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  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    Facebook's temporary ban on political advertising and Twitter's labeling of Trump's tweets are triggering the growth of some new social media apps like Parler, Rumble, and Newsmax.
    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/11/technology/facebook-twitter-parler-rumble-newsmax-conservatives-apps.html
    Apparently the fear of censorship has grown big enough to prompt a bunch of people to advocate switching to new communities where conservatives would be predominant and the companies in charge wouldn't try to fight disinformation.
    We don't know if the exodus will be permanent, but either way, we've got more conservatives seeking out further-right echo chambers on the grounds that the rest of the world is a liberal echo chamber.

    The rise of the alt-right and more recently QAnon has already shown us just how far you can warp someone's entire worldview if you feed them a steady stream of misinformation, and the GOP leadership has discovered that there isn't actually anything stopping them from just making shit up.

    A host of bullshit conspiracy theories has already sprung up in the wake of the election, and no amount of fact checking is going to perturb people who don't think Democrats are supposed to win elections; it doesn't even matter that a new accusation of voter fraud is based on absolutely nothing.

    The reason we don't have an unregulated marketplace for drugs is because opiates are addictive and people will take them no matter how unhealthy they are, as long as it makes them feel good in the short term. The reason we can't have an unregulated free marketplace of ideas is because some people will make shit up and other folks will believe it if, no matter how fake or toxic it is, as long as it tells them they're the good guys and their enemies are the bad guys.

    My friend Dustin--the former friend I mentioned who hurled a series of insults at me when I came out as trans--fell into an alt right rabbit hole somewhere along the way, and he didn't want to get out or challenge his beliefs because they suited him. His ideology made him feel good about himself, and given the choice between accepting his friend or continuing to believe that he was superior to liberals and trans people, the latter won out. Conspiracy theories are just like racism and bigotry; they make people feel superior to other people, feel smarter and more informed than other people.

    That feeling of superiority is more compelling than any form of evidence.

    Anger and fear are addictive, and people gleefully accept misinformation. Every Internet community that doesn't regulate speech, whether it's 4chan or Gab, spawns made-up conspiracy theories, hatred and bigotry of all kinds, and incitement of violence.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited November 2020
    Tim Pool is widely watched among young conservatives. The guy was pushing the idea that Trump would win a 49-state landslide ala Reagan just a few weeks ago. If you are so far gone that you believed Trump was going to win EVERY state but California, then you truly have cut yourself off from all reality, and this is just a surface level example.

    You wouldn't be able to find a single liberal commentator anywhere arguing something similarly bonkers, like Biden being poised to sweep Alabama and Mississippi. They weren't just conditioned to believe Trump would win (they thought Romney would win in 2012 as well, and most liberals were banking on Hilary in 2016). They were convinced he was going to win nearly every state. If you believe that, and you see Biden emerge as the winner, you have two choices. One is to abandon your preconceptions and evaluate why you were wrong. The other is to double and triple down on why you were right and go further down the rabbit-hole. This is a neverending cycle
  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,176
    edited November 2020
    Democrats demanding recount and investigations on Bush election = OK
    Democrats accusing "Russian collusion" against Trump = OK
    Trump demanding investigation on an very suspesious election = COUP!!!! Conspiracy theory!!!

    Trump flips Michigan county after ‘error’ initially had Biden in the lead
    "One Michigan county clerk caught a glitch in tabulation software so they hand counted votes and found the glitch caused 6,000 votes to go to Biden + Democrats that were meant for Trump and Republicans. 47 MI counties used this software. All must check now!"


    source : https://www.rt.com/usa/505967-michigan-antrim-county-error-trump-biden/


    If I was a elected president and was accused of Fraud, I would ask for an open investigation, since It would increase the legitimization of my government. I also don't like Trump, but he is the unique president who din't started an war.
    semiticgod wrote: »

    A host of bullshit conspiracy theories has already sprung up in the wake of the election, and no amount of fact checking is going to perturb people who don't think Democrats are supposed to win elections; it doesn't even matter that a new accusation of voter fraud is based on absolutely nothing..

    Where was the "fact checkers" when Trump was accused of being elected by Russia a accusation which was already proven wrong many times.




    USA has the last Right Wing government in Americas. Chile will get a new socialist constitution and fail like every other country. Of course, if the population on USA wanna social democracy, there are nothing that we can do against it, except try to persuade then to not vote that way. But what is the problem with then investigating the votes?

