Yes, the EEs come with their own hefty set of problems and hindrances. But they also have many improvements and advantages over the originals.
Whether you think the advantages outweigh the disadvantages is subjective and up to you to decide. I personally play the EEs more often than I play vanilla or modded vanilla, even though there are a lot of things in the EEs that bother me. A lot.
I'm surprised to see people defending BG UI. It was crammed into 640x480, did not scale, had a terrible illegible font (they tried to patch it in ToSC, but people still used the IWD one), they didn't even have a space for the _Rest_ button! (and no shortcut, too). There was no item comparison, items had stupid with a _pisssh_ sound unfurling tooltips, mages had only one weapon slot, there was no XP bar, etc. etc.
alot of people don't actually play vanilla bg 1. before ee it was always tutu with a few exceptions.
Tbh I can live with bad UI (I played Daggerfall!); what really makes it hard to go back to vanilla BG1 instead of Tutu or BGT is the obnoxiously slow walking speed.
Tbh I can live with bad UI (I played Daggerfall!); what really makes it hard to go back to vanilla BG1 instead of Tutu or BGT is the obnoxiously slow walking speed.
If I recall there's some way around that. I think you increase the frame rate of the game, and that helps. Problem is that speeds up the whole game, not just walking, so now you're walking at normal speed and everything else is happening super fast.
Tbh I can live with bad UI (I played Daggerfall!); what really makes it hard to go back to vanilla BG1 instead of Tutu or BGT is the obnoxiously slow walking speed.
anyone that defends that slow walking speed is lying to themselves. it makes vanilla bg 1 unplayable.
You actually liked the hideous gray stone interface of the original?
I do. I like it better than BGII's, and better than the EE's.
@Magnus_Grelich : @Kilivitz is working on a mod that will restore the stony UI to the Enhanced Editions, and @skellytz on a mod that fixes a ton of audio bugs (that have been there since day 1 and also affect the originals) on top of restoring a number of sounds from BG (including UI sounds.) So eventually you should be able to retrieve the look and sound you're after while enjoying the bug fixes and engine improvements in the Enhanced Editions.
Not necessarily for exploration, mind you. It's just that BG1's combat element works better and has more tactics involved when combatants move at their original speeds and creatures and characters have their original, larger selection circle sizes.
The combat in vanilla BG1 more heavily relies on melee/tank positioning and body blocking than BG2 does, and it was originally developed for a slower combat pace. I think it loses some of its appeal when that pace is selectively sped up.
I might also prefer a bit slower walking while I explore a trappy dungeon, since with the resolution change, its easy to miss traps. Maybe the range is shorter too, but I suspect its more the resolution.
i think the last time i played vanilla bg was in 2013, when the EE was first coming out, i was going back and forth between the 2 until i finally stayed with the EE when the 1.3 patch came out
and then about a year or so ago, i bought the bg series off of GoG for like 10 bucks or so? ( i also bought IWD 2 for super cheap as well ) so i gave vanilla BG a try after all these years of playing the EEs and now....
