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12 Bandit ambush

What the flying fuck is up with that, is there any mod that disables it. Im trying harcore runs and it pisses me off that even before I reach the FFI Im ambushed by a circle of bandits with absolutely no chanche to survive. Im mad.

TressetBelgarathMTHjackjack
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Comments

  • subtledoctorsubtledoctor Member Posts: 11,185
    toolarg said:

    Im trying harcore runs

    To be fair, that's about as hardcore as you get...

    Btw can't you just run away?

    MortiannajoluvthespaceCrevsDaak
  • AlbinoWyvernAlbinoWyvern Member Posts: 32
    You could always have a handy stack of Potions of Invisibility for situations like that. They're accesible very early in the High Hedge. You could also try casting Sleep on them, with its fast time it should get to most of them before they'll do serious damage to you, assuming of course that they're not aiming at your mage(s).

    JuliusBorisovAeginidae
  • joluvjoluv Member Posts: 2,136
    Yeah, modding that out would not be a very hardcore thing to do. You could always just go south to Beregost instead; there are no random encounters in the AR2800-AR3300 trip.

  • MortiannaMortianna Member Posts: 1,355
    Which is a good reason for mages to have Shield memorized (if you're playing a mage or sorcerer). I was once ambushed by the bandit circle along with some kobolds thrown in, and was lucky enough to cast Shield while everyone else died in the first volley of arrows. I then fled to Beregost to start a new party with Kagain, as I couldn't believably justify carrying three corpses (Imoen, Monty, and Xzar) with a 9 STR.

    @Tresset Especially in original BG, where you didn't get to pause the game while you desperately rummaged through your pack for that Potion of Mirrored Eyes, only to return to the game screen to find someone petrified. I learned the hard way to make sure to buy a Stone to Flesh scroll before I leave Candlekeep with Gorion.

    JuliusBorisovCrevsDaak
  • HeindrichHeindrich Member, Moderator Posts: 2,959
    Wait that ambush is still in the game?! I thought it was removed for BG:EE. I got really nasty early-game ambushes all the time in BG1 vanilla (ogre mage and the ring of bandits), but in BG:EE all the random encounters were pretty tame. Was this changed again for v1.3 or was I just lucky?

  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058
    Probably the bandit ring would seem tame to any minmaxed characters with max dex and con.

    They'd be super deadly against anyone with average dex and con scores though.

    Best to figure out safe transition paths, not all transitions are created equal.

  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 18,694
    If you're really trying hardcore runs, @toolarg, try something else to survive - that's the only way of making a no-reload run, to me.

    In this case, don't go east from the location with Imoen, go south. This way, you won't get this ambush and will safely reach Beregost. From there, you can go the the Friendly arm inn.

    Aeginidae
  • Fiendish_WarriorFiendish_Warrior Member Posts: 309
    Heindrich said:

    Wait that ambush is still in the game?! I thought it was removed for BG:EE. I got really nasty early-game ambushes all the time in BG1 vanilla (ogre mage and the ring of bandits), but in BG:EE all the random encounters were pretty tame. Was this changed again for v1.3 or was I just lucky?

    I've definitely seen it on Android, multiple times. While I've also encountered a wyvern ambush near Bandit Camp of all places (the Cloakwood wyvern ambushes are pretty common), I do not recall seeing a basilisk ambush yet. That sounds pretty terrible.

  • Fiendish_WarriorFiendish_Warrior Member Posts: 309
    edited March 2015
    I'm also curious whether anyone has any insight into respawn rates. In one of my games, I don't know what's different (checked difficulty), but the battle music, once triggered, will play for most of the duration of the map and large groups of enemies respawn absurdly frequently. For my other playthroughs, before and after, this has not been an issue. In this particular one though, I was playing with a god-llike hero character who had max stats, and so I'm not sure whether that factors into some algorithm that determines enemy encounters.

  • JoshBGJoshBG Member Posts: 91
    "The roads are dangerous", they said.

    "Hah!", I said.



    You are given three bodies at the beginning, use them as shield. Remember, the point of no-reload runs is to survive. Not level-up fast, etc.

