Skipping werewolf Island

MacHurto

I am starting a run and I was seriously considering not going to werewolf island. It always makes me wonder why the hell does charname lose 50 days or whatever on a trip, with all the s*** going on around him. Unless you haven't yet cleared the Nashkell mines (and can assume that it is not your problem plus it is good to put space between you and your assassins) it seems out of place to go on that long trip, compared to any other quest. What do you all think? Do you justify it in your head cannon in any way?

FrozenCells

I don't think the games lend themselves well to that kind of in-world consistency. BG2 e.g. has a mass of content available in chapter 2, with a caveat that you really ought to skip most of it to progress the story ASAP. You can do it later in the game but, again, it wouldn't make much sense then either.

rion26

I actually never go there as it does not bring any advancement to the party, neither experiencewise (I have always reached the level cap before chapter 7) nor itemwise, and since I always try to keep it at no- or at least minimal reloads, why take the risk?

BelgarathMTH

I'm never going there again in a no-reload or minimal reload, because SoD has changed it so that there are now FOUR greater wolfweres there to fight instead of just Karoug. And you have to fight the first one before you ever go to Karoug's ship and get the special weapons.

(The change is not in BG:EE 2.1 without SoD, only in BG:EE with SoD installed, and on Core Rules. But, I don't intend to ever revert to playing BG without SoD installed.)

Tresset

@BelgarathMTH you do realize that is a bug, right?

BelgarathMTH

@Tresset, No one has officially admitted that that I've seen. @Gate70 was the one that figured out it was in BG with SoD but not in BG without SoD.

Did somebody put it on the Redmine list and the developers acknowledge that it was a mistake to be fixed in the future?

I also thought it must be a bug at first, but after @Gate70 found it in the game code, I thought it must be an intentional "feature".

If they "fix" it, then I might go to Werewolf Island again in a future run. There's also an issue where the greater wolfweres' regeneration seems to be regenerating a lot faster and more than in the original TotSC, but nobody seems to know for sure what's up with that, including the devs, whom I've never seen admit that there's any problem at all. I've about gotten to where I prefer to just avoid having issues with the whole Werewolf Island scenario in the EE's by not going there.

Mush_Mush

I like to go there for completionist reasons. Its always nice to finish a game knowing you've actually completed all the main quests. But technically there's not a whole lot to be gained on the island which is unfortunate.

They should have made you go there to get the Helm and Cloak of Balduran imo. Its waaay too easy to get those godlike items....I guess the butterknife of balduran was the more coveted prize >.>

MacHurto

@Mush_Mush I also like to do all the content, but last run it struck me as weird to waste my time with it.
@FrozenCells well, you can always argue you need money/power/items to find and fight irenicus before Spellhold. After the Underdark I agree it feels strange, unless you house rule that you dont know Bodhi has the lantern, so you are trying to find clues about it. In any case, no BG2 quest *alone* takes so many days. Spending a couple of days exploring something or helping a companion, might make sense. Nobody in their sane minds would take that ship and spend 50 days at sea in BG2 either.

BelgarathMTH

@Tresset , okay, good, thanks. I'm glad they're aware of it.

Montresor_SP

Both the Tales of the Sword Coast quests in Baldur's Gate and Watcher's Keep in BG2 have always bugged me a bit from a role-playing point of view.

In Baldur's Gate you are supposed to get a lot of things done: Clear out the Nashkel Mines, find and infiltrate the Bandit Camp, clear out the Cloakwood mines, etc. I guess you could rationalize it by saying that after revisiting Candlekeep, when the entire Flaming Fist is after you, it would make sense to hide away in a dungeon or on a distant island for a while but you'd still want to be able to return to Baldur's Gate in a hurry if Sarevok gets too close to seizing power.

Same thing with Watcher's Keep. In Shadows of Amn, you are supposed to save Imoen, and then to get your soul back. In Throne of Bhaal you are busy hunting other Bhaalspawn - there is really no time for investigating a large dungeon! I try to rationalize it by doing Watcher's Keep at the end of chapter 8 when the Tethyrian army is hunting for me; again to hide away for a little while.

