@histamiini: Wait, every third round? Not every single round? Because if you actually have time to do other stuff, you could cover Caelar with Champion's Strength scrolls in between Greater Restoration scrolls to build up her THAC0. She has a +3 longsword that deals 2 extra damage to demons, she has Grandmastery in swords, and she has 15 fighter levels, which amounts to about 60 base damage per round if she can land every hit. Once you got her THAC0 down low enough, she'd be dealing 46.125 damage to Belhifet on average every round. She could kill Belhifet in 27 rounds, not counting the time it took to buff her up. A single-classed cleric, druid, or even monk could take down Belhifet pretty easily that way, if Caelar really could survive that long. It might depend on disabling the bonus damage from LoB mode.
I count 22 Greater Restoration scrolls total: 5 from Belegarm, 2 from Dosia, 5 from the Flaming Fist Healer in the starting dungeon, 5 from Onoroth, and 5 from Crusader Priest Polvi in the Underground River. There's also 10 from an unknown store called HKGAR01.sto and 3 from a store that's named Xhost, but Xhost's dialog links to no stores, so I think we only get 22.
@semiticgod Well it depends, vs. Belhifet maybe she lasts one to two rounds, against others much longer. That sounds interesting tactic and definitely something to try out. Cleric could possibly open with Strength of One and lower Bel's Thac0 by 2, although Caelar's AC might be that bad that it doesn't matter.
I had 21 such scrolls last time, so atleast that many confirmed.
@histamiini and @semiticgod thnx for your help guys ! i managed to get the key from tazok .. in the meantime i leveld high enough to get GATE for me mage ! haha since u said vorpal i was like hm balor does vorpal on hit too! and i went down there again and smashed his ass!! haha
btw guys this Teleport of the boss... is that SCS ? if so i need to report that stuff towards the creator of it cause teleporting on me and making me completely stuck like that is not so fair imho..
@Mr_Salty: That's not SCS, though SCS might have given him the teleport ability. One of the EE updates introduced a bug that allowed teleporting enemies to teleport directly on top of you and trap both of you. I think a CTRL-J would be justified if you don't have an alternate means of escaping it.
@Mr_Salty: That's not SCS, though SCS might have given him the teleport ability. One of the EE updates introduced a bug that allowed teleporting enemies to teleport directly on top of you and trap both of you. I think a CTRL-J would be justified if you don't have an alternate means of escaping it.
yea but CTRL-J feels so bad to do man i cannot accept it lol!
@semiticgod How does the Scorcher Ammunation work against Mel, when targeting Yaga?
Although 21Archer-Cleric doesn't really need that. I can in theory kill her single handely with Energy Blades and Called Shot. Energy Blades give:
+10 Thac0 which gets my Thac0 naturally to -23 with bonuses and bonus gear, Melissan AC is -24
9 apr which 21Archer naturally makes 10 apr
20 blades which is enough to drain Melissan 19 str
EDIT: Oh, tested it and it's actually better than that. Because Called Shot lasts 10 seconds, two of them can be overlapped, which means 2 str drain with single hit. I can actually kill Mel with 15 Energy Blades if I don't roll ones.
EDIT: Well now I realized that single Energy Blades with two Called Shots should kill every boss in the game in two rounds, as they strike as +5 weapon, potentially draining 26 str.
@histamiini: The Scorcher Ammunition will hit Melissan if you target Yaga-Shura and then catch Melissan in the middle of the beam. The Scorcher Ammunition has some advantage over Energy Blades: first, it has better APR, since it has 5 base APR and strikes twice for an effective APR of 10, or 12 when hasted, or 20 when under Improved Haste, compared to a flat 10 for Energy Blades (since the Archer's level 7 and 13 APR bonuses will bump it up from 9 to 10). Second, it doesn't require casting a spell to get it; it's aura-independent. Third, it never runs out. Fourth, it can bypass Absolute Immunity and PFMW if you target a nearby critters. Fifth, it's area-effect and can therefore slay multiple enemies at once.
The advantage of Energy Blades is that they can strike any target directly, which means you don't need to worry about finding a vulnerable target in the right position (like Yaga-Shura for Melissan or Bone Blades for the Ravager). The Energy Blades also deal more damage in the absence of haste, partly because electricity resistance is more rare, slashing resistance is more rare, and because the base damage of Energy Blades, 1d4+5, is better than the proficiency bonuses of the Bit Metal Rod, +5 for Grandmastery (a single-classed Archer could still deal more damage by combining it with the Firetooth crossbow).
Basically, the Scorcher Ammunition has superior potential APR, but the Energy Blades are more convenient in that they don't require special positioning for targets immune to +1 weapons.
Just to be perfectly clear on Called Shot mechanics: you can say it lasts 12 seconds and you can say it lasts 10 seconds. For 12 seconds, Called Shot penalties will apply to your hits, and those on-hit effects vary by duration: STR drain lasts 10 seconds, save vs. spell penalties last 15 seconds, and THAC0 penalties last 20 seconds. Thus, if you cast Called Shot twice in a row, the first round would penalize STR by 1, the second round would penalize STR by 2, and the third round would penalize STR by 1 again, though the STR penalties would only last 10 seconds per hit.
Thus, two Called Shot spells cast precisely 6 seconds apart could drain 28.33 STR, assuming 10 APR and a 100% hit rate. A single Called Shot would drain 18.33. That's enough to kill anything if you have two rounds of free aura.
