(Lurien and the Great Rift perhaps not as inventive, but still very rich.)
I agree, but those areas are race-specific. Plus i think visiting them would be kind-of boring in a way.
I dont want to see things "Stolen" from DA, but something i really enjoyed about DAO is that you started in a different place depending on your race, i think a realms game based like that would be pretty cool.
I would like to see an alternate shadows of Amn, essentially an alternate ending to Baldur's Gate 1. One where you finally beat your way into the Duchal Palace and Liia and Belt die in the fighting. It would be sweet to have a story branch off of that instead of "Muahahahaha! 800 damage".
I would suggest charname being chased through the streets by the Flaming Fist Battle Companies and Sarevok's soldiers should do, The charname would get ambushed by shadow theives along the way to Amn.
the alternate game would begin in Irenicus' Dungeon, with an army fighting in the Cloud Peaks against Amn. A bunch of the game would be the same, but it would be cool to have a final showdown between charname's band allied with Amn and the armies of Sarevok.
I really have no idea as to where the bhaalspawn story could go from here. I mean the story was so complex! If you analyze it between and in correlation with a typical, everyday story, those don't even hold a candle! I'm hoping they find some way to expand the bhaalspawn story. But I think they should make an overall different premise altogether, and that way they could make two more games with two more expansion, so perhaps at the end of that you'll feel godly and powerful.
They could always set something in the Sword Coast area like... Dragonspear Castle. In game lore, it was built by a half-Dwarf character named Daeros Dragonspear- he was the size of a human, but had Dwarf-like skills with stone. Well, someone opened up a gate to the Nine Hells under the castle, and it was taken over by Devils/Baatezu. In history, the gate was closed and the castle cleared out by forces from several different areas, including Baldur's Gate. You could do a character who is the son of/is another Bhaalspawn, who basically is born in this area, and adventures around and in the Sword Coast, and ends up being one of or the main hero who helps retake Dragonspear Castle from the Baatezu. Along the way of adventuring, you find out that the Baatezu intend to open up other bridgeheads/other gates in different places around the Sword Coast area, and you fight against them, leading up to the assault on the castle. Perhaps an evil mage or cleric is working with the Baatezu to gain power, and this would put a human/demi-human "face" on the threat, so you aren't always fighting off Minor Baatezu, which would probably get somewhat tedious.
(Lurien and the Great Rift perhaps not as inventive, but still very rich.)
I agree, but those areas are race-specific. Plus i think visiting them would be kind-of boring in a way.
Yeah, I probably shouldn't even have listed them. Maybe a minor quest could take the party to one or the other, but that's it.
Lurien is kind of a strange, ersatz ripoff of the Shire. Lurien's hobbits... oh, er, uh, I mean "halflings" ... are actually kinda nasty little buggers. I agree that it's about the last place in FR that I would want to visit in a CRPG (or book).
The Great Rift sounds like it would be impressive visually, but culture-wise I'm not that big of a fan of dwarven lore.
The places that I really like in the region though:
Ormpur the Shaar Halruaa the Shining Lands (lands and city-states surrounding the Golden Water) Dambrath
and I could easily picture an adventure that follows that route, more or less.
Messing with the existing story by revising TOB or otherwise for the sole purpose of beeing able to call the new product Baldur's Gate 3 sounds like the worst idea in a long while (no offence intended). The reason why everybody would want a Baldur's Gate 3 in the first place is that we love the original games. To meddle with these to excuse the new title would just be backwards and wrong in every sense.
To me, the idea of another game featuring the original protagonist just doesn't make any sense. Not so much because of wether or not said protagonist actually became a god or not, but beacuse of the divergence from the storys starting point that is the result of every single playthrough. Have you noticed the amount of topics on these boards that in some way or the other deals with the fact that BG2 assumed that you had completed BG1 with a certain party? Considering the various choices presented to you in BG2 (followers, romances, DESTINY) it's simply inavoidable that the starting point of a third game would feel even further removed from YOUR game experience.
