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Factual class / kit major strengths and weaknesses?

I've been looking through threads here and there, but can't find a comprehensive overview of all the classes and kits for comparison. "Best X" discussions don't seem to help me much, as a new player I can't distinguish between opinion and fact.

Is there a purely factual based summary of the strengths and weaknesses of all the classes and kits, or can anyone break it down for me without injecting opinions?

Thank you!

gorgonzolaThacoBell

Comments

  • CarefulCodeCarefulCode Member Posts: 4
    @sarevok57

    Thanks for the detailed overview, I'm trying to pick something mostly balanced without very extreme bonuses / penalties so this overview helped immensely.

    BelgarathMTHsarevok57
  • AurorusAurorus Member Posts: 194
    edited October 7

    @sarevok57

    Thanks for the detailed overview, I'm trying to pick something mostly balanced without very extreme bonuses / penalties so this overview helped immensely.

    The question in choosing your class is what role do you want to play either as the protagonist of an engrossing story or tactically in a combat team or both.

    CarefulCode
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 6,971
    @Aurorus Your comment here was caught by our spam filter. I have restored it and verified you so that this should not happen again.

  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 1,703

    "Best X" discussions don't seem to help me much, as a new player I can't distinguish between opinion and fact.

    there is not a clear border line between opinions and facts.
    almost every class is good, strong and players have soloed the whole game, even modded to be more difficult, with almost any class. some are easier to play, fighters, rangers and paladins. when the spell casting becomes the most important thing, mage, sorcerer, cleric and druid, you need a deep knowledge of the magic system to be really effective. rogues, bards and thieves, have their strengths if you learn to use them.
    each class is strong only as much as you are able to play it correctly, this is a fact, not an opinion. every advanced player has his style and tactics, this is why you are not able to discriminate between facts and opinions. you have to play yourself and begin to find your own style, then you will understand why some advanced players can discuss pages and pages on "best x" threads.

    then in the game a character can have more than 1 class, as dual that stops all the progress in the 1rst one and focuses only on the second or as a multi that continues to progress each class but split the XP between them. you will find NPCs (not playable characters, your companions in the game) of both types.
    usually in this game 1+1 is not 2 but 3 or more. some examples: a multi cleric/mage can use the buffs of both classes to be a awesome mlee fighter while his mage spells protect him completely from enemy damage, so in the hardest battles he can be the most useful frontliner as your fighters "hide" themselves behind him using long reach weapons. a dual (usually at 7, 9 or 13) from fighter to a caster or thief has much more hp (hit points) then the single class thief or caster, but will reach high levels in the second class, retaining some fighting capabilities that are useful till the end of the game.

    1 fact that is really important is apr (attacks per round) the number of times a character can hit the enemy in each 6 seconds round. only fighters, rangers and paladins can have more than 1 natural apr, they gain +0.5 at lev 7, +0.5 at lev 13, +0.5 with a weapon in which are specialized and an other 0.5 with a weapon they have mastered ( 5 points in that weapon, only pure fighters and dual classes ones, multi can not go beyond specialization). those classes can reach a high number of attacks as they can also put points in dual welding (DW), and with the help of some items you find in the game can reach the maximum number of attacks allowed by the game, 5 that can be doubled by the mage spell improved haste. is easy to understand how a toon hitting 10 times every 6 seconds in more effective in mlee than someone hitting only a couple of times when hasted. you can have the bard kit blade and a buffed cleric/mage DW effectively, the others loose too much thac0 so to do it not beneficial, but a C/M will never go beyond 4 apr improved hasted, even if them will be 4 high damaging attacks, the blade can reach higher apr as he can stack some of the few +1 apr weapons in the game, but he can not benefit of the offensive spin (+1apr and other bonuses) while improved hasted. they both can tank much better than a fighter but can not do the same damage as they have less apr.

    about the magic system is really complex and to master it needs study and experience, the right spells in the right moment can make an impossible battle really easy.