Anyway, whenever you're using two Called Shot spells in a row, remember to count your attack rolls to make sure you're using Called Shot as soon as you're able, or else you won't get the maximum benefit from it.
Also, the Scorcher Ammunition is easier to switch than the Energy Blades, since you can't unequip the Energy Blades until you either dispel them or run out.
And, as always, note that Sendai and Abazigal are supposed to give a dying dialog when they reach low HP, which means that killing them via STR drain can result in a game-breaking bug due to the cutscene failing to trigger. I believe the same is true for Irenicus at Spellhold, the Tree of Life, and possibly Hell. Same goes for Lavok.
@semiticgod Thanks for the explanation. I did notice one additional benefit, well small benefit for using Energy Blades. I can use shields if I've them equipped when casting Energy Blades, so I could have some undispellable effects, like using Reflection Shield against Illasera etc.
Irenicus Dungeon. With Hide in Shadows picked up the activation stone and activated the Sewage Golem. Looted the room and shut the door locking up the Mineral Mephit there. With Hide in Shadows I returned to the Smoke Mephit corridor which I used to enter the Otyugh room. Picked up Oil of Speed and used one of the corridors to hide again. With speed potion lured the Duergar out of the way, then picked up the key and used all of my normal healing potions to stop the hasted poison, picked up the Helm of Balduran and escaped the level.
With speed lured the Mephits back and shut the door, and casually destroyed the pits. Interestingly you can't destroy them with fists, or even with on hand daggers because they don't reach them. Luckily I had also the Long Sword +1. Picked up Ring +1 and another Oil of Speed from Frennedan room, so I could loot and run the Blunt Belt. Then made my escape. That was easy enough with good Hide in Shadows. Also surfacing from the dungeon I made my first level up and got second level druid spells, which still are nothing impressive. Bought Gem Bag and Scroll Case and was left 500 gold.
Started Athkatla like always, looting Mae'vars guild hall although this time I was 500 gold short for the Nymph cloak. So I bought one invisibility potion and left for the first Thieves Guild guest. Looting the temples I got enough money to buy the Nymph cloak. Went straight to Seven Vales and managed to charm Amon and Pooky. I blocked the doorway with invisibility. This time Pooky managed to charm Brennan who was quickly killed by the other two. Yellow Orcslicer then conviniently killed Pebblecrusher. Amon skeli then casually hacked yellow Orcslicer. Don't know why Orcslicer switches between yellow and red circles, but it makes this fight easier to manage. Then Pooky and Amon wasted their spells, before skeli wasted them both. Got the first free invisibility among other loot.
Looted De'Arnise for FoA +3, Orc Leather +3 and Elven Court Bow +3 among others stuff, pretty easily done with Sandthief Ring and Hide in Shadows, stopped the guest after giving the stew for the Umber Hulks. Also made 14k gold. Then picked up Belm +2, and Potion Case, Crimson Dart +3, and Arrow Belt from the Watchers Keep, just using invisibility avoiding fights. Axe +2 from Graveyard and I had already 24k gold, so I went ahead and started chapter 3.
Tanner's guest got me to level 11. Did the easy guests in Graveyard and Umar Hills. Managed to charm Shennara which stops them from agroing, then wasted the goblins, slept and managed to charm Prebek too. They wasted their spells, Shennara made me invisible, then they fougth. Prebek got better of Shennara, but I then easily finished him too. After Harper Hold 18k gold, enough to buy 40 Arrow of Dispelling. Made level 12 during the Circus quest. Attacked Kalah and went far corner and drank invisibility potion. This protects indirectly against his confusion spell, and lured the minions onto me. Then left them in the fog of war, dispelled Kalah couple times with Dispel Arrows, before Piercing Arrows took him down.
Got ranged free charm ring, so it was time to pay visit in the sewers. Charmed Rengaard with the ring, who silenced Tarnor, who I then charmed with the cloak. Fed Tarnor to the kobbos, and now I could walk past them without agro. Charmed Rengaard again, rested and then charmed Zorl. Rengaard silenced Gaius, and he had the infinite spell bug that he could summon 5 Aerial Servants. All ganged on Gaius who was killed in an instant, Gallobchair and Draug Fea followed soon after. Then the gang massacred the Kobolds and Rakshasha, then Otyugh and the Sea Troll, then the Beholder and the Gauths. Lastly Rengaard summoned couple more Servants who wasted Zorl and Rengaard himself. 18k gold again.
Continuing Shadow Thieves, I charmed Jaylos with the ring and we attacked Caehan, who's pretty tough. I dispelled his haste with an arrow, but still had to kite him because in melee he did too much damage. Then kited the Guild Contact. With the help of invisibility picked up the Mace of Distruption from Bodhi's Lair. Used outside to wait out Neb's haste, then killed him with kiting and melee. Went and improved the Mace of Distruption, and it was time to do some lich hunting.
Wiped all three minor liches with single PfU and Mace of Distruption. Charmed one of the Minotaurs for easier hacking. Another PfU, Frost, Clarity, Speed and waited Kangaxx Cornugon to unsummon. Then hacked Kangaxx with FoA +3 until he transformed, then waited his PfMW to end, and with few hits from MoD +2 he was killed. Got the first end game gear.
so guys im in trademeet and there is a mage caster that cast summon those summons become mine ?? is this a bug or what ? after that i went to druid grove... middle of map there is a group of druids fighting trolls when they summon dryads and bears ... they become mine to control ? what is going on here i am confused what is happening
question about dual wielding in end game what is better to have Flail of ages + crom or Flail of ages + Belm +2 for the extra attack? for the Kensai/Mage
@Mr_Salty That can happen with third party summons or charms, happens in Beholder dungeon too when Beholders are fighting Mind Flayers. It's been like that long as I remember, so don't know if it's fixable.
