Mizhena, Social Justice and why we can't have nice things
Buttercheese
Member Posts: 3,766
The topic of Mizhena came back up lately. I too have been thinking about it a lot the past few weeks, I even had a loooong post prepared, but then I chickened out of posting it, because I was too scared of the repercussions. So here is me finally speaking up, openly and honestly.
Please note that the following words are not just strictly about Mizhena, but more about my thoughts and feelings towards the general topic of social justice in the media. My words will be harsh and for some of you they will most certainly be hurtful. A good chunk of you are probably gonna disagree. I am also gonna repeat a bunch of points other people already made, for sake of completion.
Mizhena - as a character - was both a huge failure and a small success.
A lot of people have been going on about how disliking Mizhena automatically makes you a transphobe, but honestly, assuming that makes you ignorant and short sighted. Yes, some of the Mizhena haters most certainly are transphobic, however, I would like to believe that those are just a small - alas vocal - minority.
Wizards of the Coast and Ed Greenwood themselves have come out saying that D&D and the Forgotten Realms have always included transgender characters.
Let me call out bullshit on that statement.
Sure, we had Corellon Larethian and co. for the longest time, but the beauty of Dungeons and Dragons is, that it’s what the players want it to be. For some players it’s orthodox dragon hunting and dungeon crawling. For some it’s a Game of Thrones inspired hellhole. For some it’s a world of rainbows, bunnies and sunshine. For some it’s the place where they can be who and whatever they want. The list goes on and on.
I am dead sure that for a good chunk - if not the vast majority - of players, transgender characters never made an appearance in their games and even if, just as fuels for jokes. Until the very recent years and months, most players didn’t even know what modern, “american” transgenderism is after all (myself included).
Which brings me to my next point: The associated implications.
The problem isn’t and has never been the fact that Mizhena is a trans-woman.
The problem is what people associate with the topic of transgenderism.
A lot of us non-left-extremists had our fair share of not so pleasant run-ins with self-proclaimed “Social Justice Warriors”, most of which ended badly. I myself became target of a witch hunt on Tumblr a few years back, where I openly called out a bunch of people who said that all non-trans people should die. Literally and repeatedly. A few years ago, Tumblr was FULL of posts like these and they usually were widely celebrated.
After openly disagreeing with a statement like this, people lost their proverbial shit. A flood of hatemails came in. People telling me to kill myself, people telling me to leave the fandom, people telling me to delete my account, people telling me that they were disappointed, people calling me a Nazi over and over again, especially after they found out that I am German.
I mean, f*** me for not wanting the vast majority of humanity dead, right?
The entire situation escalated so badly, that people started spreading lies about me (for example, I allegedly tried to break up two “fandom famous” people who were in a relationship [spoiler: I didn’t]) and started harassing my friends. One of them even started to physically harm themself because of it.
That was when I ought the person who “lead” this witch hunt to sit down with me and have a talk in private. It ended with me making a long, public post apologizing for my “mislead believes” and stating that I had been wrong all along, yada yada.
I was literally bullied into openly betraying my morals and my believes.
By self-proclaimed Social Justice Warriors.
The very same people btw where actively and systematically bullying other artists off the website who did not openly supported their agenda, effectively censoring art and free speech.
So you should be able to understand why I am a tiny bit squeamish about social justice as a whole.
Cases like these are not the exception. They happen all the bloody time.
Remember Feminist Frequency and Anita Sarkeesian? Yeah.
Of course people are gonna have a negative reaction towards a character like Mizhena, especially in a game series that previously treated transgenderism as a joke. Edwin’s Nether Scroll quest, anyone? And the girdle of masculinity-femininity is a tool for literally punishing players for not identifying magical items.
Baldur’s Gate is a game that treats sexchange as a punishment.
And you don’t think that Mizhena might seem a tad bit out of place as a result? No?
Even a lot of transgendered people and even self-proclaimed SJWs didn’t like her.
Arguments like her being nothing more than a token, her being just a tool to make the team look progressive were made. Even going so far that it incidentally “put a giant target sign” on the backs of transgendered people.
Alright, to my next point. This is not a black and white issue.
It’s not “SJWs vs. GamerGaters”.
There are as many different views and reactions as there are players.
And if you believe that not agreeing with one side of the argument makes you automatically part of the other, then you my friend are an idiot. Plain as that.
The entire issue is as colourful as all of the LGBTQ+ pride flags combined.
