I didn't read everyone's response so not sure if someone asked, but due to this delay.. will this mean we can get the BG1 animations for release? Would be nice.
@GueulEclator You don't have the pre-order badge. So either you cancelled your pre-order and the people at Beamdog are so thorough in the design of this website that they revoked your badge, or you never preordered (like me) and really have no right to whine about a delay.
Not only did I pre-order this game with my hard earned cash, not only were my hopes of donning my wizard hat this Tuesday absolutely CRUSHED but I even took time out of my annual leave along with 5 of my friends which is now UNABLE to be used for playing BG:EE... Only to find out that the release of this "Enhanced Edition" is delayed by TWO MONTHS!? I just can't believe what wonderful developers we have here that understand that release dates are fickle in the grand scheme of things! Now we will get more content and a better product (which I dream about infrequently)! Thank you so much for not handing us a result that could be better! ^_^
I find it amazing people can make stupid fanboy comments like this when they dont even know how the game will turn out. Bioware made BG not overhaul, your fanaticism is misplaced. Customers have a obligation to criticize delays when money is involved.
How pragmatic. So you're saying that "fanboys" need to be critical of the delay just because they (seemingly) already paid for the game? The situation has been explained. One does not qualify as a fanboy just because they have the empathy to realize that yeah, sometimes these things happen.
The post you quoted was talking about people who bitch and complain about a process that they have but a vague notion of how it goes. Doing that is just as stupid as praising a game that you haven't even played yet.
The game is not the issue here -it's how people react to the news. What is misplaced is your sense of entitlement as a paying customer. Talking trash and dismissing supportive people as fanatics doesn't make you come off as the wiser one in this situation.
Hmmmm. I understand the frustration. But I don't think folks realize what a beta tester is or does. I consider my time and energy valuable. I gladly donate it to a game I love - and I would likely also be among the first to scream bloody murder and not support an effort that I did not think was 100% in the interests of players.
There is no value judgement here, but... dudes, dudettes - the modders working on an over-a-decade-old game are the type of folks who are bothered by *anything* that doesn't work quite right. It isn't that we are more or less invested in the game than players. Modders are players who are so invested in the game that they get so frustrated that something doesn't work quite right that they start fixing it themselves. So playing an unfinished game does not equal "playing" any more than working as a stage manager is a free ticket to a theater performance.
I hope the frustrations ebb as folks realize that a company that is willing to get things done right rather than ship out before it is ready is a unique, wonderful, rare thing. I could rant against the garbage most of us have to deal with for a $60 game, but I don't have to - everyone reading this has most likely experienced it. So I am darned happy to see a company care as much about doing things right as us players.
I just wanted to pop back in to address one point.
You have every right as a customer to express your anger, your frustration, your disappointment. But to the folks insinuating (or outright saying) that the Sept. 18 date was never a real goal--as a beta tester I took it very seriously, as did the other beta testers, and we're really frustrated and disappointed we didn't make the date. The only people more frustrated than us are the devs themselves. No one is happy with this, and the anger and frustration in this thread is shared.
By all means, express your rights as a customer, but let's all at least try to keep the tone civil.
I'm all for a civil tone, but saying beta testers and devs are more frustrated then the rest of us who only have a couple of screenshots from the game - yeah that makes no sense.
Why doesn't it? I'm confident they are more emotionally invested than most of us, you included.
You do realize they have the game, right? Let me shed a tear for the emotionally stressed beta testers who are playing the game as we speak [/sarcasm] Personally, I'm fine with the delay, but the level of fanboism on this thread is repulsive. Judging by this thread, the devs should announce the release date in November and delay it again, a couple of days before the release. It seems the community likes it that way. I'm sure there will be a lot of people whose schedule is busy till February anyway, and also a lot of people who will have other games to finish, not to mention that the game will be much more polished if it came out in February. Go delays !
LOL at playtesting being the same as playing for fun. You do know what play testing is, right? Seriously though, I see a lot of people with various responses, not any clear majority for fanboys or gripers. You may feel a more outraged response is warranted, many of us are too old for that.