    There are two more instances in vanila BG:EE where you can die and probably break something in the real world:

    1) Basilisk area. Make sure you always have at least one potion of Mirrored Eyes/potion Invisibility(if solo)/Protection From Petrification scroll(or memorized spell), when you're traveling there or out of there. If the ambush with a Lesser Basilisk happens and you are unprepared, that can be it. Also, the Stone to Flesh scroll wouldn't hurt; if you're in party and someone got petrified, and you don't have the scroll, both the companion and the equipment are lost forever.

    2) Cloakwood Wyvern ambush. Always have some Cure Poison potions. In most cases it's easy to run away, but don't take any chances. Wyvern's poison is deadly: 5hp per tick. Even if you have the Slow Poison ability from the dreams, you won't be able to use it.

    Dexter
  • subtledoctorsubtledoctor Member Posts: 11,185
    Well, my last playthrough I got that ambush at around 4th/5th level and I really enjoyed it. So I don't think it needs to be removed. But there should e some kind of level check. And/or a dialogue option to give them gold for your life.

    HeindrichEadwyn_G8keeper
  • Fiendish_WarriorFiendish_Warrior Member Posts: 309
    From a storyline consideration though, we know that bandits are a problem and that they ambush caravans frequently, why wouldn't they ambush you on a bad day? I know it's virtually insta-death, but I have survived it with a level one character at least once. It made scalping all of them all the more enjoyable.

    Mortianna
  • HeindrichHeindrich Member, Moderator Posts: 2,959
    By the sounds of it, I was really lucky in my BG:EE playthroughs. I've done it three times and never seen the "ring of death bandits" once, so I assumed that Beamdog nerfed random encounters like that. The hardest ambush I had to deal with were the Wyverns, which were more inconvenient than deadly.

    In contrast I've only played BG1 vanilla once to Chapter 5, and I saw that ambush twice, as well as one where a wolf spawned right next to a poor lv1 Imoen, and chunked her in one bite.

    *shivers at traumatic noobie memories.*

  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 6,784
    Question: does having metal armour on increase the chance of this encounter firing?

    AeginidaeCrevsDaak
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 7,585
    deltago said:

    Question: does having metal armour on increase the chance of this encounter firing?

    No, would be kinda cool if it did though.

    JarrakulFiendish_WarriortoolargCrevsDaak
  • toolargtoolarg Member Posts: 178
    Tresset said:

    deltago said:

    Question: does having metal armour on increase the chance of this encounter firing?

    No, would be kinda cool if it did though.
    Have to agree with that. Last night I was ambushed like 3 consecutive times and all I had was a ragtag bunch of level 1 NPCs + Charname with armor and weapons made of cardboard and hope.

    Mortianna
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 7,585
    @Heindrich There has been some discussion about scribe scrolls statistically not working properly. This was from a while ago and I don't think anything was changed since it couldn't really be nailed down. Just keep in mind that the mechanism may or may not be working properly...

    JarrakulHeindrich
  • subtledoctorsubtledoctor Member Posts: 11,185
    edited March 2015
    toolarg said:

    Have to agree with that. Last night I was ambushed like 3 consecutive times and all I had was a ragtag bunch of level 1 NPCs + Charname with armor and weapons made of cardboard and hope.

    How far are you traveling? I may be completely wrong here by I think the chance of being ambushed rises if you make longer trips (like Nashkel straight to FAI). If that's correct (if!) then you might have a better chance of surviving by walking map-to-map the whole way. (That would seem more appropriate for 'hardcore' playthroughs anyway... reminds me of the Oblivion mod that disables fast travel, forces you to get around Morrowind-style...)

  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058

    @subtledoctor , You can't run away from the ring-of-bandits ambush because when the screen comes up, you're surrounded, and all twelve bandits automatically target the main character.

    Also, it can come up during your first trip to the FAI, with you, Imoen, and Monty and Xzar if you took them, all at first level with no special equipment.

    It's basically a "You rolled a 1, ha, ha, rocks fall, everyone dies" screen.