I know for a fact that the majority of players don’t even really care that Mizhena was included. Some of us were initially put off when meeting her but moved on with a shrug. Some of us were genuinely happy. Some of us couldn’t care less. Some of us didn’t even find out that Mizhena is trans. But all of us - within the active community at least - had to witness this ugly gross mess of a shitstorm that took over the forums and the social media.
Baldur’s Gate is an old game. Baldur’s Gate is a traditional game. In fact, it prides itself on how traditional it is and the fact that it’s so traditional is the main selling point for most players today.
This game was around before social issues like transgenderism were openly discussed in the media. So of course the entire topic is bound to be alien and/or off-putting to a really good chunk of the players. Especially those of us who are not from North America.
This might come as a shock to some of you, but Baldur’s Gate has fans all over the world, not just in the US of A and Canada. And even more shockingly, the rest of the world only rarely shares the same issues as North America. North America is not the hub the world.
And if you are going to argue that Baldur’s Gate and D&D are games from North America, then I have to remind you that these games are almost entirely based in foreign folklore, culture, history, religion, mythology and literature.
Just to make this clear, I am not saying that there are no transgendered people in the rest of the world, that is of course far from the truth. But each country and culture, treats the topic differently. For example where I come from, we don’t even have a word for “Gender” in our language. The entire concept of gender is either completely arbitrary or solely rooted in sexist stereotypes. Transgenderism is almost exclusively about wanting a physical sexchange to some degree and the majority of people “live at let live”. “It’s your body, do with it what you want.” I have heard of no laws that forbid you to get a sexchange and to change your name and official gender accordingly. At least judging from what I’ve seen.
And in different countries it’s gonna be different again.
To me as a foreigner, the entire topic looks insanely american-centric. And boy, am I sick and tired of how american-centric international media is.
Next point. Beamdog, you guys handled this entire drama horribly. I love you and I support you but the way everything went down after release was terrible. You openly asked for better reviews? That was so unbelievably weak of you. You closed every thread on the forums that handled the topic? No wonder that there were a billion threads at all times. People wanted to talk about the topic and not all of them are the “evil GGlers”. You simply should have merged all those threads into one and only removed/ altered the specific posts that broke the rules. You openly engaged in the drama on Twitter, even tried to get f***cking Feminist Frequency to get in on it??? I literally cried after I saw that. You guys literally made me cry.
I am so so disappointed that you guys didn’t show the farsight and delicacy that hot button topics like transgenderism need and deserve. The term “unprofessional” doesn’t even begin to cover it.
If I wouldn’t know better, I’d say everything was an elaborate marketing stunt to make the news. Every publicity is good publicity, am I rite? (Sarcasm)
Now let’s get to the only thing that should have mattered. Mizhena’s character and dialogue.
She is not well written. No matter how I look at her.
First of all, the name thing? How/ why would Charname notice that she has a weird name? Everyone in this world has a weird name. That is just how this genre works. She doesn’t even have the weirdest name in Siege of Dragonspear, that award goes to Fenster (german for “window”).
Second, the part about Mizhena just straight up telling you that she is trans. In reality a lot of transgendered people are very closeted about it. A lot of them don’t like to talk about it. I certainly have never talked to anyone who just openly told a complete stranger without reservations. It would have been so much better if some other character would have pointed it out or if the reveal would have been later in the game.
Like, okay, here are some ideas. I am not saying these ideas are good ideas, but they are definitely better ideas than what we got. Maybe she could have gotten a letter from home, where one of her loved ones brings up the topic one way or another. Maybe she could have been wearing the girdle of masculinity/ femininity and Charname could have picked up on that. Maybe (if she is not physically transitioned/ doesn’t look traditionally feminine) another NPC could have misgendered her and she could have shown her disdain for that.
I mean, Mizhena did get some good moments. I really cracked up when she loses her shit during the thief guild quest. I also thought it was clever to incorporate her in the Talos shrine quest (my favourite quest in SoD, btw).
Anyway, the problem is, that Mizhena’s lack of quality writing just ads up to the perceived tokenism.
I am still upset that Mizhena was the cause for such disproportionate drama, especially about all the personal attacks Amber had (and probably still has) to go through.
But for all the bad things that happened, there also was one good thing. The massive uproar lead to just as massive transvisibility. People started talking about the topic. People started to become more aware. It’s a small win, but a win non the less.
Either way, I am looking forward to see what the team is gonna do with the promised update on Mizhena’s character. I am also really glad that David Gaider is on board now, because he has proven time and time again that he knows how to write delicate topics like these (thank you for Krem and Dorian. Seriously, thank you.)
To wrap things up, here are two videos I’d like you to watch.