Hudzy

I like to think I'm getting out of town after the Candlekeep shenanigans in chapter 6, being a wanted person of interest and all that. Koveras gets more time to establish the takeover he's accomplished in chapter 7, and my protagonist gets yet another hint that you can't run away from destiny. Or something.

Buttercheese

At this rate, I am mostly doing "in character" playthrough. Meaning I try to do only things that my character would do, that includes exploration and quests. So if I am playing an asocial loner who can't bothered by the people around them, I miss out on most content. If I am playing an outgoing overachiever, I get (almost) all the content.

lansounet

I rarely do it like many because it doesn't bring much and then the RP reasons, which is why I love how BGT handles the transition and I hope EET does the same so you can do all these side quests between Sarevok and SoD.

EEs should have done something similar IMO, makes more sense that ToTSC content happens after Sarevok's demise as it was with the premade save in the original expansion pack.

Metal_Hurlant

BelgarathMTH said:

I'm never going there again in a no-reload or minimal reload, because SoD has changed it so that there are now FOUR greater wolfweres there to fight instead of just Karoug. And you have to fight the first one before you ever go to Karoug's ship and get the special weapons.

(The change is not in BG:EE 2.1 without SoD, only in BG:EE with SoD installed, and on Core Rules. But, I don't intend to ever revert to playing BG without SoD installed.)

I was wondering why there's a Greater Wolfwere waiting for you as soon as enter the North Island map. And what's even worse is if you try and run away, back to the South Island Map, they follow you as well. Running away doesn't help even to a new map!

As soon as that happened, I reloaded back to before I left for the island and skipped the whole thing.

Tresset said:

@BelgarathMTH you do realize that is a bug, right?

It would be good to have a known bug list posted somewhere and this was on it.

Sharguild

I LOVE the Werewolf Isle.
I can probably think of a dozen reasons to go (RP wise) but I just really enjoyed the whole story arc of these folk on the isle.
TBH, I find that perhaps my MC is not the best "cure' for the whole affair but that's another matter.

Appreciate the heads-up on the SoD bug though.
I haven't purchased SoD yet so may hold off for a bit.

As for weapons to resolve the "bug", the Bastard sword you get at either the merchants quest in BG city or in a particular house (in UB) should help.
There are other weapons as well (Durlags Tower) that work on GWWs.

m2c

MacHurto

@Sharguild can you share some? :-)

Sharguild

Spoiler:







- "Flame Tongue" for one.
- "Staff of Striking" for another.

edit - possibly "Worlds Edge" (+3 - 2H Sword) but I have not verified that.

Mush_Mush

Wands of frost & paralyzation are pretty effective....against almost everything in the game for that matter...especially doom guards.

MacHurto

@Sharguild sure, but you don't know they are there :-)

@Mush_Mush I hate doom guards. I skip them as much as I can. Same as with the rogues' maze

Metal_Hurlant

The major problem I found is I left Durlag's Tower for later and tried to do the Werewolf Island first and wasn't geared to go against Greater Wolfwere's at the start. Having that Greater Wolfwere at the beginning of the North Island Map and it's regenerating faster than I could do damage to it was just insane.

I'm sure there's something wrong with the regeneration because I could only get it down one bar and then it would go back to full health.

Also, the Bastard Sword +1, +3 against Shapeshifters wasn't in the house at Ulgoth's Beard. Where the hell did it go?

Zilber

Metal_Hurlant said:

The major problem I found is I left Durlag's Tower for later and tried to do the Werewolf Island first and wasn't geared to go against Greater Wolfwere's at the start. Having that Greater Wolfwere at the beginning of the North Island Map and it's regenerating faster than I could do damage to it was just insane.

I'm sure there's something wrong with the regeneration because I could only get it down one bar and then it would go back to full health.

