, hybrid end for mid to high, high score letting shepard survive the destroy ending, and finally, a very high score letting you combine the control and destroy endings that lets you fire a destruction pulse (without destroying the weapon) that only targets the reapers.
It would give more weight to your cumulation of all your choices throughout the series without ruining the restricted nature of the final choice.
Yeah, I'd have tweaked the ending too to something similar, although...
In my version, I'd have eliminated the Synthesis ending altogether. I can see why the designers thought it was the perfect solution to their organic-synthetic conflict arc, but personally, I find the idea of imposing such a transformation on untold numbers of sapient beings without consultation or permission to be frankly horrifying. It also raises a bunch of really awkward situations; for instance, the end cinematic made a big show of indicating that even the trees were now synthetic. If ALL organic now is integrated and you can sense the feelings and emotions of all other species in the galaxy... How on earth is anybody going to eat anything now? You would be able to sense the pain and distress of not only animals, but also plants, fungi and even right down to bacteria. Perhaps the newly synthetic races could switch to some form of new energy, but completely eschewing the consumption of matter for energy is really going to change the nature of things. If nobody has to eat food anymore, what does that mean for the millenia of history that food and cuisine has influenced our culture? Organic life would never be the same again.
But anyway, I digress. I'd just keep it to two main choices: Destroy and Control, and what exactly you get depends on the level of your War Score and how well you can convince the Catalyst in the final conversation about whether it is time to give organic-synthetic peace another chance. (This is much easier if you solved the Quarian-Geth conflict peacefully, naturally.)
For Destroy, things play out much as I mentioned above. If your War Score is low, the Relays explode destructively, wiping out all life in their systems. The Reapers are defeated, but Earth is gone, and humanity is extinct. With a middle score, you get the "Dark Age" ending. The relays still explode, but the damage is contained enough that most of the system survives. However, with the relays gone, the galaxy is thrown back into a new Dark Age where nobody can travel to nearby clusters in any kind of timely fashion anymore. Trillions of people will probably die from starvation and deprivation, trapped on planets that can't feed them or construct essential industry. If your War Score is high, then the relays survive mostly intact, and the Citadel races manage to repair them within a few decades. Furthermore, having a high War Score with Destroy also destroys purely the Reapers, while sparing EDI and the Geth. (This is because both of them are built off Reaper technology, but if your War Score is high enough, the Crucible can differentiate between them.)
For Control, if your War Score is low, then things go very badly for Shepard. Cerberus' plans for the Crucible are flawed, and it completely fails to dominate the Reapers. Shepard's mind is consumed by the gestalt intelligence of the Reapers/Catalyst, and the harvesting continues. With a middle score, Shepard is partially successful. They manage to seize control of the gestalt intelligence, but realize that this control will likely only be temporary. Shepard orders the Reapers to fire on the Citadel, destroying it and the Catalyst (and killing Shepard in the process), but doing so weakens the Reaper force so that the organic races can win the day. It will take several more centuries of grueling war before the last of the Reapers are finally destroyed. If your War Score is high, then you get the current Control ending in which Shepard's mind merges with the gestalt intelligence, and overlays their personality onto the new being. This gives Shepard full control over the Reapers, and they direct them to rebuild the relays and the shattered worlds, before becoming a sort of galactic peacekeeping force. But fear and distrust remain between the organic races and the Reapers, and none can say for sure if the Shepard Intelligence will always remain benevolent towards the organic races...
the story would make no sense if you played as anything other then human.
The story didn't have to be written that way in the first place :P I hate that bioware gave us so many good races...and we can only play boring humans.
@Zaxares Reflecting back, I don't know if I'd want a "perfect" solution like the one I posted earlier. With how big the theme of self sacrifice and no perfect choices are throughout the trilogy, options that let Shepard survive, or spares everyone else should probably be mutually exclusive.
As for synthesis, I don't think its intended as the "perfect solution", so much as the typical "screw you I'm taking a third option" type deal. If high war score implies objectively better outcomes, then very high destroy would be the "golden" end. Since that extra scene requires the highest war score.