Rantasmo’s take on Mizhena (I don’t agree a 100%, but he brings up some very good points) and the Nostalgia Critic’s Ghostbusters 2016 review (different topic, equal situation).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-r51IZ2qiq4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORS3CqPTgDg
Thank you all very much for reading and your time.
Please note that the following words are not just strictly about Mizhena, but more about my thoughts and feelings towards the general topic of social justice in the media. My words will be harsh and for some of you they will most certainly be hurtful. A good chunk of you are probably gonna disagree. I am also gonna repeat a bunch of points other people already made, for sake of completion.
Mizhena - as a character - was both a huge failure and a small success.
A lot of people have been going on about how disliking Mizhena automatically makes you a transphobe, but honestly, assuming that makes you ignorant and short sighted. Yes, some of the Mizhena haters most certainly are transphobic, however, I would like to believe that those are just a small - alas vocal - minority.
Wizards of the Coast and Ed Greenwood themselves have come out saying that D&D and the Forgotten Realms have always included transgender characters.
Let me call out bullshit on that statement.
Sure, we had Corellon Larethian and co. for the longest time, but the beauty of Dungeons and Dragons is, that it’s what the players want it to be. For some players it’s orthodox dragon hunting and dungeon crawling. For some it’s a Game of Thrones inspired hellhole. For some it’s a world of rainbows, bunnies and sunshine. For some it’s the place where they can be who and whatever they want. The list goes on and on.
I am dead sure that for a good chunk - if not the vast majority - of players, transgender characters never made an appearance in their games and even if, just as fuels for jokes. Until the very recent years and months, most players didn’t even know what modern, “american” transgenderism is after all (myself included).
Which brings me to my next point: The associated implications.
The problem isn’t and has never been the fact that Mizhena is a trans-woman.
The problem is what people associate with the topic of transgenderism.
A lot of us non-left-extremists had our fair share of not so pleasant run-ins with self-proclaimed “Social Justice Warriors”, most of which ended badly. I myself became target of a witch hunt on Tumblr a few years back, where I openly called out a bunch of people who said that all non-trans people should die. Literally and repeatedly. A few years ago, Tumblr was FULL of posts like these and they usually were widely celebrated.
After openly disagreeing with a statement like this, people lost their proverbial shit. A flood of hatemails came in. People telling me to kill myself, people telling me to leave the fandom, people telling me to delete my account, people telling me that they were disappointed, people calling me a Nazi over and over again, especially after they found out that I am German.
I mean, f*** me for not wanting the vast majority of humanity dead, right?
The entire situation escalated so badly, that people started spreading lies about me (for example, I allegedly tried to break up two “fandom famous” people who were in a relationship [spoiler: I didn’t]) and started harassing my friends. One of them even started to physically harm themself because of it.
That was when I ought the person who “lead” this witch hunt to sit down with me and have a talk in private. It ended with me making a long, public post apologizing for my “mislead believes” and stating that I had been wrong all along, yada yada.
I was literally bullied into openly betraying my morals and my believes.
By self-proclaimed Social Justice Warriors.
The very same people btw where actively and systematically bullying other artists off the website who did not openly supported their agenda, effectively censoring art and free speech.
So you should be able to understand why I am a tiny bit squeamish about social justice as a whole.
Cases like these are not the exception. They happen all the bloody time.
Remember Feminist Frequency and Anita Sarkeesian? Yeah.
Of course people are gonna have a negative reaction towards a character like Mizhena, especially in a game series that previously treated transgenderism as a joke. Edwin’s Nether Scroll quest, anyone? And the girdle of masculinity-femininity is a tool for literally punishing players for not identifying magical items.
Baldur’s Gate is a game that treats sexchange as a punishment.
And you don’t think that Mizhena might seem a tad bit out of place as a result? No?
Even a lot of transgendered people and even self-proclaimed SJWs didn’t like her.
Arguments like her being nothing more than a token, her being just a tool to make the team look progressive were made. Even going so far that it incidentally “put a giant target sign” on the backs of transgendered people.
Alright, to my next point. This is not a black and white issue.
It’s not “SJWs vs. GamerGaters”.
There are as many different views and reactions as there are players.
And if you believe that not agreeing with one side of the argument makes you automatically part of the other, then you my friend are an idiot. Plain as that.
The entire issue is as colourful as all of the LGBTQ+ pride flags combined.
I know for a fact that the majority of players don’t even really care that Mizhena was included. Some of us were initially put off when meeting her but moved on with a shrug. Some of us were genuinely happy. Some of us couldn’t care less. Some of us didn’t even find out that Mizhena is trans. But all of us - within the active community at least - had to witness this ugly gross mess of a shitstorm that took over the forums and the social media.
