Really I think Tony K's AI mod, Kaedrin's Prc, the Client Extender, NEN's face and hair compilation, and the other small graphical mods make the game pretty amazing.
The AI mod lets you make the game turn based and then I feel all the D&D rules shine very well. I think if they did make an EE with the permission to use those mods NWN2 might be my number 1 game again (it was my number 1 but when I did my BG>SoD>BG2>ToB run it made BG my number 1 game/series).
Hit F to bring up the spell list on the side and from there you can cast all your spells. If you mean something else then I am unsure what you mean.
Go into Strategy Mode by clicking the middle button on the right end of the action bar. It looks like a RTS selection tool. This allows Marquee selection https://puu.sh/xwIwk/45b823200d.jpg
also under options go to Strategy Camera and put move freely under camera control, I can't remember the specific option. This allows you to move the camera around like BG.
as for tactical formation I am unsure myself if that is a thing.
The standard way of playing NWN/NWN2 is you control one character (at a time) and the AI controls your companions. It's not Baldur's Gate, it's its own thing, more like KotOR and Mass Effect.
NWN2 does have some tools to allow BG style control, but they are tacked on, so not ideal. The game isn't so difficult that you need that level of control.
The only thing difficult about the games is convincing your allies not to burn through their spell slots like there's no tomorrow. Sure, with the way Resting works in those games you can easily refill spell slots, but it is annoying having to perform a "Long Rest" every encounter.
And don't get me started on caster companions with AoE spells...
My issues are fairly basic ones: - How do I select several party members? I can't figure out if there's a BG-style "drag a box around some people" mechanic. (Hopefully there is, and I just missed it.) - How do I arrange party members in a tactical formation? Again, hopefully this capability is there and I'm just missing it. - How do I know what each party member is doing? In BG when I click on a team member, their target pulses or whatever. NWN2 is a bit flashy so it's hard to tell, but It doesn't seem like that's there. - How do I cast spells? I found a hotkey for "quickcast" but is there a simple "cast" button somwhere, like BG's?
-It's a totally different control scheme than you're used to. You don't select multiple party members because they're programmed to follow you around and follow your orders automatically. It's *supposed* to be easier than the old way, but it's often not. They have four different modes - attack nearest, guard me, hold your ground, and follow without attacking. These modes can be accessed and dragged to your quick bar by pressing "V". The peaceful follow mode is under "exploration", and the other command modes are under "combat". Peaceful follow and hold your ground modes are very important to keep them from running off and aggroing everything in the area, and from walking into traps before Neeshka can disarm them. I found the party control nearly impossible until I learned how to access and use the voice commands.
-No formations. If you want your tank to go in front, you have to take direct control of that character by clicking on it. In the character AI tabs, you can access some check boxes that direct party members whether to follow at close, medium, or far distance from the party leader. You can also set how they use ranged versus melee weapons, cast spells or not, use items or not, and use abilities or not.
-You have to just remember what each party member is doing. They'll usually be using their default attack. They will sometimes switch targets randomly. They will sometimes countermand your orders if you're not in direct control of them, so if you need to be sure a spell gets cast, it's best to stay in control of that person until they do it. (See EDIT below.)
-I like to turn on both horizontal and vertical quick action bars (there are two of each) in the settings. I then drag the spell icons to the various boxes. You have to either use the quickcast menu, which I don't like, because it takes up so much space on the screen, or have every spell icon in the quick action bars to cast each spell, which is how I do it. You can also click on the tiny arrows on the main quick action bar to scroll among ten different quick action bars.
It's a far from perfect system, and many people got turned off to NWN 1 and 2 because of it, especially Baldur's Gate fans. However, I love NWN 1 and 2 as much as BG. The combat is not anywhere near as hard in NWN 1 and 2 as it is in BG, and that makes up for the quirky party control for me. I also enjoy the stories, quests, and character building, I like the NPC's, and I like NWN because it's Forgotten Realms and D&D, and I pretty much love anything FR or D&D based.
EDIT: I forgot to mention, there's an action queue up in the upper left corner or the top center that can help you see what party members are doing. You can only see the action queue for whichever party member you are controlling. If that icon is a sword, they're planning to use their default attack on their next turn. It will turn to a cross if they're going to heal, or a spell icon if they're going to cast. You can stack multiple orders for round actions in an action queue.
EDIT2: You can slow down the camera speed by editing the .ini file in your game folder. The minimum edge turn speed will be something like 7 or 8. You need to take the minimum number down to 1 or 2, and then move the slider in the game options down all the way. Why they set the minimum edge turn speed to such a ridiculously fast, dizziness and headache-inducing speed I will never understand. I found NWN2 unplayable until I learned how to edit the camera speed.
