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Original BG movies vs new EE movies

ikonomovikonomov Member Posts: 13
Less than an hour after writing a post http://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/41494/original-movies#latest to suggest that the original movies should be reintroduced into the game ATigersClaw wrote a reply disagreeing with my view. I believe that making this change is an obvious design decision that can benefit the game, and in hope to have a more active discussion and not let the issue settle to oblivion I propose a poll. Please vote!

Original BG movies vs new EE movies 58 votes

Original BG movies
62%
GaltharielAedanSpjuv3rnParyslefreutPeccamister_ennuidwilliams1966WithinAmnesiaTuthspacejawsLadyRhianGoodSteveJalilyBazzaKadrikreVenAntOneAngryMushroomJenzafarbooinyoureyes 36 votes
New EE movies
37%
ScottBrooksGodKaiserHellmoody_mageChnapyNoonJuliusBorisovCalmarTigerbalsamAstroBryGuyPekingduckmanSouthpawJarrakulSertoriusbaldurskjdSmilingSwordKhoanHudzySaigon1983ZeswyssSxphxrxth 22 votes
JuliusBorisov
«1

Comments

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    The bugs forum is not intended for discussion. Moving this to the Baldur's Gate discussion forum.

    elminsterJuliusBorisov
  • proccoprocco Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 915
    i kind of feel meh on this topic. It's a total of *maybe* 3 minutes in a 100 hour game. Seems like a non issue.

    meagloth
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    New EE movies
    I'm with @Hudzy. Having said that, I think it would be awesome if the old movies were added with an option to choose which version to see in the game.

    Brer_RabbitCalmar
  • DreadKhanDreadKhan Member Posts: 3,859
    Optional makes some sense, provided they can be made tiny enough (the old ones I mean, which are quite dated in BG1) to not waste space. Not exactly a gameplay issue, and new ones ought to be the default anyways.

  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 3,414
    New EE movies
    If the new ones really bother you, just use the Classic Movies mod.

    http://www.shsforums.net/topic/55573-mod-bg-ee-classic-movies/

    booinyoureyes
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,151
    edited May 2015
    I like some of the original BG1 movies better, but I can't say I miss a lot of the random clips that the original game had. Namely I can't say I miss the videos for

    Beregost - At most what it does is provide atmosphere for an area that doesn't have much plot significance.

    Nashkel - I'm trying to remember if you encounter any evidence that kobolds are in the town itself. Some vague farmers comments is about all I can remember. Not enough to base a video on.

    Flooded Cloakwood mine - I prefer the EE one

    Tavern - I've seen this one online, but I don't know where its actually used in the original game. You don't get it when you sleep in taverns. At least not in BG1. Either way I'm not really a fan.

    The palace - What it is showing is inconsistent with what the game shows the palace looks like (particularly regarding the location of trees and grass). This has always bugged me :)

    The palace basement - 20 seconds to point out that there is treasure in the basement. Its also unnecessary with the advent of the tab key.

    Werewolf island - Its replacement isn't great but this one really was showing its age and its still an improvement.

    Durlag's tower- Looked too dated. Plus honestly Durlag's doesn't need the help to seem terrifying, the battle horrors you encounter outside probably will give people that picture anyways.

    Post edited by elminster on
    AstroBryGuyCalmarJuliusBorisov
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 3,414
    New EE movies
    elminster said:

    Tavern - I've seen this one online, but I don't know where its actually used in the original game. You don't get it when you sleep in taverns. At least not in BG1.

    Not in the original, but it *is* new component of BG1UB v14 beta (for BG1/Tutu/BGT). :shameless plug:

    http://forums.pocketplane.net/index.php?topic=29319.0


    It's also available for BGEE as part of the Classic Movies mod.

    http://www.shsforums.net/topic/55573-mod-bg-ee-classic-movies/

    typo_tillyelminster
  • the_sexteinthe_sextein Member Posts: 711
    edited May 2015
    I think the intro and end movies from the original game are better. Other than that, I think what Beamdog did with the movies for various areas and story points are better.

