Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Categories

Attention, new and old users! Please read the new rules of conduct for the forums, and we hope you enjoy your stay!
Curious about our plan for the next update? Read more about it Here!
Baldur's Gate: Siege of Dragonspear now available on Steam and GOG!
Baldur's Gate: Siege of Dragonspear is out! Order your copy at SiegeOfDragonspear.com!

The Thruth: Druid/shaman Spells Sucks in Baldur's Gate

Hey ppl, sorry for the harsh words here, but they're just blatant truth about the subject. I tried play with a shaman recently and only them i saw how much sad the druid repertory of spells is.

I'm not saying here that all druid spells sucks, but in general, cleric and, of course, arcane spells outmatch druid/shaman spells by a long range. I mean, Iron skin, summon insect andInsect plague (that rocks), area really cool, but we have a lot of useless spells there or boring to use spells, like: detect evil, shillelagh, goodberries, know alignment, find trap and hold animal. Also, druids have a lot less possible spells than Clerics and many of the best divine spells are kept on clerics repertories.

This can be easly identified by taking a single look on Icewind Dale Druids, that rocks a lot.

So the question is?

With IWD:EE done and released, when those druid spells will be brought to Baldur's Gate? Not all are needed if you think the game needs balance, but some should surelly come. In adition some actual druid spells don't make much sense for a druid to have, such as the buff ones (righteous magic), detect evil (druids are neutral), bless and chant (isn't the kind of direct intervention expected from nature), and others that i don't see atm but surely some ppl more focused than me will hint.

LoldrupDullSkullTheSecondCrevsDaakPaladayneQuartzTeo_live
«13

Comments

  • OrlonKronsteenOrlonKronsteen Member Posts: 181
    I don't mind some of the cleric ones (bless and chant) that are in there as I can see such powers being granted by gods/goddesses of nature, but I agree with you that druid spells suck, especially level 2. I never got into IWD but if the druid spells are that much better and it's easy to port them over, then I say they should do it. Druids definitely need some love.

    And speaking of that, I wouldn't mind it if they changed their leveling structure, too. I assume the devs were trying to be consistent with the PnP version of the class, but the leveling handicap you hit at level 13 doesn't make sense in the context of BG2, where other, stronger classes have no problems reaching higher levels more quickly.
    Danacm
  • kamuizinkamuizin Member Posts: 3,678
    Druids are in IWD what mages are in Baldur's Gate @OrlonKronsteen.
    RaduzielQuartz
  • OrlonKronsteenOrlonKronsteen Member Posts: 181
    Oh, that sounds great. @kamuizin . Maybe I'll eventually get around to finishing it someday. Do you know if the spells from IWD are from PnP or were they implemented just for that particular game?
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 1,787
    Opinion does not equal truth. I say that druids in BG do NOT in fact suck, despite being nerfed. Druids are actually my favorite casters.
    justfeelinathome
  • kamuizinkamuizin Member Posts: 3,678

    Oh, that sounds great. @kamuizin . Maybe I'll eventually get around to finishing it someday. Do you know if the spells from IWD are from PnP or were they implemented just for that particular game?

    That i'm not sure about.

    Opinion does not equal truth. I say that druids in BG do NOT in fact suck, despite being nerfed. Druids are actually my favorite casters.

    Play IWD then @thedamages, you will love it if druids hit a soft spot in your heart :)!
    Quartz
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 1,787
    @kamuizin Oh I have, there is no denying that Druids in IWD are BETTER. Druids rock so hard though that they are still awesome with heavily nerfed spell tables.
  • kamuizinkamuizin Member Posts: 3,678

    Mods.

    I'm asking fore core content in fact, i believe some mods for this already exist.

    It's just that, among other reasons, after that big work on shamans, the class appears to be a lot shallow and boring if compared with it's counterpart, the sorcerer.
    Quartz
  • KuronaKurona Member Posts: 588
    Druids get the short end of the stick in BG as far as spellcasting classes are concerned. They're still viable of course, even in ToB, but they're definitely weaker than clerics and mages.

    Protip: install aTweaks, specifically the PnP Elementals component. It makes elemental summoning a lot more powerful and the elemental princes Druids can summon will pack a punch as well as being able to summon their own small army.

