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Unfinished buisness mod?

How do I install this? its really annoying some quests go nowhere, like Kagains quest.
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Comments

  • jasteyjastey Member Posts: 376
    BG1NPC Project has a finish to Kagain's quest as well.
    To answer your question: The most current version of bg1ub is here.
    If you have SoD from GOG or Steam, make sure to run modmerge first.
    Then, install bg1ub according to the install guide in the readme.
    LeokostaAstroBryGuy
  • WatchForWolvesWatchForWolves Member Posts: 88
    Other than Kagain's all quests go somewhere. And EE has the fix for Kagain included(as soon as you enter the map N of Beregost he gives up, quest complete) Alternatively you can simply not accept his quest at all, since it's meaningless.

    I really can't recommended BG1UB, the content it restores is done half-assedly and it seems to not properly recognize EE installations anyway.
    JCDenton
  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 1,775
    edited June 2
    @WatchForWolves
    half-assedly? but why? i feel like you're the first person to say so.

    edit: i could rephrase it like this - if UB has been done half-assedly, which mod in your opinion is more competently created and polished?
  • jasteyjastey Member Posts: 376
    edited June 2

    it seems to not properly recognize EE installations anyway.

    Which version did you install? If it's the current one updated by @AstroBryGuy please give us a hint as to what went wrong in your installation. If it wasn't the EE compatible version, ...then don't say something like this.

  • WatchForWolvesWatchForWolves Member Posts: 88
    edited June 2
    I got the latest version from PPG. Page says it's 13.1, readme says it's 14.0(how about that, problems before we even get into the game) I see there's also 14.1 on the forums, but changelog doesn't mention any specific BG:EE compatibility changes.
    bob_veng said:

    @WatchForWolves
    half-assedly? but why? i feel like you're the first person to say so.

    Like that pointlessly powerful ghost in Ulcaster with absolutely jumbled dialogue tree, or the fallen Paladin in Firewine, whom I killed and then the zombie which was supposed to attack him never turned hostile to me. It's been a while since I played the mod but overall it just seemed like they restored what was commented out in the code without actually improving it to the level where it shouldn't have been commented out in the first place. It's like Thief Gold all over again.
  • jasteyjastey Member Posts: 376
    edited June 2
    @WatchForWolves I can understand that you are disappointed from the behavior you encountered in the game, but instead of badmouthing a mod you think introduced the glitches how about being constructive and report the encountered bugs to the mod's maintainer? The modding scene is people doing all this in their free time, and mods can only be as good as the feedback and reports the players give for it. I never read about a bug report concerning the things you mentioned, and that with all the players out there using this mod - I would think someone would have encountered it by now (and reported it*). Also, you stated that the mod didn't "properly recognize EE installations" in your case and unless you can specify this maybe you should stop telling things like that.

    *I'm not saying it's not possible these bugs are in the mod, I am only surprised you'd be the only one encountering them.
    PaulaMigrateThacoBell
  • UnderstandMouseMagicUnderstandMouseMagic Member Posts: 1,324
    There's a fallen Paladin in Firewine?
    Somebody give me a pointer please.

    I think the people modding deserve a lot of respect for what they are doing. And certainly don't deserve any bad mouthing. As I'm not a modder in an way, shape or form, I can safely say,

    If you don't like other people's efforts, do it yourself.

    PaulaMigrateThacoBellGusindaBalrog99
  • GallowglassGallowglass Member Posts: 3,356

    I think the people modding deserve a lot of respect for what they are doing.

    Hmmm, well, some modders deserve a lot of respect for serious, quality work ... some other modders, not so much. I don't see anything inherently unreasonable about a user giving his opinions about which mods are good work and which are not.

    (For the avoidance of doubt, I haven't tried UB and have no opinion of my own.)
  • OniDaimyoOniDaimyo Member Posts: 25
    So thanks for de-railing everything. So this mod isn't worth it?
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 2,785

    There's a fallen Paladin in Firewine?
    Somebody give me a pointer please.

    Check out the base of the bridge at night.
  • UnderstandMouseMagicUnderstandMouseMagic Member Posts: 1,324
    OniDaimyo said:

    So thanks for de-railing everything. So this mod isn't worth it?

    I think it is.

    The NPC projest is vital IMO, UB adds some nice things. Sorry I can't be more exact but I've had it installed for so long I don't know exactly what it does but would probably miss things if it wasn't there.
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 2,785

    I got the latest version from PPG. Page says it's 13.1, readme says it's 14.0(how about that, problems before we even get into the game) I see there's also 14.1 on the forums, but changelog doesn't mention any specific BG:EE compatibility changes.

    bob_veng said:

    @WatchForWolves
    half-assedly? but why? i feel like you're the first person to say so.

