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Add in "Max HP on lvl up" option

I just like to point out certain annoying point when my character, that is everytime before I lvl them up, I have to set the difficulty down to normal mode before I can reset them back to where I enjoyed my game. Most of the time I even forget to set them up.


Pls enable this option or give me as 100% Normal rule (and not a 75% nerfed version). In fact difficult and convenient gameplay are totally independent. So give us a option where we can toggle if we want

1) Max HP on lvl up
2) All spell able to memorise successfully
3) Character cannot die permanently

Huskarl2006RaduzielGrammarsaladrorikondunbarDetectiveMittensNihilus
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Comments

  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 2,595
    all three are in the tweak pack. and unless you don't like using mods the hp thing is turned on if you play the game on easy.

  • ValamirCleaverValamirCleaver Member Posts: 184
    edited February 2016
    Or one can effect a all 3 of your criteria with EE Keeper.
    https://sourceforge.net/projects/eekeeper/

    Post edited by ValamirCleaver on
  • gattberserkgattberserk Member Posts: 190
    edited February 2016
    I mean is there no legit way of separating them beside dl / using a mod... Talk about user friendly :(


    I have EE keeper, but I am not sure what u mean by effect a 3.

  • LifatLifat Member Posts: 353
    I agree that it would be awesome to have more customization in the difficulty ratings so I definitely wouldn't mind the mentioned options.

    That said, the tweakpack can at least set the MAX HP and Spell memorization that you were talking about. If you don't consider the way you are playing the game now cheating, then I can't see that it becomes cheating by modding the game to do the things you want automatically.

  • gattberserkgattberserk Member Posts: 190
    In the past, vanilla BG I always load my level up till I get the max possible HP roll. So I dont see how is that cheating

    Now adding a mod just for that purpose seem to be abit overboard. IWDEE has that option available, why BGEE cant?

  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 21,465
    In BG2EE after the last patch you can change one line in your baldur.ini file, that is responsible for Max or rolling HP on lvl up.

    https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/37833/a-bunch-of-neat-baldur-ini-options-in-bg2ee-1-3-that-ive-noticed-carry-overs-from-iwdee#latest

    I think it'll be fine if the same approach will be taken towards SoD and BGEE after a patch (although the default option should be rolling HP on lvl up).

    lolienGrammarsaladRodrian[Deleted User]
  • Mikey205Mikey205 Member Posts: 302
    Should be average hp. In fact when you import it should really force average hp onto everyone. Max hp is unbalanced and is what ruined NWN 2 when they applied it to enemies too. Most I can accept is 75%.

    Yamcha[Deleted User]Heindrich
  • gattberserkgattberserk Member Posts: 190
    I would prefer to have max hp. Would not like other to enforce their idea to the general public. Always have an option to toggle, that is what I believe :)

  • YamchaYamcha Member Posts: 484
    Something like getting between 50 and 100% would be nice. Getting like 2 HP on a fighter is a joke and just results in a reload.

  • LifatLifat Member Posts: 353

    In the past, vanilla BG I always load my level up till I get the max possible HP roll. So I dont see how is that cheating

    Now adding a mod just for that purpose seem to be abit overboard. IWDEE has that option available, why BGEE cant?

    Please don't misunderstand me. I'm not calling you a cheater. I do the exact same thing and more. I was simply pointing out that I fail to see the difference between multiple reloads (or lowering of difficulty for leveling) for MAX HP and installing a mod that automatically makes your hit points max. In fact, in the mentioned mod, you have the option of giving monsters max HP too, which would make the game more difficult.

    @Bengoshi: I completely agree. By all means add MAX HP as a seperate option from the difficulty slider. And I also agree that standard assumption should be rolled HP.

    @Mikey205: I will always be in favor of more options, so an average HP option is completely fine with me. But as said by others, forcing a specific rule down everyone's throat is unacceptable.

    @Dee: I used to be addicted to rolling, stats and everything. I have since learned that I like stability and equality more.

    JuliusBorisov
  • Avenger_teambgAvenger_teambg Member, Developer Posts: 5,862
    I'm pretty sure 2 and 3 are already in every game, you get them on easy difficulty.

  • Mikey205Mikey205 Member Posts: 302
    The problem with Max HP is that the DnD ruleset is not designed with it in mind. A rogue's HP is 1D6
    and a fireball is also 1D6 per level. On average a fireball from an equal level mage should kill an average equal level Rogue 40-50% of the time if the save is failed. When the Rogue starts gaining 6 HP every level, then that same event very quickly becomes almost impossible - that's a massive reduction in effectiveness of weapons, spells etc... Giving Max HP on level-up is basically only balanced by making all damage hit for max every time. The average on the otherhand makes the DnD ruleset work in an ideal setting and 75% is livable with (this is what I do because I do get power-gamer urges and reset a little bit but not for perfection).