    mi suggestion is to not care much about which class is "the best" one, pick what you feel to play, possibly avoiding classes that need more knowledge to be effective, like sorcerer and bard.
    pick it according to the role you want for charname, fighter, paladin or ranger if you want him leading the charge in the front line, mage if you feel to be so, and in end game your power will be really high, or druid or cleric if you want to be a caster that is more oriented toward buffing the party, healing it and summoning helpers.
    pick your class, play it and have fun. and try to have in that initial run NPCs that cover all the classes, at least a mage, a druid and a cleric, as well as some fighter/pally/ranger.
    so, as you play the NPCs the very same way you play your character, you will gain experience in how all the classes feel and then you will begin to look at the "best x" threads with a different eye. ;)

    my suggestions, and are opinions based on what i like, is to start with a multi F/M, you don't have npcs like that, a pure class thief or F/T , to scout the areas, master the backstab and setting traps, or a plain fighter, maybe with the berseker kit. are all relatively novice friendly combos and is easy to have charname shine in the party with them.
    pick your class, have fun and gain experience, the next run you will know much better what you like and what is not good for your own play style, that you will have begun to shape.

    hope it helps.

    GoturalCarefulCodesarevok57
  • CarefulCodeCarefulCode Member Posts: 4
    Thank you both, very good information and well explained to a new student. This game is much more complex than I thought it was.

    I do enjoy playing a "tactical strategist" role in other games. This kind of character is one who gathers intelligence before the conflict, and uses uncommon or indirect methods of out-thinking the enemy. In some cases he would destroy the enemy without any physical confrontation, or otherwise neutralize the threat so that it can be managed with a minimum of risk to his team.

    Classes:

    @gorgonzola

    Your suggestion of Fighter Thief seems to be a strong one for my idea. The Thief ability to set Traps, and to strike from the shadows, seems excellent to me.

    However, you also suggest Fighter Mage if I read you correctly. The spells and their uses are of course beyond my knowledge, but I could learn as I progress.

    After considering them, I wonder if Thief/Mage would be the best choice? I would have a large amount of strategic options available, and multiple ways of scouting the enemy and forming a good plan.

    Aurorussarevok57
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    @CarefulCode As it looks like you are considering Fighter/Thief, Fighter/Mage and Mage/Thief, you should also consider Fighter/Mage/Thief which is the combination of the above classes, it would also suit your style very well I think. You will have every options available and it is a true powerhouse if played correctly.

    gorgonzola
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 7,690
    @CarefulCode If you are new to the game, I'd recommend passing on spellcasting classes. They can be very complicated with dozens upon dozens of different spells, and just knowing what the spells will do takes research, let alone WHEN and against what to use them on. I'd recommend learning the core mechanics of the game first.

    CarefulCodeStummvonBordwehr
  • AurorusAurorus Member Posts: 194

    Thank you both, very good information and well explained to a new student. This game is much more complex than I thought it was.

    I do enjoy playing a "tactical strategist" role in other games. This kind of character is one who gathers intelligence before the conflict, and uses uncommon or indirect methods of out-thinking the enemy. In some cases he would destroy the enemy without any physical confrontation, or otherwise neutralize the threat so that it can be managed with a minimum of risk to his team.

    After considering them, I wonder if Thief/Mage would be the best choice? I would have a large amount of strategic options available, and multiple ways of scouting the enemy and forming a good plan.

    If this is the role that you enjoy, then M/T may be the correct class for you. This will also give the opportunity to learn and master the magic system, which is often not mastered until one has played a mage-type as Charname. As an aside, I love the tactical aspects of the game, and M/T is my favorite class.

  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 4,034

    Berserker - Weakness: Berserk state adds bonus hit points, and if the berserker has been wounded down to those bonus hit points during combat, he dies when the berserk state wears off if he has not been healed.

