One PoE feature I would like to warn every BG/IWD fan about
JuliusBorisov
Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,724
in Off-Topic
Browsing the Internet on the subject of Pillars of Eternity previews and trying to escape any spoilers as much as I can, I still have noticed one major thing many players encounter and/or complain about: the engagement system.
You wizard has been chasen by an enemy and right now this enemy is next to your wizard. So the first thing you do in BG/IWD is that you attempt to kite your wizard away, don't you?
If you do it in PoE, it would be a big, big mistake. You will suffer a disengagement attack after a disengagement attack afterwards.
in PoE, this system basically means the following.
When two opposed combatants come near each other and one of them
a) has a melee weapon equipped
b) is not moving
c) is not currently at his or her maximum limit of engagement targets (the standard is 1),
- the other character will be Engaged. When an opponent is Engaged by an attacker, moving any significant distance away from the attacker will provoke a Disengagement Attack, a "free" action with no recovery.
A Disengagement Attack has an inherent Accuracy bonus, does significantly more damage than a standard attack, and will call a hit reaction animation while momentarily stopping the character's movement.
When it's initiated, a Disengagement Attack automatically breaks Engagement on the target, but if the target is also the attacker's current melee target, the attacker will typically be able to re-establish Engagement before the target can move farther away.
If the attacker switches to a non-melee weapon or performs a non-melee-based action, Engagement immediately ends. If the attacker moves away from their Engagement targets, is paralyzed, knocked down, or otherwise prevented from maintaining a threat, Engagement will also immediately end. If the attacker has a limited number of Engagement targets (as most do) and switches his or her attack focus to a different character, Engagement immediately ends.
Engagement range is only a little more than a character width (barring special circumstances) and most characters can only engage one enemy at a time. If they don't have a target, it's the first enemy who enters the radius. If they do have a target, it's them. For fighters in Defender mode, it's the first three, one of which is typically someone they are attacking.
Fleeing targets can be engaged, as soon as the pursuer catch up to them and stops moving, forcing them to stop as well.
This shouldn't come as a surprise to everyone who followed the PoE development closely, because the engagement system was covered in the 44th PoE update. http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/63432-update-44-the-rules-of-melee-engagement/
But the fact remains: many current reviewers of the game (many of them are media persons) encounter this problem and don't understand what's happening.
I've felt I have to post about it so that at least every forumite here could once more think about it and not be surprised while actually playing the game.
You wizard has been chasen by an enemy and right now this enemy is next to your wizard. So the first thing you do in BG/IWD is that you attempt to kite your wizard away, don't you?
If you do it in PoE, it would be a big, big mistake. You will suffer a disengagement attack after a disengagement attack afterwards.
in PoE, this system basically means the following.
When two opposed combatants come near each other and one of them
a) has a melee weapon equipped
b) is not moving
c) is not currently at his or her maximum limit of engagement targets (the standard is 1),
- the other character will be Engaged. When an opponent is Engaged by an attacker, moving any significant distance away from the attacker will provoke a Disengagement Attack, a "free" action with no recovery.
A Disengagement Attack has an inherent Accuracy bonus, does significantly more damage than a standard attack, and will call a hit reaction animation while momentarily stopping the character's movement.
When it's initiated, a Disengagement Attack automatically breaks Engagement on the target, but if the target is also the attacker's current melee target, the attacker will typically be able to re-establish Engagement before the target can move farther away.
If the attacker switches to a non-melee weapon or performs a non-melee-based action, Engagement immediately ends. If the attacker moves away from their Engagement targets, is paralyzed, knocked down, or otherwise prevented from maintaining a threat, Engagement will also immediately end. If the attacker has a limited number of Engagement targets (as most do) and switches his or her attack focus to a different character, Engagement immediately ends.
Engagement range is only a little more than a character width (barring special circumstances) and most characters can only engage one enemy at a time. If they don't have a target, it's the first enemy who enters the radius. If they do have a target, it's them. For fighters in Defender mode, it's the first three, one of which is typically someone they are attacking.
Fleeing targets can be engaged, as soon as the pursuer catch up to them and stops moving, forcing them to stop as well.
This shouldn't come as a surprise to everyone who followed the PoE development closely, because the engagement system was covered in the 44th PoE update. http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/63432-update-44-the-rules-of-melee-engagement/
But the fact remains: many current reviewers of the game (many of them are media persons) encounter this problem and don't understand what's happening.
I've felt I have to post about it so that at least every forumite here could once more think about it and not be surprised while actually playing the game.
10
Comments
That said, I hope the "engagement range" is not too big, because there is a difference between trying to escape when an enemy has already got you a bear grip (or for those familiar with tabletop games, base contact) and when somebody is still a few feet away, where it makes sense for weaker party members to back away and allow the warriors to step in. If the engagement zone is too big around each character/monster, it would be very difficult to protect mages and other ranged characters. I hope they also provide spells and abilities to help with disengagement without associated penalties. Something like Bolt Escape in Elder Scrolls or a fast-cast Shadow-Door.
My thought is if someone closes on your wizard, have another party member, preferably a combat heavy one, close from behind and 'Distract' the attacker with heavy damage. Not sure how that will work in game though.
Like it, and it forces you to not go randomly around with your squishy mage first: it favors strategy
I really like the engagement mechanic. It makes moving your guys lot more tactical, and also a bit PSA try to set up your guys to surround enemies to get flanking bonuses. Standing behind enemies isn't just a rogue thing.
http://www.tentonhammer.com/guides/pillars-eternity/pillars-eternity-double-click-active-effect-bug-workaround
But as you say, if it is overly sensitive, it could be a PITA and not very realistic.
Personally, I like it. It forces you to think about positioning and movement pre-fight quite a bit, and I know that if I move Aloth out of melee range, he is going to get cut down.
I would have loved the engagement system if it weren't for the situation above. And the pathing.
Don't the Wizards get an attack that slams their spellbook on the enemy, knocking them back or something? This thing counters it.
Also kiting is stupid.
Sometimes however the shadows are able to teleport behind fighters, but Aloth is still too far away, so it's still manageable. Just be careful with scouting ahead, use the environment to your advantage and use all the per encounter abilities. I managed to clear the temple without too many reloads. Though I still think the teleporting is a bit BS and I risked the disengagement attacks just to get my fighters near Aloth to save him.
Also, I wonder how it's possible to fire two fireballs by one party member before the actual battle starts and enemies begin to attack your party.