For those interested, GoG.com are selling both BG games atm (original versions + goodies) along with a bunch of other D&D games for a real bargain on their website atm, if you're gagging for a D&D/BG fix in the very lengthy meantime.
Unlucky. Can't say I'm not a little disappointed but you get that on the big jobs!
In other news GoG.com emailed me also - 65% off D&D games... Timing!
Talk about timing. I am glad I don't pre-order this game yet. Been waiting for more screenshots and gameplay trailers before deciding to buy. I never owned and played the original games, so I hoped to jump in on the best ever CRPG craze I've been witnessing for many many years, with this release.
However, since this happens, and there's a sale on BG (and other D&D games) on GOG.com, I've decided to spend my money there instead, and maybe, by 30 November 2012, I've recuperated enough money to buy this game as well. Do take your time to polish the game, and please, release gameplay movie(s), plenty of time before release date. B-)
I don't know beta testers from beta fish. But I thought Overhaul and their partners were businesses. I'm a consulting engineer. My customers expect a good price, a good product, and on time delivery.
I certainly have no complaints about the price. I would have paid more.
They started with a great product. What they do with it remains to be seen.
Epic fail on the delivery. If I did this in my business I wouldn't have a business.
I haven't been this disappointed in ages. But, as I said earlier, I will wait it out. I don't really have a choice. But if I ever have a great idea for a game, I will take it to a professional, not Overhaul.
4 days to go and we get hit with a 2 and a half month delay.
No, I don't just blindly accept this, this stinks. It's not as if you're building a new game here, all you're doing is smoothing out an existing one and squashing the bugs and you've had a bigger time schedule than a lot of games built from scratch.
It better be absolutely spotless and bug free when it's released or it'll be the last time I pay you money for anything, after all that's exactly what you are being paid for, a bugfree version
...and I would absolutely love someone to try to accuse me of not being a fan of the game. Being a fan of the game and a fan of the dev are two entirely different things.
Ouch, Ouch, Ouch. I hope I have the money in November. I generally don't pre-order anymore, got ripped off the last, and only, time I did.
Short version of that was I pre-ordered and it was supposed to ship and arrive on release date. That was set down by the publisher. The shipper wasn't going to ship till after release date and I wasn't going to receive for 10 days after release.
Anyways for that reason I nolonger pre-order. If I don't have the money in November, I will order it as soon as I can.
Seriously though, I see a lot of people with various responses, not any clear majority for fanboys or gripers.
Look at the thread again, it is clearly fanboy infested. Even if there was no clear majority, what would you normally expect from a thread about a 2 months+ delay, 3 days before release?
You may feel a more outraged response is warranted, many of us are too old for that.
On the contrary, I feel a less cultist response is warranted. I guess you are never too old to join a cult. I am fine with the delay, as I said. Just disappointed with the "Yes, delay!" crowd which seem to be the majority.
Mad about it too. Damn this. Will get the FIRST and hopefully the LAST refund because of it. (No badge here b/c registered here after the pre-order. But if it ever comes, would gladly exchange this sh*tty badge for the September release date. -_-)
Why can't devs just RELEASE the game and then UPDATE it? Seriously? Is that hard? Especially if it is DIGITAL distribution?
Considering the size of Overhaul's team (I'm just guessing, I don't know for real) and the scope of this project, that they decided to delay the launch of BG:EE is a very brave decision. If this was, say... Bioware, we could be angry due to the amount of resources they have, but working against time, improving as much as they are doing and taking care of BG like a baby of them is something I fully support.
Why can't we have the current version now? I don't care if I have to retstart a character 2.5 months from now. I'll probably be back anyway since you're doing so many changes.
Beamdog has to much integrity to ship an unfinished product. Too many other companies do not have the courage to do the same and they eventually develop a bad reputation.
Right, because no successful company releases betas. Integrity is a word without substance in this matter. I honestly don't see the problem in releasing a clearly marked 'Beta' version and have an official launch later. People will remember the 'finished' version half a year from now.