    Also I'm pretty sure BG2 had all NPCs join with average HP values and have like 2-3 level-ups before HP stops increasing. That never bothered me.

    ValamirCleaver[Deleted User]Heindrich
  • BigfishBigfish Member Posts: 368

    I'm pretty sure 2 and 3 are already in every game, you get them on easy difficulty.

    They are, but they're also tied to "Enemies do 75% damage", which ends up feeling like 50% because you've got 30-50% more HP to soak up all the lessened damage. If you want to play with those 3 features, but not the damage reduction, you're out of luck unless you don't mind adjusting the difficulty slider on level up, which is its own brand of annoyance when you forget to turn it back up.

    JuliusBorisovRaduziel
  • GreenWarlockGreenWarlock Member Posts: 1,354
    I did notice on the first game I took into BG2EE that my cleric/thief had distinctly fewer hit-points than comparable NPCs in the game. Importing at max hp, you definitely get a few more, but rolling HP and taking what comes, for a more average level set of rolls, leaves you underpowered compared to the expected BG2 set-up.

    Experts in the game who relish turning up difficulty and modding in life-is-tough features would naturally want to have average rolls, but it should not be foist on the rest of us for some 'purity' principle. It would feel particularly bad if I am celebrating that PC who makes it through BG with good HP rolls every time, only to lose that through some forced averaging at the start of the next game.

    If I were to fantasize about HP rolls though...
    One neat change would be to pre-roll all level-up HPs at character creation (it is 'only' another 9/10 die-rolls to remember) and let the stats screen know the final HP total, but not the path to get there. The player can then choose their stats roll with that extra info available - with an option to hide it for those who prefer to play blind.

    Alternatively, on the level-up screen, have a button to choose 'max HP' or 'roll' for each level, allowing a PC to make up for a set of bad rolls by maxing up a few levels, or always maxing to avoid reload grief if that is what the player prefers, without messing around with difficulty sliders before leveling.

    Of course, the current game works just fine, but we can always dream of little tweaks to make the game truly 'perfect' ;)

  • gattberserkgattberserk Member Posts: 190
    Mikey205 said:

    The problem with Max HP is that the DnD ruleset is not designed with it in mind. A rogue's HP is 1D6
    and a fireball is also 1D6 per level. On average a fireball from an equal level mage should kill an average equal level Rogue 40-50% of the time if the save is failed. When the Rogue starts gaining 6 HP every level, then that same event very quickly becomes almost impossible - that's a massive reduction in effectiveness of weapons, spells etc...

    Also I'm pretty sure BG2 had all NPCs join with average HP values and have like 2-3 level-ups before HP stops increasing. That never bothered me.

    Well charname is bhaalspawn right, maybe that is what make us difference? ;)


    I dnt mind enemy getting max HP though, as long as its not atrocious like those in IWD HOF mode.

  • LifatLifat Member Posts: 353
    edited February 2016
    Mikey205 said:

    The problem with Max HP is that the DnD ruleset is not designed with it in mind. A rogue's HP is 1D6
    and a fireball is also 1D6 per level. On average a fireball from an equal level mage should kill an average equal level Rogue 40-50% of the time if the save is failed. When the Rogue starts gaining 6 HP every level, then that same event very quickly becomes almost impossible - that's a massive reduction in effectiveness of weapons, spells etc... Giving Max HP on level-up is basically only balanced by making all damage hit for max every time. The average on the otherhand makes the DnD ruleset work in an ideal setting and 75% is livable with (this is what I do because I do get power-gamer urges and reset a little bit but not for perfection).

    Also I'm pretty sure BG2 had all NPCs join with average HP values and have like 2-3 level-ups before HP stops increasing. That never bothered me.

    I don't think anyone is saying that MAX HP should be forced on anyone. Simply that we would like the OPTION.

    I completely agree with your logic, although it is mostly a nerf to spellcasters (and a few one shot kill builds like assassins) because their daily alotment of spells are limited while fighter type chars can keep hacking all day long.

    OPTIONS means that people are free to play the game the way they want to. In a single player game like this, it is hard to argue that people should play it a specific way. Your point is irrelevant to the discussion about adding the option for max hp.
    Your point is relevant when choosing between max hp / average hp / rolled hp.

    On a personal note, I play the game modded with both my guys and the opponents playing with MAX HP. I like that killing things take slightly more effort.

    the_spyderFaydark
  • KilivitzKilivitz Member Posts: 1,459
    edited February 2016

    I did notice on the first game I took into BG2EE that my cleric/thief had distinctly fewer hit-points than comparable NPCs in the game. Importing at max hp, you definitely get a few more, but rolling HP and taking what comes, for a more average level set of rolls, leaves you underpowered compared to the expected BG2 set-up.