    Like that pointlessly powerful ghost in Ulcaster with absolutely jumbled dialogue tree, or the fallen Paladin in Firewine, whom I killed and then the zombie which was supposed to attack him never turned hostile to me. It's been a while since I played the mod but overall it just seemed like they restored what was commented out in the code without actually improving it to the level where it shouldn't have been commented out in the first place. It's like Thief Gold all over again.
    If you look at the README file (http://mods.pocketplane.net/readmes/BG1UB-Readme.html), you'll see the changelog for version 14 starts out, "Version 14 (BGEE Compatibility)". Then, many of the individual changes specifically reference BGEE (e.g., "BGEE: Creature Restorations - Created BGEE version of ubcorian.cre").

    The BG1UB thread on this forum is titled "BG1 Unfinished Business v14.1 (with BGEE compatibility)". And the first post of the thread states: "Main highlights of v14: BGEE compatibility"

    I don't know how I could state that BGEE Compatibility is part of v14 any plainer.

    if you have a specific bug report or feedback on mod content, please make a post in the BG1UB discussion thread. Mods are improved by bug reports and feedback from users. If you really don't like the mod (or certain components of the mod), you are under no obligation to use it.
    JuliusBorisovThacoBellelminster
  • PaulaMigratePaulaMigrate Member Posts: 887
    edited June 2
    I have played large modded games in the old game (mostly BGT installs) and now with EET in the *new world* for over a decade. As that I declare myself a *Player of mods* and I think I know almost all of them.
    Some remarks
    - there a good ones and bad ones, aside from the matters of taste. Bad ones you play once and leave them out in the next install.
    - there are worth attempts that may still have bugs and issues. Like @AstroBryGuy and @jastey were saying, you support them by providing feedback and making suggestions and reporting stuff. I never found a modder who does not respond positive if you try to help to improve a mod.
    - whether you like a mod or not can only be determined by YOURSELF and by PLAYING it. Forums are full of people commenting/critisizing on stuff they have not even experienced themself. Just remember the whole discussion about SoD just a short while back - 80% of **** written about it was by people who did not even play it.
    - yes, and mods are a matter of taste, at least those which provide characters and stories. Even if I do not like a mod's contents, it can be a well done effort. I like Chloe despite the fact she is a lesbian which has nothing to do with my real life. I do not like Ajantis even if it is a superb mod because he is such an unfailable paladin through and through. But never would I call them *bad* mods just because I cannot agree with their contents.
    - the great bulk of mods, quests and NPCs are an enhancement of the game. There are quite a few that are far better than original contents, just because the modder had far more freedom and far less time pressure than the poor developper who had to deliver to a boss/company cheap and on time.

    Ah, yes - Unfinished Business (same as BG1NPCs) has become so much an integral part of the game that I cannot even tell all the details belonging to it - only that I would surely recognise if anything is missing.
  • WatchForWolvesWatchForWolves Member Posts: 88

    If you look at the README file (http://mods.pocketplane.net/readmes/BG1UB-Readme.html), you'll see the changelog for version 14 starts out, "Version 14 (BGEE Compatibility)". Then, many of the individual changes specifically reference BGEE (e.g., "BGEE: Creature Restorations - Created BGEE version of ubcorian.cre").

    And, at the very top, it plainly states: "A mod for BG1Tutu and Baldur's Gate Trilogy". But that's beside the point, as I was referring specifically to the thread on BG1UB forums.

    Finally, if the mod is EE compatible, why does it restore the nobles hiding their valuables in Candlekeep Inn even though they already do in EE, and why does it add ending to Kagain's quest even though EE already does that?
    if you have a specific bug report or feedback on mod content, please make a post in the BG1UB discussion thread. Mods are improved by bug reports and feedback from users. If you really don't like the mod (or certain components of the mod), you are under no obligation to use it.
    So in other words, what you and @jastey are saying is this: you can either praise a mod, or report bugs for a mod, but never criticize it? Outstanding.
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 2,785
    edited June 2

    If you look at the README file (http://mods.pocketplane.net/readmes/BG1UB-Readme.html), you'll see the changelog for version 14 starts out, "Version 14 (BGEE Compatibility)". Then, many of the individual changes specifically reference BGEE (e.g., "BGEE: Creature Restorations - Created BGEE version of ubcorian.cre").

    And, at the very top, it plainly states: "A mod for BG1Tutu and Baldur's Gate Trilogy". But that's beside the point, as I was referring specifically to the thread on BG1UB forums.
    Then that line in the README needs to be updated (and has needed to be updated for about a decade, since BG1UB supports BG1 and BG1+TotSC too :smile:).

    The thread for v14.1 doesn't mention any specific BGEE compatibility changes because those are in the changelog for v14.0 - i.e., when BGEE compatibility was added. The changelog for v14.1 contains the changes I have made since the previous release, i.e. v14.0. Aside from updating variables to support EET (which implies BGEE, I guess), there were no BGEE-specific changes.