    I never saw a Trump supporter saying that the investigations on russian collusion was "coup" or "conspirator y theory"
  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,176
    edited November 2020
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    There was no demand for an "investigation" of the 2000 election by anyone, and it was a legal fight over 500 votes in one state, and also about the nature of the ballots thenselves (as in how they were designed). If you're going to pretend it's remotely analogous to anything going on now, and if you can't even bother to obtain cursory knowledge about the 2000 Florida recount before posting about it, I'm not even addressing the other points. In the end, Al Gore literally ended up overseeing and certifying his own loss on the floor of the United States Senate.

    And if you never heard a Trump supporter say that about the Russia investigation (which took place after Trump was already sworn in as President) then I suggest you expand your media horizons just a tad. There were people in this THREAD who called it that. What are you even talking about??


    I ask again. Why do democrats fear so much an investigation? Let people investigate the ballets, the election methods. If they are wrong, Biden wins much more legitimacy. But if the entire media and social media decides to try to suppress it, it will only hurts the legitimacy of Biden if he was lawfully elected. The fact is, as I've posted PEOPLE ALREADY FOUND COUNTING ERRORS in Michigan. Why not investigate even further? https://www.rt.com/usa/505967-michigan-antrim-county-error-trump-biden/

    See the timestamps
    1:40
    2:05
    2:35
    3:00
    3:10
    Here
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bi64CQBbV4

    This is not enough evidence to say "it was a fraud" but is IMO enough evidence to investigate.
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    If you care to read the previous posts from the last 3 or 4 pages you would know why. You haven't, or you ignored them, and it's not my responsibility to repeat them.
  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,176
    edited November 2020
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    If you care to read the previous posts from the last 3 or 4 pages you would know why. You haven't, or you ignored them, and it's not my responsibility to repeat them.

    I mentioned Michigan as main point.
    Page 611 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 610 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 609 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 608 - Two mentions of Michigan, both mentioning supreme court, NOT the error that I've posted
    Page 607 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 606 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 605 - ZERO mentions of Michigan

    This is the main reason which I believe that they should investigate. If they already found errors on the software used on Michigan, why not continue investigating?

    https://www.rt.com/usa/505967-michigan-antrim-county-error-trump-biden/

    And other question.

    There are ANY case of any error of the same type benefiting republicans?
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,367
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    The vaccine may be around the corner, but these last couple months are basically going to be a slaughter. There is no way the healthcare systems in these rural states can hold another week at this point. His citizens are dying and the current President is wallowing in his own private misfortune. The harshest lesson of all in this election was learning just how many citizens do not give a fuck about this at all. If Trump just decided to nuke Saskatchewan tomorrow, he wouldn't lose a single additional voter.

    Well the good ol' boys like hunting in Saskatchewan so make it Quebec and I'll agree wholeheartedly...
  • smeagolheartsmeagolheart Member Posts: 7,963
    edited November 2020
    The Media has contacted election officials in all 50 states.

    Every state says there is no evidence of voter fraud.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/10/us/politics/voting-fraud.html

    Trump is lying. He's trying to get money before he's thrown out.

    Trump lost.

    Click here for details about him losing:
    http://www.Loser.com

    USA had the last Right Wing government in Americas? What about Bolsanaro?
  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 7,811
    edited November 2020
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    The vaccine may be around the corner, but these last couple months are basically going to be a slaughter. There is no way the healthcare systems in these rural states can hold another week at this point. His citizens are dying and the current President is wallowing in his own private misfortune. The harshest lesson of all in this election was learning just how many citizens do not give a fuck about this at all. If Trump just decided to nuke Saskatchewan tomorrow, he wouldn't lose a single additional voter.

    Well the good ol' boys like hunting in Saskatchewan so make it Quebec and I'll agree wholeheartedly...

    No! I live on the Quebec border. :(

    Edit: but knowing the Trump administration, they announce they are going to bomb Quebec, but end up bombing a small part of Montana instead. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec,_Montana
  • DinoDinDinoDin Member Posts: 1,574
    edited November 2020
    jjstraka34 wrote: »
    If you care to read the previous posts from the last 3 or 4 pages you would know why. You haven't, or you ignored them, and it's not my responsibility to repeat them.