    It works for enemies too of course. And for elementals found around the portals in the Underdark.
    kamuizinOrlonKronsteenQuartzTeo_live
  • JumboWheat01JumboWheat01 Member Posts: 911
    I never look at druids' spell list and think it's crap. It's not godly amazing, but not really crap. It's their wonky exp table that gets me every time.
  • PK2748PK2748 Member Posts: 381
    Druids get significantly better weapons and lots of granted powers. At low levels they just aren't casters. I think people who complain about Druids are not really using them to their potential
    RaduzielDJKajuru
  • IglosnofIglosnof Member Posts: 117
    They also get shapeshift, which while not great, grants several APR compared to clerics.
    Loldrup
  • kamuizinkamuizin Member Posts: 3,678
    PK2748 said:

    Druids get significantly better weapons and lots of granted powers. At low levels they just aren't casters. I think people who complain about Druids are not really using them to their potential

    Sorry dude, but compare it with druids from IWD. Any crap can be well used, that doesn't make a crap less crap.

    Druid don't have better weapon choice. Clerics have.

    Clerics can use Flail of Ages and Crom Faeyr. Druids lose flail/morning star, mace, war hammer for scimitars/wakizaki/ninja-to. It's just not good.

    Shapeshifter of druid is ridiculous weak. You hit normal, with a very low damage percent based on the normal animal attack and you can't cast spells. Werewolf is a bit less problematic and still not the best use of a druid. This isn't 3.5Ed were you get tons of feats for wildshape druids.

    No matter how you look, druid is too much weaker than any cleric. Even what was good on them was taken away. Doom if i'm not wrong was druid/ranger exclusive spells on normal BG and BG2. Iron Skin was instant cast and isn't anymore.

    Their best spell i insect plague that can target the caster itself and be spreaded on invisible and protected (spell turning/spell deflection) enemy casters.
    Quartz
  • PK2748PK2748 Member Posts: 381
    I'll take daggers, returning throwing daggers, scimitars and spears over cleric weapons any day. Especially with all the easier ways to get a ridiculous strength than Crom Faeyr.

    Druids spells at low level are worse than clerics but at high level are much more versatile. Are Druid spells worse in BG than in IWD? Sure. So are many Cleric spells. But a Druid in BG is strong against mages with the insect spells and against melee with iron skins. Clerics are really just great for dealing with undead.

    I will concede that BG shape shifting is underwhelming. It's like Illusion Magic in that it's amazing versatility just can't be replicated in a computer game. That doesn't mean it's useless

    In any case the only reason I play Cleric over Druid is because they screwed up Druid multiclass options.
  • JumboWheat01JumboWheat01 Member Posts: 911
    What multiclass options? It's just option, hehehe.

    Though why isn't there a Ranger/Druid multiclass? That would totally be awesome.
    ThacoBellLoldrupMush_Mush
  • PK2748PK2748 Member Posts: 381
    edited September 2016
    Druids in Second Edition are supposed to have the ability to multi class with Fighters, Rangers, Mages and Bards. Sadly BG just dumped everything but Fighter
    LoldrupQuartz
  • JumboWheat01JumboWheat01 Member Posts: 911
    Ah. I'll admit, my knowledge of pre-3e D&D is... well... non-existent. Now Fighters and Rangers I can sort of understand, but Bards? Mages? That seems very anti-Druid. Or is it they're allowed to multi-class if they lose the ability to continue as a druid?
  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058
    Fighter/Druid was the only standard Druid multiclass allowed.

    Half elves could play:
    Fighter/Mage/Druid
    Mage/Druid
    Ranger/Druid

    BUT only with DM approval.

    God how I would love that approval even now ...
    Loldrup
  • PK2748PK2748 Member Posts: 381

    Ah. I'll admit, my knowledge of pre-3e D&D is... well... non-existent. Now Fighters and Rangers I can sort of understand, but Bards? Mages? That seems very anti-Druid. Or is it they're allowed to multi-class if they lose the ability to continue as a druid?

    The second edition main handbook allowed half elves to multi class anything Druid they could multi as Cleric. Plain as day. The Druid handbook did say most circles wouldn't allow multi class Druids to challenge for arch Druid though so they tended to get stuck with artificial additional level caps.

    Actually I'm in a second edition campaign right now and there is a Druid/Mage (kinda) in the party with me.
    elminster
  • JumboWheat01JumboWheat01 Member Posts: 911
    Wowo said:

    Fighter/Druid was the only standard Druid multiclass allowed.

    Half elves could play:
    Fighter/Mage/Druid
    Mage/Druid
    Ranger/Druid

    BUT only with DM approval.