With Improved Haste Crom Fayer for better damage, Belm is also +2 weapon so some bosses can't be touched with it. If you're talking about end battle, there's parts that you probably want to use Reflection Shield instead of second weapon, against Illasera and Fallen Solars.
@Mr_Salty That can happen with third party summons or charms, happens in Beholder dungeon too when Beholders are fighting Mind Flayers. It's been like that long as I remember, so don't know if it's fixable.
With Improved Haste Crom Fayer for better damage, Belm is also +2 weapon so some bosses can't be touched with it. If you're talking about end battle, there's parts that you probably want to use Reflection Shield instead of second weapon, against Illasera and Fallen Solars.
@histamiini
well right now i always end up going warhammer / Flails but ive seen some posts that offhand does only 1 attack per round ? and therefor offhand with a +apr always is better then offhand with +thac0 not sure how all this works lol i am no expert on this game ^^
@Mr_Salty Crom Faeyr does 13 average damage against 6.5 of Belm, it also adds 4 damage (22str to 25str) to hits of both weapons. FoA +5 does 19.5 average damage. Without counting Thac0 bonuses with improved haste.
@Mr_Salty Crom Faeyr does 13 average damage against 6.5 of Belm, it also adds 4 damage (22str to 25str) to hits of both weapons. FoA +5 does 19.5 average damage. Without counting Thac0 bonuses with improved haste.
Hopefully I got that right, if you get grand mastery on Flail's you can have 9 apr with Crom.
Lots of numbers but in short the FoA + Crom is better and yea when i lvled myself in the test i had 9 apr with the imp haste so its even better then
Btw in the meantime i was waiting on answers i tried getting the Belm (but there is no entrance in that tower in druid grove.. am i missing some quest ? cause i already finished the druid grove Cernd quest and the Genie
Edit: the site Banshee was wrong on where this tower was lol so nvm i found it!
@histamiini: I notice a lot of charms. Is this a no-reload run? I was wondering if it were doable to win this challenge with an Archer without reloading, but some of those situations seemed to rely on failed saves. The Nymph Cloak is touch-range, so it seemed hard to charm Sanasha and Prebek, since the hostile goblins would prevent you from using stealth immediately, which would give Prebek and Sanasha time to deliver their dialogue, go hostile, and potentially follow you outside, unless perhaps you used the haste effect (a rare source of early, renewable haste) from Arbane's Sword beforehand to quickly escape. Mencar Pebblecrusher also seemed risky, because I've seen him go hostile if you show up in his field of vision for too long after you agree to leave him alone, and a bad stealth roll could leave you in plain sight if you tried to hide immediately after attempting to charm Amon or Pooky.
The Ring of Human Influence also seems dicey. The range is longer, but I understand that the charm turns the target hostile if it makes its save.
I've been considering returning to this challenge, but I really want to try it when the saving throw bug is fixed, since that would pose additional difficulties for no-reload purposes.
@semiticgod Yeah this is no-reload run. I mostly use charm in situations that don't agro if failed, Sanasha isn't one of them, but this time it worked. And if it doesn't work, I can level skip their spells as they don't follow outside I don't think. If Sanasha is charmed from invisibility, they don't activate their dialogue, and the goblins can then be dealt more easily. With Mencar you get two free charm attempts if you agree to leave him alone, I've never gotten him agro in this short duration if I've agreed to leave.
The Ring of Human Influence doesn't agro on failed save, which is why it guarantees charms on neutral mobs when you can hide from the agro activator.
Serafina hit level 13 during the Temple guest. Used one PfU to mow down the Undead Bridge with MoD. Left the Rift device to the sewers for now. Beastmarter doesn't agro if you get a hit from invisibility. Tried charming Captain Haegan, but couldn't, so I lured them into the sewers and used the poison trap to kill them. Didn't bother with the last party, level 14, 40k gold.
MoD easily killed the Crypt King for the silence sword. Jumped on Mekrath with 8 apr and got him badly injured before his defences triggered. Invisibility and waited them out, then silenced him but he vocalized, which I then again waited out. After second silence he didn't vocalize, took his stoneskin with a Dispel Arrow, and hacked away. Got Rod of Resurrection among other loot. Rayic Mephits were divided and conquered. Used the same previous tactic against Rayic too, hacked until he put up defenses, waited them out, silenced from fog of war, dispelled with one arrow, and killed in melee. Although I did notice he did somehow try to cast spells, which were all interrupted though. Charmed the priest with the ring in Maevar's Guild hall who summoned two skelis and silenced Maevar, who I then charmed with the cloak. Soon all enemies were down.
Druid Grove dispersed the three druids, dispelled their Stoneskins and interrupted their spells with arrows. Protected Cernd with Chaotic Commands before he challenged Faldorn. Tried casting insects on Faldorn but it didn't work, so Cernd trasformed to Greater Werewolf and started hacking. Faldorn summoned a lot of help, but with Cernds fast healing and my RoR, Cerdn outlasted all. Hacking the Dao Jins Serafina made level 15. Did rest of the guests in Trademeet, after which Rasaad accompanied me to the City Gates. Bought Vhailor's Helm.