I still think a party in nwn 2 is more manageable than dragging around Npcs in nwn 1 was. Usually henchmen just made the game harder for me...At least on Core difficulty, since you cannot aim spells properly with the henchmen ai or navigate traps without incident.... With Nwn 2 npcs you can always turn puppet mode on/off. I mean it's slow and not very comfortable, but it can be DONE at least.
Isn't DA:I far worse than nwn 2 in terms of party management? Maybe it's just me.. I was grinding my teeth at the camera and party management in Inquisition. It's like someone on the dev team hated party overview there...I could not play that properly anyway.
yeah, it's something they fixed in pathfinder and 5e where cantrips you can cast an infinite number of times. Not sure why wotc decided them to be limited in 3.0/3.5 /shrug
@subtledoctor , I'm not sure what you mean by "basic universal action". I think the voice command modes I told you seem to address that - You can click for "everybody attack the closest enemy to you", "everybody attack the enemy closest to me", "everybody follow me and attack nothing", or "everybody stand your ground and stay rooted to your current position".
I would only want it if UI, controls, camera, and combat were improved. If it were more like NWN but with the good parts of the Infinity Engine, the game would be so much better.
The thing to understand about NWN is it wasn't designed to be an NPC party based game. It was designed to be multiplayer, or single player with a drone sidekick. NWN2 added companions but they are still drones, it's not really a party based game. Athough you can switch between characters in 2, you might find it helps to limit yourself to only controlling the protagonist, and shout orders to the rest of the party.
You might also find it helps to play NWN1. Remember NWN2 is a sequel to that game, not Baldur's Gate.
@subtledoctor , As far as I can tell, your basic complaint is that "Neverwinter Nights 2 is a different game from Baldur's Gate, and its UI was a step backward from the already perfect UI of BG."
I can't really argue with that. I'm sorry that the differences in controls are apparently ruining your ability to enjoy NWN or like it.
It wasn't Obsidian, it was Bioware in NWN1. And they weren't trying to reinvent the wheel because NWN was never intended to play like Baldur's Gate. If Obsidian is guilty of anything it is of adding more BG-like features to the NWN format. The original game has at least as much in common with WoW, Diablo and RollD20 as it does with Baldur's Gate.
1) "Premiere" = marketing hype. 2) "Dungeons & Dragons". Hillsfar, Stronghold, Lords of Waterdeap, Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance and Sword Coast Legends are all "Dungeons & Dragons". None of them are much like Baldur's Gate. 3) It is not a "squad based" game. The "squad" is tagged onto what was designed to be a multiplayer online game. 4) It's not a tactical game. X-Com is a tactical game. NWN is a social story-telling game. 5) The pause function only works in single player mode. The game is actually designed to be played without using it, and it is disabled in multiplayer. That is why the UI is designed the way it is. 6) I'm not being defensive. I'm actually fairly critical of NWN2. But on the basis of it's characters, plot, graphics, bugs and optimisation. Not the way the game plays, which does what it was designed to do. You are criticising a dog for not being a cat.
I would seriously recommend you tried NWN1 to get some understanding of what the original designers set out to achieve. If you can play it multiplayer and have a go with the toolset so much the better.
That's just it: you insist you are playing a "squad based tactical game" then complain that the game doesn't have the features that give you full tactical control over your squad, like the ability to set a formation (you will also find, if you haven't already, that even if you go round each party member whilst paused and give them instructions they will sometimes change thier minds and do something different).
This did not happen by mistake, or because the developers "forgot". It works like that because it's not a squad based tactical game. Specifically, its designed to be playable without pausing, and you can't directly control a squad without pausing.
You are right, the NWN1 OC only gives you one companion, and they behave much like mercenaries in Diablo, running around after the player character and using thier abilities as the AI dictates. However, NWN1 does support more companions, and the expansion packs and other additional content give you 2-4 companions. You still don't have direct control over them though. NWN2 works the same way - unsurprisingly, since it uses the same engine. The only addition in the sequel is it allows you to "possess" a companion and control them directly whilst the main character runs around under AI comtrol.
Frankly, if you are looking for team based tactics, you are going to find NWN2 just as disappointing as NWN1.
It's only "hard" because you are trying to control the characters like BG rather than like NWN. If you want Neeshka to use a crossbow set her AI to ranged, set her follow distance to long and issue the "follow me" command until you want her to attack, then issue "attack my target" "defend me" or "attack nearest enemy" orders. Simple. The fights are generally much easier than Baldur's Gate.
