@Mathsorcerer: A fallacious argument - one doesn't need to be a director in order to have a critical opinion of a film. By the same token, you don't need to have the ability to write stories in order to critique them.
In fact, in my experience writers are generally the worst people to ask for criticism; we have a nasty tendency of rewriting stories and plots in our critique, which is rarely what you're looking for when you're looking for feedback.
True enough, @shawne. Nevertheless, it is siginifcantly easier to negatively criticize a video game because it contains x and y (which both suck) but not z (which would have made gameplay/the scenery/the characters better) than it is to work on making a game that takes advantage of the criticizer's high standards. No game is perfect and no game will please everyone; similarly, no game can include all the content everyone wants or it would be a 1 TB install.
There are things I disliked about BG1, just like there were things I disliked about SoA/ToB, IWD/HoW/TotLM, Fallout 3, New Vegas, BGEE, etc. In fact, there are little things I disliked here and there about every game I have ever played. Rather than complain about them, though, I either sold the game back used (if possible), gave it away, threw it away, let it sit on my bookshelf never to be played again, or--in the case of BGEE and the other games that I can mod--corrected that which I found problematic or nonsensical.
Clearly, the price of artistic creation is that some will dislike your work, sometimes vociferously and loudly. Haters gonna hate, so sayeth the wise Alaundo. I still applaud the work done by the devs for BGEE in successfully resurrecting the franchise and I hope their stay in legal limbo doesn't last too terribly long.
Well I've seen people put forth a case for dealing with loose ends from the previous games or just continuing the story. Continuing the story can mean adding another chapter to the Bhaalspawn chapter, but it could also be a different story inolving CHARNAME and his/her companions. I don't personally subscribe to the idea some do that you can't have any games after that.
I'm not personally interested in a BG3 where the only continuity you see from previous games is the odd bit of background lore and at best a cameo from an npc or two. That just seems more like a spin off than a sequel. I think that's fine for another game, but not for BG3.
What loose ends, exactly?
What would a different story entail? What level would you be at the start? What level would you be by the end? When did CHARNAME find the time? Why is CHARNAME not a god, or a preposterously powerful mortal with +6 weapons and armor? You really can't answer any of these questions in a satisfactory manner. There's too many variables, the game can end in two completely different ways, the game balance would be weird, and there's really no place for another chapter in the timeline. CHARNAME's story is over. We were with him or her from the beginning up to the end.
Sorry, but after TOB, there's really no place the story of CHARNAME can go. There comes a time when stories when all stories need to end. A new story set in Baldur's Gate is really the best way to go.
I think Overhaul are a fitting choice. The Black Pits was well written, with memorable characters. The improvements and additions to the engine were and are very welcome. The fresh NPC characters with quests, dialogue, voices, and new areas are quality. The after sales support for the game to further improve and add to the experience has been very good. That support only came to a halt due to a legal dispute over the rights to the franchise.
For a small team with a modest budget who have had one hand tied behind their back the entire time (due to contractual constraints), they have done really well. I do not see anyone else who cares about the franchise, nor has any roots in the franchise, looking to do anything what-so-ever. This team have a real passion for Baldur's Gate, and the ability to back it up, and that is what matters. The size of a team and the weight of their wallet has no relevance to doing a game justice. A big studio can put out a turkey just as much as a small studio can release a sensation.
My concern is one that remains regardless of who may be the developer. The bhaalspawn storyline is complete. It has a beginning. It has an end. I would prefer a new protagonist in a different time frame, with a fresh storyline. Revisiting Baldur's Gate and the Sword Coast would be fine, nostalgic even, but it would be wise to include new areas and a selection of re-imagined areas with the passing of time. To attempt a resurrection of the bhaalspawn saga could hurt both the franchise and the developer.
@Schneidend If you haven't yet read this interview yet, I heartily recommend it. In it, George Ziets talks in detail how he imagines a Baldur's Gate III that's built around the continuation of CHARNAME's storyline. It's not a requirement for every RPG for the protagonist to start out as a lowly commoner.
@Calmar Even if you disregard Adul's post and go with the notion that no one involved ever wanted a BG3 that involved CHARNAME, I don't see how that should have any affect on what I posted. Or should I suddenly change my opinion to suit or simply just not express it?
