wouldn't it be interesting to go the original BG route with portraits? Could someone convince the Beamdog team to post their pictures we could baldurize/icewindize ?
Philip Daigle and Trent Oster were the models for Nat Jones' original portraits of Rasaad and Dorn.
Gotta hand it to their wives. They married two sexy beasts.
@bengoshi - awesome souce! This gives me an idea - wouldn't it be interesting to go the original BG route with portraits? Could someone convince the Beamdog team to post their pictures we could baldurize/icewindize ?
@bengoshi - awesome souce! This gives me an idea - wouldn't it be interesting to go the original BG route with portraits? Could someone convince the Beamdog team to post their pictures we could baldurize/icewindize ?
This is an incredible idea I love it I hope that the portraits from BG1:EE and BG2:EE can be used for IWD:EE you can make your own verion of the original Cannon party Kalid as a fighter/mage Jaheira a fighter/druid Minsc as a Ranger Imoen as a thief Dynaheir as a mage CHARNAME I know that they wont interact but since you already know their personalities. it will be alike a whole new adventure
2 Fighters (one Elf with long sword and one dwarf with axe of course) 1 thief/fighter (gnome or halfling) 1 wizard (Elf) 1 priest (human) and sometimes the last one is a dual-class Wizard/Cleric or Figher/druid (half-elf)
I like to mix races and have a group with as many as different races I can
1. Arandes, LG M Human Inquisitor, Swords 2. Shaneka, TN F Half-Elf Fighter/Druid, Daggers and Scimitars 3. Andor, LE M Human Berserker(9)/Mage, Grandmastery Axes 4. Nathaniel, NE M Human Berserker(9)/Cleric, Grandmastery Flails 5. Jeremiah, CN M Halfling Fighter/Thief, Archer and sencdonary Swordsman 6. Elora, NG F Human Bard, secondary Mage, Archer and Swordswoman, Pickpocket, Identify and War Chant of Sith
I did the whole playthrough on hard difficulty and it was quite manageable with a few quirks:
1. I like Paladins, but Inquisitors are obviously not my style. Arandes did not really work as IWD is not magic heavy enough, so there were only few times I needed his Dispel and True Sight and I missed some other features like Healing, Curing and the Remove Fear of the Cavalier (my favorite paldin kit). Next time I will go with the Cavalier (first Char I ever finished BG2:SoA). 2. Druids in IWD suck! Spell selction is mediocre and I am not the shapeshifting guy. Shaneka was a frontliner like Arandes with some but not enough useful spells. Jaheira in BG2 is powerful because of her Summon Insects spell, which is nerfed in IWD and you really do not need it. Fighter/Cleric is much more fun in my opinion. 3. Nothing to complain about. As expected, this one was a machine, Grand Mastery in Axes was just fine. 4. Meat grinding machine! BUT it was no good idea to roll an evil cleric, misses out too many good spells and cannot Raise Dead, cannot use Three White Doves! 5. Quite powerful and useful, as expected. 6. I like Blades in the BG Series, Blade was my funniest playthrough, but Bards are too underpowered in IWD. I wanted to play vanilla, because I thought that Blade would be quite useless, loosing most of the songs for a little more melee prowess. Good things about the bard were the Lore ability (never needed shop identify or spells) and to some extend the War Chant and the Courage Song (remember - I did not roll a Cavalier), but that's it mostly. I had some hard times to keep her alive. Totally different experience than I had in the Baldur's Gate series.
It was quite a powergamy party, but in my opinion IWD is a powergamy game.
Next party based on the experiences from the beta will be (even more powergamy):
1. Thoren, LG M Human Cavlier - Swords, see above 2. Gilgor, LN M Dwarven Defender - High Mastery Axes and Warhammers, Tanks rule in IWD 3. Belinkhar, NG F Half-Elf Cleric/Ranger, dual-wield, druid spells 4. Merrick, CG M Gnome Fighter/Illusionist - Swords, Daggers and Spells 5. Shagar, CN M Half-Orc Cleric/Thief (always wanted to play one, but somehow never did) - Cubs (for sneak attacks) and slings 6. Kathryne, TN F Human, undecided between a) Sorcerer (maybe Dragon Disciple) - lots of spells but not very durable b) more likely Fighter 7/Mage - High Mastery in Longbows
The one problem I think of with this party is that I have to rely on spells and shops for identifying, which can be quite annoying considering the amount of (random) magic items in IWD.
The general consensus on the forum is that druids in IWDEE, just on the contrary, become much more useful and powerful than they are in BGEE. In IWDEE they get new powerful spells at all levels and become stronger than in BGEE.
