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TES4: Oblivion: EE

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edited January 2019 in Off-Topic
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semiticgoddessVallmyrLudwig_IIBalrog99

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  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,714
    Getting Morrowind would be awesome too.
    lefreut
  • VallmyrVallmyr Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 2,457
    I need to do a playthrough of Oblivion, I plan to just use the character creation overhaul to make the models look better and that mod that removes scaling so the game is better balanced. I also might add the Elswyr mod because Khajiit are my jam.
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    edited January 2019
    What's really needed isn't so much TES IV: Oblivion Enhanced Edition, which will realistically speaking never happen. Given that Beamdog hasn't exactly got the pocket money for aquire the rights anyway. But a completely new engine in Gamebryo's place. And no, I don't just mean an "enhanced" Gamebryo engine either.

    Morrowind received such attention thanks to OpenMW. The merits are clear as day: native Windows, Linux, Mac and even Android support being some of the more prominent ones. As well as a brand new and far more powerful Construction Set... and best of all? OpenMW CS works natively on Linux and Mac, too! Something which even NwN:EE didn't manage with its toolset.

    Heck, even Daggerfall followed OpenMW's example with it's Daggerfall Unity engine.
    KuronaFinneousPJ
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited January 2019
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  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    @subtledoctor Really? People complained rather loudly that Oblivion's CS was more than just one step backwards from Morrowind's more powerful CS. Enough so that even Todd Howard and Bethesda got rather pissed off by those massive complains.

    If we go for what game is the most modded one out there, then the clear winner is Skyrim (the original one). According to the Nexus it currently hosts 59.3k Oldrim mods, 28.9k Oblivion mods, 15.4k Skyrim SE mods and 5.3k Morrowind mods. Honestly, the latter really deserves more love.
  • KuronaKurona Member Posts: 881
    The golden era of Morrowind modding happened when there wasn't a big centralized website like the Nexus (named Morrowind Chronicles back then iirc). The end result is that the mods are a bit everywhere on the internet and a lot of them has been lost to history :(

    As for Morrowind-in-Oblivion-engine I personally never liked it. On top of lacking certain things that made the original memorable (levitation, complete enchanting freedom, etc...) the art direction is simply too different to faithfully recreate the atmosphere. In my eyes at least, but this is a YMMV case.

    OpenMW is frankly the best thing for Morrowind lovers.
    Kamigoroshi
  • AmmarAmmar Member Posts: 1,295
    @subtledoctor I always felt that you can't separate most games from their engines. Morrowind in the engine of Oblivion will never be a proper Morrowind. I also don't agree that the Oblivion engine is superior, at least for MW.
    • Oblivion dialogue system is totally unsuited for the amounts of dialogue in MW
    • MW had superior spell-making and enchanting. Oblivion does not even have on-use items
    • MW had many more equipment slots, which *matters*. Getting all pieces of Daedric Armor was a real achievement in MW and even Wraithguard does not have a proper place in the Oblivion equipment system
    • Most-controversial one in the list: I like the combat in MW much better. It is fast and governed by your in-game skills.
    • Finding things was a core part of Morrowind; it needs neither map markers (as in your screenshot) nor quest markers.
    OpenMW is fine, but I personally will never touch Skywind or Morroblivion. And when I look at that screenshot I don't see Morrowind.

    Nothing specific to Elder Scrolls, really. I will the same about Ultima or BG remakes. E.g. Ultima V: Lazarus is a great game in it's own right, but it is not Ultima V.
    lefreutKamigoroshiKurona
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited January 2019
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    semiticgoddess
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    Oblivion did have the most solid gameplay in terms of complexity and diversity. Morrowind can't support all the same things, and Skyrim simply doesn't have a lot of tools to diversify gameplay. Skyrim is fun, but for modding purposes, Oblivion does open up more possibilities for gameplay. The only shortcoming is the dialog system--I'm not sure how that would be fixed. That's the sort of problem that you'd need the source code to truly fix.
    [Deleted User]
  • KuronaKurona Member Posts: 881

    Incorrect! All of that can be had in Oblivion!

    I haven't played Oblivion in quite a while so I'm a bit behind the news. If that's true (I assume by way of OBSE plugins?) then it's a pretty cool thing. Not enough to make me play Morroblivion though.

    In any case Oblivion is fairly enjoyable by itself, assuming one gets rid of its horrible level scaling. I still prefer Morrowind all around but Oblivion is colorful and kind of silly at times and I vaaaaastly prefer it over the bland attempt at a quote-unquote-grimdark world that Skyrim ended up to be. It also has some of the best quests in the franchise.
  • AmmarAmmar Member Posts: 1,295

    Oblivion did have the most solid gameplay in terms of complexity and diversity. Morrowind can't support all the same things, and Skyrim simply doesn't have a lot of tools to diversify gameplay. Skyrim is fun, but for modding purposes, Oblivion does open up more possibilities for gameplay. The only shortcoming is the dialog system--I'm not sure how that would be fixed. That's the sort of problem that you'd need the source code to truly fix.

    What exactly does Oblivion support that Morrowind does not? The only thing that comes to mind is Radiant AI. If you think the combat is that much better in Oblivion you can equally well mod Morrowind to make it the same as in Oblivion.

    Incorrect! All of that can be had in Oblivion!

    Elaborate please. I have seen mods that try to add equipment slots, but they are had significant issues, as in for example requiring very specific orders in which to equip the items and/or clipping issues.

    I also have not seen any good on-use enchanting mod. You can do a by-item workaround using scripting, but 1000s of additional scripts running in the background will certainly not help performance or stability. The closest I am aware of is is this: http://tesrenewal.com/forums/morroblivion/mods/2657. And it still has very significant limitations.

    All this with the caveat, that I have not looked for these kinds of mods in a long time (though I now did a quick google search.

    As for map markers and quest markers, those can obviously be turned off. But once this feature is there, both the official and the mod designer start to work under the assumption that you have them on. Skyrim radiant quests point to a random location, without dialogue. It's often similar in Oblivion. They don't really support directions instead of markers.
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    semiticgoddess
  • AmmarAmmar Member Posts: 1,295
    @subtledoctor That is absolutely fair and my point was simply that for me if *I* want to play Morrowind, I would want to do it in the proper engines.

    On-use items are part of my play-style, so any issue with that is larger for me anyway. As for how many armor types/equipment slots there are, I don't have strong feelings about it in general, but again, would argue that Morrowind is designed and balanced with this in mind.

    As said, I would feel something is missing if I don't need to track down all the Daedric Armor items that old Morrowind has. Or necessarily running around with a bare arm if I have Wraithguard equipped. There are other minor things, as e.g. I really like collecting all the books in Elderscrolls Game, and they just display nicer in bookshelves in Morrowind. The physics for this can really mess it up (btw I am the author of the original book placement mod for Oblivion, so I actually worked on improving that part).

    But of course everyone can play it in whatever engine preferred.

    And maybe I am surprised in the future and those features will be added without issues, but I doubt it unless they work directly on the engine. As said, it is the other way around for MW: there are mods that add Oblivion style combat, followers and daily routines, but they are always hacked-in a bit and have minor issues due to that.
    [Deleted User]
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    Why should TES4 be the first EE? What about 1-3?
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    FinneousPJ
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