Baldur’s Gate is an old game. Baldur’s Gate is a traditional game. In fact, it prides itself on how traditional it is and the fact that it’s so traditional is the main selling point for most players today.
This game was around before social issues like transgenderism were openly discussed in the media. So of course the entire topic is bound to be alien and/or off-putting to a really good chunk of the players. Especially those of us who are not from North America.
This might come as a shock to some of you, but Baldur’s Gate has fans all over the world, not just in the US of A and Canada. And even more shockingly, the rest of the world only rarely shares the same issues as North America. North America is not the hub the world.
And if you are going to argue that Baldur’s Gate and D&D are games from North America, then I have to remind you that these games are almost entirely based in foreign folklore, culture, history, religion, mythology and literature.
Just to make this clear, I am not saying that there are no transgendered people in the rest of the world, that is of course far from the truth. But each country and culture, treats the topic differently. For example where I come from, we don’t even have a word for “Gender” in our language. The entire concept of gender is either completely arbitrary or solely rooted in sexist stereotypes. Transgenderism is almost exclusively about wanting a physical sexchange to some degree and the majority of people “live at let live”. “It’s your body, do with it what you want.” I have heard of no laws that forbid you to get a sexchange and to change your name and official gender accordingly. At least judging from what I’ve seen.
And in different countries it’s gonna be different again.
To me as a foreigner, the entire topic looks insanely american-centric. And boy, am I sick and tired of how american-centric international media is.
Next point. Beamdog, you guys handled this entire drama horribly. I love you and I support you but the way everything went down after release was terrible. You openly asked for better reviews? That was so unbelievably weak of you. You closed every thread on the forums that handled the topic? No wonder that there were a billion threads at all times. People wanted to talk about the topic and not all of them are the “evil GGlers”. You simply should have merged all those threads into one and only removed/ altered the specific posts that broke the rules. You openly engaged in the drama on Twitter, even tried to get f***cking Feminist Frequency to get in on it??? I literally cried after I saw that. You guys literally made me cry.
I am so so disappointed that you guys didn’t show the farsight and delicacy that hot button topics like transgenderism need and deserve. The term “unprofessional” doesn’t even begin to cover it.
If I wouldn’t know better, I’d say everything was an elaborate marketing stunt to make the news. Every publicity is good publicity, am I rite? (Sarcasm)
Now let’s get to the only thing that should have mattered. Mizhena’s character and dialogue.
She is not well written. No matter how I look at her.
First of all, the name thing? How/ why would Charname notice that she has a weird name? Everyone in this world has a weird name. That is just how this genre works. She doesn’t even have the weirdest name in Siege of Dragonspear, that award goes to Fenster (german for “window”).
Second, the part about Mizhena just straight up telling you that she is trans. In reality a lot of transgendered people are very closeted about it. A lot of them don’t like to talk about it. I certainly have never talked to anyone who just openly told a complete stranger without reservations. It would have been so much better if some other character would have pointed it out or if the reveal would have been later in the game.
Like, okay, here are some ideas. I am not saying these ideas are good ideas, but they are definitely better ideas than what we got. Maybe she could have gotten a letter from home, where one of her loved ones brings up the topic one way or another. Maybe she could have been wearing the girdle of masculinity/ femininity and Charname could have picked up on that. Maybe (if she is not physically transitioned/ doesn’t look traditionally feminine) another NPC could have misgendered her and she could have shown her disdain for that.
I mean, Mizhena did get some good moments. I really cracked up when she loses her shit during the thief guild quest. I also thought it was clever to incorporate her in the Talos shrine quest (my favourite quest in SoD, btw).
Anyway, the problem is, that Mizhena’s lack of quality writing just ads up to the perceived tokenism.
I am still upset that Mizhena was the cause for such disproportionate drama, especially about all the personal attacks Amber had (and probably still has) to go through.
But for all the bad things that happened, there also was one good thing. The massive uproar lead to just as massive transvisibility. People started talking about the topic. People started to become more aware. It’s a small win, but a win non the less.
Either way, I am looking forward to see what the team is gonna do with the promised update on Mizhena’s character. I am also really glad that David Gaider is on board now, because he has proven time and time again that he knows how to write delicate topics like these (thank you for Krem and Dorian. Seriously, thank you.)
To wrap things up, here are two videos I’d like you to watch.
Rantasmo’s take on Mizhena (I don’t agree a 100%, but he brings up some very good points) and the Nostalgia Critic’s Ghostbusters 2016 review (different topic, equal situation).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-r51IZ2qiq4https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORS3CqPTgDgThank you all very much for reading and your time.