Well, I think there's no need for any of us to dig into our respective points of view to the point that we can't see what the other is saying. I totally see @subtledoctor 's points, and I would agree that NWN2 makes it much harder to control a party than BG does. The devs included "puppet mode", and the ability to turn off the party AI with a button in the bottom left corner of the screen, so I think the player is supposed to have a choice to play with player-mananged party tactics if he or she wants to. It just doesn't work as well as in BG because the game is designed to try to accommodate different playstyles, and has mixed success doing so.
I definitely disagree that NWN2 is designed or "meant" to be a multiplayer game. I've been playing it as a single player for years, ever since it was released. The cutscenes, the need for a main character to drive the plot (Harborman, son of Esmerelle, raised by Daegun, Shardbearer, etc.) the trial, the fight with Lorne - all of that stuff screams "single player Charname meets party of colorful NPC's and travels with that party, being the main character of his or her own personal story."
It would be more accurate to say the game engine used by NWN1/NWN2 is a multiplayer engine. The NWN2 OC is designed to be played by a single player, but it is using an engine designed for multiplayer, and that is the reason for a lot of it's quirks.
Eh, I always had the impression that with NWN they wanted to create an action-RPG like demon stone, or maybe even a hack'n'slash like Champions of Norrath, but halfway through the devs were like "Fuckit, we're gonna stick to the BG concept." Only halfway through that they were like "Nah, this gonna be a multiplayer" and halfway through that they started running out of funding and the bossman came in and were all like "Ok people, time to wrap it up, and plaster on whatever story we can shit out on time!"
With NWN2 however, they wanted to create what DA:O is, but failed. And also the graphics suck, it looks like Mario 64.
And thats a problem. Demon Stone, Champions of Norrath and also KOTOR are better games than NWN, and DA:O is a better game than NWN2, and if what you want is BG3, well, then you dont want NWN at all, what you want is PoE. So, why would you ever play NWN or NWN2 when there are superior alternatives? Especially considering NWN2 is a buggy mess.
Comments
The AI mod lets you make the game turn based and then I feel all the D&D rules shine very well. I think if they did make an EE with the permission to use those mods NWN2 might be my number 1 game again (it was my number 1 but when I did my BG>SoD>BG2>ToB run it made BG my number 1 game/series).
Go into Strategy Mode by clicking the middle button on the right end of the action bar. It looks like a RTS selection tool. This allows Marquee selection
https://puu.sh/xwIwk/45b823200d.jpg
also under options go to Strategy Camera and put move freely under camera control, I can't remember the specific option. This allows you to move the camera around like BG.
as for tactical formation I am unsure myself if that is a thing.
NWN2 does have some tools to allow BG style control, but they are tacked on, so not ideal. The game isn't so difficult that you need that level of control.
And don't get me started on caster companions with AoE spells...
-It's a totally different control scheme than you're used to. You don't select multiple party members because they're programmed to follow you around and follow your orders automatically. It's *supposed* to be easier than the old way, but it's often not.
They have four different modes - attack nearest, guard me, hold your ground, and follow without attacking. These modes can be accessed and dragged to your quick bar by pressing "V". The peaceful follow mode is under "exploration", and the other command modes are under "combat".
Peaceful follow and hold your ground modes are very important to keep them from running off and aggroing everything in the area, and from walking into traps before Neeshka can disarm them. I found the party control nearly impossible until I learned how to access and use the voice commands.
-No formations. If you want your tank to go in front, you have to take direct control of that character by clicking on it. In the character AI tabs, you can access some check boxes that direct party members whether to follow at close, medium, or far distance from the party leader. You can also set how they use ranged versus melee weapons, cast spells or not, use items or not, and use abilities or not.
-You have to just remember what each party member is doing. They'll usually be using their default attack. They will sometimes switch targets randomly. They will sometimes countermand your orders if you're not in direct control of them, so if you need to be sure a spell gets cast, it's best to stay in control of that person until they do it. (See EDIT below.)
-I like to turn on both horizontal and vertical quick action bars (there are two of each) in the settings. I then drag the spell icons to the various boxes. You have to either use the quickcast menu, which I don't like, because it takes up so much space on the screen, or have every spell icon in the quick action bars to cast each spell, which is how I do it. You can also click on the tiny arrows on the main quick action bar to scroll among ten different quick action bars.