    I think the intro and final movies in BG2 are fantastic and I wouldn't want them changed. But the small CG parts in the original game like the intro to the friendly arm and bergust look better and more classy with Beamdog's artwork.

    They have cool artwork that is nice and clean because it is done with modern resolutions in mind but Beamdog's animation leaves much to be desired and does not have the quality of true CG. I have seen similar animation for other indie titles that were done by mod teams like STALKER Lost Alpha and they are poor quality as well. The intro to BG1 is cheezy compared to the original in my opinion.

  • wubblewubble Member Posts: 3,156


    I think the intro and final movies in BG2 are fantastic and I wouldn't want them changed. But the small CG parts in the original game like the intro to the friendly arm and bergust look better and more classy with Beamdog's artwork.

    The intro movie scared the cr*p out of me when I was little, it still gives me chills today.

    booinyoureyes
  • BelanosBelanos Member Posts: 968
    edited May 2015
    Original BG movies
    Jarrakul said:

    I'm with @Hudzy. Having said that, I think it would be awesome if the old movies were added with an option to choose which version to see in the game.

    There is a mod that allows you to have the old movies instead. I've added it to my game and they work just fine.
    elminster said:


    Nashkel - I'm trying to remember if you encounter any evidence that kobolds are in the town itself. Some vague farmers comments is about all I can remember. Not enough to base a video on.

    I kind of like that one myself. It sets a sinister mood for that area seeing that Kobold appearing in the frame. I also get kind of a kick out of that one in Beregost, seeing that old man sneeze. It adds a touch of humour.

  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,151
    edited May 2015

    elminster said:

    Tavern - I've seen this one online, but I don't know where its actually used in the original game. You don't get it when you sleep in taverns. At least not in BG1.

    Not in the original, but it *is* new component of BG1UB v14 beta (for BG1/Tutu/BGT). :shameless plug:

    http://forums.pocketplane.net/index.php?topic=29319.0


    It's also available for BGEE as part of the Classic Movies mod.

    http://www.shsforums.net/topic/55573-mod-bg-ee-classic-movies/
    Yea I saw it listed the latter link. I can see why they cut it but thanks for the link (and your work on UB) :)

  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 3,414
    New EE movies
    elminster said:

    elminster said:

    Tavern - I've seen this one online, but I don't know where its actually used in the original game. You don't get it when you sleep in taverns. At least not in BG1.

    Not in the original, but it *is* new component of BG1UB v14 beta (for BG1/Tutu/BGT). :shameless plug:

    http://forums.pocketplane.net/index.php?topic=29319.0


    It's also available for BGEE as part of the Classic Movies mod.

    http://www.shsforums.net/topic/55573-mod-bg-ee-classic-movies/
    Yea I saw it listed the latter link. I can see why they cut it but thanks for the link (and your work on UB) :)
    Sam added the music track for the Tavern movie. All credit for that to him!

    elminster
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    Original BG movies
    I thought the Inn one was kind of ridiculous when you get the, "Never had rats, no sir!" and the movie shows a rat. Is this supposed to imply the innkeepers are lying?!

    elminstertypo_tillyAstroBryGuy
  • NonnahswriterNonnahswriter Member Posts: 2,520
    LadyRhian said:

    I thought the Inn one was kind of ridiculous when you get the, "Never had rats, no sir!" and the movie shows a rat. Is this supposed to imply the innkeepers are lying?!

    Yes.

    booinyoureyesNimran
  • Brer_RabbitBrer_Rabbit Member Posts: 159
    ... So it's NOT as clean as an elven arse?

    proccobooinyoureyeselminsterATigersClaw
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,151

    ... So it's NOT as clean as an elven arse?