    This was the case in vanilla and in early EE versions, but in later versions the berserker falls briefly unconscious rather than dying (though if enemies are still around then that can be fatal anyway ...).

    gorgonzolaGusindaBelgarathMTH
  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 1,703
    edited October 7
    ThacoBell said:

    @CarefulCode If you are new to the game, I'd recommend passing on spellcasting classes. They can be very complicated with dozens upon dozens of different spells, and just knowing what the spells will do takes research, let alone WHEN and against what to use them on. I'd recommend learning the core mechanics of the game first.

    this is very true, but is also true that he will not play only charname, he will have to manage all the party, and in a balanced party casters are needed, so he will anyway have to learn the spell system.
    but i agree, to chose a charname that is mainly a caster for the first run is not the best idea in most of the situations, unless someone really WANTS to be a powerful mage...
    Gotural said:

    @CarefulCode As it looks like you are considering Fighter/Thief, Fighter/Mage and Mage/Thief, you should also consider Fighter/Mage/Thief which is the combination of the above classes, it would also suit your style very well I think. You will have every options available and it is a true powerhouse if played correctly.

    really good suggestion. i want only to add that even if is one of the most powerful, versatile and fun to play combo FMT split the xp in 3 classes. this mean that is leveling slower, as thief will gain slower skill points so will be able later to hide in shadows with a good success chance if he wants also to focus on setting traps and to deal with the traps and locks the party find in the game. not a problem if an other thief is in the party, like joshimo, jan jansen or hexxat. even imoen and nalia, that are basically pure mages with few thief levels, can deal with traps disabling and locks opening, leaving the FMT free to initially focus on hiding for exploration and back stabs, and setting traps.
    the other consequence of leveling slower is that the FMT never gets the super powerful lev9 spells, not a problem if an other mage is in the party as he can be a fantastic support mage while he also uses his spells to self buff.



    @gorgonzola

    Your suggestion of Fighter Thief seems to be a strong one for my idea. The Thief ability to set Traps, and to strike from the shadows, seems excellent to me.

    However, you also suggest Fighter Mage if I read you correctly. The spells and their uses are of course beyond my knowledge, but I could learn as I progress.

    After considering them, I wonder if Thief/Mage would be the best choice? I would have a large amount of strategic options available, and multiple ways of scouting the enemy and forming a good plan.

    F/T: good fighter and good thief. his fighter part gives him the thac0 to actually hit often when he backstabs, when backstabbing is not an option he can wear a full plate armor and fight almost as well as a pure fighter.

    F/M: a mage has some spells that can use only on self that make him really resilient. blur and improved invisibility lower his AC (armor class, the lower the better, just like thac0), mirror images protect against some spells and physical attacks, an image is consumed each time, stoneskin absorb physical attacks, one skin is consimed each time, and is long lasting, you can even cast it, sleep and have it active when you wake up. then spells like protection from magical weapons (PFMW), and the mantle line make him completely immune to the weapons for a short time, 4 rounds. spell immunity makes him immune to a magic school, so SI abjuration makes him sure that hes protections can not be dispelled by mages and protect him also against the nasty imprisonment demi liches cast (imprisoned charname is game over).
    so F/M is a fighter that excels on defense while being a good damage dealer, and a good support mage, that actually in the late game can cast lev 9 spells.

    M/T: he lacks of apr and thac0 cause he don't have fighter levels. so is tricky to use for a new player. back stab worst than a pure thief cause he has only half of the XP in that class. there is one M/T npc in the game, that has some special equipment that only he can use. also as a gnome he is an illusionist, not a plain mage, so has 1 more spell/level, even if he can not cast the spells of the opposite school. i suggest you to try him, to have him in the party, so you can have an idea of what a M/T can do. but don't use the combo for charname the first run.

    a really good choice is going FMT and having the M/T gnome in the party, so your charname can focus on hiding and setting traps while the gnome deals with finding and disabling traps and opening locks.
    an other really useful thief skill is detect illusions, it reveals invisible enemies without wasting your mages spells. or go FMT and have imoen or nalia in the party so they can deal with traps and locks and will also be as powerful as pure class mages. your charname will be the king of bock stabs, and also the best tank and a good damage dealer. (there are some exploits that can make him incredibly OP as damage dealer, but is not the right way to start, let them to the advanced players that play on really hard settings of modded games...).