I knew that my statement about druids in IWD would raise objections. But for me it is true. I was never keen on druids in BG, I played Jaheira (who I like story-wise) always as a less competent version of a Fighter/Cleric with the powerful additions of Insect Plague (much less useful in IWD) and the Elemental Princes (no HLAs in IWD). Druids in Icewind Dale miss out a good weapon selection, I always end up using daggers ... which is sort of underwhelming ... good Scimitars (if any) are very late game and Shapeshifting is almost never used by me.
And if I want druidic spells I will go Cleric/Ranger.
Voila, I always run full girls party, heavily divine spell oriented. head leader is a lawful neutral, i believe it is a good alignment for leadership when you have to stick with people from different background.
Stats are from first roll. As for their story, I don't have any yet, let's say that Shizuka and Anju met a long time ago and decided to stick together for survival purpose. While Ryoko befriended Kyoko saving her from certain death during an ambush.
Now how they all came together, i haven't figured that out yet.
I knew that my statement about druids in IWD would raise objections. But for me it is true. I was never keen on druids in BG, I played Jaheira (who I like story-wise) always as a less competent version of a Fighter/Cleric with the powerful additions of Insect Plague (much less useful in IWD) and the Elemental Princes (no HLAs in IWD). Druids in Icewind Dale miss out a good weapon selection, I always end up using daggers ... which is sort of underwhelming ... good Scimitars (if any) are very late game and Shapeshifting is almost never used by me.
And if I want druidic spells I will go Cleric/Ranger.
Your opinion is another gamer's different perspective that we respect. Rather than raising objections, I think it's important for people to acknowledge and call things as they see it (In which you did, sir).
[spoiler=wall of texts, something you probably already know] I don't know if the level experience scaling has changed throughout the game. But from what I remember in the vanilla version, multi-class characters are bound to fall behind in terms of levels compared to single-class characters. If you use fighter-druid solely for frontline, then he is definitely going to be weaker since his fighter levels are behind. Vice-versa, if he is used solely for casting spells, he will be no better than a pure class druid that has access to more higher level spells.
Of course, multi-class characters get weapon specialization that most pure classes (unless kitted) don't. That in itself is important when spells ran out and the only option left is to stand and fight. The attacks/round increase as well as higher survivability than the pure classes is what makes multi-class characters powerful, provided they are adequately leveled.
Humans kind of bypass that multi-class leveling on the long term with dual-class option (over-powered in my opinion) as long as people find the right spot and the right time to dual-class. [/spoiler] How far did you get with the IWDEE Beta? I see that in your party it's mostly dual-class characters and the other multi-class chracter is the fighter/thief (Thieves have lower experience requirements to level). Unless it is far into the end of the game where levels and experience started to reach some kind of soft cap, I think your druid might be hindered by that multi-class option rather than the class itself.
I am halfway through Lower Dorn's Deep and have finished HoW and TotL, roughly 3.5 Mio XP. That said my Druid is Lvl 14 and has all spell levels available. The problem I have with most AoE Druid Spells is, that they are not party friendly so I rarely use them. It mostly comes down to sunscorch, fire elemental, iron skins and the healing spells. That's it. The fighter part of her is much more dominant in my playstyle and here I feel restricted in contrast to BG concerning weapon selection.
I feel in IWD Cleric/Ranger is superior to Fighter/Druid in almost every aspect bare shapeshifting, which I almost never use.
@bengoshi - awesome souce! This gives me an idea - wouldn't it be interesting to go the original BG route with portraits? Could someone convince the Beamdog team to post their pictures we could baldurize/icewindize ?
No idea yet what will be in my IWD... Since my multiplayer group has yet to even discuss what classes they want to play. However I'm thinking about running a Half-Orc Barbarian (or Berserker) that uses two-handed axes.
edit:
Also, unfortunately, I doubt my multiplayer group will be finished with our run through BG2:EE by October 30th.
I am halfway through Lower Dorn's Deep and have finished HoW and TotL, roughly 3.5 Mio XP. That said my Druid is Lvl 14 and has all spell levels available. The problem I have with most AoE Druid Spells is, that they are not party friendly so I rarely use them. It mostly comes down to sunscorch, fire elemental, iron skins and the healing spells. That's it. The fighter part of her is much more dominant in my playstyle and here I feel restricted in contrast to BG concerning weapon selection.
I feel in IWD Cleric/Ranger is superior to Fighter/Druid in almost every aspect bare shapeshifting, which I almost never use.
You do know Cleric/Rangers don't get druid spells until they qualify for them as a ranger? That's level 22 for Iron Skins.