    Apparently not :)

    Brer_Rabbit
  • SharGuidesMyHandSharGuidesMyHand Member Posts: 2,504

    I'm torn on this issue. On one hand, I feel that the original BG1 videos seem very outdated on the surface, but on the other, I think that they may have been better at accomplishing their goals. For example, the original intro video for BG1 gives you more time to empathize with the character's situation and listen to what he has to say (the "ThereareothersIcanshowyouplease!" from BG:EE is just ridiculous).

    I also wish that Beamdog had either redone or kept in the videos for Nashkel and Cloakwood forests, since they help to lend an ominous atmosphere to your entrance to those areas.

  • SharGuidesMyHandSharGuidesMyHand Member Posts: 2,504

    Incidentally, for anyone who wants to refresh their memories, this video gives a rundown and comparison of the cutscenes for both games.


    DauntJuliusBorisovJenzafar
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,151
    edited May 2015
    Probably worth noting that some of the BGEE videos have been changed since the uploading of that video. Including the inclusion of an inn and dungeon resting video and a change made to the initial Sarevok video (and possibly changes made to the ending video as well I can't remember).

    JuliusBorisov
  • SharGuidesMyHandSharGuidesMyHand Member Posts: 2,504


    I'm torn on this issue. On one hand, I feel that the original BG1 videos seem very outdated on the surface, but on the other, I think that they may have been better at accomplishing their goals. For example, the original intro video for BG1 gives you more time to empathize with the character's situation and listen to what he has to say (the "ThereareothersIcanshowyouplease!" from BG:EE is just ridiculous).

    I also wish that Beamdog had either redone or kept in the videos for Nashkel and Cloakwood forests, since they help to lend an ominous atmosphere to your entrance to those areas.


    Incidentally, for anyone who wants to refresh their memories, this video gives a rundown and comparison of the cutscenes for both games.


    Watching the video that I posted has reaffirmed my earlier statement in my mind. The BG:EE scenes are better from a technical/artistic standpoint IMO, but the fact that they use stills instead of videos hinders their ability to convey their points. For example, watch the original video for the shipwrecked area (beginning at 6:50), how it begins with a view of a scenic landscape and then gradually pans to the ominous view of the wrecked ship - the BG:EE scene isn't able to do that. Also, because the BG:EE scenes are shorter, they cut out some of the music as well.

    Also, I had forgotten that there were videos for the Gnoll Stronghold and the BG sewers - damn, those were both creepy!


  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    Original BG movies
    A Few Things:

    1) I don't remember the Bhaal video at all. Was it in BG or BG2? I know the one with the tents is from BG2, because that's Trademeet. The Dungeon one reminds me of The Seven Suns, and I don't remember that one, either. I do remember the "Night becomes day/Day becomes Night videos" and how annoying they were when your characters were awake in the city for 12+ hours at a time...

    2) I liked the original Nashkel video. Even if the Kobolds aren't in the town, it provides you a hint at what's coming (and gives a sense of menace towards the girl and farmwife). Same for the Wyvern video, which played in Cloakwood Forest.

    3) I agree about the opening video. The original one makes you feel much more for the poor schlub being murdered. Sarevok looks like an undead creature in the original one (Battle Horror, maybe?). In the EE video, he more resembles an Ogre.

    4) The figure to the right of the crumbling Sarevok statue resembles Imoen in the original video cutscene.

    booinyoureyesAedan
  • DreadKhanDreadKhan Member Posts: 3,859

    ... So it's NOT as clean as an elven arse?

    That might depend on the Elf... he did say 'clean as an elven arse', not 'clean as any elven arse', right?

    Brer_Rabbit
  • SouthpawSouthpaw Member Posts: 2,026
    New EE movies
    Lots of people complain about the new videos. I find them lovely and much better than the old crude
    3D renders. I am also quite delighted my vote brought the poll to a perfect 50%-50%

  • meaglothmeagloth Member Posts: 3,806
    I have mixed feelings about this. First off


    I'm torn on this issue. On one hand, I feel that the original BG1 videos seem very outdated on the surface, but on the other, I think that they may have been better at accomplishing their goals. For example, the original intro video for BG1 gives you more time to empathize with the character's situation and listen to what he has to say (the "ThereareothersIcanshowyouplease!" from BG:EE is just ridiculous).