Used the same previous tactic against Rayic too, hacked until he put up defenses, waited them out, silenced from fog of war, dispelled with one arrow, and killed in melee. Although I did notice he did somehow try to cast spells, which were all interrupted though.
@histamiini forgive me if I've misunderstood, but it looks as though you silenced Rayic and then dispelled him. If that's so, it's not entirely surprising he tried to cast spells .
You guys have been busy.
Couldn't read all the posts sadly but idk if this has been answered yet:
Someone asked about Chromatic on previous pages and Silver Sword was mentioned, which is great if you can use it.
Pure Mages can't use it tho, for example a Sorcerer.
Mind Flayer form works like a charm, but is really high level (and only Sorcerers get it before ToB).
Disintegrate works (and most similar spells except Chromatic orb I guess because+6 (might work with the LoB saving throw bug if not fixed yet, should definitely work with malison))
If your set of Disintegrates doesn't work, resting here is really easy, jsut go outside with the portal and you can rest for free and go right back in.
Yeah now is the time to take advantage of the saving throw bug. Chromatic Demon has -3 saves normally with LoB I think. After they fix it, WoW is the general tool for every character, well except for Wizard Slayer.
At Windspear Hills, paladins didn't stand a chance against two Serafina's and Efreeti, nor did the ambush bandits. Used invisibility to reach the bridge in the dungeon, this time the way was blocked, Efreeti lured the mob away. Had to rest 4 times before my charm worked against Tazok, but eventually it worked, and after we wasted the Orcs, my gang ganged on Tazok. Silenced Conster but he vocalized after I sent Efreeti in, after it was killed and the silence didn't work anymore, I sent my double next to waste Consters spells. After waiting Consters Improved Mantle out, I dispelled him and with 9 apr Piercing Arrows from Tuigan bow he was quickly killed.
After buying Roger the Fence out of potions, I charmed him and he helped me to smuggle the Rift Device out from the sewers. I wont maybe need the 60% hp damage in this run, but it also has a nice guaranteed dispel effect, which I don't think anything can protect against. Before entering the Mind Flayer dungeon, I drank Speed, Stoneform and Invul to get low enough saves just in case. I reach the loot with invisibility, and immediatelly drink another invisibility and start to run away. And save buffs turn valuable when Alhoon reveals me, but in the end I make my escape.
With Pai'Na I charmed one of the minions and killed the spiders out of sight of the others, rest and charmed another. When attacking it, it actually triggered the rest of the spiders. But hacking them without Pai'Na wasn't hard. After this Pai'Na actually could be killed casually as she didn't agro. Got Kitthix. Bought Shield of Balduran and started farming xp with Gauths. Serafina tanked the other, and clone shot Piercing Arrows from back against the other. This meant both were getting killed without observation, without risk because they weren't hurting me fast enough with -14 AC, and I could do something else in the mean time. Actually I'm still doing that as I write this.
Oof, finally made level 21 so I could start the dual to Cleric. Sold bunch of useless stuff, and bought 50 Stone to Flesh scrolls. Lets see how Firkraag handles stoning.
21 Archer will provide to this build:
171 hp
3rd lv Druid Spells
2 apr
0 base Thac0
+7 missile Thac0/dmg bonus
** Slings
*** Two Weapon Style
Hardiness
Power Attack
2x Critical Strike
5x Called Shot
I chose Critical Strike to go with Energy Blades, which does massive damage, one Hardiness if I need damage resistance. I can eventually have five Energy Blades per rest, and clone has one.
@histamiini: How do you deal with the Firkraag XP loop safely? Won't Firkraag be able to deal lots of damage in between petrifications? Do you just run in and out of the area for each attempt?
I notice you don't have Smite in your list of HLAs, but you do have 2 castings of Critical Strike. Did you not want the knockback from Smite? I'd have thought it would have been worth it given the 2-round stun effects of Smite.
Your Archer should actually have +6 to hit and damage with ranged weapons, unless you have a mod that fixes the Archer kit. For some reasons Archer bonuses slow down after level 8; you only get the +1 to hit and damage every 5 levels after that, so you'd have to be level 23 to get to +7.
This is a really impressive run. Of the three successful no-reload runs thus far, two of them, the Archer/Mage and Cleric/Mage, had access to mage spells and wands, and the third, the Totemic Druid->Fighter, required numerous restarts to land Harm on Belhifet. The Archer is a great character for BG2 and ToB, but it's really ill-suited to BG1 and SoD compared to the other classes, at least for a solo LoB run.
@semiticgod Because I didn't agro Firkraag, he doesn't turn red circle after Stone to Flesh. He's will still fire his defensive triggers though. And he can also trigger a bug, that he fires Melf's Acid Arrow on himself, instantly killing him because he only has 1 hp left. Hopefully that wont happen though. After turning back to flesh I always escape the level and rest, which resets Firkraag so I can casually petrify him again.
Not taking Smite maybe oversight on my part, I didn't remember it also has Critical Strike, because I've never bothered to use it in any of the runs.
You're correct about the Archer bonuses. Is it a bug or should it be that way? If it really is a bug, I should maybe try to fix that. One difference isn't much, but it should still be correct.