Honestly, the game was ready to be played 14 years ago. Now it's about polish, and 90% is completed. I'm happy with a beta, and many of us had plans around the release date. Seems like a bigger waste to not release a beta. Like me for instance, I'm headed on a trip, and it would be so cool to have a game like BG (even vanilla) for the iPad to keep me company.
Its lousy that they delayed the game for so long and with such little notice. And I think a more detailed explanation with what went wrong is warranted. But I also understand that Overhaul must get this game right or its over. That is, a "fix it later" release probably scuttles the whole ship. So, I'm willing to be patient. But if they don't deliver in November, I'll probably ask for a refund.
For everyone complaining about the '4 days notice': it was mentioned on the early pages of this thread that Trent & co WANTED to announce a delay earlier but had to get official corporate approval before any official unveiling of a new date (probably from WOTC). For all we know they asked for a delay a week or more ago. Decisionmaking at big companies is always slow. Trust me; I work for one.
Also, I don't think my idea of another new NPC at the new release date is out of the realm of possibilty. While the testers continue to work, the content team (consisting of different people) do their thing. Since they may have already been planning for post-release NPCs already it seems reasonable to me.
It was the exact same situation with Dragon Age: Origins. For those of you who weren't following that game pre-release - the PC version was finished about 6 months before the console versions. A corporate decision was handed down to release all the versions on the same day. This gave the devs 6 months while the console port teams worked. They took that time to perfect an NPC they had intended to put in the game, but had to cut out because of bugs (the golem Shale). When DA:O came out, everyone buying a new copy could download Shale for free.
The company's not going anywhere. They still got more DLC to release after my understanding, and they need to prepare the game to be compatible with BG2. More fixes and updates are bound to happen.
Anyway, I do understand that Overhaul Games could do much with that time. That said, customers who paid for a game, but cannot play the game during a promised period of time, are allowed to address the issue. If they do not voice their concern, there is something wrong with them. It can however be done without being a douche. And the people who are defending Overhaul Game have a point. The company isn't evil. It has good intentions, and it just happen to move very slowly. But seriously defenders.. It's been less than half a day since the announcement, and some people have taken days off because of said release day. They have even PAID money in assuming they would be playing a good game during that time. They absolutely are ENTITLED to be upset with the short notice they got. That's not whining, that's a legimate outlet. Though if it drags on for a longer period of time, it could be considered whining.
Allow me to loosely quote a lovable character, "talking and magic is impressive, but now, Minsc leads! BG:EE Betas for everyone!"
I've also preordered this game and I'm a little but frustrated by the short notice although I'm aware also that for Overhaul, BG:EE needs to be a suceess for them to be accredited and therefore able to do the same Enhanced Editions with BG 2, Planescape and IWD. That said I'm ok with the delay because I think this is for the best...
Stop using the word entitled as an insult or buzzword. a customer IS entitled to a product. saying "you feel entitled" or whatever is no different from saying "how dare you feel like you have some right to access a product you paid and waited for". If a customer isn't entitled to a product then the world is screwed.
That is literally the epitomy of being a drone.
Course, a customer being rude is a seperate issue all together, it makes the customer a douche, certainly. futhermore, a customer can't make demands to which he has no rights to (eg, he cant pay for one item, but then ask for 2). But this is a seperate issue from the obligations of the producer/company.
@vonbek777 Actually I like the abruptness in which Trent did it. It's like ripping someone's bandaid off before they know whats happening. You would have complained no matter what, so...stop complaining. Style points to @TrentOster for a nice quick rip. I love it.
Actually, no I wouldn't have. I have lots of hoop jumping myself to do. I understand project management quite well in fact, and it is no fun being stuck in the middle. The new date for release is better for me and the wife anyhow. But a little communication or hint of a delay earlier, and the wife would not have been taking a week of leave off next week that we will now have to rush to undo before next week.
You were planning vacation around the release of this game? That's what's got your undies in a bundle? Sounds like you're more upset with consequences of your actions than the release date change itself. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt: working right up to the deadline to make it before realizing it wasn't happening, legal hoops to jump through to announce this, etc.