22
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
If anyone wants to have a SJW discussion or have any of their non-sense slapped around their face/ears/whatever they can do that in a forum or on youtube or wherever; but since when have PC games (fantasy games in particular) become a medium for delivering socio-political ideas, especially when it is done in such a blunt and in-your-face sort of manner ?
Bad idea, BeamDog, bad idea indeed!
Also, please define what you mean by "non-sense". There is nothing wrong about including these themes in the game. Just this particularly way it was done is bad.
PS: Differnet social justice themes have btw always been a topic in the games. Racism and classcism probably being the most prominent ones.
I love the Nostlagia Critic and I'll be sure to watch the video.
By the way, is it only me or does Imoen's SoD portrait looks a bit like Anita Sarkeesian?
Like Rantasmo said in another video (don't ask me which ...), this stuff is not happening in a vacuum. People are jumpy about the topic, now more than ever.
That is especially true, because she doesn't have a lot of other stuff going for her.
I mean, it sucks that it is that way, but that doesn't change that truth.
My condolences, @Buttercheese. Nobody should have to deal with that.
Ah, thank you. I didn't try to get condolences though, I am just using this anecdote to hammer home my point that calling oneself a SJW does not make one free of fault.
Extremism is bad. Judging people based on their labels is bad.
Gender, skin colour, nationality, sexual orientation, etc.: All these things have nothing to do with one's quality of character.
Calling someone else a bigot doesn't mean oneself cannot be a bigot themself.
Personally I don't have problem with Mizhena. I neither like nor dislike her. And I can agree that the writing associated with her is not very good. Granted, you have to pry about her name for her to tell about her... "issue", but still I think she's too open about it. That kind of openess towards complete stranger is psychotic But you know, what's also psychotic?
- Immediately asking total strangers you met in the woods to help you in wyvern hunt (even if none of said strangers look trustworthy and reputation of said strangers are that of a villain) - (Coran)
- Immediately asking total strangers you met in the woods (again) to help you in getting to Grand Duke's daughter (again, no matter who's among the group) - (Eldoth)
- Immediately asking total strangers you met to kill the witch without any good reason besides "just because" (even if there are lawful and good characters in the group, and also said witch's protector) (Edwin)
- Immediately asking total strangers in the middle of some wilderness to help you find the reasure nearby (Safana)
All are examples of psychic, or unrealistic at best, behaviour. The difference between above examples and Mizhena? You have to literally question Mizhena for her to tell you anyting. The "classic" Baldur's Gate character ain't having time for that. So, classic characters are as "badly written" as Mizhena at best, if not straight up worse. So, I have my doubts about the quality of the writing being the issue or reason for the drama and shitstorm that followed release of SoD.
In my opinion, people are actively seeking things to be offended by, especially on the internet. If you mix that with the fact that majority of population seem unable to rate recieved stimuli in constructive way and being able to express only polarizing opinions (I like/I hate instead of "I like it, but I also think it has some bad things about it" or "I hate it, but I can also notice some good qualities about it") then you'll have answer as to why people are so prone to creating pointless shitstorms and dramas, despite the fact neither does the topic any justice.
The facts about Mizhena are as following: she's a minor NPC that doesn't affect the game in any significant way. You can literally beat the entire expansion without learning about her being trans person. And she's also in the game (according to Amber Scott) because variety of NPCs would make an more interesting game overall. The fact that she feels undeveloped is rather because she's minor NPC (this one is according to Trent Oster, but I might be mistaken). No LGBT agenda here. Personally, I was more dissapointed by some other aspects of writing, some of which actually breaking the immersion.
I don't have to say this, but I'll state it anyway, just to leave no doubts. It doesn't matter to me, SJWs, feminatzis, transphobes, homophobes or regressive cavemen. They are all as bad to me, the only difference is that they are on opposite camps. And I don't believe that the discussions and dramas those people create can be constructive in any way. Because when you want to have a discussion and achieve something, you should listen to other side as well, and these people aren't going to do that. They are also prone to label you as their opposition if you don't agree with them and insult you.
Modern ideology and agendas introduced into new modern games is one thing, I have no problem with that. If introduced in a thoughtful and sensitive manner, they can make us all think and grow. High jacking this old classic to further new political views and agendas is an entirely different thing.
To me, whether you agree or disagree with any of the issues involved, isn’t the point.
This video made by Liana K concerning Minsc being used as a pawn in these controversies, is one example of how strongly many people feel about the decision of some of the developers to use these beloved characters to promote their own personal beliefs. Other people had similar feelings about some of the other characters who were “upgraded”.