@Schneidend It's a story. It's not set in stone. I personally wouldn't bat an eyelid if we saw another canon ending. I don't think that's quite the blasphemy some on these boards tend to think it is. You can tell me I'm wrong all you want or that there is no way to follow on with CHARNAME, I'm just not going to agree with you.
@Schneidend If you haven't yet read this interview yet, I heartily recommend it. In it, George Ziets talks in detail how he imagines a Baldur's Gate III that's built around the continuation of CHARNAME's storyline.
The story sounds idea interesting, actually. The mechanics of having more than one avatar at the same time, however, sounds a bit annoying. Replace that weaksauce with being able to raise a few BG2 characters as your exarchs or angels.
It's not a requirement for every RPG for the protagonist to start out as a lowly commoner.
Well, given that I never suggested as much, and was perfectly fine starting BG2 at level 7-9, I would suppose that it is indeed not a requirement.
@Schneidend If you haven't yet read this interview yet, I heartily recommend it. In it, George Ziets talks in detail how he imagines a Baldur's Gate III that's built around the continuation of CHARNAME's storyline. It's not a requirement for every RPG for the protagonist to start out as a lowly commoner.
I actually like this idea for a game, however, not in a canon heavy universe such as Forgotten Realms. It would be a unique way of introducing a new universe. However, I can see someone getting a hold of this idea and destroying it and making it a fb game or something *shudder.*
But on second thought, that'd be a cool marketing idea to sell this new universe and game. Having actual people competing to be gods in a social network and then implementing them as the gods of their chosen portfolio once an actual console game (like Dragon Age) was ready to be released. But then on third thought, I really wouldn't want to play a game where a bard goes "All hail the god of Music and Poetry - Justin Bieber." *shudder*
My suggestion is to liscense Dragon Age 3 and convert it to a total overhaul of Dragon Age Origins in that nice looking frostbite engine hmmmn hmmmn ... I spent something like 700+ hours playing that thing, kinda unbelieveable ... Uh, and just call that baldur's gate 3 ... Cash Money!!$?!
I actually like this idea for a game, however, not in a canon heavy universe such as Forgotten Realms. It would be a unique way of introducing a new universe. However, I can see someone getting a hold of this idea and destroying it and making it a fb game or something *shudder.*
None of the video games are canon, anyway, so it doesn't much matter.
@Schneidend It's a story. It's not set in stone. I personally wouldn't bat an eyelid if we saw another canon ending. I don't think that's quite the blasphemy some on these boards tend to think it is. You can tell me I'm wrong all you want or that there is no way to follow on with CHARNAME, I'm just not going to agree with you.
When a story is over, it's over. To me there's nothing as disappointing to a story than some forced retconning that dilutes all that was important and meaningful in the previous installment. I think that's what they did with Diablo III, it only weakens the credibility of the storyline.
I prefer a spiritual successor with a new plot and cast to lengthy retcons.
@Schneidend It's a story. It's not set in stone. I personally wouldn't bat an eyelid if we saw another canon ending. I don't think that's quite the blasphemy some on these boards tend to think it is. You can tell me I'm wrong all you want or that there is no way to follow on with CHARNAME, I'm just not going to agree with you.
When a story is over, it's over. To me there's nothing as disappointing to a story than some forced retconning that dilutes all that was important and meaningful in the previous installment. I think that's what they did with Diablo III, it only weakens the credibility of the storyline.
I prefer a spiritual successor with a new plot and cast to lengthy retcons.
Well, Diablo II ended on a pretty ominous cliffhanger with the World Stone destroyed, so there was definitely room for a sequel there.
I find this silly; if somebody makes BG3 and it isn't good, don't buy it. Anyway, basing future results on a particularly (contractually) hamstrung project is borderline illogical. If a great story, and fun NPC's, are involved, the game will be wonderful. If not, it won't. Anyway, first things first - the current SNAFU needs to be fixed (not saying it isn't in progress) and BG:EE patching must continue along (as it was about to). From there, BG2 moves toward EE status. Only after that, should we worry about the far future.
I have always wished that the Infinity Engine or similar interface could be used to run literally hundreds of full scale DLC 'modules', if you will. This has been my hope since I played my first BG1 campaign. I don't care if the new content is linearly related, tangental or totlay new. Just give me more quality content. (imagine how cool it would be remaking famous old P&P modules to run in the Infinity Engine.)
It is one of the best ways to play D&D ever devised IMO.