    I also wish that Beamdog had either redone or kept in the videos for Nashkel and Cloakwood forests, since they help to lend an ominous atmosphere to your entrance to those areas.


    Incidentally, for anyone who wants to refresh their memories, this video gives a rundown and comparison of the cutscenes for both games.


    Watching the video that I posted has reaffirmed my earlier statement in my mind. The BG:EE scenes are better from a technical/artistic standpoint IMO, but the fact that they use stills instead of videos hinders their ability to convey their points. For example, watch the original video for the shipwrecked area (beginning at 6:50), how it begins with a view of a scenic landscape and then gradually pans to the ominous view of the wrecked ship - the BG:EE scene isn't able to do that. Also, because the BG:EE scenes are shorter, they cut out some of the music as well.

    Also, I had forgotten that there were videos for the Gnoll Stronghold and the BG sewers - damn, those were both creepy!


    I completely agree. Some of the old ones are ugly, but they get their point across better. Like the nashkel video. The new on isn't that awful cgi, but the old one tells a story "watch out for kobolds/there is something going on here" the new one is just "uhh, hey, look guys, it's a village!" We lnew that already.
    procco said:

    i kind of feel meh on this topic. It's a total of *maybe* 3 minutes in a 100 hour game. Seems like a non issue.

    For people like us, yes. But it's good to remember that for someone playing the game for the first time the video is the first thing they see. It sets the tone for a new player.

  • DauntDaunt Member Posts: 52
    Original BG movies
    To be honest, the new stills in the EE games don't translate very well. In addition to having the same audio as the original CGI, the viewer loses something.

    Like @meagloth said, having CGI gets a storytelling point and position across better. Plus, the music helps with tone. And having a smooth CGI transition is a lot better than simply changing the focus of a static art splashpage.

    For the comparison of the Ending Movie (8:50 point in the video), you see how badly the artwork compares against the smooth transition of camera-work in a CGI representation. It's a bit nitpicky, but even for how old BG1 is, that original End Movie has a lot better feel to it than rotating an art piece around.

    Not to mention the hamfisted, so-obvious-you-can't-miss-it Bhaal symbol at the bottom of Ye Olde Matrix Bodyfarm Cylinder. In the original it's a little less so.


    Beamdog's artwork is nice and very crisp, but it isn't the best pick for scenes that are transmitting story + tone. I get that they wanted to have their own take/signature in the game, but maybe it would have been better to simply remake the cutscenes for a more fluid presentation.

  • TuthTuth Member Posts: 233
    Original BG movies
    I prefer the old movies, both for the artstyle and animation. Papercut stills would be a better for a game like Card Hunter. I always laugh when Sarevok strangles the guy in EE and his head gets bigger like a balloon. The colours are weird in my opinion, the original represented the locations quite similar to the ones in the game as for the atmosphere goes. The new ones are too dark and the locations in the first Baldur's Gate were not as dark. There's too much brown and the rest colours seem very pale to me.

  • SmilingSwordSmilingSword Member Posts: 827
    New EE movies
    I really can't stand the old movies, just because something is old doesn't make it good. Really they look like poorly rendered, poorly modeled, playblasts. I had to manually change the rest movies in bg2 to the new movies from bg1, I really don't understand why those weren't updated with the ee version. Anyways a option between the new and the old probably makes the most sense.

  • lroumenlroumen Member Posts: 2,127
    Original BG movies
    Same can be said about new movie styles. Just because it's new doesn't make it better. ;)

    I think the new ones set a different mood than the old ones. That's fine. For me i just miss the nostalgic movies; i played with them for over 15 years.

    Jenzafar
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 20,962
    New EE movies
    I can't wait to see the actual new movies in the Adventure Y.

    I like the style of the enhanced movies and it's interesting how they would depict the events after the Sarevok's fall.

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