There is a big difference between enhancing something, and changing it to suit you and your own views. This dearly loved, classic game, should never have been dragged into any of these modern controversies.
It wasn’t the messages that were wrong, it was the platform they used.
In fact, an unwelcomed sex change would upset almost anyone, including transgendered people. You could say that transgendered people were essentially born or raised with that girdle and they want to remove it, in the metaphorical sense.
Though one could argue that the other ones aren't particularly good examples of writing either. That's the problem with wordcount regulation and not fleshing out characters. Also, the writers learned their lessons by the time of BG2. I mean, there are probably some examples of this as well, but far fewer ones. I can't think of any at the top of my head.
Pretty much, yeah.
My personal theory is, that too many people are using topics like these to vent their anger about comepletely different topics. A few months ago an old friend of mine suddenly started ranting about their hate for muslims completely out of nowhere. After I verbally ripped them a new one and they had calmed down, I started prying for the real issue. Which - as suspected - where family problems.
Also, remember the SJWs I mentioned above? Yeah, the main person behind that was a college dropout who was kicked out by their family.
That's why I don't openly engage in dramas like these anymore. Because the people involved are usually so driven by emotion, that they are not able to have logical arguments about it anymore.
Well, yeah. Because time had to pass so that people can calm down. I am not here to to take a stance for or against Mizhena, I am here to paint the bigger picture of exactly what went wrong and to give a new perspective. I too don't care enough about Mizhena as a character, but aparently everyone else does enough to blow up the forums, twitter, tumblr and whatnot. That is my issue.
And really, Beamdog should have kept that in mind. Especially after the Hexxat drama. It was clear for a while now - at least to me - that the audience of BG is aaaall over the spectrum of political views and social and cultural backgrounds. So using BG as a tool for very specific social/ political agendas (like with Minsc) is just stupid. Of course there will be an outrage. Like, why is Gamergate called Gamergate? Because they are all gamers.
Also, I especially saw on Tumblr people going on about how people who don't like Mizhena are not "real gamers". What is the logic behind this? Are you only allowed to play video games if you have specific political views? What?
This entire mess is rooted in and fueled by little more than stupidity and overemotionalness.
And in the end the team and the community had to pay for that.
Part of why we "can't have nice things" is because people will create half-hour diatribes protesting a line of easter egg dialogue in a wizards and dragons video game.
Oh yes, how dare she express her feelings! They couldn't possibly have any validity. After all, they don’t agree with your own feelings on the matter. Everyone who was not happy should just keep their mouth shut.
It’s so easy to dismiss anyone who wasn’t happy with all the choices that were made as haters or winners. This woman expressed no hate. You may not agree with how she felt about it, but that in no way makes what she had to say, or how she said it, a diatribe.
Unlike your remark about her, there was nothing bitter or abusive in what she said.
Well, I didn't perceive it this way until all this drama went down either (still don't really), I just find it noteworthy that aparently nobody is making a connection here. And yes, transgenderism and sex changes are not the same thing, you can't deny though that they are connected. Especially in this context where people like to connect everything with everything.
Either way, it's just a small thing I wanted to point out.
@Glam_Vrock & @Ravenslight
People can talk about what they want for how long they want.
The real reason why we cannot have nice things is that too many people got unnecesarrily hostile over this instead of speaking their minds like the adults they claim to be. You saw all the personal hate Amber Scott received. No matter how good or bad Mizhena is written, nobody deserves treatment like that.
After reading your comment, I decided to give it a chance. 15 minutes in, she told me she hasn't played the game, then went off on a tangent about Sherlock, a show I've never seen, and my only takeaway about the issue she claims to be addressing is that she really super likes Minsc a lot, so it annoyed her when they made him say the thing.
This doesn't mean anything. Sometimes people get too invested in their favourite whatever and blow things out of proportion. Neither Beamdog nor anyone else should have to tread on eggshells to appease them. You love the original games. Great. They're still there. Nothing's changed. Go play 'em.
That's like when politicians start blaming video games for real world violence.
If she had, for example, given me some insight as to what struggles or challenges she had faced in her journey to self discovery. I think there is an opportunity for a really interesting character there. One I as a player would have liked the opportunity to interact with.
But then that’s just me. I also understand that there are many people from all over the world that play Baldur’s Gate. From all different kinds of backgrounds and cultures. Such characters aren’t going to appeal to everyone. And, as Buttercheese pointed out, this is a hot button topic for many people. It’s a subject that needs to be handled with care and sensitivity, if it is going to be included in any game.