vanilla is just unplayable, despite the fact there are things im am not a fan of in the EEs, compared to the EEs, there is absolutely no way i will be able to play the vanilla again, i even tried heavily modding bg vanilla, and it was still terrible, with one of the big things being that walking speed, even at 60 fps its absolute garbage on a RES of higher than 640x480
i think back in the past i didn't mind the speed so much because when you play at that garbage low RES its okay, but when i installed the widescreen mod because that RES is so low my graphic card can't even go down that low it was utter madness, it was like watching snails crawl in molasses, and for all of you sports fans who enjoy the 30 fps, i dont know whether to call you heros of patience of silly nillies of madness because i just can't do it
plus, some features of the EEs are absolute god sends compared to the orginals like:
- the loot bar, oh my god has this contaminated me to the point of no return, if NWN had this, i might actually enjoy playing that series a little bit more
- the fact that in bg2 you no longer get that weird whacky +10 XP load of nonsense, that really grinded my gears and its nice to see that it is gone
- level drain is no longer so much a pain in the ass like it used to be back in the vanillas, in fact in the vanilla days, if one of my spell casters got level drained i just reloaded the battle, because that was faster than trying to rememorize everything in order again, the EEs make it much more tolerable
- the fact that in my opinion beamdog implemented the bg2 engine into bg1 way better than that tutu mod did ( even though im not a fan of the bg2 engine being bg1, i like how beamdog did it as apposed to tutu )
- when i play bg1 my characters dont crawl across the screen, they actually move! thanks to the bg2 engine, and as far as i can recall it doesnt really seem to upset the balance with enemy movement as far as i can tell
but even with that said i still love how vanilla bg1 was implemented ( no class kits, no bg2 jargon cloggin up the place ) but i just can't go back to vanilla, its like playing pokémon fire red for hundreds of 100s and then trying to go back to pokémon red, you just can't even though mechanic wise pokémon red was better because of it's broken code, its unplayable garbage compared to fire red, and this is where vanilla bg stands as apposed to bg ee, i still like the way vanilla bg1 was better than EE, but going back is just impossible because its unplayable trash compared
so all i can hope is that beamdog can answer our prayers and fix up the UI ( especially that have to double click EVERYTHING nonsense to sell stacks ugh ) and after that, it should be a relatively smooth play through what out no hitches, or at least for me it will be
( PS: if im not making any sense i apologize, its 3 in the morning and sometimes my thoughts can be quite scattered )
The combat in vanilla BG1 more heavily relies on melee/tank positioning and body blocking than BG2 does, and it was originally developed for a slower combat pace. I think it loses some of its appeal when that pace is selectively sped up.
I really can't agree with this - all it does is making archery even more overpowered because enemies take forever before reaching you.
@AndreaColombo Interesting to see people who actually prefer BG1 UI though. BG2 was almost universally considered an improvement in this regard so I wonder what you like about it. Is it simply a matter of aesthetics? I'm not mocking your opinion in any way, just genuinely curious.
The combat in vanilla BG1 more heavily relies on melee/tank positioning and body blocking than BG2 does, and it was originally developed for a slower combat pace. I think it loses some of its appeal when that pace is selectively sped up.
I really can't agree with this - all it does is making archery even more overpowered because enemies take forever before reaching you.
Yes, it makes ranged attacks more effective, on both sides. Enemy archers and spellcasters are also more dangerous in vanilla.
It's, of course, up to you and your tastes which approach you prefer. I prefer vanilla, because when testing both systems one after the other, I found that vanilla had more nuance involved in a typical fight. Your fighters/tanks advance more slowly, which makes it more crucial to get them into position as soon as possible. I found the vanilla fights more 'chunky' and dangerous. Which is what I like.
What the enhanced editions need is that fast-forward mode from the Pillars of Eternity games so we can speed up the movement. I don't mind taking my time while exploring a new area, but when I'm having to walk from one corner to another in an area I've been to 15 times, that can get kind of boring. Sometimes I cast a Haste spell on the party to avoid the wait.
It's interesting how much some ppl notice and care about GUI. I can't even tell you what color it is, the background theme and I didn't even know there were differences between the games (does SoD have a different GUI from BG1?). I did play some BG back in the day but has primarily played since the EE's came out and though I have noticed now I have to click different tabs, I only ever really use the "level up" button and the inventory. My eyes filter out anything in the background and only see the numbers, everything else is ineffecient background white noise I ignore.
I guess this makes me the odd one out, but I really coulnd't care less as long as I have my hotkeys mapped out and correctly displayed figures for AC, Thac0 etc.
@Skatan I'm on the other end of the UI-detail-noticing spectrum, and I can tell you it's no cakewalk.
But to answer your question, yes pretty much all versions of Baldur's Gate have different UIs with varying styles, features, and issues. The following game versions all feature different interfaces:
Vanilla BG1
Vanilla BG2
BG:EE v1.X
BGII:EE v1.X
BG:EE v2.X (without SoD)
BG:EE v2.X (with SoD)
BGII:EE v2.X
And that's only the unmodded versions of Baldur's Gate.
@AndreaColombo Interesting to see people who actually prefer BG1 UI though. BG2 was almost universally considered an improvement in this regard so I wonder what you like about it. Is it simply a matter of aesthetics? I'm not mocking your opinion in any way, just genuinely curious.