@Zaxares Reflecting back, I don't know if I'd want a "perfect" solution like the one I posted earlier. With how big the theme of self sacrifice and no perfect choices are throughout the trilogy, options that let Shepard survive, or spares everyone else should probably be mutually exclusive.
As for synthesis, I don't think its intended as the "perfect solution", so much as the typical "screw you I'm taking a third option" type deal. If high war score implies objectively better outcomes, then very high destroy would be the "golden" end. Since that extra scene requires the highest war score.
Yeah, I can see that point, and maybe agree with it to some extent. Still, I think players would be rather peeved if they couldn't have a way to get a "Best Ending" after how the previous two games allowed it. XD
I think it's debatable whether or not the high Destroy ending is really better than a high Control ending, using the hypothetical scenarios I gave. Destroying the Reapers means also destroying the last remnants of ancient races that existed before and were consumed by the Reapers, forever consigning their lore, history and memories to oblivion. It also deprives the Citadel races of the vast amounts of knowledge and technology the Reapers have that they used to construct the Mass Relays and build their shells. (Up to this point the various races still have not managed to unlock the secrets behind the Mass Relays and how they work. The Protheans were the only race that came close thus far.)
With that in mind, you could argue that the high Control ending is far superior. With one stroke, you have not only brought peace back to the galaxy, but also gained the vast knowledge and technology of the Reapers AND gained an exponential increase in military power. The horizons would truly be open to all after this; maybe the newly united races decide to expand to other galaxies, or turn inwards and study the mysteries of dark energy. (The plot line that Casey Hudson was originally going for and later abandoned.) Some players dislike the Control ending because it also means that Shepard technically "dies", but what's stopping Shepard from simply constructing a supremely advanced android model (even more advanced than EDI) and just using that as their "avatar" to interact with ordinary people, including their love interest?
Also, there is actually a 4th ending that some might not know about: "Reject." You can actually just go ahead and shoot the Catalyst boy himself. XD If you do this, the cycle continues. The Citadel races lose the war and are consumed, but the following cinematic shows that Liara's backup plan of seeding information capsules on various worlds succeeded, and since the last cinematic between the Storyteller and the Child is exactly the same, it means that one of the subsequent cycles succeeded in stopping the Reapers. Liara's plan worked, and the player wins after all, though perhaps not quite how they imagined it happening.
Hell yeah, Mass Effect 3 is still during on my pile of shame. There was always no time to play it. It's a perfect excuse niw to play the whole trilogy with a modern visuals. I wonder if Bioware would implement any changes in the gameplay too.
I wonder if Bioware would implement any changes in the gameplay too.
Unlikely, judging from the blog post. Looks like this "Legendary Edition" bundle is strictly limited to become a cosmetic update which will run on modern consoles. Then again, it remains to be seen how the official enhanced graphics will fare against fan-made 4k enhancement mods such as A Lot of Textures.
Either way, guess it will be interesting to see if owners of the original titles will receive a loyalty discount. And whenever or not its steam release will still require the bloody Origin launcher to be installed as well. But given how other Bioware titles were run on steam.... they'll probably won't change a thing on their approach here.
Comments
Now, if they were going to move the games onto a more modern engine or something, I could definitely get behind that.
It's also probably too soon to ask for a remake a la Resident Evil 2 and 3.
TR
Now there is an unpopular opinion if I ever heard one.
Not gonna lie, every character in Andromeda was like nails on the chalkboard of my sanity.
TR
Give them a consistent set of combat mechanics through all three games, as well as consistent leveling.
Rethink the ending.
Vulkan's a better renderer
HDR is good. Ray tracing is good.
Plus the quest outcomes. There was that one side quest I remember in particular where at the end you have to choose between two outcomes. But it was like why would I want either of these things?
(apparently the sidequest was First Murderer)
There was no like "keep him in prison and retry him on the correct charge" option. You either banish him or let him walk free. Like... what?