There has for instance been a couple of suggestions that the story should concern Aeries child. Aeries chid? I can't recall a single playthrough where my Bhaalspawn hasn't - sooner or later - left her standing around in the Copper Coronet, minding her own business. He has certainly never entertained the idea of fathering her children. I mean for gods sake, what if it turned out to be winged?!
Hopefully you see my point.
As for a BG3, I only see two options:
1. A title along the lines of "Baldur's Gate - The History of the Fated Coin", "Baldur's Gate - Return to Cormyr (or whatever), that doesn't claim to be part of the original trilogy but rather relates to it through a similar setting and featuring the city either as location or indirectly.
No, bg3 doesnt have ot be called "baldurs gate 3" I would love a "Waterdeep" or a "Dale lands" game SO much of the realms has yet to be explored in these type of games, why stick to just The sword coast and icewind dale?
Agreed. Waterdeep might be tough, just cuz its SO massive. Then again, they did Athkatla... I dunno too much city kills me. I think a game in Vasa or the Bloodstone Lands would be fun. Also, if you're going to north maybe do up by Silverymoon. That'd be cool.
I also agree that a new game with a new character with ties to either the old character or old NPCs is best.
Obviously much of this speculation will depend on exactly what is in this rather strict contract agreement between the "partners". Though i don't like the term partners when it's applied to people who put so many restrictions, which block against making radical changes to the original story/plots etc. But be that as it may i like some of the ideas presented so far. Mine which was met with much derision on another post was that the story was in the future and a child of the former protagonist(for me...jaheira but with the additions to BG:EE could be any of the new chars). That would give reason to start a char from lvl 1, could easily flashback to previous events and could include cameos of previous companions, would involve something happening to the former protagonist that causes major issues with the world etc etc. Since i tend to ramble on and on if i don't stop myself, that's as far as i go with that.
That could very well include many of the regions mentioned by others on this thread that games have not explored before(except for Myth Drannor which has been done with the more modern "Pool of radiance " released by Ubisoft many moons ago...and bombed).
Got a possible plot... Iron Throne completely defunct after crisis after crisis. A war has started... Hate it when they try and get you to try and stop one... lets up the anty here... They need someone to take over the company... They see that Saveoursock had a few brothers and sisters... They go looking for Imoen... They find that she took in a swarm of strays and adopted them willy nilly... Whatever CHARNAME has to leave the safety of the Thieves guild in BG and as the oldest ward of Imoen or her daughter... YOU are thrust into the limelight... Everyone wants to be your friend as you have supposedly been given the location of a weapons dump, that supposedly has huge new pistols with kegs that could fill many powderhorns. Of course many would like to bump you off (good guys mostly!) so as the weapons dump is not revealed. The protectors of BG want you on their side so that they can continue to protect the city... The besiegers (Zhents?) Wan't you to help level the place...
In BG IV after being reunited briefly with the aged Imoen, you realise that you are actually the progeny of two Bhaalspawn... Imoen did not want you killed by the previous CHARNAME so hid you away. She needed powerful magic and literally mazed you and other time warping shannigans to hide you away. You battle through the planes to find the murderer of your mother and father whom you are convinced must have been evil and then confront the God of Murder... Is he any better than his farther.
Why this fixation on Baldurs Gate 3 anyway, there should be an absolutely new game, with new protagonists and NPCs, with maybe some minor references to the Times of Trouble and the Bhallspawn conflict as well as some other important things happening throughout the Realms.
What I'd really love to see would be a new Infinity Engine game, with a D&D ruleset. Since they are outdated now, it's almost impossible though.
What I'd really love to see would be a new Infinity Engine game, with a D&D ruleset. Since they are outdated now, it's almost impossible though.
I don't think so. In essence we're talking about isometric view with prerendered 2D backgrounds and sprites as characters. That's the Infinity Engine as we know it. I think it is easy to keep that style and "modernize" it at the same time.
What I'd really love to see would be a new Infinity Engine game, with a D&D ruleset. Since they are outdated now, it's almost impossible though.