I find this silly; if somebody makes BG3 and it isn't good, don't buy it.
But what's the point of being a fan if you can't throw a tantrum and complain about how your childhood has been destroyed whenever your favourite franchises are revisited after an extended hiatus, ya know?
I find this silly; if somebody makes BG3 and it isn't good, don't buy it.
But what's the point of being a fan if you can't childlishly throw a tantrum and complain about how your childhood has been destroyed whenever your favourite franchises are revisited after an extended hiatus, ya know?
I find this silly; if somebody makes BG3 and it isn't good, don't buy it.
But what's the point of being a fan if you can't childlishly throw a tantrum and complain about how your childhood has been destroyed whenever your favourite franchises are revisited after an extended hiatus, ya know?
I find this silly; if somebody makes BG3 and it isn't good, don't buy it.
But what's the point of being a fan if you can't childlishly throw a tantrum and complain about how your childhood has been destroyed whenever your favourite franchises are revisited after an extended hiatus, ya know?
Fixed that for ya.
In case there's any confusion, I was joking.
I thought that was obvious. I guess my attempt at humor was not so obvious. sorry. I was laughing with you.
just like how BG:EE's new content flows perfectly into that game and doesn't seem alien to the original game at all.
...
If the content they make for 2EE flows as seamlessly into the original game, and is on par with it, just like how BG:EE feels.. well.. it's looking good so far.
Okay sorry what. Have you just never played Vanilla BG, only TuTu with the NPC mod and twenty or so others? BG:EE's new content stuck out like a sore toe, make no mistake. It's completely legitimate to like said content (I did for the most part), but let's be honest; it felt like BGII content not BG1 content.
That said, as a result, BGII:EE will probably kick ass. But yeah.
I honestly totally agree with this forum topic, especially the first post. In fact, I've been trying to say for a LONG time on this forum that the developers needed to get their act together, to no avail. In many instances it just resulted in bashful fights, and finally *someone* says it?
Open your eyes people, leave nostalgia out of the equation for once, Baldur's Gate EE was no true success! For example, the new areas they made were amateurish at best, and the content was very nil and void in terms of actual content. Reviews were mediocre. And if reviews don't make games, how come the top studios get 1,000,000+ views? I look at reviews.
Let's be honest, they have one chance. They have one chance to make sure their next remake of a game succeeds. It's a tough thing to do. For right now, Overhaul doesn't have what it takes.
Hate to say I called it a long time ago, much as it upset everyone. One visit to their site to see the hundreds of other games Beamdog has pumped out is all you need to see. It looks like a cheap gaming site from the 90's you'd get to by clicking the flashing banners. Expecting a BG installment of the same quality from them is a pipe dream.
This is not however a failure or naivete. A lot of potential suitors saw how large and dynamic this series' fanbase is over the past many months, and it'll be much easier to find a respectable company to fund a worthy addition, possibly even BG3, because of this.
Hate to say I called it a long time ago, much as it upset everyone. One visit to their site to see the hundreds of other games Beamdog has pumped out is all you need to see. It looks like a cheap gaming site from the 90's you'd get to by clicking the flashing banners. Expecting a BG installment of the same quality from them is a pipe dream.
This is not however a failure or naivete. A lot of potential suitors saw how large and dynamic this series' fanbase is over the past many months, and it'll be much easier to find a respectable company to fund a worthy addition, possibly even BG3, because of this.
I'm curious to know what other games Beamdog has been "pumping out"?
In response to my previous comment... Look, we all want there to be a Baldur's Gate III, but I'm sure we all have our doubts. I, too, have my doubts because it's impossible for ANY ONE of us to be completely assured that Baldur's Gate III will live up to its name. Why? Because it's just natural. Baldur's Gate is a sensitive game series!
In my previous comment, I said that I didn't think Beamdog had the abilities to create Baldur's Gate III. Well allow me to be the first, and only person, to revert from that decision and give my fullest support to Beamdog. I'm sure everyone on this topic has already made up their minds. But in this tentative situation, I think we all should give Beamdog our support. Not for if they can or can't create Baldur's Gate III, but because I think Baldur's Gate III needs to happen. As we all do.
Hate to say I called it a long time ago, much as it upset everyone. One visit to their site to see the hundreds of other games Beamdog has pumped out is all you need to see. It looks like a cheap gaming site from the 90's you'd get to by clicking the flashing banners. Expecting a BG installment of the same quality from them is a pipe dream.