How are my undies in a bunch? Am I being unreasonable in my request for better or more frequent communication? I'm pushing 40, and though I work at home, I have plenty of deadlines to schedule around, the wife is an IT manager/programmer with plenty of hoop jumping of her own on multiple projects. We have two young kids. Time is precious, and we're both old school crpg players. Scheduling time to be together to accomplish that requires effort. Granted none of that is Overhaul's concern, but communicating with the customers in general is. Is that an unreasonable request? We will gladly shell out money and support for a company like Overhaul to bring back some great memories for the both of us, and some new memories for our kids. I have 10 machines at home. We still do lan parties once in a blue moon with old friends from college. If I am coming off as overbearing...that is not my intent. Just request better communication. I've checked and my undies are definitely not bunched as far as I can tell.
Touché. I guess you just put a lot more eggs in this September 18th basket than I did, which is reasonable to say is a risky bet in this industry/specific situation/etc. The delay didn't throw off any big plans of mine, as opposed to you. Besides introducing myself to the new NPC's, that is. Well, here's to a more complete product in a handful of weeks!
Comments
Good thing you guys are gamers. In the real world heads roll for this kind of thing.
That said, I will patiently await the release date. Like I have a choice. I want to play this game.
Sounds like a typical hobby project of mine.
Not only did I pre-order this game with my hard earned cash, not only were my hopes of donning my wizard hat this Tuesday absolutely CRUSHED but I even took time out of my annual leave along with 5 of my friends which is now UNABLE to be used for playing BG:EE... Only to find out that the release of this "Enhanced Edition" is delayed by TWO MONTHS!? I just can't believe what wonderful developers we have here that understand that release dates are fickle in the grand scheme of things! Now we will get more content and a better product (which I dream about infrequently)! Thank you so much for not handing us a result that could be better! ^_^
The post you quoted was talking about people who bitch and complain about a process that they have but a vague notion of how it goes. Doing that is just as stupid as praising a game that you haven't even played yet.
The game is not the issue here -it's how people react to the news. What is misplaced is your sense of entitlement as a paying customer. Talking trash and dismissing supportive people as fanatics doesn't make you come off as the wiser one in this situation.
There is no value judgement here, but... dudes, dudettes - the modders working on an over-a-decade-old game are the type of folks who are bothered by *anything* that doesn't work quite right. It isn't that we are more or less invested in the game than players. Modders are players who are so invested in the game that they get so frustrated that something doesn't work quite right that they start fixing it themselves. So playing an unfinished game does not equal "playing" any more than working as a stage manager is a free ticket to a theater performance.
I hope the frustrations ebb as folks realize that a company that is willing to get things done right rather than ship out before it is ready is a unique, wonderful, rare thing. I could rant against the garbage most of us have to deal with for a $60 game, but I don't have to - everyone reading this has most likely experienced it. So I am darned happy to see a company care as much about doing things right as us players.
Seriously though, I see a lot of people with various responses, not any clear majority for fanboys or gripers.
You may feel a more outraged response is warranted, many of us are too old for that.
ELE
However, since this happens, and there's a sale on BG (and other D&D games) on GOG.com, I've decided to spend my money there instead, and maybe, by 30 November 2012, I've recuperated enough money to buy this game as well. Do take your time to polish the game, and please, release gameplay movie(s), plenty of time before release date. B-)
I certainly have no complaints about the price. I would have paid more.
They started with a great product. What they do with it remains to be seen.
Epic fail on the delivery. If I did this in my business I wouldn't have a business.
I haven't been this disappointed in ages. But, as I said earlier, I will wait it out. I don't really have a choice. But if I ever have a great idea for a game, I will take it to a professional, not Overhaul.
No, I don't just blindly accept this, this stinks. It's not as if you're building a new game here, all you're doing is smoothing out an existing one and squashing the bugs and you've had a bigger time schedule than a lot of games built from scratch.