I don't think so. In essence we're talking about isometric view with prerendered 2D backgrounds and sprites as characters. That's the Infinity Engine as we know it. I think it is easy to keep that style and "modernize" it at the same time.
What I actually meant was the AD&D 2ed ruleset, as seen in BG2. Since Infinity is a 2D engine and the ruleset from BG2 is very old too by now, there is very little chance something like that would come out. I'd really like to be proven wrong, Project Eternity looks promising.
What I'd really love to see would be a new Infinity Engine game, with a D&D ruleset. Since they are outdated now, it's almost impossible though.
I don't think so. In essence we're talking about isometric view with prerendered 2D backgrounds and sprites as characters. That's the Infinity Engine as we know it. I think it is easy to keep that style and "modernize" it at the same time.
What I actually meant was the AD&D 2ed ruleset, as seen in BG2. Since Infinity is a 2D engine and the ruleset from BG2 is very old too by now, there is very little chance something like that would come out. I'd really like to be proven wrong, Project Eternity looks promising.
There is Inquisitor who have come out recentelly that his a 2D isometric RPG, it don't use D7D rules... but it's a new game with mechanics who are similar
How about setting it before Baldur's Gate? Not really a prequel but just a different part of the history of the BG story line that wasnt directly experienced in the games
The BG story of Bhaal plotting his resurrection does begin before the Time of Troubles, actually...
The Time of Troubles takes place 14 years before BG1 begins. Bhaal foresaw that he would be killed during the Godswar. So he set about "sowing his mortal progeny," and so forth.
I'm not sure how old the various Bhaalspawn are. But we do know that one Bhaalspawn, Abazigal, had a son, Draconis. So Bhaal was likely out there sowing his seed probably at least a good 2 generations before the story begins.
If the story is launched by a young Gorion in his late 20's offering the initial quest to help the Harpers spy on Bhaal's scheme, that would set the tale roughly 40 years before BG1.
Of course, the PC can choose not to take the quest. He can also side with other factions, etc.
Now how to weave a good CRPG story that simply begins there is the question. But it could be rather open as to where the tale leads. In fact, I think one of the most interesting things to do is to make very many different type of outcomes possible. The type of mark the hero makes in many cases probably will not be widely known, but nevertheless fateful. Perhaps this is a story where the character doesn't have to literally save the world, but in some ways is more witness to history, and who plays an important part in it even if he or she doesn't recognize it at the time. In some cases the impact might be very great. In others it may not seem to be all that crucial, but nevertheless it is meaningful, and in the epilogue you learn what it was.
And although the story would begin on the Sword Coast, some of the quests could lead the hero to more exotic locales in Faerun (perhaps Calimshan, Halruaa, etc.). I would love to see a game that explores some new ground geographically.
Now something like this will only be possible if it has WotC's approval. Which means it has to be compatrible with the products on the shelf at the time. But if Ed Greenwood's new FRCS basically provides a framework to play in any time period, then it should be fine.
I'm not all that concerned about the ruleset, because what I'm reading is that Edition Next supports DMs in customizing the rules. If that's so, then the devs could take much of what is great about 2nd ed. AD&D and improve what isn't.
Maybe he just saves his party, or his hometown, or sets the foundation for something that occurs in BG. Although you run into the problem of not being able to have a super open game at that point. Hell maybe bhaal ruined his flower garden and he sets out on a quest for revenge that ultimately contributes to bhaals downfall and saving some of the bhaal spawn. Or he joins bhaal and attempts to ensure that bhaals plans go as planned.
My 2nd idea for a new bg game was for it to be completely new and original. Bare in mind i'm not a pro D&D player who knows the entire land inside and out. My knowledge is based solely on the games i've played and a wonderful map i found once and never could find again of the realms.
I kept hearing dialogue in some of the games about that wonderful new land called...Maztica? in BG2 and how many factions were heading for a confrontation over it's wealth of resources. Nice big war theme for supremacy of those lands which could involve oodles of factions and nations and conspiracies. But also theses new lands hold many more secrets, many deadly that puts ALL factions/nations in danger.
