In this picture, you have three straight lines on the left, and two on the right... I've marked a little bit of them in green so it's easier to see where I mean.
It's because the separator is a box effectively creating a double border on the left just below the border of the pause box. The three straight-ish lines make it look very busy and for me, is bad...
The right side naturally has a double-border. It's where the border of the text box naturally meets the border of the bottom section - that's good.
However, if you move it to a single line border on the left, as per my quick cut and paste earlier, then you achieve a balance of two straight-ish lines on each side (even though they aren't aligned) and it looks far less busy.
I'm not saying it should be an empty space there - it could be filled with any SOD relevant ornamentation. But straight-ish box lines are not ornamentation they are for separating areas... It could end up looking something like this (Bad cut and paste example time):
Again, I have no horse in this race. But adding a bit of SoD’s own art where you can helps with the overall feel of the screen. Any BG screen should have an organic feel, not a data base feel like you get with all straight angles and matching lines.
There is no SoD-related ornamentation, though. Only dried lava backgrounds, and some statue-like structures at the edges of windows. SoD is very barren.
Here's one where all the lines are double-lines. I think this one works the best so far, because it's consistent:
There is no SoD-related ornamentation, though. Only dried lava backgrounds, and some statue-like structures at the edges of windows. SoD is very barren.
That lava background and statue-like structure is the ornamentation for SOD. It's not the same style as BG1 or BG2 but it's the flavour of SOD.
There is no SoD-related ornamentation, though. Only dried lava backgrounds, and some statue-like structures at the edges of windows. SoD is very barren.
That lava background and statue-like structure is the ornamentation for SOD. It's not the same style as BG1 or BG2 but it's the flavour of SOD.
Well, there is lava background there. It's not very visible, because it's dark, but it has patterns.
Here... I've marked on your BG1 mock up the natural borders (or physical borders).
Note the pause box and then the border underneath it where it meets to the slots... 2 borders on left, 2 borders on right, even though they aren't aligned. Just like my proposal for SOD.
And a direct comparison - note the boundaries are the same from your BG1 mock up and my SOD proposal.
I added a lighter background there, in an attempt to spruce it up a bit. I don't want to add a repeating texture, as I haven't really seen a precedent for something like that in SoD.
Okay so, in my opinion we have enough examples. I'm looking at the IWD inventory now, and it feels like I would be wasting time making another inventory draft that's not going to be used. I'm sure Beamdog can come up with it on their own, using the examples can already provide.
Maybe we should start discussing what to put in that report? If everyone agrees?
I wonder if it might be beneficial to make a report containing what is generally agreed upon at some point, then make supplement requests as they come up?
It just seems that discussions could go on for a very long time, maybe indefinitely, as so many different ideas and likes and dislikes are possible.
I don’t know what the time line is for the developers, but the sooner they start getting some idea of what we want the better, it seems to me. Not to mention that there is still much of the UI to go over, journal, spell screens, etc?
I made an alternate scrollbar-less blueprint for tablets, and for the scenario where the devs can't or don't want to use scroll bars for ground scrolling:
I think it's important to agree as it is one of the biggest frustrations for people - it's listed in the OP as one the challenges we need to find a way to 'make work' - as it stands we have no recommendation for item comparisons other than the discussion we have already have which was hardly conclusive.
I'm out right now but I have a proposal to put forward which I will do within an hour. That way people can comment and we can do a mock up of just the text box to demonstrate what that will look like.
Item Recommendations is the portrait colouring to recommend which character might use the 'picked up' item (yellow) or to show which character cannot use an item (black). This can be toggled on/off as needed but is defaulted to ON.
Item Comparison is the change in text of JUST the text area to indicate whether an equipped Item is better or worse than the currently equipped item. This can be toggled on/off as needed but is defaulted to ON.
Item Comparison example:
When picking up an item, and assuming Item Comparisons is toggled to ON, the above screen appears.
It show the difference to the stats (so how much better or worse) something is for main hand and off hand. The green triangle implies BETTER. The red triangle implies WORSE. If there is no change to a stat then that stat is not shown.
Side note: I would recommend we physically do a few (3 or 4) examples with the pre-made existing characters to demonstrate exactly what we want to see text wise.
EG Equipping a Bastard Sword +1 to Meryll when she has a Dagger in her left hand and a long sword in her right hand would show this...
That way we are making it as explicitly clear what we would like, and should the suggestion be taken onboard there are a few test scenarios to ensure the information displayed is correct.
Item Recommendations is the portrait colouring to recommend which character might use the 'picked up' item (yellow) or to show which character cannot use an item (black). This can be toggled on/off as needed but is defaulted to ON.
Item Comparison is the change in text of JUST the text area to indicate whether an equipped Item is better or worse than the currently equipped item. This can be toggled on/off as needed but is defaulted to ON.
On the SoD draft, regarding the single vs. double border, how about leaving the border single, but put a few spikes on it. That way it looks more like a continuation of the border above the ground slots.
Comments
Let me draw a picture, hang on..
I prefer the BGII art, but that old stone does bring back a warm fuzzy feeling for me.
It's because the separator is a box effectively creating a double border on the left just below the border of the pause box. The three straight-ish lines make it look very busy and for me, is bad...
The right side naturally has a double-border. It's where the border of the text box naturally meets the border of the bottom section - that's good.
However, if you move it to a single line border on the left, as per my quick cut and paste earlier, then you achieve a balance of two straight-ish lines on each side (even though they aren't aligned) and it looks far less busy.
Here's one where all the lines are double-lines. I think this one works the best so far, because it's consistent:
Note the pause box and then the border underneath it where it meets to the slots... 2 borders on left, 2 borders on right, even though they aren't aligned. Just like my proposal for SOD.
And a direct comparison - note the boundaries are the same from your BG1 mock up and my SOD proposal.
Three lines:
Maybe we should start discussing what to put in that report? If everyone agrees?
BG:EE draft:
BG2:EE draft:
SoD draft:
Have we fully decided the format of the optional comparison ?
-2 AC
+2 AC vs slashing
-1 attack per round
Either regular white text or red/green text.
It just seems that discussions could go on for a very long time, maybe indefinitely, as so many different ideas and likes and dislikes are possible.
I don’t know what the time line is for the developers, but the sooner they start getting some idea of what we want the better, it seems to me. Not to mention that there is still much of the UI to go over, journal, spell screens, etc?
I'm out right now but I have a proposal to put forward which I will do within an hour. That way people can comment and we can do a mock up of just the text box to demonstrate what that will look like.
Two toggle options in the settings menu:
Inventory
- Item Recommendations ON/OFF
- Item Comparisons ON/OFF
Item Recommendations is the portrait colouring to recommend which character might use the 'picked up' item (yellow) or to show which character cannot use an item (black). This can be toggled on/off as needed but is defaulted to ON.
Item Comparison is the change in text of JUST the text area to indicate whether an equipped Item is better or worse than the currently equipped item. This can be toggled on/off as needed but is defaulted to ON.
Item Comparison example:
When picking up an item, and assuming Item Comparisons is toggled to ON, the above screen appears.
It show the difference to the stats (so how much better or worse) something is for main hand and off hand. The green triangle implies BETTER. The red triangle implies WORSE. If there is no change to a stat then that stat is not shown.
Side note: I would recommend we physically do a few (3 or 4) examples with the pre-made existing characters to demonstrate exactly what we want to see text wise.
EG Equipping a Bastard Sword +1 to Meryll when she has a Dagger in her left hand and a long sword in her right hand would show this...
That way we are making it as explicitly clear what we would like, and should the suggestion be taken onboard there are a few test scenarios to ensure the information displayed is correct.