As it is, I wish she hadn’t been included at all as it has just contributed to all this controversy surrounding the game. And like you Buttercheese, it makes me want to cry.
We are all products of our own individual cultures and upbringing. Not every person is just a “hater” because they don’t hold the same values as ourselves.
Some of the divide over this can almost directly be attributed to popular forums around the web refusing to allow discussion of the topic or handing out immediate bans for disagreeing with the stated position of the moderators
I don't think the controversy should discourage people from this.
Not every game needs to have a trans character in it, and certainly not purely for the sake of diversity and representation.
However, I would say that beamdog have a point to prove on this issue, and should strongly consider creating an interesting and relevant trans character in their next project, that addresses some of the criticisms levelled at Mizhena
D&D and transgender.
In the last post that @Dee closed, I posted a quote in the newest Dungeons & Dragons Players handbook regarding gender and how it is inclusive for all non binary gender types. The book even lists examples of how these could be played out (my favourite being a female dwarf with a beard always getting offended when she is called by masculine pronoun).
Official licenced products (which SoD is) needs to follow this and IMO, encourage it, to let players know these types of players are acceptable in all D&D licenced worlds.
The argument regarding "this isn't how a transgender acts when confronted by strangers" also annoys me. As everyone likes to point out, this is fantasy. How people react in Forgotten Realms is different than how people act in the real world. If transgender people are accepted without question on Toril, then they would be more inclined to be open with what they are, because it isn't a big deal.
Mizhena's Writing
With that said, how this character was introduced, and the lines she was given were poorly implemented. Not everyone has read, or even cares, about 5e Handbook and what it says. So it needed to be established, in game on how the world reacts to transgender characters. DA:I did this nicely with Krem having the PC casually mention it (later after he had been introduced) and having another character (Iron Bull) explain how Krem was accepted in Qun culture.
Something like this should have been introduced in SoD (or prior EE releases) to establish this as canon on the world of Toril. There would be less of a backlash on how Mizhena responded to the PC if how she portrayed herself was already normal in society. It wasn't, so it left the door open to argument on how a transgrender character is accepted in the world, going back to the player's own head canon (like Buttercheese called BS on) instead of licenced canon.
Her voice acting also was poorly done in this situation. Here we have a cleric is who loud, rude and boastful when she is speaking about anything except for changing her name. Her voice changes into a softer tone, explaining causually her childhood and her previous name not being suitable for her. The change in character when she delivers this line fuels the "token" snd "SWJ" rhetoric instead of silencing it.
The answer to the question also didn't make sense. The PC asks about her name and where it comes from and gets an answer that has nothing to do with the question. I also think this conversation should have had another hidden level to it, either having the character to perform a lore or intelligence check to have the option to ask about her name. Something like:
"I can't place what dialect a name like Mizhena comes from. How did your parents name you?"
I named myself, Mizhena is derived from three words that best describe who I am. "Miz" [explain Miz], 'hen'[explain hen], and "a"[explain A].
This would then give the PC an option to be rude about the name (what a stupid name or what not), or ask why it needed to be changed (allowing the already written dialog to be said).
This has more to do with the restrictions placed on the writers though than on the dialog itself. The three node limit restricts the creativity the writers can create the characters and the world in which the player interacts giving the game less depth than what it should have. This lack of depth and the immersion that comes with it held back this character.
Beamdog's Reaction
This is where I disagree with you. I think beamdog handled the situation extremely well, except for Dee's attempt to bring "SWJ" into the argument through twitter.
The moderators did a good job of streamlining the discussion into 2 or 3 different discussions. Repeitive topics were closed (as they should have been. Add to the conversation going on, do not attempt to start another one) and people who were trolling, or breaking site rules, were being dealt with quickly.
Imagine if there was a Bengoshi that you could have went to @Buttercheese in your run in with those SWJ crap? Do you think if that fandom was moderated the same way this site is, it would have escalated as far? That is what the moderators did here. Discussion on the topic here was welcome, as long as it stayed civil and constructive and didn't break the site rules (rarely did that happen though, hence the mass closing of threads).
I also find it extremely hypocritical for a side that is flooding sites with fake reviews to take offense from a developer asking people who have actually played the game to consider writing a review for it. What Trent said was twisted and taken out of context and used by a vocal minority to attempt to demonize the company more.
I also didn't like the removal of Minscs hidden line. I think a company needs to stand behind its product and not bend to outside pressure. If Trent thought the line shouldn't have been in the game, he should have nixed it before release. Lesson's learned though, right?