Maybe there wasn't enough for other charges. But I just remember the quest ending really falling flat for me.
Some of that seems dicey. Which combat mechanics should be used? I really liked 3's, but there's no way everybody does.
*whispers* I really like the ending.
*whispers* mee too...
Such an unpopular opinion ?
With Baldur's Gate, ME is one of my favourite games ever. I would love an unified gameplay and consistent leveling, but it would be quite some work to adjust all the content... It's not likely.
the only thing i see happening is all the graphics and technical issues of me 1 getting fixed. the games are gonna be the same.
*points and does the pod person scream*
J/k.
But that was the point of that mission. The reapers are wrong about co-existence.
The ending was trash. The ending that was replaced by this ending after a leak was also trash. This is always why a story should actually be written backwards (at least roughly) instead of forwards. Start with a cool ending
Warning: MAJOR ME3 spoilers ahead, so I'm wrapping everything in spoiler tags. XD
I was just terribly disappointed with the last mission and the finale considering the perfection that was the Suicide Mission in 2. Depending on how well you built your squad, and your decisions on how to deploy them, the mission could be a unparalleled success or an absolute travesty. ME3 could have done the same. Did you manage to recruit the Krogan clans? Or saved the biotic kids from the Grissom Academy? Perhaps during the final push, Shepard receives a message about how Reaper forces are breaking through the front line and reinforcements are desperately needed. If you managed to acquire either ally, you can send either the Krogans or the biotics to reinforce them. (Failure to do so means you get a penalty during your final push to the Beacon.) And furthermore, depending on whether or not it's Wrex or Wreave leading the Krogans, or whether you told the biotic kids to focus more on defense or offense, can also drastically change the outcome of your decision.
Put in enough of those decisions, decisions that harken back to the choices the player made throughout the game, and then it all comes down to that final push. If your score is too low, then Harbinger wipes out the entire Hammer squad, Shepard dies and it's over. If your score is just middling, Shepard alone makes it to the beacon. Whoever was in his team for the final push dies. If your score is high, then Shepard AND his team make it, and that drastically changes the outcome of the final encounter again. (His teammates show up and stop the Illusive Man from killing Anderson.)
And finally, exactly how high your war score is will influence the final outcome of your choice. For example, picking the Destroy option with a low war score is catastrophic; the Relays explode destructively, wiping out all life in their systems. The Reapers are defeated, but Earth is gone, and humanity is extinct. With a middle score, you get the "Dark Age" ending. The relays still explode, but the damage is contained enough that most of the system survives. However, with the relays gone, the galaxy is thrown back into a new Dark Age where nobody can travel to nearby clusters in any kind of timely fashion anymore. Trillions of people will probably die from starvation and deprivation, trapped on planets that can't feed them or construct essential industry. But if you have a high war score, then the relays survive mostly intact, and the Citadel races manage to repair them within a few decades.
Also, one idea I had? At some point, you also get given control of an allied Dreadnought (if you saved the Destiny Ascension, you're given control of that instead), and you have to slug it out in a space battle with Harbinger. How well you do in this fight also has an impact on the final push, as Harbinger is either still mostly intact, or badly wounded and can't bring his full arsenal to bear on Hammer squad.) I was just majorly annoyed that despite being a major villain throughout the series, the player never gets a chance to confront Harbinger directly and mete out justice.
For sure its not perfect, I'd have your war score have variability in the ending. One new ending and a variant on another isn't enough. I'd have liked if:
It would give more weight to your cumulation of all your choices throughout the series without ruining the restricted nature of the final choice.
Down with the human Shepard supremancy!
Yeah, I'd have tweaked the ending too to something similar, although...
But anyway, I digress. I'd just keep it to two main choices: Destroy and Control, and what exactly you get depends on the level of your War Score and how well you can convince the Catalyst in the final conversation about whether it is time to give organic-synthetic peace another chance. (This is much easier if you solved the Quarian-Geth conflict peacefully, naturally.)