    The v14.0 forum thread (http://forums.pocketplane.net/index.php/topic,29556.0.html) specifically mentions BGEE compatibility.
    Finally, if the mod is EE compatible, why does it restore the nobles hiding their valuables in Candlekeep Inn even though they already do in EE, and why does it add ending to Kagain's quest even though EE already does that?
    If I missed something that the EEs also restored, then that would be a bug. Please report it. It doesn't mean the mod isn't BGEE compatible.
    So in other words, what you and @jastey are saying is this: you can either praise a mod, or report bugs for a mod, but never criticize it? Outstanding.
    Neither @jastey or I ever said anything of the sort.

    I actually asked for "bug reports and feedback on mod content" (emphasis added). The latter would include criticism of the mod.

    Also, constructive criticism (e.g., "CREATURE X is overpowered, how about toning it down?") is more useful than just saying it's "half-[BLEEP]ed". But you're free to post the latter.
    AndreaColombo
  • jasteyjastey Member Posts: 376
    The BG:EE part of the mod takes account of the BG:EE content for Kagain's quest.

    Critizising done right is feedback, too, and welcome (to most modders). But that's not what you are doing (and I guess you know that.)
    AstroBryGuyThacoBell
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 2,785
    edited June 3

    Finally, if the mod is EE compatible, why does it restore the nobles hiding their valuables in Candlekeep Inn even though they already do in EE, and why does it add ending to Kagain's quest even though EE already does that?

    BG1UB offers a different (and, in my opinion, better) resolution to Kagain's Caravan Quest than the one in BG1/BGEE. The BG1/BGEE quest ending is just a termination of quest, unresolved. Since BG1UB is very modular, users have the choice of installing BG1UB's version, or sticking with the vanilla BGEE version.

    For the Howells in Candlekeep, BG1UB only patches the dialog state where you've charmed Mr. Howell. No other dialog states are edited. There's an inconsequential bug in which BG1UB adds a second GivePartyGold(20) command to his actions. However, since GivePartyGold() requires the creature have enough gold to give and Mr. Howell only has 20 gold, he can only give you a total of 20 gold.

    Frankly, they're just glad to be off the island... :wink:
    ZaghoulAndreaColombo
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 3,146
    "you can either praise a mod, or report bugs for a mod, but never criticize it? Outstanding." This may surprise some people, but it is actually possible to be constructive with criticism and not be a jerk.
    AndreaColomboGallowglasssemiticgodBalrog99
  • WatchForWolvesWatchForWolves Member Posts: 88


    Neither @jastey or I ever said anything of the sort. (...) Also, constructive criticism (e.g., "CREATURE X is overpowered, how about toning it down?") is more useful than just saying it's "half-[BLEEP]ed"..

    Not only you did said that, you just basically repeated it: instead of saying what I think about the mod, I should only report bugs or "write constructive feedback". How do you even rationalize this...
  • jasteyjastey Member Posts: 376
    @WatchForWolves Sorry to keep this going, but you did not post what you think of the mod. You wrote "the content it restores is done half-assedly and it seems to not properly recognize EE installations anyway. " That's not an opinion. You state it as a fact. (I am still waiting for your explanation how the v14 you have isn't supposed to recognize EE installations properly, btw.)

    You say you know the mod behaves that way. I say: you can only be sure a mod is really the source of your game experience if you did bug hunting to nail the issues down to this specific mod. Otherwise, don't blame a mod because you don't know it's really the mod's fault.
    And: if you did all the bug hunting so you can nail the issues to a certain mod - why the -beep- didn't you spend the 10 extra minutes and let the modder know.
    ThacoBell
  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 1,775


    Neither @jastey or I ever said anything of the sort. (...) Also, constructive criticism (e.g., "CREATURE X is overpowered, how about toning it down?") is more useful than just saying it's "half-[BLEEP]ed"..

    Not only you did said that, you just basically repeated it: instead of saying what I think about the mod, I should only report bugs or "write constructive feedback". How do you even rationalize this...
    (real) criticism = constructive feedback

    criticism is not about being negative and *itchy, it's about being ... constructive

    you should be happy that the mod is still being developed and supported, what a fantastic thing to be able to effortlessly install, play and help improve such a classic mod for this old, classic game, it's almost a miracle! take a myriad other games from the 90s that are also fantastic that never even got a content restoration mod, let alone having the mod scene active in 2017. gotta check your privilege sometimes
    GirewanThacoBellJuliusBorisov
  • OniDaimyoOniDaimyo Member Posts: 25
    Should I even bother with this mod? I hate that some quests seem to go nowhere. I like all the side stuff to do and learn more about NPCs.
  • UnderstandMouseMagicUnderstandMouseMagic Member Posts: 1,324
    OniDaimyo said:

    Should I even bother with this mod? I hate that some quests seem to go nowhere. I like all the side stuff to do and learn more about NPCs.

    yes.