This is not however a failure or naivete. A lot of potential suitors saw how large and dynamic this series' fanbase is over the past many months, and it'll be much easier to find a respectable company to fund a worthy addition, possibly even BG3, because of this.
Yeah, note to the wise. There is this book series with really crappy mono color covers. The books look like the outside of a crayon box only with one color per book. Really crappy covers. Therefore the books themselves must also be crappy.
Game of something or another?? Or is it Song of something firey and cold??? Anyway, looks like total crap from the outside. Best steer clear of it entirely. Just sayin.
Baldur's gate 3 would be in the future after Baldur's gate 1 and 2, so here's what I think what would be nice. The technology has advanced so your main guy would have maybe like a pistol or something, and he could also ride a dinosaur that was cloned and he received as a gift from his father. You would think that it would be imbalanced but the orcs would maybe have some machine guns when you attack them, and you have to escape, but maybe a friend like imoen would show up in a fighter warplane and shoot rockets(Think fireball spells shot by the magical plane) but there would be not enough missiles so you go like "oh no we lost" but then imoen or maybe minsc would maybe find a nuclear missile and give it to you and you could throw it at the orcs and think you won the game, but maybe the orcs were not the real threat but were getting help from a time traveller and it would turn out that the time traveller was like a nazi that gave them weapons. Also if you want to play a cleric the nazis could be like zombies so you could turn undead them and maybe a druid could shapeshift into one too so you could sneak to their base, instead of needing a thief to do that.
You could get captured by the zombies but then a ninja who doesn't really talk has 2 extra cyborg arms and uses 4 katanas would show up and kill all the nazis in the base and saves you, and maybe he did this because he was really your brother. And if you want he would give you cyborg arms too so you could use 4 pistols. If you were really good at this game you could maybe buy a tank for 10 dollars so your character could drive it and shoot from longer range than with pistol. Then maybe a ranger could adopt your dinosaur as a pet.
Anyway, in the end, you would be traveling in the space with your party, and you could maybe find planets where there are something like talking dog-people who are fighting the nazi zombies, and you could ally with them(or kill them haha, maybe you could get some new weapons so it would be a good choice too). Maybe a planet that has a princess that you could marry so the girls would like the game too. or maybe you could play the princess which would be great for an expansion imo though I wouldn't play it, maybe my sister would. End boss could be like a giant zombie that has a rocket launcher, and you have to dodge the rockets until he has to reload, and then you can attack him.
I think this would be great and bring many new people to the great baldur's gate. Game would be in 3D so it would look really good too, maybe make it for Xbox one too but no PS4 please. Maybe in the future you could then make Baldur's gate 3 - enchanced edition maybe
[...] Maybe make it for Xbox one too but no PS4 please. [...]
I am curious about something, @Ville. Why did you single out the PS4 to not get the hypothetical game? Such a fantastic game idea absolutely deserves to be on all systems.
Comments
There are things I disliked about BG1, just like there were things I disliked about SoA/ToB, IWD/HoW/TotLM, Fallout 3, New Vegas, BGEE, etc. In fact, there are little things I disliked here and there about every game I have ever played. Rather than complain about them, though, I either sold the game back used (if possible), gave it away, threw it away, let it sit on my bookshelf never to be played again, or--in the case of BGEE and the other games that I can mod--corrected that which I found problematic or nonsensical.
Clearly, the price of artistic creation is that some will dislike your work, sometimes vociferously and loudly. Haters gonna hate, so sayeth the wise Alaundo. I still applaud the work done by the devs for BGEE in successfully resurrecting the franchise and I hope their stay in legal limbo doesn't last too terribly long.
What would a different story entail? What level would you be at the start? What level would you be by the end? When did CHARNAME find the time? Why is CHARNAME not a god, or a preposterously powerful mortal with +6 weapons and armor? You really can't answer any of these questions in a satisfactory manner. There's too many variables, the game can end in two completely different ways, the game balance would be weird, and there's really no place for another chapter in the timeline. CHARNAME's story is over. We were with him or her from the beginning up to the end.
Sorry, but after TOB, there's really no place the story of CHARNAME can go. There comes a time when stories when all stories need to end. A new story set in Baldur's Gate is really the best way to go.