For Destroy, things play out much as I mentioned above. If your War Score is low, the Relays explode destructively, wiping out all life in their systems. The Reapers are defeated, but Earth is gone, and humanity is extinct. With a middle score, you get the "Dark Age" ending. The relays still explode, but the damage is contained enough that most of the system survives. However, with the relays gone, the galaxy is thrown back into a new Dark Age where nobody can travel to nearby clusters in any kind of timely fashion anymore. Trillions of people will probably die from starvation and deprivation, trapped on planets that can't feed them or construct essential industry. If your War Score is high, then the relays survive mostly intact, and the Citadel races manage to repair them within a few decades. Furthermore, having a high War Score with Destroy also destroys purely the Reapers, while sparing EDI and the Geth. (This is because both of them are built off Reaper technology, but if your War Score is high enough, the Crucible can differentiate between them.)
For Control, if your War Score is low, then things go very badly for Shepard. Cerberus' plans for the Crucible are flawed, and it completely fails to dominate the Reapers. Shepard's mind is consumed by the gestalt intelligence of the Reapers/Catalyst, and the harvesting continues. With a middle score, Shepard is partially successful. They manage to seize control of the gestalt intelligence, but realize that this control will likely only be temporary. Shepard orders the Reapers to fire on the Citadel, destroying it and the Catalyst (and killing Shepard in the process), but doing so weakens the Reaper force so that the organic races can win the day. It will take several more centuries of grueling war before the last of the Reapers are finally destroyed. If your War Score is high, then you get the current Control ending in which Shepard's mind merges with the gestalt intelligence, and overlays their personality onto the new being. This gives Shepard full control over the Reapers, and they direct them to rebuild the relays and the shattered worlds, before becoming a sort of galactic peacekeeping force. But fear and distrust remain between the organic races and the Reapers, and none can say for sure if the Shepard Intelligence will always remain benevolent towards the organic races...
The story didn't have to be written that way in the first place :P I hate that bioware gave us so many good races...and we can only play boring humans.
@Zaxares Reflecting back, I don't know if I'd want a "perfect" solution like the one I posted earlier. With how big the theme of self sacrifice and no perfect choices are throughout the trilogy, options that let Shepard survive, or spares everyone else should probably be mutually exclusive.
As for synthesis, I don't think its intended as the "perfect solution", so much as the typical "screw you I'm taking a third option" type deal. If high war score implies objectively better outcomes, then very high destroy would be the "golden" end. Since that extra scene requires the highest war score.
Yeah, I can see that point, and maybe agree with it to some extent. Still, I think players would be rather peeved if they couldn't have a way to get a "Best Ending" after how the previous two games allowed it. XD
With that in mind, you could argue that the high Control ending is far superior. With one stroke, you have not only brought peace back to the galaxy, but also gained the vast knowledge and technology of the Reapers AND gained an exponential increase in military power. The horizons would truly be open to all after this; maybe the newly united races decide to expand to other galaxies, or turn inwards and study the mysteries of dark energy. (The plot line that Casey Hudson was originally going for and later abandoned.) Some players dislike the Control ending because it also means that Shepard technically "dies", but what's stopping Shepard from simply constructing a supremely advanced android model (even more advanced than EDI) and just using that as their "avatar" to interact with ordinary people, including their love interest?
Also, there is actually a 4th ending that some might not know about: "Reject." You can actually just go ahead and shoot the Catalyst boy himself. XD If you do this, the cycle continues. The Citadel races lose the war and are consumed, but the following cinematic shows that Liara's backup plan of seeding information capsules on various worlds succeeded, and since the last cinematic between the Storyteller and the Child is exactly the same, it means that one of the subsequent cycles succeeded in stopping the Reapers. Liara's plan worked, and the player wins after all, though perhaps not quite how they imagined it happening.
Either way, guess it will be interesting to see if owners of the original titles will receive a loyalty discount. And whenever or not its steam release will still require the bloody Origin launcher to be installed as well. But given how other Bioware titles were run on steam.... they'll probably won't change a thing on their approach here.