Aesthetics. Stone and gold were in the official Forgotten Realms logo at the time, and BG faithfully turned it into a UI that looked good and just screamed "AD&D Forgotten Realms adventures!" Like @subtledoctor said, it fit the atmosphere of the game very well. Add some rose-tint from my nostalgic glasses, and there goes my favorite UI in any Infinity Engine game (second would be @erephine 's take on the BGII UI.)
If you mean the font BG used for dialog (which was contained in REALMS.BAM, if I'm not mistaken), I loved it. I looked for it left and right but it seems to be a custom font created for the game, and therefore impossible to retrieve elsewhere. I'd love to be able to restore it in the Enhanced Editions.
It's really interesting to see how opinions differ on the aesthetics. Ofc these things are always subjective in the end.
When I first played BG I was like 11-12 and no prior D&D background so I just thought the gray stone was ugly and the font hard to read. Switching to BG2 was a huge improvement and at that age the whole thematic appropriateness (is that a word?) was really the last thing on my mind.
I've played games with significantly more mismatched UI over the years, such as Final Fantasy XII and its out-of-place futuristic interface for instance. Maybe if I had been older when the BG games came out my opinion would differ. Who knows?
As for the various incarnations of the EE UI I find myself favoring the blue/gold of the 1.3 versions over the current white/wood. And I really dislike the SoD black. @lefreut interface mods allow for the blue/gold everywhere and I'm pretty happy with it.
Interesting indeed. Much as I’m not a fan of any of the EE UIs, SoD would be my favorite in terms of looks (though I wouldn’t want to use it because it’s new and it doesn’t kick me in the nostalgias.)
It certainly is a good thing that the EEs made their UI more flexibly moddable, seeing how different people have wildly different tastes
Comments
Yes, the EEs come with their own hefty set of problems and hindrances. But they also have many improvements and advantages over the originals.
Whether you think the advantages outweigh the disadvantages is subjective and up to you to decide. I personally play the EEs more often than I play vanilla or modded vanilla, even though there are a lot of things in the EEs that bother me. A lot.
Check facts before posting on the Internet? Nah, I'm pretty sure it doesn't work that way.
(Yes, I'm teasing--I'm wrong about stuff like this all the time.)
alot of people don't actually play vanilla bg 1. before ee it was always tutu with a few exceptions.
If I recall there's some way around that. I think you increase the frame rate of the game, and that helps. Problem is that speeds up the whole game, not just walking, so now you're walking at normal speed and everything else is happening super fast.
anyone that defends that slow walking speed is lying to themselves. it makes vanilla bg 1 unplayable.
I do. I like it better than BGII's, and better than the EE's.
@Magnus_Grelich : @Kilivitz is working on a mod that will restore the stony UI to the Enhanced Editions, and @skellytz on a mod that fixes a ton of audio bugs (that have been there since day 1 and also affect the originals) on top of restoring a number of sounds from BG (including UI sounds.) So eventually you should be able to retrieve the look and sound you're after while enjoying the bug fixes and engine improvements in the Enhanced Editions.
Not necessarily for exploration, mind you. It's just that BG1's combat element works better and has more tactics involved when combatants move at their original speeds and creatures and characters have their original, larger selection circle sizes.
The combat in vanilla BG1 more heavily relies on melee/tank positioning and body blocking than BG2 does, and it was originally developed for a slower combat pace. I think it loses some of its appeal when that pace is selectively sped up.
and then about a year or so ago, i bought the bg series off of GoG for like 10 bucks or so? ( i also bought IWD 2 for super cheap as well ) so i gave vanilla BG a try after all these years of playing the EEs and now....