    or go F/T or F/M for faster leveling but less versatility.

    i suggest you to run a party of 5 so you have a place for the NPCs you find that are involved in some quest (that you can usually do also without them, but as first run it break the flavor). and the 6th free place will come useful later, i don't want to spoil no more about it.
    a good balanced party has a druid, a cleric, a mage that can reach high levels (so no triple class), a support mage and some fighters. so you can deal with any situation and try all the 3 magic classes.
    for druid and cleric you find both pure class npcs and multi ones. the druid is also fighter and the cleric is also mage. there is also a dual class fighter into cleric.
    try to have at least 3 toons with fighting capabilities, figher, ranger or paladin, as a novice does not have the needed knowledge to run without raw mlee power, it will come later.

    last thing i link a thread on the M/C npc cause imo she is a very interesting toon to play and also cause there are some screenshots that show how she is not effective if not using her buffs but becomes super effective while she does. this better than words show how knowledge of a class/combo can really change the way you play and how a toon is effective on the field.

    https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/47354/superaerie-power-tactics-for-the-c-m-spoilers

    EDIT: the screenshots are not there, are here
    https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/comment/1010868/#Comment_1010868
    check how thac0, damage/hit, armor class and hit points change, only few buffing spells, the right ones, and the change is drastic.
    the same toon not buffed but at the same level and with the same equipment looks like that



    EDIT2: as you are going to probably have some thief in your charname i link a guide that i find very useful. is old but still good even if something is slightly not accurate (ie is proven that hide in shadows and move silently work the same way, the hint of spending more points in MS is not working).
    you can get some ideas about how to backstab efficiently and use traps in a fair way.
    https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/pc/258273-baldurs-gate-ii-shadows-of-amn/faqs/27550

    Post edited by gorgonzola on
    Grond0GusindaGoturalCarefulCode
  • ArchGhostArchGhost Member Posts: 23
    In very broad strokes:

    Warriors (Fighters, Rangers, Paladins, Barbarian):
    -take a ton of punishment before dying and generally save or have enough HP to tank spells.
    -hit hard and often physically. No other archetype outputs as much damage as consistently physically
    -utilize widest range of items by default. The special abilities of some magical items are very useful
    -simplest to outfit and use -- look for better AC and higher weapon enchantments then whack things

    Priests (Clerics, Druids):
    -have moderate HP and varying but moderate overall item restrictions
    -weak in physical output (damage, APR, to hit), but still the best option of all the non-warriors
    -great array of general protective and buffing magics; druids tend to have less but better offensive spells
    -has a learning curve sorting out the magical side; but unlike arcane casters you don't have to bet your life on it nearly as much and less hands-on as mostly buffing/summoning. Priest spell casting is more supplemental than direct.

    Rogues (Thieves)
    -fair HP, moderate equipment restrictions before UAI but weak thaco and AC restrictions hurt survivability in direct confrontations, especially in BG2 (they could get away with being in archers in BG1)
    -lack damage output in straight up fights until much later (HLAs). Instead you have to utilize preemptive planning to utilize traps or backstab to have decent offense.
    -more of a support class that is weak alone, until much later and HLAs
    -control intensive -- abusing Hide in Shadows and their supportive skills are key to utilizing a thief whether you are scouting for the party, laying traps, disarming traps/picking locks, trying to dispell illusions, or attempting backstabs before running away to hide and try again.
    -extremely powerful HLAs make them a great end-game class, but early vulnerability/lack of power lend them heavily to multiclassing

    Wizards (Mages, Sorcerers)
    -weak HP, very restrictive equipment choices, and overall vulnerable when threatened (squishy)
    -limited offensive potential early on, as lower level spells are weak until they scale, castings are limited, and stronger magic is further down the line. young mages tend to have lots of problems dealing with extended encounters or LOTS of enemies without parties or the support of things like wands. Mages are pretty garbage physical attackers without powerful magical items custom tailored for them.
    -very intricate and involved magic system that is essential to using the character beyond a summon font or haste bot. Lots of intense deliberation with how to allocate your limited spell slots toward all the needs of your mage (self-protection, party buff/support, summons, disabling magic, enhancements like sequencers/time stop, and plain ol' offensive damage).
    -less item dependent than any other class, but requires good foresight and familiarity of the magic system.
    -by far the strongest end-game class, but probably also the hardest at all stage before this!


