Perhaps they both could get a boost to turn undead
Well, perhaps they could, but then you'd have the problem of having unbalanced the choice between the different Cleric kits (which is already a little advantageous to Priests of Lathander, IMO) ... so no, too much knock-on effect, it might be never-ending.
So I reckon make an Undead Hunter equal to a Cleric at Turn Undead. If the Undead Hunter needs even more of a boost to make it competitive, then I'd say give it another bonus as well (e.g. an additional immunity or an additional innate ability), rather than yet more Turning ... but one thing at a time, perhaps it doesn't need more boost than Cleric-style Turning. I suspect that might be enough to make it an attractive kit, so I'd prefer to get this change and test it out, before contemplating further change requests.
I think it's pretty hard to discuss your favorite kit without having a powergaming argument. Because in a way, the things that define your favorite kit are often his advantages and disadvantages, but in a game like BG, these often result in the kit being better or worse mechanically. Of course the poll isn't about the strongest kit, but I think it is healthy to say something like "I really like this ability" or "This feature of the classe is so good ! I like it".
It was the same last week when people debated the Archer and the Stalker, the backstabs versus the bonuses at range, but people were factoring early BG, SoA, ToB etc ...
But I agree comparing the Blackguard to the overlords Mages was an error, sorry about that !
Well I thought the poll would be more one-sided, I was sure 50% of the people would vote for the Blackguard and the other 50% for a "good" option, resulting in a clear advantage for the evil !
I dunno, I rarely take mechanics or powergaming into consideration—for me, it's all about the flavor. But it's always nice to find common ground with people who think differently
Cavalier. It seems the best fit for the PC to me. I don't see why he'd particularly want to hunt mages, or even have seen any undead, but a Cavalier seems likely enough imo. I quite like the idea of the Blackguard also, but I don't like the thought of serving some demon as the PC. I guess I could just imagine he gets these powers as a Bhaalspawn without one somehow.
Cavalier. It seems the best fit for the PC to me. I don't see why he'd particularly want to hunt mages, or even have seen any undead, but a Cavalier seems likely enough imo. I quite like the idea of the Blackguard also, but I don't like the thought of serving some demon as the PC. I guess I could just imagine he gets these powers as a Bhaalspawn without one somehow.
I would imagine that CHARNAME started out as a paladin and then in SoA ended up as an Inquisitor. What mage would he particularly want to hunt, eh?
Cavalier. It seems the best fit for the PC to me. I don't see why he'd particularly want to hunt mages, or even have seen any undead, but a Cavalier seems likely enough imo. I quite like the idea of the Blackguard also, but I don't like the thought of serving some demon as the PC. I guess I could just imagine he gets these powers as a Bhaalspawn without one somehow.
I would imagine that CHARNAME started out as a paladin and then in SoA ended up as an Inquisitor. What mage would he particularly want to hunt, eh?
True, and of course that works fine with UH as well. But now in the EE when we start that way, it'd make me feel like my PC had daddy issues.^^ Any rate, it's just what fits best with the charnames I imagine.
Blackguard is the most powerful simply due to poison weapon negating casters, for utility would have to be inquisitor simply cause of the broken dispel, and cavalier for a solo playthrough due to having all the advantages of being a paladin and no disadvantages making him one of the easiest solo classes to chunk the game with.
@SionIV I feel like if someone really wanted to role-play changing kits, then paladin is the class most likely to change from the basic version in BG1 to a kit in BG2. Most classes don't really seem like a "stage 1" version of any of their kits, but I feel like a paladin would be a class that throughout their journey in BG1, they would find something they want to specialize against.
Of course I also believe that a fighter/cleric makes WAY more sense for a BG1 character anyway, but y'know, logic hasn't stopped people before. (It IS a video game, after all.)
Not to forget the Cavalier is described as a demon and dragon hunter, it isn't more fitting/realistic than the Undead Hunter or the Inquisitor IMO.
Well, except to some extent once you get to ToB, when a certain amount of dragon-hunting becomes part of the main plot, so a Cavalier is then rather appropriate.
Of course I also believe that a fighter/cleric makes WAY more sense for a BG1 character anyway, but y'know, logic hasn't stopped people before. (It IS a video game, after all.)
For BG1, yes ... although you can always fill the F/C role with Yeslick (or Jaheira as an F/D), and in that case there'd be less point in having another of the same, so you'd have room to play your protagonist as an all-out warrior class.
However, if you're planning to continue on through BG2, the slower levelling and lower maximum level of the multiclass changes the balance of advantage ... to about evens, IMO. But again, it all depends on who else you're planning to include in the party.
(Really, any class at all can make a strong contribution if you assemble a party which fits well around him/her. That can be difficult for newbies who don't know what'll work, but I'm sure every experienced player could construct a great run with any class.)
@Gallowglass I kind of like the idea of using an editor to change your character's class partway through BG2 from a F/C to a paladin for the role-playing aspect. Which is why I say F/C in BG1. If it weren't for role-playing then I'd be likely to take the paladin every single time.
@Gallowglass I kind of like the idea of using an editor to change your character's class partway through BG2 from a F/C to a paladin for the role-playing aspect. Which is why I say F/C in BG1.