I thought Archer was pretty good on BG1 and SoD too. That's probably because I only usually find two class specific bottlenecks in the run, Crusader Attacks and Belhifet. Rest can be charmed away, which is currently easy in 2.5 LoB, and Sarevok can be pretty much killed with general tactics, using all One Gift Losts, Oils of Fiery Burnings, Potions of Explosions and Potions of Firebreaths in the game. Archer blasts through the Crusader Attacks, and I think Belhifet is very repeatable with all hitting almost flat damage from Bullets of Darkness and Champion's Strength scroll stacking. Tanking will get him always at least Near Death, and then he can be finished with Arrows of Detonation.
Also noticed that I almost always play the start of BG2 the same way, with general tactics, so I haven't really even taken advantage of Archer specific stuff yet, only in few encounters. And I've already lost my bows, and wont probably even use slings because I don't have GWW's. I thought having Critical Strike with the Energy Blades was the better alternative. But we'll see.
Your Archer should actually have +6 to hit and damage with ranged weapons, unless you have a mod that fixes the Archer kit. For some reasons Archer bonuses slow down after level 8; you only get the +1 to hit and damage every 5 levels after that, so you'd have to be level 23 to get to +7.
Just to clarify a typo, the slow down is after level 18, not level 8. That's not documented, so you can make up your own mind if it's a bug. I suspect it is deliberate - along the same sort of lines as monk AC at high levels - but I don't know that to be the case.
I think the archer has quite a lot going for him even in BG1. I find the availability of stealth helpful, but then I'm too mean to make the extensive use of the invisibility ring @histamiini does .
First three WoW's used and the bug hasn't trickered so maybe I've cracked it.
Here's the general advice for XP-looping with Wand of Wonder and Stone to Flesh scrolls. It's great way of handling dual from high level first class. It only takes money, with 20/20 economy Sister Garlena can recharge the wand with 4900 gold.
1. Neutral victims wont turn red circle after Stone to Flesh, but might still cast triggers etc.
2. Remove any item that decreases spell casting time, because WoW has couple effects that will agro enemy.
3. Use WoW on enemy and watch your portrait, and pause as soon as the icon disappears. Now use WoW again and unpause. This will prevent the couple agroing spell effects from triggering. Agro spells have casting time of 2 I think, so you should have enough time to act. Petrification will happen anyway because it's an instant effect.
4. Resting after using Stone to Flesh will reset the victim.
Now how to stop Firkraag from killing himself with Melf's Acid arrow after he has 1 hp left from Petrification.
1. Stay as far away from Firkraag and close as possible of exit.
2. If WoW triggers instant Haste on Firkraag, wait it out. It's only 4 rounds I think.
3. After Stone to Flesh, absorb his first trigger and pause. It's mostly defensive triggers and Lower Resistance.
4. Click on exit and unpause.
5. Out of level use invisibility ring and rest. This resets Firkraag and you can start from the beginning again.
Note, that this needs still more testing to see if it really stops the bug.
From the first WoW I got 9 petrifications, 5 from the second and 7 from the third. I'm almost level 14, so I'm not that worried if the bug happens anymore, because skeli army can handle the Gauths I think.
Dual completed, and without the bug so I would say the above tactic is a go. Had to recharge the wand 7 times, and with Stone to Flesh scrolls, the cost was about 40k. But it's pretty fast and no risk tactic to do. I'll still probably take one level and Deva before saying goodbye to old Firkraag, permanently.
Comments
I count 22 Greater Restoration scrolls total: 5 from Belegarm, 2 from Dosia, 5 from the Flaming Fist Healer in the starting dungeon, 5 from Onoroth, and 5 from Crusader Priest Polvi in the Underground River. There's also 10 from an unknown store called HKGAR01.sto and 3 from a store that's named Xhost, but Xhost's dialog links to no stores, so I think we only get 22.
I had 21 such scrolls last time, so atleast that many confirmed.
He does not give me the key tru dialog options tho tried them all when he was charmed so i just have to kill him ^^
btw guys this Teleport of the boss... is that SCS ? if so i need to report that stuff towards the creator of it cause teleporting on me and making me completely stuck like that is not so fair imho..
yea but CTRL-J feels so bad to do man i cannot accept it lol!
Although 21Archer-Cleric doesn't really need that. I can in theory kill her single handely with Energy Blades and Called Shot. Energy Blades give:
+10 Thac0 which gets my Thac0 naturally to -23 with bonuses and bonus gear, Melissan AC is -24
9 apr which 21Archer naturally makes 10 apr
20 blades which is enough to drain Melissan 19 str
EDIT: Oh, tested it and it's actually better than that. Because Called Shot lasts 10 seconds, two of them can be overlapped, which means 2 str drain with single hit. I can actually kill Mel with 15 Energy Blades if I don't roll ones.
EDIT: Well now I realized that single Energy Blades with two Called Shots should kill every boss in the game in two rounds, as they strike as +5 weapon, potentially draining 26 str.
Energy Blades - Time - Str Drain - Called Shot
20 - 0s - 00 - 1st
10 - 6s - 10 - 1st+2nd
4 - 10s - 22 - 1st+2nd
0 - 12s - 26 - 2nd
The advantage of Energy Blades is that they can strike any target directly, which means you don't need to worry about finding a vulnerable target in the right position (like Yaga-Shura for Melissan or Bone Blades for the Ravager). The Energy Blades also deal more damage in the absence of haste, partly because electricity resistance is more rare, slashing resistance is more rare, and because the base damage of Energy Blades, 1d4+5, is better than the proficiency bonuses of the Bit Metal Rod, +5 for Grandmastery (a single-classed Archer could still deal more damage by combining it with the Firetooth crossbow).