    It's the equivalent of terrible DM'ing, and I've stopped even counting it against my minimal reloads. I'm not too sure I'd count it against a no-reload, either. It definitely needs to be taken out of the game, as it serves absolutely no good purpose, and it detracts from the quality of the game.

    I fail to see why this encounter shouldn't count as a reload as it is quite reasonable to survive or avoid it, even at level 1.

    As others have mentioned the most consistent approach is to make initial transitions so as to avoid any chance of the encounter at all (south to HH, east to Beregost).

    If you do encounter it then most charnames should be able to survive if they have armour, shield and HP (or familiar HP and Shield spell for a Mage). Only charname up shit creek is a thief, better grab some invis pots quick smart.

    Mortianna
  • epicrakshasasepicrakshasas Member Posts: 71
    I do think that there should be a specific level that this can show up for. With all the bandits having arrows, they can easily get lucky and insta-kill charname. My least favorite random is the ettercap encounter that you get while going through the Cloakwood. That's mainly because of the web trap that can cause utter peril for your party if you are unprepared.

    atcDaveFiendish_Warrior
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 7,585
    I am not entirely sure you guys are correct about how the waylaid by enemies system works... I don't think traveling in short chunks really helps, but I would have to look it up to be sure... I also know for certain that you can get this encounter traveling from the stone circles area to the High Hedge (and I know this because I remember my very first time with the 12 and where it took place even after all these years).

    Fiendish_Warrior
  • HeindrichHeindrich Member, Moderator Posts: 2,959
    Wowo said:


    I fail to see why this encounter shouldn't count as a reload as it is quite reasonable to survive or avoid it, even at level 1.

    As others have mentioned the most consistent approach is to make initial transitions so as to avoid any chance of the encounter at all (south to HH, east to Beregost).

    @Wowo I think it's perfectly fine for people to define rules that makes sense to themselves. For example although I am very strict about not reloading bad outcomes that arise from my mistakes, I didn't feel guilty about cheating in the third part of the Flail of Ages in my noobie blind run because the game mechanic where all the golems and loot disappears after you kill Torgal made no sense to me, and unfairly punished my sensible roleplaying decisions.

    In the same vein, although you could avoid that ambush if you had the metagame knowledge to take a very specific route, but a roleplayer (roleplaying a good obedient Charname) will like go straight for the Friendly Arm Inn. And it would suck to be forced to reload or lose party members due to pure bad luck. I personally would count such an ambush towards a reload, just like I count reloads caused by Neera wild surges, which I also have little control of, but I can totally understand why @BelgarathMTH might not.

  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058
    Tresset said:

    Guess what everyone! I figured out exactly how this mechanism works!

    If you don't want to run into the bandits then you can avoid doing so by not traveling between areas where the waylaid area is ar6100. If you cannot avoid doing this then try to make it so that your travel time does not overlap with hours 20-23 and you should not encounter bandits.

    So lets say that you are traveling from the area with the belt ogre to the Friendly Arm. The travel time is 8 hours. If you are waylaid you will likely have traveled for 4 hours. And the creatures spawned will be based on the current hour of the day when you arrive in the ambush area. Since the 10 bandits are spawned at hours 20-23 you would be at risk of running into the bandits if you set out at hours 16-19. There is also a 5 bandit encounter in this area that happens at hours 18-19 so you may want to avoid that too by not traveling between hours 14-19. Keep in mind that this is just one example and travel times vary so you may need to adjust your math accordingly.

    That's pretty amazing information. How does it fit with a Charname who doesn't rest and proceeds straight to FAI? I ask as I haven't encountered this ambush at the start of the game that I can remember.

    JuliusBorisovCrevsDaak
  • Fiendish_WarriorFiendish_Warrior Member Posts: 309
    So nothing good really does happen at night (er, evening)?

    JuliusBorisov
  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058

    So nothing good really does happen at night (er, evening)?

    I can think of a few things.

    Like, you know, your favourite tv show being aired on TV.

    Why, what were you thinking of?

    Fiendish_WarriorJuliusBorisovCrevsDaak
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