That opens up a TON of possibilities. Choice of faction(s) to work for or against, politics, drama, intrigue. Just throwing thoughts and ideas out there.
IMHO the setting could go like this: ****SPOILER***
original protagonist as we know can either ascend (becoming good or evil deity) or get back to Faerun and live long and fairly happy life. Lets assume the latter (or becoming good deity, as game is slightly 'good focused').
the new protagonist could be someone standing up when the world realizes that the old hero Charname succumbed to evil (either as deity or mortal) and started doing evil deeds Faerun-wide. ****END SPOILER*****
the setting should be Thay, Cormyr, Calimshan but also South like Halruaa. don't mind revisiting Waterdeep (nevr liked nwn anyway).
i opt for 2-2.5 ed AD&D rules (hated IWD2 for using 3rd ed).
would LOVE to have isometric view with hand painted graphics (not fully 3d).......of course all FullHDas we're 21st century after all.
Comments
I dont want to see things "Stolen" from DA, but something i really enjoyed about DAO is that you started in a different place depending on your race, i think a realms game based like that would be pretty cool.
But your right, there are better areas to base a new game
I would suggest charname being chased through the streets by the Flaming Fist Battle Companies and Sarevok's soldiers should do, The charname would get ambushed by shadow theives along the way to Amn.
the alternate game would begin in Irenicus' Dungeon, with an army fighting in the Cloud Peaks against Amn. A bunch of the game would be the same, but it would be cool to have a final showdown between charname's band allied with Amn and the armies of Sarevok.
Lurien is kind of a strange, ersatz ripoff of the Shire. Lurien's hobbits... oh, er, uh, I mean "halflings"
The Great Rift sounds like it would be impressive visually, but culture-wise I'm not that big of a fan of dwarven lore.
The places that I really like in the region though:
Ormpur
the Shaar
Halruaa
the Shining Lands (lands and city-states surrounding the Golden Water)
Dambrath
and I could easily picture an adventure that follows that route, more or less.
Thay
Calimshan
Netheril
Cormyr
or maybe the rest of Tethyr of which we didn't get to see much in ToB.
I feel all these places make interesting adventure settings because of their political intrigue and
their cultural and historical richness.
To me, the idea of another game featuring the original protagonist just doesn't make any sense. Not so much because of wether or not said protagonist actually became a god or not, but beacuse of the divergence from the storys starting point that is the result of every single playthrough. Have you noticed the amount of topics on these boards that in some way or the other deals with the fact that BG2 assumed that you had completed BG1 with a certain party? Considering the various choices presented to you in BG2 (followers, romances, DESTINY) it's simply inavoidable that the starting point of a third game would feel even further removed from YOUR game experience.
There has for instance been a couple of suggestions that the story should concern Aeries child. Aeries chid? I can't recall a single playthrough where my Bhaalspawn hasn't - sooner or later - left her standing around in the Copper Coronet, minding her own business. He has certainly never entertained the idea of fathering her children. I mean for gods sake, what if it turned out to be winged?!
Hopefully you see my point.
As for a BG3, I only see two options:
1. A title along the lines of "Baldur's Gate - The History of the Fated Coin", "Baldur's Gate - Return to Cormyr (or whatever), that doesn't claim to be part of the original trilogy but rather relates to it through a similar setting and featuring the city either as location or indirectly.
2. A completely different title.
I also agree that a new game with a new character with ties to either the old character or old NPCs is best.
That could very well include many of the regions mentioned by others on this thread that games have not explored before(except for Myth Drannor which has been done with the more modern "Pool of radiance " released by Ubisoft many moons ago...and bombed).
wait for it...
BALDUR'S GATE ! ! ! !
In BG IV after being reunited briefly with the aged Imoen, you realise that you are actually the progeny of two Bhaalspawn... Imoen did not want you killed by the previous CHARNAME so hid you away. She needed powerful magic and literally mazed you and other time warping shannigans to hide you away. You battle through the planes to find the murderer of your mother and father whom you are convinced must have been evil and then confront the God of Murder... Is he any better than his farther.