vanilla is just unplayable, despite the fact there are things im am not a fan of in the EEs, compared to the EEs, there is absolutely no way i will be able to play the vanilla again, i even tried heavily modding bg vanilla, and it was still terrible, with one of the big things being that walking speed, even at 60 fps its absolute garbage on a RES of higher than 640x480
i think back in the past i didn't mind the speed so much because when you play at that garbage low RES its okay, but when i installed the widescreen mod because that RES is so low my graphic card can't even go down that low it was utter madness, it was like watching snails crawl in molasses, and for all of you sports fans who enjoy the 30 fps, i dont know whether to call you heros of patience of silly nillies of madness because i just can't do it
plus, some features of the EEs are absolute god sends compared to the orginals like:
- the loot bar, oh my god has this contaminated me to the point of no return, if NWN had this, i might actually enjoy playing that series a little bit more
- the fact that in bg2 you no longer get that weird whacky +10 XP load of nonsense, that really grinded my gears and its nice to see that it is gone
- level drain is no longer so much a pain in the ass like it used to be back in the vanillas, in fact in the vanilla days, if one of my spell casters got level drained i just reloaded the battle, because that was faster than trying to rememorize everything in order again, the EEs make it much more tolerable
- the fact that in my opinion beamdog implemented the bg2 engine into bg1 way better than that tutu mod did ( even though im not a fan of the bg2 engine being bg1, i like how beamdog did it as apposed to tutu )
- when i play bg1 my characters dont crawl across the screen, they actually move! thanks to the bg2 engine, and as far as i can recall it doesnt really seem to upset the balance with enemy movement as far as i can tell
but even with that said i still love how vanilla bg1 was implemented ( no class kits, no bg2 jargon cloggin up the place ) but i just can't go back to vanilla, its like playing pokémon fire red for hundreds of 100s and then trying to go back to pokémon red, you just can't even though mechanic wise pokémon red was better because of it's broken code, its unplayable garbage compared to fire red, and this is where vanilla bg stands as apposed to bg ee, i still like the way vanilla bg1 was better than EE, but going back is just impossible because its unplayable trash compared
so all i can hope is that beamdog can answer our prayers and fix up the UI ( especially that have to double click EVERYTHING nonsense to sell stacks ugh ) and after that, it should be a relatively smooth play through what out no hitches, or at least for me it will be
( PS: if im not making any sense i apologize, its 3 in the morning and sometimes my thoughts can be quite scattered )
@AndreaColombo Interesting to see people who actually prefer BG1 UI though. BG2 was almost universally considered an improvement in this regard so I wonder what you like about it. Is it simply a matter of aesthetics? I'm not mocking your opinion in any way, just genuinely curious.
Yes, it makes ranged attacks more effective, on both sides. Enemy archers and spellcasters are also more dangerous in vanilla.
It's, of course, up to you and your tastes which approach you prefer. I prefer vanilla, because when testing both systems one after the other, I found that vanilla had more nuance involved in a typical fight. Your fighters/tanks advance more slowly, which makes it more crucial to get them into position as soon as possible. I found the vanilla fights more 'chunky' and dangerous. Which is what I like.
I guess this makes me the odd one out, but I really coulnd't care less as long as I have my hotkeys mapped out and correctly displayed figures for AC, Thac0 etc.
But to answer your question, yes pretty much all versions of Baldur's Gate have different UIs with varying styles, features, and issues. The following game versions all feature different interfaces:
And that's only the unmodded versions of Baldur's Gate.
@CamDawg As far as the BG games go, I don't think I have ever seen you wrong about engine functionality...
I can imagine! (though not at all relate). Thanks for the info, mate.
Aesthetics. Stone and gold were in the official Forgotten Realms logo at the time, and BG faithfully turned it into a UI that looked good and just screamed "AD&D Forgotten Realms adventures!" Like @subtledoctor said, it fit the atmosphere of the game very well. Add some rose-tint from my nostalgic glasses, and there goes my favorite UI in any Infinity Engine game (second would be @erephine 's take on the BGII UI.)
i thought it was aight
When I first played BG I was like 11-12 and no prior D&D background so I just thought the gray stone was ugly and the font hard to read. Switching to BG2 was a huge improvement and at that age the whole thematic appropriateness (is that a word?) was really the last thing on my mind.
I've played games with significantly more mismatched UI over the years, such as Final Fantasy XII and its out-of-place futuristic interface for instance. Maybe if I had been older when the BG games came out my opinion would differ. Who knows?
As for the various incarnations of the EE UI I find myself favoring the blue/gold of the 1.3 versions over the current white/wood. And I really dislike the SoD black. @lefreut interface mods allow for the blue/gold everywhere and I'm pretty happy with it.
It certainly is a good thing that the EEs made their UI more flexibly moddable, seeing how different people have wildly different tastes
Not sure about that - the text looks a bit like one of the tests you get on websites to confirm that you are not a robot