Also, daggers?! IWD may lack scimitars and clubs, but it has staves and slings.
I am halfway through Lower Dorn's Deep and have finished HoW and TotL, roughly 3.5 Mio XP. That said my Druid is Lvl 14 and has all spell levels available. The problem I have with most AoE Druid Spells is, that they are not party friendly so I rarely use them. It mostly comes down to sunscorch, fire elemental, iron skins and the healing spells. That's it. The fighter part of her is much more dominant in my playstyle and here I feel restricted in contrast to BG concerning weapon selection.
I feel in IWD Cleric/Ranger is superior to Fighter/Druid in almost every aspect bare shapeshifting, which I almost never use.
No Cleric/Ranger exploit to access all druid spells until the Ranger portion is high enough level.
Actually the most effective weapon for my Druid was The Dagger of Venom, which I only discarded when I got the Talon of Gloomfrost near the End of HoW, which compared to the weapons of the other chars (Long Sword of Action, Axe of the Minotaur, Long Bow: Hammer, Morning Star of Action etc.) felt rather mediocre. And I did not find any appealing staff either. Slings for me is rather situational.-
Concerning spells it is true, that my Ranger/Cleric will probably take a long time to get Ironskins (not checked if IWDEE uses the IWD or the BGEE progression for the R/C Druid Spells), but Ironskins for me is not as vital as some Cleric spells like Protection from Evil, Draw upon Holy Might and the like buffers by far. Not to mention Raise Dead. And even with IWD Spell Progression I will get Sunscorch, Cloudburst and Static Charge soon enough, at least on Insane.
So for me it is still Cleric/Ranger >> Fighter/Druid > Single Class Druid (Kit).
Holey portrait-perfec face batman! And me with no spare time this weekend... Maybe I'll manage to stuff some icewindizing in between all the house/family duties.
So far, this is what I am thinking: For definite: Undead Hunter Sorcerer (Dragon Disciple is tempting, but I think the loss of one spell per day is too much)
Still thinking about: Berserker dualled to Cleric Fighter/Thief Mage/Cleric Archer (but the fighter kit variant) dualled to Mage Shadowdancer (tempting but the fact that it would have to be a single class kinda ruins it for me) Fighter/Druid
Its nice that Druids have much better spells available to them in IWD, but I'm still not sure whether it is worth bringing one along because of their weapon limits. I mean, are there good spears in IWD:EE? Or scimitars?
I'm quite keen on the Berserker dualled to cleric, but taking one along would mean that I would likely need another cleric to cover while the other one is still a fighter. Or at least, someone with healing ability.
I might investigate using EE Keeper or whatever it is called to allow me to dual class a fighter into a shadow dancer. I think single class thieves are generally a waste of time. And I don't think it is worth dualling from a shadow dancer into a fighter because their backstab multiplier grows so slowly.
Also, someone else pointed out that when you get enough potions of invisibility, the shadowdancer loses much of it's advantage. True?
Concerning spells it is true, that my Ranger/Cleric will probably take a long time to get Ironskins (not checked if IWDEE uses the IWD or the BGEE progression for the R/C Druid Spells),
It uses the HoW spell progression, which means Iron Skins at level 22 (as opposed to never with BG progression).
but Ironskins for me is not as vital as some Cleric spells like Protection from Evil, Draw upon Holy Might and the like buffers by far. Not to mention Raise Dead.
In which case, Fighter/Cleric is a better choice than Ranger/Cleric.
In which case, Fighter/Cleric is a better choice than Ranger/Cleric.
F/C is a valid choice as well, especially if you do not want to play a good Half-Elf. But I think the few offensive low level druid spells you get, the favored enemy and the 2 free points in dual wield give a small advantage over the faster level progression of the Fighter part. That is, as mentioned, if you don't want to play an Lawful Evil Dwarf.
I'm actually planning on running a Dwarf Priest of Lathander - is he going to be worth a darn in melee? I don't need him to be the main DPS (ive got undead hunter and barbarian for that), but I am hoping he can provide some off-tanking when needed, to keep monsters away from my squishies.
Clerics tank just fine. What they lose in hp they can easily make up in defensive spells. They're just terrible at dealing damage. The Priest of Lathander can even negate that weakness for short durations with Boon of Lathander, and any priest can mitigate it by dual-wielding. I actually ran a half-orc Priest of Lathander through BG1 as a main front-liner. Can't say he was the strongest character I ever played, but once I got him dual-wielding he was no slouch in physical combat. In short, I think your dwarf will manage fine.