What I'd really love to see would be a new Infinity Engine game, with a D&D ruleset. Since they are outdated now, it's almost impossible though.
Most of the accompanying images can be found here: http://minnels.ath.cx/index2.php?Qwd=./Spel/Project Jefferson&Qif=Chiloptec human Maztican fighter sorcerer.jpg&Qiv=thumbs&Qis=XL
I feel so forlorn reading and looking at what could have been an incredible legacy.
The Time of Troubles takes place 14 years before BG1 begins. Bhaal foresaw that he would be killed during the Godswar. So he set about "sowing his mortal progeny," and so forth.
I'm not sure how old the various Bhaalspawn are. But we do know that one Bhaalspawn, Abazigal, had a son, Draconis. So Bhaal was likely out there sowing his seed probably at least a good 2 generations before the story begins.
If the story is launched by a young Gorion in his late 20's offering the initial quest to help the Harpers spy on Bhaal's scheme, that would set the tale roughly 40 years before BG1.
Of course, the PC can choose not to take the quest. He can also side with other factions, etc.
Now how to weave a good CRPG story that simply begins there is the question. But it could be rather open as to where the tale leads. In fact, I think one of the most interesting things to do is to make very many different type of outcomes possible. The type of mark the hero makes in many cases probably will not be widely known, but nevertheless fateful. Perhaps this is a story where the character doesn't have to literally save the world, but in some ways is more witness to history, and who plays an important part in it even if he or she doesn't recognize it at the time. In some cases the impact might be very great. In others it may not seem to be all that crucial, but nevertheless it is meaningful, and in the epilogue you learn what it was.
And although the story would begin on the Sword Coast, some of the quests could lead the hero to more exotic locales in Faerun (perhaps Calimshan, Halruaa, etc.). I would love to see a game that explores some new ground geographically.
Now something like this will only be possible if it has WotC's approval. Which means it has to be compatrible with the products on the shelf at the time. But if Ed Greenwood's new FRCS basically provides a framework to play in any time period, then it should be fine.
I'm not all that concerned about the ruleset, because what I'm reading is that Edition Next supports DMs in customizing the rules. If that's so, then the devs could take much of what is great about 2nd ed. AD&D and improve what isn't.
Maybe he just saves his party, or his hometown, or sets the foundation for something that occurs in BG. Although you run into the problem of not being able to have a super open game at that point. Hell maybe bhaal ruined his flower garden and he sets out on a quest for revenge that ultimately contributes to bhaals downfall and saving some of the bhaal spawn. Or he joins bhaal and attempts to ensure that bhaals plans go as planned.
I kept hearing dialogue in some of the games about that wonderful new land called...Maztica? in BG2 and how many factions were heading for a confrontation over it's wealth of resources. Nice big war theme for supremacy of those lands which could involve oodles of factions and nations and conspiracies. But also theses new lands hold many more secrets, many deadly that puts ALL factions/nations in danger.
That opens up a TON of possibilities. Choice of faction(s) to work for or against, politics, drama, intrigue. Just throwing thoughts and ideas out there.
****SPOILER***
original protagonist as we know can either ascend (becoming good or evil deity) or get back to Faerun and live long and fairly happy life. Lets assume the latter (or becoming good deity, as game is slightly 'good focused').
the new protagonist could be someone standing up when the world realizes that the old hero Charname succumbed to evil (either as deity or mortal) and started doing evil deeds Faerun-wide.
****END SPOILER*****
the setting should be Thay, Cormyr, Calimshan but also South like Halruaa. don't mind revisiting Waterdeep (nevr liked nwn anyway).
i opt for 2-2.5 ed AD&D rules (hated IWD2 for using 3rd ed).
would LOVE to have isometric view with hand painted graphics (not fully 3d).......of course all FullHDas we're 21st century after all.