    In terms of ease of use, Warrior-types are simplest and easiest to use especially at low levels, while strict casters are the most difficult but offer more eventual potential. Multiclasses tend to be more complex but often end being more forgiving than either parent class alone so long as you don't entirely discard one portion of the combination.

    Multiclasses obviously fall in somewhere between their parent class combination, but are generally more useful starting out due to the overlap of class strengths/weaknesses and end up being pretty much the strongest overall endgame classes after Sorcerer, which is horribly broken OP, due to their eclecticism.

    Bards and Monks are kinda odd flavor characters. Bards offer a bit more support in basically providing some mimicry of other classes with limited spellcasting (up to lvl 6 IIRC in the base game) and some pickpocket/lore combined with more open item restrictions on top of Rogue HP, and they can party buff with their song (not too hot until the HLA song). They become much better after HLAs as they gain many of the same as thieves and greatly improve non-skald bardsongs.

    Monks are much weaker warriors that eventually gain some nifty outside abilities like passive immunities and the ability to roll save or die on enemies they hit. They are physically weaker and more vulnerable than other warrior classes due to their slow power curve, priest HP, and their item restrictions really hurting them -- unless you stop leveling another warrior class by dual classing it, proficiencies + more HP + free item restrictions granting access to better and better gear combined with access to the Warrior HLAs they share with monk put them way over the top. Monks do get granted a significant amount of natural Magic Resistance though, and it can be fun to augment this angle as best you can.

    Note that in either case of Bard or Monk, a multiclass will do the same jobs better in almost all cases, and bard song alone is not really worth it unless you exploit the hell out it!

    Grond0CarefulCodeBelgarathMTH
  • ArchGhostArchGhost Member Posts: 23

    Thank you both, very good information and well explained to a new student. This game is much more complex than I thought it was.

    I do enjoy playing a "tactical strategist" role in other games. This kind of character is one who gathers intelligence before the conflict, and uses uncommon or indirect methods of out-thinking the enemy. In some cases he would destroy the enemy without any physical confrontation, or otherwise neutralize the threat so that it can be managed with a minimum of risk to his team.

    Classes:

    @gorgonzola

    Your suggestion of Fighter Thief seems to be a strong one for my idea. The Thief ability to set Traps, and to strike from the shadows, seems excellent to me.

    However, you also suggest Fighter Mage if I read you correctly. The spells and their uses are of course beyond my knowledge, but I could learn as I progress.

    After considering them, I wonder if Thief/Mage would be the best choice? I would have a large amount of strategic options available, and multiple ways of scouting the enemy and forming a good plan.

    Your description belies that a Fighter/mage or Mage/Thief would be a good fit for the playstyle you want. A class combination that gives you immediate access to more tools than the simple sword and board without having to wait on a dual class. Though i would normally recommend an early dual, you can do fine with the in-game NPCs covering for you and take an immediate multi instead. Just be sure to pick up a beefy fighter, and a good tank to go along with him, and you should have no problems with the party staying alive for you to figure things out.

    Fighter/thief doesn't offer much utility other than being able to hit things a bit harder than a normal thief for much of the game (until HLAs). The 2 things they can really do other than just beating stuff up is uses hidden status for scouting/backstabs, and lay traps (note than any arcane magic is way stronger than thief traps in the early going, but you cna spam up to 7 thief traps in one area pretty easily with setup time). It's still a good class, but less potential for subterfuge or tactic than any spell user and only really offering a higher HP/thaco/damage thief, that still is lesser than a true warrior class straight up due to thief armor restrictions and slower progression. The game itself also supplies plenty of adequate thief characters (you only really need half a class, really) so you're not optionless in that regard.