Hmmm, yes, interesting concept. You'd have to manually edit the spells and innate abilites and so on, as well as just change the class, so it'd take some effort, but I guess it's possible.
Editing (other than cosmetically) is not to my personal taste, but I'll be interested to hear how you get on with this plan.
(Though I found a paladin portrait on these forums that's really pretty and makes me tempted.)
Having said that, just show me the results and all that, I think Inquisitor is probably the most powerful. But I've never really cared about playing the most powerful.
I find the Undead Hunter tends to falter by the endgame in TOB.
There are more demons and dragons, so the Cavalier's bonuses are applicable more often. Mage fights become increasingly tricky, so the Inquisitor's abilities are still relevant. The Blackguard's poison abilities give enemies a hard time whatever their strength. For the Undead Hunter, his abilities are less applicable as there are few undead in TOB, and even fewer that can pose a threat.
To add variety, how about a Chosen of Tyr paladin kit that makes enemies die of heartbreak (Saerileth... )?
Chosen of Tyr: hostile to all npc with a charisma lower than 16, class quest causes character to be kidnapped and then the game ends cause no one cares enough to rescue the chosen.
Chosen of Tyr: hostile to all npc with a charisma lower than 16, class quest causes character to be kidnapped and then the game ends cause no one cares enough to rescue the chosen.
How about the overly attached boyfriend/girlfriend who stalks you?
Chosen of Tyr: hostile to all npc with a charisma lower than 16, class quest causes character to be kidnapped and then the game ends cause no one cares enough to rescue the chosen.
How about the overly attached boyfriend/girlfriend who stalks you?
Lol! Rescuing someone from a kidnapper is "overly attached"?
I never understand, why a fighter give up the faster xp progression and grandmastery for garbage skills. If i view paladin as an advanced fighter, who learn more things And slower to advance, i keep the grandmastery for them. Or keep the same xp chart.
I never understand, why a fighter give up the faster xp progression and grandmastery for garbage skills. If i view paladin as an advanced fighter, who learn more things And slower to advance, i keep the grandmastery for them. Or keep the same xp chart.
Paladin isn't an advanced fighter. Its a tanking class that gives up fighter abilities for divine protection.
Comments
So I reckon make an Undead Hunter equal to a Cleric at Turn Undead. If the Undead Hunter needs even more of a boost to make it competitive, then I'd say give it another bonus as well (e.g. an additional immunity or an additional innate ability), rather than yet more Turning ... but one thing at a time, perhaps it doesn't need more boost than Cleric-style Turning. I suspect that might be enough to make it an attractive kit, so I'd prefer to get this change and test it out, before contemplating further change requests.
Ever since then I think that a true knight should fight dragons.
The best part of the game was when I managed to get from L1 to L20+ without fighting a single monster XD
I can't play evil and I love dispelling mages so I have to go with Keldorn..
Of course the poll isn't about the strongest kit, but I think it is healthy to say something like "I really like this ability" or "This feature of the classe is so good ! I like it".
It was the same last week when people debated the Archer and the Stalker, the backstabs versus the bonuses at range, but people were factoring early BG, SoA, ToB etc ...
But I agree comparing the Blackguard to the overlords Mages was an error, sorry about that !
Well I thought the poll would be more one-sided, I was sure 50% of the people would vote for the Blackguard and the other 50% for a "good" option, resulting in a clear advantage for the evil !
Of course I also believe that a fighter/cleric makes WAY more sense for a BG1 character anyway, but y'know, logic hasn't stopped people before. (It IS a video game, after all.)
However, if you're planning to continue on through BG2, the slower levelling and lower maximum level of the multiclass changes the balance of advantage ... to about evens, IMO. But again, it all depends on who else you're planning to include in the party.
(Really, any class at all can make a strong contribution if you assemble a party which fits well around him/her. That can be difficult for newbies who don't know what'll work, but I'm sure every experienced player could construct a great run with any class.)
Editing (other than cosmetically) is not to my personal taste, but I'll be interested to hear how you get on with this plan.
(Though I found a paladin portrait on these forums that's really pretty and makes me tempted.)
Having said that, just show me the results and all that, I think Inquisitor is probably the most powerful. But I've never really cared about playing the most powerful.
There are more demons and dragons, so the Cavalier's bonuses are applicable more often. Mage fights become increasingly tricky, so the Inquisitor's abilities are still relevant. The Blackguard's poison abilities give enemies a hard time whatever their strength. For the Undead Hunter, his abilities are less applicable as there are few undead in TOB, and even fewer that can pose a threat.
To add variety, how about a Chosen of Tyr paladin kit that makes enemies die of heartbreak (Saerileth...
IIRC Saerileth's admirer put flowers next to her head every night.
I could have gotten it wrong. It was quite some time ago. I'm not about to abuse myself by reviewing the material again.
disliked : blackguard they just went way over the top with his powers and gave him no real disadvantage
feels like a cheese to me tbh
Paladin isn't an advanced fighter. Its a tanking class that gives up fighter abilities for divine protection.