Basically, the Scorcher Ammunition has superior potential APR, but the Energy Blades are more convenient in that they don't require special positioning for targets immune to +1 weapons.
Just to be perfectly clear on Called Shot mechanics: you can say it lasts 12 seconds and you can say it lasts 10 seconds. For 12 seconds, Called Shot penalties will apply to your hits, and those on-hit effects vary by duration: STR drain lasts 10 seconds, save vs. spell penalties last 15 seconds, and THAC0 penalties last 20 seconds. Thus, if you cast Called Shot twice in a row, the first round would penalize STR by 1, the second round would penalize STR by 2, and the third round would penalize STR by 1 again, though the STR penalties would only last 10 seconds per hit.
Thus, two Called Shot spells cast precisely 6 seconds apart could drain 28.33 STR, assuming 10 APR and a 100% hit rate. A single Called Shot would drain 18.33. That's enough to kill anything if you have two rounds of free aura.
Anyway, whenever you're using two Called Shot spells in a row, remember to count your attack rolls to make sure you're using Called Shot as soon as you're able, or else you won't get the maximum benefit from it.
And, as always, note that Sendai and Abazigal are supposed to give a dying dialog when they reach low HP, which means that killing them via STR drain can result in a game-breaking bug due to the cutscene failing to trigger. I believe the same is true for Irenicus at Spellhold, the Tree of Life, and possibly Hell. Same goes for Lavok.
Irenicus Dungeon. With Hide in Shadows picked up the activation stone and activated the Sewage Golem. Looted the room and shut the door locking up the Mineral Mephit there. With Hide in Shadows I returned to the Smoke Mephit corridor which I used to enter the Otyugh room. Picked up Oil of Speed and used one of the corridors to hide again. With speed potion lured the Duergar out of the way, then picked up the key and used all of my normal healing potions to stop the hasted poison, picked up the Helm of Balduran and escaped the level.
With speed lured the Mephits back and shut the door, and casually destroyed the pits. Interestingly you can't destroy them with fists, or even with on hand daggers because they don't reach them. Luckily I had also the Long Sword +1. Picked up Ring +1 and another Oil of Speed from Frennedan room, so I could loot and run the Blunt Belt. Then made my escape. That was easy enough with good Hide in Shadows. Also surfacing from the dungeon I made my first level up and got second level druid spells, which still are nothing impressive. Bought Gem Bag and Scroll Case and was left 500 gold.
Started Athkatla like always, looting Mae'vars guild hall although this time I was 500 gold short for the Nymph cloak. So I bought one invisibility potion and left for the first Thieves Guild guest. Looting the temples I got enough money to buy the Nymph cloak. Went straight to Seven Vales and managed to charm Amon and Pooky. I blocked the doorway with invisibility. This time Pooky managed to charm Brennan who was quickly killed by the other two. Yellow Orcslicer then conviniently killed Pebblecrusher. Amon skeli then casually hacked yellow Orcslicer. Don't know why Orcslicer switches between yellow and red circles, but it makes this fight easier to manage. Then Pooky and Amon wasted their spells, before skeli wasted them both. Got the first free invisibility among other loot.
Looted De'Arnise for FoA +3, Orc Leather +3 and Elven Court Bow +3 among others stuff, pretty easily done with Sandthief Ring and Hide in Shadows, stopped the guest after giving the stew for the Umber Hulks. Also made 14k gold. Then picked up Belm +2, and Potion Case, Crimson Dart +3, and Arrow Belt from the Watchers Keep, just using invisibility avoiding fights. Axe +2 from Graveyard and I had already 24k gold, so I went ahead and started chapter 3.
Tanner's guest got me to level 11. Did the easy guests in Graveyard and Umar Hills. Managed to charm Shennara which stops them from agroing, then wasted the goblins, slept and managed to charm Prebek too. They wasted their spells, Shennara made me invisible, then they fougth. Prebek got better of Shennara, but I then easily finished him too. After Harper Hold 18k gold, enough to buy 40 Arrow of Dispelling. Made level 12 during the Circus quest. Attacked Kalah and went far corner and drank invisibility potion. This protects indirectly against his confusion spell, and lured the minions onto me. Then left them in the fog of war, dispelled Kalah couple times with Dispel Arrows, before Piercing Arrows took him down.
Got ranged free charm ring, so it was time to pay visit in the sewers. Charmed Rengaard with the ring, who silenced Tarnor, who I then charmed with the cloak. Fed Tarnor to the kobbos, and now I could walk past them without agro. Charmed Rengaard again, rested and then charmed Zorl. Rengaard silenced Gaius, and he had the infinite spell bug that he could summon 5 Aerial Servants. All ganged on Gaius who was killed in an instant, Gallobchair and Draug Fea followed soon after. Then the gang massacred the Kobolds and Rakshasha, then Otyugh and the Sea Troll, then the Beholder and the Gauths. Lastly Rengaard summoned couple more Servants who wasted Zorl and Rengaard himself. 18k gold again.
Continuing Shadow Thieves, I charmed Jaylos with the ring and we attacked Caehan, who's pretty tough. I dispelled his haste with an arrow, but still had to kite him because in melee he did too much damage. Then kited the Guild Contact. With the help of invisibility picked up the Mace of Distruption from Bodhi's Lair. Used outside to wait out Neb's haste, then killed him with kiting and melee. Went and improved the Mace of Distruption, and it was time to do some lich hunting.