    A stalker might fit your appeal as well, if you don't necessarily care about getting to involved in arcane magic. They are Rangers with weaker backstab (a straight class stalkeris still a better warrior than F/T before HLAS due to better HP/Thaco progression and better weapon type access for quite a while, but won't get the eventual x5 backstab, stopping at x4 instead) and some eventual select spells, with a focus on the type of careful play. You would still be sneaking a lot, picking your fights and trying for backstabs, but with eventually ability to haste, deflect minor spells and become immune to normal missiles among other low level druid spells in exchange for thieving skills. Stalkers make better frontliners but aren't as necessarily as much about the subterfuge angle while still having an element of it. Stalkers are also pretty easy to play this way, as their Sneak levels automatically with them and they can hold their own in combat.

    F/M is a good combination even for those new to the magic system. Arcane magic can be used as a complement or directly (self-buffing vs. nuking or disabling, for example) and your fighter side will still be tough enough to fall back on in combat. Especially so if you use your magic to protect yourself and disrupt the enemy before wading in. Arcane magic offers almost endless options to explore tactically other than just direct confrontation, from using invisibility to scout/hide in combat, buffs to boost your defenses, summons to throw out as distractions and fodder, to disruption and disabling magic and traps to set for the enemy. Even without an intricate knowledge of the magic system, you can start simple with some protective magics (Mirror Image, Stoneskin, Ghost/Spirit Armor) and just play as fighter with better defenses until you get the hang of it.

    M/T is a bit more involved as it lacks the beefiness and physical oomph of a fighter, but makes up for it in being one of the best tactical characters (C/M and high level wizards are better still), Careful thought will have to be applied to bring harm to the enemy, or simply support the party as best you can, but you have the tools to do it with. M/T starts out as a mostly support character but as they get higher leveled they move into heavy player territory, being able to lay traps, sling spells, scout around and single targets out with backstab/targeted magic, and eventually combine UAI and any equippable item with an arcane spellbook, one of the most potent combos of any class. Thief HLAs are the strongest ones in the games, and with eventually even access to lvl 9 magic, they can become stupid powerful (if a bit complex) thorugh combining their abilities, magical items, and casting together.

    gorgonzolaCarefulCode
  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 1,703
    edited October 8
    @ArchGhost
    i disagree on F/T, but is only my personal opinion, based on my play style and taste.
    when i go with F/T charname he is the king for most of SoA, clears whole areas with his back stabs and lures enemies in his traps. when those tactics, slower than an attack with all the party, but pure fun for me, are not possible he wears a better armor (as his fighter part allows it) loosing his thief abilities, but having the same AC of each other fighter (while the stalker can not do it), and does not loose much thac0 as he will be only 1 or 2 levels behind a single class fighter on average. he looses HP, and this is the real disadvantage, but this is true for every multi fighter.
    i like very much playing thieves in an active and aggressive way, scouting, setting traps, backstabbing and making the best possible use of the terrain, using corners and low light points to lure the enemies, disappear and backstab again. i am not telling that is the most powerful class, i am telling that playing a thief this way is a great fun, if someone likes that play style. i like also the stalker, that looses traps and is less good at hiding than a dedicated thief, and the plain thief, that progresses fast in back stab multiplier but lacks thaco to have it working often against fighters, but the multi F/T imo is the best combo to do it.
    the F/T also gets both the fighter and thief HLA that work well together.

    about the game having " plenty of adequate thief characters" i can think only to joshimo, that has some problem i don't want to spoil, jan, that is multi as well, and hexxatt. the other 2 are not thieves, are powerful mages that can find traps, disable them and can open locks cause they have few levels of thief.
    playing imoen and nalia you don't get the feeling that playing a thief gives, give only some utility, their strength is being mages, really powerful arch mages in end game.

    the stalker is fun to play, and there is a stalker npc, and has a better stronghold than the thief, is a good alternative. some runs i have both a F/T and the stalker npc and then to backstab is double fun.

  • CarefulCodeCarefulCode Member Posts: 4
    edited October 8
    @ArchGhost thanks for joining and providing some more details.