Transgender and Politcs
Before this uproar, I had never heard of gamergate or Social Justice Warriors, nor did I care too. Anytime someone mentions one of these two terms in their first line, I skip the post. Anything you have to say is meaningless if you boil your argument down to an acroymn.
I personally believe all consumable media needs to as inclusive as possible. No one chooses how they are born so they shouldn't have to be judged by it. A transgender person isn't a political statement. They are a human being, like everyone else.
Whenever I hear someone say "I don't want this political crap in my games" I cringe. Because it isn't a political statement. People are just using the word politics to hide behind bigotry and exclusion.
TL;DR So much for bullet points eh?
First off, according to google (which interestingly enough, "what % of the population is..." automatically autofills transgender as it's #1 pick)....0.3% of the world's population is transgender. That's a tiny, tiny, super tiny fraction. But it still exists, so in my opinion, it was only a matter of time until a video game introduced a trans character. How many sci-fi fantasy movies and shows have already? I have no idea, but I know the number isn't 0
So it happened, it is inevitable, because even for such a tiny % of humans, eventually one is going to be a programmer or writer interested in transgenderism in a video game. Did you know there are Japanese simulator games where you as a human can date pigeons in highschool? There's ones where you can do surgical operations on Elsa from Frozen's zombie baby to make it look less undead? Video games are like porn, in that, there is eventually going to be a video game for everything that you can be or do or think of
The backlash should have been anticipated. That 30min video that someone posted was BORING as all get out. I'm sorry, I think that someone else touched on that. I'm sure the person meant well but that could have easily been trimmed to like 5min or less. I think Beamdog's reaction to the controversy (having just read/skimmed it, not witnessed it) sounds understandable, without going much into that
I wouldn't call the introduction forced considering it's a passable line of dialoge from some minor character in some expansion of a game. If the main quest of SoD was to earn enough gold for your main character to undergo a sex-change operation, I would call that "forced"
I'm just sad that that drama happened but also moreso also that I wasn't there to witness it, like I mentioned above, I love controversy (at least online)
--------
Imagine a hockey team called the Dragons. The Dragons have a loyal fanbase and a rich history. They also have never had a black player. (This is hockey, after all.) One day the Dragons come under new management, and they make several personnel moves of varying wisdom. One is that they add a black player, Michael Zhena, to their roster. He is a flawed, mediocre player -- maybe not the worst player on the roster, but far from being the best.
A small minority of fans react with undisguised racist outrage. They throw bananas on the ice, shout racial slurs, and denounce this move as a betrayal of the "heritage" of the Dragons in particular or hockey in general. A larger group of fans are upset that the team ownership didn't spend more to acquire a more talented free agent. There's an overlap between these two groups, and it's sometimes hard to sort out. It's not uncommon for someone to start off complaining about Zhena's shortcomings as a player but, when pushed, end up making some thinly coded comment about "people like him." The concept of tokenism is invoked frequently.
In response, other fans get very defensive about Zhena and the Dragons' new owners. Any time someone starts criticizing either, these fans suspect that racism is the underlying reason. So they reject all criticism of either, even though obviously Zhena isn't very good and obviously it would have been better for ownership to spend more money. Fans start shouting at each other at Dragons games, and sometimes fights break out. Some black fans say that they no longer feel safe at games.
Many fans are just disgusted with the whole scene. They came to watch their favorite team play hockey, not to witness a race riot. They're sick of hearing about this, and they just wish none of this had ever happened. Some think ownership could have avoided all of this by spending much more to hire a really excellent black player, or at least by handling the PR better. Ownership should have known that hiring a black player would anger people and distract from the game, the thinking goes, so they owed it to the fans to either handle it very delicately or not do it at all.
--------
Personally, I think the idea that certain types of people are too "controversial" to be represented -- or to be represented except by "doing it right" -- is deeply misguided.
And yeah, baldur's gate characters often have personality stereotypes, so one that overshares their sexuality I wouldn't consider all that ridiculous, compared to all the ridiculous things characters say in baldur's gate. Xzar and Tiax are borderline crazy and Minsc is kind of dumb. And just about every non-joinable NPC's has hugely exaggerated personality traits, often that will lead you to kill them in self defense quite easily at various points. So a character that just runs up and tells you "I'm gay!" or whatever, doesn't even seem all that farfetched considering the dialog in these games.
In fact, just off the top of my head (having just played BG1) there's spots where characters dialog breaks the 4th wall by saying "Don't click me, I don't want any trouble!", and a spot where a character references a modern day device (can't remember exactly where it was said). So I wouldn't take keeping dialog to rigid D&D setting as gospel for any of these games