It's a far from perfect system, and many people got turned off to NWN 1 and 2 because of it, especially Baldur's Gate fans. However, I love NWN 1 and 2 as much as BG. The combat is not anywhere near as hard in NWN 1 and 2 as it is in BG, and that makes up for the quirky party control for me. I also enjoy the stories, quests, and character building, I like the NPC's, and I like NWN because it's Forgotten Realms and D&D, and I pretty much love anything FR or D&D based.
EDIT: I forgot to mention, there's an action queue up in the upper left corner or the top center that can help you see what party members are doing. You can only see the action queue for whichever party member you are controlling. If that icon is a sword, they're planning to use their default attack on their next turn. It will turn to a cross if they're going to heal, or a spell icon if they're going to cast. You can stack multiple orders for round actions in an action queue.
EDIT2: You can slow down the camera speed by editing the .ini file in your game folder. The minimum edge turn speed will be something like 7 or 8. You need to take the minimum number down to 1 or 2, and then move the slider in the game options down all the way. Why they set the minimum edge turn speed to such a ridiculously fast, dizziness and headache-inducing speed I will never understand. I found NWN2 unplayable until I learned how to edit the camera speed.
Isn't DA:I far worse than nwn 2 in terms of party management? Maybe it's just me.. I was grinding my teeth at the camera and party management in Inquisition. It's like someone on the dev team hated party overview there...I could not play that properly anyway.
/shrug
You might also find it helps to play NWN1. Remember NWN2 is a sequel to that game, not Baldur's Gate.
I can't really argue with that. I'm sorry that the differences in controls are apparently ruining your ability to enjoy NWN or like it.
2) "Dungeons & Dragons". Hillsfar, Stronghold, Lords of Waterdeap, Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance and Sword Coast Legends are all "Dungeons & Dragons". None of them are much like Baldur's Gate.
3) It is not a "squad based" game. The "squad" is tagged onto what was designed to be a multiplayer online game.
4) It's not a tactical game. X-Com is a tactical game. NWN is a social story-telling game.
5) The pause function only works in single player mode. The game is actually designed to be played without using it, and it is disabled in multiplayer. That is why the UI is designed the way it is.
6) I'm not being defensive. I'm actually fairly critical of NWN2. But on the basis of it's characters, plot, graphics, bugs and optimisation. Not the way the game plays, which does what it was designed to do. You are criticising a dog for not being a cat.
I would seriously recommend you tried NWN1 to get some understanding of what the original designers set out to achieve. If you can play it multiplayer and have a go with the toolset so much the better.
This did not happen by mistake, or because the developers "forgot". It works like that because it's not a squad based tactical game. Specifically, its designed to be playable without pausing, and you can't directly control a squad without pausing.
You are right, the NWN1 OC only gives you one companion, and they behave much like mercenaries in Diablo, running around after the player character and using thier abilities as the AI dictates. However, NWN1 does support more companions, and the expansion packs and other additional content give you 2-4 companions. You still don't have direct control over them though. NWN2 works the same way - unsurprisingly, since it uses the same engine. The only addition in the sequel is it allows you to "possess" a companion and control them directly whilst the main character runs around under AI comtrol.
Frankly, if you are looking for team based tactics, you are going to find NWN2 just as disappointing as NWN1.
You are playing a multiplayer game on your own.
'tis not the same.
It's only "hard" because you are trying to control the characters like BG rather than like NWN. If you want Neeshka to use a crossbow set her AI to ranged, set her follow distance to long and issue the "follow me" command until you want her to attack, then issue "attack my target" "defend me" or "attack nearest enemy" orders. Simple. The fights are generally much easier than Baldur's Gate.
I definitely disagree that NWN2 is designed or "meant" to be a multiplayer game. I've been playing it as a single player for years, ever since it was released. The cutscenes, the need for a main character to drive the plot (Harborman, son of Esmerelle, raised by Daegun, Shardbearer, etc.) the trial, the fight with Lorne - all of that stuff screams "single player Charname meets party of colorful NPC's and travels with that party, being the main character of his or her own personal story."
With NWN2 however, they wanted to create what DA:O is, but failed. And also the graphics suck, it looks like Mario 64.
And thats a problem. Demon Stone, Champions of Norrath and also KOTOR are better games than NWN, and DA:O is a better game than NWN2, and if what you want is BG3, well, then you dont want NWN at all, what you want is PoE. So, why would you ever play NWN or NWN2 when there are superior alternatives? Especially considering NWN2 is a buggy mess.
But the success of NWN was based around it's easy to uses toolset, player DM, and build-your-own-MMO persistent worlds.
I agree about NWN2. Obsidian tried to force it's square pin into the Baldur's Gate round hole, and it didn't really work.