    I mentioned Michigan as main point.
    Page 611 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 610 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 609 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 608 - Two mentions of Michigan, both mentioning supreme court, NOT the error that I've posted
    Page 607 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 606 - ZERO mentions of Michigan
    Page 605 - ZERO mentions of Michigan

    This is the main reason which I believe that they should investigate. If they already found errors on the software used on Michigan, why not continue investigating?

    https://www.rt.com/usa/505967-michigan-antrim-county-error-trump-biden/

    And other question.

    There are ANY case of any error of the same type benefiting republicans?

    You didn't even read the story you linked. From the story you linked: "However, the county’s election officials now say human error was behind the problem, explaining that it’s likely a small change made to the ballot resulted in the miscalculation, according to local 9&10News."

    I'm sorry but if you're going to link to an article on here making serious allegations, you need to do due diligence. Otherwise you are spreading misinformation.

    That county, by the way, is deep red, again as the article notes. So who exactly committed the human error that the county election official say it was? Democrats?

    I don't understand why anyone expects people to take these ever-increasingly strained allegations seriously. Trump's legal team appears before judges and literally confess to have no evidence of fraud. We're told of a software glitch in red counties that the red counties then say was human error. We're told of a postal worker who makes outrageous claims to conservative activists but then cannot make those same allegations to law enforcement. Conservatives latching on to this and insisting that THERE MUST BE INVESTIGATIONS are only revealing their own poor attachment to reality.
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,367
    I live in Michigan. Trump is not going to win here, period...

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/nbc25news.com/amp/news/local/counting-the-votes-election-management-system-in-antrim-county-used-across-mid-michigan

    So far every discrepancy has been caught by the checks and balances in the processing. That's why we have them! It sucks living in a swing state and hearing how bad we suck at voting every four years...
  • semiticgoddesssemiticgoddess Member Posts: 14,903
    Russia Today (RT), for those who aren't aware, is an arm of the Russian government. This isn't a secret. With Putin being a Trump ally, I wouldn't use it as a source.

    Fox, for those who aren't aware, has been a prominent backer of Trump for the past 4 years. This is also no secret. With Fox being a famously partisan outlet from its very creation, I wouldn't use it as a source.

    We are well aware of the endless stream of theories and allegations coming from the Trump administration.
  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,176
    edited November 2020
    USA had the last Right Wing government in Americas? What about Bolsanaro?

    Bolsonaro can't do anything, the congress doesn't let do anything.

    Brazil still with everything that the Lefitists approved. Including affirmative actions to protect the non white majority from the white minority, all productive states being overtaxed to subsidize welfare on "favelas"...

    The solution to Brazil is not simple politically speaking
    • Reestablish the monarchy
    • Return to the imperial constitution
    • Give extreme more autonomy to states and cities
    • Revoke ALL laws approved during the "mensalão", which made this country a bribecracy
    • Revoke ALL laws punishing victimless crimes
    • Revoke ALL laws protecting criminals from his victims
    • Revoke ALL form of gun control
    • Revoke ALL anti discrimination laws
    • Revoke ALL affirmative action program
    • Make those who are dependent upon the welfare for longer than a year having to be sterilized to continue receiving government help.
    • Make politicians and regulators responsible for the regulations that they approve and end all useless bureaucracy and regulations
    • Make real a strong currency and bring gold standard back
    • Become a tax heaven


    Anyway, I still don't get

    A ) There are no evidence
    B ) They should't investigate.

    Chose one. Why fear investigations?
  • m7600m7600 Member Posts: 318
    edited November 2020
    Seriously, if baffles me how some people throw around the term "socialist". Like Trump calling Biden a socialist. If that's the case, then I suppose that Bernie Sanders is the Brooklyn equivalent of Fidel Castro, right? Wrong. Absolutely wrong. These guys are, at most, center-left. That's not a knock on them in any way, it's just an attempt to be a little bit more accurate with our descriptions. But apparently some people seem to believe that the "Red Scare" never really ended.
  • DinoDinDinoDin Member Posts: 1,574

    Anyway, I still don't get

    A ) There are no evidence
    B ) They should't investigate.

    Chose one. Why fear investigations?

    Why don't you investigate the articles you link a little more closely. What are you afraid of?
  • jonesr65jonesr65 Member Posts: 66
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    I live in Michigan. Trump is not going to win here, period...