It better be absolutely spotless and bug free when it's released or it'll be the last time I pay you money for anything, after all that's exactly what you are being paid for, a bugfree version
...and I would absolutely love someone to try to accuse me of not being a fan of the game. Being a fan of the game and a fan of the dev are two entirely different things.
... and where are the pre order badges?
Short version of that was I pre-ordered and it was supposed to ship and arrive on release date. That was set down by the publisher. The shipper wasn't going to ship till after release date and I wasn't going to receive for 10 days after release.
Anyways for that reason I nolonger pre-order. If I don't have the money in November, I will order it as soon as I can.
how is it possible to miss the release date on something like this. --->its already finished<--- ? honestly i would like to know.
Playtesting = something much more interesting then waiting for new screenshots Look at the thread again, it is clearly fanboy infested. Even if there was no clear majority, what would you normally expect from a thread about a 2 months+ delay, 3 days before release? On the contrary, I feel a less cultist response is warranted. I guess you are never too old to join a cult.
I am fine with the delay, as I said. Just disappointed with the "Yes, delay!" crowd which seem to be the majority.
(No badge here b/c registered here after the pre-order. But if it ever comes, would gladly exchange this sh*tty badge for the September release date. -_-)
Why can't devs just RELEASE the game and then UPDATE it? Seriously? Is that hard? Especially if it is DIGITAL distribution?
I'll wait eagerly for November! :P
I wonder why. I guess it leaves more time for the translators, which is nice.
Honestly, the game was ready to be played 14 years ago. Now it's about polish, and 90% is completed. I'm happy with a beta, and many of us had plans around the release date. Seems like a bigger waste to not release a beta. Like me for instance, I'm headed on a trip, and it would be so cool to have a game like BG (even vanilla) for the iPad to keep me company.
Also, I don't think my idea of another new NPC at the new release date is out of the realm of possibilty. While the testers continue to work, the content team (consisting of different people) do their thing. Since they may have already been planning for post-release NPCs already it seems reasonable to me.
It was the exact same situation with Dragon Age: Origins. For those of you who weren't following that game pre-release - the PC version was finished about 6 months before the console versions. A corporate decision was handed down to release all the versions on the same day. This gave the devs 6 months while the console port teams worked. They took that time to perfect an NPC they had intended to put in the game, but had to cut out because of bugs (the golem Shale). When DA:O came out, everyone buying a new copy could download Shale for free.
The company's not going anywhere. They still got more DLC to release after my understanding, and they need to prepare the game to be compatible with BG2. More fixes and updates are bound to happen.
Anyway, I do understand that Overhaul Games could do much with that time. That said, customers who paid for a game, but cannot play the game during a promised period of time, are allowed to address the issue. If they do not voice their concern, there is something wrong with them. It can however be done without being a douche. And the people who are defending Overhaul Game have a point. The company isn't evil. It has good intentions, and it just happen to move very slowly. But seriously defenders.. It's been less than half a day since the announcement, and some people have taken days off because of said release day. They have even PAID money in assuming they would be playing a good game during that time. They absolutely are ENTITLED to be upset with the short notice they got. That's not whining, that's a legimate outlet. Though if it drags on for a longer period of time, it could be considered whining.
Allow me to loosely quote a lovable character, "talking and magic is impressive, but now, Minsc leads! BG:EE Betas for everyone!"
Stop using the word entitled as an insult or buzzword. a customer IS entitled to a product. saying "you feel entitled" or whatever is no different from saying "how dare you feel like you have some right to access a product you paid and waited for". If a customer isn't entitled to a product then the world is screwed.
That is literally the epitomy of being a drone.
Course, a customer being rude is a seperate issue all together, it makes the customer a douche, certainly. futhermore, a customer can't make demands to which he has no rights to (eg, he cant pay for one item, but then ask for 2). But this is a seperate issue from the obligations of the producer/company.
Touché. I guess you just put a lot more eggs in this September 18th basket than I did, which is reasonable to say is a risky bet in this industry/specific situation/etc. The delay didn't throw off any big plans of mine, as opposed to you. Besides introducing myself to the new NPC's, that is. Well, here's to a more complete product in a handful of weeks!