    But it is restored content so if it doesn't satisfy you enough, put it down to that being the game developers themselves. (I think that's the correct way to look at UB).

    If you want more added content for the NPC and to learn about them more, then NPC project is the mod that you should install.
    That mod has a lot of content written by people/modders all collected together, and it is considered almost vital to make BG come alive. Banters, a few sidequests, romances ect.
    ThacoBell
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 2,785
    edited June 3
    OniDaimyo said:

    Should I even bother with this mod? I hate that some quests seem to go nowhere. I like all the side stuff to do and learn more about NPCs.

    Yes. It's a great mod. I don't leave Candlekeep without it. :wink:

    If you want to learn more about the NPCs, you should also look at BG1NPC. It expands the NPCs a lot, giving them more dialogs and banters. Just install BG1NPC before BG1UB.

    https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/39422/bg1npc-v22-8
    Post edited by AstroBryGuy on
  • AstroBryGuyAstroBryGuy Member Posts: 2,785
    edited June 3


    Neither @jastey or I ever said anything of the sort. (...) Also, constructive criticism (e.g., "CREATURE X is overpowered, how about toning it down?") is more useful than just saying it's "half-[BLEEP]ed"..

    Not only you did said that, you just basically repeated it: instead of saying what I think about the mod, I should only report bugs or "write constructive feedback". How do you even rationalize this...
    Again, I did not say you "should only report bugs or 'write constructive feedback'". I said that constructive criticism is more useful than simply saying the mod is done "half-[BLEEP]edly", but I did NOT say you can't post such criticism. In fact, I specifically said that you are "free to post" such criticism.

    At this point, you're twisting my words and fabricating quotes (the quote "write constructive feedback" is not something I ever wrote). So, I'm done.
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 6,628
    If you're offering constructive feedback, you're doing two things:

    1. Pointing a specific part of the mod that you didn't like.
    2. Explaining what you wish the mod would do instead.

    If you're doing both of those things, then you're contributing in two different ways:

    1. You're letting players know if they might like the mod, because they know what you liked or didn't like.
    2. The mod creator now knows how to improve the mod.

    If you're not doing both of those things, it's not constructive feedback. It may be a valid opinion, but it doesn't provide any useful information for the mod creator, nor does it tell anything about the mod to prospective players like @OniDaimyo.

    An example: Let's say ToB was a mod. I say that ToB is too linear, and I wish it had more side quests in new areas, like a smaller Watcher's Keep dungeon. That feedback is constructive because:

    1. People who don't like linear games will know they won't like ToB.
    2. People who do like linear games will know they will like it.
    3. The mod creator would know that I for one would like the mod more if it had a little extra dungeon crawling.

    People might not agree with me, and the mod creator might never take the suggestion. But I'm still offering useful information because I'm being specific about what I didn't like about ToB, and what I would like instead. If I just said "I don't like ToB," it's still my opinion and that's still fine...

    ...but it doesn't tell anybody anything about the mod.

    Personally, I don't know much about BG1's Unfinished Business mod. But the mod in BG2 was quite good. In terms of quality and tone and immersion and so forth, it fit in perfectly with the original game.
    ThacoBellJuliusBorisovMathsorcerer
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 6,628
    @WatchForWolves: What exactly do you think should be changed about Unfinished Business? That would give @OniDaimyo an idea of whether s/he might like it.
  • WatchForWolvesWatchForWolves Member Posts: 88
    Uh yeah, I know how constructive feedback works, thanks. Have you considered the possibility that I did not write 1000 words about what I think about the mod since I simply couldn't be arsed - especially since I had a hunch I'll be flogged for my opinions either way?

    Unlike for example @UnderstandMouseMagic, who praised the mod and yet no one demanded justifications from her(?). Funny how that works, isn't it? It's almost like it's less about "constructive feedback" and more about some people being offended because I didn't like their work. Or just didn't like what they liked in general.
    jastey said:

    @WatchForWolves Sorry to keep this going, but you did not post what you think of the mod. You wrote "the content it restores is done half-assedly and it seems to not properly recognize EE installations anyway. " That's not an opinion. You state it as a fact.

    I assure you I am not omniscient and everything I write is my own opinion until proven otherwise. Sorry if that was not clear. I get confused with a deity all the time; I should have known better.
    Gallowglass
  • OniDaimyoOniDaimyo Member Posts: 25
    Not all deities are smart...look at goblin ones.
    mf2112
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member, Moderator Posts: 6,628
    The reason praise doesn't need to be specific is because you're not asking anyone to change anything. Criticism is different.
    ThacoBell
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