Wiped all three minor liches with single PfU and Mace of Distruption. Charmed one of the Minotaurs for easier hacking. Another PfU, Frost, Clarity, Speed and waited Kangaxx Cornugon to unsummon. Then hacked Kangaxx with FoA +3 until he transformed, then waited his PfMW to end, and with few hits from MoD +2 he was killed. Got the first end game gear.
@histamiini
@semiticgod
question about dual wielding in end game what is better to have Flail of ages + crom or Flail of ages + Belm +2 for the extra attack? for the Kensai/Mage
With Improved Haste Crom Fayer for better damage, Belm is also +2 weapon so some bosses can't be touched with it. If you're talking about end battle, there's parts that you probably want to use Reflection Shield instead of second weapon, against Illasera and Fallen Solars.
@histamiini
well right now i always end up going warhammer / Flails but ive seen some posts that offhand does only 1 attack per round ? and therefor offhand with a +apr always is better then offhand with +thac0 not sure how all this works lol i am no expert on this game ^^
FoA +5 + Belm +2 10 apr = 8x19.5 + 2x6.5 = 169 average damage
FoA +5 + Crom Faeyr +5 8 apr = 6x23.5 + 2x17 = 175 average damage
Hopefully I got that right, if you get grand mastery on Flail's you can have 9 apr with Crom.
Lots of numbers but in short the FoA + Crom is better and yea when i lvled myself in the test i had 9 apr with the imp haste so its even better then
Btw in the meantime i was waiting on answers i tried getting the Belm (but there is no entrance in that tower in druid grove.. am i missing some quest ? cause i already finished the druid grove Cernd quest and the Genie
Edit: the site Banshee was wrong on where this tower was lol so nvm i found it!
The Ring of Human Influence also seems dicey. The range is longer, but I understand that the charm turns the target hostile if it makes its save.
I've been considering returning to this challenge, but I really want to try it when the saving throw bug is fixed, since that would pose additional difficulties for no-reload purposes.
The Ring of Human Influence doesn't agro on failed save, which is why it guarantees charms on neutral mobs when you can hide from the agro activator.
Serafina hit level 13 during the Temple guest. Used one PfU to mow down the Undead Bridge with MoD. Left the Rift device to the sewers for now. Beastmarter doesn't agro if you get a hit from invisibility. Tried charming Captain Haegan, but couldn't, so I lured them into the sewers and used the poison trap to kill them. Didn't bother with the last party, level 14, 40k gold.
MoD easily killed the Crypt King for the silence sword. Jumped on Mekrath with 8 apr and got him badly injured before his defences triggered. Invisibility and waited them out, then silenced him but he vocalized, which I then again waited out. After second silence he didn't vocalize, took his stoneskin with a Dispel Arrow, and hacked away. Got Rod of Resurrection among other loot. Rayic Mephits were divided and conquered. Used the same previous tactic against Rayic too, hacked until he put up defenses, waited them out, silenced from fog of war, dispelled with one arrow, and killed in melee. Although I did notice he did somehow try to cast spells, which were all interrupted though. Charmed the priest with the ring in Maevar's Guild hall who summoned two skelis and silenced Maevar, who I then charmed with the cloak. Soon all enemies were down.
Druid Grove dispersed the three druids, dispelled their Stoneskins and interrupted their spells with arrows. Protected Cernd with Chaotic Commands before he challenged Faldorn. Tried casting insects on Faldorn but it didn't work, so Cernd trasformed to Greater Werewolf and started hacking. Faldorn summoned a lot of help, but with Cernds fast healing and my RoR, Cerdn outlasted all. Hacking the Dao Jins Serafina made level 15. Did rest of the guests in Trademeet, after which Rasaad accompanied me to the City Gates. Bought Vhailor's Helm.
@histamiini forgive me if I've misunderstood, but it looks as though you silenced Rayic and then dispelled him. If that's so, it's not entirely surprising he tried to cast spells
Couldn't read all the posts sadly but idk if this has been answered yet:
Someone asked about Chromatic on previous pages and Silver Sword was mentioned, which is great if you can use it.
Pure Mages can't use it tho, for example a Sorcerer.
Mind Flayer form works like a charm, but is really high level (and only Sorcerers get it before ToB).
Disintegrate works (and most similar spells except Chromatic orb I guess because+6 (might work with the LoB saving throw bug if not fixed yet, should definitely work with malison))
If your set of Disintegrates doesn't work, resting here is really easy, jsut go outside with the portal and you can rest for free and go right back in.
At Windspear Hills, paladins didn't stand a chance against two Serafina's and Efreeti, nor did the ambush bandits. Used invisibility to reach the bridge in the dungeon, this time the way was blocked, Efreeti lured the mob away. Had to rest 4 times before my charm worked against Tazok, but eventually it worked, and after we wasted the Orcs, my gang ganged on Tazok. Silenced Conster but he vocalized after I sent Efreeti in, after it was killed and the silence didn't work anymore, I sent my double next to waste Consters spells. After waiting Consters Improved Mantle out, I dispelled him and with 9 apr Piercing Arrows from Tuigan bow he was quickly killed.
After buying Roger the Fence out of potions, I charmed him and he helped me to smuggle the Rift Device out from the sewers. I wont maybe need the 60% hp damage in this run, but it also has a nice guaranteed dispel effect, which I don't think anything can protect against. Before entering the Mind Flayer dungeon, I drank Speed, Stoneform and Invul to get low enough saves just in case. I reach the loot with invisibility, and immediatelly drink another invisibility and start to run away. And save buffs turn valuable when Alhoon reveals me, but in the end I make my escape.