Also, the Bastard Sword +1, +3 against Shapeshifters wasn't in the house at Ulgoth's Beard. Where the hell did it go?

Well, there's another in cloakwood. My CHARNAME did fine on my own with Albruin and the silver dagger, but that was kinda buffed (werebane amulet, gauntlets of weapon expertise, AC somewhere in the -10's, potion of heroism, str/dex/con 25 (due to draw upon holy might), hasted, prot from evil, bless, chant, aid, and a few more buffs I can't remember).

I do find it odd there's one dagger, one sword and three (or four, depending on patch) bastard swords that can harm them. This seems a bit lopsided, a silver mace, morning star or staff would have been more interesting.

BelgarathMTH

Mush_Mush said:

Wands of frost & paralyzation are pretty effective....against almost everything in the game for that matter...especially doom guards.

Wand of paralyzation doesn't work on greater wolfweres any more. It says "Unaffected by effects from wand", and they don't even roll a save. Unless that's what it says when a save is made without being shown. Are wand saving throws not shown in the EE's, or is that message telling you the wand will never work, which is how I interpreted it?

Mush_Mush

That's normally what it says when you have a dodgy wand, I had a wand of missles that said that every time I used it. I'm "fairly" certain WoP still works...I'll have to test it again.

Seldar

The werewolf Island is my favorite part of the game. Ok in fact I HATE werewolves, but it's the story about the island and the inhabitants present here that I really enjoy. Meeting that mad mage Dradeel, by Torm, he was a friend of Balduran ! And then exploring that forgotten ship, I remember that lovely little video when you find it.

SirBatince

The lack of worthwhile items is outrageous. Only the necklace is worth keeping. I kept it for SoD before my first playthrough. I felt really smart and smug when I got the opportunity to use it again.

JuliusBorisov

One should always distinguish bugs from features.

BelgarathMTH said:

Mush_Mush said:

Wands of frost & paralyzation are pretty effective....against almost everything in the game for that matter...especially doom guards.

Wand of paralyzation doesn't work on greater wolfweres any more. It says "Unaffected by effects from wand", and they don't even roll a save. Unless that's what it says when a save is made without being shown. Are wand saving throws not shown in the EE's, or is that message telling you the wand will never work, which is how I interpreted it?

The wands problem looks like another bug, reported on Redmine. Right, @Tresset ?

jtth

Is there a way, say, for a cleric to solo kill a wolfwere? Or does it have to use one of the silver weapons? I'm unclear.

Mush_Mush

jtth said:

Is there a way, say, for a cleric to solo kill a wolfwere? Or does it have to use one of the silver weapons? I'm unclear.

Any basic wolfwere? yes, a Greater/Karoug?...probly not.

Wand of Heavens works but whether that alone would overcome his regen I'm not sure havnt tried it. Also I believe he has some fire resistance so the wand's damage would be reduced. Coupled with his immunity to I think every weapon a cleric can weild it's highly unlikely.

Grum

It's best to do it right after you get framed for murder. Leave for two months while the heat died down.

Tresset

bengoshi said:

One should always distinguish bugs from features.

BelgarathMTH said:

Mush_Mush said:

Wands of frost & paralyzation are pretty effective....against almost everything in the game for that matter...especially doom guards.

Wand of paralyzation doesn't work on greater wolfweres any more. It says "Unaffected by effects from wand", and they don't even roll a save. Unless that's what it says when a save is made without being shown. Are wand saving throws not shown in the EE's, or is that message telling you the wand will never work, which is how I interpreted it?

The wands problem looks like another bug, reported on Redmine. Right, @Tresset ?

@bengoshi That sounds like a mod to me...

dac0152

Grum said:

It's best to do it right after you get framed for murder. Leave for two months while the heat died down.

This is what I always do. Travel to Ulgoth's Beard after Candlekeep for a small vacation and do Durlag's Tower and the Island while laying low. Fits pretty well with the leveling too.