    After more consideration, I've decided on a Fighter Mage combination. I need to consider carefully as I'm starting in the first game, Baldur's Gate, and will continue afterwards to game two, Shadows.

    I still have yet to decide on dual or multi, but since a quick search shows this is one of the most highly debated topics on the forum, I'm sure people are sick of discussing it.

    Therefore I won't try anyone's patience and ask for opinion, as these previous discussions should serve me well.

    Edit:

    A few pages reference this document (although I had to find the proper URL with google), which I find helpful.
    pihwiki.bgforge.net/Baldur%27s_Gate:_Dual_and_Multiclassing

    Can't seem to get the link to properly work, sorry about that.

    Post edited by CarefulCode on
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 6,971
    @CarefulCode This time your post was caught by the spam filter. I have restored it and verified you.

  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 1,703
    dual is tricky for new players and is even worst for who wants to run the whole saga.
    cause in bg1 you start at lev 1 and you fight against low level enemies while in bg2 you reach the higher levels and fight against high level enemies.
    every level you can dual a fighter into something other in bg1 will give a sub par fighter in bg2 (i don't own SOD so i don't know how it changes the things, but i am afraid that it makes things only worst).
    to have a character that is functional as fighter in bg2 you have to spend all bg1 as pure fighter. the shared opinion on dualing is that lev 9 is the best spot for bg2, some like to do it at 13 for the added +0.5 apr and doing it at 7 is probably only viable for fighters dualed into cleric cause the cleric self buffs offset the low dualing level, giving hp boost, thac0 of a fighter of the same level of the cleric and STR enhancement, up to 25.
    the cap level for bg1 is 161k xp and a fighter needs 250k xp to reach lev 9 so to don't have a sub par fighter you have to dual in SOD.
    the level cap in SOD is 500k and to reach mage 10 that re activates the first class you need other 250k xp so assuming that you don't use tricks to boost the xp like dropping out the party members and going to a spell memorizing and erasing feast (please don't do it on your first run, you will have many others to use such kind of exploits) you will have your dual class complete only near the end of SOD, playing it as a mage with 250k xp less than he is supposed to have.
    then in bg2, lev cap 8M, you will be a king, but why going trough all this on the first run?
    play multi and you will feel trough all the saga the flavor of merging fighter and mage.
    multi is powerful, is fun to play, gets both mage and fighter hla as he reaches 3M xp and, most important, don't force you to play in a not natural way, using tricks to farm more xp than you are supposed to get or delaying quest rewards to minimize the down time.
    the first run should be all toward learning the basics, exploring areas and living new adventures, power gaming and optimizing can come later.

    because there is a real chance that there will be other runs after the first one, some of us are playing this game since it come out at the beginning of the millennium.

  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 1,703
    edited October 8
    https://pihwiki.bgforge.net/Baldur's_Gate:_Dual_and_Multiclassing
    here there is the link working :)

    i disagree on a lot of things the guide tells, some of them really important. an example: for the FMC does not list into the advantages, compared to the M/C , of having up to 1.5 more apr and possibility to put 3 pips in DW. the whole sense of going triple class with M/C is to have better fighting capabilities and ignoring that the FMC has almost the double of attacks compared to M/C is missing the main advantage of the class, the reason to use it instead of the 2 classes multi M/C.
    in the weaknesses of the same combo the fact that the FMC looses the lev9 arcane spells, so can not put in a chain contingency divine spells is completely ignored. and also improved alacrity is lost so the FMC can not spam, with the robe that cuts casting time, a lot of divine and arcane spells in the 2 rounds that the alacrity lasts.

    is only one of the possible examples, but the F/M part is decent and that is your choice, so enjoy your FM and have fun.

  • SkatanSkatan Member Posts: 3,541
    F/M is a great starting class. The only one better IMHO would be the dwarf F/C multi. Have fun!

  • Yulaw9460Yulaw9460 Member Posts: 634
    edited November 6
    Deleted.

    Post edited by Yulaw9460 on
    StummvonBordwehr
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