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/nbc25news.com/amp/news/local/counting-the-votes-election-management-system-in-antrim-county-used-across-mid-michigan

    So far every discrepancy has been caught by the checks and balances in the processing. That's why we have them! It sucks living in a swing state and hearing how bad we suck at voting every four years...

    I wish I lived in a swing State, that way my vote might count sometime. Last time it did was President Clinton second term in 1996 the rest of the time Arkansas has voted red
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,367
    edited November 2020
    jonesr65 wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    I live in Michigan. Trump is not going to win here, period...

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/nbc25news.com/amp/news/local/counting-the-votes-election-management-system-in-antrim-county-used-across-mid-michigan

    So far every discrepancy has been caught by the checks and balances in the processing. That's why we have them! It sucks living in a swing state and hearing how bad we suck at voting every four years...

    I wish I lived in a swing State, that way my vote might count sometime. Last time it did was President Clinton second term in 1996 the rest of the time Arkansas has voted red

    Careful what you wish for. My phone was buzzing with cold-calls and unsolicited texts for months. Even though I ignored them they were highly irritating. I'd say roughly 75% of the texts were from the Trump campaign or his supporters (very few were from Biden supporters or his campaign and the rest were various scams). Not sure about the cold calls because I never answered any of them...
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    Both Project Veritas and the Lt. Governor of Texas as offering cash rewards to provide information of voter fraud. Is this a missing persons case or a hunt for Whitey Bulger?? If there is fraud, I'm pretty sure you wouldn't have to literally BRIBE people to produce "evidence" of it. Which is exactly what Veritas did. Then, when the guy is faced with perjury if he keeps going, admits he did it for the money. The EXACT same thing happend with their Ilhan Omar "bombshell" a month ago. Eventually, the person they paid off admitted to the scheme.

    The reason we can't take the fraud accusations seriously is because they are starting from a belief that fraud took place, and then searching high and low for any scintilla of evidence they can find. It is NOT starting from evidence that would evetually lead one to believe fraud took place. They are actively trying to manufacture evidence to suit a predetermined narrative.
  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,176
    edited November 2020
    m7600 wrote: »
    Seriously, if baffles me how some people throw around the term "socialist". Like Trump calling Biden a socialist. If that's the case, then I suppose that Bernie Sanders is the Brooklyn equivalent of Fidel Castro, right? Wrong. Absolutely wrong. These guys are, at most, center-left. That's not a knock on them in any way, it's just an attempt to be a little bit more accurate with our descriptions. But apparently some people seem to believe that the "Red Scare" never really ended.

    Socialism = State controlling the means of production

    If the state forces me to hire X under A laws and produce following 666 pages of worthless regulations, do I really own the means of production?

    The greatest flaw of democracy is that inevitably lead to socialism. I wish that monarchism was the norm on the world or that at least my country was a monarchy. Believe or not, I an descendant of a Baron. I literally cried when saw how the lands that my ancestor owned was gorgeous and now, under social democrat democracy, looks like a "plain favela"... People on 1800 had way better architecture.
    DinoDin wrote: »
    Trump's legal team appears before judges and literally confess to have no evidence of fraud. We're told of a software glitch in red counties that the red counties then say was human error. .

    Source?

    PS : My RT source named other sources.
  • m7600m7600 Member Posts: 318
    Socialism = State controlling the means of production

    You think that Biden or Bernie Sanders want to socialize the means of production? They don't.
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 7,367
    m7600 wrote: »
    Seriously, if baffles me how some people throw around the term "socialist". Like Trump calling Biden a socialist. If that's the case, then I suppose that Bernie Sanders is the Brooklyn equivalent of Fidel Castro, right? Wrong. Absolutely wrong. These guys are, at most, center-left. That's not a knock on them in any way, it's just an attempt to be a little bit more accurate with our descriptions. But apparently some people seem to believe that the "Red Scare" never really ended.

    Socialism = State controlling the means of production

    If the state forces me to hire X under A laws and produce following 666 pages of worthless regulations, do I really own the means of production?

    The greatest flaw of democracy is that inevitably lead to socialism. I wish that monarchism was the norm on the world or that at least my country was a monarchy. Believe or not, I an descendant of a Baron. I literally cried when saw how the lands that my ancestor owned was gorgeous and now, under social democrat democracy, looks like a "plain favela"... People on 1800 had way better architecture.
    DinoDin wrote: »
    Trump's legal team appears before judges and literally confess to have no evidence of fraud. We're told of a software glitch in red counties that the red counties then say was human error. .