I think Overhaul are a fitting choice. The Black Pits was well written, with memorable characters. The improvements and additions to the engine were and are very welcome. The fresh NPC characters with quests, dialogue, voices, and new areas are quality. The after sales support for the game to further improve and add to the experience has been very good. That support only came to a halt due to a legal dispute over the rights to the franchise.
For a small team with a modest budget who have had one hand tied behind their back the entire time (due to contractual constraints), they have done really well. I do not see anyone else who cares about the franchise, nor has any roots in the franchise, looking to do anything what-so-ever. This team have a real passion for Baldur's Gate, and the ability to back it up, and that is what matters. The size of a team and the weight of their wallet has no relevance to doing a game justice. A big studio can put out a turkey just as much as a small studio can release a sensation.
My concern is one that remains regardless of who may be the developer. The bhaalspawn storyline is complete. It has a beginning. It has an end. I would prefer a new protagonist in a different time frame, with a fresh storyline. Revisiting Baldur's Gate and the Sword Coast would be fine, nostalgic even, but it would be wise to include new areas and a selection of re-imagined areas with the passing of time. To attempt a resurrection of the bhaalspawn saga could hurt both the franchise and the developer.
@Schneidend It's a story. It's not set in stone. I personally wouldn't bat an eyelid if we saw another canon ending. I don't think that's quite the blasphemy some on these boards tend to think it is. You can tell me I'm wrong all you want or that there is no way to follow on with CHARNAME, I'm just not going to agree with you.
But on second thought, that'd be a cool marketing idea to sell this new universe and game. Having actual people competing to be gods in a social network and then implementing them as the gods of their chosen portfolio once an actual console game (like Dragon Age) was ready to be released. But then on third thought, I really wouldn't want to play a game where a bard goes "All hail the god of Music and Poetry - Justin Bieber." *shudder*
I prefer a spiritual successor with a new plot and cast to lengthy retcons.
Just my 2¢
I have always wished that the Infinity Engine or similar interface could be used to run literally hundreds of full scale DLC 'modules', if you will. This has been my hope since I played my first BG1 campaign. I don't care if the new content is linearly related, tangental or totlay new. Just give me more quality content. (imagine how cool it would be remaking famous old P&P modules to run in the Infinity Engine.)
It is one of the best ways to play D&D ever devised IMO.
That said, as a result, BGII:EE will probably kick ass. But yeah.
This is not however a failure or naivete. A lot of potential suitors saw how large and dynamic this series' fanbase is over the past many months, and it'll be much easier to find a respectable company to fund a worthy addition, possibly even BG3, because of this.
In my previous comment, I said that I didn't think Beamdog had the abilities to create Baldur's Gate III. Well allow me to be the first, and only person, to revert from that decision and give my fullest support to Beamdog. I'm sure everyone on this topic has already made up their minds. But in this tentative situation, I think we all should give Beamdog our support. Not for if they can or can't create Baldur's Gate III, but because I think Baldur's Gate III needs to happen. As we all do.
Game of something or another?? Or is it Song of something firey and cold??? Anyway, looks like total crap from the outside. Best steer clear of it entirely. Just sayin.
You could get captured by the zombies but then a ninja who doesn't really talk has 2 extra cyborg arms and uses 4 katanas would show up and kill all the nazis in the base and saves you, and maybe he did this because he was really your brother. And if you want he would give you cyborg arms too so you could use 4 pistols. If you were really good at this game you could maybe buy a tank for 10 dollars so your character could drive it and shoot from longer range than with pistol. Then maybe a ranger could adopt your dinosaur as a pet.
Anyway, in the end, you would be traveling in the space with your party, and you could maybe find planets where there are something like talking dog-people who are fighting the nazi zombies, and you could ally with them(or kill them haha, maybe you could get some new weapons so it would be a good choice too). Maybe a planet that has a princess that you could marry so the girls would like the game too. or maybe you could play the princess which would be great for an expansion imo though I wouldn't play it, maybe my sister would. End boss could be like a giant zombie that has a rocket launcher, and you have to dodge the rockets until he has to reload, and then you can attack him.
I think this would be great and bring many new people to the great baldur's gate. Game would be in 3D so it would look really good too, maybe make it for Xbox one too but no PS4 please. Maybe in the future you could then make Baldur's gate 3 - enchanced edition maybe