    God how I would love that approval even now ...

    So what your inferring is that the Baldur's Gate DM is REALLY stingy and strict.
    LoldrupDJKajuruQuartz
  • kamuizinkamuizin Member Posts: 3,678

    What multiclass options? It's just option, hehehe.

    Though why isn't there a Ranger/Druid multiclass? That would totally be awesome.

    An dual/class of Archer/Druid (if archer wasn't broken and allowed Grand Mastery in any ranged specialization) would be awesome. The kit is already out of rules the way it is.

    Archer in fact isn't a class kit, but an race kit limited to elves and linked to the warrior class, contained in "The Complete Book of Elves" of AD&D rule set. To be true on AD&D rule set, Archer kit should be elven restricted (or at least only extended to Half Elves) the same way Dwarven Defender Kit is restricted to Dwarvens.

    That's why AD&D books only mention multiclass to archers, cos it's an race kit, not class kit.

    The complete elven books mention expressively that multi-class can freely take a kit (and exist not only kits for single class, but kits exclusive for multi-class).
  • lunarlunar Member Posts: 3,250
    edited October 2016
    In bg1, druids get level 5 spells far earlier than clerics. This is a huge boost. Because insect plague is very powerful in bg1. It is even more powerful in bg2, where cleric only spells are not really needed. Items and summons can do everything cleric only spells do and more in bg2. Druid only spells like insect plague, fire elementals are very strong and I believe druids are better casters than clerics at bg2.
    ThacoBellLoldrup
  • RawgrimRawgrim Member Posts: 557
    If you play simply for combat and how much damage a class can do, yes. The druids do suck.

    For roleplaying reasons and things like that? Nope. Easily one of my favorite classes to play.
    JumboWheat01DJKajuruNoobacca
  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058
    Druid is the fastest levelling class in BG1 with access to some incredibly powerful spells.

    Yes, there aren't that many great spells and some are situational but still.

    Druids are the best healers in Bg1 due to Call Woodland Being which is an incredibly OP spell. They have one of the strongest nukes, albeit only useable outside. The level 5 choices (insect plague and iron skins) are really the icing on the cake.

    Yes, level 1 and level 2 choices are rubbish but these can be filled with cure spells anyway and if you really want an expanded spell selection you have the Avenger kit.

    All that said I do have iwdification installed though I haven't played a Druid with it yet.
    ThacoBellRawgrimDJKajuru
  • kamuizinkamuizin Member Posts: 3,678
    Rawgrim said:

    If you play simply for combat and how much damage a class can do, yes. The druids do suck.

    For roleplaying reasons and things like that? Nope. Easily one of my favorite classes to play.

    With this excuse you justify every unbalance in every RPG.

    I would prefer balance + Roleplay.
    IrbisQuartzTeo_live
  • RawgrimRawgrim Member Posts: 557
    kamuizin said:

    Rawgrim said:

    If you play simply for combat and how much damage a class can do, yes. The druids do suck.

    For roleplaying reasons and things like that? Nope. Easily one of my favorite classes to play.

    With this excuse you justify every unbalance in every RPG.

    I would prefer balance + Roleplay.
    It is a single player game....Not WoW. Balance between classes isn't really an issue.
    DJKajuruthespace
  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,058
    Rawgrim said:

    kamuizin said:

    Rawgrim said:

    If you play simply for combat and how much damage a class can do, yes. The druids do suck.

    For roleplaying reasons and things like that? Nope. Easily one of my favorite classes to play.

    With this excuse you justify every unbalance in every RPG.

    I would prefer balance + Roleplay.
    It is a single player game....Not WoW. Balance between classes isn't really an issue.
    D&D is balanced in its own way.
    IrbisDJKajuru
  • ZilberZilber Member Posts: 168
    Wowo said:

    Rawgrim said:

    kamuizin said:

    Rawgrim said:

    If you play simply for combat and how much damage a class can do, yes. The druids do suck.

    For roleplaying reasons and things like that? Nope. Easily one of my favorite classes to play.

    With this excuse you justify every unbalance in every RPG.

    I would prefer balance + Roleplay.
    It is a single player game....Not WoW. Balance between classes isn't really an issue.
    D&D is balanced in its own way.
    Only since third. 2nd still had the horrible "XP bonus for high main stats", percentile strength, dual class, race restrictions and many more examples.
«13
Sign In or Register to comment.