With Pai'Na I charmed one of the minions and killed the spiders out of sight of the others, rest and charmed another. When attacking it, it actually triggered the rest of the spiders. But hacking them without Pai'Na wasn't hard. After this Pai'Na actually could be killed casually as she didn't agro. Got Kitthix. Bought Shield of Balduran and started farming xp with Gauths. Serafina tanked the other, and clone shot Piercing Arrows from back against the other. This meant both were getting killed without observation, without risk because they weren't hurting me fast enough with -14 AC, and I could do something else in the mean time. Actually I'm still doing that as I write this.
Oof, finally made level 21 so I could start the dual to Cleric. Sold bunch of useless stuff, and bought 50 Stone to Flesh scrolls. Lets see how Firkraag handles stoning.
21 Archer will provide to this build:
171 hp
3rd lv Druid Spells
2 apr
0 base Thac0
+7 missile Thac0/dmg bonus
** Slings
*** Two Weapon Style
Hardiness
Power Attack
2x Critical Strike
5x Called Shot
I chose Critical Strike to go with Energy Blades, which does massive damage, one Hardiness if I need damage resistance. I can eventually have five Energy Blades per rest, and clone has one.
I notice you don't have Smite in your list of HLAs, but you do have 2 castings of Critical Strike. Did you not want the knockback from Smite? I'd have thought it would have been worth it given the 2-round stun effects of Smite.
Your Archer should actually have +6 to hit and damage with ranged weapons, unless you have a mod that fixes the Archer kit. For some reasons Archer bonuses slow down after level 8; you only get the +1 to hit and damage every 5 levels after that, so you'd have to be level 23 to get to +7.
This is a really impressive run. Of the three successful no-reload runs thus far, two of them, the Archer/Mage and Cleric/Mage, had access to mage spells and wands, and the third, the Totemic Druid->Fighter, required numerous restarts to land Harm on Belhifet. The Archer is a great character for BG2 and ToB, but it's really ill-suited to BG1 and SoD compared to the other classes, at least for a solo LoB run.
Not taking Smite maybe oversight on my part, I didn't remember it also has Critical Strike, because I've never bothered to use it in any of the runs.
You're correct about the Archer bonuses. Is it a bug or should it be that way? If it really is a bug, I should maybe try to fix that. One difference isn't much, but it should still be correct.
I thought Archer was pretty good on BG1 and SoD too. That's probably because I only usually find two class specific bottlenecks in the run, Crusader Attacks and Belhifet. Rest can be charmed away, which is currently easy in 2.5 LoB, and Sarevok can be pretty much killed with general tactics, using all One Gift Losts, Oils of Fiery Burnings, Potions of Explosions and Potions of Firebreaths in the game. Archer blasts through the Crusader Attacks, and I think Belhifet is very repeatable with all hitting almost flat damage from Bullets of Darkness and Champion's Strength scroll stacking. Tanking will get him always at least Near Death, and then he can be finished with Arrows of Detonation.
Also noticed that I almost always play the start of BG2 the same way, with general tactics, so I haven't really even taken advantage of Archer specific stuff yet, only in few encounters. And I've already lost my bows, and wont probably even use slings because I don't have GWW's. I thought having Critical Strike with the Energy Blades was the better alternative. But we'll see.
Just to clarify a typo, the slow down is after level 18, not level 8. That's not documented, so you can make up your own mind if it's a bug. I suspect it is deliberate - along the same sort of lines as monk AC at high levels - but I don't know that to be the case.
I think the archer has quite a lot going for him even in BG1. I find the availability of stealth helpful, but then I'm too mean to make the extensive use of the invisibility ring @histamiini does
Yeah Archer stealth is very good advantage, saves a lot of money in BG1, and makes Irenicus Dungeon and ambushes in BG2 pretty trivial.
Here's the general advice for XP-looping with Wand of Wonder and Stone to Flesh scrolls. It's great way of handling dual from high level first class. It only takes money, with 20/20 economy Sister Garlena can recharge the wand with 4900 gold.
1. Neutral victims wont turn red circle after Stone to Flesh, but might still cast triggers etc.
2. Remove any item that decreases spell casting time, because WoW has couple effects that will agro enemy.
3. Use WoW on enemy and watch your portrait, and pause as soon as the icon disappears. Now use WoW again and unpause. This will prevent the couple agroing spell effects from triggering. Agro spells have casting time of 2 I think, so you should have enough time to act. Petrification will happen anyway because it's an instant effect.
4. Resting after using Stone to Flesh will reset the victim.
Now how to stop Firkraag from killing himself with Melf's Acid arrow after he has 1 hp left from Petrification.
1. Stay as far away from Firkraag and close as possible of exit.
2. If WoW triggers instant Haste on Firkraag, wait it out. It's only 4 rounds I think.
3. After Stone to Flesh, absorb his first trigger and pause. It's mostly defensive triggers and Lower Resistance.
4. Click on exit and unpause.
5. Out of level use invisibility ring and rest. This resets Firkraag and you can start from the beginning again.
Note, that this needs still more testing to see if it really stops the bug.
From the first WoW I got 9 petrifications, 5 from the second and 7 from the third. I'm almost level 14, so I'm not that worried if the bug happens anymore, because skeli army can handle the Gauths I think.