    Source?

    PS : My RT source named other sources.

    Guess I should have tagged you specifically with this. It involves the voting discrepancy in Michigan's Antrim County. The glitch was due to human error and confined to that one county.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/nbc25news.com/amp/news/local/counting-the-votes-election-management-system-in-antrim-county-used-across-mid-michigan
  • jjstraka34jjstraka34 Member Posts: 9,850
    edited November 2020
    I've actuall been keeping an eye on this more than I should, since every additional state is a buffer against this avalanche of bullshit. If Wasserman says it's over in AZ, it's over:

  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,176
    m7600 wrote: »
    Socialism = State controlling the means of production

    You think that Biden or Bernie Sanders want to socialize the means of production? They don't.

    If they can regulate everything about how my workline works, they are technically owning the means of production. Fabian socialists adovocate for it, a gradual increment on state control. And worse, they can dictate that you should hire 40% blacks in a area where blacks are less than 5% of the population, make your business fail and face NO CONSEQUENCES from his authoritarian regulations.

    Lawmakers and bureaucrats should be responsible for the regulations that they approve. So if they passed a strict gun control and people become more victim of criminals, they should take a share of responsibilities.
  • m7600m7600 Member Posts: 318
    edited November 2020
    If they can regulate everything about how my workline works, they are technically owning the means of production. Fabian socialists adovocate for it, a gradual increment on state control.

    Biden and Sanders are not Fabian socialists. They're Democrats. Sanders is more to the left, sure, but he's still a Democrat.
    There are, like, actual socialists in the United States that do want to socialize the means of production. Biden and Sanders are not among them. Who is, then? Well, the Communist Party of the United States of America, the Revolutionary Communist Party, USA, and the Socialist Workers Party, just to name a few. But not the Democrats.
  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,176
    edited November 2020
    m7600 wrote: »
    If they can regulate everything about how my workline works, they are technically owning the means of production. Fabian socialists adovocate for it, a gradual increment on state control.

    Biden and Sanders are not Fabian socialists. They're Democrats. Sanders is more to the left, sure, but he's still a Democrat.
    There are, like, actual socialists in the United States that do want to socialize the means of production. Biden and Sanders are not among them. Who is, then? Well, the Communist Party of the United States of America, the Revolutionary_Communist_Party,_USA, and the Socialist Workers Party, just to name a few. But not the Democrats.

    They still wanna a big state dictating everything about you and your business. Which is just one step towards socialism. Trump deregulated a lot, reduced taxes and din't started any war, in fact, he managed to make a lot of peace agreements. But if people on US voted for a guy who wanna to spend US tax dollars and US soldier lives to bomb countries in other side of the globe, who wanna a giant state dictating everything about their life...

    The regulators can pass crippling regulations that destroy your family business and suffer no consequence.

    My fear is not even Biden himself, his Vice president is lefitist like Dilma Rousseff
  • m7600m7600 Member Posts: 318
    They still wanna a big state dictating everything about you and your business. Which is just one step towards socialism.

    Doesn't seem like it, honestly. The most "controversial" thing that Sanders proposed was a 1% tax on Wall Street speculations. One percent. And this is what suddenly turns him into Fidel Castro? Come on, man...
  • SorcererV1ct0rSorcererV1ct0r Member Posts: 2,176
    edited November 2020
    m7600 wrote: »
    They still wanna a big state dictating everything about you and your business. Which is just one step towards socialism.

    Doesn't seem like it, honestly. The most "controversial" thing that Sanders proposed was a 1% tax on Wall Street speculations. One percent. And this is what suddenly turns him into Fidel Castro? Come on, man...

    1% now, then raise to 5%, then to 10%(...) and more tax is every single time awful.

    Peron on Argentina, started with an single tax, single regulation and 50 years later is a semi socialist country far less developed than 50 years ago.
  • m7600m7600 Member Posts: 318
    1% now, then raise to 5%, then to 10%(...) and more tax is every single time awful.

    A nation has to have taxes in order to fund things like roads. Even police stations and fire departments are funded by taxes. Where do you propose that the money should come from for those things, if not from taxes?
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