Comments
I hope that the portraits from BG1:EE and BG2:EE can be used for IWD:EE
you can make your own verion of the original Cannon party
Kalid as a fighter/mage
Jaheira a fighter/druid
Minsc as a Ranger
Imoen as a thief
Dynaheir as a mage
CHARNAME
I know that they wont interact but since you already know their personalities.
it will be alike a whole new adventure
2 Fighters (one Elf with long sword and one dwarf with axe of course)
1 thief/fighter (gnome or halfling)
1 wizard (Elf)
1 priest (human)
and sometimes the last one is a dual-class Wizard/Cleric or Figher/druid (half-elf)
I like to mix races and have a group with as many as different races I can
Second: Human, barbarian
Third: Dwarf, dwarven defender
Forth: Half-Elf, druid / Human, cleric
Fifth: Human, theif / assassin
Sixth: Human, monk / paladin
"Icewindize"
by Aristillius
ICEwinDIZE
DizeWindICE
iceWINdize
WINDDIZEICE
icewinDIZE
ICEwindize
diceicewind?
ICEWINDIZE!
1. Arandes, LG M Human Inquisitor, Swords
2. Shaneka, TN F Half-Elf Fighter/Druid, Daggers and Scimitars
3. Andor, LE M Human Berserker(9)/Mage, Grandmastery Axes
4. Nathaniel, NE M Human Berserker(9)/Cleric, Grandmastery Flails
5. Jeremiah, CN M Halfling Fighter/Thief, Archer and sencdonary Swordsman
6. Elora, NG F Human Bard, secondary Mage, Archer and Swordswoman, Pickpocket, Identify and War Chant of Sith
I did the whole playthrough on hard difficulty and it was quite manageable with a few quirks:
1. I like Paladins, but Inquisitors are obviously not my style. Arandes did not really work as IWD is not magic heavy enough, so there were only few times I needed his Dispel and True Sight and I missed some other features like Healing, Curing and the Remove Fear of the Cavalier (my favorite paldin kit). Next time I will go with the Cavalier (first Char I ever finished BG2:SoA).
2. Druids in IWD suck! Spell selction is mediocre and I am not the shapeshifting guy. Shaneka was a frontliner like Arandes with some but not enough useful spells. Jaheira in BG2 is powerful because of her Summon Insects spell, which is nerfed in IWD and you really do not need it. Fighter/Cleric is much more fun in my opinion.
3. Nothing to complain about. As expected, this one was a machine, Grand Mastery in Axes was just fine.
4. Meat grinding machine! BUT it was no good idea to roll an evil cleric, misses out too many good spells and cannot Raise Dead, cannot use Three White Doves!
5. Quite powerful and useful, as expected.
6. I like Blades in the BG Series, Blade was my funniest playthrough, but Bards are too underpowered in IWD. I wanted to play vanilla, because I thought that Blade would be quite useless, loosing most of the songs for a little more melee prowess. Good things about the bard were the Lore ability (never needed shop identify or spells) and to some extend the War Chant and the Courage Song (remember - I did not roll a Cavalier), but that's it mostly. I had some hard times to keep her alive. Totally different experience than I had in the Baldur's Gate series.
It was quite a powergamy party, but in my opinion IWD is a powergamy game.
Next party based on the experiences from the beta will be (even more powergamy):
1. Thoren, LG M Human Cavlier - Swords, see above
2. Gilgor, LN M Dwarven Defender - High Mastery Axes and Warhammers, Tanks rule in IWD
3. Belinkhar, NG F Half-Elf Cleric/Ranger, dual-wield, druid spells
4. Merrick, CG M Gnome Fighter/Illusionist - Swords, Daggers and Spells
5. Shagar, CN M Half-Orc Cleric/Thief (always wanted to play one, but somehow never did) - Cubs (for sneak attacks) and slings
6. Kathryne, TN F Human, undecided between
a) Sorcerer (maybe Dragon Disciple) - lots of spells but not very durable
b) more likely Fighter 7/Mage - High Mastery in Longbows
The one problem I think of with this party is that I have to rely on spells and shops for identifying, which can be quite annoying considering the amount of (random) magic items in IWD.
http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/34135/druid-spells
http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/comment/508535/#Comment_508535
The general consensus on the forum is that druids in IWDEE, just on the contrary, become much more useful and powerful than they are in BGEE. In IWDEE they get new powerful spells at all levels and become stronger than in BGEE.
I was never keen on druids in BG, I played Jaheira (who I like story-wise) always as a less competent version of a Fighter/Cleric with the powerful additions of Insect Plague (much less useful in IWD) and the Elemental Princes (no HLAs in IWD).