    You can circumvent that by re-importing your character into BG2 (via the character generation screen) instead of taking the "PLAY" button shortcut.

    Vanilla BG2 had a similar bug in which a character's HP would get rerolled upon choosing a kit.

    On the max HP per level option: it will be, at the very least, a BALDUR.INI option. BG2:EE's current build not only already has it, but makes it enabled by default.

  • the_spyderthe_spyder Member Posts: 5,018
    I gotta kind of agree with @Lifat regarding the option. In a single player game, the player should have the option to play however they feel comfortable (within reason). If they want to play with MAX hit points and that is a reasonable edit in the game to give them that option, I see no reason (regardless of impact to game balance) to not at least respect their request.

  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 3,415
    BG2 Tweaks has a "Higher HP on level up" component that can be set "NWN-Style" to give between 50% and 100% of possible HP per die, e.g. 4-6 on 1d6, 5-8 for 1d8, etc..

    http://www.gibberlings3.net/bg2tweaks/cheats.php

    JuliusBorisovFaydark
  • Mikey205Mikey205 Member Posts: 302
    If max hp is done I think average or NWN style should be supported too in game and max HP should not be default. Also if you're going to do this then you should at least add a scroll failure disable option too. Just as annoying as reloading HP so why do just one and not the other.

  • gattberserkgattberserk Member Posts: 190
    edited February 2016
    Mikey205 said:

    If max hp is done I think average or NWN style should be supported too in game and max HP should not be default. Also if you're going to do this then you should at least add a scroll failure disable option too. Just as annoying as reloading HP so why do just one and not the other.

    I think i did mention the toggle that include all 3 together. Basically whatever is in the normal setting (beside the 75% dmg nerf) you separate them and add them as a toggle option.

    Anyway for those hardcore average hp fan, would really appreciate you do not enforce your rule to everyone else. If u are so determined on average hp, you can always play on insanity where enemy dmg are doubled (same effect as with ur hp effectively halved). So even u are on your max hp option, your actual hp compared to average core rule is abt the same. Sarevok will take 4 hits in insanity to kill you rather than 8 hit for eg.

  • GreenWarlockGreenWarlock Member Posts: 1,354
    @Kilivitz - the problem was not that my hits were re-rolled on import, but that by taking the first hp roll (as part of a no reload run) I was distinctly below the HP curve that the BG2 NPCs seemed to live on, who mostly seemed to roll 75%+.

  • LifatLifat Member Posts: 353
    Mikey205 said:

    If max hp is done I think average or NWN style should be supported too in game and max HP should not be default. Also if you're going to do this then you should at least add a scroll failure disable option too. Just as annoying as reloading HP so why do just one and not the other.

    I think the tone in your post is slightly to demanding for my taste, but I completely agree that all those options would be wonderful to have. I even agree that MAX HP shouldn't be default. I'd like ROLLED HP to be the default option.

    the_spyder
  • LifatLifat Member Posts: 353
    edited February 2016
    Dee said:

    I can confirm that the "Max HP on Level Up" option will be in the in-game Options menu for SoD. There are no plans for an "Average HP on Level Up" option, though; if you want that, it's easy enough to modify the appropriate 2da files.

    You people ROCK! I love the tendency you have towards handing out options left and right! Dee, make sure that you walk tall because you are awesome. Also, please pass that along to your colleagues.

    JuliusBorisovGreenWarlock
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited February 2016
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

    ValamirCleaver
  • LifatLifat Member Posts: 353
    edited February 2016

    Anyway for those hardcore average hp fan, would really appreciate you do not enforce your rule to everyone else. If u are so determined on average hp, you can always play on insanity where enemy dmg are doubled (same effect as with ur hp effectively halved).

    It's not "our" rule, it's the rule. It's nice that Beamdog is accommodating people like you, but I still think it's pretty selfish to *demand* that they add in the ability to not play by the rules because you are, for some reason, not willing to help yourself by using EEKeeper or one of the numerous mods that generous modders have made available to you for free, out of the goodness of their heart...
    Any difficulty at normal and below has MAX HP as standard setting. Any difficulty above that has ROLLED HP as the standard setting. So advocating for "average hp" being the standard setting is exactly as entitled as the ones arguing for "max hp" being the standard setting.
    The standard setting should be the same as it always have been. Max for normal and below in difficulty and rolled for anything above. Then add in the option as they have already said they would for changing the above difficulties to max hp.
    The average that you seem to think is/should be the standard setting haven't even been confirmed.

    But lets say that what you fear came true and they DID change the standard setting to always be max hp (which is something I don't want, even though I always change it to max hp). Then you want them to change so many things in the way the game works, instead of you simply switching away from the new standard setting? Talk about entitlement...

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