Druids in Icewind Dale miss out a good weapon selection, I always end up using daggers ... which is sort of underwhelming ... good Scimitars (if any) are very late game and Shapeshifting is almost never used by me.
And if I want druidic spells I will go Cleric/Ranger.
Hmm
old: New:
Blackguard - sword/shield
Cleric/Ranger - dual blunts
Sun Soul Monk - fists
Fighter/Thief - Longbows
Avenger - staff/spear/sling/darts?
Wild Mage - sling[
Stats are from first roll. As for their story, I don't have any yet, let's say that Shizuka and Anju met a long time ago and decided to stick together for survival purpose. While Ryoko befriended Kyoko saving her from certain death during an ambush.
Now how they all came together, i haven't figured that out yet.
[spoiler=wall of texts, something you probably already know]
I don't know if the level experience scaling has changed throughout the game. But from what I remember in the vanilla version, multi-class characters are bound to fall behind in terms of levels compared to single-class characters. If you use fighter-druid solely for frontline, then he is definitely going to be weaker since his fighter levels are behind. Vice-versa, if he is used solely for casting spells, he will be no better than a pure class druid that has access to more higher level spells.
Of course, multi-class characters get weapon specialization that most pure classes (unless kitted) don't. That in itself is important when spells ran out and the only option left is to stand and fight. The attacks/round increase as well as higher survivability than the pure classes is what makes multi-class characters powerful, provided they are adequately leveled.
Humans kind of bypass that multi-class leveling on the long term with dual-class option (over-powered in my opinion) as long as people find the right spot and the right time to dual-class.
[/spoiler]
How far did you get with the IWDEE Beta? I see that in your party it's mostly dual-class characters and the other multi-class chracter is the fighter/thief (Thieves have lower experience requirements to level). Unless it is far into the end of the game where levels and experience started to reach some kind of soft cap, I think your druid might be hindered by that multi-class option rather than the class itself.
@ifupauline
Those are some beautiful portraits!
I feel in IWD Cleric/Ranger is superior to Fighter/Druid in almost every aspect bare shapeshifting, which I almost never use.
edit:
Also, unfortunately, I doubt my multiplayer group will be finished with our run through BG2:EE by October 30th.
Also, daggers?! IWD may lack scimitars and clubs, but it has staves and slings.
Concerning spells it is true, that my Ranger/Cleric will probably take a long time to get Ironskins (not checked if IWDEE uses the IWD or the BGEE progression for the R/C Druid Spells), but Ironskins for me is not as vital as some Cleric spells like Protection from Evil, Draw upon Holy Might and the like buffers by far. Not to mention Raise Dead. And even with IWD Spell Progression I will get Sunscorch, Cloudburst and Static Charge soon enough, at least on Insane.
So for me it is still Cleric/Ranger >> Fighter/Druid > Single Class Druid (Kit).
For definite:
Undead Hunter
Sorcerer (Dragon Disciple is tempting, but I think the loss of one spell per day is too much)
Still thinking about:
Berserker dualled to Cleric
Fighter/Thief
Mage/Cleric
Archer (but the fighter kit variant) dualled to Mage
Shadowdancer (tempting but the fact that it would have to be a single class kinda ruins it for me)
Fighter/Druid
Its nice that Druids have much better spells available to them in IWD, but I'm still not sure whether it is worth bringing one along because of their weapon limits. I mean, are there good spears in IWD:EE? Or scimitars?
I'm quite keen on the Berserker dualled to cleric, but taking one along would mean that I would likely need another cleric to cover while the other one is still a fighter. Or at least, someone with healing ability.
I might investigate using EE Keeper or whatever it is called to allow me to dual class a fighter into a shadow dancer. I think single class thieves are generally a waste of time. And I don't think it is worth dualling from a shadow dancer into a fighter because their backstab multiplier grows so slowly.
Also, someone else pointed out that when you get enough potions of invisibility, the shadowdancer loses much of it's advantage. True?
But I think the few offensive low level druid spells you get, the favored enemy and the 2 free points in dual wield give a small advantage over the faster level progression of the Fighter part.
That is, as mentioned, if you don't want to play an Lawful Evil Dwarf.
Uncle Otto Botkins Male Dwarf Fighter / Defender
Big Daddy Bruno Botkins Male Dwarf Barbarian
Crazy Cousin Uzzi Botkins Male Dwarf Ranger / Archer Crossbows
Sweet Mama Mojo Botkins Female Dwarf Druid / Avenger
Honorable Ozzy Botkins Male Dwarf Chaotic Neutral multiclass Cleric / Thief
In-law Peewee Botkins Male Gnome Dragon Disciple